Respite Open Thread: Grizzly Tiff

So this pretty much encapsulates my mood today. A good day not to call/txt/email me. LOL Sympathies to anyone having a similar mood. LOL

Don’t miss the wolf in the background watching intently.

I have so many questions, but lucky woman to not only witnessed this but had the presence of mind to film it.

Respite open thread – a little break between the madness today.

Or if you still need to analyze what’s going on in the political world, that kind of open thread, too. :-)






145 replies
  1. 1
  2. 2
    MattF says:

    Reminds me of bar fights I’ve seen. The wet floor, the growling.

  3. 3
    Barbara says:

    That would catch your attention!

  4. 4
    germy says:

    @MattF: The only thing missing is the sudden noise of chair legs scraping back from tables.

  5. 5
    hells littlest angel says:

    Fighting or foreplay?

  6. 6
    trollhattan says:

    Holy crap! Young’n challenges older dude, gets in a few licks then has his ass handed to him. Background critter, “Yeah, let’s you and him fight.”

    Not sorry they don’t live in CA any more. Don’t want to become a Larson cartoon in my little nylon tent.

  7. 7
    cain says:

    Is it really a wolf? I thought it was a coyote..
    Also I thought grizzlies were bigger? In any case, it seemed fairly tame, they certainly weren’t out to kill each other. :D

  8. 8
    PPCLI says:

    Sorry to intrude some politics, and sorry if this has already been posted, but I hope this Lindsey Graham video clip gets wide distribution. Lindsey saying (wrt Clinton, of course) that someone doesn’t have to say “go lie for me” or “go obstruct justice”, since you judge people by their conduct “not a magic phrase“:

    https://twitter.com/girlsreallyrule/status/1119349981599674369

  9. 9
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    OMG this is literally what it’s like to watch the State High School Championship Wrestling semi-finals in the 189# weight class

  10. 10

    Non-politics, let’s see.

    Writing going well, 2.5 stories accepted for the anthology, 2.5 to go. What a slog! But it’ll be worth it.

    In video game news, there’s a new indie game out called Untitled Goose Game. The premise is that you’re a goose and you go around a village making people’s lives miserable. It’s pretty true to life, in other words. It’s great fun, and while it’s a bit of a trifle, it’s priced accordingly.

  11. 11
    trollhattan says:

    A dad’s report from teenland, my kid tells me none of her vaping friends is quitting in light of recently reported bad outcomes for vapers. But, this happened anyway.

    E-cigarette maker Juul is shutting down broadcast, print and digital advertising and ending lobbying efforts in Washington as safety concerns over vaping intensify.

    The company on Wednesday said its CEO was stepping down and will be replaced by a senior executive from Altria, the maker of Marlboro. Altria took a 35% stake in Juul in December at a cost of $13 billion. Also on Wednesday, one month after announcing that they were in merger talks, the tobacco giants Altria and Philip Morris International said they were calling off those discussions.

    Juul has long pushed its e-cigarettes as an alternative for adults looking to wean themselves off tobacco products. But e-cigarettes have become popular among teenagers, and illnesses potentially linked to the product are on the rise.

    Now we can get to talking about the role vaping actually plays. It was never about helping smokers quit (even if it might help in some instances) it’s always been about creating new and future smokers. Always.

  12. 12

    @trollhattan:

    my kid tells me none of her vaping friends is quitting in light of recently reported bad outcomes for vapers

    Unless they’re vaping counterfeit cannabis oil, which is probably the actual problem, this is quite logical!

  13. 13
    NotMax says:

    Gonna repeat this from below because am mildly curious whether anyone else does the same thing and keeps them around.

    Received several small this ‘n’ that’s via Amazon. The fabric bags or pouches inside which some were packed are simply too nice and substantial to throw away, not that I’ll likely ever find a use for them, but ya never know. Some zippered, others with a drawstring.

  14. 14
    chris says:

    Made me think of throat singing for some reason. Well, except for the violence ;-)

  15. 15
    Alain says:

    @NotMax: yea, I save them. Good for small gifts, etc. A shame to throw them away, I agree.

  16. 16

    @NotMax: Yes. Also, my new sheets came in a fabric bag, same fabric as the sheets. Kept that, too.

  17. 17
    Mary G says:

    @NotMax: I donate to the thrift store where they are usually snapped up by people who like to organize themselves.

  18. 18
    trollhattan says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Five-yard illegal procedure penalty–you used logical in a reference to teens.

    While the deaths and ER visits are primarily the result of street buys, the veneer of vaping being at all “safe” is peeling away. It’s not and cannot be “safe” and is primarily a way to create nicotine addiction.

  19. 19

    @cain: Since woman who shot the video lives on/near that road, I’m going with her identifications.

  20. 20
    Alain says:

    @trollhattan: the original inventor was about getting his folks off of tobacco, but yeah, big corporate giants get involved and it becomes evil quickly. I liked the vape boutique where you go in and get advice and some of their own-brew. Once it became all manufactured and bulk-shipped, those types of businesses have atrophied so that all you can find is a selection of brands and who knows what pressures exist so who knows what’s in this unregulated product.

  21. 21
    NotMax says:

    @trollhattan

    Smiling while picturing how stupid it would look if in 30s and 40s movies (think Bette Davis films, for example) everyone had vaped.

  22. 22
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Not quite.

    From the nicotine Wiki article:

    Nicotine may not be harmless, but it is safer than inhaled tobacco smoke. As medicine, nicotine is used to help with quitting smoking and has good safety in this form. Nicotine itself poses health risks to certain vulnerable groups such as youth, but the ideal course of action for smokers is to quit all nicotine use. Nicotine can harm adolescent brain development, which continues into the early to mid-20s.

  23. 23
    Baud says:

    I assume the winner moves on to fight the rhino.

  24. 24
    Spanky says:

    I’m sitting in the back yard in the sun. It used to be the shade, but we find ourselves in the 3rd or 4th week without rain, and the trees are giving up. Only around 80, though, with a small breeze. Our mockingbird has just kicked off his afternoon performance.

    No rain in the 10 day forecast, either.

  25. 25
  26. 26
    Martin says:

    @trollhattan: I don’t know – my teens are more logical than any Republican I’ve met.

  27. 27
    catclub says:

    @trollhattan:

    it’s always been about creating new and future smokers

    or at least people addicted to nicotine and vaping.

  28. 28

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷: I didn’t say spending all day sucking on a Juul was awesome for you. But it’s not the cause of the recent public health issues.

  29. 29
    TheOtherHank says:

    @NotMax: Well no, but my son in college has gotten into D&D and it turns out you can buy empty Crown Royal drawstring bags, so I got him one. As I recall from the ancient times, they were the container of choice for one’s dice, etc.

  30. 30
    Mnemosyne says:

    Since I was talking about my new CPAP last week, I thought I should give an update for the daytime crowd. It’s going pretty well, to tell you the truth! The first couple of nights the machine was still detecting about 5 events per hour (which is better than the 49 I was having, but still mild apnea), but then I remembered that one of the tweaks I’d read about was to turn on the heater for the built-in humidifier and voilà! My AHI went down to 1, which is basically no obstruction. Yay!

    Now I have about 10 years of interrupted sleep to catch up on … 😴

  31. 31
    Kent says:

    Speaking of bear videos. Don’t try to outrun or outclimb an enraged mother black bear.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hURgA_BNSGc

  32. 32
    Jean says:

    Didn’t read the story, but a headline in Washington Post, says Israel will have another election to help Nuttin-honey form a new government, a lifeline against corruption charges. HE CAN NEVER LOSE.

  33. 33

    @trollhattan: @Alain: It’s a recreational drug, and should be regulated at least as strongly as combustion cigarettes. I’d be very happy if the “safety” veneer got torn off, especially since the correct angle (for current smokers) is “harm reduction”.

    @NotMax:

    Smiling while picturing how stupid it would look if in 30s and 40s movies (think Bette Davis films, for example) everyone had vaped.

    Reminding me of this Onion article: Man Smoking E-Cigarette Must Be Futuristic Bounty Hunter

    @TheOtherHank: Oh man, I was just about to leave a comment about putting dice in Crown Royal bags!

  34. 34
    trollhattan says:

    @Martin:

    I don’t know – my teens are more logical than any Republican I’ve met.

    Low bar. :-)

    They’re wonderful at drilling in and ferreting out inconsistencies and disingenuousness in others, not so good at self-reflection and criticism. e.g., My kid’s a diehard feminist, supporter or LGBT and minority rights, etc. And yet loves some musicians who have lyrics phenomenally demeaning to women.

  35. 35
    NotMax says:

    @Major Major Major Major

    My understanding from afar is that Juul is the lowest common denominator when it comes to vaping products and that there are superior, albeit pricier, alternatives.

    In cigar terms, the Swisher Sweets of vaping. In spirits terms, the Bartles & Jaymes wine coolers of alcohol.

  36. 36
    Jay C says:

    @Martin:

    I don’t know – my teens are more logical than any Republican I’ve met.

    No dig against your teens, Martin: but that IS quite the low bar to hurdle….

  37. 37
    mskitty says:

    Anybody else think it looks like a schoolkids fight? – trashtalking, then pushing at each other, a little wrestling down on the ground, and then runaway, runaway?

  38. 38
    LuciaMia says:

    Bears:
    “You back off…”
    “No, YOU back off!”
    After a few minutes,
    “Okay, Im backing off.”
    Are bears more pragmatic than people?

  39. 39
    catclub says:

    @NotMax:

    from afar is that Juul is the lowest common denominator

    Well, Altria buying it (Marlboro) indicates predator recognizes predator. Juul’s advertising was the most like cigarette ads to hook new smokers,
    who just happen to NOT be 45 YO adults

  40. 40
    The Moar You Know says:

    Also I thought grizzlies were bigger?

    @cain: Those are most assuredly grizzlies. Shoulder hump and coat coloring. Young as they’re pretty small – for grizzlies aka brown bears.

    Canid in the background is wondering if they’re fighting over some food!

  41. 41
    trollhattan says:

    @Kent:
    Great video!. Not only could she outrun Usain Bolt, they can climb a tree just as fast!

    Supposedly, grizzlys can’t climb trees and if you’ve getting away from one, you can try that ploy, but this mamma cinnamon bear looks kinda like a griz and when you’re facing a bear are you supposed to ask them, “Are you a black bear or a griz?”

  42. 42
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne: I’ve had good luck using one, but I find I still have nights when the AHI spikes up to 10 or 15. Particularly if I have a cold or something. 4-5 is more common, regardless of how I’ve tweaked the humidifier. I can’t turn it up too high or it feels like my nose is constantly running.

    Main thing I discovered is that I have to clean the mask pretty obsessively or I get painful acne around where it touches my face. And that it doesn’t pay to be too obsessive about the leak rate–it can be quite high before it’s really a problem, and keeping the mask comfortable enough that it stays on all night is more important.

  43. 43

    @NotMax: I don’t know that other brands have a healthier method of delivering drugs and flavoring in an FDA-approved inhalable solvent, though. Like, Nat Shermans and Export As aren’t any healthier than Marlboro Lights, even though they provide a better smoking experience.

  44. 44
    Ceci n est pas mon nym says:

    I’m actually kind of struck by the non-violence of the grizzly argument. More like a coach yelling at an umpire than a bar fight. First they’re in each other’s faces yelling. Then the shoving. Then it progresses to a small amount of wrestling but nobody appears to be trying to inflict serious damage. And then one of them backs down, de-escalates it.

  45. 45
    Amir Khalid says:

    @mskitty:
    I’ve seen fight between cats that were way more ferocious.

  46. 46
    The Moar You Know says:

    Are bears more pragmatic than people?

    @LuciaMia: Most animals play-fight/fight over low-priority things and don’t escalate it to the point where someone gets seriously harmed. That’s not in anyone’s best interests.

    There are exceptions and the big one is mating season. Hell, deer will fight to the death during rut.

    Interesting factoid: wolf and domestic dog pups play fight. Coyote pups do not; they genuinely try to kill each other. Why this is nobody knows.

  47. 47
    NotMax says:

    @catclub

    Seem to fuzzily recall several stories about low-end vaping apparatuses tendency to catch fire. May or may not have been Juul, so don’t want to tar them (no pun intended) without checking.

  48. 48
    WereBear says:

    @LuciaMia: Are bears more pragmatic than people?

    Certainly smarter than people who start bar fights.

  49. 49
    wmd says:

    In bear related news the bracket is set for the Katmai National Park fat bear competition.
    https://www.nps.gov/katm/learn/news/news072419.htm

  50. 50
    Jay C says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    (Advice from long-time CPAP user): if you’re having issues with the mask, check around for alternative styles/models.
    I was never quite happy with how the standard pilot-style mask worked, then changed to the two-nostril “pillow” style, and have been much happier (and less “wind” on my face).

  51. 51
    catclub says:

    It may be time for another Flobalob post from Tony Jay on the number of obviously not true things BoJo is claiming while speaking to parliament.

  52. 52
    jeffreyw says:

    @NotMax:
    SeaSonic sends their power supplies in black drawstring bags. I must have a dozen of them packed away. Packed away with the cloth bags the green coffee beans come in.

  53. 53
    delk says:

    34 years ago today I was diagnosed with HIV. Doctor told me if I was lucky I’d live about 18 months.

    Probably should buy a lottery ticket today.

  54. 54
    NotMax says:

    @Major Major Major Major

    A treat for special occasions back in college days was to get hold of a box of English Ovals at the druggist’s shop in town. Apparently now history.

  55. 55
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    My understanding is that one seldom sees this in the wild outside of Provincetown.

  56. 56

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym: I am not a wildlife biologist, but it’s my understanding that among the ursines this sort of confrontation between adolescent males is common: no serious damage is done, but it establishes, once the competition for mating privileges becomes an issue, which rival it’s safe to face down and which call for a “discretion is the better part of valor” retreat.

  57. 57
    chris says:

    @NotMax: @catclub: Juul also contains the highest nicotine content, 50mg/ml, of any vape that I know of. They made a big deal about offering a 25mg juice a little while ago but even that is quite strong. They’re the unfiltered Camels of vapes, aimed directly at addicts.

    For context when I quit the cigs I used a 45mg juice for a while until it made me slightly nauseated a couple of times just like cigarettes did when I was a kid. Since then I’ve stepped down to 30, then to 15 and now 6mg. 3mg is the next step and then I put the whole thing down. Maybe.

  58. 58
    NotMax says:

    Linky fix.

    @Major Major Major Major

    A treat for special occasions back in college days was to get hold of a box of English Ovals at the druggist’s shop in town. Apparently now history.

  59. 59
    Baud says:

    @delk:

    Wow. That’s incredible. A lesson about never giving up.

  60. 60
    chris says:

    @NotMax:

    vaping apparatuses tendency to catch fire

    Cheap unregulated mods with high voltage rechargeable batteries and usually caused by user damaged batteries.

  61. 61
    geg6 says:

    @trollhattan:

    I actually have several friends and a sister who were able to quit using electronic cigarettes, so I have really mixed feelings about this.

  62. 62
    catclub says:

    @delk: wow. You and Magic Johnson. (I think magic was still playing basketball in 1988, so he was diagnosd later)

    The good news is, you’ll never have to see Donald trump as President. The bad news is that you will be dead.

    Cheers.

  63. 63
    geg6 says:

    @TaMara (HFG):

    I use those kinds of bags to store my purses. I am a bit of a Dooney and Bourke and Coach collector and they are perfect for keeping them nice.

  64. 64
    Avalune says:

    @Major Major Major Major: “It’s a beautiful morning…and you are a horrible goose.” The poor kid with the glasses. Sounds hilarious but I fear I’d get kind of bored quickly.

  65. 65
    catclub says:

    @geg6:

    I am a bit of a Dooney and Bourke and Coach collector

    I heard that Imelda Marcos occasionally bought shoes, too.

  66. 66
    LuciaMia says:

    @delk: Yay! (Hows your doctor doing.?)

  67. 67
    Gravenstone says:

    @chris: You’ve seen the Hu band? Mongolian throat singing meets metal. Coming to the states later this fall iirc.

  68. 68

    @Avalune: They give you a checklist of tricky things to do.

  69. 69
    Amir Khalid says:

    Guitar question: Should I put Fender Custom Shop ’54 pickups in my clearance-sale Squier Strat?

  70. 70
    trollhattan says:

    @geg6:
    I’m 100% on board as a tool for weaning off cigarettes. Dad died of lung cancer from a habit he acquired free, serving Uncle Sam in WWII. Had he moved from smoking to…anything else he might have met his granddaughter.

    They (vaping devices) did not go through FDA approval as a consumer product. They should have, but as far as I can tell live in that magical world that also contains nutritional supplements that are fiercely defended from government oversight by the Utah and a few other congressional delegations. If the makers of vape products had the burden of proof that they are truly safe, they would have never come to market. As medical devices, then yes, similar to nicotine patches, etc.

  71. 71
    rikyrah says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    I am so glad that you got it and that it’s working :)

  72. 72
    Ruckus says:

    @trollhattan:
    Pictures of cancerous lungs would do the trick. One look at what healthy looks like and a comparison to the cancerous-that will change any minds that aren’t dumber than a box of rocks.

  73. 73
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    I’ve been washing the mask every day, so hopefully that will ward off skin issues. It’s the Phillips Dreamwear nasal pillows mask, so it’s pretty minimal.

    It sounds like you may want to try a different mask — there are a bajillion options out there now. I found a bunch of helpful message boards when I was Googling for more information and there were a lot of places that had reviews of the different models. I like the Phillips one because the hose goes off the top of my head, so it’s less likely to get tangled.

  74. 74
    NotMax says:

    @Gravenstone

    “Got the schedule for the concert?”

    “Hu’s on first.”

  75. 75
    geg6 says:

    @catclub:

    Now, now, I only have six of each. And I have never, ever, ever paid retail for them.

    What can I say? I am a sucker for a finely made purse.

  76. 76
    trollhattan says:

    @delk:
    Good on ya! I won’t say “happy anniversary” because that would be weird, but your story is heartening indeed. I’m not unique in having known many who did not make it and watching them waste away is seared into the psyche.

  77. 77
    Ruckus says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷:
    Nicotine is/was used as an agricultural pesticide/insecticide. I’d bet there are better products to use for smoking cessation.

  78. 78
    Mnemosyne says:

    @delk:

    Congratulations! It’s easy for kids today to forget how amazing it was that scientists were able to turn AIDS into a chronic but manageable disease rather than a short-term death sentence.

    We saw an anniversary screening of the HBO documentary about the quilt. It’s still incredibly moving, especially since we were lucky enough to also get to see some of the actual quilt squares that were of or by the people highlighted in the movie.

  79. 79
    NotMax says:

    @geg6

    I only have six of each

    Whew. Was sort of imagining this interior monologue:

    “Okay, all the purses are safely stored. Now, what am I gonna do with 150 bed sheets?”

    ;)

  80. 80
    Mnemosyne says:

    @rikyrah:

    Thanks! It took so long to get the darned thing that I’m determined to make it work for me. 😂

  81. 81

    @Ruckus:

    Nicotine is/was used as an agricultural pesticide/insecticide. I’d bet there are better products to use for smoking cessation.

    If you’re addicted to nicotine, your options for cessation aides are:

    1. Nicotine, but less and less
    2. Off-label Wellbutrin, which is almost certainly a worse idea than tapering off
    3. I don’t know, hypnosis?

    (Edited because of fat finger)

    And for the record, most drugs are pesticides that we’ve distilled out of plants. Or just plants with built-in pesticides that we burn or pour boiling water over.

  82. 82
    waysel says:

    @Amir Khalid: Yes, re Fender ’54s into your Squire.

  83. 83
    Ruckus says:

    @LuciaMia:
    No, they just have sharper teeth and nasty claws. Get too serious in that game and one of them gets seriously hurt. And they know it.

  84. 84
    Aleta says:

    @delk: So glad you are here.

  85. 85
    Avalune says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Oh dang! I really don’t need any more games on my list right now! I’m doing a digital art class and working on some fall knitting and books to read…and we’re currently playing River City Girls (remake of River City Ransom) for the “true” ending, Borderlands 3, I’m still working on Fire Emblem Three Houses and Link Awakening came out and I haven’t even bought it yet because I’m overbooked as is… I’ll have to remember the goose game for later because that seriously does sound hilarious. Geese are (usually) assholes.

  86. 86
    NotMax says:

    @Ruckus

    Reason enough to crowdfund a charity to provide them with Netflix accounts to while away their free time.

    :)

  87. 87
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @delk: Wow, delk. Everyday is a blessing, no matter what happens. And amazing.

  88. 88
    catclub says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    If you’re addicted to nicotine, your options for cessation aides are:

    The memorable one for me was the teacher who told me he went into the hospital with (either a stroke or heart attack), and was able to quit quite easily after that.

  89. 89
    Alain says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    It’s a recreational drug, and should be regulated at least as strongly as combustion cigarettes. I’d be very happy if the “safety” veneer got torn off, especially since the correct angle (for current smokers) is “harm reduction”.

    Agreed, 100%. I’d like all vape liquids and flavors to be tested and the whole industry regulated. I’d like to see the THC vape industry similarly regulated in all the states that allow it, so that bad solvents and dangerous techniques can be stopped and also to ensure that any flavorings or additives are also safe.

    Basically, regulate it!

  90. 90
    Ruckus says:

    @delk:
    Maybe you should. You contacted about the time serious effort was being spent figuring it out and at the time progress actually happened. Not lucky to get it, but lucky to get help.

  91. 91
    Gravenstone says:

    @Ruckus: Yeah, witnessing the cost of smoking, through whatever means can have a rather sobering effect. Both of my grandparents were heavy smokers when I was a teen (2-3 packs/day). Grandfather develops and ultimately dies from massively metastasized lung cancer. Grandmother quits cold turkey in the aftermath and lives another 23 years.

  92. 92
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Eh, Wellbutrin isn’t any worse for you than the other antidepressants. It does have a couple of very major contraindications that some doctors don’t take seriously enough when it comes to checking patients for seizures or co-morbid conditions that can cause seizures (like eating disorders and alcohol abuse).

  93. 93
    joel hanes says:

    @The Moar You Know:

    shoulder hump and coat coloring

    The shape of the face/muzzle is even more dispositive.

    The muzzle of a black bear is a straight line from the crest of the head to the nose.
    Grizzlies have a “forehead”: the line of the face dips around the eye sockets.

  94. 94
    NotMax says:

    FYI. Although it’s a Scottish series from the 90s, the second season of Hamish Macbeth – gentle country policeman program – has not been available on Prime. Until now.

    Series 3 maybe later on?

  95. 95
    Ruckus says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    I know, nicotine patches, but there are alternatives. Of course if you’re already poisoning yourself……….

  96. 96
    joel hanes says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Wellbutrin isn’t any worse for you than the other antidepressants.

    Withdrawing from Wellbutrin is no fun.

    Withdrawing from Effexor is a prolonged nightmare.

  97. 97
    Ruckus says:

    @catclub:
    Sounds like a buddy that told me he had some disease I can’t remember the name of now, and I went to see him in a “rehab” place he was staying at, only to find out years later, he was/is an alcoholic.

  98. 98
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @catclub:

    I heard that Imelda Marcos occasionally bought shoes, too.

    And Amir occasionally buys guitars!

    @Amir Khalid: yes. Until you buy a new guitar to put them in!

  99. 99
    trollhattan says:

    @Ruckus:
    Lordy, I recall going to the World’s Fair (remember those?) and seeing a display of a research “smoking machine” and a big, clear cylinder filled with accumulated tar from N cigarettes (where N was a typical smoker’s consumption). This was before the Surgeon General’s report. Cured this tyke from ever wanting to even try.

  100. 100
    trollhattan says:

    @Gravenstone:
    Both parents smoked. Mom got the flu one Christmas and after recovering had a cough that she said “Tastes like an ashtray.” Somehow she used that to quit and lived to 88. Dad continued and lived to 65.

    ETA My new primary care doctor quizzed me as to whether I smoke. “Nope” Ever? “Nope” Parents? “Yep” You smoked.

  101. 101

    @Mnemosyne:

    Wellbutrin isn’t any worse for you than the other antidepressants.

    Right, if you’re depressed. Bupropion’s (effective, but incidental) use as a smoking-cessation aid should be taken with a grain of salt. It has major side-effects!

    ETA I started taking it for depression the week I also started quitting cigarettes, it was a big help, but also it turns out I’m bipolar and mildly epileptic, not depressed, and bupropion was in fact a terrible idea

  102. 102
    geg6 says:

    @delk:

    Wow, that’s amazing. I’m so glad you are still with us and hope you will be for many more years!

    ETA: I have a couple of friends who succumbed before there were any sort of treatments. So I know how much of a medical miracle it is to have you with us.

  103. 103
  104. 104
    HeleninEire says:

    Donny up. Stoned.

  105. 105
    HeleninEire says:

    He’s whining already.

  106. 106
    catclub says:

    News!? important if true.

    via Bloomberg

    Congress to Receive Whistle-Blower Complaint (3:14 p.m.)

    The Trump administration will give Congress a whistle-blower complaint involving Trump’s call with Zelenskiy on Wednesday, according to a person familiar with the matter.

    The complaint, made to the inspector general for the U.S. intelligence community, concerns a sequence of events including the call. Up to now, the administration had prevented the inspector general from briefing Congress on the complaint or providing it to lawmakers.

    Acting Director of National Intelligence Joseph Maguire is scheduled to testify to the House Intelligence Committee on Thursday and is expected to face questions about the complaint.

  107. 107
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Steve in the ATL:
    My guitars are the cheap ones (he said defensively) and I buy a guitar somewhat less often than Madam Marcos bought shoes. Besides, I’m trying to save money here; RM640 pickups in a RM290 guitar which I already have seems a better use of money than blowing RM1,200 on a new Squier Standard Strat.

  108. 108
    Quinerly says:

    @HeleninEire: I go weeks without seeing him on TV. It’s a test for me to check out changes in him. I listen on Tune in MSNBC on Echo. Today, is the first time I’ve actually seen him in over 6 weeks. Big changes in appearance. Plus, low energy right now.

  109. 109
    cain says:

    Shouldn’t we have dorky don’s press thing on a separate thread? Whose running this joint anyway?

    ;)

  110. 110
    Mike in NC says:

    Fat Bastard at UN is babbling incoherently, lying through his teeth. “Largest economy, blah blah blah, China losing billions”. Sad stupid man-baby.

  111. 111
    Leto says:

    @delk: congratulations! I hope you have many more to come 😀

    @Avalune: your knitting is getting in the way of our Borderlands! Priorities!!! 😜

  112. 112
    The Moar You Know says:

    Guitar question: Should I put Fender Custom Shop ’54 pickups in my clearance-sale Squier Strat?

    @Amir Khalid: Unless you’ve got a really nice tube amp I highly suspect you would find this to be a waste of money. The stock Squier pickups are quite good.

  113. 113
    Baud says:

    Ukraine president thought only U.S. side of Trump call would be published

  114. 114

    @delk: Way to prove that doc wrong! Go you.

  115. 115
    cain says:

    STFU about India and Pakistan. You know nothing about it to even think about mediating it.

  116. 116
    Ohio Mom says:

    @NotMax: That’s the sort of stuff I save for July, when the synagogue’s Sisterhood has its annual rummage sale. Somehow, I don’t think that’s an option for you.

  117. 117
    cain says:

    WTF.. what kind of stupid deal did Poland do?.. paying 100%, I’m sure that is a lie.

  118. 118
    The Moar You Know says:

    Grizzlies have a “forehead”: the line of the face dips around the eye sockets.

    @joel hanes: Right! Heard it referred to as “dished”.

  119. 119
    Avalune says:

    @Leto: I could probably do both – you spend a hour figuring out which gun to use every time a gun drops in a loot drop game. :-P

  120. 120
    chris says:

    @Gravenstone: Who’s Hu? Ha, looks like fun.

  121. 121
    Amir Khalid says:

    @The Moar You Know:
    B-b-b-but the guy in the store said I could make my Squier sound like a Fender American Professional Strat! (The American Pro is 13x the price of my Squier California Strat.)

  122. 122
    chris says:

    @Ruckus:

    Pictures of cancerous lungs would do the trick

    Nope. Search “canadian cigarette pack image.” Actually, I suppose it helps a little but doesn’t stop any addicts.

  123. 123
    The Moar You Know says:

    Ukraine president thought only U.S. side of Trump call would be published

    @Baud: Dude’s on crack. That wouldn’t happen under any president, but especially not this one, who has made it his life’s work to fuck over every single person he’s ever encountered.

  124. 124

    “Sir” alert! Trump just said “many” foreign leaders came up to him and said, “Sir….” (Mr DAW has him on our TV. I left the room, but I can still hear him.

  125. 125
    SFBayAreaGal says:

    @trollhattan: My dad was a smoker, my mom and all of us kids were non smokers. Both sets of my grandparents were smokers.

    Cancer outcome for us grandchildren and mom:

    My mom passed away from stomach cancer. One sister had a double mastectomy due to breast cancer, another sister had her bladder removed due to bladder cancer.

    Yes second hand smoke is deadly.

  126. 126
    Leto says:

    @Avalune: Hey! That .248% dps increase is what we need to defeat that end boss! You want your purple loots, right? 😜

  127. 127
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Steve in the ATL:

    Heh. I once had a grocery store clerk whose mind was blown when I took a shopping bag in its own bag out of the bag I was carrying.

    To be fair, I suspect he may have spent his break smoking the kind of herb that they didn’t sell in California grocery stores at the time.

  128. 128
    The Moar You Know says:

    B-b-b-but the guy in the store said I could make my Squier sound like a Fender American Professional Strat! (The American Pro is 13x the price of my Squier California Strat.)

    @Amir Khalid: Well, here’s a guy who’s worked in four and managed two of them. The single best thing you can do for your tone, once you have a guitar without overt defects or playability issues, is buy a REALLY GOOD AMP. An electric guitar is literally one half of an instrument. The amp is the other half. That’s how important this is.

    (yes that means pretty expensive most of the time)

    If you’re going to buy a Fender, stay away from the Pro Junior, Blues Junior, Hot Rod Deluxe and Blues De Ville. They are not that great – my guitar player brings a Blues Junior to our smaller gigs, but he spent so much on mods for it he may as well have bought a new Mesa (he has an old one – best guitar amps made, period.)

    The Fender reissues – Princeton, Deluxe, Twin – are great. The new Supro stuff is pretty decent. If I can think of anything else, I’ll let you know. But save your pennies and buy a good amp!

  129. 129
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @The Moar You Know: vintage Twin Reverb of GTFO!

    Never mind that my hearing is already in rapid decline….

  130. 130
    Ceci n est pas mon nym says:

    @catclub: It’s been delivered to Republican Richard Burr on the Senate Intelligence Committee. So I guess it’s his turn now to tell us why the House doesn’t get to see it.

  131. 131
    Amir Khalid says:

    @The Moar You Know:
    I have a Fender Champion 100. Budget 2×12 combo amp (US$350 in the US), generally considered good valye. This’ll do me. Not willing to spend on a valve amp.

  132. 132
    VOR says:

    Speaking of bears, it’s nearly time for Fat Bear Week! The US Katmai National Park tracks their brown bears and runs an elimination contest every year. The idea is to pick the bear who has gained the most weight prior to hibernation. https://www.nps.gov/katm/learn/news/news072419.htm

  133. 133
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Yes, you’re basically the worst possible candidate for bupoprion. That was some bad doctorin’.

    I suspect that the smoking cessation patients that Wellbutrin works best for are the ones with undiagnosed ADHD, because it’s the anti-depressant of choice for folks with ADHD. It gives a little bit of the same effect as ADHD medication since they all work on dopamine.

  134. 134
    Ohio Mom says:

    @delk: Congrats! To you and to modern medical science. What a fabulous anniversary to note.

    That musta been a hell of a thing to live through, those first months and year when it looked like there was no hope. I’m shuddering in sympathy.

  135. 135
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Hypnosis worked for my uncle, and inspired by that, my mom. They were in their fifties and had smoked heavily their entire adult lives.

    Which tickled me because they were two of the most cynical people ever. You’d think they would have dismissed hypnosis as woo (had the word existed back then). But they each gave it a fair try and it worked.

    After quitting, both of them chewed toothpicks constantly for a while. And then they didn’t.

  136. 136

    @Mnemosyne:

    Yes, you’re basically the worst possible candidate for bupoprion. That was some bad doctorin’.

    Eh. Young man presents with major depressive episode and no history of mania or seizures. It was a fair call.

  137. 137
    Ohio Mom says:

    @SFBayAreaGal: Not that it makes any difference, but breast cancer is something of an anomaly in that there is no evidence of any link to smoking. Now, youthful binge drinking, that there is some evidence for.

  138. 138
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Avalune: Aw, you guys are so cute. ; )

    I am so glad Leto and delk are still with us, and that we got Avalune as a jackal into the bargain.

  139. 139
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Mnemosyne: Really? My ex was on Paxil – he had ADHD and depression, and the doctors basically told him, “well, we can give you drugs that will treat you for one or the other but not both”. He opted to feel better instead of being able to concentrate better.

    But that was back in the 90s. Things may have changed.

    And as far as I know, he’s never been able to wean himself off the Paxil. : (

  140. 140
    Miss Bianca says:

    Really? Fucking moderation? Why, because I mentioned prescription drug names? >:<

  141. 141
    Avalune says:

    @Miss Bianca: <3 Haha thank you!

    @delk: Late response in a dead thread but that's awesome. Happy Anniversary.

  142. 142
    pluky says:

    @cain: Yes, they weren’t out to do real damage. Notice the swats were with the pads, not the claws, and no biting. Ethologially, this was an agonistic display — a test of relative size, strength, and overall fitness. The larger, older bear let the challenger get in his (almost certainly males here) best shot, then dropped the hammer. Not the shift from challenge to submission before scampering away,

  143. 143
    J R in WV says:

    @delk:

    Congratulations! And many happy returns of the anniversary!

    HEY!! We’ve got two new puppys in the house. Are nearly 6 months old, the dad is half lab and half great pyrenees and mom is a mix of Australian cattle dogs. Around 50 pounds each, black with some white trim.

    They have been living on a dairy farm as outdoor dogs, now they’re indoors in our house. Our current dog has been a single dog for a year or two, and is intimidated by having strangers in the house. She doesn’t get it that these two young’ens are hers to train up!

    Pics will happen. They need to visit the vet for some shots, spay and neuter work. Friend will email me the vaccination details, they’re professional dairy goat farmers, ordered vaccine and shot them up twice on schedule, but our vets will need to know what and when with regard to that.

    They’re SO CUTE~~!!!~~ Scared now that their mom has left them with strangers, even though we visited them a few weeks ago, they don’t remember at all. Quiet, laying on the floor.

    All the political news today is way past insane ! I’m trying to hold off watching too much video news….

  144. 144
    daize says:

    @joel hanes:

    Withdrawing from Effexor is a prolonged nightmare.

    Yup.

  145. 145
    Tehanu says:

    Late to the thread, but wow. I hope that was a telephoto lens!

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