.
And there’s another damned debate tonight, because one of the cranky old men involved threw a tantrum about not getting enough TV time in 2016, so now we all get an introduction to a different cranky old man that nobody likes except the people he’s already bought (including a lot of ‘journalists’ who’ll drop their… objectivity for anyone who offers them free food & a novelty tour).
I’m only gonna watch second-hand, via twitter & your comments, because there’s only so much blood-pressure medication can do. Be sure to let me know if Cranky Old Man #1 shows signs of having another infarction, or if Cranky Old Man #2 tries to order his security personnel to remove one or more of the other debaters.
My only sure bet is that one or both of them will wag a finger at Elizabeth Warren, probably at the encouragement of the moderators. Fortunately, I have faith in my favorite Senator…
DRAG HIM, LIZ https://t.co/7FMWWeeUw8
— Elizabeth Spiers (@espiers) February 18, 2020
Hate to disagree with @DrJasonJohnson, but if Warren goes at Bloomberg tomorrow night, it’s not a “suicide mission.” It’s a return to her fundamental political identity and the most basic theme of her career. It’s not Christie v. Rubio at all.
— Charles P. Pierce (@CharlesPPierce) February 19, 2020
A lot going on here. https://t.co/MaCSxi0wLi pic.twitter.com/StfoPNEqqE
— Matt Pearce ?? (@mattdpearce) February 19, 2020
Something to watch for tomorrow night: Bloomberg’s mental sharpness. Like Sanders, he’s 78 years old (Biden is 77), so it’s a legit concern w all three
— Dana Houle (@DanaHoule) February 19, 2020
If Hillary Clinton had a heart attack 4 years ago and said this, CNN would have run non stop panels featuring Sanjay Gupta, Dr. Oz and a magic wall that only showed various searches of WebMD. https://t.co/kbg5Ps8HKl
— Lily Adams (@adamslily) February 19, 2020
Most unpopular qualities for a prez candidate in the new NBC/WSJ poll (combined reservations + very uncomfortable):
Socialist: 67%
Heart attack in past year: 57%
75+: 53%
Self-funder: 41%
Under 40: 40%
Gay/lesbian: 27%
Woman: 14%Feb 14-17, RVs, MOE +/- 3.3%
— Mark Murray (@mmurraypolitics) February 18, 2020
There are still so many candidates and SO MANY PRIMARIES LEFT. 2 of the whitest states in the union have voted and we’re ready to call it for either of the guys that won(?) or the guy buying all the ads?
If we claim we want to “save democracy” we have to let it actually happen??♀️
— brittany packnett cunningham (@MsPackyetti) February 16, 2020
OzarkHillbilly
I was just about to go back to bed. May yet. Twas not a restful night as Chuck’s equine herd repeatedly galloped thru my bedroom.
debbie
I hope Warren gives every goddamn one of the other candidates hell. And the moderators too.
JPL
@OzarkHillbilly: I woke at 2:30 and couldn’t go back to sleep. If I didn’t have a dentist appointment this morning, I would try to get a few more z’s.
Go for it.
JPL
Bernie has been getting a pass on his health issues and I hope that he is asked about it again tonight. Also he’s a millionaire, so he’s not hurting financially. How many hours did they replay Hillary’s coughing episodes.
Chyron HR
You can’t complain that he’s hiding his real self from the voters behind slick ad buys and then complain that he’s being allowed to take part in the debate.
Baud
I hope NBC remembers to include Warren’s podium on the stage.
OzarkHillbilly
@Chyron HR: Sounds to me like those complaints go together like salt and pepper.
ETA: on 3rd reading I think I get what you are driving at, that he can’t hide his real self in a debate. I think that is a questionable assertion but beside my point that I think it is reasonable to complain that he is buying his way into the debate.
Baud
I’m also interested in seeing how Bloomberg responds. I doubt he’ll be a pushover like Delaney was. And his BermieBro ad suggests he’s willing to go places that the Dem candidates are not.
prostratedragon
The Toles cartoon at the top triggered my kitten filter!
JPL
@Baud: ???
Baud
@JPL: He gets a pass on everything.
Sab
@Baud: They’ll have her podium up there, with the microphone unplugged.
debbie
@Baud:
Money’ll do that for a guy.
debbie
I’m wondering if those ridiculous pardons yesterday are an indication that Trump thinks he’ll lose in November?
Baud
@debbie:
My comment was about Bermie, but it applies to Bloomberg, at least so far.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
Media really wants Bernie to get the nomination because it would insure another Dump term and more tax cuts, ratings, and lucrative book deals and subscriptions.
rikyrah
Good Morning, Everyone ???
Baud
The funny thing about “buying one’s way into the debate” controversy is that Steyer has been there the whole time. ?
germy
Can’t we give Chuck Todd a break? Will he do the “show of hands” or “one word answer” thing again?
rikyrah
@David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch:
Tell? that ? truth ?
Baud
@rikyrah: Good morning.
rikyrah
@JPL:
I remember that ???
NotMax
Refuse to engage in the hopped up on speed game of jumping the gun of which the MSM and Twitter are so enamored. So, as an angst and agita palliative –
Dickens fans will probably like it, Dickens purists will probably loathe it.
;)
debbie
@Baud:
Oops, sorry.
germy
@debbie:
Don’t presidents usually issue pardons while they’re on their way out of office?
Baud
@germy:
Yeah. He’s going to empty federal white collar prisons for Christmas.
germy
@NotMax: Did you see this when it came out?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-WnIVD5kJDI
Dorothy A. Winsor
@NotMax:
Dev Patel as David Copperfield? I want to see it
Baud
Today show mentioned Warren in the poll this morning. Progress!
rikyrah
NotMax
@debbie
Occam’s Magic 8-ball says more than likely a smokescreen to divert attention from something else afoot of a more malevolent nature.
Baud
Today show also says Pete will go after Sanders tonight. FWIW.
OzarkHillbilly
@debbie: No, it means he thinks he can do anything and get away with it. Pretty soon he’s gonna head for 5th Avenue with an AK-47 so he can show them NYers the error of their ways.
rikyrah
OzarkHillbilly
@Baud: Never heard of the guy. ;-)
NotMax
@germy
Nope, although have seen it listed as available on either Netflix or Prime, I forget which.
mrmoshpotato
Who could that be?
Baud
OT – it’s interesting how much authoritarian action we accept as necessary to fight the coronovirus but it’s still politically difficult to mandate vaccination of children.
satby
@Baud: the Bernitalldowners have been the main purveyors of a lot of anti-Pete, anti-Warren bullshit, so I hope they all call his ass out.
rikyrah
Baud
@satby:
I have wonder whether Warren will ever decide it’s in her interest to distinguish herself from Bernie.
satby
@NotMax: oh, that looks great!
mrmoshpotato
@germy: ?Give Chuck a break. Give Chuck a break. Drop Chuck Todd into a fucking lake.?
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: Yeah how is BS is my friend, rigged primaries bullshit working out for EW.
schrodingers_cat
@Baud: The cult is not afraid of Steyer as they are of Bloomberg
HeleninEire
@debbie: I had the same thought.
Baud
Andrea Mitchell emphasizing that debates are not Bloomberg’s strong suit. Accurate reporting or an attempt to lower expectations?
SFAW
@NotMax:
Damn you, sir. Now I have to go read it.
SFAW
@satby:
I don’t know if that term is your own invention, but I like it.
Geminid
I’m guessing Bloomberg does his mock debating session with 2-3 focus groups watching on TV. Then highly paid social scientists analyse, then more highly paid communications specialists advise him. And top-tier acting coaches train him to project “warmth,” “strength” and equanimity. A little “humility.” (That’s the hard one). Next they do it again with another 2-3 focus groups.
Steeplejack (phone)
Here’s a feel-good respite story on the importance of teachers:
British footballer Ian Wright in 2010.
In the news again because of BBC Radio 4 this week.
germy
rikyrah
germy
Statler/Waldorf 2020
Baud
@HeleninEire: Hello there. It seems like it’s been a long time.
schrodingers_cat
BTW modi is throwing the Orange King a rally in Ahmedabad. One liar has promised the other a crowd of 7 million.
Lapassionara
@germy: to which I say, hah. Hah, hah.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Baud: I was infuriated by a report I read in which someone asked about leaving Warren off the poll and the pollster said they only had 5 slot and the 5th one went to Klobuchar. So the men’s places were assumed to be secure. The 5th one was the girls’ place so obviously one of them had to be left off.
germy
@Dorothy A. Winsor: They could barely fit her name /
Baud
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
5 spots? I didn’t realize polling technology was so limited.
Immanentize
@NotMax: I like!
SFAW
@germy:
It was either that, or they would have had to shorten it to “War,” the way That Other Woman became “Klob.”
Immanentize
@Baud: did the Today show report Warren showed up as second in Nevada in at least one poll?
Baud
@Immanentize: The poll I saw was a national poll.
SFAW
@germy:
Yeah, I’ll get right on that. I don’t know what the over/under is on Barr resigning, but I’ll take “never.”
Shalimar
@debbie: The pardons mean Trump is appalled that rich and/or famous guys ever face consequences for anything, and also that he thinks this will be popular with his voters because they all feel the same way. Otherwise he would have waited until after the election win or lose. He really thinks those pardons of horrible people were good campaign strategy.
Cheryl Rofer
@Baud: Warren who?
Baud
@Cheryl Rofer:
Must be Warren Buffet. He’s even richer and older(?) than Bloomberg.
Chyron HR
@schrodingers_cat:
Its weird how you guys seem to be legitimately angry that an actual Democrat is running on an unabashedly left-wing platform. You do understand that the reason we hate Bernie is because he’s an awful human being, not because he’s going to spend our tax dollars on
T-bonesinsulin shots for young bucks, right?SFAW
@Cheryl Rofer:
Not sure, but the Politburo is “correcting” the pictures which (used to) have her in them.
SFAW
@Baud:
Can’t be, they wouldn’t have omitted him.
Immanentize
@germy: Of course Sessions threatened and even offered to quit face to face with Trump. It is a public bluff and a way of getting Trump to reassert his loyalty to Barr
Cheryl Rofer
Here’s why they could add only one of the girls.
Kristine
@Chyron HR:
I wonder if the reason many media outlets are knuckling under to him is because he owns a media outlet that provides info/stories/etc? His people are their people?
Baud
@Chyron HR:
“You guys”? I can’t speak for cat, but Warren is my top pick. I’m disappointed in her campaign strategy. Maybe it’ll work out for her and I’ll give her her due. But there’s little hard evidence of it yet.
germy
@Immanentize:
Yes, I believe you’re correct.
Betty Cracker
Some outlet (Daily Beast?) surfaced a 2019 clip of Bloomberg speaking at a business conference that has something to do with Bermuda. In the clip, Bloomberg criticizes Democrats extensively for being spendthrifts and overly concerned with identity politics, although he allows they’re better than Trump and he wants them to win.
Interestingly, he also says there’s no way he can win a Democratic primary because of his views, and he admits he’s too old to run anyway. Paraphrasing, he says he’d be 79 when he took office and noted that when Reagan left office at 80, he was “carried out gaga.”
This was less than a year ago, in public, on camera. I think he’s in the race to kneecap Warren and Sanders, but he’s taking out Biden instead and clearing a path for Sanders. So, if Bloomberg’s objective remains to prevent a candidate who might be hostile to business interests from getting the nomination, maybe he’ll rain fire on Sanders tonight?
Immanentize
@Cheryl Rofer:
This WSJ poll leaving out Warren, and the other obvious attempts to erase her, or report her place as lower than it actually is, feels to me like a big “Own the libs” exercise. They object when it is pointed out, but then they do it again and again.
JMG
@Betty Cracker: That’s not how business works. The weakest link is the target. He’ll go after Biden, then Sanders.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Baud: The only campaigns I’ve seen on the TV machine here in LA are Bloomberg, Steyer, and Bernie(at least one or maybe 2 slots on the 11pm news). I know that TV time in the LA market is expensive, but it makes a difference, and where is Bernie getting the cash to put on two commercials during the 1/2 hour news?
Shalimar
@Betty Cracker: Reagan was 78 when he finished his 2nd term, but Bloomberg did have a point. He’s too old to depend on for the highest-stress job in the world.
edit: actually 77. he turned 78 a month later.
Immanentize
@Chyron HR: I have much more confidence that Warren will enact policies that actually help people generally and will work to fix our democracy much more than I trust Sanders will do the same.
And yes, he is a horrible person as you say which is part of my analysis in the first part.
Baud
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
He’s got an impressive fundraising machine. I’m not sure how traceable his donors are however.
germy
germy
@Kristine: He might be their future employer.
Baud
@germy:
Are we confident that those are real people, and if so, are people in this country?
Immanentize
@?BillinGlendaleCA: From that surprising 24 million he raised in January. At the time, he said it would be used in California. If Kay were here, she might add that it is crazy that people raise so much and do the same old type of advertising — TV ads.
germy
Steeplejack
@Immanentize, @germy:
I agree that it’s a bluff, but more for damage control to dampen internal dissent within DOJ and external criticism that he can’t shrug off, e.g., “group of 1,000 federal judges calls emergency meeting.”
Baud
@Immanentize:
Kay, not Jay.
Shalimar
@Baud: I’m pretty sure none of them are real people, but that won’t stop Trump, Jr. from retweeting some inflammatory shit they tweet and defending himself by saying they have 50k followers.
Cheryl Rofer
@Immanentize: That may be part of it, but it’s easy to do because of a general societal sexism, which is probably worse at NBC. It’s not that they’re saying, oh we can have only one girl (word used advisedly) in our poll, it’s that nothing else occurs to them.
And I think the situation with Warren is worse – it’s more like the phenomenon of a woman offering an idea in a meeting and it’s ignored until a man offers it. Smart women must be ignored – again, not a conscious thought, but that the men present can’t accept their participation.
OzarkHillbilly
Baud
@germy:
I was convinced the absence of treason would persuade her.
Back to the drawing board.
Baud
@OzarkHillbilly: That is a good zinger.
Betty Cracker
@JMG: If he’s in it to win the nomination himself, that makes sense, but I’m speculating that he’s NOT in it to win it and that his objective remains what it was last year: to keep a progressive candidate from getting the nomination.
Immanentize
@Steeplejack: I have no doubt that he is getting very upset calls and emails from people who were previously his colleagues at large, wealthy firms, etc. But they are too smart, frankly, to buy his complaints about Trump. One of my favorite Henry Miller quotes:
“People who say they would rather be doing something else are liars.”
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Immanentize: In a big state like CA, if you’re not on TV, I don’t think you’ll get alot of traction.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Immanentize:
I guess it’s good to have a cult(or other means of support).
Geminid
I just read that the League of Conservation Voters and House Majority Forward are spending $1million advertising in 8 congessional districts held by freshmen, including Xochitl Torres-Small (Las Cruces NM). I remain an optimist, but I take nothing for granted. If all else fails, we absolutely have to hold on to the House.
Immanentize
@Baud: I fixed it before you had time to correct me! Funny how the “J” and “K” are right next to each other on my little phone keyboard.
Baud
@Immanentize: No worries. If it were me typing the name, there’s a good chance it would have come out as “jshyfejj.”
Mr. Mack
@Betty Cracker: That maybe true. But I’m sitting here wondering why a guy who is nearly 80 would worry about protecting his wealth. He could lose 3/4 of it and still live better than almost everyone on the planet. I guess I don’t think like a billionaire. Thank FSM.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@germy:
I want every vote and yet Meghan McCain makes me want to say we wouldn’t have her vote if she begged us.
Betty Cracker
@OzarkHillbilly: Score one for Mayor Pete! :)
Immanentize
@Mr. Mack: They didn’t become billionaires by giving out handouts!
Baud
@Mr. Mack:
I think he took that Bill Gates pledge to give most of it away when he dies. If so, this is all coming out of his future charity.
WaterGirl
@Immanentize: I am glad you guys have yesterday’s testing behind you. Now I imagine you have to wait for results?
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Cheryl Rofer:
Exactly. It’s like a few years ago, the Rs had a panel of people testifying about birth control. Apparently it never occurred to anyone that all the people were men.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Immanentize:
Any sense yet of how Immp’s scan went?
germy
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
Betty Cracker
@Mr. Mack: I can’t begin to wrap my mind around the enormity of $60B, but I’m pretty sure if every one of us at this blog and all of our descendants from now until the crack of doom went on shopping sprees full time, we wouldn’t be able to spend it all. I assume Bloomberg really believes expanding Social Security and working toward a single payer healthcare system are an existential threat to the nation’s long-term survival whereas Gilded Age levels of wealth inequality aren’t such a big deal. I think he’s wrong, but I’ll assume he’s wrong in good faith.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Betty Cracker:
I read somewhere that if someone gave you $5000/day for every day since Columbus landed in the New World, you wouldn’t yet have $1 billion.
OzarkHillbilly
I’m gonna try and catch some of that stolen sleep. Y’all play nice now, ya heah?.
Steeplejack
@Immanentize:
Yeah, I don’t buy Barr’s “complaints” and posturing either. I think he is getting out over his skis on how well the con is working. I’m sure he has a bubble of yes-men, minions and enablers just the way Trump does. But occasionally a glimmer of reality leaks in.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
I’m actually curious about how he’s paying for this campaign. I don’t think most billionaires keep most of their wealth in cash, so he must be liquidating some of his assets for this run.
Baud
@Dorothy A. Winsor:
I volunteer for the experiment.
Betty Cracker
@Baud: Sofa cushion change maybe?
schrodingers_cat
@Chyron HR: Reading comprehension fail, if you think that I support BS of Vt. I have been critical of him and his vaporous promises long before he ran in 2016.
ETA: Even in the comment you responded to I am being critical of Warren for giving BS a pass and not taking him on earlier in the primary season.
Steeplejack
@Baud:
I’ll do it for $4,000 a day!
Baud
@Steeplejack:
See, this is why it’s so difficult to raise people’s wages. Everyone always be undercutting everyone else.
Immanentize
@Dorothy A. Winsor: none yet. We go see the oncologist tomorrow. One more day of uncertainty and therefore distraction
Funny story (sort of) -+ the first time he had a CT with contrast last year, he said he could feel the fluid moving up into his arm and chest and it felt like it was going to explore. Bad, right?! They checked him out then, no allergic reaction, and just said, “Proceed!”
This time, in anticipation of the same trouble, he had the auto-injector set to low, then lowest pressure. But what really helped was the Ativan the doctor prescribed — one pill — that he took before the scan. He really had no worries at all. It was kinda cute.
schrodingers_cat
Warren supporters, BS cult is already adding her delegates to his total because they think she will fold and give the Vt senator her delegates. I am not so sure that she won’t which is why I am not in the EW camp.
Immanentize
@Baud: He has created special “Bloomy Bucks” which he is using to pay everything. Kinda like Milo Minderbindrer.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Immanentize:
When my son had his wisdom teeth removed, he was amusingly loopy afterwards too.
Fingers crossed. Keep the faith.
WaterGirl
@Baud: I am of two minds on this. No, make that three.
satby
@OzarkHillbilly: yep, he’s that dry funny IRL.
Jerzy Russian
@Dorothy A. Winsor: You would have $964 million. You could probably get over the billion dollar threshold using the magic of compound interest.
Shalimar
@Dorothy A. Winsor: If someone gave you $80,000 a day from when Jesus died and you never spent any of it, you would need another 100 years to have more than Bloomberg.
Geminid
@Cheryl Rofer: Women: a majority group that in many ways is still treated like a minority.
trnc
I’m super impressed how all the people who don’t seem to care about Bernie’s health records apparently assume that he won’t have another major health event between July and November.
the Conster
@schrodingers_cat:
She passed on several opportunities to go hard on why she’s a better choice than BS – the gun votes, the campaign sexual harassment settlement, the lack of accomplishments, and then yesterday she comes out to affirm that the Sanders’ campaign is built on hate after Bloomberg named names.
I just can’t with her. She has never figured out that his cult will never go for her – that it’s a one way street and it’s not in her direction.
Baud
@the Conster:
What did she say yesterday? I missed it.
germy
mrmoshpotato
@germy: Free time really has the fighting spirit there. ?
the Conster
@Baud</a
It’s a little late now, Liz.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/warren-says-sanders-has-lot-questions-answer-about-his-supporters-n1137836
Kristine
@germy: Yup, that, too.
J R in WV
@Baud:
Wife and I watched pretty much all of the 2016 Democratic National Convention, much on either NBC or MSNBC. Ms Mitchell (Greenspan) was an important part of their coverage, which was unfortunate.
We could watch a speech, in full, beginning to end, and then Andrea Mitchell would proceed to fabricate a false story about what we had just heard with our own ears.
It was despicable, horrible, false reporting in real time. She should not be allowed on the air after that performance. Distortions and outright falsehoods were the order of the day on her segments, which were constant. If Ms Mitchell is talking, it isn’t real news, it’s her version of propaganda.
Edit to fix block quote foul-up
J R in WV
@Chyron HR:
I don’t think you can mention Senator Sanders in the same paragraph while discussing a Democratic candidate running on a left wing platform. Senator Sanders is very clear — he is not a Democrat! This is why he is currently running for re-election to the Senate as n Independent.
At the same time we do have a Democratic Senator running for president with a very progressive and liberal platform! Her name is Senator Elizabeth Warren, and she is really a member of the Democratic party, and has been for many years.
You may have heard of her in spite of the news blackout about her success so far in the elections that have been held. In her short time in the Senate she has far more accomplishments to her name than Senator Sanders does in a 40-year political career.
She is also in great health, as opposed to Senator Sanders, who had a heart attack recently and is keeping his medical records secret, unlike Senator Warren, who published her medical records in toto. Along with her tax returns, released in toto, which Senator Sanders prefers to keep secret, but for brief summary pages.
ETA: We contribute to Senator Warren’s campaign, as well as to Senator Amy Klobuchar’s campaign. They appear to be the only really viable candidates in this primary to us.
Jay
@J R in WV:
Chyron HR was actually dissing all the NeverWarren-ers here.
Elizabelle
@J R in WV: Agreed re the marvelous EW and the propagandist Mrs. Greenspan.
I cannot believe (MS?)NBC let Andrea Mitchell Greenspan do some of the recap of Obama speeches. Too bad John Oliver wasn’t on air yet at that time.
Evap
What was that yelling when Biden was giving his closing speech?