The bunker occupant held a conference call with the nation’s governors this morning. He wasn’t in a happy mood:
I wish activating Bill Bar and activating him “very strongly” referred to a mechanism for launching a projectile — a trebuchet containing Bill Barr aimed at the side of the DOJ building would be ideal. But I’m thinking Trump means to subvert the rule of law even further, perhaps to empower head-knockers in a bid to save his (Trump’s) own ass from this humiliating spectacle. Coincidentally, that was the Fox & Friends advice this morning, if you read between the lines.
One NYT reporter says Trump told the governors he was putting the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs “in charge.” Is that even legal? Fuckifino.
Anyhoo, it’s alarming, obviously. But as Cheryl correctly pointed out on Twitter, it’s pretty clear there’s no real strategy here. Just a small, scared shitbird squawking in a gilded cage. Still, he’s a shitbird with the nuclear codes and military forces, so yeah, I’ll categorize this display as alarming AND disorganized for now.
Courage, friends. The only way out of this dangerous time is through it.
kindness
Trump is unhappy because he’s crapped all his britches down in the bunker this weekend.
Baud
Memes of Bill Barr in a Rambo outfit in 3 … 2 …. 1….
JPL
CNN has one clip of his speech link
MattF
‘The way out is through’ is the quote of the day, maybe of the century.
zhena gogolia
Addictive gif:
SiubhanDuinne
Both NYT and WaPo have the call with governors up as lead story. Trump: The Unhingening is the featured show right now.
different-church-lady
Is it just me, or does anyone else get the sense this ends with Trump defending himself in courtroom from inside a plexiglass box?
Baud
@SiubhanDuinne: I can’t believe this knocked Tara Reade off the NYT’s front page.
Redshift
Looks like Barr is going for another round of acting as Trump’s personal enforcer instead of serving the public:
AG Barr deploying federal riot teams to DC, Miami to quell unrest, DOJ official says
The unrest in DC is nowhere near many other cities, so this is obviously just to protect President Tough Guy from the scary Black people.
And if you, like me, had never heard of federal riot teams, it’s because they’re from the Bureau of Prisons. Trumpers treating this situation as a prison riot seems entirely unsurprising.
Old School
I guess Putin offered some helpful advice on how to handle protesters.
(Trump and Putin reportedly spoke this morning.)
BGinCHI
My governor pushing back in that exchange, and Trump’s reply?
“I don’t like you.”
He has NOTHING.
No argument, no facts. Nothing. A Bully shitting his pants in fear.
Cheryl Rofer
I would like to know which came first, the call with Putin or the call with the governors.
germy
SiubhanDuinne
@JPL: I listened to that entire clip as though it were a Sarah Cooper lip-sync. Please, by sundown tonight, let it be so.
JPL
@Baud: I can’t believe they had another fking story about her..
I’m surprised they didn’t reach out to Jill to see what she thought.
Cheryl Rofer
@BGinCHI:
charluckles
There is somewhat of a strategy here. Its the same one he is using with the coronavirus. The same one he has used his entire life.
Blame shifting.
JPL
@Cheryl Rofer: Would you please put up the entire exchange with Pritzer. I can only copy and paste jpeg links.
Well that was quick.. She put it up before I even posted my comment.. lol
Ceci n est pas mon nym
He really really wants to give the order to shoot somebody and have it carried out. He tried that at the Mexican border, visiting troops and telling them to meet any protests with lethal fire.
After he left, the officers advised their troops that it was an illegal order and anybody doing it would be charged with war crimes.
I think we’re going to see that played out here. Despite his glorification of war criminals, most of our military is professional.
Re: “I don’t like you.” Neither he nor any of his advisors have every understood that the federal government is supposed to GOVERN, and that job description has nothing to do with “only do stuff for people you like”.
LongHairedWeirdo
I don’t know. Has the DOJ always been this dirty, that it deserves to have its wall stained with Barr?
Barr wasn’t the first, mind you; the DOJ decided that Trump could make money from his businesses, while President, and it didn’t violate the foreign emoluments clause. The explanation is probably the quality you’d expect: “a *bribe* is illegal! It’s DIRTY! Okay, but if a bribe is given, as profits over a business deal, that’s not dirty at all. It’s… um… oh, great word! It’s *laundered*, so it’s no longer dirty!”
But Barr is bad, and worse, he’s equally shameless. For example, remember how there’s a report that the Treasury Department acted correctly in not handing over Trump’s tax returns?
Well, there’s a department, the OLC, that is more powerful than a great many courts – opinions of the OLC are seen as binding law. For example, the primary reason that torture wasn’t punished on the individual level was (as I understand it – and I welcome new knowledge if I’m wrong) because *there was an OLC opinion stating it was allowed*.
The problem, then, is that Republicans running the OLC know they can cheat. They can force the OLC to issue an opinion on torture; or on refusing to hand over tax returns. The OLC is now permanently broken, because in two successive Republican Presidencies, it’s been abused to make things that are clearly unlawful, into the law of the land, with no recourse for external review.
Anyway: the Treasury Department acted rightly, because there was an OLC opinion, that was put in place for the sole purpose of covering Trump’s ass; we know the opinion is garbage because the law states clearly that returns are to be handed over, and you need a whiny-ass Trumpie-baby argument to even imagine why a refusal could be allowed.
SiubhanDuinne
@Baud: Oh, it didn’t. She’s just lurking below the fold right now.
trollhattan
@Redshift:
Gosh, are there Trump properties in those two places? What a coinkidink.
germy
ant
The police brutality at the police brutality protests is dumping gasoline on top of the fire of ‘rona-FUD anger.
Everybody is pissed off, including MAGA chodes in the various police departments. They are angry about the prospect of losing power in November, and also at people not respecting their authority.
The push-back includes riots, with the booger boys/proud boys/undercover copps sparking them off.
Trump is the leading ingredient for this shit pie.
hueyplong
Looks like trump couldn’t tweet from the bunker, but he could take a call from Steiner — err — Putin while rocking in the fetal position.
Since 1932, no president other than trump has looked to Anacostia Flats as a model (with the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs in the MacArthur role).
cain
Just keep showing him images of a lights out white house and then a cartoon of him tweeting from a bunker. That imagery is a gift from the gods. While he runs around talking about strength – his people will go ape shit because it’s hard not to get ‘weakness’ from it.
The Lincoln Project people must be in absolute glee over what has been given to him.. the ad is going to be devastating – George and Keyllanne will either have hate filled sex after it being deployed or they’ll be living in separate bedrooms and occupying different flours.
Cheryl Rofer
@JPL: Balloon Juice is a full service blog
ET
tRump is going to stroke out because the world operates how it wants and not how he wants. I won’t cry for him.
randy khan
@LongHairedWeirdo:
And think of the poor workers who’d have to clean up the mess. That’s why I favor launching him into an active volcano. Much less cleanup required.
randy khan
In the scheme of things, putting the Joint Chiefs in charge would be much better than putting Barr in charge.
Geoduck
@cain: Nah, she’s just a cold-blooded mercenary and they’re working both sides. God knows what if anything she actually believes.
trollhattan
City of Sac (dunno about the county) is proposing a curfew starting tonight and considering bringing in National Guard. Saturday and Sunday nights both featured vandalism and looting downtown and elsewhere, IDK if it’s been determined by whom. Similar pattern as other cities–organized or ad hoc marches and demonstrations are peaceful, then end and breakaway groups start the trouble.
Downtown basically shut today, and all State buildings are closed. They had been occupied by essential workers.
OTOH the weather is nice. In two days we’re back to triple digits and my historical observation is heat makes people nuts.
Spanky
I’m sitting in the shade of a locust tree, watching an osprey wheel and dive for fish. Another hovers nearly overhead, riding the updraft from our bluff.
It’s 70 degrees and the dew point is 41, a blessing in Southern MD. Two puffy white clouds hang in the sky.
Control what you can, let your elected officials (e.g. one of those governors) know they have your support. Hoard your strength for when we’ll need it, and be generous where it counts. And take time when you can to appreciate who and what surrounds you.
p.a.
I can see him demanding his handlers truck in MAGAs to the WH so he can get him some lovin’, assuage his infantile ego with a torchlight whinefest.
Jay C
@Cheryl Rofer:
According to most reports, the call to Putin was first.
Though because of Trump’s priorities, or time-zone conveniences wasn’t made clear….
Duane
@cain: Someone please leave a diet Coke and a cyanide pill in Trumpov’s bunker. It’s the right thing to do.?
Johnnybuck
If Doug Jones loses his senate race I think he’d make an excellent Attorney General in a Biden Administration.
low-tech cyclist
https://twitter.com/stevesingiser/status/1267490964009967616
Baud
Isn’t Biden speaking to a bunch of mayors later today? It’ll be quite the contrast.
PenAndKey
You know, I’m not a lawyer or even someone who pretends to be one, but while I could squint my eyes and see a case for him having the authority to do something like that in DC I legitimately don’t understand how sending a federal prison riot team to Miami is in any way legal.
Ohio Mom
This morning I am remembering Trump’s inaugural speech. I don’t remember the specifics, only that it sketched out a dystopian America, and that GW was heard to mutter afterwards, “That was some weird shit.”
If this was a novel and not real life, English teachers would have been including “foreshadowing” in their lectures on that first chapter.
SiubhanDuinne
@Baud:
He’s live with the mayors now. I’m watching on FB.
Kay
I may regret this, but I find it impossible to be scared of the Trump people. They’re soft people. They’ve never weathered any hardship, personally. Their big threat is to sue people or be mean to them on Twitter. Bill Barr looks like some pampered member of an imaginary gentry and Donald Trump has trouble walking on a slightly uneven surface. These are people who spent their adults lives going from the back seats of cars they pay people to drive and then into hotel ballrooms. They don’t even actually earn their educational credentials- they buy them. Nixon always struck me as someone you personally would not want to fuck with, but these flabby, coddled golfers? Nah. Not scared.
Sloane Ranger
@Redshift: Presumably because they can do what they like in DC and the Governor of Florida was the only one willing to accept BOP Riot Squad “help”. I would think there can’t be too many of them, given their role, but their mere presence will likely escalate the situation.
On a different note, Dump said he wanted to deploy the military and was putting the Chief of the Defence Staff in charge. CNN says that’s illegal but, thinking about the western films of my youth, can’t they get some sympathetic Sheriff to deputise soldiers?
Luciamia
@p.a.: I’m surprised he hasn’t organized his own at-home rally. To any normal person that would look so pathetic, but well…
Benno
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: it’s really amazing, isn’t it. He is desperate to perform his POWER. He so much want to be a “man” like ex-officer Chauvin. He has the full authority of the office of the president, a congress that will not keep him in check, and a DOJ that clearly and materially supports authoritarian dominionism, but he’s still too much of a chickenshit coward to actually do anything himself. And yet the apparatus that supports him can still do so much damage, even with a flaccid authoritarian as leader.
randy khan
Speaking of reactions to the protests, this one is pretty surprising (in a good way):
Not the sports figure you’d expect
Matt McIrvin
Well, so far, the effect of all this on Trump’s poll numbers is nuthin’. I stand corrected for expecting a big Trump bump.
Johnnybuck
@randy khan: Dale is a good guy, this doesn’t surprise me at all.
germy
A documentary from the year 2030 about the fall of Trump:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHVvrvx2eFY
JPL
@randy khan: Earlier I saw a link to his tweet. I missed the local news so I don’t know if they covered his comments. Murphy was liked and respected when he played in Atlanta.
MattF
Boris Johnson sez the UK would veto Russia rejoining the G7.
different-church-lady
Yup, he’s gonna get dragged from the White House by his heels.
WaterGirl
@Cheryl Rofer: I’m pleased to see that from Pritzker. Both the challenge to Trump and the affirmation that there truly is a problem at the root of this.
Subsole
@different-church-lady:
If the box lacks airholes, I can support this outcome.
Ksmiami
@MattF: Adam Silverman and I said the same thing a few months ago- keep on trucking- the Mussolini moment is at hand
JPL
@different-church-lady: How about in a pink straight jacket and to help pay off the debt they could leave him in the rotunda and sell tickets to see him strapped in.
Ksmiami
@Kay: Add Mitch to that flaccid club – he freaked out when upper middle class whites booed him out of a dc restaurant and his wife had to defend his weak ass
Ohio Mom
A month or so ago, Trump’s message to the governors was essentially, Stop bugging me, this is your problem.
Today it is, “Listen to me! Follow my orders!”
I feel for the Democratic governors but not for the Republican ones. Lie down with dogs, etc.
Kirk Spencer
Re the federal riot control, a couple of things.
First, it’s possibly legal. If they are protecting federal property in the process.
Second, most of the officers I’ve known on riot control are surprisingly clear on where the lines that must not be crossed are drawn. (Worked in the Colorado State system, got a little time with people in canon city.)
That’s not all riot team, and it’s twenty year old data, but it’s a data point to watch for surprises.
Kent
@Baud: Jesus. I went and read the Tara Reade story in the NYT and need to take a fucking shower. Talk about a whitewash. For example:
No, that’s not an “embellishment. That’s a fucking lie. Anyone who has ever worked on capital hill knows that there is a night-and-day difference between staff assistants and legislative assistants. The former are often 18-21 year old intern types. The latter are usually attorneys or other experts with higher degrees like economists, public health experts, etc. depending on the legislative committee they are working for. It’s like working in a law office as a filing clerk or receptionist and then embellishing your resume to say you were a staff attorney
You mean there’s MORE lies?
Feathers
The best thing that can come out of all of this is a wave of “defund the police” candidates. One thing I saw on twitter yesterday was women astonished to learn how much is being spent on policing. Police have a seemingly endless supply of very expensive gear while doctors and nurses don’t have PPE and schools lack books and teachers must buy classroom supplies.
My brother is a cop and he has often said the best thing about the job is the toys.
Cacti
Saw multiple articles today that protesters are vandalizing and toppling Confederate monuments throughout the southern states.
The HQ of the United Daughters of the Confederacy was also set ablaze and covered with graffiti.
I wonder if Republicans will greet this with the same cheers as when oppressed Europeans toppled statues of Lenin, or Iraqis tore down a statue of Saddam?
No, I really don’t.
Booger
@ant: Hey now, watch it.
A Ghost to Most
“For Everyman”
Betty Cracker
@Kay: You may be right. His followers are chickenshits for the most part too. I thought it was outrageous and dangerous when Trump incited the MAGAs to show up at the White House to defend his flabby ass, but they apparently failed to materialize! Maybe they’d show up if golf carts were provided.
Baud
@Kent:
I once embellished my resume by referring to my former job as “Associate Justice of the Supreme Court.”
I didn’t get the position.
burnspbesq
Like it or not, we’re betting the ranch on the willingness of our military to refuse to follow clearly illegal orders.
Kent
In the south that is often fueled by seizures of money, vehicles, and property, often from people of color. And often from people who never get convicted of anything.
Barbara
@Matt McIrvin: He’s not even trying. George W. Bush proved to me for all time that just acting the part of the uniter in chief is almost guaranteed to pay enormous political dividends. Trump isn’t even trying to act the part, not for COVID-19 and certainly not for the concept of equal protection of the law. His single political gift was to turn racial grievance into performance art. He doesn’t have any other mode for interacting with the nation’s citizens.
MattF
@Matt McIrvin: Looks like there’s something about Trump that’s making people uncomfortable.
hueyplong
@randy khan: As an ATL resident in Murphy’s time who hated the Braves, I can testify that everyone liked Dale Murphy.
I am very proud of him today.
Cacti
@Kent: Isn’t Ms. “Reade” currently under investigation for perjury in California, for fudging her expert witness credentials in criminal trials?
Lapassionara
@Kay: it’s Putin that I worry about. He has his hands in our government now, and I don’t see him giving that up easily.
mvr
No its not legal. The Posse Comitatus act limits the use of the military for domestic law enforcement.
Cermet
From all I’ve read, the joint chief of staff has zero authority over any State as far as police or legal policing – no more than you or I. Now, if an national emmergency is declared then there is a more sound (but far from certain) legal stance. Like all obxious gas clouds – the comb over, small handed commander bone spur just shits his pants in fear and further stinks
Kent
Mostly it just looks like graffiti. These protesters need to up their game and figure out how to permanently destroy those statues. Can’t be that difficult to do. A couple of hours with a pressure washer and the right chemicals will usually clean the graffiti right off. They need to blow the damn things up. Or use stuff like hydrochloric acid that will permanently deface the bronze and marble.
Where are the young chem majors when we need them
I would think a backpack sprayer full of full-strength HCL would do a number on most of those statutes that couldn’t easily be repaired. I’m sure there are other creative solutions.
SiubhanDuinne
@germy:
So many great little touches in that, like the tennis player in the Pence clips.
Subsole
@Matt McIrvin:
You and me both.
Now, if there hadn’t been video? Entirely different outcome.
The cops are going buckwild because they got caught red handed. Everybody SAW a uniform kill a defenseless civilian, on the ground, begging for his life, while three officers looked on.
Normally, white folks have to complicate this shit so we can look away. You cannot complicate this. You can only lie to yourself.
And even then, you’ll still know it.
hueyplong
@mvr: Don’t you think they picked Miami because Trump’s servile lackey governor will invite federal troops in?
germy
NEW YORK TIMES’ STYLE GUIDE SUBSTITUTIONS FOR “THE PRESIDENT LIED”
by MICKEY McCAULEY
“The president, offering no evidence, insisted upon his version of the story.”
“The president extemporized with a blithe disregard for established fact.”
“Confounding experts and antagonizing the historical record, the president painted his own, rosier portrait of events.”
“The president, perhaps inadvertently, wound up smudging the line between empirical verification and his own boundless optimism.”
“The president once again found himself galloping ahead of reality’s leisurely pace.”
“The president dabbled anew in the shallow pond of misrepresentation, filling his beak with succulent morsels hidden among the reeds.”
“The president’s most recent encounter with the specter of honesty caught him wrong-footed.”
“Two roads diverged in a yellow wood, and the president? The president took the one less truthful.”
“Quantum physicists posit the existence of infinite universes, so it is entirely within reason that one or more such contained the timeline described by the president, and we look forward to seeing it.”
“Mrs. Clinton lied. The president followed suit.”
Cacti
@Kent: In Birmingham, they actually pulled one down.
Cheryl Rofer
Daily Beast now has the full audio of the phonecall. About an hour.
Fair Economist
@Feathers:
I’m hoping people notice that the supposed pension crises for local governments are mostly about police pensions, just because policing is such a huge portion of most municipal budgets.
Lapassionara
@Betty Cracker: I heard that DC law prohibits open carry of automatic weapons, so MAGA’s couldn’t come armed. What fun would that be? No weapons? Not sure whether Florida law would permit them to bring weapons to Mar a lago. Maybe Trump will decamp to South Florida, and we will see if his supporters show up.
MisterForkbeard
@Baud: To be fair, apparently the NYT did a whole bunch of investigating, interviewed 100 people and basically came back and said “no evidence of this happening and Reade’s credibility is awful”.
But they didn’t lead with that conclusion. And they haven’t done remotely close to this for any of the 31 reputable accusers against Trump.
Fair Economist
@Kent:
I wonder if thermite might do the trick.
Kent
Good for them. They need to destroy them so they can’t be put back up. Most states and cities won’t commission NEW statutes, but they will put the old ones back up if they aren’t damaged beyond repair.
If I was still a college student and living in that part of the country, that would be my mission. Creative destruction of confederate monuments by chemical means!
Gin & Tonic
@Kent: The Lenin statues were often broken into pieces (my son has a piece from one of the Kyiv statues.)
trollhattan
@Kent:
She’s a fabulist and a user. Those are well established facts and continuing to give her a platform is acting to undermine the Biden campaign for no valid reason. IDK how it can be seen in any other light by now. Criticize him on his ideas or how he runs the campaign as warranted, not on this.
James E Powell
@cain:
I loved the treason flag ad. I wonder how many people and which people are seeing it.
mvr
@hueyplong:
It’s not clear to me that a governor can undercut the act by inviting the feds in. But I just did a quick scan of the language, which does have exceptions, some of which were repealed.
MattF
@Lapassionara: There have been occasions where gun ‘activists’ have threatened to show up in DC and parade through the streets with guns. They back down when informed that they will be stopped at the DC line, arrested, and tossed in jail.
Kent
The reporting is reasonable if you read all the way through to the 25th paragraph. But in typical NYT fashion the headline is:
“Tara Reade’s Tumultuous Journey to the 2020 Campaign” and they spend a whole lot of time talking about her love of horses and abusive father before they finally get around to casting a skeptical eye on her claims.
Gin & Tonic
@Subsole: My mother-in-law, 96 years old, an immigrant from Eastern Europe, is beside herself with anger over the video of the George Floyd killing. She tells her grandkids how upset she is. Not really the protesters’ target demo, but there you are. Perhaps having survived fascism and wanton random cruelty affects one.
David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch
Morning Consult Poll — May 31st thur June 1st
Who will you vote for president?
Biden…………..46%
Dump………….37%
trollhattan
@mvr:
Digby did a deep dive into the law and found it’s not so clearcut. Closing graf:
WaterGirl
@Cheryl Rofer: I have tried 3 times to listen to that. The terrible audio + it’s Donald Trump made me bail every time. Hoping there will be a full transcript at some point. That, I can get through!
Subsole
@Barbara:
Makes sense. Racial grievance is inherently reductive and exclusionary. That precludes inclusive inspirational acts.
They literally said they would rather stop being American than be American with democrats.
You gonna have a hard time unburning that bridge, Clevon…
hueyplong
@David ? ☘The Establis6hment☘? Koch: 16% undecided seems high.
MisterForkbeard
@Matt McIrvin: You’d want to wait a few more days anyway.
Three options: 1) His numbers go down because he’s failing abjectly and making things worse, 2) They stay about the same because everyone who’s open to discussion has already decided he’s terrible or 3) He makes racists really happy and his numbers start to go up.
Last I saw his averages are something like a quarter percentage point higher than they were two days ago, which is to say: Statistical noise so far.
MattF
@MisterForkbeard: Also, one has to bear in mind that small changes in polls reflect changes at the margin– which is to say, among people who can’t make up their minds about Donald Trump.
MisterForkbeard
@Kent:
Yes. This is a lie. If someone puts “Senior Software Developer” on their resume but their job title is “Intern, Software Development” it’s a lie. A huge lie, which is what she did here. Repeatedly and for decades.
Subsole
@Cacti:
I heard they are reviewing cases she was involved with.
Jesus, can you imagine what a gutpunch that has to be? You think it’s settled and then twenty years later:
“Oh hey. That guy we put away for molesting your daughter? Yeah, he might walk now. Because Bernie wudda wun.”
I mean…fuck.
Barbara
@Subsole: Right. His instructions to the governors are, basically, “sow more division!”
Subsole
@Kent:
Truck.
Winch.
Cable.
Done.
Kent
When I taught HS in Texas I used to always call it the “loser flag” when the topic would come up in class (which wasn’t often as I taught science). I’d tell the black and Hispanic kids in my mixed classes stuff like “losers gotta find some way to self-identify and celebrate getting their butts kicked by real Americans. They deserve your mockery and pity, not your anger.”
NotMax
The image now conjured is of Dolt 45 with a knee on Uncle Sam’s throat.
Ugly, ugly picture but I can’t shake it.
Subsole
@Gin & Tonic:
I can see how she would be furious at this shit. These folks are exactly the kind of swaggering little jackbooted village tyrants from whom people used to come here to escape.
A chekist is always a chekist, ne?
Barbara
@Subsole: A long time ago someone who is now very prominent was my then colleague, working on a pro bono death penalty case and she got someone’s sentencing overturned because multiple experts for the state were shown to have lied about their credentials, as well as their prior professional dealings with the defendant. More than once have I wondered whether their resumes had been artfully redrafted with assistance from prosecutors.
JPL
@WaterGirl: When trump said that he’s going to activate Barr strongly, does that mean Barr is going to have his batteries replaced? hmm
Frank Wilhoit
We are days, perhaps hours, away from our Tienanmen Square moment. If Xi Jinping has his wits about him, when it happens, he will at once publicly congratulate Trump in the most fulsome terms, explicitly drawing the parallel.
Kent
@Subsole: Some of them are on college campuses and town squares where you can’t get close to them with trucks. So an average redneck F250 with a winch isn’t always the right tool.
I mean hell, if you want to get serious, you could “borrow” a D11 Caterpillar from some construction site and make serious short work with one of those monuments. That would do the trick too.
But there is a certain elegance to being creative. Like the assassins in Killing Eve. You gotta have flair!
Redshift
On Twitter yesterday, an egyptologist provided the benefit of her knowledge of how to topple an obelisk that might be disguised as a Confederate monument. ?
Baud
@MisterForkbeard:
@Kent:
As I said in the morning thread, the point of this story is not the reporting. It’s to keep a buzz going about the “Tara Reade” story, whether for the clicks or for some more insidious reason.
Matt McIrvin
@Barbara: The willingness of the media to jump in and declare “this is the day Trump became President” over the most meaningless actions early in his term showed that there was an opportunity here. They were thirsty for Daddy to do some Presidenting. But he couldn’t manage it, even to the degree that came naturally to GWB. All he can do is throw poo and sow chaos, and it’s not funny any more, even to some people who initially were attracted to that.
His base isn’t abandoning him, though. They’re still on board.
trollhattan
@Frank Wilhoit:
IIUC, the CCP’s stance is Tienanmen never happened. You just know Xi is laughing at Trump right now. “How do you like it, orange tariff boy?”
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@Kay: Yes, but Barr and Trump’s supporters are crazy and some of them are dangerous.
Baud
@Matt McIrvin:
Trump’s base cannot abandon him without abandoning themselves.
Dorothy A. Winsor
CNN has the audio of Trump’s call with the governors. I can’t force myself to listen to him.
Miss Bianca
@James E Powell: so are the Lincoln Project dudes actually buying ad time – say on Fox News – for these ads? Because they’re good and all, but it seems liketheir entire MO is just “own Trump”.
Kay
My son lives in Denmark and he says the Danes he speaks with aren’t laughing at us. They’re sad for us and sort of baffled. Shocked, in an embarrassing way to him, like they can’t believe how far we’ve fallen.
It started before the protests though- it started when we couldn’t handle a pandemic, at all, and didn’t take care of our own people when they were sick and scared and how we let 100k of them die while bitching about haircuts and manicures. But it’s probably true that Putin is laughing.
Redshift
@Lapassionara: Even if they could come armed, MAGAts would be scared to be in a majority-Black city after dark. I remember a printed map from one of the big conservative rallies a few years ago advising them where was safe, and it was basically the tourist/federal building corridor and nothing else.
This is not helped by the fact that Fox tells them crime in cities is terrible, and they’re sure DC is a crime-ridden hellhole where people are shooting each other in the streets every night.
trollhattan
@James E Powell:
Just watched it. On the nose, with great force.
These have been surprisingly good, hope they’re being seen widely.
Mallard Filmore
@Frank Wilhoit:
I have to disagree here, there was nothing untoward at Tienanmen Square. Since there were no live TV cameras sending live video to the whole world showing military action, and the government didn’t kill about 10,000 people that day, Xi Jinping will not make that comparison.
//
James E Powell
@Kent:
The NYT interviewed nearly 100 people and PBS interviewed 74 all about one person’s allegations against Biden.
How many people have they interviewed for each of the women who have made similar claims against Trump?
Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony
@MisterForkbeard: 4) The wavering suburbanites (who have more empathy for the business owners than the protestors) get nervous, and his support goes up
You would think his many failures would be evident to everyone, but I’m seeing post from relatives that are really supportive of Trump and think he is being unfairly criticized. It is absolutely depressing.
Matt McIrvin
@MattF: A thing that’s really different in the Trump era from past Presidencies is that there are relatively few people in the “undecided/don’t know” category. That probably has a lot to do with the stability of the numbers.
Redshift
@Kay:
And Putin is definitely telling Trump everyone is laughing, because it’s one of the easiest ways to manipulate him.
different-church-lady
@MisterForkbeard: Except, of course, that all the intern is doing is screwing up a couple of modules in Grand Theft Auto, not permanently altering the course of people’s lives.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Cheryl Rofer: I got through a two minute clip. He said at least twice “the whole world was laughing” at Minneapolis. There were BLM rallies in London, Berlin and Toronto.
He also says “I live in Manhattan”. He apparently doesn’t know he moved to Florida. I can’t remember the last time he spent the night in Manhattan.
germy
germy
ballerat
I see he still wants the governors to provide all the leadership without the resources but he still wants to tell them what to do and how to do it while sitting back and tweeting incendiary incitements and refusing any responsibility for what results.
Quelle surprise. He’s an existential threat to the nation.
Feathers
@Fair Economist: Police pensions are a huge problem. There are so many complaints about low pay, but the pension payouts are astonishingly high. Many, if not most, cops can retire in their early 50s and either not work or pick up part time gigs. A pension becomes “golden handcuffs,” keeping people in a job that they would rather leave, because they won’t be able to do better elsewhere. I’ve know cops in their 20s who bitch about how many years, months, and days they have until they can cash in on their pension. It also is used to enforce the thin blue line. If you are all just there for the pension, doing anything to jeopardize a fellow cop’s pension is seen as unforgivable. Also, a reminder that if you lose the pension, you won’t be eligible for social security, because you haven’t been paying in.
The shortened careers have several other negative knock-on effects. It reinforces that policing is physical work, with the ability to intervene violently a necessity. It means that the workforce is young and removes the perspective of people who know what doesn’t work. (See also Silicon Valley and the tech world.) It also keeps people not suited to the profession in the job. You only have to make it a certain length of time. You don’t have to worry about leaving now so you have the time to build another career.
It’s also why you see ex-cops getting into all sorts of trouble. As private detectives, consultants, small business owners, etc. you have people with authority, used to others obeying them unquestioningly, and feeling that society owes them something. And your tax dollars are still paying them. You also have a large cohort in the community who are getting pensions with the time and money to spend a lot of time advocating to local and state government to spend more time on the police.
One of the on the street interviews yesterday had a young black guy saying that misconduct payouts should come out of pensions, not insurance companies.
What I would add is that it should come out of the pension fund overall, spread out evenly over all the pensions paid out, as a line item deductible. This would do a great deal to undermine the thin blue line. If payouts are going to cost the retirees money, something might happen.
Woodrow/asim
HEY. Keep in mind, when racist statues topple, in moments like this?
It’s Black folx like me, who risk getting crushed by “law-abiding White citizens, seeking ‘redress’ for property damage.”
We’re already at-risk from people, esp. media, calling us rioters and vandals. Please have a caution about encouraging that kind of activity, given current situations.
Thanks!
HumboldtBlue
I haven’t read Slate in years but Fred Kaplan argues that fears that Trump won’t relinquish the office next January of he loses the election are a bit far-fetched.
Bruce K
@germy: I get the distinct impression that Dan Rather’s stockpile of hoots to give has been drained.
JPL
About three minutes in he moves on to Occupy Wall Street.
Colleeniem
@Frank Wilhoit: Seriously. We will accelerate the rise of the Chinese century/dominance by 50 years without them doing a thing.
Cheryl Rofer
@Frank Wilhoit: June 4 is the anniversary of Tianamen Square
Kent
Exactly. Tienanmen Square never happened. The Chinese erased it from history. They aren’t going to bring it up. EVER.
I also expect they won’t be amused if we start talking about how “Uighur Lives Matter too.”
There was something of a legendary story from the 1970s about how KGB spies were reportedly stirring up separatist shit in Quebec and the CIA sat them down and said. “You have Ukraine, Georgia, Uzbekistan, Azerbaijan, Armenia, Chechnya and a whole bunch of other ethnic minorities waiting to be riled up. You really sure you want to play this game? And the KGB quickly backed off.
Today, of course, they have penetrated the Oval Office so things are different. But perhaps not with the Chinese. I don’t expect them to needle Trump too much.
JPL
It’s really difficult to listen to trump, because he just streams out thoughts, some of which are repetitive.
Gin & Tonic
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: I’d think the NYS Department of Taxation and Finance will be very interested in his claim.
ema
@James E Powell:
America or Trump! is a great slogan.
Colleeniem
@Kent: They don’t have to.
MisterForkbeard
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: Oh, Trump HAS been unfairly criticized by a small number of people. I see some memes about him that are unfair: One showing his response to the COVID “re-opening” demonstrators vs the rioting going on, for example. These are very much not identical situations and it’s a little unfair to compare them.
But not much. Trump made his statements before the protests got really violent and before outside agitators got into it. And you can still see he gave the entire benefit of the doubt to white people threatening cops with automatic weapons but wants to bring the hammer down on ALL the black protestors, peaceful or otherwise.
But that “this is unfair!” ignores all of Trump’s other culpability – encouraging white supremacy, going after protestors, even promising during his campaign to cover the legal costs for his supporters who beat up liberals. But it’s what they’ll hang on to, because they can’t acknolwedge how bad Trump is without indicting themselves as well.
cain
@PenAndKey: Those people are some kinda of goon squad right? You can bet they’ll go after the press too – it will all be captured on camera.. and I hope our dems will immediately bring barr in for questioning in the house about these tactics.
I’m wondering when that happens how they will weasel out of it.
WaterGirl
@Dorothy A. Winsor: Me, too. Waiting for a transcript.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
from Obama’s Medium post of this morning, touching on one of my hobby-horses, the cult of the Presidency vs local elections
Gravenstone
@germy: Airing on Limpballs, eh? Someone must think the audio makes Trump sound powerful and in charge, rather than like the terrified coward and bully he actually is.
Cheryl Rofer
This is consistent with Humboldt Blue’s observation at #138. Our military telling us that they are OUR military, not Trump’s.
Feathers
Also, good morning. I spent so much time keeping track of the demonstrations over the weekend I barely slept.
Woke up at six this morning. Brushed my teeth, then decided to crawl back into bed and woke up again at 1:30. Good call.
Gravenstone
@Geoduck:
Moar money! That’s it, that’s all. Lying for fun and profit has always been her game.
James E Powell
@Baud:
This is the ice cold truth. We cannot change them. We can only outvote them.
Matt McIrvin
@HumboldtBlue: The danger isn’t that Trump just refuses to leave. It’s that Republicans can sow enough confusion that there’s actually popular uncertainty over who won, and then they can pound the table and work the refs 2000-style, and then people who do care about the Constitutional lines of command won’t necessarily abandon him. Republicans have an advantage in that kind of contest, as we’ve already seen.
SiubhanDuinne
@Kay:
Most of my foreign friends are Brits and Canadians, and this is descriptive of their reactions. Like when a friend of yours has the lead in a play but on opening night they freeze and can’t remember their lines, and you’re just curdled with humiliation for them.
Omnes Omnibus
@HumboldtBlue: A number of us have been saying the same thing every time the subject comes up. But still the subject keeps coming up.
Cheryl Rofer
@WaterGirl: I’m a transcript fan too. Washington Post’s recording is a little better.
Kent
@Feathers: Pensions are a huge issue but not easily fixable. And taking payouts out of pension funds would accomplish nothing because they are defined benefit-pensions. The cities would just need to make up the difference.
You can’t contractually change pensions mid-stream for cops. If that was possible then GOPers would be rushing to do it for teachers and all other government employees as well.
Creating a new retirement system for new cops ends up being doubly expensive because you then have to fund two separate programs simultaneously.
The solution isn’t to fuck with their salaries and benefits. It’s to demand more accountability and change the culture.
Duane
@Kent: If Trumpov can make demands of the governors so can we the people. Present them a list of demands. Make them relatively simple things that can be done. Removing all Confederate monuments from public property is one. All those southern state flags with variations of the stars and bars, take them down. Instead of escalated violence some good faith acts could decrease the violence. Obviously Trumpov can’t lead but there are governors who can.
Gin & Tonic
@Cheryl Rofer:
Sounds like I might need a history refresher.
Jay C
@Cheryl Rofer:
Interesting: Gen. Lenyel’s comments are all about “help”, “assistance” and meeting “challenges” – nothing about stomping out Antifa, or blowing people away: obviously he didn’t clear this tweet with the WH…..
???
ema
@HumboldtBlue:
I’m curious, if impeached public servant Trump refuses to leave, and the Republican leadership supports him, who exactly removes him from office, legally and physically?
Subsole
@Barbara: Maybe I’m naive but that sounds like a really FAST way to piss a judge off at you, if you’re a prosecutor…
Gravenstone
@Kent:
Thermite.
Matt McIrvin
@ema: The Uniformed Division of the Secret Service protects the White House and its grounds. If Trump is physically there after he’s no longer President, he’s trespassing and it’s their job to eject him.
Subsole
@JPL:
“Mr. President, I can’t swallow a car battery!”
“Good news! It’s a suppository!”
cain
@Cermet:
If he made it a national emergency it will all fall on his head – he can’t blame the governors or anything because he took over. But you know he’s still going to try – he will fail at it – and worse of all he will promulgate a civil war because it will be brutal setting the entire country ablaze making the entire situation worse.
Meanwhile the GOP will be silent the entire time – not a word. Notice they still dont have any messaging with what is going on – because they have absolutely no leg to stand on. Cowards.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
cain
@hueyplong:
Yeah, but when it turns into a shit show – the lackey governor is going to get fucked sideways. His re-election is all but over as will his political career.
cain
@germy:
That last one is epic.
Omnes Omnibus
@Gin & Tonic: The individual colonies had organized militias since long before the US existed. The National Guard which is run by the states is a continuation of that.
Kent
She’s talking about bronze age techniques. Using 40 people with ropes and chains to pull them down.
I think today’s STEM college students could get more creative than that. For example, send in nightly drones to drop nitric acid or hydrochloric acid on those monuments. It will dissolve bronze and marble in quick order
Drones would also be the way to deal with any remaining confederate flags on the tops of public buildings. Build a drone with a little gasoline sprayer and a flame thrower. Burn them in place. Robotics kids love being creative that way. And let the MAGAts wonder how their confederate flags keep burning up when they are 100′ up on the pole.
Subsole
@Kent:
I’ve read waaay too much Pratchett to be impressed with assassins anymore, sadly.
Except Vetinari. That dude was a gentleman beast.
Of course, some of those starues are so flimsy you could almost knock a head off with a hammer. Like that one RIDICULOUSLY GHETTO statue of N.B. Forrest that looks like it belongs in front of an auto zone.
Hard to worship a headless god, yes?
ema
@Matt McIrvin:
Interesting, thank you.
Roger Moore
@Kent:
Speaking as a chemist, I think physical means are likely to be better for a lot of these. Marble monuments can be smashed with sledge hammers. Bronze monuments can be cut up with torches, saws, or angle grinders. Any monument can be dragged down by people with ropes and possibly some additional hand tools if they’re bolted down.
Ruckus
@randy khan:
SpaceX to the sun with his dumb racist ass.
Least wasteful government spending ever.
Kay
@SiubhanDuinne:
He hates the concerned expression on their faces “How ARE you?”
Do NOT pity me! :)
OTOH we have bigger and better “appliances” according to him, so…good with the bad. He sneers at Danish appliance engineering. Strutting around bragging about the top load washer he had in Chicago.
jonas
@Miss Bianca: They’re not running nationwide, but yes, they do get them up on stations in key states and cities, depending on how much $$ they raise. The one a couple of weeks ago making fun of how Parscale is fleecing the Trump campaign aired during Tucker Carlson’s show on the DC Fox affiliate and sure enough, guess who saw it…
Matt McIrvin
@ema: And another thing: reading between the lines, I get a definite sense that the Secret Service has no love for Donald Trump. They may be a bunch of right-wingers by sentiment (the one I personally knew, who was on George HW Bush’s guard detail when he was Vice-President, definitely was). But I don’t think they’re going to be personally loyal to the man.
VOR
@Miss Bianca: They ran one of the prior ads only in the DC area on Fox. Targeted for an audience of one. The ad cost something like $5k to air. Trump took the bait and tweeted about it. The Lincoln Project got $2.4M in donations following airing the ad.
So yes, they aren’t spending a lot of money putting the ads on TV.
Kent
@Roger Moore: But that requires a serious lot of people armed with tools. I guess if the public demonstration is part of the desired effect then yes. 50 demonstrators with sledge hammers, sawzaws, jackhammers and the like can do a lot of physical damage. But that’s a pretty confrontational way to go. I like the idea of seeing them mysteriously melt away over time.
Cheryl Rofer
James E Powell
@Miss Bianca:
I don’t know how much money they have or how they plan to spend it in relation to the campaign season.
I would kick in a pretty penny to put that treason flag ad on the air in the treason states just to watch their heads explode.
SiubhanDuinne
@Kay:
LOL
sdhays
They probably concluded you were overqualified, which, as I’m sure you know, is almost as bad as being over-prepared.
Subsole
@trollhattan: Really? Are we talking like Armenian Genocide denial, where if Canada mentions it they get embargoed? Or is it more of a “it’s not in any history books and old folks know better than to bring it up, but we forgive the barbarians their heathen misremembrances,” kind of thing?
Feathers
@Kent: I don’t know that it is fixable, but I do think that it has to be recognized as part of the problem.
I would support having a defined deduction from pension payments for misconduct charges. One of the issues with the structure of union benefits is that the union ends up fighting for “bad apple” union members to a degree that it harms other union members. I say this as a union member whose union fought hard to save the job of a mentally ill co-worker who was making our lives miserable. The union as a whole having to bear the costs of the bad apples will help end this.
The pensions are a huge driver of the culture. As I said, my brother is a cop, I’ve hung out with cops. It is an obsession.
Ruckus
@Matt McIrvin:
He’s already tied up the maximum racists. Who else is he going to get? He’s so obviously useless and unable to do much of anything but rant and yell at people to protect him. Who is going to change their mind about shitforbrains now?
HumboldtBlue
@ema:
Kaplan explains it better than I could and as Omnes pointed out more than once the issue has been addressed. There are simply too many institutional hurdles for the holdouts to jump over, it would literally be sedition.
Cheryl Rofer
Former governor of New Jersey
Immanentize
@Fair Economist: Re: funding the police. The huge funding you are talking about is direct funding. It is hard to get, but the number that would be worth also having is how much cities pay in police violence settlements. Millions in settlements. Millions more in lawyers’ fees. Those things add up when you are firing teachers because of budget issues, Covid, who cares, etc.
Matt McIrvin
@Subsole: That ridiculous plastic Nathan Bedford Forrest statue is on somebody’s private land IIRC, which is why it’s not gone already. There have been many attempts to vandalize or destroy it but the dude just keeps fixing it.
HumboldtBlue
@Gin & Tonic:
The oldest unit in the Pennsylvania National Guard was formed by Ben Franklin as a volunteer fire brigade.
I served in the 112th in Erie when I signed up and the 111th when I went back to Philadeplhia for sophomore year.
oopzwtf
What’s Bill Barr’s pot life once activated?
Betty Cracker
@Kent: There’s a giant Confederate flag where Interstates 75 and 4 meet just east of Tampa. It’s truly enormous and very high up — can be seen for miles. It’s maintained by some Sons of the Confederacy cranks. Anyhoo, my kiddo tells me the cranks took it down last night because they got wind that the protesters might pay it a visit.
Immanentize
@MisterForkbeard: The NYTimes started the Reide story on the front page and then had a two page spread inside the first section! The real estate they gave the story does not suggest their attitude is anti-Reide. Although their written conclusion might not support that impression of supporting her.
Matt McIrvin
@Ruckus: Traditionally, when there’s mass rioting with property damage and fires and such, it sends a lot of worried white people running to the Daddy Party for reassurance that Strong Measures will be taken. And that could still happen, but the guy currently playing the reassuring daddy role is Biden.
David ? ☘The Establishment☘? Koch
@NotMax: I don’t think morbidly obese Dump can bend a knee – not with those debilitating bone spurs.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@HumboldtBlue: This is Trump, Trumpis about the appearance of power, not the substance. Trump will make his staff and cabinet refuse to leave their offices, scream on twitter about Biden cheated, law suits and so on.
James E Powell
@Kent:
The GOPers at state level bring this up all the time, about as often as GOPers at the federal level bring up social security “reform.” And wasn’t it Christie’s big plan?
Ruckus
@Barbara:
I’m sorry but this isn’t art to him, this is him. He’s not trying to create anything or do or be performance art. This is his core. You are right though that he doesn’t have any other modes. The reason he doesn’t is because this is him, there is no calculation, no thought process, he just blurts out what he believes, right down to his socks. He is an ignorant, racist fuck. That is the sum total of him.
Kent
There’s one here in Vancouver WA too, for fuck’s sake. Maintained by the same “Sons of the Confederacy” racists. Lest you think it is just a southern thing. Not that big, but visible from I-5 about 15 miles north of Portland. Every so often the ANTIFA folks drive up from Portland to mess with it. I used to drive by every day on the way to work. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_Davis_Park,_Washington
Martin
@different-church-lady:
The public has given up on that. It’s clear that there is no justice at the federal level. Public is in the process of making its own justice. Either the public will get this out of their system and back off, or Trump is going to get dragged out of the WH while it burns.
Sincerely hoping for the former, but increasingly looking like the latter given that Trump can’t help but keep pouring fuel on this fire. A lot of these protesters aren’t threatened by a 10 year prison sentence (which they’re smart enough to know is bullshit) – they’ve lost their job and the GOP has declared them expendable to keep the Dow high, or police fodder to try and keep the Karens in the electorate.
Suspect a lot of them don’t feel like they have a ton to lose right now.
Subsole
@cain:
I’m wondering if Barr isn’t trying to send in ‘picked’ troops.
The locals have completely dogfucked the response, lost the public, and more importantly lost the uncritical support of the media.
Maybe Barr thinks he can put a couple parade formations up to look intimidating without them fucking tomahawking journos on air. Recover the media momentum?
Or fuck, who knows. The fuhrer is shitting himself in his bunker. Maybe Barr’s just trying to scrape up enough hitlerjugend to hold the doors. I dunno anymore.
Fucking klownwaffen.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Enhanced Voting Techniques:
Until the Secret Service escort them from the premises
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Kent:
@Betty Cracker:
Heritage not Hate! /s
cain
@Subsole:
Whatever it is, it will get botched because he isn’t sending his best – they aren’t negotiators — instead it will inflame people even more and more protesters will join – the burn is going to keep going.
The french do a pretty good job of protesting.. let’s show them what Americans can do when they are really pissed off.
HumboldtBlue
@Betty Cracker:
Can you please fix Mones in #191 to Omnes for me?
James E Powell
@Ruckus:
Agreed. And I have argued since 2016 that this is why the Republican voters chose him over the other Republican candidates. They sensed that Trump wasn’t just pandering to them. The others were politicians, but Trump really did hate Obama as much as they did.
HumboldtBlue
@Miss Bianca:
The confederate flag ad will run in several battleground states and they spent $1.5 million on the campaign.
Subsole
@cain:
Ahhh. Paris. The city that paved over its cobblestones because the gendarmes were sick of rioters prying them up and using them as projectiles…
sdhays
@James E Powell: The problem, to the FTFNYT and their friends is not the crime, but potential hypocrisy. If Biden was guilty of anything untoward, it would be very off-brand, and that would warrant blaring headlines and 24/7 coverage. But sexual assault is just “Dump being Dump”, so it’s no big deal.
Hoodie
@James E Powell: My sense is that a significant amount of his support comes from people whose perceptions are grounded in the 60’s and ’70s, and Trump embodies this worldview in every tweet. I vividly recall my FIL telling me in 2016 that he thought Trump was “another Reagan” (a positive for him), which suggested to me that Trump may be the final episode of the 60’s culture war, since my FIL is a Viet Nam vet in his 80’s who still is pissed off at Jane Fonda. Since he’s dying of kidney disease, I didn’t have the heart to tell him that, while Reagan was an incompetent moron, Trump is nothing but a criminal in a suit. The point is that anyone in the GOP succeeding Trump will likely find it much more difficult to cobble together even the barely sufficient minority that Trump put together in 2016 because the narrative he evokes is becoming more obscure as time passes. Sure, younger people will eventually take their place in right-to-center-right part of the political spectrum, but their narratives will not necessarily unified to the extent the right-to-center-right worldview was coming out of the ’70’s. Trump will be hard for the GOP to replace, which may be why they’ve hung on to him so desperately.
Barbara
@Ruckus: The art is in giving it enough sheen or whatever you want to call it so that it involves something other than just screaming racial epithets. For instance, going after football players who are kneeling during the anthem as unpatriotic. It’s racist, of course it is, but how many people can pick up on it and swear that it isn’t? So yeah, it is a kind of art.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Martin:
Wouldn’t the Secret Service, the National Guard, and DC Police ensure that doesn’t happen?
MisterForkbeard
@Subsole: I mean, these guys love Trump too. They’re clearly fine with worshipping a man without a brain.
Ruckus
@Fair Economist:
Isn’t a lot of that budget reserves for suits that the police often lose? LAPD has lost a few doozies over the years, costing millions in awards, not even counting the untold amounts spent fighting them till they lost. Being human, not all the suits will disappear but is it possible that at least some of them might if actual reform were to happen in policing? Some departments seem to get it, what makes them different? Hiring practices? Management? Leadership? Certainly those could affect how good or bad things are.
trollhattan
@Subsole:
I’m no expert but their actions imply they’re hellbent on erasing it, internally foremost and internationally, as a longer term goal.
Amnesty
And a story re. last year’s annivarsary
They’re very big on “internal affairs.”
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@Ruckus:
It’s definitely the culture within the departments as well as the right wing, racist “law and order” BS in wider society that both sustains and reinforces it
Martin
@hueyplong: No, because it’s one-sided. Biden has the solid base you would expect. A good chunk of Trump’s base is undecided which is what you would expect in a referendum on Trump. They’re not with him, but they’re not sure they’re willing to leave (or ready to say it out loud yet).
Those are terrible numbers for an incumbent, because the uncertain folks almost always bail on election day. Incumbents generally face nothing but downside risk on election day.
Mike in NC
Fat Bastard is looking for his Tiananmen Square moment. Won’t end well.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@trollhattan:
Jean-Luc Picard: “A matter of internal security.” The age-old cry of the oppressor.
Which itself is a paraphrase of Voltaire
Matt McIrvin
@Hoodie: Donald Trump was explicitly an Eighties nostalgia figure. He was already famous in the Eighties as a super-successful go-getter businessman; The Art of the Deal came out in 1987. I think for a lot of people he’s a symbol of the Reagan era they want back.
Martin
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): They can try. By all accounts, DC police won’t step on federal land, so count them out. No love lost between DC mayors and the feds.
I mean, there’s no realistic possibility it would play out that way, they’ll Fall of Saigon Trump out of there long before and stuff him at Camp David or under a hotel in WV.
But Trump already is behaving like a leader that has lost his authority. So it may not make much of a difference.
ballerat
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: And some are both organized and have training.
Kay a posted a link the other day to these Explorer groups who ostensibly provide “police” training for wannabe cops but in reality provide training in military weapons and tactics, urban warfare and sniping. I read that and thought, shit they’re training paramilitaries.
I recall that the feds some years ago warned that white supremacist groups were trying to get their members into the army so they could get weapons training, to the point where recruiters were screening for white power tats.
I guess the neo-nazis don’t need to do that anymore, what with options like the Explorers, or at similar ‘ranches’ and ‘academies’ that offer training for urban warfare and small unit tactics.
Christ even the logo at the last link looks like a goddamed nazi eagle.
Subsole
@Kent:
Hell, just use a bleaching agent.
Or white paint.
Make it the Authentic Southron Flag.
hueyplong
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): In a normal world, the Secret Service is taking orders from Biden on about 12:01 pm on 1/20/21.
Subsole
@MisterForkbeard:
Ha! Touche!
Calouste
@Cheryl Rofer: Former Republican Governor of New Jersey.
Kent
I’m 56 and all I remember of the 60s is Sesame Street and the Moon Landings in 1969. Heck, I don’t even remember Watergate except that it was annoying because it pre-empted my afternoon Tom & Jerry episodes on TV for the live coverage of the hearings. The 1976 elections I only vaguely remember as something to do with peanuts. It wasn’t until 1980 when I was in HS that I actually started being politically aware.
Any Trump supporters who actually REMEMBER the 1960s or early 1970s in a political way have to be in their mid-60s or older
The 1960s today are as farther in the distant past than WW1 and the roaring 20s were to the 1960s generation.
Jeffro
@zhena gogolia: must. absolutely must. Let’s hear it, GOP Senators. Who will go to the president* and tell him he must go?
Jeffro
Love.
This.
Omnes Omnibus
@Subsole: Picked troops?
Ksmiami
@Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony: they are dumb fat fucks who would make for slow moving targets despite their cosplay Rambo gear
LongHairedWeirdo
@Ohio Mom: Oh, wow. Keen, and biting, observation!
Interesting tidbit: in October, the Washington Post did story on pandemic (lack of) preparedness, and Biden tweeted the link, and mentioned how Trump had screwed the pooch (figuratively; there’s no compelling proof he’s done so literally) by dismantling Obama administration changes.
The right wing underground tried to spin that as “BIDEN KNEW THE PANDEMIC WAS COMING!” It’s amazing, but scary, how pathetically bad the lies can be, without the rubes revolting; the real news story would have been “the Washington Post knew the pandemic was coming” since they printed the article that prompted the tweet.
I mean, that’s basically in qanon territory.
Feathers
@Goku (aka Amerikan Baka): One of my worries is how wingnutty the Secret Service and other government homeland security outfits are. Some of it is that the normal bitching about your job that goes on everywhere becomes drastically politicized whenever there is a Dem president. And your shitty boss, same as every shitty boss everywhere, is somehow Nancy Pelosi’s fault when the president is a Republican. This is balanced by the fact that these all tend to be deeply lazy and incurious people. A large part of their problem has to do with these attributes leading to their having no understanding of how the world works or how things get done.
LongHairedWeirdo
@Benno: You’re not *quite* correct here. The DOJ isn’t going to hamstring Trump, and will work to take the heat off of him, but Barr wouldn’t, e.g., open an investigation into the Bidens – though we can reasonably believe that the DOJ would have, if Ukraine had followed through, and the whistleblower report was stopped.
So Trump doesn’t quite have carte blanche to do as he pleases; I expect that’s why he’s so much a cranky toddler these days. If he could have the Bidens investigated, with lots of juicy leaks of facts that, taken out of context, look bad (and are meaningless, in proper context), I think he’d be as happy as if he got a *third* scoop of ice cream, when everyone else only got one.
Kay
@ballerat:
I did post that but my oldest son was a police explorer in high school and they did nice, community minded things. He did traffic directing at street fairs, bring the police car to the preschool and give them little badges, that sort of thing. He joined on his own without our urging or even really approval and stayed for the whole course- junior and senior year in high school. I think he enjoyed it. He shoots for fun- goes to a course, and he had a rifle at that point. He doesn’t have a gun now but he likes shooting targets, so that was part of the appeal.
Ladyraxterinok
@Subsole:
Super conservative science fiction
writer John Ringo adores NBForrest. He praises him in every story. In one the statue is venerated
Darkrose
@trollhattan: Reading that is kind of surreal. I live in the grid, but far enough out that I didn’t hear anything. There’s also the fact that I haven’t left the house in over two months except for a walk around the block or to take the garbage out. I’m in an odd little bubble.
HumboldtBlue
@Ksmiami:
From your keystrokes to Twitter
Miss Bianca
@jonas: Ah, right. I forgot about that one. I guess there have been a couple distractions in the meantime.
WaterGirl
@Cheryl Rofer: The audio is much better on that one. Thank you!
Even so, praying that there will be a transcript because I cannot listen to his voice for that long. Ugh.
Kay
@Jeffro:
I just can’t even believe the people I’m supposed to buy as “tough guys”. Please. What a joke. Donald Trump would cease to exist without constant primping. He’s composed of hairspray and tanning cream.
I love the video clip where he’s too fucking pampered to ever have figured out how to operate an umbrella. He throws it away, but not before looking for some serf to hand it off to. I would bet money most of them have forgotten how to drive, if they ever knew. They would be completely and utterly helpless without staff.
Jinchi
His tweets about Obama have predicted his presidency. Let’s hope this quote predicts his future.
trollhattan
@Darkrose:
Weird, isn’t it? Our two crises are polar opposites and I’m a poor multitasker, so have difficulty knowing which one to pay attention to at a given moment. I normally work downtown and much of the chaos has occurred in places I routinely walk and cycle past.
The kid marched Friday, masked but there was no distancing so I’m a nervous dad the next week or so.
trollhattan
@Jinchi:
Ten years on prison food will be just about enough. Plus they take away his phone.
Ruckus
@Omnes Omnibus:
Doesn’t the SS haul the ex president out of where ever he is, at noon eastern on Jan 20th if he refuses to go? It is after all, no longer his office or home, and it will take time to fumigate the WH.
The Pale Scot
@germy:
That was tasty
Ladyraxterinok
@Kent:
That reality totally freaks me out! Remember very clearly hearing about Berlin Wall going up August 1961 and JFK assasination. Sat in student union watching on TV LBJ being sworn in on the airplane back to DC.
Jinchi
Did he ever get that Nobel prize for ending the nuclear war with North Korea?
Ruckus
@Kent:
I can see a major problem with say acid. People will touch it to see what’s going on and they will be burned and injured/killed because HCL acidic enough to destroy bronze or marble will definitely not do skin and flesh any good. .
Matt McIrvin
@Ruckus: Yes. As long as there’s a clear winner to the election (which is the possible sticking point–I remember 2000), I don’t see the Secret Service regarding anyone but the legitimate President as the President.
mvr
@trollhattan:
Thanks for the link to Digby.
That analysis may be right. I can’t tell if the deep dive was in 2004 (the piece references a previous piece from then) or if the analysis was redone more recently. Some of what was in place by way of exceptions in 2004 was later repealed.
notoriousJRT
@Kay: I appreciate the bracing words, but these flabby golfers have immense governmental powers at their disposal and they are vindictive and have proven to be relentless in pursuit of their twisted goals. A lack of fortitude, character, and personal courage makes them more dangerous in my estimation, not less.
notoriousJRT
@Kent:
I went and read the Tara Reade story in the NYT
Maybe your first mistake? Clicks are what they are looking for…
Ruckus
@Matt McIrvin:
Well shitforbrains is trying to play the standard gop daddy role, except that he has no knowledge how to that. I’d imagine, to a gop faithful he sounds tough. To anyone not having swallowed the kool-aide, he sounds delusional. That will not get better.
Ruckus
@Barbara:
The best you could call it is first day of 2nd grade art at best. Which is a few years above the level that shitforbrains plays at. Also art is in the eye of the beholder and I’ve helped create art and have a few friends/had relatives who are/were pretty decent artists. This isn’t art of any kind. Not cultural, not natural, not even political, this is the yelling tantrum of a developmentally 4yr old, spoiled, racist brat.
lurkypants
@Fair Economist: @Kent: The Virginia Flaggers are mighty upset about the loss of Stonewall Jackson’s flag, which got burnt up in the UDC. Shame, that.
Subsole
@Omnes Omnibus:
Inarticulate expression.
A group he can rely on to not mace the newsblonde on the 8 o’clock worldwide news while still looking macho mcbeefmuscles for the rubes.
Unlike, apparently, a lot of metro departments.
Amir Khalid
@HumboldtBlue:
A more plausible fear (to me, anyway) than Trump refusing to yield the presidency is Trump spending the transition period doing as much damage as he can.
Captain C
@Mike in NC: Or maybe his Grozny moment.