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You are here: Home / Politics / Activist Judges! / Procedural Open Thread: Merrick Garland Gets A Hearing

Procedural Open Thread: Merrick Garland Gets A Hearing

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Poltico, today:

Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell will support Merrick Garland’s nomination for attorney general, five years after blocking the judge’s path to the Supreme Court…

The Senate Judiciary Committee held a two-day confirmation hearing this week for Garland.Some Senate Republicans criticized Garland for not answering enough questions, but several have already announced their support for him to lead the Justice Department, including Sens. Thom Tillis (R-N.C.) and John Cornyn (R-Texas), a McConnell confidant. Iowa Sen. Chuck Grassley, the top Republican on the Senate Judiciary Committee, also spoke positively of Garland on Monday…

The Senate Judiciary Committee will hold a committee vote on Garland’s nomination March 1 and Senate Majority Whip Dick Durbin said he is hoping for final confirmation next week…

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    235Comments

    4. 4.

      Roger Moore

      Honestly, the only reason to go hard after Garland is to pander to white nationalists, since he correctly said they represent a terrorist threat.

      I don’t think that’s quite true. The Republicans party is a criminal conspiracy, so avoiding a functioning DoJ is in their best interests in general.

      Reply
    5. 5.

      Ajabu

      And Garland looks so quiet and unassuming while he politely slides the shiv into these assholes trying desperately to unnerve him.

      You go, Mr. AG…

      Reply
    6. 6.

      Geoboy

      I look forward to the arrest, trial, conviction and lengthy imprisonment of current sitting members of Congress as co-conspiritors to the insurrection.

      Reply
    7. 7.

      dmsilev

      Ted Cruz, eternally and evermore an asshole lacking in self-awareness:

      Ted Cruz tells @HolmesJosh that his wife Heidi is “pretty pissed” at the leaked texts about Cancun trip.
      “Here’s a suggestion just don’t be assholes. Yeah, like just you know treat each other as human beings have some degree, some modicum of respect.”https://t.co/Q2EFk3xKen
      — Manu Raju (@mkraju) February 23, 2021

      Reply
    11. 11.

      Geoduck

      Moscow Mitch might end up regretting it, who knows what illegal crap he’s had going on the side all these years. But yeah, he’s not the first one in the metaphorical crosshairs.

      Reply
    15. 15.

      David 🌈 ☘The Establishment☘🌈 Koch

      Honestly, the only reason to go hard after Garland is to pander to white nationalists

      but, but….. economic anxiety

      Reply
    19. 19.

      trollhattan

      The sheriff is near!

      So happy at this choice. Shame on McConnell for denying him a SCOTUS seat (not that he does shame) but the country can use his skill and experience to help unTrump the joint.

      And I don’t like Nazis with AR15s.

      Reply
    22. 22.

      debbie

      @Raven:

      I was just ranging around Twitter. There’s been no indication of a back injury. They say there was no sign he was impaired, that he was calm and alert. I cannot imagine.

      Reply
    28. 28.

      Ken

      @dmsilev: “Yeah, like just you know treat each other as human beings have some degree, some modicum of respect.” – Ted Cruz

      Trying to remember Cruz’s stance about five years ago, when the GQP was deriding empathy.

      Reply
    34. 34.

      Roger Moore

      @debbie: ​
       

      They say there was no sign he was impaired, that he was calm and alert.

      I saw a local saying people tend to drive way too fast where he had his accident, and given the time of day it was likely foggy. Combine those things, and you can have a very nasty single car accident without being impaired. Of course I’m still curious about the toxicology report.

      Reply
    36. 36.

      SiubhanDuinne

      @zhena gogolia:

      Far be it from me to give Moscow Mitch credit for anything with a positive outcome, but it’s possible that he did us all a huge favour five years ago. I think Merrick Garland may end up being more consequential (in the good way) as AG than he would have been as a SC Justice.

      Reply
    38. 38.

      Chyron HR

      Asked by Josh Hawley if he supports defunding the police, Merrick Garland says he does not

      “NOOOOO why won’t the neoliberal shitlibs recite our shibboleths???” – Some Twitter asshole, probably

      Reply
    41. 41.

      SiubhanDuinne

      @Dorothy A. Winsor:

      I’m thinking the same. I started listening at some point after the news broke, and for a good 15 minutes I thought he was dead. It wasn’t until I actually bothered to look at a chyron on the screen that I realised he was alive, injured, and in surgery.

      So I mentally changed “R.I.P.” to “Speedy and full recovery.”

      Reply
    42. 42.

      MomSense

      @germy:

      I saw a funny Reel a month (2? 3? 10?) ago with a woman sitting at her kitchen table.  She said “If you think it’s bad now, in 20 years this country will be run by people who were homeschooled by day drinkers”

      Reply
    43. 43.

      Kattails

      @germy: Ummm. British racing green though. And Prince of Darkness electrical systems, but…  who cares.

      I’m a couple of years older. It’s all about maintenance, baby. ;-)

      Reply
    46. 46.

      Roger Moore

      @Chyron HR: ​
       
      I think they really believe all Democrats buy into the craziest stuff the online left says. After all, they buy into the craziest stuff the online right says, and we all know the parties are mirror images of each other.

      Reply
    51. 51.

      Jim, Foolish Literalist

      @Roger Moore:

      I think they really believe all Democrats buy into the craziest stuff the online left says.

      Nah, they just find it useful when the online left forces its slogans into the mainstream discourse.

      Reply
    52. 52.

      different-church-lady

      @SiubhanDuinne:

      but it’s possible that he did us all a huge favour five years ago.

      When he freakin’ STOLE a supreme court appointment from a democratic president and handed to to Donald Goddamned Trump? I think not.

      Reply
    53. 53.

      different-church-lady

      These “McConnell blocked Garland because he’s too good” takes are really stupid. McConnell was not going to allow ANY Obama nominee to go forward because he wanted to steal the seat on the off-chance Trump would pull it out, and he won his bet.

      Reply
    56. 56.

      Jeffro

      @dmsilev: I love it!  The people who ratted them out are the actual ‘assholes’; likewise, Dems are just trying to make hay out of Cruz’s negligence since they don’t know what to do with themselves now that trumpov’s gone.

      I’ll say one thing: these GQPers, they sure know how to throw off some chaff, that’s for sure.

      Reply
    58. 58.

      lurker

      @different-church-lady:

      agreed.  if you want to claim McConnell and Graham (I think) did not allow a hearing because Garland was too good – agreed 100%.  But Obama could have nominated a 100% rightwing conservative and they would not have advanced it out of a combination of exercising their power and inherent spiteful ornery dispositions.

      Reply
    63. 63.

      Jeffro

      @Roger Moore:I think they really believe all Democrats buy into the craziest stuff the online left says. After all, they buy into the craziest stuff the online right says, and we all know the parties are mirror images of each other.

      I know, right?

      It’s a good weakness to keep exploiting, and I hope they NEVER figure it out.

      Reply
    67. 67.

      Jim, Foolish Literalist

      @Mai Naem mobile: he gives off the most powerful that-boy-ain’t-right vibe this side of Rick Santorum, and more threatening. Santorum locks himself in a closet and weeps. Cotton’s got a crawl space full of small animal skeletons and Barbie doll heads.

      Metaphorically speaking.

      Reply
    69. 69.

      Jeffro

      @lurker: I think if Obama had nominated a Scalia clone – a demonstrable, rock-solid, 40-year-old crazy ass conservative Scalia clone – they would have pocketed the win and moved on.  “Thanks, Barack!”  Never would have happened but still, sure they would have taken that.  Why not?

      But anything less was unacceptable, and they had the power, and they used it, and here we are.

      I still don’t know what Obama could have done differently.  Clearly no force on earth can force McConnell to do the right thing, or the consistent thing, it’s all about conservative white male power, period.

      Reply
    71. 71.

      Amir Khalid

      @germy: 
      Let’s see. He’s thin, Bilbar is fat. His hair is grey, Bilbar’s is dark. he says he’ll work for the people, Bilbar was carrying water for Trump from before he was AG right to the end. So in all the important things, yes.

      Reply
    72. 72.

      Frankensteinbeck

      @dmsilev:

      “Here’s a suggestion just don’t be assholes. Yeah, like just you know treat each other as human beings have some degree, some modicum of respect.”

      Explaining his quote about how everyone in the Senate hates Ted Cruz, he said it’s not about Cruz’s politics.  It’s not about anything big.  Cruz is an asshole.  He’s a horrible coworker who does every selfish little thing to make everyone else’s life miserable.  He’s the guy who never refills the coffee, who reports you for putting up pictures in your cubicle, who makes meetings take twice as long so he can nitpick something unimportant no one else cares about.

      Reply
    75. 75.

      BC in Illinois

      @Frankensteinbeck:

      Ted Cruz:

      He’s the guy who never refills the coffee, who reports you for putting up pictures in your cubicle, who makes meetings take twice as long so he can nitpick something unimportant no one else cares about.

      I once heard a school principal talking about having meetings with another principal. He summarized the guy in one sentence. “He’s someone who makes easy things difficult.”

      Reply
    78. 78.

      lurker

      @Baud:

      so I thought that these comments:

      @West of the Rockies:[first]; @West of the Rockies:[second]; and @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: in this thread: Late Night Open Thread: Tucker Carlson, Gunne Dude

      [Bill in Glendale said something about someone running in 2024 which I deliberately misconstrued as relating to the first and second comments in the thread.]

      meant that we all had to switch to supporting West of the Rockies in 2024 because he got the first and second comments.  Then I see this:

      @Baud: [first]; @Baud: [second]; and @Baud: [fourth] in this thread: Monday Morning Open Thread: Sweet, Refreshing “Boredom”

      Baud getting the first, second and fourth comments.

      so, mind blown and now I have to figure out how to support Baud 2024 and West of the Rockies 2024.

      This blog makes like confusing.

      Reply
    81. 81.

      Mai Naem mobile

      I didn’t know much about Merrick Garland until Obama nominated him and the time I saw him speak was when Obama introduced him at the WH. He was so impressive yesterday. Really smart but in a low key manner. I have to wonder if this isn’t going to end up being a lesser version of Warren not becoming the head of the CFPB and running for the Senate.

      Reply
    85. 85.

      Jeffro

      @Baud: there’s a few ways that come to mind:

      1. Keep pointing out loudly, publicly, that the GQP’s completely off the hook and note the differences (in theory, this helps keep Dems together, wins a majority of independents, breaks off some small fraction of Rs who see the light)
      2. Keep encouraging our own leaders to stay focused on bigger-picture issues (a la Biden & Co ignoring Twitter) and avoid being baited by our snooze media’s lame framing
      3. Probably as a subset of #1, keep mocking the RWNJs for constantly swinging at caricatures and being wrapped up in their own bubble…not stable…not fit to govern.

      Sound good, for starters?  I guess another would be

      4.  keep doing things that a majority of Americans want, that help make their lives better, and then pouncing when Rs oppose those things?

      The GQP is just not. in. touch. not with reality, and not with what Americans want.  Lots of ways to keep pointing out both of those things.

      Reply
    86. 86.

      CaseyL

      @germy:  I went to a classic car show some time back, where they had a large selection of old British roadsters.

      I was amazed at how small they were.  They weren’t just low to the ground, but even the rest of car was such that you’d have to fold yourself up to get in. They were also surprisingly (to me) narrow, particularly across the hood/bonnet.

      Not as small as the true Mini Coopers, of course (which nowadays look like toys, esp. compared to their steroidal modern counterparts), but still…

      Just adorable little rockets.

      Reply
    91. 91.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @BC in Illinois:

      I once heard a school principal talking about having meetings with another principal. He summarized the guy in one sentence. “He’s someone who makes easy things difficult.”

      Literally my boss. He’s nothing like Cruz but his superhero power is figuring out how to complicate the fuck out of everything. It’s how he imagines a COO should operate.  Let’s figure out some ridiculous hoops you should jump through just because. And paradoxically, he’s a person who thinks everything is easier than it actually is. I think most of his “let’s figure out how to complicate this” is his fundamental aversion to making a decision. He hates making decisions. He will literally talk for an hour making good cases for either side of a decision in order not to make that decision.

      Reply
    92. 92.

      Jim, Foolish Literalist

      @Baud: unlike Sinema, who I don’t think I could pick out of a line up, I think Joe is enjoying the attention. And the power.

      Reply
    94. 94.

      Baud

      @Jeffro:

      Fair. But unlike some aspersions the GOP casts on us, “defund the police” is a real slogan used by some people on the left.  We can probably get away with ignoring this particular slogan, but sooner or later the GOP could find a real wedge issue to use to divide us.  It can get tricky.

      Reply
    95. 95.

      mrmoshpotato

      @Amir Khalid: ​

      How is this a pertinent question? The US Attorney General has no say in the budgets of local police deparments.​

      It’s not, but hot diggity dog if it’s not a right-wing asshat talking point.

      Reply
    97. 97.

      lurker

      @Jeffro: likely correct, i can see it going either way – they get something they want regardless in that scenario.  they might distrust the nominee, along the lines of David Souter.

      Reply
    99. 99.

      Malovich

      He’s got an axe to grind and It Is Large.

      I’m sure he’s an adult. He looks very reasonable. He’s a quiet, modest man.

      He’s very, very angry in a quiet, modest way.

      “There are three things all wise men fear: the sea in storm, a night with no moon, and the anger of a gentle man.”
      ― Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man’s Fear

      Reply
    101. 101.

      Tom Levenson

      @germy:  That’s an MG-TD. I drove one once. Drove like a little truck, but everyone smiled as I drove by.

      Belonged to a friend who was a shade tree mechanic, restored and raced old British cars (had a 20s Rolls Royce in which he once chauffeured Diana Rigg.

      He died when a suspension part failed in his MG-TC (I think, might have been his TD) during a classic car race, and he drove full speed into a wall.

      Reply
    108. 108.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @Baud:

      Fair. But unlike some aspersions the GOP casts on us, “defund the police” is a real slogan used by some people on the left.  We can probably get away with ignoring this particular slogan, but sooner or later the GOP could find a real wedge issue to use to divide us.  It can get tricky. 

      Meh, they’ll find a way to twist even the most nuanced argument. Remember “you didn’t build that”? Best to just own it and move the goalposts through repetition.

      Reply
    110. 110.

      Baud

      @Just Some Fuckhead:

      Right.  The GOP will just make stuff up.  What I’m saying is that when they aren’t making stuff up but using left wing slogans and ideas (Reparations!) against Democrats, Democrats need a response that not going to scare fickle moderates away while also not insulting the left.  That’s often not easy to do.

      Reply
    111. 111.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @Baud: What’s easier, running from it and making it look like a real issue or just pointing out (when asked) that “defund the police” is an argument to put more money into community health and stop requiring police officers to deal with stuff they shouldn’t be dealing with?

      Reply
    119. 119.

      Baud

      @Just Some Fuckhead:

      No. We can’t control their framing.  We can only offer a comepring framing.  That’s what Biden did.  His framing just wasn’t “defund the police” because that would have scared away moderates and gotten us no votes.

      Reply
    120. 120.

      different-church-lady

      @Baud: He responded to what the slogan sounds like, not whatever mobius-strip-in-four-dimensional-space interpretation you need to haul out in order for the slogan to make sense to anyone but a liberal academic.

      Which is why he won.

      Reply
    121. 121.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @different-church-lady: Well, no. We actually have to stop dumping so much money into terrorizing communities of color. “Defund the police” is actually a very reasonable response to the policing atrocities of the last decades. You’d realize that if you weren’t 80 fucking years old and white.

      Reply
    122. 122.

      different-church-lady

      IF YOU SPEND ALL YOUR TIME EXPLAINING YOUR OWN FRAMING YOU LOSE NO MATTER WHAT THE OTHER GUY SAYS. JESUS ON A BROKEN SEGUE…

      Reply
    123. 123.

      gwangung

      @Baud: Folks should remember that a lot of marginalized people really DO want to defund the police and will resent like hell any efforts to put words in their mouths. And they ARE Democratic voters.

      So, don’t legitimize their concerns. Just don’t allow them to put words in your mouth.

      Reply
    126. 126.

      Kattails

      @Ken: made me laugh.

      On a good news note, my best friend who’s been in the hospital for a couple of months, mentioned it here, is scheduled to come home on Thursday.  He’s climbing the walls.  Damn near died. Post surgical blood infection leading to major organ problems, kidney dialysis, now having to rebuild muscle tone just to walk like 360′.  But home with his beloved 6 kitties who have been so stressed with all these strangers coming in to help out.  His wife died while he was so sick.  But something good finally coming along.

      Reply
    127. 127.

      Elizabelle

      @Just Some Fuckhead:   I think “Defund the Police” is the stupidest goddamn slogan I have EVER heard.

      It’s not even informative, unless you’re among the woke.  It’s an enormous own goal.

      “Reallocate Police Funding” or “Refocus the Policing Mission” or any number of informative slogans would be better.  Something that sounds positive, and not punitive.

      Reply
    128. 128.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @Elizabelle: Yeah, I get that people who will never ever find themselves on the violent side of police have a different opinion about policing and the solutions to over-policing.

      Reply
    129. 129.

      gwangung

      @Elizabelle:

      “Reallocate Police Funding” or “Refocus the Policing Mission” or any number of informative slogans would be better.  Something that sounds positive, and not punitive.

      That’s nice. Would have been nicer if people listened when we were saying that.

      Reply
    130. 130.

      Jeffro

      @Baud: I agree.

      Seems to me the biggest wedge they have available is between moderate Dems and further-left Dems…the “we’re making progress!” side vs the “hurry the hell up/burn it down” side.  The GQP could try to ramp up on the shit-stirring like trumpov was always trying to do with goading Bernie.

      The problem with that is, the GQP’s so obviously out of control and dangerous to the country, the further-left…most folks there, anyway…recognizes that now is certainly not the time for wavering on our side.  Not with a 50-50 Senate and razor-thin margin in the House.

      But yeah, they could try.

      They’re also (obviously) trying to pretend all of a sudden that the GQP is the party of working folks.  Again, that’s just so absurd on its face that even FoxBubble zombies – some – might wake up upon hearing that bit of nonsense.

      I don’t think they’re going to have much of a chance with these narratives until the danger from trumpov and his nuts has lessened to a much greater degree.  Covid-19 is slowly being rolled back, Biden’s about to get his relief package one way or another, the GQP’s Reps and Senators continue to act like loons and throw around the FoxSpeak.

      We’re not home free, but every cycle the electorate gets younger, less white, less religious, and more progressive.  If we can avoid own goals like “defund the police” (which Biden ably did) we can keep this thing going.

      Reply
    131. 131.

      Baud

      Anyway, this proves my point.  Dems have to be careful when responding to real wedge issues that the GOP will try to exploit.

      Reply
    133. 133.

      Viva BrisVegas

      @Jeffro: I still don’t know what Obama could have done differently.

      If we are talking realpolitik here and not decency, he could have done what the Republicans would have done if the situation had been reversed.

      I don’t know the US Constitution well enough to say what they could have gotten away with, but you can bet that one way or another there would have been a Republican bum on that Supreme Court bench six months before the 2016 election.

      Perhaps they would have taken the silence of the Senate as consent and appointed someone anyway and then let the rest of the Supreme Court sort it out?

      Anyway they wouldn’t have let the opportunity hang there on the assumption it would still be there 12 months later.

      Reply
    134. 134.

      Elizabelle

      @SiubhanDuinne:

      I think Merrick Garland may end up being more consequential (in the good way) as AG than he would have been as a SC Justice.

      I am hopeful that is going to happen, too. He and Joe Biden are both effective and with NFLTG.

      And oh, the schadenfreude, if any DOJ investigations embroil Mitch McConnell and other top Republicans. All the screaming they’ve been doing over the years, and realizing how much of it is projection.

      Mitch may come to regret stealing that USSC seat, because it put him squarely in the bull’s eye, although not likely we will ever hear that.

      Reply
    137. 137.

      different-church-lady

      ME: Your nickname for your policy makes your policy seem unrealistic and drastic.

      THEM: The policy is quite sound. Here, let me spend the next ten minutes explaining why.

      ME: YOU WOULDN’T FUCKIN’ HAVE TO IF THE NICKNAME FOR YOUR POLICY DIDN’T JESUS SEBASTIAN CHRIST THE FIFTH WHY DO I BOTHER?

      Reply
    139. 139.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @different-church-lady: And what captured the national zeitgeist about over-policing? (checks notes) Oh, look it was “Defund the Police”! I guess they should have gotten together with you old white privileged people and hammered something out that didn’t upset your protected sensibilities.

      Reply
    149. 149.

      The Thin Black Duke

      Meanwhile, another person of color died this week when a cop kneeled on his neck for five minutes. If a slogan like “Defund The Police” is a bridge too far for some white moderates, I don’t think of them as worthwhile allies anyway.

      Reply
    153. 153.

      Just Some Fuckhead

      @The Thin Black Duke: Meanwhile, another person of color died this week when a cop kneeled on his neck for five minutes. If a slogan like “Defund The Police” is a bridge too far for some white moderates, I don’t think of them as worthwhile allies anyway.

      Thank you. I’d encourage everyone to read MLK’s remarks about white moderates before making that stupid argument again.

      Reply
    154. 154.

      Brachiator

      @Jeffro:

      We’re not home free, but every cycle the electorate gets younger, less white, less religious, and more progressive.

      I agree with you on the first two, but not the last two.

      But I agree that the Democrats have an advantage, and also that the GOP commitment to insanity hurts them big time.

      Reply
    157. 157.

      Elizabelle

      @Baud:   So I am not a worthwhile ally?  Because I have to tell you, that slogan was a topic among several of us participating in BLM protests.  And it’s a problem in swing districts too, because it’s so easily subject to disinformation which is weaponized.

      Reply
    161. 161.

      Elizabelle

      @Baud:   I found the comment harsh because it sounded more like people were not allowed to think it was a bad slogan, and therefore they could not possibly be good allies.

      People who seize on the slogan as an excuse not to vote for Democrats … were probably going to find some other excuse as well.

      Reply
    163. 163.

      Kattails

      @Elizabelle: Review Community Security? (Reform, revise sayeth the Thesaurus.) I have heard Reform the police. I think that “the police” seems directed at a group. Policing perhaps takes it one step away. How would it sound if I said to someone “I think we should review community security and policing, see how we can get the good cops help with mental health crap they have to respond to, but also weed out the bad ones”.

      I agree that something like these, reframing it to include the idea that NO we’re not talking about letting the robbers get away, but that there are so many other issues.

      Reply
    165. 165.

      japa21

      @The Thin Black Duke:  So does everyone else here on BJ. That particular slogan has nothing to do with that desire, however. In fact, the use of that slogan became a major focus rather than the real problem of systemic racism within the justice system, extending far beyond police departments.
      It’s like the phrase ACAB. Not only is it inaccurate, it also distracts from the greater problem.

      Reply
    166. 166.

      Elizabelle

      @The Thin Black Duke:   I know.  And Black Lives Matter means precisely that.  And I think it’s been an incredibly effective slogan and movement, based upon tragedy after tragedy after needless death.  Like school shootings.  So many that you just remember the top seven to ten murders/excessive use of force by name, and it keeps happening and happening.  In this country, and not so much others.  American exceptionalism, again.

      When you run across someone who refuses to acknowledge what BLM means, you are dealing with someone who is part of the problem.

      Reply
    167. 167.

      Baud

      @Elizabelle:

      My original point was basically that the GOP will find ways to divide our coalition and some of those ways won’t be entirely made up out of nothing.  In each particular case the margins are small, but I suspect there will be a sliver of people who fall for each attempt.  The vast majority of people are set in favor of one of the two parties.

      Reply
    170. 170.

      Geminid

      And in other news, the Senate has confirmed Linda Thomas-Greenfield as the new U.N. Ambassodor. She is a 35-year veteran of the Foreign Service. The vote was 78-20.

      Reply
    173. 173.

      Shana

      @Just Some Fuckhead: My SIL calls stuff like that (Family’s last name) Planning. Take an ordinary task like figuring out driving a number of people to a location, add in picking up some people at different locations and between themselves they will come up with the most convoluted inefficient manner of accomplishing it. I can’t count the number of times we’ve just looked at each other in disbelief and the contortions they will put themselves through.

      Reply
    174. 174.

      Elizabelle

      @The Thin Black Duke:   What drives me nuts, and I am sorry to say that I am seeing it in my own extended family,  is the — why yes, they are all white men, every single one of them — who appear to believe that Black Lives Matter and Blue Lives Matter are diametrically opposed.

      When, it seems to me, they could be actually more symbiotic.  Reckless, murderous police officers who should not be on the force endanger other police officers as well.  There have been revenge killings.

      I don’t understand why these beloved male inlaws stubborn and uncurious jerks cannot acknowledge how different policing is for people of color, and even for the occasional white person who comes across one of the force’s not finest.

      I think we need to massively retrain the police in de-escalation techniques.

      I also think the police are secretly afraid of the public they have pledged to serve and protect because there are way too many guns out there.  And they really take their fear out on black and brown people, but you also see a smaller toll of white people dead of excessive force too.

      I hope Merrick Garland’s DOJ can turn their attention to this, and the fact that white supremacists have infiltrated (or, face it, never left) some law enforcement agencies is likely to be an early thread of DOJ investigations.

      It’s sickening to deal with so many people who are zero sum types.

      Reply
    175. 175.

      Dopey-o

      @different-church-lady:
      .

      different-church-lady
      FEBRUARY 23, 2021 AT 8:42 PM

      @Just Some Fuckhead: Might be easiest of all to just change the damn boneheaded slogan.

      Stupid shibboleth. Says “Kick me again!” Better slogan?

      “We need to help to over-worked, under-resourced, under-paid police. Cops shouldn’t be distracted by mental patients, homeless people, or domestic disputes. We need to HELP the police do their jobs.”

      Okay, try to make right-wing points off of that. Thanks, George Lakoff.

      Reply
    176. 176.

      Salty Sam

      @Tom Levenson: That’s an MG-TD. I drove one once. Drove like a little truck

      My high school buddy let me drive his MG Midget once.  It was nothing like driving a truck, I fact it was Iike nothing I’ve ever driven before or since.  It was so tight and responsive that it seemed like the car was driving me.  And when I played with quick fast side-to-side swerves, it DID start driving me.  The front wheels and suspension got into a positive feedback loop with the pavement and the swerving grew in amplitude- I was seconds away from losing control and flipping his car on a crowded freeway.  I locked the wheel as best I could and played the brakes and regained control.  Then pulled over to the shoulder and trembled for a good five minutes.

      Other than that, it was a really fun car to drive.

      Reply
    177. 177.

      Gravenstone

      @Amir Khalid: Right wing talking point successfully inserted into the right wing media noise chamber. Mission accomplished!

      Wonder if I can fit any more buzzwords into this?

      Reply
    179. 179.

      Elizabelle

      @Kattails:   Reform the Police is a non-starter, because it’s in the “thoughts and prayers”  nonsensical slogan category, and police themselves and their political allies have fought “reform” quite effectively.

      “Defund” sounds too much like “Abolish” though, for someone who is new to the slogan or even malicious.

      Reply
    180. 180.

      Ceci n est pas mon nym

      @Amir Khalid: Nor does the President. That doesn’t stop Republicans from saying “Biden’s going to defund the police” and having their followers believe it.

      Reply
    181. 181.

      Kattails

      @Brachiator: Not arguing.  What this comment set seems to be about is how to just end-run all the usual bullshit objections with a slight rewording.  I would actually prefer Black Rights are Human Rights, (similar to Women’s rights) because it would be harder to co-opt to the All lives/blue lives etc. However, it has taken hold, which is great.

      I’m not arguing against using a shiv, just for doing so with some subtlety and distraction.

      Reply
    184. 184.

      Chacal Charles Calthrop

      @Dorothy A. Winsor:  Remember when the notorious RGB was “Justice Ginsburg”? When she was being confirmed in 1993, she admitted that she’d smoked pot. Of course the press led with the headline, “Ginsburg Smoked Dope,” and I, being in school and thinking of the poet Allan Ginsberg, saw that and thought, it’s news to someone that Allan Ginsberg smokes pot?

      Reply
    186. 186.

      TS (the original)

      @Dorothy A. Winsor:

      I would suggest Chris Hayes is a bad judge of what counts as national news. Tiger Woods accepted a medal of freedom from the previous president*. As per the “cancel culture” thread a few days ago – I no longer have any interest in hearing about  anything connected to Woods.

      Reply
    187. 187.

      Kattails

      @The Thin Black Duke: You might be interested in this article in Psychology Today, linking deaths by domestic violence with the rise in white supremacy.  I completely understand that you want cops to stop killing black people.  I would like to completely undo the notions that, for example, trespassing or theft or wanting to leave a relationship are reasonable causes for summary execution (by this I’m referring to the “you enter my house I get to kill you” mentality).  About four women a day are killed by a domestic partner.  I want that to stop too.  It appears that these issues are related.  Perhaps this is worth looking into.

      Reply
    188. 188.

      Elizabelle

      @Geminid:   Linda Thomas-Greenfield.  She’s wonderful.  Love that there are people like her in this world. I’m glad she got an actual bipartisan vote of support. Foo on those who opposed her.

      WaPost food section (!) profiled her recently, for her “gumbo diplomacy.”  And shared her recipe and, wow, that one is a labor of love. (30 minutes constant stirring for the roux!, although she can do it in 20. And she is not a fan of tomato paste. — “While she’s all about flexibility, she does have strong opinions when it comes to gumbo: “Do not use tomato paste or sauce. I hate red gumbos. … Gumbo should have a nice brownish color.”)

      Have a taste of ‘gumbo diplomacy’ by making this Biden nominee’s classic recipe

      … Thomas-Greenfield, a 35-year veteran of the Foreign Service, explained how she would invite her counterparts in countries such as Nigeria into her home to cook and eat together: “I put a Cajun spin on it. … It was my way of breaking down barriers, connecting with people and starting to see each other on a human level. A bit of lagniappe is what we say in Louisiana.”

      Still, like many who make gumbo regularly, she faced a hurdle when The Washington Post asked her to share her recipe. “I don’t have one,” said Thomas-Greenfield, who is awaiting a Senate confirmation hearing that could have her following in the footsteps of George H.W. Bush, Madeleine Albright, Andrew Young and Susan Rice. “I’ve never cooked gumbo from a recipe. I learned it from watching.”

      … Thomas-Greenfield, 68, has had plenty of opportunity to share her gumbo around the world, including in Gambia, Kenya, Jamaica, Liberia, Pakistan and Switzerland. She began working in the Foreign Service under President Ronald Reagan, then served as ambassador to Liberia under President George W. Bush and assistant secretary of state for African affairs under President Barack Obama. She retired from the State Department in 2017, after the inauguration of [that guy we are all sick of talking about; Individual One].

      Thomas-Greenfield said she is eager for the appointment to Biden’s Cabinet because it will “give me an opportunity to really bring back to our foreign policy the relationships and the values that have been so key to our success as a country. Those values that I think relate to gumbo diplomacy are generosity, hospitality, its kindness … all of that.”

      She first heard the phrase “gumbo diplomacy” from a fellow Foreign Service officer and realized that’s what she had been practicing throughout her career. “When we were living overseas, we had staff who were supporting us, but if I had people over to my house and I really wanted them to enjoy the meal, I’d cook myself,” she said. “I’d make red beans and rice, or gumbo, and it was always a conversation.

      “It causes people to relax. You’re sitting around. You’re talking about food. You’ve had this really important conversation around human rights. Now, you’re having a conversation about what you put in your gumbo and what a roux actually is, but you’re also talking about a certain issue happening in a country.”

      … Gumbo is a great example of how great things can come from being flexible and resourceful, she said.

      “People will say ‘I can’t make gumbo because I don’t have filé,’ or because I don’t have celery, or ‘I can’t have this conversation with you because I haven’t gotten instructions,’ ” she said. “You will never have 100 percent of what you need to get to the point of negotiation, and you may never have everything you need to make the perfect gumbo. You just work with what you have at the table.”

      Reply
    191. 191.

      The Thin Black Duke

      @Elizabelle: No, we’re not. Your commentary is always worthwhile. We’re on the same side. Same church, different pew. I think the past four years have been–difficult.

      Reply
    194. 194.

      Lymie

      Neera Tanden criticized Manchin‘s daughter, explains a lot: https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-epipen-ceo-bresch-salary-20160824-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true

      Reply
    195. 195.

      Jager

      @Kattails: My wife and I were waiting for our car one night at the valet stand, we struck up a conversation with an older couple while we waited. Their car rolled up, an MG like the one in the picture. I asked him how he liked it, He said, “We love it, we bought it new and drove it on our honeymoon.” At that time the car was 50 years old.

      Reply
    196. 196.

      frosty

      @CaseyL:  Yes, the British cars were small. I had a Bugeye and a TR-3 and I could slide open the side curtains on the passenger side while driving.

      Bought a Miata in ‘89. I had to lean way over to crank the pac window down. It was a much wider car. Just as much fun as the others though!

      Reply
    200. 200.

      jonas

      @Elizabelle: ​
        A little Streisand Effect there? Had he just quietly kept his head down, we wouldn’t all be talking now about HOW JOE MANCHIN’S DAUGHTER PROFITEERED OFF EPIPEN AND HOW HE’S BLOCKING TANDEN BECAUSE OF BUTTHURT.

      Oh, sorry. Was I saying the quiet parts out loud again? My bad.

      Reply
    201. 201.

      cain

      @Malovich: ​
       

      Patrick Rothfuss, The Wise Man’s Fear

      On the other hand, fuck this guy – he’s never going to complete that book series. I fell in love with the Name of the Wind – bah. At least Wheel of TIme was completed.

      Reply
    202. 202.

      bluefish

      @dmsilev: Snowflake and the Security Guard. The Movie.

      I did not know that Garland was in charge of any aspect of the OK City bombing investigation til a few days ago. What a tragedy that was.

      I was very pregnant walking past the FBI building on a rare lunch break with my baby papa on the day of that disaster. This was pre cell phone and instant internet and all our current info pokes. Cannot remember how we found out really. But we did, the two or three of us. Beautiful, sunny day. I am sorry I can’t remember how we learned it on the street.

      Bill Clinton turned up later in OK City and gave the finest speech of his career. This stuff has been going on forever. That soon to be baby at the time is now 25. I remember that moment a lot. Strolling down the avenue on a beautiful, breezy day, just having had a nice office lunch with my guy. This was before we learned of the deaths at the daycare center. Long time ago.

      This country simply must pull it together. We will. I do believe that.

      Reply
    203. 203.

      Jay

      @Elizabelle:

      Policing budgets are still the largest single “line item” in Municipal budgets, ranging from being roughly 10% of all spending, to over 45%.

      Those numbers often don’t include overtime, military equipment, loss and liability. Liability and loss are usually covered by an Insurer, and are reported outside of Police budgets.

      https://www.motherjones.com/crime-justice/2020/08/the-blue-budget-what-major-cities-spend-on-police/

      In response to a nutjob stabbing sleeping unhoused people on the Subway, NYC put 500 extra Police on the Subway, on overtime. They could have housed 2500 unhoused people for the same costs. Instead of catching the “Subway Stabber” those Officers instead harassed the unhoused and skyrocketed “garbage*” arrests.

      ( a “garbage” arrest is an end of shift arrest, where for a non-crime, the Officer get’s overtime or additional overtime, during the period of escort, processing, logging evidence, and usually results in a “catch and release”, once the accused, spends the night in jail, ( or nights) and faces a preliminary hearing. It’s a means for Officers to double, triple or quadruple their take home pay while oppressing the public.)

      Camden tried “Reforming the Police”, 5 times. Failed every time.

      Things got so bad that they “cancelled” the Police, the Police Union, and replaced them with “Public Safety Officers” and a “Public Safety Office”.

      Can you come up with a short “slogan” that replaces “Defund the Police”, that covers the proposals for public safely improvements behind the slogan.

      Reply
    206. 206.

      Elizabelle

      I don’t think a slogan substitutes for policy.

      But I know that a misleading one is dangerous.

      Reallocate Police Funding.  Not every incident requires a police response.

      Reply
    207. 207.

      The Fat White Duchess

      Not really apropos of anything, but I have to share: a commenter in the Boston Globe yesterday referred to Senator Josh Hee-Haw.  (Also Tumor Torbyville and a few others.)

      Reply
    208. 208.

      Jay

      @Baud:

      there is a segment of the public that requires the Police oppress people. Lawn Order people.

      They don’t vote for the Democratic Party.

      They do vote against, but “Defund the Police” is just one of the 1000 reasons they do, and it’s not #1.

      Reply
    209. 209.

      SFAW

      @SiubhanDuinne:

      SD, I loves ya, but you’re wrong. Justice Garland means a 5-4 split on the current SCOTUS (with Roberts maybe doing the right thing once in a while), not a 6-3. Maybe Kavanaugh is the one who doesn’t get nominated, or maybe it’s Barrett. [Gorsuch might perhaps still be there, replacing Kennedy (although didn’t that corrupt mofo say he wanted Kavanaugh? I can’t remember). And although I think Garland will be an excellent AG, there are plenty of others who could also do an excellent job, including pursuing RW terrorism.

      Reply
    211. 211.

      Another Scott

      @Just Some Fuckhead: There’s politics – the noble profession of figuring out ways to solve collective issues.  And there’s getting votes for legislation to change laws.  They’re not always the same thing.

      We all here agree on the goals.  We’re arguing about the best tactics.

      Cheers,
      Scott.

      Reply
    212. 212.

      mrmoshpotato

      @Elizabelle: I don’t think a slogan substitutes for policy.

      Are you saying ideas should be fleshed out?  What’s with this adulting when it comes to politics and policies that affect hundreds of millions of people?

      Reply
    217. 217.

      Mary G

      @The Thin Black Duke: Even shit like this incident, which many white people would say “turned out OK” (ETA: charges were dropped) makes my blood boil and my heart hurt.

      An 18-year old black man — Rodney Reese — was walking home from work at @Walmart during #TexasFreeze when @PlanoPoliceDept officers charged him with “Pedestrian in the Roadway”, Tuesday. He spent the night in jail. I’m speaking with him — and the Chief of Police, tonight. @FOX4 pic.twitter.com/g6f02okXM1
      — David Sentendrey (@DavidSFOX4) February 21, 2021

      I don’t know how you stand it year in and year out. It doesn’t change. Even here in newly blue Orange County CA, the sheriff has refused to cooperate with civilian review and enforce any mask offenses  during COVID, and will probably be replaced when he goes to jail for stealing money or taking bribes like several of the past ones have. And even Martin on here doesn’t know what we can do about it because “respect” for law enforcement, which translates into “they keep the black men from taking our shit or raping us” in so many cases, is ingrained in white people from the cradle and goes so deep they don’t even know it. I frankly don’t know how you stand it.

      Reply
    219. 219.

      Mary G

      So the man who gouged a Capitol Police officer's eye out is………..a retired police officer. It's a cult.— TheDaily (@StopTheCriminal) February 23, 2021

      Found a link as well. https://t.co/FeDPWjP3ia— TheDaily (@StopTheCriminal) February 23, 2021

      I get the “wanted from the Capitol riots” tweets from the FBI and I’ve been wondering why, with such clear pictures of his face, they could not ID this guy, and it’s because of the blue wall of silence.

      Reply
    220. 220.

      Jay

      @Elizabelle:

      doesn’t really cover it. Doesn’t cover the opportunity costs and other investments in public safety that Cities can’t make because “Policing Costs” suck the budget dry, like vampires.

      doesn’t cover or even suggest that in the absence of many Social Services, Police Forces are placed into roles they are not suited for.

      does not mention the whole “Warrior Cop” ethos where they see, and are trained, to see themselves as separate, special, not part of the community, not part of society, and as enforcers and punishers.

      Needs work.

      Every past attempt to “Hold Police Accountable” has failed.

      Reply
    222. 222.

      Elizabelle

      @Jay:   It’s a problem from hell.  And it’s complicated, but very simple in that its impact — undue amount of deaths due to bad policing — is apparent.

      At least with Biden and Democrats, the issue is on the table.  I think there is also a real desire to improve the situation, at least in communities with good leadership.

      Reply
    223. 223.

      lurker

      @cain: likely true.

      however, you have to want the job of supreme court justice – it carries some significant restrictions.  People have talked about nominating Obama for it, and I do not see him wanting the limitations.  McConnell might have had good reason to work against his own nomination.  So we might have gotten a good result there because he worked against it.  ‘cuz McConnell strikes me as likely to be a terrible Supreme Court justice.

      Reply
    224. 224.

      lurker

      @Chacal Charles Calthrop: pretty much had the same thought during that confirmation.  had managed for forget she admitted to it.  thinking back on it now, it would likely be unusual for someone in her circles to not have at least tried it.

      Reply
    226. 226.

      Jay

      @Elizabelle:

      there are those who want change, and then there are the Cops.

      Camden solved the problem by getting “rid of Cops”.

      Up here, in Canada, despite more education, more training, more liability, more “accountability”, we have the same problems.

      People who understand the problems, have no issues with “Defund the Police”.

      People who do have a knee jerk response,

      well, there are a lot of different issues from “ not wasting my pretty mind” on understanding how fucked up it is ( blinders) to actually appreciating that cops are “slave catchers”.

      sadly, as long as it’s “not their problem”, a lot of people really don’t care.

      Slogans, catchphrases, really don’t impact that.

      There is the old saying that one rotten apple spoils the barrel. In the past few years, between social media and cellphones, it has been made clear, it ain’t one rotten apple.

      Logically, we as a society should be asking WTF is wrong with apples and why do we still have/grow/eat them?

      That’s a deep dive, most people don’t want to take.

      President Joe Biden announced a few weeks ago, a moratorium on deportations. ICE has amped them up.

      All across the board, it’s a huge problem.

      And it’s not just Cops, it’s Courts, the Jail System, the whole Criminal Justice system.

      Reply
    227. 227.

      trnc

      @SiubhanDuinne: ​
       

      Far be it from me to give Moscow Mitch credit for anything with a positive outcome, but it’s possible that he did us all a huge favour five years ago. I think Merrick Garland may end up being more consequential (in the good way) as AG than he would have been as a SC Justice.

      Maybe, but it’s also possible that RBG decided not to retire when she realized MM would not hold any nomination hearings. If Garland had been seated and I’m right about RBG, we’d have a much different SC today. Having said that, I’m glad Garland will be the AG under the current circumstances.

      Reply
    228. 228.

      trnc

      @Just Some Fuckhead: ​
       

      What’s easier, running from it and making it look like a real issue or just pointing out (when asked) that “defund the police” is an argument to put more money into community health and stop requiring police officers to deal with stuff they shouldn’t be dealing with?

      If you’re explaining, you’re losing. That doesn’t mean nothing worthwhile should ever have to be explained. It means that a lot more energy has to be spent explaining that it isn’t actually what it sounds like it is.

      Reply
    229. 229.

      trnc

      @Elizabelle: ​
       

      I think “Defund the Police” is the stupidest goddamn slogan I have EVER heard.

      It’s not even informative, unless you’re among the woke. It’s an enormous own goal.

      “Reallocate Police Funding” or “Refocus the Policing Mission” or any number of informative slogans would be better. Something that sounds positive, and not punitive.

      I think “Reform The Police” would have been a pretty good choice because anyone who saw the Floyd murder and heard about the multiple other incidents understand the need for reform in a heartbeat. I’ve read that the word Reform was explicitly shied away from because some organizers believe reforms are empty promises. I understand that, but I think that was a mistake. Abolition and emancipation were empty promises until they weren’t. Everything has a breaking point, but the Defund slogan was almost guaranteed to drive some of the people away whom we need to have invested in the effort.

      Reply
    230. 230.

      Geminid

      @Geminid: I may have jumped the gun on the U.N. Ambassador vote. Last night The Times of Israel talked of a 78-20 vote to confirm Linda Thomas-Greenfield, even had a congratulatory message from the Israeli U.N. Ambassador. But this morning Political Playbook said the confirmation vote was scheduled for 11am today. Yesterday evening’s vote must have been procedural, to bring the matter to the floor.

      Reply
    232. 232.

      Uncle Cosmo

      @Lymie: Neera Tanden criticized Manchin‘s daughter, explains a lot: https://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-epipen-ceo-bresch-salary-20160824-story.html?outputType=amp&__twitter_impression=true

      Manchin hails from the same part of WV (Marion County) as my mother’s family. One of my favorite cousins – who may have been the most dedicated Trump-despiser in the Mountaineer State before her tragic demise a couple of years ago – was def not a Manchin fan; she alluded to some chicanery involving EpiPens and Joe’s little girl. This sounds like it.

      FTR, as I told my dear departed cousin on more than one occasion, I will hold my nose & continue to defend Manchin, as a reliable Democratic vote in the Senate whenever it’s needed (whatever he might say beforehand), until & unless a less ethically challenged Democratic candidate surfaces with even a whiff of a chance of keeping that seat blue.

      Reply
    233. 233.

      Another Scott

      @trnc:  My gut feeling is that Moscow Mitch was happy to let Obama have new justices to replace existing liberal seats (Stevens->Kagan 2009, Souter->Sotomayor 2009), but he was not going to give Obama the power to change the ideological tilt of the majority on the SCOTUS. So when Scalia died in 2016, he was going to do everything in his power to keep Obama from getting to place the replacement.

      Even if the replacement was someone that everyone agreed would be a fine and fair Justice (Garland) that they would support.

      When Previous Guy was in, of course Moscow Mitch was overjoyed to tilt the balance as far right as possible. The SCOTUS has a latching ratchet as far as MM is concerned – never more liberal, always static or more conservative.

      Of course, politics changed under Obama’s 8 years. Would Moscow Mitch have gone full-obstruction if Scalia had died in Obama’s first term? Dunno, but it’s possible.

      Cheers,
      Scott.

      Reply
    234. 234.

      brantl

      @Just Some Fuckhead: Piss off. Everything isn’t about privilege. And who is going to do the job that actually requires a cop, if there are no cops left? And there are some jobs that actually require a damn cop.

      Reply

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