As I’ve told you, we will be moving to the brand spanking new site sometime between 6 November to 8 November, and while most of the stuff is done by the developers and Watergirl, I am still working on writing up a new commenting policy. Much to the chagrin of Watergirl, who wants everything done yesterday (even if she does not yell at me I know she is screaming on the inside- I have that effect on women), I’ve been tossing it around in my head for six months, how I want to handle things, how I want us to move forward, etc. In fairness, that is how I write everything- by letting it bounce around my thick skull for a while and then I just blurt it all out. At any rate, I still have not finished the policy, and will circulate it among the front pagers before implemented, but recent events have led me to believe we need to have a chat.
Obviously, and this is no mystery to anyone here, I don’t read the comments as much as I used to. For years, I responded to almost every comment directed my way, and spent hours upon hours mixing it up. I just don’t have the time to do that anymore, and some times I just get burnt out with it all and need a break. We’re coming up on 20 years as a blog, and I don’t know if you realize it, 20 years for a blog is A LONG FUCKING TIME. Most digital magazines only last a year or two, to give you an idea. So I do what I have to do to stay fresh, or as close to it as reasonably possible. A lot of times I go to write posts these days, and Betty Cracker or Mistermix or Anne Laurie or someone else has already not only addressed what I wanted to talk about, but did a better job than I would have.
I’m rambling. At any rate, I want to talk about how we treat each other in the comments. As always, you are free to say, within limits, whatever the fuck you want in the comments. Obviously there are some things we will not tolerate, like racist, sexist, and other wise bigoted bullshit. But my overall philosophy has been you are, within limits, able to post whatever you want, because it only reflects on you. When you say stupid shit, you’re the one who is standing out in public with your pants around your ankles looking the fool, not me. We’re not going to delete comments, we’re not going to censor you, and if people don’t want to hear your rambling nonsense, well, that’s why we have the pie filter (ALL HAIL CLEEK!).
Having said that, I do want to caution you that it appears we are all strung out from year 67 (that is how long he has been President, right?) of the Trump Presidency and the never-ending cavalcade of nonsense and the ceaseless barrage of mean-spiritedness and overall nastiness, and appear at times to be taking it out on each other. I’d like you to think about how you treat your fellow commenters, and try to, in the words of Melania, BE BEST. There’s no reason for pile-ons of decent people who you just happen to disagree with. Just because you don’t value one person’s insight doesn’t mean there aren’t others who love them. I’m speaking in general, but more specifically I saw MomSense take a heap of abuse and there have been others. There’s just no need for that. It’s not your job to tone police the comments, or to drive off people who don’t agree with you. There’s no need to assume that because someone lurves them some Bernie or has a full on crush for Biden (both positions I personally find mystifying) is just a troll or trying to hurt Democrats or what not. Just stop it with the bad faith stuff.
This place is supposed to be a community and a safe haven. Try to be good to one another. Try to keep that every person typing, even if their screen name is LordFartDaddy, is an actual living, breathing, sentient human being, with feelings and emotions and a life of their own. You don’t know how bad their day has been. You don’t know what they are struggling with on an hourly basis. Try not to fuck with them. Let’s use this space to help each other, help liberal causes, and vent when we need to. Let’s try to be better about not tearing each other down and getting at each other’s throats. And this goes for commenters and front pagers.
Or else I’m gonna have to fuck one or more of you up. Steve hasn’t eaten since noon, people. This is not an idle threat.
Nicole
Thanks for the reminder, Cole. Much appreciated.
(And again, the new site is soooo beautiful! I fear I’ll never get anything else useful accomplished in my life once it debuts. Watergirl, et al, did a fantastic, fantastic job.)
cokane
hear hear
almost all of the dem nominees should be perfectly acceptable to everyone here, imo. most definitely the top ones. people need to be a little more generous to folks on our side, even if their priorities aren’t precisely like yours.
Chris
::grabs the popcorn::
Ella in New Mexico
I really appreciate this post, John. Just like 2016 we’re gearing up for a rough Primary season, and there’s absolutely no doubt a lot of intense feelings will be swirling. I’d hate to see things revert to like they got back then–lots of really hurtful, personal attacks against commenters based on who they support, positions they took, perceived race or gender or age, etc. The blog has gotten so much better since those times, it would really suck to watch it all devolve again.
So here’s to 2019-2020 and the community we have here at Balloon Juice! And save the mean, vile, snarky foul-mouthed insults for Twitter for which they are perfect lolol
Martin
Pics please. The blurrier the better.
sphex
Delurking for perhaps the 7th time in 18 years to tell you how very much I appreciate you, John, and what you’ve created here.
Martin
Thank you for setting the tone, John. A rebuild is a great time to get everyone to introspect a bit on how they behave. I don’t understand why the other commenters here continue to support their garbage candidates instead of the obvious choice, so hopefully your wise words will hit home.
Mary G
Thank goodness for WaterGirl. I hope you are paying her.
Thank you for these words, but everybody is stressed as hell and I hope we can disagree without personal attacks.
Eunicecycle
@sphex: Me too! I mostly lurk but find this is one place I return to, where people are kind and generous to each other. And love animals, and have so many interesting hobbies and professions. I don’t usually have a lot to add, but I check in several times a day.
Josie
Bless your heart, John Cole.
Mary G
!!!!!!!!!!! ?????!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hardball! I saw that Sondland back into the SCIF to read his testimony again. Evidently all the witnesses can do that. I imagine his lawyer with him, facepalming on every third line.
Mary G
@Mary G: It was the other Castro brother, in writing:
Gravenstone
@Martin:
You’re just spoiling for a fight, aren’t you?
randy khan
I’m okay with getting my hair mussed (as General Ripper would have said), but I do think this is a better place when people start by assuming that others are acting in good faith until proven otherwise. We all (including me, to be clear) need to remember who our actual friends and enemies are, and treat them accordingly.
And, lest I look like an ungrateful lout, let me say I am very appreciative that I have this space that connects so many of my interests. There really aren’t that many lefty politics/pet blogs out there, after all. The canning and preserving stuff is just a bonus.
Rand Careaga
I do think that the Age of Trump has rubbed our nerves raw, and since most of us take it in via the intertubes, it is here we are apt to vent, the better angels of our natures being prostrated with exhaustion.
Felanius Kootea
Thank you John.
Martin
@Gravenstone: Certainly not. Cole wants everyone to behave civilly, which obviously means supporting my candidate. Just do that and nobody needs to fight.
Thanks John!
Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.)
A-fucking-men.
Also, henceforth my new name is Lord Fartdaddy. All hail Lord Fartdaddy!
Ajabu
@Gravenstone:
Well, personally I support the obvious candidate. Obviously…
Skepticat
@Ella in New Mexico:
Seconded, and seconding JC too.
Why has Steve not eaten? Is he feeling all right?
raven
I’ve had my share of dustups and even gone too far from time to time. There was a commentator here that I ended up not being able to tolerate (he had lots of supporters) so I straight out told him I’d never comment on anything he said and I wanted the same from him. It worked out. I also thought Tommy got treated like shit here even thought he obviously had some “issues” that were hard to ignore. We need to go lightly.
Professor Bigfoot
Yer a good soul, John Cole.
Even if it’s deep inside a curmudgeonly curmudgeon.
p.a.
I can’t wait to pick out the palm trees to prove I’m not a bot. Exciting!
Virginia
Love how you run the joint. Am happy with what you do to make this an accommodating and inclusive place.
Mostly lurking, occasionally commenting,
V
Ksmiami
@Chris: Thank you kind and wise blogmaster- We all live eachother here and need to focus on ousting the true enemy
kindness
John’s a basically moderate/conservative guy with a liberal’s values. He has heart. Something modern conservatives don’t any more. That’s one of the reasons we love him. It’s your show John. We appreciate that you humor us.
glory b
Remember, on the internet, no one can see you roll your eyes.
(An adaptation of the famous comic, “In the internet, no one knows you’re a dog.”)
Major Major Major Major
I… definitely read this as meaning ‘chat feature’ until like two paragraphs later when you hadn’t gotten to talking about chat yet. Was surprised. Phew!
Mary G
LA Times reporter goes to the area of Brentwood near the Getty evacuated due to the fire.
These are the “lazy immigrants” that Republicans bitch about. It’s telling that a lot of rich people took off without bothering to notify the help. They were apologetic when contacted by the reporter, mostly because they had been contacted by the reporter.
Mnemosyne
I quite honestly don’t have a strong candidate preference, except that I want to see the hangover from 2016 drop out. Other than that, I would be perfectly happy with pretty much anyone on offer. ?♀️
That may change as the field narrows and the Russian bots line up behind a new chaos candidate, but that’s where I am today.
zhena gogolia
@Major Major Major Major:
Oh, wouldn’t that be fun?
We did have some kind of version of that during one of the debates or elections, remember?
Aziz, light!
Right on, Cole. Everything you said should be common sense.
MomSense
Woah, thanks John. Judging by his recent photos, I can’t believe Steve has room in that belly of his for jackal- but I’m not going to risk it.
Been very busy. There are 400 refugee families from DR Congo and Senegal who are facing their first Maine winter. Bunch of knitters here are making hats, scarves, and mittens. It has been a lot of fun making woolens and making friends with our new neighbors.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mnemosyne:
kinda where I am, I see great strengths and troubling flaws in all the candidate
I’m glad Baud is coming back, I hope MomSense does too
(does this mean I have to be nice to Dwight?)
Cheap Jim
Mr Cole, I served with LordFartDaddy. I knew LordFartDaddy. LordFartDaddy was a friend of mine. You’re no LordFartDaddy.
feebog
Really appreciate the comments John. This joint really is a refuge for many of us: we.need to nurture it and each other. Now go feed the damn cat.
zhena gogolia
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
She’s right on top of you.
AliceBlue
@Mary G: As Charlie Pierce said, Sondland’s up to his knees in the Great Grimpen Mire, sinking fast, and the hound is baying in the distance.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@zhena gogolia: @MomSense: I saw that, and was glad
Ceci n est pas mon nym
I’m still smarting from how successfully the Russian troll farm fomented fights and anti-Hillary sentiment in various liberal forums, probably including this one. So I’m a little sensitized when a nym appears that I’ve never seen before and seems to be hell-bent on picking a fight over candidates. But I guess I can pledge not to greet them with tovarich right off the bat.
Mary G
Cole’s communication style has changed:
Same message, different words. I credit the sobriety, though I sometimes miss being called a fucker.
I do beg that we not feed the trolls. This still happens, and it’s annoying as fuck. Being responded to is their drug, even if you have the best facts, links, and logic on your side.
trollhattan
100% agree Trump has put us on the edgiest of edges that have ever edged, and an extended period of same has etched itself into our brains, not in a good way.
There is only one way to stop it, and the sad bit is some of the effects are irreversible.
SoupCatcher
@zhena gogolia:
So… we’re just not doing “Phrasing!” anymore?
Raven
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: who says Baud is coming back and why did they leave?
SiubhanDuinne
Thank you, John. For all of it.
TaMara (HFG)
@MomSense: I love that!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: you make me think of ’08, when a few blogs went apeshit, notably MyDD, where I may or may not have been one of the shit-flingers. I went looking for some of the pro-PUMA blogs during 2016– where were all those passionate HRC supporters who ready to burn it all down? I wasn’t seeing any of the nyms or blogs set up after the strike (remember the strike?). Now I wonder if any of those were a dry run for 2016
Mary G
@MomSense: So happy to read this.
Ladyraxterinok
Just a comment about comment threads—remember the thread where there was an extremely long debate/argument over ‘who killed the princes in the tower?’
As someone commented then ‘Where else can you find a ‘discussion’ over a centuries old mystery/ scandal being pursued with all the fervor raised by the latest US political scandal?’
This blog —host, frontpagers, commentors —is a major treasure
TaMara (HFG)
@Mary G: This was literally my first thought as I read this.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Raven: I’m not good enough to link to a comment, but they popped up in this thread. Comment 69
@SoupCatcher: I was gonna ask that, but I didn’t know if it fit in with the new decaf tone around here, which I give sixteen hours
TaMara (HFG)
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: God bless that strike, it’s how I ended up here. John’s takedown on the strike was a thing of beauty.
Zelma
Funny that you posted this about commenting civility today. I am an inveterate consumer of news and commentary and, against the advice of friends and family, I often read the comments. (Well, except at Kos; I can’t stand the way the comments keep on indenting.)
I was wondering today how Balloon Juice manages to keep out the trolls which I very much appreciate. (Does any one remember Bob? I wonder what happened to him.) I don’t comment much and, since nobody ever goes after me, I guess my comments are pretty bland. And I have observed those times when things get a bit hot and heavy and I’m sorry when someone chooses to leave after a disagreement.
But I think that this is a primarily very friendly place. I’ve been coming here for over 12 years now, and it’s the first place I visit when I log on and the last place I check when I’m about to log off. And I read just about every comment. Well, except for the gardening entries; I have a brown thumb and I hate to feel inadequate.
We may disagree on the how or who but we all want the same thing: we want our country back. And we are all, as John noted, on edge. This is a special place. So let’s all get along but not too well. After all, what’s the fun of that.
Lock him up!
LordFartDaddy
@Josie: I see what you did there.
different-church-lady
“Be decent or I feed you to the cat” — If it doesn’t become a rotating tag line you’re just weak.
Mary G
Another smoking gun in the warehouse:
Marcopolo
@Martin: Wait, when did Oscar the Grouch enter the race? If he’s running he is definitely my garbage can didate.
funlady75
thanks John, master blogger…..
Msilaneous
God bless you, John Cole. That’s right, I said it!
MisterForkbeard
Allright, I’m considering changing my name to MisterFartDaddy when the new site hits. I see no downsides.
Regarding the actual topic at hand: Agreed. We all need to calm down and remember we’re on the same side, with the exception of a few obvious concern trolls. Most of the longtime commenters here are fantastic, and even many of you new people are all right. It’s good to remember that. :)
@Mary G: I find myself COMPLETELY unsurprised by this. Considering that they have a literal recording of the call and chose to give us a “non-verbatim readout” it was pretty unsurprising. But then, it would also be helpful if Vindman told the House what was excised – and I’m sure he has it in writing, too.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mary G:
Huh. How about that?
the tapes are in the server
different-church-lady
@Josie: I recently interviewed a bilingual Muslim woman who was born in Lebanon but raised in Mississippi. I asked how she would say “Bless his heart” in Arabic and she cracked up.
Mary G
@MisterForkbeard: Yep, he’s got “takes comprehensive notes” written all over him, and I hope he told the committee exactly what they took out, and will repeat it during the public hearings. You know it’s bad if even the dullards at the WH knew to put it on the double-secret server.
seefleur
Delurking to say that THIS is why I keep coming back to this little ol’ blog site – filled with all kinds of gems and other sparkly shit/stuff. The jackals in spite of some of their collective idiosyncrasies are an awesome bunch – and it shines through, sometimes in amazing/amusing ways, but the passion and compassion are what keep me coming back here. Kudos to the bloghost and all those who frequent this place. I will keep reading and appreciating you all no matter what changes happen to the site. (I work for a state government and have become inured to weirdness in technology based on a variety of “the greater good for the greater number” reasoning – although in this case, I think it’s going to be a good thing!) Carry on!
geg6
Fuck off, Cole. ;-)
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
I admit I haven’t been a nice person at times here. I remember looking back at comments I made from 2 years ago and they were absolutely terrible. I was in a dark place then re: the 2016 election, not that that was an excuse.
I’m glad that commenters here at BJ have given me second chances to improve. I’ll try to do the same from now on. Glad to see Baud and MomSense commenting again!
Marcopolo
Also too, thanks for the blog John & and thanks fellow BJers for creating such great community.
zhena gogolia
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
You’re always nice.
rivers
Another lurker here – I really appreciate what you wrote, John. This is my first stop every morning and it’s because 1) there are so many great front-pagers – I love the twitter roundup and Adam’s insights, among many others 2) I know that you -curmudgeon and mensch – are the presiding spirit of the place and 3) I really enjoy the community. Despite the pile ons you rightly warn against, it remains one of the friendliest and most interesting group of people on the web. Thanks again.
Aleta
Yay MomSense. Baud’s bac? What a day!
Real person Karen Potter in N. CA, please come back too. Hope you are safe from fires.
JaySinWA
May I recommend Wheaten’s law as our policy:
Don’t be a dick.
ETA Violators will be Steved.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@Mary G:
Was there an official internal transcript made or is this a mistake on the writer of that tweet, calling the call summary released by the WH, a “transcript”? If the latter, I can’t imagine it looking worse than it already is
Quaker in a Basement
Jonah comments here?
J R in WV
@randy khan:
And no mention of the mushroom hunting, by one of the most valuable members of the B-J staff!!!! Take that for leaving out such an important part of foraging and preserving food!!!
;-)
I agree with everything from Blog Lord Cole and all the regular commenters. There are trolls, and that is what the pie filter is for. You all take care, and be good!
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??
@zhena gogolia:
I try to be. Thanks ^^
Nelle
@MomSense: My brother-in-law is Congolese and the kids mostly grew up there. I’m so glad you are welcoming them with such kindness.
Old Dan and Little Ann
This is the only place in the world I can complain that my cousin lurves him some Tulsi in 2020. Oi!
stinger
Thanks, John Cole.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
TS (the original)
@Mary G: Just being discussed by Rachel Maddow
Millard Filmore
@MisterForkbeard:
This looks like a good time to declare I will be known as Mallard Filmore on the new site.
different-church-lady
You know I love you all like family.
Of course, all my family ever does is shout at each other, so…
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Katttails
I first linked here from Wonkette, to a Cole post entitled Peak Wingnut. Which certainly set the tone for optimism, given that it was probably under the Dubya reign. I spend far too many waking hours here and greatly appreciate all of it. It’s in my maybe top 50 things to endow when I hit Powerball. However, threats of Steve do not greatly a-fear me since I have many methods for turning on cat purr motors.
O. Felix Culpa
You all are better than my family of origin and almost as good as my family of choice. So there’s that. Long live the jackaltariat!
Mr. Longform
This is one of the better online communities for an old, leftish, semi-housetrained, grumpy white male. I am not John Cole.
TS (the original)
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??: The process is being described on Rachel. There is no recording, edit: but transcribers transcribe the call (missed a little, there is auto transcription, which the transcribers correct). Because they don’t necessarily understand some of the language, the experts in the field who are also listening take notes and can (under previous administrations DO) update the transcript. Some of the updates by Vindman were not included in the official transcript.
The information on the call, released by the White house was not the official transcript & it now appears the said official transcript omitted some details.
Ohio Mom
@raven: I went out of my way to be nice to Tommy, mainly because he set my autism radar off at ear-splitting levels. Like so many spectrumites I know, so eager to be liked and fit in, so clueless and inept socially. Sigh.
@MomSense: Someone in the “Where Are You Baud?” thread mentioned you’d been scarce, so I am glad to hear you are fine. Must say I feel for anyone about to experience their first winter, let alone a Maine winter. I imagine the first snow will be marveled at, but after a few more… Well, what an accomplishment it will be for them to get through it.
On the topic of John’s post, needless to say, I agree wholeheartedly. The Trump years are wearing and infuriating, and I know it is all getting to me. I skip a lot of threads because I have to pace myself, else I would fall into a dark place.
And then I miss the old days, when threads were lighter. But we wouldn’t be who we are if we weren’t besides ourselves about the pickle our country is in.
In the meantime, I try to hold onto the moments when we are at our best, for a recent one, when everyone rallied around the Immp.
TS (the original)
@randy khan:
Only two that I now read – and lots of cross postings. Pre 2008 election, I followed at least a dozen. BJ keeps me sane in terms of current politics.
Mary G
@??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) ??:
mrmoshpotato
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Death threats from fascist Trump trash no doubt.
Raven
@Ohio Mom: It was not our finest hour.
zhena gogolia
@Ohio Mom:
I felt so sad for him.
Miss Bianca
@MomSense: Glad you are back.
Been thinking about as you as I’ve been breaking out the magenta pu*ssy hat you knitted me, for that three-day snow storm TaMara was grousing about downstairs. (It’s my log-splitting hat, but I’ve been wearing it downtown too.) Keeps me warm and snug. Can’t imagine what it would be like for refugees facing a Maine winter! Thanks for helping to look after them!
RAVEN
Proof of life
“Baudsays:
October 29, 2019 at 4:51 pm
I’ll be back. /ArnoldTounge
Y’all are too kind. (I can’t believe you guys got Cole involved.) It’ll just be a few more days”
frosty
@Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.):
HAIL!!!
(was that loud enough?)
ETA I bet you’re tired of typing your nym!
raven
So what about people like at TenPgulge or whatever it is? Dude is a fucking troll but people seem to want to bandy words with it.
Starfish
@Gravenstone: I can only presume that he means he does not understand why anyone supports any candidates that are not named Baud.
Katttails
?? Seem to be stuck in moderation even though I offered to endow the place with some of my soon to be realized fabulous winnings from the next gigantic-prize lottery ticket I buy. Geez. May have to rescind that even if it means Steve goes hungry.
Rose Weiss
I was a refugee from the horrible 2004 primary fights over at DK. Someone there mentioned Balloon Juice and I’ve been mostly lurking around here ever since. The level of viciousness during those primaries was astonishing, and I hope we don’t get there again. I still check in at DK now and then, but BJ is where I come first thing every morning to see what’s going on. John Cole, you’re a treasure.
mrmoshpotato
@Lord Fartdaddy (Formerly, Mumphrey, Smedley Darlington Mingobat, et al.): Ok…but you asked for it.
*farts in your general direction*
mrmoshpotato
@Starfish: +1
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
@TS (the original): me too, a lot of ‘smaller’ bloggers are more or less just tweeting now, the above-mentioned MyDD is long gone, I can’t remember the last time I looked at DKos, J Marshall’s stuff is mostly paywall (and then tweeted)…
David ??Booooooo?? Koch
NotMax
Who are you, what have you done with John G. Cole, and how much ransom are you asking?
Amir Khalid
I’ve been commenting here for something like a decade. I’ve stayed because this is a very welcoming place — so welcoming it wouldn’t let me leave, not unlike the Hotel California. And because you lot have been wittily supportive of my late-in-life musical endeavours, too.
I am ambivalent about trolls. I’ve had my share of tangling with them: my least favourite was the supremely vile Ted & Hellen. On a good day, they’re part of the show. On a bad day they’re very smart at starting fights among the jackaltariat. I think gratuitous aggression toward other commenters should be a timeout offence, and persistent gratuitous aggression should be grounds for a permanent ban. Then again I worry that it’s too easy to forget our serenity in these frazzled and frazzling times, to lose our shit and call someone we merely dislike/disagree with a troll. So I try not to.
By the way, I’ve missed some site features recently. The arrows in the lower right corner disappeared a few days ago. Before that the comment editor quit loading for me, and now even the comment countdown clock has vanished. What’s up with that?
J R in WV
Must admit, I spend more time here than anywhere else on the Innertubes. LGM is second, not as much fun as I’m closer to the other participants here than the folks on LGM, for the most part.
The trolls get to me pretty bad, and sometimes I do catch fire and dump on people I would otherwise say were my inline friends. I apologize for that. I have tried to calm down, and think I have done pretty well the past few months.
Mary G
Former NSC staffer for both the GWB and Obama admins:
satby
You’re a mensch Cole. And you’re right. But I kind of miss the old Cole rant style showcased here: @Mary G:
J R in WV
@Amir Khalid:
I have all those features in Firefox running on Ubuntu 18.0.4 of something like that. Don’t worry it will all go away when the new release shows up next Tues…er, uh, Thorsd… whenever.
Amir Khalid
@raven:
I think Tenguphule is more asshole than troll.
Jeffro
Wait…we’re still allowed to pile on Gabbard, Williamson, and Sestak, right?
GO NATS!
satby
@raven: honestly, even he had some non-trolly comments. And I miss CornerStone too, though he may just have bugged out because we never seen to have sports threads anymore.
@Ohio Mom:
I think there’s a lot of us feeling that way.
frosty
@Amir Khalid: I haven’t seen TenguPhule for a couple of weeks (?) now. One evening the comments were so atrocious and I pied him for the second time and since then, nothing. Banhammer? Fed up with us? My pie launched him into another dimension? I dunno but it’s been a better place without the death porn.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Amir Khalid:
a rage-junkie
H.E.Wolf
Thank you to John for the reminder. I’ll do my best to do better.
Lots of good folks here! My warmest appreciation to you all.
HumboldtBlue
Is this confession?
I owe Rikyrah an apology.
I did 12 Pabst in penance.
CaseyL
Thanks, John. There have been times I’ve wanted to reach through and shake some people; no doubt others have felt that way about me.
Most, maybe all, of the really awful trolls are long gone. The ones who took over thread after thread, until I’d just scroll though the whole thing. Gone and mostly forgotten.
The new site will be so nice and shiny, let’s not bloody it :)
Amir Khalid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I don’t grok rage junkies. I find being angry very unpleasant.
Just One More Canuck
Thank you for creating this place, John
Mary G
@satby: I liked Corner Stone. Every so often I write “I shutter to think that…” just for him.
NotMax
@HumboldtBlue
Thought that was for the twelfth day of Christmas.
;)
Katttails
@Amir Khalid: I had the editor not work for me a few days ago, but then it did today, but the clock disappeared on my first comment but was back on the second. So it’s not just you. Still have arrows though.
Aleta
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: The intensity of these attacks is probably also a warning to other witnesses to step back, and a threat that people around them will suffer extreme stress if they don’t. As Katie Hill pointed out, protecting other people’s privacy becomes a serious consideration. I think the rabidness is intended to trigger all that. It works all the time to keep sexual assault victims quiet — not just for themselves but to protect parents, siblings, grandparents, partners.
Martin
So, good administrators when presented with a proposed policy and asked to lay out rules for implementation, give great attention to how a policy will be enforced.
This is the logical result of anti-abortion policy. How do you know if people are getting abortions or not? Well, track everyone’s periods! One of the reasons why Griswold was ruled in the manner it was is that while the idea of banning abortions might sound reasonable, the rulemaking to enforce that is just unacceptable.
It’s basically impossible to not go there for an abortion ban policy. That alone should be sufficient reason to not go to that policy, but I guess we’re going to have to learn this the hard way, once again.
Jeffro
@HumboldtBlue: Yes, but did you take a home run ball to the chest while holding on to all 12 of them?
(That would actually be a pretty funny commercial for any beer company brave enough to spoof Bud Light fan Jeff Adams. Some guy with like eighteen Millers or twenty Pabst in his hands, balanced on his head, in his back pocket, etc, taking a rocket of a hit to the noggin but not spilling a one).
Clearly I chose the wrong line of work… ;)
satby
@Mary G: ? I did too. His kid must be about in 8th grade now, CS was such a proud dad.
And because I thought Baud was giving us a clue or joke with the /ArnoldTounge I Googled that and now my head hurts.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Aleta: speaking of Katie Hill….
It’s almost as if GP– who announced or is rumored to be running for that seat– had some information about dirt on an opponent before it became public. Think of that.
MoxieM
@LordFartDaddy: Damn! late to the party, as always. And here I wanted to change my nym to LordFartDaddy. Maybe I’ll have to settle for LadyFartMom. Hmm, requires some serious deep thinking.
EAlbert
I know this is not quite an open thread, but I usually end up coming to the site at the end of the day and reading a lot of finished threads. I was hoping that some of you from the New England (and England itself) could help me with something. My mother’s mother came from Boston, my mom used to sing me a counting song (like The Twelve Days of Christmas). Each verse started:
I’ll sing you (number) ho, green grow the rushes go
What is your (number) ho?
The final answering verse is:
12 for the 12 apostles
11 for the 11 so went to heaven
10 for the 10 commandments
9 for the 9 bright shiners
8 for the April trainers
7 for the 7 stars in the sky
6 for the 6 proud walkers
5 for the symbols (cymbals?) at your door
4 for the gospel writers
Threee, threee, the wise men
2, 2 the little white boys, clothed all in green hose
1 is 1 and all alone and ever more shall be it so.
Is anyone else familiar with this song and if so, do you know what the verses stand for? Some, like 3, 4, 10, 11 and 12 are obvious. I could see 7 referring to the Pleiades (also known as the 7 sisters). 8 could I suppose referring to frequent April rain storms. As far as the others I don’t even have a good guess. Thanks in advance for any help you could give.
Steeplejack
@Katttails:
Aren’t you usually “Kattails” with two t’s, not three?
rekoob
Although I rarely comment, I follow the postings and discussion assiduously. I tend to be one of the “only talk when it improves the silence” types, and thanks to the front-pagers and others, I can keep my mouth shut. It’s usually been covered more eloquently and accurately by others before I get there. I learn a lot.
Jeffro
OT but you know who would make a great VP candidate for almost any of the Dem candidates? Tammy Duckworth.
Geez she would tear her GOP opponent up
Wolvesvalley
Chiming in late, as usual in the rare times I’ve commented since I first started lurking here in 2005. I just wanted to say that this place has been one of my main sources of sanity all that time. In spite of dust-ups, trolls, and occasional outbreaks of nastiness, I can think of probably hundreds of instances of caring, kindness, and compassion — to say nothing of a few downright rescues — among the jackaltariat. So thank you, John, for reaffirming what kind of community this should be (and mostly is).
West of the Rockies
Well, I for one welcome our new blog rules and overlords.
MoxieM
@Mary G: If you want to be cursed at, I can oblige. Monty Python style. The Abuse office. But only with permission, you understand, and not about anything serious. I miss living in the Boston environs, and have precious few opportunities to vent my rage at other drivers, so I could easily redirect. Goodness, the vocabulary I taught my youngster when she sat in the back seat. heh.
Aleta
@raven: Strange to say, but sometimes I wonder if the word-bandying is meant as much for the audience as for the target. Since it’s not that effective, it might fill a different need than appears. In the same way that regular comments can be part performance, part hopeful attempt at communication to the people we like. Sometimes bullies do that too.
Mary G
@Jeffro: Love her, but the VP position is kind of a waste of her talents. But finding another female disabled veteran immigrant who excels in triggering Republicans would be awesome. I proposed her for president during the Cadet Bone Spurs era and was told she is ineligible due to being born overseas. I think.
tomtofa
@zhena gogolia:
It’s one thing to be nice to each other, but lets remember this is a family blog ;-)
WaterGirl
@Mary G: Maybe I should put this in as a placeholder for John’s Comment Policy until he gets the new one written? It’s like John can time travel like Obama – he wrote this at the end of 2011 when a site rebuild was just a gleam in someone’s eye!
MoxieM
@EAlbert: Here you go. I’ve never heard this version.
Green Grow the Rushes is a traditional folk song. Very much the kind of thing they sing at Revels.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Mary G: she was born in Bangkok to an American-citizen father in the foreign service, roughly the situation as McCain and Cruz
Kattails
@Steeplejack: I am, usually, yes. A foolish consistency, hobgoblins and all that. Man, you are sharp at this hour. That’s probably why the first comment was stuck… (gently bangs head against keyboard)
WaterGirl
@Mary G: You may not want to do that in front of Omnes. I did. Once. :-)
Steeplejack
@EAlbert:
“Green Grow the Rushes, O.” The Wikipedia article is pretty good.
YouTube performance by King Solomon’s Singers.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@EAlbert: I know the song. First heard it performed in DC years ago, performed by banjo player / folk singer Cathy Fink, who was the guest artist with the chorus I was singing in.
It’s an old English song called “Green Grow the Rushes-O”. There’s a Wikipedia article on it. They have explanations for all the verses, though it’s Wikipedia so who knows how reliable that is.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
EAlbert
MoxieM
Thanks so much. My mother died a numbers who and I always wondered what the verses stood for.
Ascap_scab
Be excellent to each other. Party on dudes!
Mary G
@Martin: I just stole that to tweet many angry face emojis. Unfriggingbelievable.
On a lighter note, Cinderblock the reluctant water exercising cat, has lost 0.3 pounds in the first week of her rehab. She plays like my tuxedo cat:
--bd
Sometimes, people need a word of encouragement and thanks and acknowledgement. Thank you John and the web team for keeping this island of sanity floating when sanity seems in short supply. Since Dana Houle and I were in the high school graduating class, it is fun to see his tweets here. Also, he was kinda a grump in high school as well.
Amir Khalid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
My understanding is that a foreign-born child of an American citizen is a citizen from birth, thus eligible to be POTUS. At least, that’s how I understood the law as discussed during the Obama birther kerfuffle.
MoxieM
@EAlbert: In the spirit of the blog’s evening, plus I like to find things for folks, you are most welcome! I hope it brings you comfort to sing it.
CMary
@EAlbert: This sounds like a song the Canadian folk-rock band recorded several years ago, “Come and I will sing you.” Some of their verses are a bit different than yours, but I suppose the difference between Boston and Newfoundland would account for that. They do lots of really old fascinating traditional songs, and often write about them, too, so you might want to google them and the song and see if you get some answers that way. Good luck!
Debbie(Aussie)
I love this place. As the jackals are a bunch of very compassionate people it isn’t surprising that emotions occasionally spill over.
I have been lurking and reading here, sometimes tho rarely, commenting for just over 12 years now. I think of all of you as my friends. You are all so smart, so diverse in profession and life experience that there is rarely a day goes by that I don’t learn something. I do think it’s possible that I know more about US politics than many a US citizen.
Be kind, this too shall end! For all of us but particularly for those of us the orbit of Murdoch.
Genine Tyson
Nice one, John. :-)
BlueDWarrior
Popping in to say that I agree with the blog-master says. Once the voting and caucusing starts for us, it’s going to get ugly as people who are all-in on a particular candidate get wound up about them not winning (or not winning by enough to create a narrative), and others will feel a need to respond in kind.
As much as we might like or not like someone or something, let’s just remember: we need to not let it get so out of hand that we forget we are trying to disperse a giant Orange Death Cloud back to the four winds.
Ken
“Unleash the kitten!”
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Amir Khalid: me too, but I don’t believe it became an issue until people who didn’t look… um… like they were born here started running for President. I don’t believe there was any birther questions around George Romney, whose parents sorta kinda abandoned the country before their son born in Mexico.
Now that I think about it, didn’t Franklin Pierce’s enemies did try to prove that he was Canadian? before or after his election, I don’t know
Jeffro
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Woot! Go Tammy! Or any Dem who will really lay the wood to the Repubs, honestly.
Also, I did not see the Dave Martinez until they replayed them until just now…classic! GO NATS!
Amir Khalid
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
That has never been a problem for Neil Young or Michael J. Fox. Oh, wait …
Miss Bianca
@Wolvesvalley: I see that others have chimed in on this one. I love this song, and will gladly sing it in lieu of the “The Twelve Days of Christmas.” John Roberts and Tony Barrand on one of their “Nowell Sing We Clear” albums do my favorite version of it.
Like your nym – what’s the story there?
OK, back to work on my write-up of a county commissioners meeting. Work, work, work, work…
Gvg
You know, when I saw this post of John’s, I assumed he was warning us to be nice to Watergirl and Alain, when the new site starts up. The last few times we had upgrades, we have been kind of rude and piled on the workers. I have noticed that criticism on the internet seems meaner because so many people say the same unhappy things over and over and it is perceived as louder and angrier than if it was just a few people. This also sometimes sparks a sort of counter reaction of defensiveness. Anyway, can I pre mention that we will need to stay calm about that?
It will also probably happen when something outrageous is just breaking in the news and upsetting us, because we have chaotic evil (+dumb) in the whitehouse and he’s always doing something more.
Mary G
I usually take what Seth Abramson says with a salt lick, but I hope this turns out to put JKush in the orange jumpsuit along with daddy-in-law.
Aleta
@Mary G: It’s going to end with Cinderblock halfheartedly meandering up the steps to the Philadelphia Museum of Art isn’t it?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
so… something happened in the big sports ball match that I’m not watching
Jeffro
@Mary G: ‘Messes’? Left by Joe. Biden?
Even Liz Cheney is like, “whut??!?”
That’s actually worse than “the dog ate my homework”, Jared. TRY AGAIN.
ruemara
Glad I missed whatever happened & I agree.
Aleta
@Mary G: Wait, I thought he was working on American Innovation, peace, trade, prisons, and bonding with murderers.
Ohio Mom
@satby: I googled Arnold Tounge too, and my head also hurts. My eyes crossed when I first googled Baud as well.
dmsilev
@Mary G: Jared Kushner really fits in as Trump’s son-in-law, doesn’t he?
Jeffro
Oh good, per my ‘same standards’ rant at the end of the last thread, i see the WaPo has up both
– a column by Dana Milbank, pointing out what an unbelievable fucking hypocrite Ken Starr is in pish-poshing trumpov’s impending impeachment while still defending Bill Clinton’s
– an op-ed by Chris Coons equivocating trumpov & Co’s constant “lock her up” chants with the recent Nationals game chant
Dem candidates, this isn’t hard – there are a gazillion examples of how the Repubs do this, aided by our national snooze media. Just pick a standard, ANY standard, GOP. Good or bad. It doesn’t matter. Just pick one and stick to it.
Mary G
WTF Joe Buck? “Nobody lost anything from that call?”
zzyzx
Ah mydd… I spent most of 2008 talking down Clinton supporters (or alleged ones) there.
MisterForkbeard
@Mary G: “Can you believe it? Biden was reducing corruption in Ukraine! It took a lot of work to clean up that mess.”
Mary G
@dmsilev: He, Twitler, and Ivanka were fated to merge. I can hardly wait for the tell-all books and legal testimony to reveal all.
Wolvesvalley
@Miss Bianca: I’m not the inquirer about the song, but I agree with you and the others who like it. It has that air of mystery that clings so so many really old songs; the Corpus Christi Carol and “Tomorrow Shall Be My Dancing Day” are two others that come to mind.
No big story about my nym; it’s just what my name means.
jl
@Jeffro: What is left for them? Joe Biden smells funny? Trumpers think calling Bernie Sanders ‘Crazy Bernie’ and using ethnic slurs against ‘Pocahontas’ Warren will be enough for them. Now that their criminal scheme to pressure four or five foreign countries to announce bogus investigations and insinuate smears against Biden has fallen apart, I guess juvenile insults and name calling are all they can think of for him.
BTW, Giuliani said he’d reveal the sixth country involved in the world historical treasonous anti-Trump coup plotting. I think it’s the sixth. Let’s see, we have Australia, Italy, Romania, Ukraine, and UK, so that’s five. Yep, Rudy said a few days ago that he’d name he sixth country involved. Has he done that yet? I’m just curious about what name they drew of a hat… er… I mean they uncovered during their rigorous investigations.
Brachiator
Coming late to the thread to praise John Cole and to express my humble gratitude for his giving us a place to ramble, rant, rap, rail and remark.
Mousebumples
Delurking to say thanks to everyone that has made this community what it is over the past decade, plus. I came here via Andrew Sullivan during the Dubya years and while I more read than comment, this blog has helped me cope during our national nightmare of the current president*.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Thread is long enough that I can point out: A poster way up above praising the new rules and lamenting the horrors of snarky, personal insults once told me, when I pointed out that “Look out the window Mitch” was probably not a great legislative strategy, said poster told me on that occasion that I needed to shower more. Maybe the weirdest internet insult I’ve ever received.
Aleta
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: @Steeplejack: OK then, what is the transcendental meaning of
he played one
he played knick-knack on my thumb
he played two
he played knick-knack on my shoe
With a knick-knack paddywhack
Give a dog a bone
: )
dnfree
@EAlbert: I know the end of the song as “one for the itty bitty baby, wrapped in swaddling clothing, lying in a manger, he was born, born, born in Bethlehem”. Not all the same text for the numbers. It’s called “children go where I send thee”.
danielx
LordFartDaddy: band name!
Seriously, I don’t comment as much as I used to – more time required keeping bodies and souls in the same neighborhood at Chez X. But blessings on Cole and jackals for helping me keep my sanity in these parlous times.
mvr
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Well that’s good news (Baud coming back.)!
And FWIW, the general comaraderie (which I can’t spell) here is what keeps me coming back to this place even when I think people can be a bit harsh. It is one of those places that keeps me hoping that evidence can matter as people think about what we all together do. And there aren’t enough of those. In the dark days of the aughts, this place helped a lot. And if I thought I needed help then there is now to remind me what needing help means.
rhubarb
Thank you, JohnI , J am a very long-time lurker, but this place is the breath and sanity ffor me. I did delurk to tell you of the death of my dear nephew, who worked so hard for Obama and who died on the day of his second inauguration. I also told you all when I was diagnosed with cancer. Massiive kindness both times. Thank you all. BTW, I seem to be okay now. But if it comes back, no more effin chermo fo me.
danielx
@jl:
:::::cough:::::Liechtenstein dammit:::::::cough:::::::
Marcopolo
I am so out of it movie-wise that I did not realize that the Harriet Tubman biopic opens on Friday. I’ll probably see it at an early show. Here is the trailer.
JAFD
@Jeffro: As I think I said before, I lived in Joe Sestak’s district, volunteered for his campaigns, met him a couple of times and have a very good opinion of him as a person. Had he won the ’10 Senate race, he would definitely have been a serious contender.
The good news is that there’s a good chance that control of the county government of Delaware Cty, Pa (560,000 pop) may change for the first time since the Republicans took over from the Whigs
https://www.inquirer.com/news/trump-delaware-montgomery-county-elections-20191026.html
https://www.inquirer.com/news/george-soros-billionaire-delaware-county-district-attorney-race-jack-stollsteimer-katayoun-copeland-20191025.html
danielx
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
::Baud!2020::
A nation turns its lonely eyes to you…….
debbie
@MomSense:
Glad to see your nym again!
How about instead of Melania’s “Be Best,” we go with Michelle’s “Go High”?
Aleta
@CMary: I looked and found these guys: Great Big Sea – Come and I Will Sing You
Thanks.
Mary G
@rhubarb: Glad to hear it. Fuck cancer.
Aleta
@Aleta:
Great Big Sea | Excursion Around the Bay
I'll be Frank
this bloody blog is almost 20 years.
“Of all that is written, I love only what a person hath written with his blood.”
Thank you from a very lurker
Achrachno
I promise to lurk more politely.
mvr
@Mary G: So he’s actually now trying to push Biden as a favored opponent for his FIL?
cain
I’m probably going to get smacked around for this. But as a conference organizer and working on tech communities, it’s important that you have a published code of conduct. People have used ‘be cool to each other’ thinking that’s sufficient, but ‘being excellent to each other’ is very subjective. The internet doesn’t have to be filled with shit.. it’s okay to have social rules to enforce a safe space. Saying it is a safe space doesn’t make it one. I tweeted this at John just moments ago. He’ll won’t go for it.
I have observed in years past, people here using the N word in the context of talking about racists. You don’t get to use that word unless your black. That’s an example although not recent.
Talking about free expression, or free speech inevitably brings bad elements in. While we can pie them, it seems unfair if 90% pie someone and new folks show up and are exposed to these miscreants. If Balloon-Juice becomes a victim of its own success, the bots will come as they have infiltrated other parts of the Internet.
MaryRC
@Eunicecycle: Yes, same here. I don’t contribute very much, I know, but I come here every day. This place is a refuge from the stupidity at large these days and I like all of it, from the snark to the ducks (especially the ducks). Thanks, John.
La Nonna
Also delurking from Puglia, to let you know how much I value the blog, it really keeps our spirits up in this time of terrible turmoil in the US.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@debbie: Just put them together, “Be High”.
mrmoshpotato
@?BillinGlendaleCA: We can all be high while we go best.
Redshift
@Jeffro: Damn, I wish we had a press corps that would respond “umm, if you think your major accomplishment is cleaning up messes left by the vice president, you either need to learn how our government works, or raise your standards a lot.”
What a clown.
westyny
I mostly lurk, but emerge occasionally from my lair to praise Betty Cracker’s artwork or to tear into a particular troll who is an admitted Stein voter. I presume that both are still allowed. Love this blog.
KSinMA
Thank you, John.
And thank you, jackals. Even when you’re stressed and crabby, you’re indeed the best bunch of people on the Internet.
Anotherlurker
I mostly lurk. This nearly top 10,000 blog is someplace special for me.
Thank you John for founding this blog and thanks to the amazingly informative front pagers. I’d like to also thank the pithy, insightful, snarky and yes, sometimes cranky commenters.
All of you make this this place an immensely fun and informative refuge, in these, our troubled times.
Anotherlurker
I mostly lurk. This nearly top 10,000 blog is someplace special for me.
Thank you John for founding this blog and thanks to the amazingly informative front pagers. I’d like to also thank the pithy, insightful, snarky and yes, sometimes cranky commenters.
All of you make this this place an immensely fun and informative refuge, in these, our troubled times.
bluefish
Delurking too. Just to tell you how much I love reading your writing, on any topic at all. I head over here every day. It’s like going to a class I love. Both the front pagers and the folks weighing in. Best of luck going into year 21. The thing about your effect on women made me laugh for the first time in days. I mean a real carefree laugh, not gallows.
Psych1
so are you saying that this is no longer a Bernie-Hate blog? if so please ask AL to repost my comments she deleted.
Dan B
As a left coast night owl I’m usually late to the commentariat. Ive felt hurt by comments about candidates by a few regular commenters. My favorite candidates change and some that have been dissed are on my current dislike list.
We all seem to us3 blunt 8nstruments at times, frequently by accident I assume. 95% of the time the comments are equal, in aggregate, to what the front pagers post. That is astounding on the intertubes.
JC and FP’ers, keep going. You are a lifeline to this diverse, but highly principled, commentariate community.
chris
Well said, John Cole, and thank you for saying it. Perhaps now would be a good time to talk about the wonder and excellence of Tulsi Gabbard?
HeartlandLiberal
How does the blog handle obvious trolls and malicious posts? Is there any kind of mechanism to detect and deal with them? Or just the initial moderation phase?
WaterGirl
@Ken:
That is so perfect that I am going to ask John if that can be a rotating tag.
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@Psych1: I would hope that the one thing we do not let go of is a hatred for purity ponies and messianic political cults.
If your comment got deleted (as opposed to simply disappearing into the ether, as any of mine that include a link do these days, FYWP), then you must have been a thoroughgoing ass.
alienradio
I miss the days of DougJ trolling this blog and the Village Media Idiots.
satby
@alienradio: dougj has moved his media mockery to Twitter, and continues to do excellent work there.
satby
@Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: or possibly because the link in his nym goes nowhere and it can’t be verified that Psych1 is an actual person.
Steeplejack
@satby:
What’s his Twitter handle?
Jay C
@Mr. Longform:
We are all John Cole…..
20 years? Jeeezus! Was BJ’s first coding done in cuneiform???
WaterGirl
@Jay C: Consistently wrong since 2002!
That was the old tag line.
tamiasmin
@Ella in New Mexico:
Maybe not even for Twitter, Ella. Mean, vile, snarky foul-mouthed insults do nothing but disappoint friends and confirm opponents’ belief that the insulter has nothing to say that is worth reading. Consider the performance of respectful and effective public figures. They almost always make their point or rebut an opponent’s without resorting to trash talk and insults. That requires more effort both in emotional self-control and in writing ability, but it pays off by offering readers something they might actually engage with and think about, whereas calling someone an f—ing idiot turns off more people than just the intended target.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: Come sit by me.
@Steeplejack: New York Times Pitchbot.
Steeplejack
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Thanks.