This is the debate setup for tonight.
Good morning from inside the site of tonight’s Pence-Harris vice presidential debate. pic.twitter.com/MIKbhO4u8w
— Geoff Bennett (@GeoffRBennett) October 7, 2020
It’s a farce and should not be allowed to proceed.
The plexiglass really brings this laughably inadequate infection control theater set together. https://t.co/3N9E0wDQ6N
— Dr. Angela Rasmussen (@angie_rasmussen) October 7, 2020
The phone number for the Commission for Presidential Debates is (202) 872-1020. You know what to do.
Open thread!
ETA: Voice mailbox is full. Anyone got email addresses?
And the Twitter handle is @debates.
Odie Hugh Manatee
Their preparations are worse than a joke… at least a joke is funny and this shit isn’t.
trollhattan
Can we give host duties back to the League of Women Voters?
JCJ
They should hire people who made the barriers for a Chinese take out place near me. They take this seriously. This debate stage is a farce.
chopper
christ, i’ve seen salad bar sneeze guards with more protection in mind.
Elizabelle
No. Just no. Unbelievable.
sdhays
Is the Presidential Debate Commission staffed by Dump minions? And just yesterday they were saying that the moderator would get one of their joke barriers as well. Where did that go?
WaterGirl
This is totally absurd. And dangerous. It’s like they think the issue is still droplets, as opposed to the virus being airborne.
Even if they won’t fix it, Kamala should refuse to debate in person in that setting.
Baud
Jaime Harrison brought his own plexiglass that provided more protection than this.
Nelle
My husband said it doesn’t look adequate to protect Pence from being on stage with a woman. Where is Mother supposed to be?
dr. bloor
I hope Harris walks on stage with a ginormous high powered fan, plugs it in, turns it on, and points it at Pence.
Goku (Amerikan Baka)
Did the Biden campaign actually agree to this?
Goku (Amerikan Baka)
@trollhattan:
You joke, I know, but the Commission on Presidenial Debates was set up by both political parties because the LWV asked the candidates tough questions
Benw
Ffs. Also the whole vibe screams fascist man-cave. It feels designed to make K Harris look like she doesn’t belong…
Is that eagle supposed to going into battle on an American flag surfboard?
mvr
I thought the moderator was supposed to have a shield as well.
dr. bloor
@Benw: I’m guessing Harris is familiar with operating in environments that were designed to make her look like she doesn’t belong.
dmsilev
@dr. bloor: She should come out wearing a hazmat suit. Or insist that Pence wear one, since he’s more likely to be a plague rat all things considered.
Another Scott
Laughable, and infuriating. Grr…
In other news:
We have to vote the monsters out!!
Cheers,
Scott.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
The moderator going with this nonsense?
matt
Pence should debate from a glass box.
Skepticat
YES, PLEASE
This setup is obscene. The set designer rather than a rational person was in charge and went for appearance rather than sanity.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Hariss should really be tearing into Pence for the crappy leadership example he is setting. “We’re only doing this because man child there can’t bear to follow his own recommendations on virus safety. Talk about an summing up what is wrong with the country right now; the Vice President of the United States is willing to endanger countless others just on appearances”
Mary G
They were supposed to have increased the distance between them from 6 feet to 12 feet. Doesn’t look like it. Call it off, Kamala.
WereBear
What!?!?! This is ridiculous!
Mike in NC
Fake tough guy Pence should show up tonight wearing his leather jacket and sunglasses inside the hall.
Skepticat
@matt: Pence should debate from AN AIRTIGHT glass box.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
ROFL on top if it all, Trump is planning on bigfooting the debate with some national address on TV.
Now there will a split screen, Trump, looking like death warmed over and gasping while babbling some word salad next to Harris talking like a sane human being.
germy
Is it true the audience will be loaded with conservative college kids?
mad citizen
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: My tweet was sent–thanks for the notice!
Yes, even though I hate the “athletic contest” aspect of debates “Who won? Who lost?”), this year and this debate should allow Harris to tear into this administration and party and these idiots. The level of basic incompetency in everything they do is stunning. I hope she uses that word tonight.
Yutsano
Harris should come out with a mask on and NEVER take it off. If asked to remove it she should say no and explain why. Fuck their bullshit.
Kay
Another one bites the dust. Donald Trump discredits everything and everyone he comes in contact with, and that’s on him but we really have to start asking who so many people and institutions utterly failed to push back. I do not understand why so many people are so easily bullied and cowed by the Trump Adminstration. I want an explanation.
J.
I’ve been tweeting at @debates since after the first debate to stop. But no one listens to me.
Elizabelle
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: You will notice there does not seem to be any shield at all, for the moderator.
Are we sure this photo is legit??
Immanentize
HERE is my suposition —
This whole set up is being fully paid for by the Cleveland Clinic that is just so damn tired of being singled out as a danger to debaters and guests. If they can just only make the next venue a super spreader event….
hueyplong
The Biden/Harris campaign has seemed uber competent and they know more than we do about their circumstances, but as an individual removed from the scene I hope Harris blows this off. Any contact with Republicans is a risky maneuver at present. Decline the invitation to The Masque of the Red Death.
Starfish
John I. Jenkins who has COVID-19 from attending the Amy Coney Barrett super-spreader event is on this commission, and this is how they are acting.
randy khan
I see people saying Harris should refuse to debate, but of course that’s never going to happen. First, she wouldn’t want to miss her chance to gut Pence on national TV.
Second, not showing up to a debate when you agreed to participate is losing, even when you have a good reason. It’s an unfortunate thing, but it’s true. That’s why Trump will show up for the Miami debate unless he is hooked up to every machine in the ICU. All Harris can do is find a way to make it clear that Pence, the leader of the COVID-19 task force, and someone who clearly has been exposed recently to COVID-19, refuses to follow the guidance that his own task force has endorsed because he’s afraid to appear like he takes the virus seriously.
Kay
I mean, we’re told over and over that he dominated the people who work under him because they wanted to keep their jobs. It in’t an excuse but at least it’s an explanation. Does the Commission for Presidential Debates work for the Trump Family?
I just watched the Cleveland Clinic, one of the top health care organizations in the country, be too afraid to enforce basic public health rules against the Trump celebrity entourage. Do they all work for Trump too? What is the explanation for why these people are all so incredibly weak and cowardly?
Baud
@germy: It’s in Salt Lake City, which is a Dem island in a really red state, but even the Dems there are probably on the conservative side.
Immanentize
@Kay: Ratings
oldster
Oh ffs. There is *no way* that our next Vice President should risk her health with this set up. It is patently unsafe, and the plexiglass is a bad joke.
Kamala needs to say no to this.
The Thugs are doing this intentionally. It reminds me of the time when the executives of the cigarette companies came to Congress and swore that cigarettes did not cause cancer. They did it to say “F U, what are you going to do about it?”
Immanentize
@Skepticat: Pope mobile protections for all!!
dmsilev
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Is that scheduled for sure? I know news reports said he wants to give an address, but there doesn’t seem to be anything more definitive than that.
Kay
@Immanentize:
I guess I don’t care anymore. I just want to get rid of them. But do I think the same of the Cleveland Clinic as I did before they fucking chickened out on their whole reason for existing when faced with the mighty power of Ivanka Trump? No, I do not. I think they betrayed public health and since they’re supposedly some of the best in the US, that gives me pause.
I think I’ll probably opt for U of M if I need specialized care in this region. They seem to follow infectious disease guidelines.
mad citizen
It would be great if there was a flamboyant gay mover/stage service with appropriately loud rainbow outfits that would come out and move Kamala’s desk 10 feet farther away from Pence’s desk.
Matt McIrvin
@randy khan: Fortunately Biden’s at least put his foot down and implied he won’t show up if Trump is still COVID positive. (But how can he trust any claims of negative test results? Surely Trump will just lie.)
Trump’s best shot at winning this now is to straight-up murder Joe Biden.
Baud
@dmsilev: I can see him trying to air it tonight because he’s unhappy that the Veeps are drawing attention away from his lordship.
hueyplong
@randy khan: Do you believe the outcome of the VP debate will have a shelf life of more than 24 hours? I don’t. Trump’s trying to render it irrelevant while it’s happening by “addressing the nation” tonight.
These people care so little about precautions during a pandemic that they don’t even bother to learn what the precautions are.
Leto
@mad citizen: I think when they come out she should do that before sitting down. Just pull her table and plexi another 10ft away. When they ask her why, just recite the fact they lie about everything and his boss is a walking Petri dish who’s infected most of the West Wing. This is just farcical.
Kay
Just to remind everyone it isn’t just Biden they put at risk. They sashayed into Cleveland shedding virus including holding a dinner at a hotel and didn’t bother to tell anyone they were infected and the Ohio governor can barely bring himself to speak about it at all, so terrified is he of the Trump Family.
The whole state goes under the bus to protect Dear Leader and the entourage.
Anya
I am hoping this is due to the angle the picture and they’re not that close. Why would Biden campaign agree to this. Pence is not transparent and he might be a carrier.
O. Felix Culpa
Mailbox is still full. They’re cowards.
Ruckus
@WaterGirl:
Kamala should refuse. Absolutely.
Nothing to gain debating a doofus with all the mental acuity of a 70 yr old toaster. And everything to loose.
MisterForkbeard
@Anya: I think they’re probably 12+ feet apart. It’s not that far – about he length of two adult males lying down, head to toe.
Those plexiglass shields are a joke, though. You can see why Pence objected about them until he saw the shields.
Sab
@Kay: I live in NE Ohio. My dad did his residency there. They just bought our local hospital. They have been coasting on their reputation for a generation. All they care about is marketing.
Aleta
There’s no reason for them to even be in the same room. This whole thing he’s doing is a male dominance thing.
Anya
Apparently Facebook did a thorough sweep of Qanon groups. They rooted them all out. This news made me more hopeful. It tells me that Zuckerberg is reading the writing on the wall and he believes Biden will win. This is why he’s pretending he’s serious about this stuff.
bluehill
FBI Christopher Wray is having a press briefing at 11 (I think). Another surprise for the advent calendar?
KD
She should refuse to sit, stand somewhere where she can get 25 ft away from Pence, AND wear a mask. The shields are worse than useless – all the aerosol experts say to think of it as spread of second-hand smoke.
Immanentize
@Kay: I am luckily in Boston if I need care. My uncle received very good care at CC for a heart problem. But I would never send anyone there willingly now. Who knows what rich donor or powerful person might demand of them? Go to Michigan!
trollhattan
@mad citizen:
My first thought was “just drag that desk over a good ten feet.” They can deal with the camera angles, being paid professionals and all.
Jeffro
@Skepticat: ok, now THAT debate I would watch
Emma from FL
OK, let’s start with a fact: If she doesn’t show up she will be pictured as THE LOSER. Or did you think the media had changed its spots? She should show up with two assistants and a tape measure and rearrange her desk as per the guidelines. And say why, calmly and clearly.
Jeffro
I hope she uses that exact line!
Jeffro
@Matt McIrvin: (knocks on wood)
Could we please not ‘go there’?
evap
Do we really know that this is the setup?
Immanentize
@bluehill: Wray came out with a very strong anti-meddling statement yesterday. I figured he would be fired today.
MomSense
This is a joke. Those shields are useless. She should refuse to debate him in person. Pence has been exposed to multiple Covid positive people. He couldn’t get into any courthouse in Maine with his exposure. He should be in quarantine for at least 14 days from his last exposure.
trollhattan
@Aleta:
Yup. As if Pence can ever “dominate” somebody like Harris.
Siri: Double my popcorn order.
Still boggled my Mrs. Goebbels’ tweet yesterday attempting to mock Harris for insisting on a shield at all. She had to know hubby is infected when she sent that. They’re co-monsters, with a little monster-in-the-making at home.
Amir Khalid
@randy khan:
I agree. Backing out now would look bad. The Biden/Harris campaign should, for its part, make abundantly clear that its nominees will not take part in any debate held under unsafe conditions. In light of that pitifully inadequate plexiglass barrier, Harris should indeed show up masked, and if challenged she should explain why she’s keeping it on for the whole debate. Only if the moderator insists she remove it — I really doubt that will happen, though — should she concede the debate and leave.
Jinchi
Yeah, those barriers are almost useless.
What they really need is a fully contained enclosure like the one used by the boy in the plastic bubble. Toss Pence and his cheering squad in there and then the rest of the audience should be fine.
Kathleen
@Kay: One of Cincy’s local news persons covered the debate in Cleveland and he’s now Covid positive.
The Moar You Know
@Kay: Here in San Diego, we are spoiled rotten for choice as doctors want to live here. We have our longtime provider, Scripps, we have Sharp, and we have the new kid on the block, UCSD, with more money than God and the latest and greatest.
Most of the locals go to Scripps. Force of habit. But Scripps has had a long time issue that they just seem to can’t fix – infection control.
Last straw for the wife and I was after her surgery a few years back. Roommate puked. I called for cleanup.
After six hours I did it myself. They never did clean that room, not once in three fucking days. I will never set foot in a Scripps institution again unless I’m bleeding out (they do have a hospital so close to my house I could walk there in ten minutes and drive there in a minute and a half, but like I told my wife, unless I can’t breathe, take me to La Jolla, ten miles south).
Lister spent most of his professional life and got his reputation slandered worldwide for trying to get doctors to wash their hands. We should not still be relitigating basic sanitation two centuries later, but we are at every level.
I go to clean hospitals/doctor’s offices/dentists. If they’re handling those basic requirements, odds are pretty good they’re handling the rest of their practice with at least minimal competency.
Jinchi
@Kathleen: Has there been any contact tracing of the people in that room?
trollhattan
@MomSense:
Completely correct. 14 days, same as Biden, for the very same reason: exposure to Trump.
Would be a shame if Mother gets it.
Kathleen
@trollhattan: I’m convinced she and JoGo wannabe Stephen Miller Cos play Joe and Magda Goebbels and they let Mother Pence watch.
SiubhanDuinne
@Yutsano:
She should also say, in so many words, “Fuck your bullshit.”
Leto
Apparently DoJ is about to make an announcement of “national security interest”. Expect Bill Barr Bullshit, aka “October Surprise”.
SiubhanDuinne
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
Wut? Srsly?
Matt McIrvin
@Jeffro: We need to go there because if this shit actually happens, we can’t let it be shrugged off as “unfortunate accident, who could have known”.
Kathleen
@Jinchi: Good question. I’m not sure. One would hope since site is affiliated with a medical facility due diligence etc etc oh hell who am I kidding?
Anomalous Cowherd
@dr. bloor:
I was going to say she should wear a PAPr but the giant fan is a stroke of genius.
Baud
@SiubhanDuinne:
What do they have left except stunts?
Leto
Ah, follow up to the DoJ thing: they’re indicting two terrorists. Military captured them a while ago, FBI has them now and they’re heading to the Eastern District of NY for prosecution. I think they were responsible for executing James Foley and another journalist.
TS (the original)
@bluehill:
It’s on c-span and about arresting 2 from ISI
Edit: or as Leto says above
Aleta
@mad citizen: They definitely should do that, although they’ve also put that tight circle on the floor, so he’d remain in the center and she’s be more on the outskirts. (Now that circle becomes visually like a trap to confine her location … ugh. Not saying it was intentional. But who tf knows any more. His waiting until the last moment last night to ‘agree’ certainly was.
From the start, this issue should have been Pence arguing against strict rules of the organizer/ venue. Instead the Rs managed to frame this as Harris vs Pence (since it seems her camp was forced to make demands). It’s still a shock to me that the R campaign is getting away with using the debates to display anti-mask, anti-protection as their appeal to one side of a ‘voter issue.’
Kelly
Full face respirator with a powered, filtered air supply and a microphone.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
got my TV on MSNBC and muted, the big announcement is the indictment of the ISIS group who were called “The Beatles”. They’re gonna try to make a tough-on-terror moment out of an indictment in absentia?unmuted: Lot of tough talk about American arms and the pursuit to the end of the earthETA: @Leto: ah, should’ve unmuted sooner– sorry
Immanentize
@Leto:
Proud Boys arrested? I did not see that coming! ?
Jinchi
She really should. Those desks look like they’re separated by exactly 6 feet. (Trump and Biden were separated by about twice that distance). All she has to do is follow the CDC guidelines and point out that Pence should be in quarantine right now.
trollhattan
@Kelly:
“Two turntables and a microphone.”
Immanentize
@Aleta: Harris can shoot three pointers outside the lines all night long.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@SiubhanDuinne: As serious as anything from Roid Rage lately. Anyway, being the center of attention in the worst possible way is how Trump works.
Immanentize
@trollhattan:
Excellent reference! I salute you!
SiubhanDuinne
@mad citizen:
Any chance the festive stagehand could drop an explosive glitter package on Pence’s chair? I’d watch the whole thing knowing that when Mother comes up to greet him and he stands up to masklessly embrace her, there’s multicoloured glitter all over his ass.
Anya
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: “If you have American blood in your veins, American blood in your hands, you will face justice.”
Baud
@Jinchi:
The desks are 12 feet apart.
Anya
Wrey and his team are standing too close but at least they’re wearing masks, when they’re not speaking.
Immanentize
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The news conference is about the hapless “Beatles?”. Shit, we sold the farm to bring them here for the spectacle. Like Caesar parading captives — but his were all leaders, kings, chiefs.
p.a.
GF has 2 rescue outdoor cats, female tux, male orange. Both fixed. Tux very stay-at-home, yard only. Male may go holiday for a few days a month. Tux missing last few days, not in basement, not in usual crash spots. Found this morning: gf’s car trunk????. Male will be disgruntled: she whacks him around, just on principal, it seems.
SiubhanDuinne
@Baud:
You’re right, of course. Isn’t it pathetic that every single stunt just underscores how empty their ideas and policies are. You’d think someone would catch on and suggest a wee course correction, but no.
SiubhanDuinne
@p.a.:
Good gods. I hope that string of emojis means she was found alive. I don’t like reading about animals (or even people, I guess) being found in car trunks.
Jinchi
Kamala should ask Jaime Harrison for his setup.
NotMax
OT.
Ouch ouch ouch.
How in bloody hell does one break a toe while asleep? That’s the way the middle toe on one foot feels. I’m guessing something bit it while I was unconscious. Can sort of hobble very slowly and gingerly if I only put weight on the back of the heel of that foot and drag the other foot rather than take all weight off it; standing flat on the sole of the bad foot is not a option right now.
Need to dig out a suitable pan so I can soak the foot in hot water and Epsom salt. Which will take a while as a trip covering the maybe 12 feet to and into the bathroom after being shocked awake took over a minute. Baby step, pause, wince, gird loins, baby step.
/whine
p.a.
@SiubhanDuinne: Of course, ok but hungry. Bigger danger is fishers in area but they won’t stay in the house.
Gin & Tonic
@SiubhanDuinne: I have to say, if I read a report about Stephen Miller being found in the trunk of a car at EWR long-term parking because somebody noticed the fluids leaking out, I likely wouldn’t be overcome with grief.
stinger
Yes, Kamala should wear a mask, but she’ll be protecting Pence more than herself. Maybe she could borrow Jaime Harrison’s plexi shield, and use that silly thing in the OP photo over her head. The fan is a great idea!
Anya
Is it normal for the federal prosecutor to praise the leadership of the AG? Barr seems to be like his boss.
Aleta
@Enhanced Voting Techniques: Is he worried about an internal uprising for Pence, thinks this will show his superiority? Or just the best line he could come up with for commandeering headline o’ the day, won’t actually happen.
Ken
Now searching east Asian mythology for matches. Southeast Asia and the Philippines in particular have a huge menagerie of monsters with weird attack modes. A night demon that bites the toes would fit right in.
Anoniminous
According to the Daily Beast:
“Increasingly convinced that President Donald Trump’s election chances are grim, top Republican donors, lobbyists, and operatives are directing their attention to the Senate in hopes of keeping a majority in the chamber and, with it, a check on a future President Joe Biden.”
that means the Republican money people have conceded the President race.
Cheryl Rofer
It’s from a reporter, tweeted from inside the hall.
bluehill
@TS (the original): Not the announcement I was hoping for.
Baud
@Anya: I don’t know for sure, and I didn’t see what was said, but that’s probably standard. Sucking up to the boss is a universal thing.
Ken
A favorability poll yesterday did show Pence up 5 percentage points over Trump. That would enrage him normally. On the dex he might try to gut Pence with a sharpie.
Chetan Murthy
@NotMax: Uh, not saying it is, but …. I once mistook gout for breaking a toe.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@Jinchi: Cone of Silence.
21st century version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VoRYBuxCHf0
Old school version:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1eUIK9CihA
(Suitably modified for social distance of course)
Immanentize
@NotMax: Careful! Tropical spiders are vicious little shits. Take care!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
OT, but I think even if you never watched The Office (US) you’ll find this fun to watch.
Aleta
Harris should come out with a spray gun of disinfectant.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Aleta: It’s Trump, everything he does is by instinct. The man is all lizard brain and no forebrain. People are paying attention to Pence and that’s enough reason for Trump.
Aleta
@Gin & Tonic: No empathy for the automotive paint?
geg6
@Kay:
You should be questioning their abilities these days at Cleveland Clinic. From what I can tell, it’s nothing but hacks there. And I have been an advocate for the stellar care there most of my life until very recently, so I know whereof I speak.
My oldest sister has Crohn’s disease and was diagnosed way back in the late 1960s, when there were few who knew how to treat it or even what it was all about. She became ill while in training as an x-ray tech here in Pittsburgh. She tried every doctor and hospital here in Pittsburgh and no one knew what they were doing and they almost killed her. My parents did the research and found out about Dr. Turnbull, the world’s leading expert in Crohn’s at the time, who was at Cleveland Clinic. They hired an ambulance and driver to take her there and he and his resident Dr. Fazio (who subsequently became the world’s leading expert on Crohn’s once Turnbull retired) kept her alive and eventually well. Well, she’s made it to 70 years old now and is having some issues with a small liver tumor (probably from some of the meds she’s had over the years), so she went to Cleveland, as her local doctor advised over the phone, in order to make sure no one was missing anything and, if she needed surgery, to have it there because of all the complications due to the various meds, her low weight and the delicacy of cutting into her now that she’s undergone over 40 surgeries over the years and has only about a foot of intestine left. So they set her up for a biopsy at a Youngstown satellite clinic much closer to her home. She had the biopsy a couple of weeks ago but, on the way home, passed out and didn’t perk up when she got home. Her husband rushed her to the local hospital where they found she had almost no potassium in her system (a common problem with severe Crohn’s), which could have led to a massive heart attack and her death. No one at the satellite clinic even thought to check it. No one at the main hospital thought to check it when she was there. This is supposed to be the premier facility in the world for her disease and no one took the time to do something they should be doing for every Crohn’s patient. Her local doctor was furious with them. He called two doctors he knows who are cancer specialists to set up appointments with them at UPMC and Allegheny General, respectively, and called Cleveland and reamed them out while insisting they send the whole case file to the other doctors. They tried to get out of doing that (the case file is about 3 feet high, literally), but he really blew up and talked lawsuits with him testifying against them and they finally sent it. She’s having the tumor taken out (thankfully, it is small and has not metasticized) in a few weeks at Allegheny General. I am pretty sure she will never go back to Cleveland again. Fifty years of the best treatment in the world and they went into the toilet just in the last few.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Aleta:
Or a hypodermic. “Mike, some guy told me this will knock it out, in like, a minute, one minute, almost a cleaning”
NotMax
@Imamnentize
The geckos tend to keep the spiders will in check. More likely a baby centipede.
Which isn’t an improvement…
Or it’s somehow actually broken. I can bend the toe but definitely not a wise choice to do so at the moment.
@Chetan Murthy
Thanks but lack of swelling or throbbing would seem to prelude that.
mrmoshpotato
LOL!
Chipotle and Subway give food better protection from our sneezy nose holes!
bluehill
@Anoniminous:
Along the same lines, Josh at TPM ( rest of article behind paywall)
artem1s
might try emailing University of Utah. They are the ones who will be on the short end of the plague stick . We still have zero info on who was exposed to the Orange Plague here in Cleveland at the debate and the Intercontinental hotel before hand. A bunch of service workers are being denied info on tracing and tracking and won’t get tests until/unless they become symptomatic. For sure they won’t get unemployment if they refuse to come to work and expose themselves to others who were glad-handing the WH entourage. CWRU Alumni and staffers are pretty outraged about the debate and more so when it started to leak that the Third Lady and her entourage refused to mask knowing they were infected. Coverup is ongoing. Utah may want to intervene.
Kingsbury Hall, Nancy Peery Marriott Auditorium.
debate2020.utah.edu
[email protected]
James E Powell
@Kay:
My take is that these people & organizations are either Republicans or “wired for Republicans” – as Josh Marshall puts it – or “default Republicans.” For them, the important issues are whatever Republicans are angry about (e.g., Wallace’s “race & violence in our cities”) and their most important audience is Republicans.
NotMax
@NotMax
May be my own dumb fault if something got into the house as I left the front door wide open yesterday for more than an hour while I was outside futzing around with a repairman who arrived for an appointment at the landlady’s abode and the screen door doesn’t fit the doorway perfectly. (Upshot of that is the riding mower needs a new starter, which will take several weeks to arrive.)
Anyway, didn’t intend to derail things so shall try to say no more about it or the nonce.
BC in Illinois
Shannon Watts of Moms Demand Action on Gun Sense has a tweet about the speakers at the NRA’s Women’s Leadership Summit (which starts tomorrow, in case you missed the announcement):
She could have also included:
And after the NRA ladies have had the opportunity to have the Second Amendment mansplained to them, there will be presentations by Diamond and Silk. And others.
zhena gogolia
@NotMax:
Maybe a gecko thought your toe was a spider.
scav
It’s also a handy little symbol of Republican competence and intent, right in center stage. Their wall against Mexico was useless. This pexiglass wall, indeed their entire Covid strategy is useless. Republicans aren’t protecting you against any number of things. Repeat and expand.
SiubhanDuinne
@NotMax:
I’m guessing gout. I had it once, 50-odd years ago, and it’s excruciatingly painful. And yeah, it does seem to happen at night. A stab of pain woke me up from a sound sleep, and the rest of the night was miserable. I hope you can get to a podiatrist without delay. Good luck with it.
Immanentize
@NotMax: it wasn’t an interruption at all. All threads are open threads. Rightfully, we worry! Epsom salts. Liquor. A nice stogie. Dr.’s orders.
mrmoshpotato
@Aleta: One spray bottle of disinfectant. Another spray bottle of…whatever keeps christo-fascists at least 15 feet away.
mrmoshpotato
But do the spiders save at least 15% on their web insurance?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
Josh thinks Turtle suckered Trump into stopping a second stimulus because Turtle sees Trump as dead meat, so the Senate GOP wants to do a repeat of the Fiscal Scold and obstruction they did with Obama. I just don’t see it working this time; the 2007 Banking Crash was bit of last minute surprise and the bank bailout with no public bail out the Dem controlled congress came up with infuriated everyone. This time around it’s the GOP pushing for bailout for the elite and screw the masses while the Dems are pushing for help for everyone who needs it. Being a pack of sullen pricks will play well in the Derp Red States but hard to see it working anywhere else after four years of Donald the Dickhead.
scav
@mrmoshpotato: Holy water? Maybe garlic.
Immanentize
@mrmoshpotato: garlic? Holy water? The blood of innocents?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
the no phone-ins thing is a real tell. Word on the twitter street is he wants to go to the Oval Office. I’m betting on a still photo in time for evening news. He’s probably still reeling from “Gasping” trending on twitter the other night.
Immanentize
@scav: ???
NotMax
@mrmoshpotato
One can stuff that second bottle with Devil’s food cake. Getting it thence to spray is another matter.
:)
Ken
@mrmoshpotato: @scav: @Immanentize: Genuine faith, love, and charity.
trollhattan
Photo of the stage from a different angle, avec (masked) humans.
SiubhanDuinne
@Gin & Tonic:
Nor would I. Good point.
::: hastily adding ::: Not that I’m actually wishing that, of course.
NotMax
Ken
Aren’t they out of town, headlining this month at Jugs Jugs Jugs and Beer?
:)
Ken
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: That’s an interesting point. Which causes him more pain – the actual gasping, or the hashtag trending?
Also:
He needs to be holding up today’s paper in the photo.
Marcopolo
For any Missouri folks:
It’s an internal poll for the Galloway campaign so probably tilted in her direction but this race is very winnable. In case anyone wants to throw her some money, which she could still use effectively: Nicole Galloway.
BethanyAnne
@mrmoshpotato: ok, I snorted. hehe
Peale
@Anoniminous: Well that and they are tired of having their donations spent on yachts of senior advisors, maybe.
Leto
@Immanentize: Man, where was Dr Immanentize for me these past two years with these meds? Do you accept Blue Leto Blue Avalune? ?
scav
@Immanentize: New olympic sport – synchronized posting! What a team.
Baud
@scav:
You’re practicing to be front pagers.
mrmoshpotato
@scav:
@Immanentize:
Maybe. Pence doesn’t look like an eater of flavorful food.
Wouldn’t holy water attract them?
I said keep away, not fall over in orgasm.
LurkerNoLonger
Come on, man. Do this shit virtual. Everyone is already use to seeing people in little boxes on their screen.
Anoniminous
@bluehill:
McConnell is blatantly trying to pack the court and the odds are he’ll succeed.
Which is why it is absolutely vital to flip the Senate. With it there’s a hope of undoing the ignorant hick Evangelical domination of US Law for the next 30 years. Without flipping there’s no hope at all.
Gin & Tonic
@Immanentize: Question.
Why is Trump referred to as “President” and not as “plaintiff” or “respondent” or some neutral legal term?
mrmoshpotato
@NotMax: Oooooo! Pureed deviled eggs might be more sprayable though. With the added stink of Satan.
Baud
@Gin & Tonic:
Judges don’t always use neutral terms but often use the names of parties or titles.
Trump’s arguments are mostly based on his status as president, I believe.
laura
If I’m Doug Ehmert, right now I’d be at the Home Despot picking up a drill and handful of door hinges and the swing by TAP Plastics for some panels and call Jaime Harrison to see how he made his safety screen on the way back to the hotel parking lot and then put the whole thing together and bring it along when he accompanies his darling to the debate hall and set it up around her to ensure that no one has the chance to sicken his beloved wife.
It’s not rocket surgery and it’s the right thing to do. Pence is already working up a big hissy and tizzy over the sad, inadequate excuse for protections – so go big and do it right.
Soprano2
@Marcopolo: I’ve got a mailer at home, I need to send some money tonight. It would be so great if we could get rid of the accidental governor and the rest of his accidental administration, which has shown no leadership on COVID. Oh, and I got a “No on 3” sign yesterday. I’ve been posting on FB about how bad it is.
NotMax
@Anoniminous
And they’re all made out of ticky tacky
And they all look just the same/em>
.
:)
Baud
@mrmoshpotato:
Depends on the religion.
Cameron
@Kay: Pittsburgh has some top-shelf medical facilities. I had heart surgery at Allegheny General about five years ago, and my doctors back in Philly were really impressed with my recovery.
NotMax
Razza frazza. Fix.
@Anoniminous
And they’re all made out of ticky tacky
And they all look just the same
.
:)
Gin & Tonic
@Baud: But that’s just, like, your opinion, man. I was looking for an answer from a big-shot law professor.
Mai Naem mobile
I guess the debate commission doesn’t know you can get some pretty huge pieces of plexiglass at any big box hardware store and even some small hardware stores. I know I’ve gotten some for my large dining table that I had to cut down. Some people buy them for window material.
scav
@mrmoshpotato: I’d say they’d little actual acquaintance with actual holy water, rather assuming that any old actual ditch water becomes holy by being in their presence. But garlic, especially when made into a holy water aioli . . . foreign women, foreign women not approved by mother might have made it . . . . urban metrosexuals might have taken pleasure in the like . , . .
Aleta
@NotMax: If it’s a toxin (centipede etc.), hot water at the earliest stage could imo help circulate it further into tissues or joints.
BR
I just don’t get the focus on plexiglass. This is all about air flow. Can’t they be bothered to buy a few HEPA filters (at $250 each, 4 of them placed around the stage wouldn’t break the bank) and run them during the debate?
James E Powell
@Kay:
I forgot to add, they never do this for Democrats. I don’t know if it’s because Democrats don’t push hard enough or because they just don’t regard Democrats as people who need to be satisfied.
Ken
Totally off-topic (insofar as this post has one), but cracked.com has a review of the erotic thriller Donald Trump wrote.
Villago Delenda Est
Bring back the League of Women Voters. Dispense with media and party hacks.
Chetan Murthy
@Mai Naem mobile: It doesn’t take Plexiglas. All they need is massive sheets of transparent plastic to separate the stage into spaces for each debater and for the moderator + audience. I mean, covid can’t cut thru plastic sheeting. Just hoist it high enough and wide enough to make a real barrier. And get serious ventilation going both in and out of each zone.
piratedan
in the aftermath of the McSally/Kelly debate for the AZSEN seat, here’s the best tweet synopsis I could find:
https://twitter.com/JayBarbuto/status/1313676731522244608
Punchy
Yeah, they’re going to have to push each of those desks back about 1.5m from each other and the moderator. Otherwise the moderator is in direct stream of droplets, and the other 2 are easily within aerosolized droplet range.
The plexi is so small so as to do nothing whatsoever (as 100s have already noted)
Peale
@James E Powell: Yet they’ll completely buy into Republican fear of us as baked into their worldview. Because its always 1968 and there are tons of leftie hippies threatening them if they don’t get their way.
Baud
@James E Powell:
Republicans are more likely to be customers.
NotMax
Looking at the clear panels all I can think of is Charles Van Doren and Twenty-One.
;)
Kay
@James E Powell:
It’s nice that DHS and the FBI are now issuing “voter advisories” but why do I feel like they’re only breaking with their slavish and really shameful loyalty to Trump because it looks like he is going to lose?
Time to get back to public service! Looks like our boy isn’t gonna make it! How can I trust these people again? Especially DHS, who volunteered to be the Trump Family personal army. I don’t have any respect for that.
Ken
@Baud: That explains the hookers and adderall dealers, but what about other industries?
Baud
@Kay:
Because it’s true. The world would look very different of the polls were reversed.
p.a.
@piratedan: ????? from the link
@DawnNute
Martha McSally can take consolation from the fact that she will soon no longer be just the first Republican candidate to lose an Arizona senate race in decades, she will also be the second
Leto
@Cameron: I’m eternally grateful that my accident occurred near a top notch hospital versus the other side of the county where we live. If it had occurred on this side, I would’ve been airlifted to the same hospital I was at because the general/orthopedic surgeons there are second-to-none. This is the Philly region, Montgomery County.
Baud
@p.a.: Haha.
NotMax
@Ken
At this point I’d expect Dolt 45 is manically speed dialing heads of state and asking “Is your refrigerator running?” while sniggering.
//
The Moar You Know
@laura: He bought it premade from a musical instrument retailer. They’re called “plexiglass drum shields”. They’re not that expensive. They are a little heavy; I’d want a buddy to help carry it in.
Leto
@piratedan: MSNBC is talking about that right now, talking about how McSally just word saladed her way through the debate (Saw a clip and JFC that was… bad), and is 11 points down.
I had a chance to briefly serve with her back in 2001. I didn’t really talk to her but later saw the 60 Minutes interview where she directly challenged DoD policy wrt women in theater having to wear burka’s while in meetings with Arab partner nations, as well as not being able to lead some of those meetings because Arab partners refused to speak with her as an equal. I’m glad that policy was challenged/changed, but past that… the AF seems to breed a special style of shitheel and it continues to irritate the shit out of me.
Kay
@Baud:
DHS has some explaining to do. They hid a real and present threat to the public from Right wing extremists in order to cover their ass with the boss. Pure politics. Trump ordered them to lie about it and they complied.
I’d like to say they were lucky and nothing happened but that’s not true. We had a mass murder event by a Right wing extremist in El Paso. 23 people died. That’s your 80 billion dollar a year security force, keeping you safe.
NotMax
@The Moar You Know
300% tariff imposed on plexiglass in 3…2…1…
JustRuss
@p.a.: I had a female tux disappear for over a week, broke my heart. Then my neighbor told me he was hearing strange noises coming from his crawl space, and the week prior he’d had some people doing work under there….
MazeDancer
@Yutsano:
Been thinking that, too, Or at least keep it on during Pence’s 2 minutes of virus spreading.
Cameron
@Leto: Just like Philly proper, Montco’s got a ton of hospitals. I’ll confess that Lankenau and Bryn Mawr are the only ones I’ve had any contact with. Most of the years I lived in the area, I lived in the city.
Kay
@Cameron:
My daughter and her husband lived in Pittsburgh for some time and I have a lot of affection for the place. They’re both health care people. They moved to NY because they got better offers, but I would go to Pittsburgh for hospitalization, it’s just that where I am in Ohio, Ann Arbor is closer.
Ramalama
@Kelly:
LAVALIER microphone for the best sound
Leto
@Kay: This isn’t the first time they’ve done that. Way, way, way back in (roughly) 2011, DHS issued a report that said right-wing extremist groups were recruiting active duty, retired, separated veterans with the express purpose of recruiting them to gain knowledge/train their people in small unit tactics, ala all the shit they’d done in Iraq/Afghanistan. As soon as the report was mentioned, Republicans /right-wing media went absolutely apeshit over it, disparaging DHS, asking why the Obama DHS hated veterans, etc. etc. etc. And the report was buried at that point. You can still find it on the web if you Google it, but this is the same thing here. It’s not unique to the Trumpov admin. Republicans as a whole need to answer for why they’re covering for right-wing/white nationalist groups. But we already know why they are.
Kay
Many of you are volunteering IRL so you know this, but the anxiety online among Democrats is very different from Democrats who are not “very online”. Our local Democrats are just thrilled. Really excited. I haven’t seen them this fired up since 2008.
Baud
@Kay: Which is the main reason Harris isn’t going to cancel tonight.
Leto
@Cameron: I’m in the Pottstown area, so I have Pottstown and Phoenixville as my closest hospitals. Their reputation precedes them (narrator: avoid them as much as you can). We also have access to the Einstein hospital network and they have a much better rep. A bit further away, but I’m willing to travel.
Kay
@Leto:
There is going to be a big casualty event. They must know this. We’ve all been through it before, with McVeigh. It is just insane to me that partisan politics trumps that for them. I’m horrified by that.
The El Paso mass murder was Right wing violence. That’s what it was. 23 dead. How many do they need?
I mean, come on. Who are we kidding with this? We KNOW where the threat is coming from.
Kay
@Baud:
She in particular is popular with not very online women. They’re just excited. It’s nice. It took a while for it to sink in that they might actually win, especially given that we’re surrounded by really loud Trumpsters, but they’re hopeful.
Leto
@Kay:
I think as long as they’re killing black, brown, LGBTQ+, women… they just don’t care. Hell, you had the shooting at the Congressional baseball practice and it still didn’t matter. You can tick off all the events, starting with (as you mentioned) Oklahoma City, and they won’t do a thing. It’s the same performative art that Alito/Thomas did when they signaled they wanted to re-legislate gay marriage the other day.
It’s part of why we need to move them, wholesale, out of power at every level and just implement wholesale change. They’re a rump party, representing a rump populace, albeit a very dangerous one. Treat them like a national security threat and bring the power of the state against them. When Republicans want to re-align their values, maybe then re-engage with them. Otherwise, fuck’em.
gvg
According to the actual experts online all the plexiglass stud=ff is just for show. It wouldn’t matter if the sheild is larger. the droplets float in the aid. Masks help. Air filtration and exchanges with outside air are what is important. I haven’t heard how good the air exchange rates are for this hall but that is the actual key to safety. It would actually be better to hold it outside, but if the hall has good filtration, it should be fine. someone else after the Biden debate said most stages do because the lights are so hot.
I think the audience may be more at risk.
The University mostly needs to stick to its policy about a test result before starting and cancel on the spot if Pence tests positive. Kamela needs to know she is negative before she is tested, because that would be bad publicity. I presume they test often. Anyway, it will be very hard to stand up to the Trump admin if Pence is positive but they need to do it. Psych themselves before hand and be ready.
laura
@The Moar You Know: That is both awesome and not surprising.
geg6
@Kay:
Not to mention the Pittsburgh (Squirrel Hill) synagogue.
a thousand flouncing lurkers was fidelio
@James E Powell: The people who run the companies that own the networks don’t care much about Democrats. It’s all Big Money people and while they aren’t as bad as the Murdoch family or the Smith family who control Sinclair, they’re determined to protect their money first and the country last.
Theyve also been conditioned by Focus on the Family et al. to jump when poked.
Kathleen
@Baud: Also IMHO, too many Democrats confuse “keeping an open mind” with “having to tolerate bullying and disrespect”.
Kathleen
@Kay: My running partner who is a doctor took her mother who lives on West Va to Ohio State on the advice of a colleague. He said if you live in Ohio and have cancer OS is the place to go. Her mother had pancreatic cancer and is doing very well. She was first diagnosed 2 to 3 years ago.
Kathleen
@Leto: I remember that. The blowback from Rethugs and media was so bad the Obama administration issued an apology of sorts. In fact I was just thinking about that today. Glad you brought it up.
Villago Delenda Est
@a thousand flouncing lurkers was fidelio: Which is why tumbrels need to roll.
PJ
@Kay: I would venture to guess that, regardless of politics now or at any particular time, the anxiety level of people who are very online is much elevated over people who are not. The internet, and, in particular social media, is an anxiety machine.
dimmsdale
@trollhattan: “Let the League handle the debates” is kind of my eternal cry. This mini-partition horseshit is outrageous. I just sent the Commission an email (oh, CERTAINLY they’ll snap-to and follow my recommendations, har har) suggesting they’re incompetent and irresponsible. The email I used I got from their website; it’s probably for press queries but hopefully someone with an ear for public outrage will read it. I used: [email protected]
Uncle Cosmo
@trollhattan: Unless there is extremely strong ducting directly above both participants pulling air out of the room (with fresh air introduced below them), that setup is a travesty. Among other things, the shields are too far from the principals and are easily bypassed by air currents.
Kamala needs a face shield (or at least protective eyeglasses) and a mask. (Maybe nose filters as well.) If she needs to remove the mask to be understood, she should keep it over her nose while exposing her mouth, as the nasal cavity seems to be the chief marshaling area for COVID.
Fucking Utahn imbeciles.
Dennis
Just debate from separate rooms. This is not hard. Nothing is gained by adding ANY risk.