It sucks that so many criminals associated with the 2016 election heist either evaded punishment altogether or got absurdly light sentences. That includes Trump, who remains in office despite the House Dems making an airtight case against him on two articles of impeachment.
We can and must work toward extracting a political toll on Trump and his Republican enablers in the upcoming election, and impeachment was an important part of that. But the lack of accountability under the law is disturbing regardless. Looks like Roger Stone may not be so lucky. Via TPM:
In a court filing Monday evening, prosecutors recommended to a federal judge that former Trump associate Roger Stone serves seven to nine years in prison for lying to Congress and witness tampering during the Russia probe.
“Roger Stone obstructed Congress’ investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election, lied under oath, and tampered with a witness,” prosecutors wrote in the filing. “And when his crimes were revealed by the indictment in this case, he displayed contempt for this Court and the rule of law. For that, he should be punished in accord with the advisory Guidelines.”
Prosecutors argued in the filing that given how “Stone’s actions were not a one-off mistake” and that his false statements were not “made in the heat of the moment,” a prison sentence of 87 to 108 months — which is equivalent to around seven to nine years — is “appropriate.”
Not sure that’s enough time considering the gravity of the offense, but it’s not nothing either. Stone has tried the patience of Judge Amy Berman Jackson a thousand times with his bizarre antics during the trial. I hope it comes back to bite him on the ass later this month and that the perp walk is televised.
PS: I looked up Stone’s age to figure out if 7-9 years would amount to a life sentence in his case and was surprised to learn he’s 67. Since he looks like an indifferently drawn cartoon villain, it’s hard to guess his age from his appearance, but I figured he was pushing 80 because he’s been a boil on the butt of American democracy since I was a small child. Stone must have been a ratfuck prodigy.
ETA: I’ve been avoiding Trump’s Twitter feed for health reasons, but he weighed in on Stone’s sentence recommendation during the wee hours this morning:
This is a horrible and very unfair situation. The real crimes were on the other side, as nothing happens to them. Cannot allow this miscarriage of justice!
Trump also retweeted some wingnut who said the proposed sentence would be “an unhinged miscarriage of justice.”
ETA2: Velveeta Voldemort gets mad, and Barr scurries to make it go away.
The DOJ is changing its sentencing recommendation for Roger Stone, according to a Senior DOJ official.
“The Department finds seven to nine years extreme, excessive and grossly disproportionate," the source said, adding the DOJ will clarify its position on sentencing later today— Jake Gibson (@JakeBGibson) February 11, 2020
Out-fucking-rageous.
MattF
A born ratfucker (Wikipedia):
Jim, Foolish Literalist
as I recall, the story was that he was a college Republican in the Nixon years, at the same time as Rove but in different spheres, but all the names and times and long-terms past associations run together in a clusterfuck of sleazy mediocrities that never should have risen to the top. Kellyanne Conway pretty much went from Bill Maher’s August B-list of backup guests to the White House.
People are saying (you know, people) that the day after election day will be trump’s pardon-fest. I think they’ll be announced as soon as polls close in Wisconsin.
jonas
Trump will pardon the whole lot of them — Flynn, Manafort, Stone. Basically whoever doesn’t start snitching at some point. And then we have a constitutional crisis (yes, I know…another one) on our hands because can the presidential pardon power be used to obstruct justice? Which is precisely what Trump would be doing. Barr’s DOJ will say yes, of course, go nuts, the president is an absolute monarch. Can Congress do anything?
gvg
Is Stone being sentenced in Federal or State court? I’d like Trump not to be able to pardon him.
Anonymous At Work
Trump’s already setting up the pardon by being “outraged” that Stone might get so long a sentence.
Betty Cracker
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Yeah, I’ve wondered about a pardon and the timing. Trump’s pardons so far seem largely performative; I don’t think he personally gave a shit about D’Souza, Arpaio or the war criminals, but he knows it plays well with the base.
Stone may be different in that he’s probably the closest thing a creature like Trump has to a friend. Is Stone a big hero in MAGAland? I honestly don’t know.
germy
I’m glad this didn’t happen:
bemused
A pretty good guess a guy who has a huge tattoo of Nixon’s face on his back must be at least in his late 60’s.
MattF
@jonas: Possibly. Although Trump’s pardons to date have been focused on political questions, I.e., freeing racists and war criminals, rather than on freeing particular individuals.
laura
I’d bet a shiny nickel wager that the pardon list will include Stone, Manafort, Flynn and sheriff Joe (once more with feeling as an F-yoooo!) before all is said and done.
Baud
I don’t think a grateful Stone thanking Donald J. Trump for his pardon would make a compelling Super Bowl commercial.
germy
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Betty Cracker: I’m not sure that Trump would pardon them if he loses re-election, he really doesn’t value loyalty. He’d be out the door so why would he care.
@jonas: Congress can’t review Presidential pardons, remember the Marc Rich pardon by Clinton at the end of his term?
ruemara
@germy: charming.
We’re going to have to demand punishment for the sedition & shout down the media making it into partisan payback.
Tazj
I’m honestly shocked that Roger Stone is only 67 because he looks so much older or maybe it’s because I knew he had some association with Nixon. I remember when Bill Maher considered him a harmless bon vivant and didn’t want him going to jail.
I can’t imagine spending your life scheming for Trump and people like him. Stone has certainly caused enormous problems for this country and I hope he’s held accountable.
germy
@ruemara: That photo of the proposed statue! I’m not sure why they thought it’d be a good idea.
Nicole
Depressing thoughts about how many will get away without appropriate punishment, but an excellent ear worm for the day.
trollhattan
Whatever the emoji is for chef’s kiss, ? here’s one for that title.
Trump ain’t letting Stone serve that sentence whatever the court decides.
Omnes Omnibus
In the issue of pardons, yes, the president is virtually an absolute monarch. It is one of the few places that the Framers placed that kind of power in the hands of the presidency.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
@ruemara:
Is it possible to shout down the media?
germy
@Nicole: Odd trivia: The man who wrote that song also wrote the “Mary Tyler Moore Theme”
Omnes Omnibus
@germy: You win some, you lose some.
Another Scott
@bemused:
Speaking of tattoos… Comic.
I wouldn’t be surprised…
Cheers,
Scott.
West of the Rockies
I do suspect that Stone has ingested a lot of drugs and alcohol. I think that ages the guts and brain. He might be 67, going on 80.
Another Scott
Oh, and Warning – Politico: It looks like Flynn won’t be sentenced any time soon, also too.
:-/
Cheers,
Scott.
Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)
I immediately thought of the DK version when I saw this:
Drinkin’ beer in the hot sun
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
I needed sex and I got mine
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
The law don’t mean shit
If you got the right friends
That’s how this county’s run
Twinkies are the best friend I ever had
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
I blew George and Harvey’s brains out with my
Six gun!
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
Gonna write my book and make a million
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
I’m the new folk hero of the Ku Klux Klan
My cop friend thinks it’s fun
You can get away with murder if you got a badge
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
I fought the law and
I won
I AM the law so I won
kindness
DailyKos has a piece up now that says Trump has threatened to Pardon Stone if he gets any time. Does that mean it’ll be liberals that bring back lynching in order to get justice? Hope not. Doing nothing isn’t a viable alternative either though.
Betty Cracker
Post updated to include Trump’s middle-of-the-night tweets on the topic. Sounds like he’ll move to pardon Stone immediately if the judge follows the prosecution’s sentence recommendations. But since he’s a sociopath with the attention span of a fruit fly, who knows?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@kindness: It’s Roger Stone, I’m sure he’s done plenty of other shit than what he was charged with.
the Conster
How on earth do we punish Barr for being a mob enforcer/traitor/all around sleaze? How can there be any justice for anyone with him in that job?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Betty Cracker: true about his attention span, but he seems to have a mind like a steel trap for grudges and people who could be a threat to him (I think). I think Stone, Rudi and maybe Manafort and Flynn know where some bodies are buried. They’re ideologues enough to be patient, but not endlessly…
bemused
@Another Scott:
Perfect although trump should have several other tattoos of murdering dictators surrounding putin.
germy
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: He divides the human race into two camps: those who are loyal to him, and those who are not. He wants to reward the loyalists and punish the disloyal.
Immanentize
@Betty Cracker: If that is the case, there is no reason that the Judge should not give him the Max allowable under the guidelines with a long detailed sentencing order outlining the value of citizen jurors and community values in trials in this country.
germy
How long does the gag order last on Roger Stone?
Immanentize
@germy: There is no longer a gag order, after conviction, but not even Stone is foolish enough to fuck with a federal judge before sentencing. It was all fun and games for him until, “GUILTY!”
germy
@Immanentize:
trollhattan
@West of the Rockies:
Roids, just for starters. His innards probably look like he’s maintained a Drano diet.
sdhays
@Baud: I think it would be very compelling. Nauseating, but that’s compelling in it’s own way.
Eolirin
@germy: Trump demands loyalty but he doesn’t respect it. Everyone is disposable, the only person that ever matters is him.
sdhays
@?BillinGlendaleCA: They are definitely getting pardons when he loses the election because he himself is deeply implicated in crimes and he needs them to keep their mouths shut so that he doesn’t end up in prison too.
West of the Rockies
@trollhattan:
To go a little dark, I take great pleasure in the likelihood that I will take public note of the deaths of Trump, Stone, Giuliani, Barr, Bannon, et al.
topclimber
IANAL but I have read here before that a pardon indicates acceptance of guilt. I think it shields the pardoned from double jeopardy (so no state level prosecutions in many places). But what about civil cases? Might the DNC and a few others screwed by Stone now have a much better chance of getting damages against him?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@sdhays: How would that work? If they get a pardon, they wouldn’t have any 5th amendment jeopardy, as least to the crimes they received a pardon. If they lied, they could be charged with perjury.
Nicole
@germy: I did not know that. That’s excellent trivia!
Just One More Canuck
@germy:
also one of the Crickets
Roger Stone looks like the original Homer Simpson from the Tracey Ullman
kindness
Actually someone who has been pardoned by the president is not allowed to plead the 5th in any following court proceeding regarding the matter. So Trump could pardon them but that won’t help Trump if they ever come after him. They will be forced to testify or they can be sent to jail for contempt.
wvng
Maddow’s last segment last night described how Barr’s new USA for DC, just installed a week ago, filed a motion on SUNDAY asking the judge in Flynn’s case to put off sentencing him indefinitely. That motion was the ONLY motion associated with the Stone prosecution that did not include the name of the prosecutor who has been handling the case from the beginning. I have not been able to find any additional information about this.
Betty Cracker
A new development, fellow citizens:
So, Trump erupts on Twitter, and his personal attorney Barr makes it go away. What a load of horse shit. Hope the judge throws the goddamned book at Stone, assuming she has that discretion.
Baud
@Betty Cracker:
She does.
Kay
@Betty Cracker:
Gross. At this point it’s on the lawyers at the DOJ. They have an independent duty act ethically. They’re all violating it.
We know the Trump hires are all low quality. We now find out if all the rest are also low quality.
At some point they have to decide. This is that point. Trump isn’t an intelligence test, he’s a character test. They’re failing.
Spadizzly
@bemused: Interesting. Until now I was convinced that Stone’s entire face was tattooed with Nixon’s ass.
MattF
@Betty Cracker: Because ‘contempt of court’ is now considered to be a mitigating factor in sentencing. Right up there with lack of remorse.
Kay
@Betty Cracker:
I wonder how humiliating it is to be a federal prosecutor and find yourself taking orders from these crooks. It’s almost as if Trump and Barr deliberately humiliate them- they make the order public. They’re probably authentically law ‘n order types, or were. Trump and Barr want to show they’ve captured them.
Kay
I watched McMillions the other night. It’s a great story and it’s very well done, but I wonder how much of its success depends on people wanting to think of law enforcement and prosecutors as working for The People. You watch that and then you watch the sleazy Trump lawyer-crew and it seems like a bygone age. Honest FBI agents, a hard charging prosecutor, a corporation that says “we owe it to our customers to catch these crooks”.
These people seem to spend all their times protecting lawbreakers rather than prosecuting them.
Probably a great time to pull off a sweepstakes heist or really any other white collar crime. You’ll get away with it.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kay: all the FormerFederalPRosecutors on MSNBC who speak, convincingly, of their love for the DOJ as an institution, the power and meaning of the oath they take, the veneration for the rule of law, the (decreasingly) confident predictions that the “career professionals” will never stand for this sort of courruption….
The lack of whistleblowers is disheartening, but as we’ve seen, people can barely bestir themselves from the Masked Singers to pay attention to the abuses of power the sonofabitch got impeached for.
Betty Cracker
@Kay: You’re right: it’s a character test, and so far, non-political appointees at the State Dept. are passing and those at the DOJ are failing.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Oh, it makes me sad. I’m not naive. We had a prosecutor here who was actually removed for corruption and I know they’re not all “white hats”, but just as an ordinary lawyer it makes me sad.
Is it worth it? They really want to trade all their integrity and the credibility of that institution to protect these douchebags? Trump has absolute contempt for them and their work. If it were up to him, as he told us yesterday, we would have “Chinas” justice system. He likes that idea because he loves executing people.
Kay
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
The justice system only works because 99% of people follow the rules. I had a law school professor who said “we can’t put a cop in every kitchen”, and we can’t. The thing only functions at all because there are far fewer lawbreakers than law abiders. It’s credible. We accept it as a rule. Without credibility they are lost. It’s all they really have. Just to piss it away like this, like it has no value? I don’t get it.
randy khan
@sdhays:
I’m not convinced he thinks about things that deeply. He might think of a pardon as a reward for loyalty, to the extent he thinks loyalty is anything more than what he deserves.
And a pardon can be a two-edged sword. If you’ve been pardoned for past crimes, you no longer have the ability to invoke the 5th Amendment, so you can be forced to testify and are subject to criminal contempt. Again, not that I’m convinced he’d think that deeply about it.
Kay
@Betty Cracker:
My husband thinks it’s physical exposure. Like you “catch” crime from the Trump people and if you’re in Brussels or wherever you’re not infected :)
randy khan
@Betty Cracker:
Oh, she absolutely has discretion to ignore the sentencing memo. And she probably won’t be thrilled with the DoJ for suggesting that someone who tried to tamper with witnesses doesn’t deserve a max sentence, especially after the initial memo said he did.
(By the way, they’re still, three years in, and with a guy who supposedly knows all the tricks in charge, too incompetent to have insisted on seeing the sentencing memo before it was filed by the career people. Thank goodness for that.)
MattF
@randy khan: Right. There’s a possibility that Trump will tweet something, and then his lawyers will say, ‘umm, wait a minute’. He’ll still get credit for owning the libs, so it’s all OK.
Ruckus
@Another Scott:
trump would have his own ugly mug tattooed there, being the narcissist he is. That way you could see his ugly coming and going. Good for complete stomach emptying, coming or going.
Another Scott
@Kay:
(via nycsouthpaw)
Cheers,
Scott.
Ruckus
@germy:
He wants loyalists to remain that and traitors he wants punished. Only one he thinks about rewards for is himself.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Kay: oh, I didn’t mean to suggest you were naive, more that I can almost see Chuck Rosenberg’s and Joyce Vance’s hearts break as they realize that they were, at least, overly idealistic about their former colleagues.
Rosenberg resigned before he could be fired after writing a public letter to his staff at DEA correcting trump’s call for police brutality (“would you do me a favor? could you take your hand away when you’re helping them into the car?”)
LongHairedWeirdo
Someone help me out here. Wouldn’t this normally be a serious issue, the President interfering the DOJ for personal reasons?
I mean, I’m not crazy, right? I know it’s unlawful for the President to try to stop or impede and investigation, even if his purpose *is not* to cover up a real crime; it’s obstruction of justice to stop or impede an investigation, period, even if we think you’re a crybaby who can’t handle being helped by the Russians.
And I know the Dems didn’t pursue that because the right wing noise machine already had their talking points all set up and pre-delivered by Bill “should-be dis-“Barr”ed”.
I know this would be frowned up by any ethical political caucus (so, not by the GOP since 1994, at the least), and sure, we can’t expect them to pay attention to the law, or political standards, or anything other than their political popularity, because that’s what, e.g., the founders wanted for the Senate, a bunch of scared children desperately afraid of a popularity contest that came about too often, right?
Oh, that’s kind of the opposite, isn’t it? Well, I guess the GOP doesn’t worship the founders or the Constitution.
Where was I? Right: wasn’t personally getting involved in a DOJ case, for one’s own interests (including getting a friend off), always wrong? Or is this just another case of “sure, Trump can’t take *BRIBES*, that’s DIRTY MONEY, but if he gets paid through his HOTELS, it’s CLEAN… laundered, you might say. So it’s okay that the President gets his nice, clean, money, from foreign actors, with none of that emoluments – who’s ever heard of *that* word before? – crap!”)
More seriously: wouldn’t the GOP have screamed about this if a Democrat did it? What would their basis have been? Hissy fit (i.e.: nothing), or would there be actual reason?
burnspbesq
What I’d really like to see in response to this is for Pelosi to say “not one dime for DOJ as long as Barr is Attorney General.”
Use that power of the purse, Aunt Nancy.
Baud
The career prosecutor has resigned.
E.
Okay so it’s now officially a banana republic. Good to know.