Houston DNC Debate, Post II






254 replies
  1. 1
    Dog Dawg Damn says:

    Have to say, not that it surprises anyone, I’m really digging Beto’s BDE and he would destroy Trump with white suburban women.

    Everyone else has been worse than I expected they would be (especially Kamala).

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  2. 2
    J. says:

    I didn’t realize ABC was airing “Grumpy Old Men” tonight.

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  3. 3
    Mike in NC says:

    Is Fat Bastard live tweeting insults about the debate? It’s well past his bed time but he literally has nothing better to do at night.

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  4. 4
    Mary G says:

    Free advertising:

    Kamala Harris says Trump has gotten nothing done. And insults Fox News.— Bill O'Reilly (@BillOReilly) September 13, 2019

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  5. 5

    @Mike in NC: Fat Bastard only sleeps about 4 hours a night.

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  6. 6

    @Mary G: Heh. Baud!2020! needs to insult Fox News.

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  7. 7
    Baud says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I’d prefer to bankrupt Fox News.

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  8. 8
    Immanentize says:

    @Dog Dawg Damn: You waited for that new thread, didn’t you?

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  9. 9

    @Mike in NC: I think he’s in Baltimore.

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  10. 10
    OldDave says:

    @Mike in NC: You made me look. No, silence from the Mango Menace. Won’t last, mind you.

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  11. 11
    Gin & Tonic says:

    Eating pizza with a knife and fork? Maybe he should have DiBlasio join him.

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  12. 12

    @Baud: Your first executive order?

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  13. 13
    chris says:

    OK, never mind, wasn’t important anyway.

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  15. 15
    Immanentize says:

    @chris:
    True

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  16. 16
    Another Scott says:

    Did Bernie just say that NAFTA and PNTR with China cost 4 Billion jobs??

    His screaming into his mic and popping his Ps isn’t helping get his message across.

    Joe just called Warren “Senator Warner”. (Probably thinking of John Warner, not Mark Warner.)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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  17. 17
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: “Sundowning” the entire country is hard work. Pacing back and forth while Tweeting random cray-cray while not tripping and falling over his cell phone charging cord requires constant focus.

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  18. 18
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Did Booker just make a bald joke?

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  19. 19
    206inKY says:

    @Dog Dawg Damn: I think Beto and Warren are the stars of the show right now. I hope Warren takes him along as VP. Beto’s answers on guns, race, and immigration were all absolutely stellar. Warren has made the best case against the fillibuster and corruption. They are the only two candidates speaking directly to the issues, and doing it well, though Harris gave the best answer on defending Obamacare from Trump’s attacks. Everyone else seems preoccupied with their standing relative to other people on stage.

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    @206inKY: I’ve been impressed with Beto, Warren just highlighted my problem with her, trade.

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  22. 22
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Beto and Harris are winning the night in my view.

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  23. 23
    Mary G says:

    Wow, Warren really knocking it out on Afghanistan. She is so good at explaining complicated things in basic terms. “The problems in Afghanistan are problems that cannot be solved by the military.”

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  24. 24
    zhena gogolia says:

    Pretty good line on Wonkette:

    We must point out to the Kamala team, and we know at least one of you will read this, but the “guy from Wizard Of Oz” is named “The Wizard Of Oz.”

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  25. 25
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    At this point (and I’ve had an adult beverage or two so be gentle on me) a government with ANY of these people as President and all the rest of them as Cabinet heads would be fucking outstanding to me. ESP if Harris is Attorney General if she’s not the Pres.

    OMG our peeps are the only future we have that makes any sense at all.

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    Ohio Mom says:

    @Baud: But in comedy, timing is everything and he didn’t have any.

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  28. 28
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Ella in New Mexico:

    I’m not even watching it and I agree with you. Except for Bernie.

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  29. 29
    Immanentize says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:
    You realize that no one cares about the details of real trade policy at this point other than, “crazy tariffs are baaad.”

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  30. 30
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    @zhena gogolia: Oh Dude–EVEN BERNIE.

    Really. Think about the alternative. ;-)

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  31. 31
    chris says:

    LOL Cory Booker

    “I’m the only person on this stage who finds Trudeau’s hair very menacing, but they are not a national security threat,” Cory Booker says of Canada and its leader, Justin Trudeau

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  32. 32
    Another Scott says:

    Joe’s talking about Afghanistan, saying he was against “The Surge” from the beginning.

    The Surge was in Iraq.

    (sigh)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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  33. 33
    Mary G says:

    Biden: I’ve been in and out of Afghanistan more than anybody on this stage.
    Because you are old, Joe.

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  34. 34
    Anne Laurie says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Did Booker just make a bald joke?

    About being ‘the only one on stage threatened by Justin Trudeau’s hair?” As a bankshot at You-Know-Who, I thought that was pretty good!

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  35. 35
    MomSense says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    Yup. Another thing that bothers me was during her healthcare answer when she said doctors won’t need to hire people to deal with insurance and billing. And she has endorsed Bernie’s Medicare in 4 years with no more private insurance companies. There are a helluva lot of people, and a lot of middle aged women, who work those medical billing jobs. How the hell are we going to transition all of those people to new jobs? What kind of jobs?

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  36. 36
    Immanentize says:

    @Ella in New Mexico:

    Really. Think about the alternative. ;-)

    Tulsi?

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  37. 37
    FelonyGovt says:

    I think Warren and Beto have been the stars so far although Buttigieg and Booker have had their moments as well. I’m a Harris supporter but I don’t think she is coming off very well tonight.

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  38. 38

    @Immanentize: Well, maybe nobody but me.

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  39. 39
    Anne Laurie says:

    @206inKY: I think both Beto and Pete are campaigning to be Warren’s (or Harris’) VP tonight — any of those possible combos sound good!

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  40. 40
    Jay says:

    @chris:

    Really?

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  41. 41
    Immanentize says:

    @Mary G: @Mary G:

    I’ve been in and out of Afghanistan more than anybody on this stage.

    Should he be highlighting his handsy problem?

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  42. 42
    MomSense says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I agree.

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  43. 43
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Yang is not good at this.

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    @FelonyGovt: I disagree, Harris is taking it to Trump. I think that’s a good strategy.

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  45. 45
    Bill Arnold says:

    @Another Scott:
    No, The Afghan Surge Is Over – So did it work? (Rajiv Chandrasekaran, September 25, 2012) (Just for the record.)

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  46. 46
    FelonyGovt says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Not at all, and I don’t think his $1K/ month giveaway stunt will help him.

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  47. 47

    @MomSense: Jay made a good point on the previous thread which was that all the insurance companies would end up doing different types of insurance. a medicare-for-all would cover basic stuff but there’s still tons of things like travel Health insurance, dental insurance, cosmetic surgeries out of country kind of insurance , that would all exist and people would pay extra for and would all need billing. So all those people would still have jobs. I think it was a great explanation of how the industry would change for the better for everyone. However our candidates aren’t speaking to that.

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  48. 48
    Baud says:

    The reall winners are the people who didn’t qualify for the debate.

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  49. 49
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Another Scott: Joe’s talking about Afghanistan, saying he was against “The Surge” from the beginning.
    The Surge was in Iraq.

    people have used the term to describe Obama’s troop increase in Iraq in 2010

    But advocates of the new approach have long warned of the dangers of the Obama-era strategy, which included a 30,000-person surge into Afghanistan in 2010 that was accompanied by a preannounced 2011 deadline for withdrawing them.

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    Aleta says:

    No muppet

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  52. 52
    Immanentize says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:
    Wait for the general. Each are better than Trump. I am looking at coherent world view, not (oddly enough) any “plan.”. Warren, Koblachar, maybe Harris have that. And I still like Harris and Warren best. I am not looking for reasons to hate them.

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  53. 53

    @Baud: Heh, like Baud!2020!?

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  54. 54
    Ohio Mom says:

    @MomSense: I appreciate that Harris is unflappable. You can see spurts of anxiety in most of them but she remains relaxed. At least during the snippets I’ve seen.

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  55. 55
    Another Scott says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: The hubris of business guys thinking that the first elected office they should hold is President, is, well, it’s kinda hubris-y.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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    Baud says:

    Dumb question.

    Good joke.

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  58. 58
    Immanentize says:

    @Baud:
    Which means they will qualify for the next debate.

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  59. 59
    Leto says:

    @Another Scott: we also had a surge in Afghanistan. Happened in 2009, though it was smaller in scale than the Iraq surge. 2009 Afghan Surge.

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  60. 60
    Another Scott says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Maybe it’s plausible, but then he started talking about Iraq in much more detail.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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  61. 61

    @Immanentize: You have to determine who you’ll vote for in the primary, you could use a probability device or look at the differences in their proposals. As far as the general, broken glass.

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  62. 62
    Betty says:

    @MomSense: I think the govt. would probably subcontract the insurance companies to process claims. Some execs and marketing personnel will be displaced.

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  63. 63
    Jeffro says:

    This whole field (minus two old guys) is doing us proud.

    Isn’t it great not to have Delaney, Williamson, Hick, and the rest up there?

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  64. 64
    Baud says:

    @Jeffro:

    It’s nice to have one night.

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  65. 65
    smintheus says:

    @Another Scott: There was also a “Surge” in Afghanistan, which predictably failed to change much.

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  66. 66
    WaterGirl says:

    @MomSense: I was just thinking of you, wondering whether you might have received my email message. I never know which email address to use.

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  67. 67

    @Jeffro:

    the rest up there

    So that’s what we’re calling Baud now?

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  68. 68
    Kattails says:

    @Ella in New Mexico: (gently) I’m on my second adult beverage after a long day and it still wouldn’t soften me to Bernie, perhaps I need a higher octane. Other than that, yeah.

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  69. 69
    Immanentize says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I agree. But what I have seen is more “outcome first, analysis later to support outcome” in people’s primary choices. If you have by chance avoided that equation, good on you!

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  70. 70
    Betty says:

    @Jeffro: I am afraid the two old guys are going to hang in there for a good while.

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  71. 71
    WaterGirl says:

    @Baud: hahahaha

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  72. 72
    Jeffro says:

    @Baud: I hope in their closing statements at least one of them mentions that the Democrats are not the ones trying to close their primaries.

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  73. 73
    Mary G says:

    @Jeffro: Also, the increased time to answer lets them make more sense, instead of trying to cram words in.

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  74. 74
    MomSense says:

    @Betty:

    And all the people who work for the providers? A lot more people work on the clerical side of heath care than people realize.

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  75. 75
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    Q In part 1 someone suggested a Warren/Beto ticket. Like them both.

    Something to consider —Beto’s come out very strongly for gun control. GOP will rile up their base on this.

    Also he apparently mentioned ‘1619’ favorably. GOP would go after him even more explicitly than against the others appealing to their racist base.

    GOP could come out harder and clearer against him on these 2 points than they could the others.

    Although GOP hits us uon these 2 points hit and heavy all the time.

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  76. 76
    Baud says:

    @Jeffro:

    Good point.

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  77. 77
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Well, calling him “that son of a bitch” was causing too much confusion.

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  78. 78
    Jeffro says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: LOL

    Baud: The ultimate dark horse, as in, not visibly on the track. BUT INFLUENTIAL!

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  79. 79
    Baud says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Castro? Is that you?

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  80. 80
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Ladyraxterinok: Fuckem. The GOP gets no veto over our choice of candidates.

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  81. 81
    chris says:

    @Jay: Yup. Sounds like Andrew Scheer and my conservative neighbour.

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  82. 82
    MomSense says:

    @WaterGirl:

    My emails are a mess! With the whole job search thing I’m now getting all the job search emails even though I tried to shut them off off. I’ll go looking for your email.

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  83. 83
    Another Scott says:

    @Leto: First hit in a quick search, FTFNYT from 2009:

    In January 2007, he opposed Mr. Bush’s troop buildup in Iraq by arguing that “if we’re going to surge anywhere,” then it “should be Afghanistan.” In August of that year, when Mr. Obama, too, proposed more troops for Afghanistan, Mr. Biden’s camp responded with a statement calling him a “Johnny-come-lately” and suggesting that it was “a little disingenuous” of Mr. Obama.

    But by the time Mr. Biden traveled to Afghanistan again in February 2008, he was rethinking his views, according to people close to him. He had grown sour on President Hamid Karzai and the Kabul government’s pervasive corruption. During a now-famous dinner, Mr. Biden became exasperated by Mr. Karzai’s denials about corruption, threw down his napkin and declared, “This dinner is over.”

    His answer was a mess, but it looks like his actual record on “I was against the surge from the beginning” is even more of a mess.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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  84. 84
    Baud says:

    Democracy Dollars?

    No. Baud!Bucks!

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    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Baud: I could never grow a beard like Fidel’s.

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  86. 86

    @Betty: Shhhh, don’t wake them up.

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    smintheus says:

    Wow. Yang just blew his foot off with that answer “I got a kid……I wasn’t there because I’m running for president.”

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  88. 88
    WaterGirl says:

    @MomSense: Looks like I sent it on Saturday 9/7 to gmail, if that helps. Nothing urgent, so not to worry.

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  89. 89
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Charter schools? Bye, Felicia.

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  90. 90
    WaterGirl says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I had to pause the debate because it was making my head hurt. Who was dumb enough to say that?

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  91. 91
    Jeffro says:

    Yang keeps talking about this great $1000/month stipend so they can do all these awesome things …why doesn’t he just talk about how badly the 99% need a raise?

    Seriously. Want to do a stock buyback, corporation X? Then show us how you gave your employees a 5% or better raise last year.

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  92. 92
    Jeffro says:

    @Ladyraxterinok: I’m good with Warren/O’Rourke.

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  93. 93
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @MomSense:

    There are a helluva lot of people, and a lot of middle aged women, who work those medical billing jobs. How the hell are we going to transition all of those people to new jobs? What kind of jobs?

    There was talk last nights of retraining and truck stop hookers

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  94. 94
    Betty says:

    @MomSense: I actually see all that clerical work as a problem and needless expense.

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  95. 95
    Mary G says:

    Oddest question of the night, to @CoryBooker: To help with climate change, should people eat less meat and follow your vegan diet?Booker, laughing: “No. And I want to translate that answer into Spanish: No.” #DemDebate— Doug Sovern (@SovernNation) September 13, 2019

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  96. 96
    FelonyGovt says:

    Harris is doing better now that they’ve actually come back to her.

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  97. 97
    HumboldtBlue says:

    @MomSense:

    What kind of jobs?

    Whatever they can get. I was downsized for the third time in 16 years and now I need a job. No one gave a shit I lost work because of corporate greed. I’ve been paying an insurance company more than $220 a month for three years and I still can’t find a regular doctor. They can go look for work like I must do.

    (I understand your underlying concern, just a tad bitter today)

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    lamh36 says:

    THIS is the fight that LOYAL CONSISTENT Dem voters want. The fairy tale “soft Trump voter” the other candidates are trying to attract are an illusion! Fuq trying to turn a bunch of racist away from their racist president…drag his azz for filth!

    @nprpolitics
    In contrast to other candidates, Sen. Kamala Harris is pivoting to critiques of President Trump in answer after answer tonight. https://n.pr/2UTnuJ3

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    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Why are Bernie’s shoulders six inches higher than those of a normal human?

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    Leto says:

    @Another Scott: No doubt his answer was a mess, but we still had a surge in Afghanistan. I was a part of it. Much like I was a part of the Iraq surge.

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    lamh36 says:

    @ABC
    Amid a lively debate among the 10 candidates on health care, Kamala Harris focuses her attention on Pres. orange man: “Let’s focus on the end goal. If we don’t get orange man out of office, he’s going to get rid of all of it.” #DemDebate @ABC

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    MomSense says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I don’t know but I’m ready to take my hedge clippers to his fucking pointy finger. Stop the damn pointing, Bernie!

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    smintheus says:

    And that question was as close as anybody has come to taking down Biden.

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  104. 104
    lamh36 says:

    @cmclymer
    2m2 minutes ago
    More
    “If a Black child has a Black teacher before 3rd grade, they are 13% more likely to go to college. If they have two Black teachers before 3rd grade, they are 30% more likely to go to college.”

    — Kamala Harris

    #DemDebate

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    zhena gogolia says:

    Blowing up the evil guy’s headquarters now.

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    hitchhiker says:

    @Ladyraxterinok:

    GOP will invent stuff to rile its base. In 2018 they worked the “invasion at the southern border” to death. In 2014 is was all about ebola and Obama’s failure to stop it. In 2010 is was death panels. Those were the off-year efforts.

    In 2020 they’re going to run on abortion, trump, guns, trump, taxes, trump, religious liberty, trump, and trump.

    My own opinion is that Beto and whoever might as well say bold things. They’ll be accused of saying them, and the accusations will be believed, even if they don’t.

    Because it’s RIGHT to consider taxing the wealthy and raising minimum wage and buying back AR15s, it just might also be right to say it loud and proud.

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  107. 107

    Did Joe kill Dr. Biden? I thought she is also a teacher.

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    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Immanentize:

    I’ve been in and out … more than anybody on this stage

    I thought he was making an “a clockwork orange” reference

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    MomSense says:

    Now Biden’s pointing! WTF

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    Mary G says:

    The get off my lawn act is pretty bad, Joe.

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    Butter Emails says:

    @MomSense:

    Yup. Another thing that bothers me was during her healthcare answer when she said doctors won’t need to hire people to deal with insurance and billing. And she has endorsed Bernie’s Medicare in 4 years with no more private insurance companies. There are a helluva lot of people, and a lot of middle aged women, who work those medical billing jobs. How the hell are we going to transition all of those people to new jobs? What kind of jobs?

    ///I have the same issue when they talk about decriminalizing marijuana, eliminating private prisons and police reform. If we stop imprisoning so many people, particularly minorities there’s going to be less of a need for corrections officers, prison guards and prion staff. Where are we going to find all the jobs for the people laid off from the prison industrial complex, let alone all those who won’t be incarcerated?

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    Leto says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Why does his voice only go from 1-screech? Why does his right hand immediately go into finger wag mode before the moderator is finished asking the question? I feel considerably lucky that we got the answer to how many licks to the center of a Tootsie Roll Tootsie Pop. For the rest, the world may never know!

    Edit: @MomSense: Haha, yes!

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    Baud says:

    Too many words. Hard to process all of it.

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    Ohio Mom says:

    @HumboldtBlue: Ohio Dad was laid off on the spring, just started a new job after over four months of looking. For less money. So I get your bitterness. It’s a grueling place to be.

    Hang in there, we are pulling for you.

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    chris says:

    @MomSense: A lot of those workers will go to the government because they already speak the lingo. Others will end up at clinics figuring out who pays for what.

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    Kay says:

    “Turn off the record player” – Joe Biden. Good advice.

    This is a good debate! Tulsi was ruining them.

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    clay says:

    @Ladyraxterinok: What is ‘1619’?

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    Baud says:

    Final jeopardy question coming up.

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    lamh36 says:

    @skepticalbrotha
    3m3 minutes ago
    More
    Kamala Harris has the strongest, most comprehensive and practical answer on Education. She named checked HBCU’s and their role producing Black professionals and the importance of Black teachers on Black children. #DemDebate #DemDebateTSU

    https://twitter.com/skepticalbrotha/status/1172333611946635264

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    Another Scott says:

    @FelonyGovt: I think Harris has done very well. But I can see that some might feel she’s somehow “arrogant” for not keeping to the latest 45s answer segment. She’s very personable and her eyes light up in some of her answers, but she gives people inclined to dislike her reasons if they want to look for them.

    Harris, Warren, Beto, and even Castro did well, IMO.

    Booker has some good lines, but they don’t resonate with me.

    Pete rubs me the wrong way.

    Yang shouldn’t be up there.

    Klobuchar didn’t get enough time, but the time she did have didn’t impress me (but I’m not her audience).

    Biden needs to go home.

    Bernie should join the party or quit wasting everyone’s time. He is just a bunch of slogans and can’t get anything done.

    That’s all 10?

    I think the top 4 above are the policy powerhouses. Castro made some enemies tonight, and he can’t get much national traction it seems. Maybe VP is what he’s after.

    It looks like a Warren / Harris race to me. Biden will probably only fade slowly, but I expect him to fade. He just isn’t in the same league as the women.

    My $0.02.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

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    Leto says:

    @clay: http://pulitzercenter.org/site.....roject.pdf

    In August of 1619, a ship appeared on this horizon, near Point Comfort, a coastal port in the British colony of Virginia. It carried more than 20 enslaved Africans, who were sold to the colonists. America was not yet America, but this was the moment it began. No aspect of the country that would be formed here has been untouched by the 250 years of slavery that followed. On the 400th anniversary of this fateful moment, it is finally time to tell our story truthfully. – The 1619 Project

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    Ohio Mom says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I think Jill Biden teaches at a community college. Not considered in the same category of public school (even though in many ways it is).

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  125. 125

    @clay: Project by the FTFNYT that essentially serves as a history of slavery in this country – so naturally right-wingers hate it. One of the few unambiguously good things the FTFNYT has done lately. Named after the year the first African slaves were brought over here.

    ETA: Beaten to the punch. Should have figured that would happen.

    Ceterum censeo factionem Republicanam esse delendam.

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  126. 126
    Anne Laurie says:

    @lamh36: One thing that struck me & the Spousal Unit (who doesn’t usually watch these things, but I didn’t warn him in advance this time) is that Harris is pleasant to hear! Hardly the most important thing to choose a candidate on, but it’s an advantage that those notorious low-info voters are going to find it easier to listen to her than to… well, screechy old men shouting over each other.

    (And, although I’m generally positive about Klobuchar, not everybody finds ‘Midwestern female twang’ warmly nostalgic… )

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  127. 127
    Jeffro says:

    You know, it doesn’t have to be in a debate against his current challengers, but I would greatly appreciate it if the national news “media” would press the current president* to answer the same questions that the Democratic candidates answered tonight.

    On live tv please.

    Kthxbai

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  128. 128
    Jay says:

    @MomSense:

    In Canada, there’s a crap load of people who work on billing.

    Does it go to Medicare?
    Out of Province Medicare?
    Blue Cross?
    Canada Life?
    Zurich Insurance,
    900+ other Companies?

    The key, is that the Hospitals are not for profit, so an Asprin is $1.27, proscribed, delivered,

    Not $12,876.

    A 2 hour hot stone massage for my torn up hand, is $122.50.

    Half an hour of laser therapy is $50,

    All covered by “top up” Private Insurance.

    A root canal, extraction and insert cost me personally, $71.

    ReplyReply
  129. 129
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Absolutely agree. Just a comment regarding the irritating question of electability.

    But people voting vs a candidate who’s pro gun control and pro racial justice and equality wouldn’t consider a Democrat at all.

    ReplyReply
  130. 130
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @hitchhiker: As Jayne said in Firefly, “If you can’t do something smart, do something right.”

    ReplyReply
  131. 131
    Mary G says:

    @Kay: It is a good debate. There have been a few “let’s you and him fight” questions, but mostly the moderators have been much more disciplined and brief instead of pontificating like some of the previous ones.

    ReplyReply
  132. 132
    Immanentize says:

    @Steve in the ATL:
    Kamala is a Droogie

    ReplyReply
  133. 133
    Immanentize says:

    @Kay:
    My son GAWPed at record player. Olde — with an “e”

    ReplyReply
  134. 134
    Jeffro says:

    @Ohio Mom: she does – she teaches at NVCC here in NoVA

    ReplyReply
  135. 135
    Another Scott says:

    @Leto: Understood.

    I was annoyed by his answer.

    The US military has been put in an unending treadmill for far, far too long and it ruined far too many lives. Biden trying to claim some sort of prescience about Afghanistan and Iraq was distateful even if he was on the right side at times.

    Thanks.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

    ReplyReply
  136. 136
    Baud says:

    Dammit, what a lame final question.

    ReplyReply
  137. 137
    clay says:

    @Leto:
    @(((CassandraLeo))):

    Oh right, I knew that, thanks. I wasn’t thinking ‘date’; I was thinking ‘penal code’ for some reason.

    ReplyReply
  138. 138
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @chris: LMAO

    ReplyReply
  139. 139
    germy says:

    what is the audience yelling? I can’t make it out

    ReplyReply
  140. 140
    Mary G says:

    What are the protesters yelling?

    ReplyReply
  141. 141
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Another Scott: Castro seems to have the effect on me that Pete has on you. Pete’s okay in my book.

    ReplyReply
  142. 142
    Another Scott says:

    Why did George call Biden “Senator Biden” on restarting the question after the protesters shouted him down?

    (sigh)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

    ReplyReply
  143. 143
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @WaterGirl: Hasn’t Booker been supported by Charter School people in yrs past?

    ReplyReply
  144. 144
    jl says:

    The protesters aren’t doing a good job if even the people there on the stage can’t figure out what they are yelling.

    ReplyReply
  145. 145

    @Ohio Mom:
    @Jeffro: He said my deceased wife was a teacher.

    ReplyReply
  146. 146
    Jay says:

    @Butter Emails:

    Beauty snark,

    🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩🤩

    ReplyReply
  147. 147
    MomSense says:

    Maybe you should practice your diction before you decide to interrupt the debate with a protest. I can’t understand what they are shouting.

    ReplyReply
  148. 148
    Anne Laurie says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Why are Bernie’s shoulders six inches higher than those of a normal human?

    He’s old, his spine is shrinking, which is normal. But *sensible* older candidates learn to compensate by holding themselves more erect — sometimes to an extreme, hellooo Mr. Biden.

    Bernie doesn’t see reality when he looks in a mirror, or else (also) if he held his head up, he’d have to stop leaning in to wag his finger in everyones’ faces.

    ReplyReply
  149. 149
  150. 150
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @Jeffro: I’m moving a bit that way myself.

    ReplyReply
  151. 151
    Kay says:

    @Immanentize:

    First things first on education. Turn off the record player. Biden supporters won’t care though- they seem to completely forgive him these things.

    ReplyReply
  152. 152
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @germy: @Mary G: Not an effective protest if no one knows what you are protesting.

    ReplyReply
  153. 153
    Gelfling 545 says:

    @MomSense: I’m sorry she said that because I don’t even think it’s true. Maybe there will be fewer but somebody is going to have to notify medicare who to pay & for whom & what. Doctors do just as much billing for medicare as any other insurance currently. I don’t see that disappearing any time soon.

    ReplyReply
  154. 154
    lamh36 says:

    @Anne Laurie: i find her laugh infectious, but then again…I’m already a supporter, so I admit my bias

    ReplyReply
  155. 155
    Leto says:

    @Another Scott: No problem, and I understand the annoyance. I have a ton of it regarding decisions around the military/foreign policy too.

    @germy: ANDREW YANG PROMISED ME FROZEN YOGURT BUCKS! ANDREW YANG PROMISED ME FROZEN YOGURT BUCKS!

    ReplyReply
  156. 156
    206inKY says:

    Both Warren and Sanders need to stop describing laundry lists of expensive reforms. Warren is so great at describing systems or issues in accessible terms, but listing off multiple new programs like free college all at once plays right into the stereotype of Democrats as class president candidates who promise the moon. I also think they are falling into a false consensus bias about dissatisfaction with private health benefits and/or Obamacare. Harris, Pete, and Beto have all clearly seen the polling. Still, Warren and Beto seem like the best two candidates tonight.

    ReplyReply
  157. 157
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Bernie’s political Korea? Huh?

    ReplyReply
  158. 158
    lamh36 says:

    @rweingarten
    Follow Follow @rweingarten
    More
    Thank you @KamalaHarris for highlighting the importance of diverse teachers for diverse children. #AFTvotes #DemDebate

    Representation matters, especially for minority children. If you can imagine yourself in the adults shoes, then you might actually believe that you can do the what do when you get older.

    ReplyReply
  159. 159
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @lamh36: That’s mindblowing!

    ReplyReply
  160. 160

    @Omnes Omnibus: Obviously, you don’t speak Berniese, that’s career in English.

    ReplyReply
  161. 161
    Immanentize says:

    @Kay:
    I know and understand, in fact I only thought, hmmm. but I thought it was interesting what an immediate negative impression a new first time pres. voter had. We are definitely in transition.

    ReplyReply
  162. 162
    Baud says:

    Pete’s closing is the best part of his night.

    ReplyReply
  163. 163
    Jeffro says:

    These are wildly inspirational people.
    Elections are about the future.
    We are so incredibly going to win.

    ReplyReply
  164. 164
    Another Scott says:

    @Baud: Agreed. It was good.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

    ReplyReply
  165. 165
    The Moar You Know says:

    Something to consider —Beto’s come out very strongly for gun control. GOP will rile up their base on this.

    Also he apparently mentioned ‘1619’ favorably. GOP would go after him even more explicitly than against the others appealing to their racist base.

    GOP could come out harder and clearer against him on these 2 points than they could the others.

    @Ladyraxterinok: Tucker Carlson is telling his viewers that John Bolton was a leftist progressive. John Bolton. You cannot give a shit what the GOP says about any of our candidates, because they will say anything and everything this election.

    I would bet cold hard cash that within one month, every Dem still in the race will be accused of either pedophilia or murder or both. And that will just be the beginning.

    ReplyReply
  166. 166
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @MomSense: Would you like him to stop shouting as well? Why you being Captain Bringdown to Shouty McWaggyfinger?

    ReplyReply
  167. 167

    @Baud: Don’t know, thought it got off track,

    ReplyReply
  168. 168
    lamh36 says:

    @atima_omara
    1m1 minute ago
    More
    Kamala Harris on the question of resilence: speaking personally to the experience of black women who’ve lived their lives trying to achieve, like running for office, when the world tells you no, all the time is real #blackwomenlead #DemDebate

    ReplyReply
  169. 169
    Baud says:

    AFAIC everyone except the two old guys had a decent night.

    ReplyReply
  170. 170

    @Baud: Yeah.

    ETA: Except for Yang, he needs to go.

    ReplyReply
  171. 171
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @hitchhiker: When Beto said Hell yes we’ll get the AR (whatever) back! I felt like he blew the entire primary onto a different track. It felt like a gamechanger.

    Someone who had the potential to do something about gun deaths was speaking bluntly from the heart, NOT speaking for the TV cameras and the pundits.

    ReplyReply
  172. 172
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @hitchhiker: Dump is already claiming new mothers are asked if they want to murder their newborns.

    ReplyReply
  173. 173
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    )@Immanentize: she’s so out of the running

    ReplyReply
  174. 174
    lamh36 says:

    @fawfulfan
    1h1 hour ago
    More
    The method Warren is proposing for trade negotiation — bringing unions, farmers, and environmentalists to the table — is exactly what Obama did to negotiate the TPP. Which she fiercely opposed on a bunch of specious grounds.

    I like her a lot, but she’s awful on this issue.

    ReplyReply
  175. 175
    206inKY says:

    Biden seems so old tonight, maybe unelectable. I had thought he was a safe fallback option, but I’m genuinely worried for the first time about whether he will be able to hang in there for the general election. That leaves Warren as the only viable choice of the top three, even though I’m uneasy about her too. But my uneasiness is with her proposals and framing, which can adjust for the general, whereas Biden and Sanders might be unelectable because of things that can’t be changed.

    I’m voting Warren if it’s a three-way race, but I’m donating to Beto.

    ReplyReply
  176. 176
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @MomSense: Bernie v Biden finger lightsaber battle?

    ReplyReply
  177. 177
    lamh36 says:

    @KamalaHarris
    3m3 minutes ago
    More
    Each time I ran for office, people would say: it’s not your time, it’s not your turn, it’s going to be too difficult, they’re not ready for you.

    But I didn’t listen. #DemDebate

    ReplyReply
  178. 178

    @mrmoshpotato: Before or after they ask about vaping?

    ReplyReply
  179. 179
    Anne Laurie says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Bernie’s political Korea? Huh?

    Here in Massachusetts, the joke runs: Korea is what you do for a living; Career is a country in Asia. Despite hanging on to his fake-y ‘Brooklyn’ accent like Kissinger did his German ditto, listening to New Englandaahs eventually wears ya down!

    ReplyReply
  180. 180
    Immanentize says:

    @The Moar You Know:

    And that will just be the beginning.

    What then? Accused of sex with murdered children?

    ReplyReply
  181. 181
    Kay says:

    @Immanentize:

    My youngest is brutal to Joe too. Young people will be his weakest group if he’s the nominee. They’re not going to get him at all.

    ReplyReply
  182. 182
    zhena gogolia says:

    Oh, so you only believe in America if you’re from the Midwest, Amy?

    Not great.

    ReplyReply
  183. 183
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @Leto: 3!

    ReplyReply
  184. 184
    lamh36 says:

    I’m pretty sure the Cillizz piece was already written to publish

    @Bakari_Sellers
    Y’all can burn your little Harris2020 obituaries y’all wanted to write tomorrow.

    9:25 PM – 12 Sep 2019

    ReplyReply
  185. 185
  186. 186
    Baud says:

    @zhena gogolia:

    Yeah. I don’t think that’s what she intended but it came off that way.

    ReplyReply
  187. 187
    zhena gogolia says:

    Why do they always tell these boring anecdotes when they should be making larger points?

    ReplyReply
  188. 188
    Immanentize says:

    @Ella in New Mexico: To my great glee.

    ReplyReply
  189. 189
    Ramalama says:

    @Kattails: +1 for adult beverage

    ReplyReply
  190. 190
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @lamh36: Of the people who really have a legit shot at the nomination, she is the one who seems to the complete package.

    ReplyReply
  191. 191
    Baud says:

    Done!

    ReplyReply
  192. 192
    smintheus says:

    @lamh36: That’s utter bullshit. Obama insisted on maintaining strict secrecy surrounding the TPP negotiations, and by the time the terms were revealed they were practically take-it-or-leave-it.

    ReplyReply
  193. 193
    zhena gogolia says:

    Oh, I guess I missed Kamala’s closing. Damn. I’ll try to find it somewhere.

    ReplyReply
  194. 194
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @clay: 1619 project. NYT 400 year history of slavery/racism from 1st landing of slaves from Africa in what later became VA

    ReplyReply
  195. 195
    jk says:

    @Jeffro:

    @Another Scott:

    Biden needs to go home. Bernie should join the party or quit wasting everyone’s time. He is just a bunch of slogans and can’t get anything done.

    Any Democratic ticket that excludes Biden and Sanders would be great. These 2 guys are a fucking drag and they need to call it a day already.

    ReplyReply
  196. 196
  197. 197
    Ramalama says:

    @Baud: Yeah, that was good.

    ReplyReply
  198. 198

    @smintheus: You don’t negotiate ANYTHING in public.

    ReplyReply
  199. 199
    Sister Machine Gun of Quiet Harmony says:

    I really like Klobuchar. I wish she had a better shot. :(

    ReplyReply
  200. 200
    Jeffro says:

    @jk: yuuuuuuup

    Inspire, Dems!

    Or dare I say, dream big, fight hard!

    ReplyReply
  201. 201
    Another Scott says:

    Klobuchar’s closing story was good, up until the end when she seemed to be trying to say something different but it came out as “these liberals aren’t real Americans like I am who come from the center of the country”. It left a bad taste after I was enjoying her story.

    Castro’s closing statement was very strong. Giving up a $100,000 a year job to vote the right way on a city council – and only get paid $1040 a year for it takes guts.

    I liked Harris’s closing a lot.

    Warren seemed a little flustered because she already told her story about wanting to be a school teacher, but seemed to get her footing later.

    I think they all did pretty well except for the two old white guys and Yang.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

    ReplyReply
  202. 202
    lamh36 says:

    Clip of the night?

    @ABC
    50m50 minutes ago
    More
    Amid a lively debate among the 10 candidates on health care, Kamala Harris focuses her attention on Pres. Trump: “Let’s focus on the end goal. If we don’t get Donald Trump out of office, he’s going to get rid of all of it.” http://abcn.ws/DemDebate #DemDebate
    https://twitter.com/ABC/status/1172328475820036097

    ReplyReply
  203. 203
    Jeffro says:

    @mrmoshpotato: I’m sure our stalwart national media will demand some sort of evidence for such outlandish claims.

    Right?

    No?

    Then I guess we’d better do that, ourselves

    ReplyReply
  204. 204
    Immanentize says:

    @Kay:
    It’s funny because my visceral negative it to Bernie. Joe seems like a stooge, not an phony. I just don’t agree with Joe’s ‘let’s go back to when things were better schtick.’. But my son hates that! and prefers shouty old man talking about stirring shit up. Ah, youth.

    ReplyReply
  205. 205
    Jay says:

    @lamh36:

    TPP11 passed. Funny that.

    Once US Corporate Interests were ditched, like slave labour, by the US leaving, under Dolt 45, 2 months to passing, 4 months to ratification.

    Funny that.

    Almost like there’s some kinda Corporate Infection in the US Government.

    ReplyReply
  206. 206
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    just catching up with the clips on MSNBC, and one might be forgiven for thinking they’re trying to make Julian Castro look like an asshole, but having followed here looking at a bit of twitter, one might be forgiven for thinking that was Castro’s plan

    ReplyReply
  207. 207
    Butter Emails says:

    @lamh36:
    This is a specious argument. Obama may have brought these groups to the table, but due to corporate influence the TPP was far less friendly to labor than it could have been.

    ReplyReply
  208. 208
    Duane says:

    @The Moar You Know: According to republicans they’re all socialists and that’s even worse. Of course they’ll lie about whoever the nominee is.

    ReplyReply
  209. 209
    TS (the original) says:

    @MomSense: @MomSense:

    How the hell are we going to transition all of those people to new jobs? What kind of jobs?

    Check out the NHS in UK & similar in other countries – the number of people employed in health care is equal to the number employed in the crazy system where people are fighting health care companies in regard to their payments. Regardless as to who and how of health care – be it private insurance or medicare for all – the systems employ lots of people.

    ReplyReply
  210. 210
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Ladyraxterinok: The NYT’s 1619 Project was not just the history of racism but racism as the grand unifying theory of so much of what is wrong and ugly about US culture. The traffic jams caused by suburban sprawl, our vicious criminal justice/prison sysytem, our lack of a national health care system, are just three examples of the ways the legacies of slavery continue to shape our lives.

    I wanted to get a copy from the Time’s store but they are sold out. I put myself on the waiting list if they do a second printing. They really should print a hard copy book version, it should be in every library.

    ReplyReply
  211. 211
    smintheus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Well the pro-Harris propagandists would have us believe that Obama negotiated TPP in public, because that’s clearly what Warren advocates when she says that people advocating for public and labor interests have to be involved in trade negotiations and the pro-Harris crowd would have us believe that Warren is pretending that her and Obama’s approach were not exactly the same.

    ReplyReply
  212. 212

    @Butter Emails: The corporate influence in TPP was IP issues.

    ReplyReply
  213. 213

    @smintheus: I’m going back to what Sen. Warren said at the time.

    ETA: I’ve seen Sen. Warren speak here in town briefly and was impressed, though I still have problems with her views on trade.

    ReplyReply
  214. 214
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @lamh36: To ights de ate reminded why I like Kamala so much. I gave to her campaign for the first time in about 5 weeks.

    I think that’s her problem, actually. Kamala is awesome and comes across that way on camera. but she doesnt get to do that in a high exposure environment much. Hopefully her campaign can use this performance to push her more and get some attention.

    ReplyReply
  215. 215
    Jay says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    And slave labour.

    ReplyReply
  216. 216
    smintheus says:

    @lamh36: Yeah, opposing Trump is super controversial among Democrats. Took real guts to take a public stand against him.

    ReplyReply
  217. 217
    Butter Emails says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    The corporate influence in TPP was IP issues.

    Right. And it was a negotiation. What did we leave on the table in terms of the environment, labor, etc. in order to get what we wanted regarding IP issues?

    ReplyReply
  218. 218
    Ruckus says:

    @Betty:
    In the long run it is. But as the system is kludged together they are important. Last private MD I had there were 2 docs, a nurse and an LP. And 5 women worked coding and billing. If that office was anything towards normal that’s a lot of people out of work if private insurance is eliminated. Not to mention the people who work at the insurance companies trying to figure out how to not pay for your care. We can do as other countries have done and restrict the private insurance companies to a smaller profit margin and restrict how their business operate. That would save a lot, as would building a proper coding system. As well we could phase out insurance over a time frame, with some left over for those who wanted optional services that healthcare wouldn’t/maybe shouldn’t provide.
    In any event to alter the system massively would take a number of years just to make all the pieces fit.

    ReplyReply
  219. 219
    LivinginExile says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Severe case of sore ass.

    ReplyReply
  220. 220
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @The Moar You Know: Bolton is a lifelong hippie with a tie-dyed mustache. /S

    ReplyReply
  221. 221

    @smintheus: Well, that’s a good thing then. Better to attack Trump than other Democrats.

    ReplyReply
  222. 222
    Kay says:

    @Immanentize:

    My youngest likes Bernie too, and is being unbearable about the rest of the candidates. I’d be fine with any of these, except Yang. I don’t mind him but he’s bluffing his way through this and he’s just about reached the end of being able to do that. They really do know a lot about government and policy, these people, and he just doesn’t. That starts to show right about now. It seems to be a particular conceit of businesspeople that their experience in the private sector magically transfers to the public sector. I don’t think that’s true.

    ReplyReply
  223. 223
    JR says:

    @TS (the original): Unsaid in any discussion of health care reform is that US medical practitioners are paid far more than their European counterparts. Any real reduction in US health care expenditures will have to come in part from MD/PA/NP pockets. That’s going to be a politically dicey situation, to say the least.

    ReplyReply
  224. 224

    @Butter Emails: Don’t know, do you? IIRC, we left the negotiations prior to their completion.

    ReplyReply
  225. 225
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: They’re asking about vaping right out of the womb? Kids these days…

    ReplyReply
  226. 226
    Jay says:

    @TS (the original):

    There are 219-371 “codes”, depending on the Insurer, for human-racoon interations requiring medical attention in the US.

    There’s 4 in Canada.

    ReplyReply
  227. 227
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @smintheus: She made a pretty clear case that all the Democrats care, have decent plans, and the real issue is Trump and what he’ll do to everyone.

    Brave? Not particularly. Honest, useful and necessary? Yep.

    Maybe not clip of the night but definitely a good one. And part of her recurring theme from previous debates.

    ReplyReply
  228. 228

    @Kay:

    I don’t think that’s true.

    I’d offer G.W. Bush and Trump as evidence.

    ReplyReply
  229. 229
    smintheus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: A bit of hypocrisy for Harris (as well as Buttigieg and Klobuchar) to spend time attacking their rivals and then turn right around and praise themselves as the candidate(s) who will only attack Trump…unlike all the rest of youse guys who attacking each other’s plans, not that I’m criticizing you for it, mind you.

    The more I see of Harris, the more it seems like her forte is bullshitting.

    ReplyReply
  230. 230
    Ruckus says:

    @clay:
    The FTFNYT did a really great article and published it as a magazine. I bought one and it is very well done. $6, the postage was more than the article/magazine. I’d suggest looking at their website to any one who wanted a copy. Don’t know if they are still selling it but it was well worth it, even if I had to give the FTFNYT money.

    ReplyReply
  231. 231
    Jay says:

    @JR:

    Primary-care physicians include family doctors, pediatricians, internal-medicine specialists and obstetrician-gynecologists. Those in the U.S. earned an average after expenses in 2008 of $186,582, versus $125,000 in Canada, $159,000 in Britain and just $92,000 in Australia.

    ReplyReply
  232. 232
    smintheus says:

    @MisterForkbeard: She had just moments earlier attacked some of her Democratic rivals’ plans for single-payer. She wants to have it both ways: attack rivals, than posture as the above-the-fray candidate.

    ReplyReply
  233. 233
    Kay says:

    I’m not picking on him but Biden also said first that he has a public option then after Mayor Pete had his turn and Pete said he had Medicare For All Who Want It, Biden then said he had “Medicare choice”. He either changed his mind on the spot there or has just decided to say “public option” and “Medicare”, either one. Which is not a bad approach and might work! But he’s gonna get caught. The Bernie Supporter police will pull him over.

    ReplyReply
  234. 234
    E says:

    Can we stop insulting people because they had the nerve to live.

    ReplyReply
  235. 235
    smintheus says:

    @JR: Yes, the highly paid anesthesiologists are not going to be happy to see their outrageous fees reduced.

    ReplyReply
  236. 236
    Another Scott says:

    @Kay: Anyone in business who thinks that private sector experience transfers to the Federal Government needs to take a look at the FAR.

    There are a bazillion rules about just about anything the government does, and usually for good reasons (to make sure things are done fairly, to make sure that people don’t abuse their authority, to make sure things are done in the national interest, etc.), sometimes for bad reasons (because Senator JimBob wanted to protect an obsolete industry in his state).

    And that’s just one set of acquisition regulations. There are many others.

    Government and the private sector are completely different animals. And that’s before one involves the politics…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

    ReplyReply
  237. 237
  238. 238

    @Another Scott: As commenter Martin has pointed out, one fundamental difference is government can’t fire their customers.

    ReplyReply
  239. 239
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: or shut down unprofitable divisions like Mississippi, Alabama and Idaho

    ReplyReply
  240. 240

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: True.

    ETA: Idaho’s good as a dark site.

    ReplyReply
  241. 241
    Kay says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    There’s a lot of evidence. Maybe people who are good at business should just do that, instead of pretending to be senators. I’m thrilled there are Democratic business people. God knows there’s enough Republicans.

    I admit one of the (few) things I am enjoying about watching Trump is watching him FAIL at all the shit he insisted was so “easy” and that only “stupid people” couldn’t do. I really cannot bear that particular variety of government criticism- “it’s so easy! Just get it DONE”. It’s not easy which is why all these smart and hard working people have not done “it” yet. None of it’s easy.

    ReplyReply
  242. 242
    Ruckus says:

    @Ladyraxterinok:
    Nothing has changed my view that Harris is the candidate for pres and Warren should stay in the senate and be majority leader. All her ideas are great, they are also legislative ideas. Yes there is need for input from the executive but congress writes and passes legislation. Harris is a leader, Warren is a legislator. A damn good one too.
    For VP I like Beto. I think that’s what he’s running for now and is why he’s opened his tone and even the swearing, I don’t think he believes that he’s going to be president this go round, and he has time. He’d make a great VP and be groomed for a run in 8 yrs.

    ReplyReply
  243. 243
    Jay says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    They can abandon them.

    ReplyReply
  244. 244
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @smintheus: I think she said she took their plans and made them better. She didn’t spend tons of time dunking on the rest of the candidates.

    Look, I could be wrong but you are weirdly and relentlessly negative against Harris. I don’t really get it, even if she’s not your cup of tea.

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  245. 245
    Ruckus says:

    @smintheus:
    Then why didn’t anyone else do that?
    Oh that was snark?

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  246. 246
    divF says:

    @Jay: Those numbers smell funny, I suspect inflated by ob-gyn (a surgical specialty, and therefore better paying) being included in the mix. Madame divF was a primary-care internist working in geriatrics and palliative care, she never saw anything like $180K / year – her typical year was closer to the Australian number.

    The big $$ to be trimmed are in (1) hospitals, and (2) surgical specialties, in that order. Also, NPs are not big earners – they make less than the MDs in a given primary care area.

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  247. 247
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @Jeffro: Never said the media would do a damn thing about Dump’s lies. Well, they’ll broadcast them on real time.

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  248. 248
    Ruckus says:

    @MisterForkbeard:
    I’ve often wondered what could it possibly be. I can think of two reasons, how about you? No wait, three reasons.

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  249. 249
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Ruckus: Not quite willing to go there. I think Smintheus has been around here for awhile and I never got that vibe from him/her. But this is some weird anti-Kamala feeling that seems like it goes beyond her performance.

    Maybe they’re just pissed because we like her. Dunno.

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  250. 250
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @Ohio Mom: @Ohio Mom: Could you please post at b-j when there’s a reprint? Thanks

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  251. 251
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @JR: They have 3xtremely high student loans. The European higher ed system doesn’t demand near the high student payment as US system does

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  252. 252
    smintheus says:

    @MisterForkbeard: I am negative about Harris, as well as several other candidates whom I consider to be bullshitters. Positioning yourself as the one person onstage who will attack Trump is, to put it kindly, disingenuous and self-serving. Presenting yourself as the one true paragon of party unity when you have taken your fair number of shots at rivals is just chutzpah. You know there is a candidate on that stage who has maintained her policy of not attacking fellow Democrats? She doesn’t preen over it, she just follows it as a principle; and her name is not Harris.

    There’s nothing mysterious about calling out politicians who practice the art of bullshit. Oh, and fwiw I remember commenters complaining back in 2007 that I was unduly negative about John Edwards. I considered him a bullshitter too.

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  253. 253
    Ruckus says:

    @MisterForkbeard:
    This is not a first.

    ReplyReply
  254. 254
    smintheus says:

    @Ruckus: You poor dear Harris stans, somebody is criticizing the candidate you want to talk up. That’s practically unheard of in primary season.

    ReplyReply

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