Every day in the selfie lines, I hear the stories from people who are struggling, who need a government that's on their side, not the side of the billionaires and giant corporations. They're why I'm in this fight. pic.twitter.com/oE0fR64rIW
— Elizabeth Warren (@ewarren) March 4, 2020
While she’s in it, I’m with her. (And if she endorses someone else, I’ll — almost certainly — take her advice.)
And as I said yesterday… what with circumstances (including COVID-19, yup), we need a backup candidate who’s got a campaign structure ready to go. Not to ill-wish anybody who isn’t a Republican, but in the clips I was seeing last night, the Only True Progressive Candidate did not look like a well man, and Murphy the Trickster God is taking entirely too much interest in our little contest this year.
Warren message to supporters: "There are six more primaries just one week away, and we need your help to keep up the momentum." pic.twitter.com/zr2QlQOVqk
— Shane Goldmacher (@ShaneGoldmacher) March 4, 2020
Warren has not done well tonight and that's a damn shame because I believe she's the best person to lead this country. Yet, she demolished Bloomberg and Chris Matthews in the same week and can point to a record of actually getting shit done. Her weakness? Being a woman. https://t.co/z8bxfEsXZI
— Charlotte Clymer ?️? (@cmclymer) March 4, 2020
Oh, and just to make it absolutely clear: I'm still riding with Elizabeth Warren. I can see her getting to the convention in a deadlocked scenario and being the perfect leader to unite the two wings of the party. She is of the greatest presidential timber. I believe in her.
— Charlotte Clymer ?️? (@cmclymer) March 4, 2020
Elizabeth Warren vowed to fight back after her dismal performance on Super Tuesday.
While her campaign had insisted it still saw an opening by going to the convention, the results were far below their own publicly-released projections https://t.co/Dv9e5ZgTmq pic.twitter.com/zw4ChvgfD3
— POLITICO (@politico) March 4, 2020
Elizabeth Warren deserves to be doing better than this.
— Andrew Yang?? (@AndrewYang) March 4, 2020
Fuck you. Is that articulate enough? Same as Sanders, she is arguing for her own superior capacities and vision and she can, if she wants, proceed to the convention with her own leverage to try to influence the party’s choices and platforms. Her delegates can matter. https://t.co/XgMHGlXZ81
— David Simon (@AoDespair) March 1, 2020
I've backed two people in this race, @JulianCastro & @ewarren. I poured my heart into helping them develop disability policy that meant something–that would do some good for people usually left behind
And I will do everything I can to help the Democratic nominee win the general pic.twitter.com/oDlyMi1cHT
— Matthew Cortland, Esq ?? (@mattbc) March 4, 2020
Next time vote for the person who inspires you most. That way the winner will be the one who inspires the most people. https://t.co/zBvgyA2z71 pic.twitter.com/7SYAspjT8b
— jess mcintosh (@jess_mc) March 4, 2020
Asked AOC if she thinks — as some have called for — that Warren should drop out and endorse Sanders. “I don’t think that’s up to me. I think that’s a very deeply personal decision,” she said. Said Sanders + his supporters shoud instead be making the push to earn those votes.
— Addy Baird (@addysbaird) March 3, 2020
They won’t like hearing this but progressives overreached w Sanders & cost themselves their 1st real shot at the party’s nomination. Had they gone w Warren, outcome might have been different but too many people are spooked by the actual socialist thing.
There’s a lesson in that— Rachel "The Doc" Bitecofer ??? (@RachelBitecofer) March 4, 2020
John Legend explains why he decided to publicly endorse @ewarren: "What I love about Elizabeth’s agenda is that she’s focused a lot on reforming democracy, making it less corrupt and more and more beholden to the ordinary people out there in the country" https://t.co/mLznhll4e3
— Variety (@Variety) March 3, 2020
Then, again, there’s a really smart and capable woman with many detailed plans. Whatever. https://t.co/hoMmf5Gs0H
— Soraya Chemaly (@schemaly) March 4, 2020
Speaking of inspiration:
Florida man expresses concern about woman running for president.
— Alexis Henshaw (@Prof_Henshaw) March 4, 2020
BGinCHI
Me too.
Chyron HR
BEGGING for votes? Like a common NEOLIBERAL??
Sasha
Hoping she at least holds on as long as the 11th debate on March 15th. With the field winnowed, she can now truly stand out.
FlyingToaster
I hope Warren stays in through May, and gets her delegates onto the platform committees in the convention. And this way I still get to KEEP Senator Professor Warren, thanks, all.
I’ll max out for her on June 1st, regardless.
different-church-lady
Two can play this game, asshole
(ETA: because it’s ambiguous: I’m talking about what Sanders is doing, not Warren.
Chris Johnson
@Chyron HR: You hush. It was good of AOC to have that take.
Gin & Tonic
I’m still a supporter too. I hope I can vote for her on April 28 (yeah, that’s an eternity from now.)
Chyron HR
@Chris Johnson:
I’m just predicting Ya Boi Bernie’s response.
SiubhanDuinne
Georgia’s primary isn’t until March 24, but early voting has already started. I’m thinking very seriously of casting my vote for SPW today or tomorrow. If she’s no longer in the race by the 24th, well, it won’t be the first time in my life I’ve guessed wrong, but I feel a strong need to register my support and admiration for her in a tangible way.
negative 1
Sigh. Will it matter? We’re resigned to Joe. I will obviously go to the polls and vote for him in the general but I reserve the right for today to be gravely disappointed.
Obviously ‘nothing’ beats a negative, but that’s really what we’re hoping for the next 4 years. I suppose he’s good on labor, so that’s good, but I doubt he really does anything about it except pick a better labor secretary than f&%king Scalia’s kid.
WereBear
After their woman-bashing got us Trump, they still haven’t learned a damn thing. I’m with Warren; now and into the future. Even if she doesn’t make the Presidency, I am sure that still, she perseveres.
Another Scott
A day or so ago I heard a story about NC (IIRC?) primary voters. One woman interviewed said she really liked Warren, especially because she, like Warren had training in speech pathology and worked with children. But she said she ended up voting for Bernie because Warren’s health care proposal wasn’t strong enough on cheap hearing aids… :-/
People are funny sometimes.
Dunno what’s going to happen, but people really need to stop over-thinking this. Vote for whoever you think is the better candidate in the primary. Your vote isn’t going to determine the outcome, but may influence the direction of the platform or who thinks about running in the future. Whoever is strong enough to win the primary is going to be a great candidate to defeat Donnie and his minions in the fall.
“We got this” – if we keep our eyes on the prizes and do the work.
Cheers,
Scott.
satby
I wish I had kept my Chicago registration (my name is still owner on the house there) because the Indiana primary isn’t until May! Hope SPW lasts til then so I can vote for her too.
But I confess I feel better that Biden made such a strong showing against Berner.
schrodingers_cat
I wouldn’t be surprised if Warren gets a primary challenger for her senate seat when she is on the ballot next time 2024. Coming 3rd in the state where you are a sitting senator displays political weakness.
IIRC even Ted Cruz won Texas in 2016.
different-church-lady
@schrodingers_cat: Nah, that’s not the vibe I’m getting here. It’s more that people were calculating that Biden was the only way to neutralize Sanders winning the state. More circumstantial than systemic.
zhena gogolia
@negative 1:
He can save the country from fascism. If that’s not good enough for you, I don’t know what to tell you. There are people for whom this is a matter of life and death. I hope you will think about their hopes and dreams and not just your own.
Served
@schrodingers_cat: Ahhh even when she’s down, you keep kicking. You just can’t help but be anti-Warren in every single thread
She will get a primary challenger from the Bernie wing, but not because she looks weak.
Baud
It’ll be interesting to see what she does in the next debate, especially if Bloomberg does drop out.
Chris Johnson
She needs to stay in because both our frontrunners are running a demanding and russian-sabotaged campaign against a hostile media and a huge array of dirty tricks while both being older than Bill Clinton is NOW.
This is bonkers. But so is ‘President Trump’, and everything else about this situation, so bring it. But Liz needs to stay in the race and be as chill as possible—be herself, basically—since it is absurd to expect these impossibly old guys to bear up under this strain. And that’s not even considering that we are at ground zero for a pandemic exacerbated by our health-not-care system, and they are going to be holding rallies. RALLIES. Jesus take the fuckin’ wheel.
Trump’s side will be worse. He does rallies for emotional support, not just for politics. And he is possibly so deteriorated that he can’t eat solid food anymore. If our side looks dangerous, the Republican side is in desperately bad shape and needs to be stomped, which can still happen.
Gelfling 545
I have noticed on several occasions that AOC seems a good deal smarter than Bernie & his usual crew.
different-church-lady
@Gelfling 545: Let’s hope she doesn’t learn the wrong things from him.
Baud
@Gelfling 545: Agree.
rp
God I hate GG. That is all.
germy
Spanky
I’m convinced that as President, Trump, Sanders, and Biden would/will not be in office 4 years from now due to health (aka dying in office). I think that’s a variable everyone needs to take into account in making their choice. I know I’m not alone in taking a keen interest in watching who gets the VP slots.
Barbara
Glenn Greenwald would be comical if here weren’t such a smug know it all asshole. First, assuming that voters for Warren would all line up behind Sanders (highly debatable), and second, assuming that there is something wrong about deciding to “help” Biden at Sanders’ expense if that’s what she is indeed doing (and FYI, I don’t think it is). She is an adult who gets to decide these things, just like other adults might decide to run away and hide in a foreign country to avoid having to deal with the fall out they helped to unleash in 2016
ETA: And third, assuming that Warren or any other candidate has any reason whatsoever to listen to him.
germy
Tenar Arha
@SiubhanDuinne: FYI: It took the pressure off having to pay attention to every little thing by early voting last week. I could look at polls & the SC results & go “I picked who I’m sure would be the best President.”
Anyway, even if she doesn’t get all the way to the convention, I want her to do whatever she thinks is best to have influence on the platform & in the party. Plus, I want her to stay in to keep Bloomberg out, bc neither Bernie nor Biden have a clue how to stake-him-through-his-money better than her.
Spanky
Also too, Bloomberg’s ego is not going to drop out.
schrodingers_cat
@different-church-lady: EW is by and large popular as a senator but I was thinking that if Joe Kennedy can’t unseat Ed Markey he might try to do the same when EW is up for reelection sensing her weakness.
TaMara (HFG)
Me, too. To a point. I don’t have the stomach for a brokered convention. But honestly, nothing about her says, “hey, I want to create chaos.”
So, yes, I’m with her. And I’m also happy Biden voters handed Sanders his butt yesterday. I can hold more than one belief at a time (unlike some Republicans I know)
germy
Jim, Foolish Literalist
PsiFighter37
Bloomberg drops out, endorses Biden.
laura
Bloomberg out. Endorsing Biden.
Calouste
@schrodingers_cat: Sanders barely got 51% in Vermont yesterday, down from 86% 4 years ago. By comparison, Dean got 53% in Vermont in 2004, even though he had already suspended his campaign.
Baud
Mike is out.
Baud
@Calouste: Wow.
NotMax
For all intents and purposes (leaving aside Bloomberg, who is irredeemably damaged goods, what with the numbers of early votes, yesterday was still a five person contest.
Now it is a three person race. Different ball game.
germy
Barbara
@negative 1: Here is my honest view: Neither Sanders nor Biden “should have” run. I believe that Biden got in the race only because Sanders did. I can’t prove anything, of course, but I assume that Biden realized that Sanders’ greater name recognition and/or the fear voters would have of nominating another woman would hamstring other candidates not named Sanders and that there is deep aversion to someone like Sanders being the nominee, not because of policy objections, but because his personal style divides people, and he does not value African American voters — and those things are the polar opposite of what Biden values. I think Biden truly does want to enable the next generation. Yes, it’s all crazy making.
satby
Bloomberg has dropped out according to the Guardian
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Calouste:
Baud
Thank you Warren for taking out Bloomberg.
dm
I think the answer to Glen Greenwald is basically the one that people who vote third party use: it sends a more precise message about the voter’s desires.
In this case, the stakes are a lot lower than they were in Nov 2016. It’s not even, for many, a matter of a choice between evils.
I’ve already cast my vote, but I still have money I can donate, and I’ll continue doing that.
Spanky
What the fuck! Is this some kind of record for blowing a prediction?
Barbara
@germy: Well, God knows it won’t be because of his crackerjack response to unleashing an effective public health response to Covid-19.
Wag
Bloomberg is out, endorses Biden
schrodingers_cat
A brokered convention will be a disaster we need to focus on beating the Orange Man.
Gin & Tonic
@satby: WSJ is saying the same.
Omnes Omnibus
@schrodingers_cat: Weakness as a presidential candidate and weakness as an incumbent senator are not the same thing.
schrodingers_cat
@Calouste: Leap year Democrat needs a Democrat to primary him.
jackmac
I love Elizabeth Warren but I’m absolutely fine with Biden. I’m still with SPW as our March 17 Illinois primary approaches. But if there’s a chance that Biden could start to lock down the nomination with a commanding Illinois win, I’ll switch and help.
PenAndKey
@Gelfling 545: I’ve long thought that. It’s my hope that at 30 she’s got plenty of post-Bernie political life left in her because there are far, far better mentors for her to take the mold of.
Baud
@schrodingers_cat:
The way things are going, Biden is going to win an outright majority, or will easily win on the second ballot.
trnc
Sad beyond words that Warren is not doing better. I hope she refrains from endorsing, not so much for leverage but to say “Either Bernie or Joe would make a far better president than the current occupant,” and press them to say the same thing. We’re gonna need the unity in November.
Baud
@Baud:
And thank you Bloomberg for taking out Tulsi in American Samoa.
(Although there were still better uses for your money.)
zhena gogolia
@Wag:
Oh, good.
satby
So looks like we’re all pretty excited Bloomberg dropped ?
hopefully this is the last time a Democratic primary gets hijacked by non-Democratic party candidates. Because that was sucky.
FlyingToaster
@schrodingers_cat: Warren had a primary challenger last time (remember the Shiva Bus?). She’ll win statewide for Senate, easy.
Yesterday was an exercise in strategic voting and misogyny. I can point you to at least a dozen locals I’d spoken to in February who flat out told me that a woman could not win the Presidency, so they were voting for (pick a guy). While I hoped for better, I sure as fuck didn’t expect it.
Joe3 won’t challenge her. The beef with Markey is personal (last summer, Markey threw the first punch). This race should be compared to Ayanna Pressley; there’s almost no daylight between the candidates, but one is nearly 80 years old, and the other ain’t. If he doesn’t beat Markey, I’d expect him to run for Governor in 2 years, and win.
I know you don’t like Warren. I do.
I’m sick and fucking tired of electing the stupidest candidates.
Betty Cracker
@Spanky: Haha! It surprised me too, but good for him. I guess he doesn’t want to muck up Biden’s shot at a Florida blowout (early voting started a while back).
This probably means Bloomberg will keep his promise to drop money-bombs in the general election on the Democrats’ behalf.
zhena gogolia
@Barbara:
I tend to agree with your analysis.
ETA: I also tend to give Bloomberg more credit for civic-mindedness than most people here. His actions today confirm that.
NotMax
What I most am concerned about right now is that when the spotlight is locked to focus on him and he’s basking in being on top, THAT is when Biden’s dominant gaffe gene will shift into overdrive.
Baud
@satby:
I hope this brings Kay back. She was really upset about Bloomberg when he was on the rise.
germy
I’m glad Bloomberg couldn’t buy the presidency.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: I think that’s where it is headed. The desire for a brokered convention in the comments here by some is what has left me dumbfounded.
James E Powell
I voted for Warren for all the reasons one votes. If I had a magic want, she’d be president. But her campaign is not gaining ground.
There are six primaries next week. I’d pick Biden to win big in Idaho, Mississippi, Missouri, and North Dakota. Michigan and Washington, I don’t know, but if Biden wins either or both, that is if he goes five for six or sweeps, what’s the justification for anyone to continue?
The argument about delegates and influence on the platform seems lame when the only real job is defeating Trump. The platform is not going to matter at all. Democratic unity, enthusiastic Democratic unity, will matter a great deal.
zhena gogolia
@satby:
I think he was afraid that “BURISMA” was going to fatally damage Biden.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Baud: I was starting to doze, but I swear Kornacki was arguing that Biden is moving to a majority of delegates last night. Looking at the map (and putting on my Half-Assed Pundit hat), I think it depends on how well he does in IL and MI. I’d bet on him taking FL, GA and PA. Not sure what the NY primary looks like
Gin & Tonic
Imagine how much better use Bloomberg could have made of that half-billion.
satby
@Baud: we can take turns chanting “low quality hires” if you like.
different-church-lady
HOW’S THAT LIFELONG STRATEGY OF NOT MAKING FRIENDS WORKING FOR YOU NOW, BERNIE?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@schrodingers_cat:
I love it.
Betty Cracker
@trnc: Great point. Warren has progressive cred, and as much as this particular internet bubble likes to dismiss the importance of the progressives to the party, we cannot win without them. Warren can help with the healing, and I would expect no less of her.
zhena gogolia
@Gin & Tonic:
He did great anti-Trump ads.
scav
Somebody’s going to be grumpy that the stock market jump this a.m. is being credited to Biden’s performance yesterday.
The Dangerman
He stole that from Balloon-Juice, right? David, you lurk around here?
Warren HAS to stay in as this race turned on a dime in the last week or so. It can happen again and for who knows what reason. We live in interesting times.
Seems to me most interesting from yesterday is that people were waiting in line for 6 hours in places. Team Broken Glass is definitely in play. People are pisssssssed at Trump. I hope the local registrars clean that up before November, but who knows?
Ruckus
@germy:
7 hrs!
I spent 4 hrs in the OH debacle of 2004. And said debacle worked as intended, I saw people wait for a bit and then leave without ever getting in the building. Don’t know if they came back at night or not.
7 damn hrs!
Gin & Tonic
@zhena gogolia: I’m getting a feeling that team Trump shot their load too early.
schrodingers_cat
@FlyingToaster: I like Warren as my senator I voted for her. Outside the progressive blog bubble of which this blog is a part, her Presidential campaign has been a total bust. Tell me how may contests has she even came second in?
As for the senate that was pure speculation on my part and I wish she continues being our senator for as long as she wants.
ETA: The Indian Idiot who was her challenger was not a Democrat. He was an independent IIRC.
Ella in New Mexico
@Chris Johnson:
THIS is why I’m totally hoping she does not get out before at least the next two primaries. I want her voice in the ring, and God knows the events on the ground lately are completely unpredictable.
And I’m REALLY hoping that she works out a deal to be the one who brings all but the most disgruntled Bernie voters over to Biden as his VP.
West of the Rockies
@trnc:
I hope she says Joe. Beloved Bernie would lose and Clump would waddle on with his vile and violent agenda.
different-church-lady
@germy: In terms of symbiotic relationships I’m fine with the events described.
Gin & Tonic
@satby: It still is.
Mary G
Thank you, Senator Warren, for taking out the billionaire after one day his name is on a ballot.
Thank you, Mike Bloomberg, don’t let the door hit you on your way out. Now turn your money firehose onto the Senate races.
I am comforted by the big turnout to elect a real Democrat, even if it isn’t one of my first choices.
Elizabelle
If front pagers do a Bloomberg drops out post, you’ve totally got to include a recent New Yorker cover.
Mr. B, in top hat and tails, setting his money on fire.
Hildebrand
As I was driving my daughter (17) to school today, she couldn’t help but feel more than a bit smug over Bernie’s not-so-great night. She is no fan of Biden (‘creepy old bastard’), but she loathes Bernie and the Bernie ‘cult’.
She continues to encourage me to vote for Warren in the primary next week – as she has every day since Sen. Harris dropped out (she was all in for Kamala from the beginning). Doesn’t really take that much encouragement, I plan on voting for Warren, as does my wife.
My daughter is now holding out hope that Biden picks Sen. Harris as his running mate.
delk
Bloomberg had some of the best ads until he actually started talking in his ads.
dmsilev
@zhena gogolia: I’ll give Bloomberg credit for this: He truly deeply thoroughly despises Trump.
Baud
Bloomberg gloat thread up.
kindness
I voted for Warren yesterday and still support her but that clock is now ticking. I suspect that shortly, she will have to drop her campaign. If that happens I hope she doesn’t pick another candidate to back.
Here’s the thing, the quandry I find myself in. I prefer Warren and Bernie’s notions about what direction to take legislatively. I have no faith that Bernie can do it. He hasn’t shown he can get a bunch of folk together that don’t completely agree on a topic and hammer out a compromise that is acceptable to all. Because Bernie isn’t that person. Never has been. Won’t be in the future either. And beating Trump and Republicans across the board is the most important thing here, not the individuals running. I find myself leaning to Uncle Joe for just that reason. Bernie and his Bros I fear will bring ruin to us all because of the chips on their shoulders if he runs (and even if he wins).
flyingwatertanker
We’ve gone from the awesome possibities of ‘nevertheless, she persisted’ to the incredibly frustrating near inevitability of ‘nevertheless, he merely existed’. Because we still live in a world that values mediocre white guys with a pulse (barely) who don’t bother anyone over any kind of effort to do better. Weird.
Barbara
@Hildebrand: Will she be 18 in time to vote in November? I make sure my kids are registered and nag them to vote. Fortunately, they see the point of doing it as well, especially the one that lives in NC.
O. Felix Culpa
@schrodingers_cat:
I don’t recall seeing a desire for a brokered convention. Maybe some people feared it would happen based on the multi-person race we had just a few short days ago. But a desire, no
ETA: The only context in which desire might have applied was the potential scenario in which BS went into the convention with a plurality and other candidates and their delegates coalesced around someone else. Luckily for us, the latter is happening now.
SiubhanDuinne
@NotMax: Let’s for a minute assume Biden wins both the nomination and the presidency. Apart from his VP pick, I think his most significant staffing choices will be his CoS and Press Secretary. Good picks in those roles would go a long way towards mitigating some of Joe’s “dominant gaffe gene” in office.
germy
@Betty Cracker: I finally got around to watching Warren’s lunch with Colbert video, and one thing I noticed is her insistence that we can’t afford a repeat of 2016, where one half of the Democratic party was at war with the other half. I know this frustrates folks who were dying for her to attack Sanders.* I was glad to see her go hard after Bloomberg. She even shamed him into releasing 3 NDAs.
I’m glad she outlasted Bloomberg and his money.
* I know, I know “wilmer” isn’t a real Democrat, but he’s running as one, and she’ll need every progressive vote she can get if Sanders flames out like last time.
zhena gogolia
@Gin & Tonic:
When I saw an article in the NYT Style section about Hunter Biden’s artwork, I thought maybe that danger had passed. But you never know . . . .
?BillinGlendaleCA
@satby: Bernie’s still in the running.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@flyingwatertanker:
So you see no difference between trump and Biden?
Ella in New Mexico
@NotMax:
His gaffes are totally backed in at this point. The reason people are so relieved he’s back on track is because they accept that about him, maybe actually find it endearing, and see him as the best strategic candidate to win and restore the country.
Quite the contrary to him blowing something, he’s now going to face a full on attack from the DOJ, from more than one Senate committee and from what ever countries have Trump’s ballsack in their hands and want to keep him in office for as long as his spongey, prion-addled brain allows him to stand upright and not urinate on himself visibly.
Get ready for Benghazi 2.0: The Burisma Smear
We’re actually gonna need Bloomberg now, more than ever.
germy
@Ruckus: We need the U.N. to monitor our elections.
Ella in New Mexico
@Gin & Tonic:
A pattern, according to Stormy. :-D
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@SiubhanDuinne:
not sure about Press Secretary, but I’d bet half my quatloos on CoS Ron Klein, he’s been Biden’s eminence grise for a while
ETA: Klain, god dammit. Autocorrect, quit messing with proper nouns, at least with names
Hildebrand
@Barbara: Yep, she turns 18 this summer. She cannot wait to vote this November – she is beyond amped to get rid of Trump.
Growing up watching President Obama (‘my president’) being so calm, thoughtful, and compassionate led her to believe that that was the standard. She grew up thinking that Presidents were supposed to be curious, engaged, caring, and willing to bring in experts in the fields they didn’t understand. Trump offends her at every level.
She starts college this fall, she wants to major in International Studies as she hopes to go into the Foreign Service – so she really wants some professionals back in the State Department to start cleaning house and restoring order (which is one reason she doesn’t like Bernie, she just doesn’t see that he will be able to curb his ego and put brilliant people in positions of actual authority).
schrodingers_cat
@O. Felix Culpa: Some EW supporters have been speculating since last night that she could play kingmaker if the convention were to be brokered. Or emerge as the compromise candidate.
zhena gogolia
@Hildebrand:
Good for her.
I feel so sorry for my students who grew up with Obama and then had this monster thrust upon them. What a shock.
Feathers
Sady Doyle said what I was trying to last night about “white feminism” hurting Warren.
One of the most useful takeaways from my yearlong literary theory class is that “tools of analysis are not revealers of truth.” As with many leftist framings, it started as a useful call to expand what feminism means. It is now a lefty “both sides” whinge to shut down and gaslight women you disagree with (and WOC can be called white feminist, too).
Warren has her own very specific knowledge about how financial and legal systems intertwine to drain the middle and lower classes. And the will and fire to do something about it.
Link: https://twitter.com/sadydoyle/status/1234921884392808448
Gin & Tonic
@Ella in New Mexico: I’m glad somebody else went there.
Ruckus
@germy:
Sure wouldn’t hurt.
Also. Maybe there is a need the UN for more than just our crappy voting stuff. Just an idea…….
zhena gogolia
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Right.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Ella in New Mexico: Brava!
?BillinGlendaleCA
@SiubhanDuinne: Sec of State’s going to be an important job.
Omnes Omnibus
@Baud: She was more upset by the Sanders hate, it seems to me. She was starting to see Sanders as the front runner and thought that much of the rhetoric about Sanders from a number of commenters was over the top.
lamh36
I need someone to explain to me as non-biased as possible why a brokered convention strategy now is a good strategy but not in 2016?
As I wrong in imagining a scenario where if it happens and it’s vs Bernie and she prevailed would be one thing but if it’s convention time and it’s vs Biden, then you have two loyal bases if Dem party pitted against one another at the convention (Biden powered by African Americans, Warren powered by mostly liberal white women), I have a hard time believing that would be a good thing no matter who prevails ??♀️ especially since each one needs to be TOGETHER for the general?
Wasn’t the fact that Bernie stayed in so long why some folks complained it hardens the division of supporters and did not help HRC against Chump??♀️
anarchoRex
If Warren is in third place at the convention and gets the nomination, that’s a recipe for general election disaster.
different-church-lady
@Feathers: “Just not this woman. Or that woman. Or that other woman. And that other woman who is particularly ickky. And…”
different-church-lady
@anarchoRex: Na ganna happen.
Baud
@Omnes Omnibus:
I think she was upset that we were talking about Sanders so much when Bloomberg was the bigger threat. So a little of both.
anarchoRex
@anarchoRex: just adding that if ANYONE who isn’t the front runner, including Bernie, gets the nomination then again, general election disaster.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus: There were problems here in LA county yesterday, it wasn’t the machines, it was the check-in. I knew there would be problems since I had problems with the check-in process last Friday.
The way it’s supposed to work is they scan your sample ballot and the computer finds your registration and you sign then they print and give you your ballot. That didn’t work for me, so the lady had to manually override it which took a few minutes. Not a big deal for me since it was not busy, but apparently lots of folk had to do that when it was busy yesterday. Big Problem.
Aleta
@Feathers: You may have seen this from last week already. (It’s not only about her.)
Omnes Omnibus
@schrodingers_cat: Random speculation or brief wishful thinking =/= actual desire for.
Tenar Arha
@Tenar Arha: LOL, I look away from my comment for 3/4 of an hour & Bloomberg drops? LOL
schrodingers_cat
@lamh36: Word.
Cowrey
I’ve been a contributor to Elizabeth Warren’s campaign all along. I believe in her knowledge, drive and ability to lead. I want her to win the nomination.
Betty Cracker
@Omnes Omnibus: She’s not the only one who feels that way. I sure hope she comes back, though. She’s one of the most insightful and low-key funny commenters we have.
FlipYrWhig
I like how Greenwald, whose entire recent career has been anti-anti-Trump (but how dare you suggest he *supports* Trump) suddenly has strong opinions about whose actions qualify as derailing vs. helping.
Omnes Omnibus
@Baud: I think they are both crap. I want and wanted a real Democrat, and I didn’t see any reason any reason to pre-compromise.
O. Felix Culpa
@schrodingers_cat: I don’t read that as a desire for a brokered convention. More a desire (and a possibility) for EW still to have some influence in outcomes, whether it’s for the eventual nominee or the platform.
dm
@lamh36: I kind of think that Hillary->Warren people who were so pissed at Sanders for persisting may have an opportunity for self-reflection. I hope so, anyway, because I want her to persist, since, like Sanders, I think she brings a nice sledge hammer for widening the Overton window.
Unlike Sanders, however, Warren doesn’t seem to attract as many Twitter-jerks for supporters.
Feathers
@schrodingers_cat: The best way to think about brokered convention nerds is that they are the political equivalent of someone who jumps into a conversation about Lord of the Rings to excitedly point out how you’d understand all of this much better if you only knew about this one incident from The Silmarillion.
flyingwatertanker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
As a Democrat, he’ll be surrounded by people who will try to stop him from breaking things rather than help him break things or sell off what isn’t broken.
But as individuals, they’re both bumbling idiots from the same mediocre old white guy mold.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@flyingwatertanker: Well, I’m sure you think you’re making a point.
catclub
@Wag:
Wow, all good on him.
Feathers
An interesting twitter thread from a black woman Warren supporter analyzing why black voters are so drawn to Biden. She puts it down to how traumatized the electorate is after three years of Trump, so traumatized that they are afraid to hope. Warren absolutely is the best choice for actually undoing the harm Trump has caused, but voters just want it to end. They see Biden as promising that.
Link: https://twitter.com/lisasharper/status/1235188641187627009
PenAndKey
In my adult lifetime I’ve seen three presidents but four people I’d say filled the roll. You had pre-9/11 idiot fratboy, post 9/11 idiot fratboy figurehead with an Emperor Palpatine behind the curtain, Obama, and the villain from Back to the Future 2.
I totally understand where your daughter is coming from, because as far as I’m concerned Obama is the only real president I’ve seen since I’ve been old enough to vote.
flyingwatertanker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I’m sure I was venting. I see little evidence here that making points is some sort of requirement.
Aleta
@Omnes Omnibus: Better to quote/link her own words exactly instead of try to interpret her feelings in a later thread. Since old threads take more effort to read than new comments, you may in effect unintentionally end up speaking over a woman who’s capable of speaking for herself. She explained herself differently.
Omnes Omnibus
@Aleta: A fair point. Hopefully everyone will follow your advice.
Uncle Cosmo
Among other things, he could’ve built another couple of buildings at our mutual alma mater (Johns Hopkins) & dumped the rest into their endowment – which would’ve kept the greedy bastards out of my mailbox & inbox for another year or two. (Srsly, the Alumni Giving types were pretty quiet over the last few years, until Mike decided to divert his pocket change into a Presidential run – whereupon the academic panhandlers crawled right back out from under their rocks, whining about their poverty. Back off, bloodsuckers.)
Kent
NO he is NOT running as a Democrat except in name only. And barely that. His Senate web site still identifies him as an Independent and makes no mention at all of the Democratic Party. I don’t think his current campaign web site does either, but it doesn’t overtly identify him as an independent.
Democrats are a PARTY that works together towards common goals. Sanders may share many of the same policy objectives as Democrats, but he is absolutely NOT running as a Democrat. He is running as a party of ONE under the assumption that if he creates a large enough “movement” then actual Democrats will be FORCED to come around to supporting him and his objectives.
They are not the same thing at all. I see no evidence whatsoever that Sanders has ever supported other Democrats out of party solidarity, either in terms of electoral politics, or in terms of supporting wider party policy objectives.
Citizen Alan
@Gin & Tonic: No, the Burisma “scandal” was timed perfectly. The only reason it didn’t wreck Joe’s campaign is the whistleblower (who I would say deserves a Presidential Medal of Freedom except that Rush Limbaugh has permanently stained the value of that award).
janesays
If she’s still in the race next Tuesday, she’ll have my vote. But I have no illusions about that vote – it will be almost entirely symbolic. She’s not going to be the nominee. She’s hands down the best candidate in the field, and that has been true since the primaries began. But being the best is hardly a guarantee of being the winner. Finishing in third place in her own state was the final nail in the coffin. I suppose we can talk about brokered conventions if we want, but it’s pretty delusional to think there’s any realistic scenario left where SPW emerges as the 2020 Democratic presidential nominee. Even if she sticks around until the bitter end, she’s not going to win a single state in this contest, and it’s very unlikely she even finishes above third place in any of them. There is absolutely no path to the nomination here.
I do hope she gets a better speaking slot at the convention than Sanders.
Kent
And I think that Biden has the extraordinary luck of having it all drug out last fall and examined with a microscope in the context of impeachment, which pretty much inoculates him from further media frenzy scandal. Sure the GOP will try to continue to hold hearings and Guliani will continue to try to stir up shit. But that ship has sailed. They aren’t ever going to be able to generate the sort of multiple front page NYT headlines and talking head media frenzy that they did with EMAILS!! because the Dems can just dismiss it as more madeup bullshit.
It is sort of like how during the Bush v Gore campain there was all the rumors about how he had skipped out on his national guard service during Vietnam. Then some memo surfaced that turned out to be probably fake and there was a big to-do about CBS news and then the story just went away. Everyone else was afraid to touch it, even though it was never disproved and plenty of people said it as true.
For the Ukraine scandal to have worked they would have had to dribble it out during the fall with an ongoing “investigation” in Ukraine accompanied by a long list of talking heads on TV expressing “concern” about this and that detail to just keep it in the front pages. That ship has sailed. They will have to come up with a new scandal. No one is going to want to hear about Ukraine anymore and the more they bring it up, the more it will draw attention to Trump as the source.
glory b
@kindness: Guy on the Thom Hartman Show, who sounds like a straight reporter, said the expectation is that Warren suspends in the next 48 hours.
glory b
@Citizen Alan: I think it was Heilman on Morning Joe this a.m. who said that a Repub operative told him to get used to hearing the words “Hunter Biden” over and over and over this election.
Suzanne
@Betty Cracker:
This is why she is ten times the person that Bernie is.
That tweet from Bitecofer is going to be really difficult for a slice of the progressive left, the slice for whom it really is Bernie’s personality cult. But I think she’s right; if they hadn’t been better at coalition politics, they could have had a lot more influence. The Gin&Tacos dude is seriously on the edge of collapse right now.
And again, party ID and voting behavior is established young. While not enough young people vote, for sure, the sooner you get people on your side, the better chance you have of having them stay on your side and be firmly aligned to the party in future elections.
I will have to put my faith in Joey B that he will be a good team builder. I don’t really have a lot of faith in his politics, but I do have faith in him for this.
kindness
Hunter Biden….I think at this point the only people that will get worked up over Hunter Biden are folks already voting for Trump and the MSM who are already voting for Trump. At this point it’s like another Benghazi hearing and most of us don’t want to hear what one might say when they lead off with Hunter Biden. It isn’t going to hurt Democrats come November.
Betty
Biden ran a crappy campaign while Warren worked her butt off. There is no justice. Seems to me the Biden votes have been based more on fear than any policy has promoted.
negative 1
@Hildebrand: I know I’m going to regret asking this, but why?
I preferred Warren to Bernie but would’ve been fine with either — both are genuine progressives. Universal healthcare, for real, would be a HUGE thing. The idea of ending college debt-slavery would be a HUGE thing. Whether or not they could get them passed, the fact that two(!) presidential candidates specifically endorsed that as ideas is utterly amazing!
Chapo trap house is a bunch of a$$holes so now none of that is as important as saying ‘well those guys are a$$holes’? Warren’s policies are only good things coming from Warren? I know, she and Bernie aren’t *totally* the same — but they’re a hell of a lot closer than either one to the Generic Dem Candidate (whom we elected last night). I truly don’t get this line of thinking. Most of the world are jerks. Any group will lump you in with some. You think that in the universe of Biden supporters there aren’t plenty of them who are voting for him because he’s not a woman or ‘the soshalisms are scary!!1!’? It creates this asinine double standard where genuine progressive policies again have this scrutiny in a way where ‘middle of the road’ Joe has none.
Kent
The problem with the Hunter Biden scandal for the GOP is that there isn’t really a scandal. What is the one sentence “hot take” on Hunter Biden? If it takes 3 paragraphs of fever swamp conspiracy theory explaining to do then there is nothing there and people will lose interest.
Hildebrand
@negative 1: My daughter is a bit of a stickler for governance – she wants someone who will actually get good stuff done, even if you don’t get everything that you hoped for. She is very progressive (more progressive than me), but very pragmatic. If you can’t get legislation passed, your grand vision isn’t really worth much, is it? If you aren’t moving the ball forward, even an inch at a time, what are you doing? She finds that Bernie postures far more than Warren – and that he surrounds himself with too many ideologues who seem to be more interested in making an argument as opposed to getting stuff done.
On top of all that – and she knows this is a style thing – she hates that Bernie shouts all the time. ‘It’s just draining, Dad.’, she says, and then tsks and rolls her eyes in a way that only a seventeen year-old can muster.
She finds Biden to be very creepy, but hopes that Obama’s pragmatism has worn off on him enough to put really good people around him, ‘He can be the figure-head and turn good people loose to fix everything Trump has broken.’
Hoodie
@Kent: Hunter Biden = Billy Carter = Neil Bush. No there there.
Amir Khalid
@Betty:
Election campaigns are not about justice, alas.
Brachiator
Damn, this was an astute observation. I do believe that this woman has a future in politics.
Dan B
@O. Felix Culpa: It seems that there are people who believe a brokered convention would look like Dem’s in Chaos!!! and would turn off “voters”. I believe the other extreme is worse. A birung convention which generates tepid media. The narrative there is Old Tired Codgers. We can thread that needle.
Brachiator
@Kent:
Doesn’t matter. Trump and GOP political strategists know that all they need are fast labels to paste onto Democrats. I hear lazy and stupid talk radio hosts talk about the Ukraine Biden scandal. By the magical transitive properties of bullshit, Hunter obviously did something wrong, nobody knows what, and Joe is obviously corrupt as well.
As a bonus, easily manipulated Democrats will start bloviating over how there is a dangerous conflict of interest in children of politicians using their parents’ name recognition to land sweet gigs. And Joe is magically at fault for not controlling his greedy kids.
Shit, they are still investigating Hillary Clinton over her emails. The sweet thing about the bullshit smear that is unconnected to anything substantial is that the it can be brought up forever.
And the shorthand is simple. Ukraine. Biden. Corruption.
Brachiator
@Betty:
Working her butt off is not the same thing as running a good campaign. Warren stumbled along the way. But I still happily voted for her in the California primary.
Rarely is in politics, and especially in political campaigns.
You may be right here, and it is a shame if people let fear shift them away from making a better decision about who should lead the country.
Dan B
@lamh36: My wish is for Warren to negotiate with Biden to hire a progressive staff the will let Warren, at Treasury, to rein in the financial industry. And select a Harris (or Val Demings) as #2. Joe has said one term, or less, so number two is gonna be an incumbent for the general.
And Bernie can be the angry socialist all he wants. It will provide a good contrast to freedom loving Dems.
Then Warren embraces Biden and campaigns hard for him while telling Bernie to be quiet or he’ll be “Bloomberged”. It could look like Hillary joyfully campaigning for Obama. A Happy Dem’s story is very important.
Dan B
@negative 1: Middle of the Road Joe has plenty of scrutiny. Student Debt, Anita Hill, etc. but as someone who feels yhe existential threat of Pence / Hailey’s hatred of my “perversion” and the Trump cabal screaming burn baby burn, I’m all for a candidate that is not a Socialist, especially since a majority of voters do not want to vote for one.
On top of that Bernie seems to give lip service to racism, homophobia, and misogyny. Better wages will not fix these problems.
LongHairedWeirdo
From one of the embedded tweets:
They won’t like hearing this but progressives overreached w Sanders & cost themselves their 1st real shot at the party’s nomination.
I’m not sure I agree with this 100%, but I will say that, anyone who jumped to Sanders as “the only *real* progressive” was, IMHO, a fool. (Does “IMHO” still mean “In My Humble Opinion”? I’ve heard some people think it means “Honest” opinion, which can be the opposite!)
By this, I mean, Warren *is* a *real* progressive. So, if you preferred Bernie, I’m not saying I think you were a fool, even as a humbly spoken thought. But if you picked Bernie because “there’s only one progressive here”, I think you were incorrect, and a bit short sighted(foolish). And I’m humble here, because I prefer Warren *so* much over Sanders, I admit it – my judgment isn’t objective!
Heh. But in today’s climate, sometimes “we can agree to disagree” gets taken as a savage attack. It’s almost like politics has been warped by actual hatred for the past 25+ years.
Barb 2
I do not like Biden. He is too old and he is a nitwit. But then he is one among many. At least Biden doesn’t yell all the time and point his finger. Plus his voice is creepy.
women are women’s worst enemies. Documented in the ancient witch trials.
so rather than a smart, healthy female we get two idiot males – one is slightly less of an idiot.
it will be interesting to see how this plays out.
We are heading to code red epidemic response, in WA regarding the Covid-19. I have a doctor’s appointment today – via the phone due to the pandemic. We got a call this morning asking me not to come in due to the pandemic – the doctor will call and well we shall see. How are the red states dealing with this pandemic.
Meaning that a whole lot of campaigning will probably change.
My mail in Ballot is still for Warren. November is another decision. NOT Trump ever.
This country will never elect a woman. Women are women’s worst enemies. Some of Warren’s strongest supporters are men. So thank you guys. You guys make my day when I read such positive words about Warren and other women candidates.
Bonnie
I’m with you all the way. Elizabeth Warren would make a great President!