We’re starting to find out what they knew and when they knew it. Senator Brian Schatz of Hawaii calls the Trump administration out:
THEY ALL KNEW AND THEY DIDN’T TELL YOU. https://t.co/Y2z4jXklTa
— Brian Schatz (@brianschatz) April 7, 2020
Axios obtained memos from the economic adviser who sounded the warning, but there were probably similar warnings from other sectors that we haven’t seen yet. Via Axios:
In late January, President Trump’s economic adviser Peter Navarro warned his White House colleagues the novel coronavirus could take more than half a million American lives and cost close to $6 trillion, according to memos obtained by Axios…
Navarro’s grim estimates are set out in two memos — one dated Jan. 29 and addressed to the National Security Council, the other dated Feb. 23 and addressed to the president. The NSC circulated both memos around the White House and multiple agencies…
The Jan 29 memo set out two stark choices “Aggressive Containment versus No Containment.”
Navarro compared cost estimates for the choices and wrote that the Council of Economic Advisers’ estimates for stopping travel from China to the U.S. would be $2.9 billion per month. If the virus turned out to be a pandemic, that travel ban could extend 12 months and cost the U.S. $34.6 billion.
Doing nothing (the “No Containment” option) could range from “zero economic costs” to $5.7 trillion depending on the lethality of the virus.
On the high end, he estimated a scenario in which the coronavirus could kill 543,000 Americans.The Feb. 23 memo…was titled as a memorandum to the president via the offices of the national security adviser, chief of staff and COVID-19 task force, and the subject line described as a request for supplemental appropriation.
It began: “There is an increasing probability of a full-blown COVID-19 pandemic that could infect as many as 100 million Americans, with a loss of life of as many as 1-2 million souls.”
He called for an “immediate supplemental appropriation of at least $3 billion” to support efforts at prevention, treatment, inoculation, and diagnostics.He described expected needs for “Personal Protective Equipment” for health care workers and secondary workers in facilities such as elder care and skilled nursing. He estimates that over a four-to-six month period, “We can expect to need at least a billion face masks, 200,000 Tyvek suits, and 11,000 ventilator circuits, and 25,000 PAPRs (powered air-purifying respirators.)”
Trump sat on his ass for weeks after that memo was circulated, tweeting inanities like this:
“Low Ratings Fake News MSDNC (Comcast) & @CNN are doing everything possible to make the Caronavirus look as bad as possible, including panicking markets, if possible. Likewise their incompetent Do Nothing Democrat comrades are all talk, no action. USA in great shape!”
The administration didn’t get around to ordering ventilators and masks until mid-March.
Since the Trump administration’s natural state is chaos punctuated by palace coups and the president is a lazy-ass retiree who watches TV all day, it’s possible Trump himself was in the dark about what was coming. It’s also possible he knew and was moving behind the scenes to secure a personal advantage.
Regardless, it’s clear Trump was derelict in his duty to protect Americans. We’re going to need a bigger select committee.
Patricia Kayden
This is what to expect when crooks, reality stars and con artists are elected. They’re not in Washington to serve us. They’re there to take what they can to enrich themselves. Let’s see if any of them are held accountable for their blatant misconduct. I’m not holding my breath.
Nora
I sure am glad we didn’t get Hilary Clinton as president. Those emails of hers were definitely disqualifying. And think what would have happened if some hysterical female had been given briefings saying 100 million Americans might catch some virus and a million might die from it! Why, she would have overreacted, the way women do. /bitter, furious sarcasm.
PenAndKey
Seriously, if there isn’t a top-to-bottom investigation resulting in prosecution of the malignant actors in the executive and legislative branches after next January we will likely be able to look back in the history books in a generation and say this was the moment the US collapsed as a world power. Pandemics, wars, and economic collapse are three of the biggest ways nations have failed throughout history. Add in famine and we’d have the whole set.
Barbara
OMG. Navarro is one of my candidates for most worthless members of the Trump administration and even he knew that the jig was up — and you can add Alex Azar to the list of people who tried to get earlier action, but since he has made himself persona non grata with the Pence faction, Trump just yelled at him about vaping. And if you are looking for the face of selling out human lives to save a few pennies, you should ask Joe Grogan what he was worrying about in early March. Hint: it wasn’t the safety or health of the American people. He has basically been acting as shadow secretary of HHS for a while now.
MattF
Navarro was right, although he had an axe to grind– he wanted (and, I’d assume, still wants) to shut down trade with China. There are a wide variety of lurid pathologies in the Court of Trump, and Navarro was only one crazy voice among many.
Nora
@PenAndKey: You are so right. I don’t want to hear one damned word about “not looking back.” We need to make sure every one of these monsters is prosecuted to the outermost limits of the law, so that this will NEVER happen again.
RAM
I’ve come to the conclusion that Trump simply wasn’t able to comprehend what was happening. It was far outside his experience and he has no capability to learn new things, especially anything as complicated as how a pandemic will affect the U.S. and the world economy. I don’t think he understands it yet. It’s his combination of ignorance and stupidity that is an existential threat to the nation.
Spanky
Don’t need no select committee. There are enough lamp posts to go around.
donnah
Document the atrocities. Take names, post the dates, and spell out who knew what and when they knew. Trump will do anything he can to shift the blame to everyone else, especially the Democrats. We have to make sure that Trump and his cronies get the full measure of criticism for letting the coronavirus get such a big start here, and for how badly they have handled it since. We can’t let them put everything onto the state government. We had no national leadership, and we’re paying for it in human lives lost.
germy
MattF
@RAM: And there’s the problem of the Presidential attention span. As is often true, Alexandra Petri has the best take.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
173 test positive on USS Theodore Roosevelt, USS Frank Cable sequestered Just FYI article from local Guam news about the USS Theodore Roosevelt
What sequestered means is that the crew of the Guam based submarine tender, the USS Frank Cable has been basically confined to the ship (can’t go home to their base housing or local apartment, can’t see their families). Random factoid, the Cable was the ship my husband was assigned to when we got orders to Guam
Also in case you are interested in the local Guam/Marianas COVID-19 news: 8 new cases, 121 confirmed cases
Dorothy A. Winsor
@donnah:
That’s right. Now is the time to set the narrative that Trump and his cronies screwed up and left the rest of us to sicken and die. You need to do that months ahead. Like now.
TS (the original)
@germy:
Look at the virus figures 10 days from now. This is criminal – encouraged by the Supreme Court of the United States.
taumaturgo
@Patricia Kayden: Wise decision not to hold your breath. The recently announced commission by the conservative leadership to supervise the bailout funds is not interested in looking back, they, in essence, don’t care how horribly and tragically the current administration botched the Covid19 response. Like Obama’s 2018 free pass to the crooked bankers and Wall Street profiteers, this commission will not look back will only look forward. One can only conclude that Democrats seem to have a high tolerance for losing.
germy
Jeffro
“oh my gosh…we’re heading for a global pandemic that will kill hundreds of thousands if not millions…but the stock market is going SO. WELL!…and Donnie Dimwit won’t understand the danger anyway, he’ll just call it ‘fake news’…hmm…what to do…I know! I’ll just do nothing and hope that somehow everything magically improves!!”
Gvg
@Nora: Actually….some of the extreme chauvinists would have proclaimed it was proof we shouldn’t have women leaders, that god sent the virus as punishment. I wish I hadn’t realized that.
Patricia Kayden
And despite the medical crisis, Wisconsinites have to risk their health to vote today.
TS (the original)
@EmbraceYourInnerCrone:
Do we know if any other navy ships are currently having crew tested – or have they all been told to grin and bear it or die for trump rather than admit to having a virus on board?
germy
Barbara
@Patricia Kayden: The one thing about being unemployed is that you are often in the position of affirmatively looking for ways to kill time. (Snark)
The Supreme Court shows its true colors in saving itself from even the merest of risks, and then wishing death on ordinary citizens. Somehow, it’s fitting that this decision came down during holy week because it is so clarifying of what it really means to be “pro-life.” But then, we always knew it was about power, not virtue, and certainly not what Jesus would do.
MJS
@Patricia Kayden: If Biden is elected, and if we take the Senate, we absolutely have to increase the Supreme Court by a minimum of two seats. This decision seals it.
Kattails
Jim Wright on Twitter was excoriating Republicans’ actions and attitudes towards the military from the current fiasco back to Bush and Reagan. Someone asked him why military voters would still seem to prefer Republicans to Democrats if the Reps. really were that awful. His response was that Democrats had lousy PR.
We need to pound this home over and over and over. Horrible to say, but if the MSM starts losing some of their colleagues, they might finally have enough and start actual reporting. It would be great if it didn’t take that to make it happen.
PenAndKey
@Patricia Kayden: For 600k people and 5 polling places over the 13 hours the polls will be open that comes out to 154 people processed per polling place PER MINUTE to keep up without any delays.
That? That’s insane. This is blatant election stealing and I won’t ever consider the 2020 Spring elections in this state to be legitimate for the rest of my life. I’m beyond disgusted right now.
Bruuuuce
Lindsey Graham gets a boost in the race for Craziest Republican
Well, no, it wouldn’t be. But it certainly wouldn’t be the decision you and your gang of thieves would make, Lindsey.
Jinchi
@germy: I’ve read that there are 10 polling stations in a city that typically has 180. They’d be 18 times as crowded as normal if people turn out in typical numbers. Republicans will probably demand they be shut down on schedule, regardless of how many are still waiting.
Fingers crossed that most of them got absentee ballots and mailed them back with witness signatures.
It’s absurd that the Roberts Court, which has shut down due to coronavirus, insists that people risk their lives to vote under the most restrictive circumstances.
Bruuuuce
@MJS: Before we try expanding SCOTUS, we need to remove Rapey Brett for his documented perjury in his confimation hearings. That gets a majority; then we need to increase it if at all humanly possible.
germy
Hungry Joe
How unnerving is it that Grade-A nutjob Peter Navarro is one of the brightest guys in the (Situation) room? We pretty much laughed him out of San Diego years ago, after he ran unsuccessfully — usually as a Democrat — for mayor, city council, county supervisor, the House, and … something else; I forget. The last time he got about 8% of the vote.
germy
Leto
It was in his PDB back in January because the Intel chiefs saw what was coming and tried to warn him. At this point I don’t care. If we can’ t prosecute him, then every under him needs to be prosecuted. Every last one of them. Once he’s out of office they can’t claim presidential immunity/privilege/any of that horseshit. Just have trials for crimes against humanity. We didn’t do it with Bush the Ignoramus, but we have a chance to fix it now.
@germy:
Fixed.
Jinchi
What’s this voluntary nonsense? Trump decided he’d try that plan on the entire crew of the Roosevelt. Yang shouldn’t try to play this like it’s a noble thing.
Chyron HR
@taumaturgo:
Remember, folks, this is what passes for SMART in Bernie’s revolution.
Nora
@Gvg: Eeek. You’re right.
Barbara
@Bruuuuce: I wonder what would happen if Iraq sent us a bill for the 2003 invasion?
Leto
@Jinchi: I’ll volunteer as soon as Yang and his family heads to the largest NYC corona hospital and licks every single door handle. As Kay says, we need better elites.
Jeffro
@MJS: And expand the federal judiciary, even doubling it if necessary, to water down the impact of all the unqualified (literally!) GOP hacks that have been put in place.
Betty Cracker
@taumaturgo: I lost my shit when I saw Clyburn’s comments on a Sunday show about the new committee being future-focused too, but according to other folks who weighed in on my “what the goddamned fucking hell?!?!” tweet on the matter, that committee’s sole purpose is to oversee funds distribution, and it’s not an investigatory committee in the sense that it’s examining the entire response but needs subpoena power to monitor funds disbursement.
Okay, then. That’s needed. But we also need an investigation into the early bungling of the response. There has to be. Period. I think it’s wise to build pressure for that without assuming bad faith on the part of Democratic leadership. YMMV.
Jinchi
Have they not learned that you don’t want to confine people onboard a ship during an outbreak. Do these guys even have their own bunks?
Nora
@Jeffro: Considering how overworked many of the courts are now, doubling their size is a good idea in general. And with all these unqualified people (including people found NOT QUALIFIED by the American Bar Association — who ever heard of judges being appointed when the ABA found them unqualified??) in office, the need is even greater.
japa21
@taumaturgo:
That is a perfect example of a statement that contradicts itself. The commission is specially set up to supervise the bailout funds and not investigate the administration’s response. And I am not sure what you are referring to with the term conservative leadership. Leadership of what? Dems don’t have any conservative leaders. I’ll totally ignore the swipe at Obama, because it isn’t based in reality.
Bruuuuce
@Barbara: It is, as my grandmother used to say, to laugh.
TS (the original)
@germy:
How do we ever know if he believes this or is saying it under pressure from trump. I have trouble seeing truth in anyone who works for trump.
Barbara
I have the same response to these kinds of suggestions: “You first. Show us how it’s done.” And it turns out whoever is advising this “solution” is tucked away in some remote second home spot or working remotely and getting every scrap of supplies delivered by other people who remain at much higher risk. It just kills me that they say these things without understanding that, at base, it means they are okay with other people dying for mostly someone else’s benefit.
Jinchi
@Leto: I’ll volunteer to wish Yang the best if he’s stupid enough to try it himself. This suggestion is just slightly less offensive than Dan Patrick’s appeal for old people to sacrifice their lives for the stock market.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
one of the Tea Party obsessions was that government jobs were what they used to call “no-show” and “no-work” jobs on the Sopranos
bluefish
American Carnage. Criminal neglect. Donald John Trump. Reconstruction of the administtative state, on our knees, on the other side. And hearings, with muscle.
Betty Cracker
@MJS: It’s my understanding that would require a supermajority in the Senate. So would impeaching the hacks Trump added (not just to the SCOTUS but throughout the federal judiciary) and replacing them with qualified judges, even if Trump is convicted of crimes after his “presidency” ends, which seems unlikely.
I could be wrong. But I think the only way out of the judicial trap the Republicans have successfully sprung is a wholesale repudiation of that party at the polls come November. That’s also unlikely in a country this polarized and stuffed to the gills with idiots, but it’s probably our only shot.
Leto
@Jinchi: No, they don’t. So getting around your sick comrades laying around the corridors should be fun times for all.
germy
Jinchi
Modly explicitly went to the Roosevelt and told the entire crew to shut up and stop talking to the press. So I’m guessing yeah. Firing Crozier was a giant signal to the rest of the fleet to suck it up and stop whining.
germy
@TS (the original): I’m not sure Fauci says anything he doesn’t believe. He disagrees with the president from time to time.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@germy: ah, so she’s going from no-show to no-work
I am deeply ambivalent about the whole institution of the “First Lady” to begin with, but what the hell does the Chief of Staff of a do-nothing First Lady do?
SiubhanDuinne
@germy: I anticipate that she’ll be every bit as effective as FLOTUS CoS as she has been as WH Press Secretary.
Ohio Mom
On a personal level, I wonder what it would be like for me to only have to deal with the practicalities of living through a pandemic — not to also have to cope with helplessly watching the ever-accelerating fall of the US into failed state status.
That is sending me into a deep funk. Other countries are having their challenges but are their governments crumbling like ours?
TS (the original)
@germy: I know he has – but this came out so quickly after trump’s lackey was talking about it – I just wonder.
Leto
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Maybe Grishim was responsible for the “I don’t care” jacket. So she can go back to that.
@Jinchi: How well did that work out for him? Immediate leaked audio. If he was more than a junior officer playing grown up, he’d have known to go to the senior officers to deliver that message. You know, that whole “chain of command” bullshit pr he was spouting.
Amir Khalid
@germy:
I’m curious. Just what does Melania do that requires a staff, let alone a chief thereof?
Crashman06
@Ohio Mom: Just wanted to chime in that I sympathize with this feeling and think about this a lot. It’s definitely putting me into a deeper funk as well.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@TS (the original): This is what I have found with a quick Google search:
So far, in the active duty and Reserves, 431 sailors have been diagnosed, as well as 334 soldiers, 281 airmen and 86 Marines. The National Guard, both Army and Air, has reported 303 cases.
Overall, DoD reports 2,528 cases, including 398 civilians, 336 dependents and 177 contractors. Of those, 44 civilians are hospitalized and 23 have recovered; 14 dependents are hospitalized and 26 have recovered; and 15 contractors are hospitalized, and eight have recovered.
COVID-19 Military Times
Jinchi
@Amir Khalid: Well, Grisham doesn’t do any work, so she’s a perfect fit for Melania’s chief of staff.
Leto
@Amir Khalid: It takes that staff many, many months to prepare Melania-bot for her 1-2 public appearances. More advance notice is needed in case it has to speak.
The Moar You Know
@germy: The Chinese may say they will, in PR statements to the West, as they already have in Shenzhen. But they really won’t. Won’t even drive them underground. You’d have riots. Aside from the cultural issue (the consumption of these critters is supposed to make one “strong”, among other things, and fresh-killed food is considered the best) for quite a few people, this is the only place where they get their proteins.
There were several in San Francisco – inside shops in Chinatown – for many years until the city finally banned the trade in live animals back in the late 1990s.
A Ghost to Most
@Spanky: So many lampposts, so little hemp.
Jinchi
So about as bad as the state of Wisconsin, but in an environment where it’s impossible to self-isolate to flatten the curve.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Spanky:
Plus, rope is cheap.
cmorenc
@taumaturgo:
Even with the typo on the year, your statement above is spot-on that Trump / the GOP are trying to blame everything that’s being mishandled / seems nefarious about the COV-19 situation on something the Obama Admin somehow did in 2018, two years after they left office.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@Jinchi: Yeah, it’s in the same basket with the 2 French doctors suggesting that some possible cures should first be tested/clinically trialed in Africa. That’s some colonial mindset crap there. Also, can anyone in the West learn the names of any of the 54 countries that make up the African continent ? I find the laziness of referring to a gigantic landmass with hundreds of languages and thousands of dialects and different nations and groups of peoples by one name, mind boggling some days…
TS (the original)
@EmbraceYourInnerCrone:
Thanks for checking – The easy spread on a ship, I thought would have meant the Navy would be in a worse position. Everything seems upside down with this virus – & I’m having trouble believing any of the data I am reading.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Barbara:
Jesus is a piece of shit. Didn’t sacrifice at all – simply chose to have a really bad weekend, and expects everybody to praise him till the end of time for it in order not to experience eternal pain….
germy
Massive New York City cathedral, including its crypt, will become a field hospital
germy
Delivery by dog: A new way to get wine and groceries in the age of social distancing
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@cmorenc:
also reflects the keen understanding of how government works– in this case the justice system– in the cobwebby parts of the emo/on-ine left
Jinchi
Wait! What? For coronavirus? Where did you hear that?
Updated:
Arggh. It’s even worse than I imagined. What the hell is wrong with people?
Apparently the idea is that you don’t want to test a vaccine on people that might be able to take care of themselves if it fails, because that screws up the statistics.
syphonblue
Donald Trump and his entire administration should be held criminally liable over this.
TS (the original)
Why is the dow surging at the minute? Industry around the world is grinding to a halt & markets are going up. Most world markets follow the US markets. What are trump & co doing to create this surge?
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Bruuuuce:
I can remember a time when Miss Pittypat and his Christianist busybody friends were up in arms about China’s “One Child” policy, something which was a rational approach in such a densely populated country.
I also remember when that feeble-minded, incompetent asshole Ronald Reagan went “all-in” with right wing elements of the Vatican and the more fundamentalist factions of Islam to crush family planning efforts worldwide, those efforts intending, in part, to manage potential pandemics.
Choose, goddammit.
Barbara
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Just sending some virtual support. I know you are having an especially rotten time of it.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Nora:
On a general basis, the ABA doesn’t rate them on ideology – it rates them on experience and temperament. Some of these guys are getting nominated in their mid-30s, a time when most lawyers are just really getting the hang of it.
jc
Unfortunately for us all, the problem with the chain of command is at the top.
Tazj
@PenAndKey: The Supreme Court claims that allowing more time for voters to vote by mail fundamentally alters the election but this doesn’t? It’s evil, just pure evil to force people to do this or give up their right to vote.
randy khan
@Betty Cracker:
Under current Senate rules, a bill to enlarge the Supreme Court by 2 seats would be subject to a filibuster, but there’s no Constitutional requirement for more than a majority. So a Dem-controlled Senate could eliminate the filibuster when it adopts the rules for the next session and enlarge the Court with a majority vote.
Not saying it’s going to happen, but that’s how you’d do it.
Bruuuuce
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Why should they have to be consistent even minute to minute? The world goes as they will it, not as the reality-based community thinks, amirite? :-(
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I’m assuming that cocktail hour has started early today – of course, given her rep, that may be a daily occurrence.
Although right now, I’m considering it.
PenAndKey
So the press secretary that didn’t hold a single press briefing is out. I’ll be honest, I forgot that she even had a job.
SFAW
@RAM:
Even a moron like the Murderer-in-Chief can comprehend it when someone says to him “It may not be here yet, but it will be. And when it does, if you sit around with your tiny thumb up your obese ass, lots of people are going to die, shitloads more — maybe even Ivanka — will be at risk, and the country will blame YOU for the Depression that will follow.”
He may not BELIEVE it, because he’s the smartest person who ever waddled the face of the Earth, etc., but he can comprehend it.
Ksmiami
@Barbara: I want this Supreme Court demolished along with everything the GOP has erected. The whole party is a cancer on the US and needs to be expunged
Barbara
@randy khan: I think they should roll out the equivalent of what they have been doing for more than 30 years for appellate courts, and that is assigning senior status at age 70 and treating it like a vacancy, even though the judge continues working with a full docket. That would, among other things, stop the abusive timing of resignations to ensure that one party gets the opportunity to replace you. Your replacement would be selected and confirmed when you turn 70, without you having any influence over the timing. In the current court that would lead to at least two and probably more new justices, but it would keep 9 as the “base” number.
ETA: You could still influence timing, but you would have to resign before the age of 70, which doesn’t seem to jibe with the average superego appointed to the court.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@A Ghost to Most:
There’s always electrical cord. Plus, all of it can be wiped down and reused.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@randy khan: I don’t think filibuster reform is part of the “Revolution”, and I don’t see people like Manchin or Coons or Hickenlooper, and under best case scenarios, Cunningham, Kelly and Bollier (who switched parties about a year ago) surprising anyone.
germy
@PenAndKey:
She made frequent appearances on the Fox network. That apparently was her job.
As far as I know, she never took questions from anyone but Fox.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@PenAndKey:
In a normal administration, most of these daily briefings would be handled by the press secretary because the president would, you know, have things to do.
Ksmiami
@A Ghost to Most: guys guillotines and firing squads are way more efficient for the numbers (checks list of Republicans) we’re looking at
sdhays
@Bruuuuce: They can’t even come up with something new. Oh sure, Linseed, Dump will “make China pay” just like Mexico is “paying for Wall”.
Oh, how I want to believe those polls that show Graham with a real race on his hands.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Barbara:
Thank you! I’m in week whatever (I’m starting to lose track of time) with zero revenue, so I resubmitted to SBA for EIDL, knowing they’re going to screw me based on the number of employees I formerly maintained.
One guy here is taking a job at Home Depot because he knows someone in higher management. I envy him.
Ksmiami
@Jeffro: no we just go in with a pair of pliers and a blowtorch and remove the miscreants
mrmoshpotato
Hangings.
(Moves on to next thread)
low-tech cyclist
This is treason. The virus is an enemy just as much as a hostile nation is. And while you can’t give comfort to a virus, Trump and his lickspittles damned sure aided it in its war on us.
Every last one of them should be sent to Gitmo for the rest of their lives. Death would be more merciful than they deserve.
mrmoshpotato
@Ksmiami: Ok ok. “Off with their heads!” it is.
Kay
I’m a lurker now but this is an emergency- if you’re worried your small business will go under look into shared work programs (state). Not all states have them, but I’ve now done three applications for Ohio’s for small businesses and all were approved in a week.
No one has gotten any money yet but I am very hopeful! :)
If you’re hitting a wall trying to use the PPP route (and you will- it’s a fucking mess) this could be a lifeline for you and your employees. You just have to stay alive. Just keep the lights on. That’s the goal.
sdhays
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: The One Child policy may have been somewhat rational when implemented, but it’s important to remember that the CCP could have avoided it if they had instituted family planning education and resources decades earlier. They knew that the population was going to get out of hand and there were proposals to get ahead of it, but Mao deliberately did nothing so that he would have bodies for the WWIII that he expected to have with the West.
When WWIII didn’t happen, the leadership realized that they were looking over the cliff of a massive disaster and implemented the horrific and draconian One Child Policy.
Of course, blood thirsty Linseed doesn’t give a shit about Chinese babies, and certainly not Chinese women.
dogwood
@TS (the original): I’m sure Dr. Fauci doesn’t believe he’s working for Donald Trump. He’s had a long, distinguished career as a public servant dating back to the Reagan administration. And of course he believes the wet markets should be closed; they are breeding grounds for all this shit. In an increasingly globalized world where millions of people move across continents with ease, containment is impossible. We have seen the failure of trying to fight this one state at a time while a corrupt and passive federal government watches from the sidelines. Likewise, we’ll never be able to control the spread of these viruses one country at a time.
zhena gogolia
So sick of the back button not working.
zhena gogolia
@Kay:
Welcome back! Stick around! We need you!
A Ghost to Most
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: For certain things, the old ways confer the most symbolism.
taumaturgo
@Betty Cracker: Of course is possible and true. It is also true that the deep-rooted propensities of individuals and groups do flourish especially during critical times. In this most propitious situation to have both a look back and supervision of the bailout funds was wasted. This is what conservative incrementalism as a practice by the current conservative leadership brings to the table. It uncovers a stubborn, stale and politically harmful not to rock the boat propensity.
Jinchi
It would be 4. RBG (87), Breyer(81), Thomas (71) and Alito (70). Sotamayor and Roberts (both 65) would be up in 5 years.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
my god, middle-school Bart Simpson is posting his book reports now
Mike in NC
Trump will go down as one of the great villains in American history, alongside the likes of Benedict Arnold and Jefferson Davis. Only much worse.
Elizabelle
Like we would notice this: LA Times:
WASHINGTON —
I think it is sinful that these Trumpsters are taking 6-figure salaries for doing nothing for the American people.
TS (the original)
@Kay:
@zhena gogolia:
Agree – Welcome back x many
PenAndKey
Sadly, that doesn’t surprise me in the least. No wonder I forgot about her. I haven’t watched FOX in more than bits and pieces in years.
Ghost of Joe Lieblings Dog
@PenAndKey:
The linked story gives her time in that job (while holding down two other senior positions, my goodness!) as 9 months. It’s hard to see what she actually did during that time, but the story tries.
It doesn’t mention what she was earning, though — or, more accurately, what she was paid for doing whatever it was she was doing, if anything. Because Journalism ™, presumably.
Elizabelle
@Kay: Hello Kay. Miss you, and glad you are helping these workers.
Lurk on, but hope you’ll comment again when you find the time. Cheers.
p.a.
A) will today’s 5o’clock follies be cancelled because of this news?
B) or will it go on w/o drumpf? (But Dense was in the loop)
C) or will he be there and only call on Fux and OAN? Or “no questions, no nasty questions…”
The Thin Black Duke
@Kay: Welcome back, Kay! I missed you.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
man this is going to come back to haunt her next time she appears on the campaign youtube channel with Lara Trump (Dollar Store Ivanka, as Tbogg calls her)
Ghost of Joe Lieblings Dog
@Kay:
Seeing your name brought a smile to my face. Count me among the many who have missed your comments… I hope you and yours are staying safe and sane during all this.
A Ghost to Most
Oops:
germy
randy khan
@Barbara: It’s sort of like Roosevelt’s court-packing plan, actually.
Bill Arnold
@Kay:
Have missed you.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
Annndd now JP Morgan and some of the other trading houses want their traders back in the office (in Manhattan!!) unless they have a doctors note. WTF are they trying to kill their people?? “More than 100 employees were on the message chain seen by Bloomberg, and some were horrified. It came soon after an outbreak of COVID-19 inside JPMorgan’s Madison Avenue headquarters, in which at least 16 people tested positive on a single trading floor,”
Wall Street traders horrified at being ordered back to their offices
Kay
@Ghost of Joe Lieblings Dog:
We’re good. It’s scary. Financial problems scare me. Our small business clients were freaking out and now they’re despairing. They just have to survive three months, I’m telling them. I hope that’s true.
I’m telling my people to abandon ship on the federal small business program and….. everyone run to the state program! :)
Ideally one would apply for the fucked up, mismanaged Trump program while accessing state bennies but they can only handle one crisis at a time.
The Ohio unemployment people are doing a great job. I actually got a real live person to call me back – I can’t imagine how swamped they must be.
J R in WV
@taumaturgo:
I toggled off the pie safe to see what you are commenting about today, same as it ever was, unintelligible gobbledegook nonsense.
[1] Why on Earth would Trump’s administration want to look back, or care how “horribly and tragically the current administration botched the Covid19 response.” Of course they don’t care about anything but covering up the Trump administration errors and deliberate murder via plague. The oversight committee actually has nothing to do with the Covid19 Response, other than how funds are disbursed to partially make up for the collapsing economy under Trump’s supervision.
[2] When did Obama have any federal office in 2018? So careless about facts…
[3] Yet here we discuss the Trump administration’s misfeasance and malfeasance, which leads taumaturgo to conclude that Democrats are guilty, guilty, guilty and have a high tolerance for losing. Which does not follow from anything taumaturgo said in the whole comment. Democrats are not responsible for anything the federal government does at this moment, as they only have 1/2 of one of the three branches of the government.
BACK INTO THE PIE SAFE, taumaturgo !!!
Mike in NC
@germy: Why does Melanoma even need a chief of staff, or any other employees, to do absolutely nothing all day long?
Bill Arnold
@germy:
For some context see YY_Sima_Qian’s comment earlier today:
https://www.balloon-juice.com/2020/04/07/covid-19-coronavirus-update-domestic-monday-tuesday-april-6-7/#comment-7663020
It starts with “The issue is consumption (for food or medicinal purposes) and trafficking of wild life, not wet markets, per se. Your local farmer’s markets and seafood wholesale markets are wet markets.”
Also, the science is nowhere close to being settled, and probably never will be, and randomness is involved. There is a small army of scientists (much of it in China) tracking down the very complicated biology (many many species) potentially involved, with some newish papers. Murky hidden international smuggling practices[1] aren’t helping either.
Sample from a month ago:
Potential Factors Influencing Repeated SARS Outbreaks in China (3 March 2020)
[1] Identification of 2019-nCoV related coronaviruses in Malayan pangolins in southern China (February 18, 2020)
(Copying some links from a comment here. I haven’t done a literature dig myself yet.)
Betty Cracker
@Kay: Scary times. My guess is your small business clients are grateful to have a smart and competent person like yourself on their side. :)
Sab
@Kay: Thanks, Kay.
joel hanes
Come now.
That memo may have been presented and discussed in a meeting with Trump present,
but Trump still did not know.
It was a written memo, mostly text, and more than a page long.
It had big words, paragraphs, and even some math.
Trump’s minuscule attention span and crippled reading ability don’t allow him to absorb information from such materials. He gets angry if anyone acts as if they expect him to read at a seventh-grade level or above.
Ohio Mom
My eyes nearly popped out of my head when I saw Kay has de-lurked.
So happy to see you, Kay, even briefly. When the next urge to be chatty strikes you, I’d love to hear your take on the new version of the Ohio primary.
EmbraceYourInnerCrone
@Jinchi: I believe they do, even if you live in base housing the tenders go out to sea , go to Okinawa frequently, (or did) so everyone needs their own bunk. hot-racking is normally only done on subs, sometimes. I assume the thinking is that since no one (as far as they know) has it yet on the Cable, they will lock them down on the ship so they don’t pick up COVID-19 from their families, or out in town or, on the base. COVID-19 is already in the general community on both Guam and Saipan. There are a lot of people on the base. Wonder what they are doing about bringing on stores, you still have to feed your people. Who are probably all going stir-crazy…
joel hanes
@Jinchi:
I’ve read that there are 10 polling stations in a city that typically has 180.
Nope. There are 5. Five
But the 180 number for normal conditions is correct.
TriassicSands
@Nora:
My guess is there will be zero accountability for Trump. Some flunkies may be thrown under the bus.
The United States simply does not hold its presidents accountable.
SFAW
@syphonblue:
I/IATMFA =
Indict/Incarcerate All The Mother Fuckers Already
Betty Cracker
@TriassicSands: This is our unfortunate history, and most of the time, I share your pessimism about Trump being held to account. But on the other hand, how many things we thought we knew about the U.S. turned out to be bullshit over the last three years? All in a bad way! But perhaps something unprecedented will happen in a good way too. It’s up to us to bring pressure to bear.
SFAW
@Kay:
I, for one, would LOVE it if you decided to comment here as much as you used to.
joel hanes
@Kay:
Seeing your nym has made my day better.
Namaste!
Ksmiami
@mrmoshpotato: my own fairly serious take is that I do not Imbue this government with my consent- they are a hostile ruler only governing because a foreign entity and some very stupid citizens aided them. The GOP as an entity is anti-American and fucking traitorous and they carry no legitimacy.
SFAW
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
That would only happen if she had any sense of shame.
Ksmiami
@TriassicSands: just wait till more people start dying and starving… bombing a bunch of “foreeners” is one thing but not affording food and watching your parents die is another
Emma from FL
@Kay: You’re back! *happy little shimmy
Kay
@Betty Cracker:
It has that rolling disaster feel. Improvise!
The Ohio program makes you identify the “work unit” you’re (halfway) laying off. So funny. It’s designed for like massive manufacturing so we’re just making up “units”.
“The 3 teenagers at the drive thru”, “the ladies up front”
Just translate that into bullshit filling in forms language.
joel hanes
It’s also possible he knew and was moving behind the scenes to secure a personal advantage.
It’s more than possible, it’s certain.
I remind you of the timeline of Trump’s abortive attempt to get “US” control of a German company working on a vaccine for SARS-CoV-2, and desire for “exclusive” rights to that vaccine.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/15/world/europe/cornonavirus-vaccine-us-germany.html
If they held the meeting 2 March, we know that they knew and were making decisions based on that knowledge at least as much earlier as the lead-time for setting up that meeting. So mid-to-late February.
frosty
@Kay:
Dead thread, but I wanted to add that I was happy to see your nym again. Glad to see you’re still here as a lurker and I hope you can share your on the ground experience from time to time.
scribbler
@Kay: I don’t comment often but wanted to add my voice to the many that are saying “Hi Kay, welcome back!” I hope you will continue to speak up when you can–your comments always add to the discussion in important ways.
James E Powell
@japa21:
I think it means “not Bernie.”
Miss Bianca
@Kay: Thank you for that, way late – Colorado does have this program and I forwarded the info on to my boss at the theater.
Hope you are keeping well, hang in there.
@A Ghost to Most: Awwwkward. : )
The Lodger
@Leto: Elites? The only other person I’ve seen come up with something like this idea was Ammon Bundy.
schrodingers_cat
@Kay: We miss you. Delurk and start reposting on the first page.
The Lodger
@Kay: Thanks for re-emerging, Kay. We’ve missed you.
tokyokie
@Ksmiami:
Wow, a reference to Don Siegel’s Charley Varrick, one of the most criminally underrated movies of all time.
Denali
@Kay,
So good to hear from you. You always add value to the conversation.
Chris Johnson
@Kay: It’s good to see your nym again, and I hope you and your folks make it through this all right :)
J R in WV
@Jinchi:
@Leto:
Actually, Leto, I’m not positive as I never served on the Frank Cable, but the active sub-tender I did serve on from 1970-73, laid down in 1942, had individual bunks for every sailor (and jar-head) on board. I think the only Navy vessels that hot-bunk are submarines. Other Navy vets can pitch in on this…
But still, a rack of 5 bunks high repeated through a berthing space, narrow corridors and hatches and ladders between decks, no way for “social distancing” of any description. Never knew if a bunk up top was better, hard to climb into, harder to get into your locker, which you slept on, but the vomit falls down upon the lower bunks after drunken shore leave or when seasick. Mine was usually in the middle, so best/worst of both worlds.
J R in WV
@Ohio Mom:
Great Britain is crumbling at least as fast as the US is.
Boris is the British equal of Twatly Trump, lies deliberately for his own benefit, cares not one whit for anyone but himself, etc. Aims to harm people if he can make $0.02 out of their pain.
No One You Know
@Kay: Thank you, Kay. It’s good to see you.