I agree with Adam’s analysis of Schumer’s strategy. I disagree that if you are going to call your senators, you must have a full understanding of the arcane maneuverings necessary to force Republicans to explicitly come out against voting rights (☑ today) and to convince Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema to vote down the filibuster (to come).
So we are one step down the road. Continue to call your senators, particularly the ones who still like the filibuster, and tell them you are in favor of the For the People Act.
Update: Here comes the pressure. Add in your Congressional delegation’s comments! I’ll add tweets as I see them.
Baud
If we pass this, then we can take the next step and pass the For The Dogs and Cats Act.
Just an added incentive.
And, for the brief moment, good on Machine and Sinema. I hope to be able to sincerely thank them once the Kabuki is over.
Baud
One question of legislative arcana. I thought Schumer had to vote no to bring it up again later. No?
Cheryl Rofer
@Baud: I won’t even try to guess at that.
WaterGirl
Not one single Republican who cares about democracy. Absolutely appalling.
zzyzx
@Baud: I believe that’s only on the actual vote, not cloture.
Omnes Omnibus
I thought Murkowski was allegedly a yes.
Major Major Major Major
raven
@Baud:
zhena gogolia
Can someone explain to me why I shouldn’t worry, if by some chance we got rid of the filibuster, that then the Republicans could do whatever the hell they wanted the next time they have the majority? Why should I be so hellbent on getting rid of the filibuster?
Flame me now.
Baud
@zhena gogolia:
They will. But nothing stops them from repealing the filibuster themselves.
Major Major Major Major
@zhena gogolia:
1. Republicans can already do almost everything Republicans actually want to do with the filibuster still in place. This is not true for democrats obviously since we want to do constructive things
2. This is a big boy country and we should act like it and that means a Congress that is able to pass budgets and laws.
3. There are still plenty of ways to reform the filibuster that don’t eliminate it entirely if that’s what you want.
WaterGirl
@zhena gogolia: If the Rs have the majority in the senate, they could eliminate the filibuster in a heartbeat. Our leaving it in place would have no impact on whether it would be in place with a R majority.
Chris Johnson
@zhena gogolia: They’re already going to do whatever the hell they want if they can, up to and including hanging Mike Pence and overthrowing the country, so it’s a purely fake ‘limitation’ they themselves wouldn’t abide by for two seconds.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@raven: I think this is a bit wrong, bring up a motion to proceed on a bill is bringing up the bill.
Omnes Omnibus
@zhena gogolia: The GOP has eliminated it for most of the things they want anyway. Also, if we eliminate the filibuster and pass good voter rights protections, the danger of a GOP win goes down. Finally, the filibuster is undemocratic. If, in fair elections, one side wins, they should be able to govern.
cckids
@zhena gogolia: The Republicans are going to do whatever they want next time they’re in the majority, no matter what the Dems do this time. That’s been clear since 2009, at the least. Worrying about how far they’ll go next time won’t help now; we need to accept that we can’t even conceive of how low they will go, and get all the shit done now that we can. They will always, always find ways to go lower. They have no respect for or need for democracy
ETA. Jesus some of y’all type fast.
UncleEbeneezer
@Baud: And Dems eliminating/reforming it now actually makes that possibility less likely, in addition to making all sorts of progressive legislation possible.
zzyzx
@WaterGirl: that assumes that they actually want something other than judges. I can see them thinking that it’s important to be seen as voting for whatever the insane cause du jour is but not want it to actually pass because that would get them voted out, in which case the filibuster might stick around.
cckids
Just in case anyone missed it, today has been National Hike Naked Day. I did not participate (yuck; sweat, bugs, dust, sunburn :(
But have a laugh about this one. Having hiked Angel’s Landing, I concur that it is NOT a place you want to encounter a naked hiker.
Baud
@cckids:
Not exactly as auspicious as Juneteenth, but I’ll take it. Thanks, Joe!
Baud
FWIW, it only makes sense for the GOP to eliminate the filibuster when they control everything, so 2025 at worst.
Turgidson
@zhena gogolia:
Moscow Mitch and the rest of the GOP dipshits in the senate know that their agenda is less popular than genital warts, so they have *some* incentive to keep the filibuster in place so that they can rest assured that Democrats will save them from themselves when they vote to privatize Medicare, outlaw unionization completely, and zero out rich people’s tax liability.
But seriously, if they had 51 votes or 50+VP for legislation they really, really wanted and the filibuster stood in the way, they’d shitcan it in a second. People occasionally forget that their attempts to repeal Obamacare were done through reconciliation and *still* couldn’t get a majority thanks to McCain’s defection. The filibuster wasn’t what stopped them that time. And I think a decent chunk of GOP senators were privately glad McCain killed it, though they’d never say so out loud, precisely because it would have created a shitstorm of angry voters.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: You went hiking today?
WaterGirl
@zzyzx: If we don’t get rid of the filibuster, or find some way to modify it for voting rights, then it’s pretty much game over for democracy. We have to deliver, or the voters who don’t pay much attention will go with the “there’s not difference between the parties” and we will be permanently out of power because of gerrymandering and voting restrictions.
The Rs are no longer a normal political party. The favor authoritarianism and autocracy, not democracy. This is for all the marbles. To not use every tool we have in order to save democracy would be dumber than dumb.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Turgidson:
Someone should remind the current senior Senator from AZ about that.
WaterGirl
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Appalachian Trail?
Roger Moore
@zhena gogolia:
Because nothing we do now can stop the Republicans from eliminating the filibuster the next time they get the chance. And personally, I think the threat of the Republicans undoing everything we care about is overblown. They didn’t privatize Social Security in 2005, and they didn’t end Obamacare in 2017. They’re actually afraid of eliminating popular programs, at least in a way that makes it clear they’re at fault, because it will hurt them in the next election.
raven
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I cut an pasted it from Adam’s post. I have idea.
schrodingers_cat
Can I ask an OT gardening question to all you master gardeners.
Roger Moore
@cckids:
I suspect that nudity will get you in trouble on any busy National Park trail. I did see some nudist campers in Grand Staircase Escalante once, but that’s not at all the same thing.
zzyzx
@WaterGirl: I’m not saying that the Democrats aren’t hurt by the filibuster, but rather that the Republicans don’t really care enough about it to overturn it when they’re in charge. They don’t want government to do anything so they’re find with an obstruction.
debbie
Did Sinema vote for it? Could Harris have broken the tie?
Roger Moore
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Passing a motion to proceed is bringing up the bill; bringing up a motion to proceed is asking if we should bring up the bill.
rikyrah
That’s right ??????????
Right to work State..
Or, did they think that didn’t apply to them???
Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) tweeted at 6:00 PM on Tue, Jun 22, 2021:
HOUSTON (AP) — Houston hospital says 153 employees who refused to get COVID-19 vaccine have resigned or been fired.
(https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1407473475334197251?s=03)
Omnes Omnibus
@debbie: All the Dems voted for it. Harris could not have broken the tie because this was a cloture vote that requires 60. That’s the whole reason for the filibuster fight.
elm
@debbie: Sinema did vote for it (it was 50 v 50). The vote needed 60 to succeed, so Harris could not have broken a tie.
This outcome is not a surprise. Schumer knew it would proceed this way. He has a plan for what to do next.
debbie
Already answered a billion times.
debbie
@elm:
Thanks, I can’t keep up with the rules.
Mary G
@schrodingers_cat: Go ahead.
Also:
meander
Rep. Barbara Lee (CA-13, eastern shore of SF Bay) tweeted
(not sure of the right way to put tweets into comments)
debbie
@Omnes Omnibus:
I need to invest in a rule book.
elm
@debbie: Having all 50 Republicans present and voting against this is probably the best outcome for Schumer. That shows that there are 0 Republicans willing to make any deal on voting rights or even to open negotiation.
In an optimistic case, today’s vote will be material to criticize Republicans and bring about some sort of filibuster change.
Today was a necessary step and not the final one.
schrodingers_cat
OT Garden question: A ground hog/s is eating my veggies what can I do stop him/her/them?
Just Some Fuckhead
Who was it that said McConnell would continue to run the Senate from the (unconstitutional) minority leader position?
debbie
@rikyrah:
Do we know if this was the hospital that was sued for mandating jabs?
Butter Emails
@zhena gogolia:
Others have commented on this, but I will take a slightly different tact. A week or so ago I read on interesting opinion piece that went over the temporary rescue of the judicial filibuster during the Bush administration.
Democrats were filibustering/threatening to filibuster Bush’s most egregious judges, so the Republicans threatened to go nuclear. The filibuster was saved and in exchange the Democrats agreed to use it only under the most extreme circumstances. They then essentially let all of Bush’s judges go through – saving the filibuster by not using it.
Fast forward a few years. Obama gets elected and the Republicans filibuster all his judges for years until Democrats finally end the Judicial filibuster themselves for all but Supreme Court judges.
Fast forward a few more years – Republicans kill the Supreme court filibuster the moment it’s used to attempt to block a Supreme Court nomination.
We would have been better off just letting the Republicans kill the Judicial filibuster under Bush. Then Democrats would have been able to confirm significantly more judges under Obama by not dawdling years just to kill it ourselves. When it was the Republicans turn, they didn’t hesitate to kill it the moment it was an impediment to what they wanted.
We should kill the legislative filibuster. It’s keeping us from getting done what we need to get done. Any protection it offers against Republican malfesance is an illusion. They’ll get rid of it without hesitation the moment it becomes a liability to them.
Cameron
@schrodingers_cat: Call any vegetable/And the chances are good/That the vegetable will respond to you…
Joe Falco
Step 1 complete. Now for the admakers to do their work, blitz the media and show the public shit won’t get done until the filibuster is amended/abolished. If the media dim stars won’t do their job to inform the public, Democrats have to do it themselves.
Cheryl Rofer
debbie
@schrodingers_cat:
My Mamaw used to run a hose down the tunnels and drown them, but I know you’re better than that.
Steve in the ATL
@schrodingers_cat: move your garden indoors
You’re welcome.
Suzanne
@rikyrah: I have to admit, I love watching Republicans get fucked by the rules that they passed to fuck us. It’s so narratively satisfying.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@WaterGirl: Maybe.
Cheryl Rofer
debbie
Surprisingly, nothing from Sherrod Brown yet.
jimmiraybob
Oh boy, which one to call/email first? Josh Hawley or Roy Blunt? Oh well, it won’t be the first time I piss into this wind.
Another Scott
@zhena gogolia: The filibuster only means something to those who respect the rules and traditions of the Senate. There are actual things in the Constitution – the supreme law of the land – about what the Senate is supposed to do about judicial nominations, but Moscow Mitch ignored that when it came to many, many of Obama’s nominations.
The filibuster/cloture system is a Senate rule. The Senate can change its rules anytime it wants.
Rules and Laws and Norms and Traditions will not save us from people who ignore them.
The Democrats have the majority in the Senate, the House, and the White House. They should try for compromise where it makes sense, but they have the majority – they should use it. Because they’re going to be painted as doing bad things with the majority, they might as well do good things while they have it. And they have been doing good things.
The time is long past for worry about what the GQP might do. The time is now to do what we can to make sure they never hold the majority again.
Cheers,
Scott.
Suzanne
From Senator Casey on Tweetz:
“Today’s obstruction is shameful but it’s not the end of the story. Voting is a foundational pillar of our democracy & the Senate has a moral duty to protect it & remove other barriers to voting.
I’m going to keep working with my colleagues to pass voting rights legislation.”
trollhattan
America the Violent
This lady was the server for a work function my spouse attended this last last Thursday. Then yesterday, this occurred.
Spouse had a client who was murdered in her own home by an ex, who drove off and when cornered by the cops, shot himself. How has this become so common that we can know multiple murder victims?
Roger Moore
On the general topic, this vote shows just how wrong the defenders of the filibuster are. The one plausible justification of the filibuster was that it was a form of extending debate. Rather than discussing an issue for a predetermined time, the Senate was supposed to be free to debate until the issue was completely talked out before moving to a vote. The filibuster was just the illogical extension of this; continuing to talk indefinitely until the side that wanted a vote gave up in frustration.
But today’s votes don’t even have that tiny sliver of justification. Rather than prolonging debate endlessly, the vote today was a decision not even to start a debate. A tool whose basic justification is the need to talk things through is being used to keep them from being talked about at all. It should be proof to the filibuster’s few serious defenders that the current rules are completely contrary to the nominal justification of the process.
Gvg
@zhena gogolia: the Republican voter suppression laws are so bad, that we can’t win elections even when the majority want us too, so the filibuster becomes pointless. The republicans are so desperate that they will get rid of it as soon as they are the majority.
they are in a catch 22. If they do the normal in the past thing and try to appeal to a wider electorate, they will lose a significant part of their supporters AND they they won’t get many new voters for several election cycles because they have double crossed and hurt so many in our current alliance. So they will lose big, until they prove they can be trusted again, plus possibly democrats screwing up something. And losing means a bunch of them would lose their jobs. OR they could keep losing by slim margins, and if they suppress enough votes, they might win some, again they would be helped if the democrats screwed up some. In the long run, the demographics trend against them plus our side is getting really mad trending even more so….but who knows, maybe the horse will learn to sing as they say. Or maybe the current crop of Republican politicians thinks they can put it off till their dead.
As worried as I am, I don’t see a good way forward for them. They waited too long. And of course, they really are stubborn bigots. That’s their real problem right there.
Adam L Silverman
@Just Some Fuckhead: I did. On the front page. About a week into McConnell jerking everyone around on the organizing resolution for the Senate.
Pseudonymous Bosch
@zhena gogolia: If Republicans control Congress while Democrats control the White House, the filibuster is unnecessary for Democrats because a presidential veto is a stronger countermeasure (it requires more votes to override). If Republicans control Congress and the White House, the nation will be beyond salvaging already.
Kattails
@schrodingers_cat: If you can find the den hole, dump used kitty litter down it regularly until the groundhog vacates. Worked for me. 8-) There are also stinky sprays you can buy in garden centers—you’ll notice it a bit but it’s much more irritating to them. You need to be fairly relentless.
Just Some Fuckhead
@jimmiraybob:
What ever happened with holding the political progenitors of the insurrection accountable?
Oh, nothing. Surprise.
SiubhanDuinne
@trollhattan:
How unspeakably terrible. I’m so sorry. Hugs to your spouse.
Edmund Dantes
@Butter Emails: one of those judges that was part of the gangs compromise? Brett Kavanaugh
trollhattan
@SiubhanDuinne:
Thank you so much.
It’s hard to not feel despair at times like this.
schrodingers_cat
@Kattails: Thanks. Will try the kitteh litter trick.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Butter Emails:
They will do whatever they want AND THEY SHOULD. That’s how the Constitution was set up – the majority rules.
Another Scott
@trollhattan: 1) Politics is slow. 2) Our base is energized, and growing, and we win when lots and lots of people are energized.
We knew – and know – it’s not going to be easy. We have to keep working.
Cheers,
Scott.
Lyrebird
@jimmiraybob: I guess you could also call Hallmark. They at least said they’d stop supporting Hawley over the insurrection. I know some of those companies came sneaking back, but I do not know about Hallmark. Bonus if you live near KC I guess.
Not my state anymore. Not calling Schumer’s office too often bc I think he gets it.
Omnes Omnibus
@Another Scott: I am not sure that it’s the filibuster stuff that has him down.
Reboot
@schrodingers_cat: What’s working for us so far is a chicken-wire fence on metal poles. The metal poles were easy to drive into our clay soil; we didn’t need post-hole diggers. Our back yard used to be a groundhog runway, but the fence seems to have rerouted them.
zhena gogolia
Thanks for all the answers. I don’t get Manchin and Sinema. I’m so sick of them.
Another Scott
@Omnes Omnibus: (Whoops. I was reading up from the bottom and jumping around too much. Thanks, OO.)
I’m sorry, Trollhattan. That’s horrible. Sincere condolences to everyone who knew her.
Best wishes,
Scott.
Another Scott
Meanwhile, across the Capitol…
(via harrisonjaime)
Cheers,
Scott.
Cacti
@Omnes Omnibus:
On the big issues, they’re all reliably fascist.
Just Some Fuckhead
@zhena gogolia: I have no issues with Manchin and Sinema being asshats. Theoretically, that’s how our system was set up – 100 asshats in our own House of Lords – before party politics ruined the fantasy.
Having said that, the unconstitutional filibuster shouldn’t be subject to the whims of Senators deciding to keep it or end it. It needs to be challenged in court on constitutional grounds. It basically sets up a supermajority threshold to pass legislation which is contrary to the constitution.
Baud
@Another Scott:
?
Another Scott
@zhena gogolia: We’ve got a big tent. Lots of critters inside…
“Our diversity is our strength. Our unity is our power.” – Speaker Pelosi.
They were unified with the rest of the party today. It’s a good day.
Cheers,
Scott.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Cacti:
Because their voters are.
Cacti
Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema believe that the traditions of the Senate are more important than the right to vote.
Period.
Another Scott
@Just Some Fuckhead:
Something like 95+% of Americans want additional gun control laws (background checks, etc.). Including their voters. It hasn’t happened because their donors don’t like it.
Cheers,
Scott.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Another Scott: Nope. It’s the voters. The ones you cite simply can’t connect their voting choices with outcomes.
Another Scott
Interesting.
Cheers,
Scott.
Zelma
@zhena gogolia:
Because when the Republicans have a Senate majority again and should there be something that they can’t pass via Reconciliation, they will get rid of the filibuster in a second.
And because if we don’t protect the vote, there will either be no more democracy and/or no more USA.
eclare
@Another Scott: Very interesting.
Citizen Alan
@rikyrah: I think you mean “employment at will” state, which Texas also is. Right to Work is actually an Orwellian phrase that actually means “right to take advantage of union membership without paying dues.”
Just Some Fuckhead
@Citizen Alan: Right to Work For Less
Chris Sherbak
Jan Schakowsky IL-9 https://twitter.com/janschakowsky/status/1407466035700244485?s=20
Just Some Fuckhead
@Another Scott:
Six months later.
Major Major Major Major
Polls are closing in NYC so we should know who the next mayor will be in a couple weeks.
planetjanet
@Just Some Fuckhead: DOJ logged its fifth guilty plea today. Pelosi said she would announce whether they will pursue a select committee later this week.
Just Some Fuckhead
@planetjanet: I’m talking about the Republican politicians who engineered this thing. Where is the accountability?
Geminid
@schrodingers_cat: Local radio garden guru Andre Viette talks up sprays that are supposed to make vegetables unpalatable to rabbits, deer, groundhogs etc., but can be washed off the vegetables for eating. One is mint oil based, one is capsicum based. I’ve never used them and cannot say how effective they are.
Roger Moore
@Citizen Alan:
“Right to Mooch”
planetjanet
@Just Some Fuckhead: Sorry that we just can’t snap our fingers and order Hawley and Cruz to jail. Justice can move slowly at times. DOJ is investigating connections between insurrectionists and Congressional personnel. The impeachment trial put up a lot of evidence about the insurrection and those who facilitated it. Don’t dismiss a lot of painstaking work that has been done so far.
Just Some Fuckhead
@planetjanet:
There is no evidence of that.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Just Some Fuckhead: And it would be normal to not see any evidence of that until indictments are brought forward.
Just Some Fuckhead
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Hillary Clinton would beg to differ.
WaterGirl
@Another Scott: That is great news!
planetjanet
@Just Some Fuckhead:
https://www.msnbc.com/american-voices/watch/-we-re-looking-at-video-evidence-of-insurrection-new-developments-on-the-jan-6-riot-115127877698
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Just Some Fuckhead: Actually, in Hillary’s case, the announcement was they were not bringing any charges.
Just Some Fuckhead
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Ok, whatever you need to tell yourself.
James E Powell
@Just Some Fuckhead:
How would you know a thing like that?
schrodingers_cat
@James E Powell: He is really Merrick Garland?
MontyTheClipArtMongoose
@Just Some Fuckhead: wm. safire promised me a hillary climpton indictment was imminent in january 1997.
i am still waiting.
Just Some Fuckhead
@James E Powell: lol, are you asking me to prove there is no evidence?
James E Powell
@Just Some Fuckhead:
No, I am asking how you would know that there is no evidence. You made the claim. What’s your basis for it?
Chris T.
I called my senators (Cantwell and Murray) to say “keep at it”. Not much more I can do from Blue Washington…
Another Scott
They really are shameless. And there are few if any consequences in the press.
Cheers,
Scott.
Another Scott
VP Harris statement tonight:
(Emphasis added.)
Good, good.
Cheers,
Scott.
weasel
@schrodingers_cat: This is short on useful advice (I think that kitty litter idea is the best bet) but I just had to share this gardener who left a second garden open for the lil piggies and shared the videos
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNdts2P-dj
(Guy Builds Veggie Garden For Family Of Groundhogs | The Dodo)
taumaturgo
@WaterGirl: Agree, but will the current conservative democrat’s leadership go for it? I sincerely doubt it. Look at Pelosi debating with herself to establish a commission to investigate the January 6 insurrection.