"By the time we get through this winter, probably 30% of the public will have had COVID," says @ScottGottliebMD on @FaceTheNation. "So they'll have some natural immunity." That means "we don't need to vaccinate 70% of the public." A lower percentage of the remainder will suffice.
— Will Saletan (@saletan) November 22, 2020
Some Americans are ignoring a government warning against traveling for Thanksgiving because of COVID-19. Dr. Anthony Fauci says it’s a good time for Americans to do a serious ‘risk-benefit assessment’ before they go https://t.co/9lPyydfM3P pic.twitter.com/DvxrkNMRaa
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
Most coronavirus cases are spread by people without symptoms, CDC now says https://t.co/uJIAQpTbkl
— Carl Zimmer (@carlzimmer) November 23, 2020
The number of active cases in the US has risen to over 4.8 million. pic.twitter.com/62VZhuTwi4
— Patrick Chovanec (@prchovanec) November 23, 2020
======
Lockdowns could be avoided if everyone followed health measures such as wearing masks, the World Health Organization's top Europe official said https://t.co/VXAgEXbbxO
— CNN (@CNN) November 22, 2020
US vs EU
One major difference now: Europeans responding effectively to massive second wave. US, so far, not. pic.twitter.com/MukkP5vgHu
— ian bremmer (@ianbremmer) November 22, 2020
Germany's confirmed coronavirus cases rise by 10,864: RKI https://t.co/JFIpA2Aw3V pic.twitter.com/CGFR3RyoN5
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
Paging commentor Satby:
Madrid’s ancient and emblematic Rastro flea market reopened at 50% capacity after a contentious eight-month closure because of the COVID-19 pandemic. Police with backup drones monitored the market to avoid overcrowding. https://t.co/6j5X7hrVWD
— AP Europe (@AP_Europe) November 22, 2020
Italy is again seeing one of the world’s highest coronavirus death tolls, but it no longer registers as a national tragedy https://t.co/pzFaKzM44x
— delthia ricks ? (@DelthiaRicks) November 22, 2020
As Russia struggles to handle the second wave of the coronavirus pandemic, Moscow has begun converting sites such as a massive ice skating rink into makeshift hospitals for treating Covid-19 patientshttps://t.co/c2vApL96Nu
— The Moscow Times (@MoscowTimes) November 22, 2020
Gaza health system 'days from being overwhelmed', experts warn as Covid-19 cases soar https://t.co/W5p752JgxI
— BBC News (World) (@BBCWorld) November 22, 2020
Australia’s two most populous states reopened their borders after more than four months, as Victoria stamped out a second coronavirus wave, raising prospects of a quicker return to normal https://t.co/829xK7FeYd pic.twitter.com/gWOGqFxETD
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
Chinese authorities are testing millions of people, imposing lockdowns and shutting down schools after locally transmitted coronavirus cases were discovered in three cities across the country last week. https://t.co/za5WKKvKdv
— The Associated Press (@AP) November 23, 2020
South Korea reports 271 new COVID-19 cases as tighter curbs to take effect https://t.co/nXxgKNeuJt pic.twitter.com/M51IG1jUz9
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
Covid: 'Families in hospital after Delhi coronavirus surge' https://t.co/VKkYp8ocFk
— BBC News (World) (@BBCWorld) November 23, 2020
Mexico posts rare jump above 9,000 for new COVID-19 cases https://t.co/Lwfb5gXDgc pic.twitter.com/msB5TOXmnR
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
======
Researchers examine which approaches are most effective at reducing COVID-19 spread https://t.co/13PpwAe27b via @medical_xpress
— delthia ricks ? (@DelthiaRicks) November 23, 2020
AstraZeneca said its vaccine for the coronavirus could be around 90% effective without any serious side effects, the latest drugmaker to unveil positive interim data in a scientific race to curb a global pandemic https://t.co/7Gfn5v4BVr
— Reuters UK (@ReutersUK) November 23, 2020
The first COVID-19 immunizations could happen on Dec. 12, the head of the U.S. effort to produce a coronavirus vaccine says. That's two days after a Food and Drug Administration committee is set to meet to discuss a vaccine being developed by Pfizer Inc. https://t.co/nxoq8pa9j6
— The Associated Press (@AP) November 22, 2020
New type of test may better discern long-term immunity to the #coronavirus https://t.co/LPDaBWGHrf
— delthia ricks ? (@DelthiaRicks) November 22, 2020
"This isn’t the battle of scientific publications, this isn't a battle of drugs or a battle between drug companies. This is about getting the BEST possible information to clinicians who save lives," –@WHO dir. @DrMikeRyan on the systematic review of data on #COVID19 therapeutics. pic.twitter.com/Kf5geKcePh
— Global Health Strategies (@GHS) November 20, 2020
The American Academy of Pediatrics says it's time to add kids to COVID19 vaccine trials https://t.co/jhJ4gRZkTM pic.twitter.com/FRToX9Tjbv
— delthia ricks ? (@DelthiaRicks) November 22, 2020
FDA has approved the Regeneron's antibody "cocktail." The green light for REGEN-COV2, a combo of 2 lab-made antibodies, was shown to reduce COVID19-related hospitalizations & emergency room visits. Regeneron expects to have 80k doses ready by the end of November pic.twitter.com/MpdJSjCUUD
— delthia ricks ? (@DelthiaRicks) November 22, 2020
======
On Jul3 the Governor of Kansas issued a mask-wearing order, but gave Counties the right to opt in or out: 24 opted YES? & 81 said NO. The @CDCgov tracked what happened in Jul/Aug & it couldn't possibly be clearer: pro-mask counties have far less #COVID19 https://t.co/UBO8pWSjtA pic.twitter.com/pDkG5Ze81H
— Laurie Garrett (@Laurie_Garrett) November 22, 2020
South Dakota peaked with the highest death rate per capita for any place in the global pandemic pic.twitter.com/LICPlKRxlP
— Eric Topol (@EricTopol) November 22, 2020
“What keeps me awake at night is that we have not felt the admissions of the 4,000-patient-a-day caseloads. We’re going to feel that in the next week or so. But our hospital already is at 100% capacity,” said Dr. Sean Callahan, a Utah pulmonologist https://t.co/ub1HoseKMk
— Dr Kathleen Bachynski (@bachyns) November 22, 2020
Nevada tightens COVID-19 limits on casinos, eateries; broadens mask mandate https://t.co/f0yuwVwfpU pic.twitter.com/KkVn7Ug1Ye
— Reuters (@Reuters) November 23, 2020
I C U, Governor. https://t.co/a4enAko3tW
— Charles P. Pierce (@CharlesPPierce) November 23, 2020
BREAKING: GOP Sen. Kelly Loeffler, in critical Georgia runoff, tests positive for coronavirus. https://t.co/f3x9pO85G4
— ABC News (@ABC) November 22, 2020
Me, age 15, goth: i want to die
Me, age 40, driving by packed brunch place with a ton of people without masks: shit i was such a poser these people the real deal
— Kyle Machulis (@qDot) November 22, 2020
Mary G
It’s still amazing how you produce these posts day in, day out, AL. Kudos.
OzarkHillbilly
@Mary G: She;s tireless. I however get tired just thinking about it.
rikyrah
I totally appreciate these posts.
I admit… I haven’t been this terrified since the beginning of the pandemic. Trying to make it until Wednesday. Then I will be at home for five days. I want our Governor to shut us down. Trying to get staff laptops so that they can work from home.
opiejeanne
I didn’t realize Astra Zeneca was the name of a company, thought it was the name of a drug. I tend to ignore or FF through the drug ads.
“Ask your doctor if this crap is what you need. The side effects may include diarrhea, internal hemorrhaging, tuberculosis, cancer of the liver, or hair loss.”
Mousebumples
Thanks for these, AL.
As much as I look forward to the day they’re no longer needed, they are appreciated.
opiejeanne
@rikyrah: I hear you about being scared. I hope you can figure things out and that neither you nor your coworkers catch it.
And Ann Laurie, thank you so much for doing this for us.
OzarkHillbilly
@opiejeanne: “or death.”
opiejeanne
@OzarkHillbilly: Yes. And there wasn’t even a choice of cake.
Brachiator
I don’t remember if this popped up here before, but some folks who are still wondering whether to have or attend a big Thanksgiving dinner might want to take a look at the Covid Risk Assessment Planning Tool.
You can choose a US county and specify the number of people in a dinner party and get a rough percentage of the chance that someone may become infected with the virus.
This was discussed on a recent episode of the BBC math and statistics program, More or Less.
In local news, Los Angeles county, one of the largest counties in California, is going to introduce additional restrictions effective Wednesday.
This may be necessary, but it may have a devastating effect on restaurants. Also, some people may have made reservations for Thanksgiving dinner Thursday at some places that have now been ordered to close. There is also, unfortunately, increasing resistance to shutdown measures, and some officials in some communities have said that they will not enforce the 10pm curfew that the governor put into place last week.
But the numbers in LA county are grim:
On Sunday, the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health reported 2,718 new cases of COVID-19 and nine additional deaths, bringing the county’s totals to 364,520 cases and 7,438 fatalities. The previous three days had each seen more than 4,000 cases reported, including a single-day record of 5,031 cases on Thursday….
The number of county residents hospitalized with the virus increased from 1,391 Saturday to 1,401, with 26% in intensive care. That’s more than double the daily number in the beginning of October, when it was under 700.
OzarkHillbilly
@opiejeanne: Say WHAT? Give me German Chocolate cake or give me death!
Winston
@opiejeanne: Astra Zeneca is a subsidiary of Pfizer and they have been fined many millions over the last decade for publishing false information about their products. As is typical for Pfizer (except billions).
ETA to add link. https://violationtracker.goodjobsfirst.org/parent/pfizer
NotMax
Number of countries reporting cumulative case totals of 500k or higher is now 21.
U.S. ~12,379k
India ~9140k
Brazil ~6071k
France ~2140k
Russia ~2115k
Spain ~1557k
U.K. ~1512k
Italy ~1409k
Argentina ~1370k
Colombia ~1248k
Mexico ~1042k
Peru ~950k
Germany ~932k
Poland ~876k
Iran ~854k
South Africa ~768k
Ukraine ~636k
Belgium ~559k
Chile ~541k
Iraq ~535k
Indonesia ~502k
.
Winston
@Winston: Actually I was thinking of another company Warner Lambert. Sorry disregard my post
opiejeanne
@Winston: Thanks for the clarification.
Brachiator
I’m a little tired (insomnia), but this doesn’t quite seem right:
Unless you do a lot of testing and screening before you give someone the vaccine, would we really know who has already had the virus? And I didn’t think we knew whether getting the virus necessarily bestows immunity.
Amir Khalid
Malaysia’s daily Covid-19 numbers. Director-General of Health Dr Noor Hisham Abdullah reports a whopping 1,884 new cases today, a new record, for a cumulative reported total of 56,659 cases. He also reports two new deaths for a total of 337 deaths — 0.59% of the cumulative reported total, 0.79% of resolved cases.
More than half of today’s new cases — 1,060 — are in Teratai cluster in Selangor, involving workers at Top Glove, the world’s largest manufacturer of latex surgical gloves. The Top Glove factory workers dorms are under enhanced movement control orders, and the factory itself is undergoing a staged closure of its 28 buildings to enable the Health Ministry to conduct screenings.
13,842 active and contagious cases are currently in hospital; 115 are in ICU, 48 of them on respirators. Meanwhile, 883 patients recovered and were discharged, for a total of 42,480 patients recovered — 75.0% of the cumulative reported total.
Four new clusters were reported today: Bintang in KL, Indah Mas in KL and Selangor, Teja Kasih in Perak, and Kobena in Johor.
1,882 new cases are local infections. Selangor has the most cases, 1,203: 1,099 in existing clusters including the aforementioned 1,060 in Teratai cluster; 77 close-contact screenings; and 27 other screenings. Sabah has 289 cases: 52 in existing clusters, 164 close-contact screenings, and 73 other screenings. KL has 195 cases: 107 in older clusters, 80 in Bintang dan Indah Mas clusters, and eight other screenings.
Perak has 80 cases: 38 in older clusters, 38 in Teja Kasih cluster, 4 close-contact screenings, and one other screening. Negeri Sembilan has 41 cases: 39 in existing clusters, and two close-contact screenings. Kedah has 36 cases: 33 in existing clusters, two close-contact screenings, and one other screening. Penang has 12 cases: seven in existing clusters, two close-contact screenings, and three other screenings
Johor has 14 cases: three in older clusters, four in Kobena cluster, and seven close-contact screenings. Kelantan has nine cases: seven in existing clusters, and two close-contact screenings. Putrajaya has one case, found in other screening. And Perlis has one case, found in other screening.
Melaka, Pahang, Labuan, Sarawak, and Terengganu have reported no new cases today.
Two new cases are imported, reported in KL and Johor. They are arrivals from Singapore and India.
The two deaths today, both reported in Sabah, are a 80-year-old man, and an 58-year-old woman with hypertension, heart disease, and chronic obstructive pulmonary disease.
Winston
@opiejeanne: AstraZeneca violations. (They are not a subsidiary.)
https://violationtracker.goodjobsfirst.org/prog.php?parent=astrazeneca
NeenerNeener
338 new cases in Monroe County, NY yesterday with 3 more people in the ICU. Even when a vaccine gets here I’m not sure it will do me any good because I’m on immune system suppressors.
YY_Sima Qian
Yesterday, China reported 2 new domestic confirmed cases and 0 new asymptomatic cases. Both cases are reported by Shanghai Municipality, 1 case is a colleague and close contact of the previously reported UPS logistics workers at Shanghai Pudong International Airport, and the other is a wife of one of the aforementioned UPS workers. Both have been under quarantine since 11/20. 55 close contacts and 2,541 regular contact/at risk individuals have been traced and tested, all negative do date.
Shanghai had not resorted to mass testing at a large scale with the current outbreak, but last night decided to test all employees at the Pudong Airport. The decision was made in haste, and required all day shift employees to get swabbed before they could leave the premises, causing significant congestion at several choke points. As of 9:30 AM, all 17,719 employees have been swabbed, all 11,544 results obtained so far are negative. All 4,015 patients/caretakers/staff at Pudong Hospital (where one of the recent cases work as a nurse) have been tested, all negative. They remain under quarantine and will be tested again.
Shanghai Municipal Health Commission also reported results of the source investigation into the two logistics workers who had tested positive on 11/10. Both had worked to unload an air freight shipping create from the US, without wearing masks. The interior was full of foam material and very humid. Viral samples taken from these two cases are are almost identical in genomic sequence, and match that currently prevalent in North America. 28 Tier 1 close contacts, 190 Tier 2 close contacts, 51 regular contacts and 9,617 at risk individuals have been traced and tested, all negative so far.
As of 7 PM on 11/22, 2,245,839 residents and workers in Binhai New District in Tianjin Municipality have been swabbed. Of the 1,002,734 results have been obtained, all negative.
Yesterday, China reported 9 new imported confirmed cases and 10 imported asymptomatic cases:
Yesterday, Hong Kong reported 73 new cases, 10 imported and 63 local (8 of whom with out clear sources of infection). There are several clusters associated with dance clubs, making up the majority of local cases in the current wave.
Amir Khalid
I heard that Kelly Loeffler had tested positive AND negative over the past few days. Is this positive test
positivedefinitive?Just One More Canuck
@NeenerNeener: yes but even if you can’t get the vaccine you will still benefit from the people around you who get it
satby
@AL: huh, drones in the market. I could totally support that if they were equipped with something like a low level tazer that zaps a non-mask wearers.
opiejeanne
@Amir Khalid: The positive test was the more reliable of the test types. The negative and another test that was inconclusive were both the rapid test, which is less reliable.
And just like Trump, she wants a do-over.
raven
Dr Dave “If you cannot, or will not, the limit, limit, limit.”
raven
greenergood
@NeenerNeener: Google ‘Covid vaccine for immunosuppressed people’ and a bunch of different articles come up like this one: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-55022288 There’s trials going on for treatment for immunosuppessed people. The article cited above says that they don’t expect widespread use to be possible for at least a few months, but you never know …
NeenerNeener
@greenergood: Thanks! It’s nice to think I may be able to set foot outside my house some day soon without waiting for herd immunity for the whole world.
Anne Laurie
@Brachiator: I’m dubious, too. Dr. Scott Gottlieb seems to be one of those ‘all is for the best in this best of all possible worlds’ guys who is popular with live-tv bookers because he’ll always answer their texts & show up on short notice. I led with that tweet specifically because I suspect (cynic that I am) we’ll be seeing all too much of such ‘reasoning’ until the Biden administration can take over — We don’t have to do a good job vaccinating people, so long as we’re throwing around doses and visualizing a sufficient level of immunity!
Zzyzx
@Brachiator:
We have pretty strong data that it provides some as the number of reinfection cases are maybe a dozen or so whereas the number of infections has been in the millions. If there weren’t general immunity for at least 8 months, the NYC area would be a lot worse now.
Zzyzx
If it weren’t for the holidays, I actually would be feeling good about January. The second derivative has turned negative and if you look at the worldometers 7 day average, we’ve plateaued in cases. Between that and the new restrictions, December is going to suck as the new cases turn into hospitalizations and deaths but this could be the worst of it.
The wild card, of course, though is how many people do stupid things this week. I’m lucky in that I only know one person personally who is traveling but they’re really annoying me by posting their vacation photos as though this were normal times.
WereBear
@Anne Laurie: Thank you, that was MY take. Entirely too freakin’ Trumpian.
Winston
@Anne Laurie: That’s about the way I see it. In about a year or two, lots will have taken the experimental vaccines and the pharma companies will cash their checks and their investors will be richer and the lawsuits against them for fraud will be going on and we will all be wiser.
Winston
@Winston: A vaccine is just another virus that is less harmful than the one it’s meant to control. It stimulates your immune system to produce antibodies. Moderna has used CRISTPR technology to modify what they now call mRNA (messenger) genetic material (it used to be called mitochondrial RNA) so you gotta wonder about why they changed the name. The owners of the stock of Moderna all sold several million shares just after they announced positive results. You gotta wonder why they did that. This company is too new to have a track record of fraud like pfizer, AZ and other pharms, so they don’t have a bad rep yet. But be careful out there peeps. You may have a long life ahead of you, or not, but I don’t and I’m not going to take a chance on cutting short what I do have left
And the Biden administration is not going to be immune to this kind of corporate malfeasance,
Enhanced Voting Techniques
What’s his bases for this, the studies I have seen the worst hit communities in the Spring Wave like the Bronx only got to 10% in the six months.
Matt
Spend time with family at Thanksgiving, spend time with God at Christmas.
Winston
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: As I understand it, the northeast got hit hard because there was no precedent, since then mitigation has kept the disease somewhat in control. And I wish Cuomo was our nominee.
charon
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
This guy models, estimates in the Dakota’s the real total infected is 3 times the reported 11% confirmed infected.
Very high testing positivity means many undiagnosed cases.
https://twitter.com/youyanggu
Soprano2
I was talking to my conservative mother last night, and she brought up that “There’s a Danish study that shows masks really don’t work”. I didn’t know anything about it, but I told her that must be bullshit, because all the other studies show differently. So I looked into it this morning, and yeah, it’s bullshit. If anything was posted about it on this blog I missed it. If there’s not much community spread, and most people aren’t wearing masks, then the mask isn’t that effective at keeping the user from getting COVID. *rolleyes* Good Lord, any one of us could have told you that without doing a 5,000 person study. I didn’t realize how angry I was about all of the bullshit that’s out there until I was talking to her. She’s being pretty responsible, too, so for her to cite that “study” was discouraging to me. Plus, like all conservatives she’s fixated on New York in April, as if nothing much has happened since then. I told her that the worst place in the U.S. for COVID right now is North and South Dakota, where all the rural people though COVID couldn’t get them. She told me no, they never thought that, and I just laughed. They sure acted like COVID was never going to come there!
Another thing I found myself wondering about this weekend – are they going to recommend that people who have had COVID get vaccinated anyway? Will they be testing people to see if they’ve had it before they vaccinate? I haven’t heard any expert address this, and it’s an issue because there are so many asymptomatic cases.
Amir Khalid
@Matt:
… Or maybe find out around Christmas that you’ve been placed with the other guy.
dr. bloor
Fauci really suggested something as pathetic and ludicrous as a “risk assessment?” Because I think it’s pretty fucking clear by now how well Americans approach that particular task.
Barbara
@Soprano2: If vaccines are in short supply, then they might consider the approach that is used with chicken pox, which is that if you have had a verified case, you don’t need the vaccine. So a medical record indicating a PCR positive test might lower your priority for a vaccine. Self-reports should not be enough, and it would slow down the effort and make it more cumbersome.
Sloane Ranger
Greetings from the UK in the last full week of the English lockdown. Yesterday, we had 18,662 new cases, just over 1000 less than the previous day. The rolling 7 day average shows a 19.5% reduction from the previous 7 days. These figures may be artificially low due to the usual weekend delays but the trendline is definitely going down. Cases by home nation,
England – 16,668 (down @1000)
Northern Ireland – 342 (down 15)
Scotland – 844 (down 43)
Wales – 808 (down @200).
Deaths – There were 398 new deaths within 28 days of a positive test yesterday (usual warning applies). 370 were in England, 10 in Northern Ireland, 7 in Scotland and 11 in Wales. The rolling 7 day average shows that deaths have increased by 7% from the previous 7 days.
Testing – No update due to weekend.
Hospitalisations – There were 16,390 people in hospital on the 19th November and 1421 on ventilators on Friday, 20th. Hospital admissions are beginning to show a downwards trend and numbers in hospital and on ventilators are showing a levelling off (but weekend figures, so let’s wait and see how things look when Tuesday’s figures come in.)
General – A few days ago, Stormont (Northern Ireland Assembly) ordered a 14 day closure of non essential shops w.e.f. this coming Friday to get a handle on the virus. The great general public reacted to this by going out over the weekend in droves and shopping till they dropped. Long queues and no social distancing.
Boris Johnson is due to announce his Christmas masterplan later this pm. The newspapers are saying it will consist to stricter restrictions in England within each of the 3 tiers but with gyms being allowed to re-open and the 10pm curfew on pubs being scrapped (not seeing how this is stricter). Also the four home nation governments are apparently finalising a UK-wide relaxation in restrictions from 24-28 December allowing up to 3 households to meet together and for Christmas Eve and Christmas Day religious services to be held. I will cover in more detail tomorrow, unless AL pips me to the post.
Soprano2
Holy Shit, I just found out that the person from my office who got COVID was told by HR to come back to work today! The dumb thing is, the rest of the crew he was on are still in quarantine, and aren’t coming back until the 25th! I have no idea whether or not this person has tested as clear of the virus. What in the hell is HR thinking?!! *facepalm
YY_Sima Qian
@Sloane Ranger: I see in the news that the UK (or is it just England) is no longer requiring close contacts of COVID-19 cases to self-isolate, but replacing it by offering daily tests (RT-PCR or rapid antigen?). Oh well, I suppose compliance with the self-isolation mandate has been low anyway.
gwangung
@Winston:
They did this to make money. This is standard behavior for executives to maximize compensation. All legal and in line with ethical behavior, particularly with a startup.
That there’s a competing hypothesis that’s just as credible shows the problem with our system of executive compensation
Another Scott
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
FWIW.
(Twitter is horrible for conversation about complex or nuanced ideas.)
Cheers,
Scott.
YY_Sima Qian
Shanghai just reported the results from the just completed mass screening of all 17,719 workers at the Pudong International Airport, 1 more individual has tested positive. The case works for FedEx’s logistics branch. 17 close contacts have been traced and quarantined.
Unfortunately, the Pudong airport authorities mishandled the mass screening effort, leading to scenes of overcrowding and major congestion at several locations, as workers trying to get home jostled with medical workers and security. Hopefully they did not create a super spreading event in their attempt stamp out an outbreak. At least the scenes of congestion appears to be at cavernous indoor spaces or outdoor parking lot, and everyone had masked up.
Winston
@gwangung: Or they cashed out before someone found out they’ve lied. They are after all very closely tied to the Trump administration and I doubt they give a fuck about Dolly Parton’s feelings. I’d say they have no confidence in the long term price of their stock. And yeah, color me cynical if you want.
chopper
@Winston:
that isn’t really true. messenger rna is what’s used by ribosomes in a cell to produce proteins.
Winston
@chopper: Okay. mtRNA then. It’s still where they acquire the genetic material to do the gene editing. Like for decades, // It’s just the messenger part of mt because they say so? And don’t get me wrong, I hope what they are doing advances medicine so Doctor McCoy can use it 400 years from now.
Sloane Ranger
@YY_Sima Qian: The Government website still has an instruction to self isolate for 14 days if you come into contact with someone who tested positive. The government is planning to run a trial programme in Liverpool from Monday with daily testing using what is described as rapid lateral flow tests (sorry, don’t know anything more about them except they apparently give give results in 30 minutes). If the Liverpool trial works, they plan to go national with the thing in January 2021.
GrueBleen
After the American Academy of Pediatrics gets kids added to the set for the vaccines to be tested on, maybe it could think about adding pregnant women. Don’t want another thalidomide, do we.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Another Scott:
@charon:
Thanks, that makes some sense then.
D Gardner
@opiejeanne: Eddie Izzard for the win!
J R in WV
@Winston:
This is not a correct description of vaccines in general, nor of the newly developed vaccines for Coronavirus-19.
Many of the newly developed vaccines for Covid-19 (wonder why I changed the name? faster to type!) are developed using similar methods. I would guess mRNA is short for mitochondrial RNA, and I don’t care why they use a different name for what may very well be a slightly different kind of RNA, as in it isn’t mitochondrial at all.
The Coronavirus is all RNA, and there isn’t anything mitochrondrial about it for example.
I would bet any amount of money I know why they did that — to make a shitload of money at an appropriate point in the development of their business. You are fearful of the financial aspects as well as the scientific aspects, am I right?
I’m probably older than you and will be in line for a vaccine as soon as my family doctor tells me to show up at a shot center.
Relating the yet to exist Biden administration to any kind of corporate malfeasance at this point is plainly incorrect and malicious speculation. You more than imply that the Biden administration will foment, permit, or be in favor of “corporate malfeasance” without even offering a shred of evidence. How could the Biden administration be immune to some other entity’s “corporate malfeasance” in any case?
Your comment is poorly thought out and reeks of raging paranoia; it saddens me to see this kind of negativity here which could make our people — the Jackals — less likely to take advantage of cutting edge scientific advancement to save billions of lives. You should be ashamed of yourself!
ETA: Hmmm… “Winston” — that nym/name rings a bell, somehow… lemme think…
Chris T.
In order:
(These are all separate issues. The technical stuff around DNA, mtRNA, mRNA, transcriptions, and so on are the only ones I know very much about. I have no idea how much CRISPR actually has to do with what Moderna have been doing.)
Bill Arnold
@Winston:
Incoherent disinformation.
Are you an anti-vaxer or in the pay of some other pharmaceutical company with a competing product? A low vaccine uptake will mean continued endemic spread and death and a continuing market for e.g. monoclonal antibody products like the Regeneron product. They’re ALL driven by greed.
The mRNA vaccines are novel for sure, but safety trials will have 6 months under them before a roll-out. If the trial data is visible to independent researchers, should be fine.
J R in WV
@Winston:
I have decided to disregard all your posts… they seem to be paranoid in nature, ignorant of the topic, and sadly misguided.
I’ve also tried out the “hide post” which doesn’t have the cute icons. Not sure I’ll stick to it, but good so far.
Bye-Bye, Winston.
J R in WV
@Bill Arnold:
“Incoherent disinformation.”
I like that description, accurate in the main. Paranoid needs to be in there too, tho.
ETA: Perhaps included in “Anti-Vaxer”?
Winston
So you skeptics, please take your vaccines asap. Let me know in about 6 months how it works out. Otherwise, just kiss my ass. Oh, you can’t get them? Sucks to be you. Winston is a town in Florida.
bluefoot
@J R in WV: messenger RNA (mRNA) and mitchondrial RNA (mtRNA) are two very different things. In the case of the SARS-CoV-2 mRNA vaccines, the vaccines contain mRNA that encodes part of one of the virus proteins. The Moderna vaccine uses the the so-called “Spike” protein. Your own cells “translate” the mRNA into viral protein fragment that then triggers an immune response.
Winston
@Winston: And another thing. If you are intent on celebrating Trump’s “Warp Speed” try to remember he has lied about everything. If you think this is the one time he and his minions have not lied and you are celebrating it, please eat a big pile of shit. I’m just saying it’s garbage like the rest of his lies.
Winston
@bluefoot: So how do you know they are not lying about this? Their details have yet to be released.
Winston
@Winston: New group JBT. Jackals Believing Trump.
Winston
@Bill Arnold: I am a normal skeptic. As opposed to some pollyanna Trump lovers on this board.
chopper
@bluefoot:
exactly. different RNAs.
chopper
@Winston:
you have literally no idea what you’re talking about.
Winston
@chopper: How many RNA proteins do you think are encoded in your regular genes? How many are in encoded in your mitochondria genes and not in your regular genes? Do you even understand the difference? You are like a Guliani know nothing. Do you know what an allele is?
Winston
@Winston: Do you even know what your blood type is and why?
Uncle Cosmo
@Winston: And another thing: Fuck off and die. Maybe you can get together with “traumaturdo” and do chainsaws at 50 cm separation – that ought to do the trick.
Winston
@chopper: Here is the simple explanation that you seek. All DNA encodes RNA. Parents contribute Alleles to Nuclear DNA which encodes why you are you. Mothers contribute a mitochondria subcell which has it’s own DNA which encodes RNA which makes you a species Didn’t you assholes go to school?
Winston
@Uncle Cosmo: Yeah. I get you are a trump supporter. Fuck you.
chopper
@Winston:
that has fuck-all to do with what “messenger rna” means. you’re just flailing now. go home, you’re drunk.
Winston
I’m only saying beware of Trump lies. Get the “vaccines” under “Death Star” Or “Warp Speed” and prove to me they work. Otherwise realize these concepts are fictional and beware’
Winston
@chopper: You think messenger RNA is Luke Skywalker or something?
chopper
messenger RNA refers to the snippets of RNA that are produced by transcription of small portions of DNA in e.g. a cell nucleus, so as to facilitate production of proteins, typically by ribosomes in the cells. most all of this (production of mRNA) happens in the nucleus because it has the vast majority of DNA code which is responsible for the vast majority of protein synthesis. mitochondria (and in plant cells, chloroblasts) also contain some DNA which is used to produce a handful of proteins. but it was never true that what we call “messenger RNA” was actually called “mitchondrial RNA” and they switched the names for some reason.
chopper
i mean, messenger RNA was discovered before we even knew that mitochondria had DNA in em!
Winston
Winston: You must realize, that messenger RNA is not natural and is synthetic, right?
Winston
@chopper: See that is like Giuliani explaining voter fraud. I’m sorry you don’t see it. Mitochondrial Dna has been a fact for decades
chopper
@Winston:
were you dropped on your head at birth? messenger RNA is being created by your cell nuclei right fucking now. how the hell do you think your body creates fucking proteins?
chopper
i mean, this is basic protein synthesis. you can’t possibly be this stupid.
Winston
@chopper: Encoded DNA.
Winston
@chopper: Please state your
expertise for the record.
chopper
@Winston:
okay, explain the process, genius. how do your cells produce proteins. we’re all ears.
Winston
@chopper: I already did.
chopper
@Winston:
no you didn’t. you obviously know nothing, and rather than admitting that you were butt-ass wrong, dug yourself even deeper.
“DNA through transcription creates mRNA, which then is used by ribosomes to make proteins” is literally one of the fundamental tenets of molecular biology and you’re literally telling everyone that mRNA is manmade. your lack of even the most basic knowledge, or at least the ability to look up something that takes all of 2 seconds to do, is mindblowing.
Winston
@chopper: Here is the simple explanation that you seek. All DNA encodes RNA. Parents contribute Alleles to Nuclear DNA which encodes why you are you. Mothers contribute a mitochondria subcell which has it’s own DNA which encodes RNA which makes you a species Didn’t you assholes go to school?
Winston
@chopper: And what is you expertize?
chopper
DNA encodes messenger RNA.
go find a high school bio textbook.
here, here’s an online one.
read the bit about how proteins are made.
fuck, look it up on wikipedia FFS, takes 2 seconds. christ.
Winston
@chopper: As I said DNA encodes RNA which you have pointed out. You have expertise beyond that? See? messenger RNA is something you’ve invented.
chopper
@Winston:
messenger RNA. say it with me, you can do it.
Winston
@chopper: I won the election. Democrats cheated.
chopper
@Winston:
you know, doug, since you don’t have my email this is basically the only way we get to talk these days
Winston
@chopper: I’m not Doug. I studied genetic biology in college, if this new tech gene editing works out it will be a boon to mankind.
chopper
@Winston:
right, you studied biology in college but think that messenger RNA is something i came up with. sure thing, chief.
Winston
@chopper: RNA is by definition a copy of DNA and always has been. If mRNA exists it is a synthetic substance that we have no idea what it will do. Take it at your own risk, knowing it has been hyped by Trump and its investors have sold their stock before knowing what it will do. Cheers
chopper