The Post has a good story about one white kid who was arrested for his role in the rioting in Pittsburgh:
Police identified Brian Jordan Bartels, 20, of Allison Park, Pa., as having “kicked off” the escalation in Pittsburgh, one of several examples of peaceful assemblies against police violence creating opportunities for pandemonium. […]
In footage that spread widely online, a man identified as Bartels, who faces charges of vandalism and rioting, wore a bandanna emblazoned with the symbol of the Animal Liberation Front, a leaderless international resistance movement that pushes for animal rights. In the footage, he raised his middle fingers to black protesters who begged him to stop. At Bartels’s home in a Pittsburgh suburb, officers found spray paint and firearms, according to an arrest warrant reviewed by The Washington Post.
[…] [A] friend, a 17-year-old who spoke on the condition of anonymity because she feared online harassment, said Bartels was militant about veganism but otherwise espouses views that do not fall neatly along ideological lines. Another teenager who moved in the city’s pop-punk scene with Bartels said Bartels loathed establishment forces, no matter their partisan makeup. But neither understood why Bartels would have smashed a police vehicle in broad daylight, as police accuse him of doing.
The story talks about a pattern seen in other cities (including my home town of Rochester) of white people with different agendas (right-wing, left-wing, whatever) using protests as an excuse to start chucking rocks and tagging.
Speaking of white, entitled idiots who want to leverage protests for their own ends, it was good to see that both the Post (expected) and the Times* (unexpected) front pages were clear that Trump had peaceful protesters tear gassed so he could have a photo op. Also, there was little discussion of his threat to call out the Army, but here’s my question on that: how, exactly, would that work? Do they just roll into states and cities that Trump thinks have a problem, no matter what the governor or mayors say? The answer is, simply, that it wouldn’t work, and Trump has no intention of calling out the Army — it was just something to say on the TeeVee, just like the bible was something to hold in a picture. (More on that from Jennifer Rubin.)
* The Times lead front-page headline “Trump threatens force; Police and Protesters are Injured” is still much worse than the Post’s “Protests intensify across US” because the story is the protesters, not Trump, who pretty much absented himself for a couple of days until his manhood was questioned, then lashed out. And, I’m guessing that far few police were injured than protesters. So it’s still a smelly Baquet of shit, as usual.
Baud
I have low expectations of the media, so I’ve been pleasantly surprised with the general reporting I’ve seen. Non-right-wing media, of course, and small sample size.
They’re producing content for right-wing media.
Wapiti
Extending General Shinseki’s estimates for Iraq (3-500,000 soldiers for 38 million population), they’d need up to 4 million military on that job.
NotMax
“Give me mung beans or give me death!”
//
Crashman06
I really hope you’re right on this. It’s all I’ve been thinking about since last night.
download my app in the app store mistermix
@Crashman06: Read that Rubin piece – the Insurrection Act requires that states invite the Army in to quell insurrection. Maybe a super Trumper will do that (and even they might think twice), but most won’t.
Kay
So, so sick of these cowards. Quit or stop complaining. I love the “they”. Like he or she is some outraged observer.
Trump laughs at them and he should. They’re worse than the active participants.
These people aren’t downtrodden poultry plant workers. They can all get other powerful jobs. They stay because they have no integrity.
Chief Oshkosh
The privilege of these assholes. They’re always white, they’re usually (but not always) from middle-class or “better” backgrounds, they’ve had everything handed to them, and they’re “rebelling” because…? In reality, it’s because they are basically fuck-ups. I’ve got to deal with these destructive WATBs in my job. Most are such mopes that they never quite get it together enough to do much of anything. Sadly, situations like the righteous protests don’t require much effort to fuck with. Just show up and hit something (or someone).
Capri
Last night a bunch of inflammatory tweets were sent to my neighbors – saying that Antifata was coming for them. One said that white houses were being targeted and that home owners should get out their weapons to protect themselves. Both were debunked immediately by the folks I know, but I fear not everyone will be so savvy.
I does seem that everyone is wising up to the fact that it is right wing agitators that are trying to escalate peaceful protests.
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s a rundown of what Trump can and can’t do legally. I don’t exclude the possibility that he will ignore that.
NotMax
@Kay
“People didn’t seem to grasp the point. Next time, let’s get hold of some napalm!”
// // // //
Kay
If we manage to get rid of Trump there will be another GOP President at some point. We won’t know if that person hires some of the Trump low lifes. Like all businesses it’s probably a club and they all hire from the same pool. We could get stuck with some of the Trump assholes on the public payroll again. I don’t want to pay any of them, ever again. They should start using their names when they weakly and cowardly whine to reporters. We need to know their names to protect against ever having any of them on the public payroll again.
SiubhanDuinne
@Kay:
Preach it, Kay. They’re arguably worse than Stephen Miller or Bill Barr. Fucking craven poltroons.
Baud
@Kay:
It’s why I’m a yellow dog Dem. Our pool is better than their pool. The person at the top is almost irrelevant in comparison.
Kay
@NotMax:
They’re bragging that Trump waddled to a church, surrounded by his family members because he was too chickenshit to go out without using them as human shields. This is apparently an act of extraordinary bravery among conservative men.
Betty Cracker
I heard a white kids not behaving badly story from the protests in Tampa last night. Groups of protesters were organizing in such a way that the white kids served as buffers between the larger crowd and the cops in expectation that the cops were less likely to bust white kids’ heads. Since my own white kid was among them, the plan made me a tad nervous, but thankfully, that particular protest ended peacefully.
Kay
@NotMax:
Why was the AG in shirt sleeves when directing the gassing and beating of citizens? Does he think that makes him look tough? Which sleazy operative came up with that?
Crashman06
@download my app in the app store mistermix: I did. I don’t know. I read elsewhere there might be some ways he can send them in without an invite. The chairman of the joint chiefs was out there during the photo op last night, in fatigues, so honestly, I don’t have a lot of confidence in the military leadership. If he orders them in somewhere, I think they follow the orders.
Woodrow/asim
@download my app in the app store mistermix:
I just read the Act, via the Wikipedia Article on same. IANAL, yet I don’t agree the only way to invoke is via a State Request. Others have said POTUS has wide latitude in invoking it, and my reading says they are right.
(EDIT: See also the article Cheryl posted, above)
But. It also requires POTUS to order protestors to disperse, prior to calling in troops.
That’s clearly a sticking point for someone like Trump. For a guy who can’t actually fire anyone, him putting out the equivalent of an EO that has actual ramifications is not the same as the kind of photo op horrorshow he put on, yesterday.
Not saying he won’t be persuaded. Just saying I suspect that’s been why he’s avoiding using it, and will keep resisting it (note he didn’t even say he’d use it, yesterday.)
Baud
@Betty Cracker: Props to Senorita Cracker.
randy khan
@Kay:
Exactly.
germy
MattF
We’re seeing a display of the full range of Trump’s personal and political pathologies, I’m not going to try to list them. I’ll note, though– it’s not merely a peculiar coincidence that so many of them are triggered by people with colored skins.
Betty Cracker
@Kay: The protesters spotted him! :)
O. Felix Culpa
@Kay:
Putin?
germy
https://www.postandcourier.com/news/he-told-charleston-police-i-am-not-your-enemy-then-he-was-handcuffed/article_e7de4b0a-a43f-11ea-a019-1f9e6a20ea55.html
SFAW
@germy:
If you substitute “US” for “presidency” in Cobb’s tweet, that’s probably more accurate. Because he sees the US as “mine,” and he’s the figurative husband/daddy/master.
Exregis
The Pulitzer Prize committee for photojournalism is going to have such a tough time this year with the very many excellent photos of cops attacking people. A good (?) quarter of cops IMO are racists or bullies or sociopaths or jonesing for violence or some combination of the above and the remaining 75% of so-called good cops are hardly good when they support the bad cops instead of the the people they pledge to protect.
Jinchi
With everything going on, a small part of me is still annoyed that Trump seems incapable of simply holding a book without looking like he’s been handed an alien artifact. This is not difficult. every grade schooler has figured it out.
terraformer
@Crashman06:
Indeed, so has my lovely wife. We’ve both been edging closer to fleeing. I know that sounds a bit crazy, but this all reads like the proverbial frog boiling. And we know the history of those in Germany who didn’t act (or react to) when the Nazis rose to power.
I had all our passport materials ready prior to the mid-terms, where it seemed like if the Dems didn’t get the House, we were lost. Now we feel that way again. (And of course, I haven’t moved on the passports – mine is current, by my wife and son’s are not – my fault completely. And now of course, the State Department his put all passport processing on hold, save for medical emergencies!)
First they came for…
Mingobat (f/k/a Karen in GA)
Re the NY Times, this headline sucked an awful lot.
ETA: Clearly I have no idea how to embed a tweet.
https://twitter.com/juliancastro/status/1267646288952205312?s=21
germy
The look of horror on the Australian news anchors’ faces when their reporter is attacked:
MattF
@Jinchi: I had the same thought.
germy
SFAW
@download my app in the app store mistermix:
As others have already pointed out, it’s not as if he feels bound by any law. And it’s not as if any Rethug member of Congress will stand against him (outside of Romney, maybe).
And anyway, if he really feels the need to give himself “cover” re: being asked by a governor, he’ll merely dictate a letter with the appropriate language — or Barr or Miller will do the dictation — and tell Kemp or DeSantis to sign it. And if they refuse to sign it, he’ll either threaten them, or he’ll have Miller/Barr forge Kemp’s/DeSantis’s signature.
Elizabelle
That sounds like a Quentin Tarantino character name, doesn’t it? I am going to use it.
SFAW
@germy:
Oh, but “the generals will refuse to obey illegal orders” (or whatever).
germy
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/louisville-police-chief-steve-conrad-fired-protest-shooting-death-david-mcatee/
schrodingers_cat
The vegetarian (they do drink milk and eat milk products) militia in charge of India right now has lynched people (mostly Muslim but not always) on mere suspicion of eating or transporting beef.
germy
Suzy
@Betty Cracker: What I find so hopeful is to see lots of white young people who have joined the protests this time. As for the civil rights movement, people outside the black community are getting engaged. Racism is a plague and americians have to unite to confront it.
SFAW
@germy:
Has McFaul not been paying attention for the last four years? Everything is authoritarian cosplay, even if not everything authoritarian has yet been implemented.
Kay
@Jinchi:
Why did the women take handbags? Is this an outing? They’re absolutely bizarre people. You just get no sense that there’s any workplace environment at all in there. They put the chairman of the joint chiefs of staff into his uniform? Like a costume?
It isn’t just that they have no self respect and willingly debase themselves with these stunts daily, it’s that they debase the whole country.
artem1s
oh that bible. That was Falwell’s doing sure as shit – televangicals hold their bibles like that to shield them from the forces of Satan. they’ll have him thinking he’s bulletproof next. The evangelical right has declared war on America. BTW where the fuck was Dence yesterday? Is he hiding in a bunker somewhere like Cheney after 9/11? The end times are a coming and the mega preachers were out last Sunday praying to their Orange Plague God. By Sunday meeting that waddle is gonna be Moses leading the Israelites across the Red Sea – lead by the righteous tear gas army of the Lord – just watch.
It’s time for cleaning up the nation’s police departments, getting god out of the military, and a major overhaul of charitable giving laws too.
Barbara
Allison Park is in the north, first or second tier suburbs of Pittsburgh. These people just make me furious. Co-opting someone’s peaceful protest so you can engage in destruction is detestable, but knowing that you are unlikely to bear the brunt of the backlash because you are white and wearing a mask makes you extra special loathsome. Take pictures, unmask these people.
Kay
Well, this is humiliating. Another great day “at work” for the Trump Administration. The country would be better off if they stopped showing up for work- all of them. They work for an hour, bad things happen.
germy
Woman Who Never Blinked at Hate Crimes on Mosques and Synagogues Now Deeply Offended About a Target
SFAW
@Kay:
That’s all they know. At the risk of stretching an analogy way-too-far: just as with the 2016 campaign, the only way for the Rethugs to win was to debase Hillary. [Whose approval rating/positives were pretty damn high before Traitor Turtle started in with Benghaziii!!!] They may think that debasing the country is a winning tactic/strategy. Not sure how that would work in practice, however.
Chip Daniels
News item:
27% unlikely to be vaccinated against the coronavirus; Republicans, conservatives especially
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/27-vaccinated-coronavirus-republicans-conservatives-poll/story?id=70962377
There’s that number again.
Barbara
@SFAW: But what would the military actually do that the National Guard can’t? Are they going to start dropping bombs on protesters? Or maybe open up fire with rocket launchers? He has no fucking clue what the military actually does. And his idiot secretary of defense seems to be as stupid as Trump. I mean, seriously, control the battle site or whatever he said — in Los Angeles or Chicago or New York City? Yo, dude, how well did that work in Baghdad? This is what is so demoralizing. Yes, they are evil, but they are so fucking stupid and have been failing upward their whole lives.
Haroldo
@Kay:
And yet, minutes after Trump got back to the White House, he was buttering up and leaning on his willing Aussie lap dog, Prime Minister Scott Morrison, “inviting” him to the September G7 meeting:
Minutes after Donald Trump returned from an impromptu stroll through a park cleared by tear gas to pose in front of a church brandishing a bible, the US President rang Scott Morrison.
It was a 15-minute call in which Trump extended an invitation to attend the G7 summit in the United States in September.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-02/donald-trump-scott-morrison-australia-g7-invitation-accepted/12312466
MattF
@artem1s: A ‘get thee behind me’ gesture. Did Barr obey?
Fair Economist
Based on my experience with my hyper-gullible son, he’s probably very vulnerable to crazy conspiracy theories and follows a bunch of them, often contradictory. Some of the agents behind the crazy conspiracy theories are particularly bad actors like the Russians and white supremacists, so one of the assorted conspiracy factions he follows was probably pushing for violence and he just followed along.
MattF
@Fair Economist: It’s also possible that Bartels is mentally ill. Various pathologies start to show up at that age.
SFAW
@Barbara:
Fire on protesters using live ammo, maybe? [Although I guess the NG can also do that.] But it’s immaterial what one can do vs the other — the Coward-in-Chief wants to show the protesters who’s Boss, and if a few
headsbodieseggs get broken along the way, well that’s just how it goes.Jim, Foolish Literalist
@artem1s:
I’m reminded of how trump excluded Sean Spicer from a meeting with the pope even though, or maybe because, Spicer is a Catholic who was really looking forward to it. Out of spite or fear of being upstaged by a true believer, it wouldn’t surprise me if trump deliberately left Pence out of it
@Kay:
How could Milley not know what was going on? He went out after that and talked about how the military was going to respect the rights of speech and assembly… Scary that he was so willing to play along.
Omnes Omnibus
@germy: I am going to speculate as to what Milley or any other high ranking military leaders will do if Trump goes full metal dictator, but I will say that basing any speculation on what Milley was wearing is in cuckoo banana pants territory. That uniform is what 99% of soldiers wear 99% of the time.
SFAW
@Omnes Omnibus:
They wear “battle fatigues” (per the tweet) in non-combat situations? When his/their primary role(s) is as an administrator, not a field commander?
ETA: Also, did you leave out “not,” as in “NOT going to speculate”?
Immanentize
@Barbara: Call in Snake Plissken! If you are going to do apocalypse cosplay, you might as well do it all the way!
Leto
@germy: @SFAW: His UOD (Uniform of the Day) is one of two things: full class A’s (the fancy dress uniform) or fatigues. It’s all the more strange that a civilian doesn’t understand basic military regulations/uniform standards.
@SFAW: You know what I saw my senior officers (O-6 through O-8) wear 99% of the time? A flight uniform (the fancy fighter jock pajama set). You know when they wore their blues (class A’s in Army speak)? At dog and pony show time, or when they were had high level meetings/etc. For me, a military guy, it would’ve looked strange as fuck if he were out there in his full dress uniform.
Immanentize
@Leto: I want one of the Steve Carell Space Force uniforms to wear around.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The public isn’t supposed to have to rely on some Trumpster’s assurance of what they “will” respect or not respect. The RULE was the curfew started at 7. THAT’S the due process. It’s very nice that he is graciously allowing assembly but he violated the rule. They have a right to notice and a predictable process. That’s the guarantee. That’s what due process is. What is is NOT is hoping and wishing one person shows mercy. They’re not subject to his fucking whims or notions. I don’t know him. I’m not supposed to have to know him.
He can’t violate their civil rights and then go out and blather about how he may or may not “respect” them in the future. They rely on the RULE, not him.
The absolute lunacy of these Trump clowns nattering on about law and order when they gassed those people prior to the order taking effect is just the most perfect explanation for WHY these protests are happening. They don’t follow the rules!
Omnes Omnibus
@SFAW: Yes, I left out a “not” in the first sentence. And, yes, that’s what soldiers wear most of the time.
SFAW
@Leto:
Why would a civilian — one who has not been in the service — understand basic military regulations/uniform standards?
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Here’s why they violated the curfew rule. Because they wanted to get Trump and his employees on the evening news. They couldn’t wait until 7.
The general knows that yet he happily went along with violating the rule and gassing those people. For Dear Leader. Why on EARTH would I trust this person? He has ZERO credibility.
Leto
@Immanentize: OMG, Avalune and I were laughing so hard at that show! I can tell that they had some military people helping with that, which made it that much more funny.
Van Buren
@germy: That is infuriating and depressing.
SFAW
@Omnes Omnibus:
OK, thanks to you (and Leto) for educating me.
Immanentize
@Leto: I really enjoyed it. Did you notice their camo is little moons all over on that blue field? Such good detail.
Leto
@SFAW:
Idk, civilian, you seem to have an uninformed answer. I see it’s not limited to top 10,000 blogs.
SFAW
@Leto:
Given your (and Omnes’s) explanation(s), I understand. I had assumed that when you got to be Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, you would usually wear suit-like attire, not fatigues.
polyorchnid octopunch
I discovered a year or so ago that white supremacist vegans are actually a thing… and I mean really a thing. I came across it because they were ganging on an Innu throat singer named Tanya Tagaq for wearing seal fur.
Serious assholes.
Leto
@Immanentize: Yeah, saw that; the fact that it’s basically all black, ala Dark Side of the Moon, is hilarious. The First Lady’s redesigns… hahahaha! The 18th century European formal dress, with cape!, was just /chef’skiss!
Immanentize
@Kay: This point about it not yet being curfew is being missed by the media. Otherwise, I think they are doing a good job on “gassing peaceful protesters for foto op.”
SFAW
@Leto:
Yeah, fine, whatever. How many Ave Marias and Pater Nosters would you like me to do?
Immanentize
@Leto: and plumes!
Nicole
In the midst of the intense anxiety and fear and depression the past weeks have put me into, I’m glad for a bit of amusement by today’s kerfuffle on Twitter- actor Lea Michelle tweeted out support for BLM, and several actors who worked with her were quick to point out that, in person, she didn’t practice what she’s preaching:
https://toofab.com/2020/06/01/lea-michele-backlash-glee-co-stars-black-lives-matter/
Good on them for calling out bad behavior.
Betty Cracker
@Kay: Exactly! Thank you for putting that into words. It’s just mind-boggling, watching as the one of the most corrupt oafs who ever trod the earth styles himself the “President of Law and Order” and his stooges lie about respecting our rights as they take them away.
Immanentize
@SFAW: two rosaries and three Acts of Contrition, please.
Leto
@SFAW: I’m sure when he’s around the *president, or other cabinet members, he’s probably in full dress. But I’ll take the flip side of this too: if something were to go sideways while he was down there, he’d rather be in a functional uniform that can actually move, than the stiff ass formal straight jacket most of us hate to wear.
As far as why he was down there, at all… idk, maybe he was down there reminding himself who he actually serves. There’s no better way to understand something than actually being there, in person/on the ground, using the good ole Mark 1 (your own eyeballs) to see wtf is going on. I’m not saying “the generals will save us!!!”, but I’m trying to hold out some glimmer of hope.
Leto
@SFAW: Considering 1) I’m an atheist and 2) I don’t know Latin, Watch this drummer And you’re good to go :P
Roger Moore
@Barbara:
Trump has made it clear he sees the solution as more violence, and the governors are wimping out. He wants to send in the army because they will be taking his orders rather than the state governors’.
Barbara
@polyorchnid octopunch: My daughter is a vegan and not an extremist of any kind, but the concept of clean living or inner purity appeals to the proponents of a wide variety of “isms.”
SFAW
@Leto:
Given your earlier explanation, I agree with your first paragraph; it makes a lot of sense.
I remain skeptical of “the generals will save us” because the past three-plus years have shown that they (apparently) won’t. [Disclaimer: this is based only on what I see in public reports. Whether there has been behind-the-scenes reining in of Trump’s authoritarian impulses/desires, by the generals, I have no idea.]
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kay: Milley’s answer to a question about what he said to the NG, “What’s your message tonight to your men?”
Barbara
@Roger Moore: Right. Start shooting. So we can have Kent State multiplied by 100. Bloodthirsty asshole so long as the blood is on someone else’s hands and far, far away from his germ free corpulence.
Immanentize
@Leto: That is so good! I may use that as my song for class tonight. That or Hero by Michael Kiwanuka
Amazing song, fabulous guitar work, super powerful video for this moment.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
He looked embarrassed in the photo that was everywhere, honestly.
Those people are the worst to me though- it’s like they want to kowtow to Trump AND be respected.
They can’t demand that from us. It’s not fair. Debase yourself, whatever, but don’t then come around looking for absolution. You made your bed. Live your shitty values, at least. This “I want it both ways” nonsense has to stop.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kay: like you can’t be a little bit pregnant, you can’t be a little bit trumpist
exceptions that prove the rule (so far): Chris Christie and Nikki Haley. They are, to borrow from the Lady Olenna, vicious but not stupid. I suspect Christie in particular knows that Jar-Vanka’s vindictiveness preserved his future career by pushing him out early
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
It’s a kind of priviege. It’s the same as Ivanka and Jared demanding to be respected as good people while doing all these horrible things. No. You don’t get that. Be cartoon evil people, go crazy, but the trade off for that is you are not loved and respected. That’s the accountability.
SFAW
@Leto:
Me, too, but I married into an Irish-Catholic family, and my mom was a (lapsed) Catholic. But to help with your “education”:
Ave Maria: a prayer typically invoked by football quarterbacks. Not sure of its exact translation, but maybe it’s something “Jesus! Catch the
damndarn ball!” ?Pater Noster: mumble mumble St Peter misspelled mumble something about a nose mumble
SFAW
@Immanentize:
Does commenting here count as one? Or do I have to — gulp — go to Red State?
Roger Moore
@SFAW:
Not to pile on but the name should be a clue. Fatigues are called that because they’re a work uniform, i.e. what you’d wear when doing something fatiguing. One form of military work is combat, but they wear the same style of uniform for any kind of physically taxing- or simply messy and dirty- work.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The only one I find interesting is Mitt Romney because it’s so rare to brush up against the Trump sleaze and come out better for it. You can count them on one hand. Nancy Pelosi is one. So is Joe Biden. And Obama, of course. But Mittens is a Republican and he didn’t just oppose Trump, he prospered doing so. That’s unusual.
Matt McIrvin
@download my app in the app store mistermix: It doesn’t, though. There are clauses allowing the federal government to act without state consent, if the situation is such that federal laws cannot be enforced or if the state is denying civil rights. Of course these cases don’t apply here, but Trump could probably find a way to construe them to apply if he felt like it.
Immanentize
@SFAW: Commenting about Restate counts as one.
Immanentize
@Matt McIrvin: You are forgetting the civil rights of property owners. That is whose civil rights Trump will claim to protect when he sends in the tanks.
Emma from FL
@Kay: Thank you for saying much better than I ever could. I was taught from childhood that absolution from sin comes AFTER soul searching, taking your punishment, and making reparations as much as one could. None of this get out of jail free card.
NotMax
@SFAW
Make a cross on your abdomen
When in Rome do like a Roman
:) (Should be no need to identify the reference here.)
SFAW
@NotMax:
Funny you should bring him up. The local PBS station was doing their fund-raising thing last night, and it was interspersed with clips of his concert/performance in Copenhagen in 1967. We watched “Who’s Next?,” “Poisoning Pigeons in the Park,” and “My Hometown” (which I had never heard before) before I decided I wanted no more commercials.
Roger Moore
@Barbara:
I actually think Trump is too chickenshit to give the order to shoot people. At his core, he’s a bully, and he’s used to get what he wants through bluster and intimidation without actually needing to resort to force. He’s hoping either that the simple threat of escalating violence will intimidate the protesters into giving up, or that his exhortations to engage in more violence will get someone else to issue an actual order without him needing to do so directly.
SFAW
@Immanentize:
That still would (theoretically) require me to go there, wouldn’t it?
Matt McIrvin
@Immanentize: Gunning down unarmed citizens under the authority used to desegregate the schools in Little Rock would certainly be on-brand for the modern Republican party.
Amir Khalid
@SFAW:
I know an eensy bit of Latin. (Well, the odd word here and there.) Ave Maria means Hail Mary, and Pater Noster means Our Father. I have no idea what the former is, as my sole source of knowledge about Catholicism is The Exorcist; but I’m guessing that the latter is the one also referred to as The Lord’s Prayer. (Our Father, who art in Heaven, etc.)
SFAW
@Roger Moore:
My original attempt-at-a-point was that Milley’s current job is as an administrator, not a combat commander, so I didn’t understand why he would be wearing combat fatigues in a non-wartime/combat situation. Leto and Omnes explained why that “point” was ignorant.
Matt McIrvin
@Amir Khalid: There used to be a hideously dangerous type of elevator called a “paternoster” that was just open cars slowly circulating without stopping on an endless chain–so called because it resembled a huge rosary. Also maybe because prayer was advisable if you rode one.
Immanentize
@SFAW: Nah, just make something up. You will probably be correct, if not accurate.
SFAW
@Amir Khalid:
Yes, I know. It was my little attempt at ein Spass. [You may already know this, but in real — a/k/a American — football, there’s something known as a “Hail Mary” pass. It’s typically thrown with the game (or half) about to end, and the likelihood of success is such that the QB (figuratively) says a “Hail Mary” when launching the football.]
PS: I threw in the “real”/”American” part just as a mild ribbing, because of your love for non-‘Murican football.
Leto
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Michael Hayden, GWB’s last CIA director, defender of torture, and creator of a domestic telephone database (while he was director of the NSA) can shut the fuck up, forever.
@SFAW: hahaha; regarding the generals, I don’t believe they’ll save us. The military is too “yes, sir”, plus Trumpov won’t listen to anyone except the deranged squirrel on his head.
Barbara
@Amir Khalid: I listen to a Roman history podcast called Emperors of Rome. There is more than one and this one happens to be Australian. They start every episode with a chipper “Ave!” “Hail Mary” is how the Angel Gabriel is supposed to have greeted Mary before the immaculate conception. That greeting became the basis for a prayer to Mary herself (“thou art blessed among women . . .”) And I have never been a good Catholic, but found long ago that one of the traits associated with being a bad one was a curiosity to actually learn the underlying details in order to know whether one should try harder . . .
SFAW
@Leto:
Did he borrow it from Rand Paul?
Oh, wait, that’s a weasel/ferret; my bad.
Bill Arnold
Perhaps more than opportunistic, in some places. This tweet captures what some people have noticed:
SFAW
@Barbara:
Not to be confused with the “Immaculate Reception,” of course
J R in WV
@Kay:
They should all be prosecuted for being accomplices in all the crimes Trump is committing every day. After all , they were there assisting, advising, consenting, every day, right?
A felony conviction might help keep them out of future administration jerbs, even a right wing nut job, should one get elected again. Just being named in a news article, not so much.
Leto
I know this is probably dead thread, Biden thread is where it’s at now, but I wanted to post this. It’s from Chief Master Sgt Wright, top enlisted person for the AF. He’s been an amazing leader throughout his career, and he’s continuing in the footsteps of some of the best Chief’s the AF has ever had (some of the best progress the AF has made has been under POC Chiefs). The “generals” might not save us, but this Chief sure as fuck is trying:
Geminid
@Kay: Romney’s republican constituents are more supportive of his independence than would be the case in other states. Mormons are the backbone of the Utah Republican party, and i think they retain an outsider’s perspective on Trump’s divisiveness. They fled the rest of the US in the mid 19th century after their leader and many other Mormons were lynched. And alhough it took them well into the 20th century to reject racist doctrine that made people of color second class, they are now big into world wide missionary work. I think that makes them question Trump’s nativist bigotry. And I bet they notice how enthusiastically political preachers like Falwell and Graham boost trump after giving Romney such tepid, nominal support in 2012.
JPL
@SFAW: Nothing should be confused with Immaculate Conception.
SFAW
@Leto:
Thanks for posting that.
Barbara
@SFAW: Heard it on the radio because the game was actually blacked out for local tv reception. It’s hard to believe that was even a thing. A local tv station played a clip of the video footage as part of its station break for at least the next three months.
J R in WV
@Barbara:
That’s mostly why I’m a member of the Democratic party, the clean living and inner purity! I don’t feel the need for veganism, tho. Evolution made me an omnivore.
J R in WV
@Roger Moore:
Generals do physicaly taxing, or messy, or dirty work? I thot that’s why people strive to become a general, so someone else will have to clean the latrine, etc. etc.
catclub
I can imagine folks willing to join AntiFava. Never liked garbanzos.
pacem appellant
NYT delenda est.
(At this point, I should change my nym to Cato the Elder or Marcus Porcius Cato)
geg6
@Barbara:
I would consider Allison Park to be upper middle class. Saw him on tv with his parents when he turned himself in. Fucking punk.
schrodingers_cat
@SFAW: He wore the fatigues to send a message and he was a willing participant in the wannabe dictator’s photo-op.
BTW Mattis is still silent, so much for his nobility,
J R in WV
@Barbara:
Ave Maria, because of course Gabriel spoke Latin, right? Right?
Wait, wait… I thought it was all in Old English, like King James spoke…??? now I are cornfused~!~
ballerat
@Kay: All little Eichmanns with an even greater moral vacuum and an even less credible excuse. This is the look of banality of evil in the US.
SFAW
@Barbara:
When my New York Jets won the Most Important Super Bowl Ever, my father booked us a hotel room in Hartford to watch the game, because we were within the 75-mile blackout zone, but Hartford was not.