Breaking! Jeffrey Epstein Arrested in New York For Allegedly Sex Trafficking Minors

From The Daily Beast:

Billionaire pedophile Jeffrey Epstein was arrested for allegedly sex trafficking dozens of minors in New York and Florida between 2002 and 2005, and will appear in court in New York on Monday, according to three law enforcement sources. The arrest, by the FBI-NYPD Crimes Against Children Task Force, comes about 12 years after the 66-year-old financier essentially got a slap on the wrist for allegedly molesting dozens of underage girls in Florida.

For more than a decade, Epstein’s alleged abuse of minors has been the subject of lawsuits brought by victims, investigations by local and federal authorities, and exposés in the press. But despite the attention cast on his alleged sex crimes, the hedge-funder has managed to avoid any meaningful jail time, let alone federal charges.

The new indictment—which, according to two sources, will be unsealed Monday in Manhattan federal court—will reportedly allege that Epstein sexually exploited dozens of underage girls in a now-familiar scheme: paying them cash for “massages” and then molesting or sexually abusing them in his Upper East Side mansion or his palatial residence in Palm Beach. Epstein will be charged with one count of sex trafficking of minors and one count of conspiracy to engage in sex trafficking of minors—which could put him away for a maximum of 45 years. The case is being handled by the Public Corruption Unit of the Southern District of New York, with assistance from the district’s human-trafficking officials and the FBI.

Several of the billionaire’s employees and associates allegedly recruited the girls for Epstein’s abuse, and some victims eventually became recruiters themselves, according to law enforcement. The girls were as young as 14, and Epstein knew they were underage, according to details of the arrest and indictment shared by two officials.

Epstein’s attorney Martin Weinberg declined to comment when reached by The Daily Beast on Saturday night. The SDNY also declined to comment.

“It’s been a long time coming—it’s been too long coming,” said attorney David Boies, who represents Epstein accusers Virginia Roberts Giuffre and Sarah Ransome. “It is an important step towards getting justice for the many victims of Mr. Epstein’s sex trafficking enterprise.

“We hope that prosecutors will not stop with Mr. Epstein because there were many other people who participated with him and made the sex trafficking possible,” he told The Daily Beast.

None of this would be possible without Julie K. Brown’s reporting at The Miami Herald, which reignited interest in Epstein, his crimes, his co-conspirators, his enablers, and his protectors by giving a public voice to some of his victims who were cheated out of their chance for justice by current Secretary of Labor Alex Acosta.

Epstein’s arrest and pending indictment is going to have massive repercussions within the US, as well as in other countries. The 2nd Circuit Court of Appeals, in response to legal intervention made by Brown, has recently ordered the unsealing of 167 pages of documents in a lawsuit brought by one of Epstein’s victims, Virginia L. Guiffre, in her attempts to get Epstein’s sentence overturned so that she and her fellow victims can seek actual justice, as opposed to the sweetheart deal that Epstein received. Here’s the link to the 2nd Circuit’s order. Lisette Voytko at Forbes explains:

A federal appeals court Wednesday ordered that 167 documents in a lawsuit that alleges famously well-connected financier Jeffrey Epstein participated in a sex-trafficking ring should be unsealed—and that many of his powerful friends could be named.

  • In its 27-page decision, the court cited the public’s right to access the case information outweighed the privacy of certain individuals, “including numerous prominent American politicians, powerful business executives, foreign presidents, a well‐known Prime Minister, and other world leaders.”
  • Virginia Guiffre (now Roberts) filed the lawsuit against Ghislane Maxwell, alleging that she had used her as part of a sex trafficking network of underage girls to Epstein and a number of his famous friends, including his lawyer Alan Dershowitz and Prince Andrew. Both men denied the accusations.
  • Dershowitz has supported unsealing the documents, according to the Daily Beast.
  • The documents will not be immediately available, as anonymous individuals involved in the case have two weeks to file appeals.
  • The court advised the documents be read carefully. “We therefore urge the media to exercise restraint in covering potentially defamatory allegations, and we caution the public to read such accounts with discernment,” wrote the court in its decision.

Those 167 documents contain up to 2,000 pages of material! This has the potential to expose a lot of powerful men in the US and elsewhere. Democrats, Republicans, politicians, businessmen, as well as other elites and/or notables. And, most likely as was the case with Ghislaine Maxwell, some women who enabled or covered up this crime spree as well. Regardless of whose ox gets gored as a result of Epstein’s pending indictment on Monday and the forthcoming release of the court documents from Guiffre’s suit, we should all be pleased that these women are one step closer to justice that has been too long denied.

Open thread!

171 replies
  1. 1
    SiubhanDuinne says:


  2. 2

    I was just going to post this, Adam. Thanks for anticipating. 😊

    I have been greatly disturbed that one of Epstein’s rape centers is in New Mexico, not far from Santa Fe. I hope they put this monster and his clients away for a very long time.

  3. 3
    Baud says:

    There’s so much stuff that would have stayed under the radar if Trump hadn’t won. I guess there’s a silver lining to everything. We were so ignorant.

  4. 4
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: You’re welcome. Also, not surprising at all that he never stopped committing these crimes. One of the few crimes that require consistently applied long term incarceration. Especially for the wealthy and powerful.

  5. 5
    B.B.A. says:

    Wipe them out. All of them.

  6. 6
    rikyrah says:

    This might explain Dolt45’s temper tantrum against AG James this week😒😒

  7. 7
    rikyrah says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    Who could be surprised that he never stopped?
    Not me.

    Even after that fraudulent sweetheart deal Acosta did for him😠😠

  8. 8
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @rikyrah: But this was in federal court, no? I mean, she’s NYS AG (certainly a powerful job, and I sure hope she succeeds in it) but that’s unrelated, no?

  9. 9
    chris says:

    Hmm, no mention of a pizza shop basement. Yet.

  10. 10
    Lit3Bolt says:

    I hope they sweep into every one of his properties and confiscate everything.

  11. 11
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @chris: Apparently that’s in Tennessee.

  12. 12
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Lit3Bolt: Given that DOJ has opened an investigation, and this IS NOT an IG investigation, it is a regular one, into Acosta, and that it was done jointly with the NYPD’s Crimes Against Children Task Force, I’m sure they’re going to dot every i and cross every t.

  13. 13
    chris says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I saw that earlier! It’s just disgusting.

  14. 14
    Adam L Silverman says:

    People need to prepare themselves that Bill Clinton may be implicated in this as he was chummy with Epstein. And there will likely be other notable Democratic politicians, donors, appointees, etc caught up in this as well. It won’t all be Republicans and scumbags like Dershowitz.

  15. 15
    mrmoshpotato says:

    Whole bunch of sick shit is going to come out, isn’t it?

  16. 16
    Baud says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Stop it. People will obsess over Bill Clinton for weeks. What people need to do is what for the information.

  17. 17
    CatFacts says:

    Take them all down. Regardless of party.

  18. 18
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @mrmoshpotato: Yes. Yes it is.

  19. 19
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Baud: That’s why I recommend that people need to be prepared for the possibility. Forewarned is forearmed.

    Especially given this stupidity:

  20. 20
    plato says:

    Finally some justice. The totus thug being a main part of this sickos’ club is why mike dense was rushed back to DC?

  21. 21
    Baud says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    No reason to single him out among the thousands of people who knew Epstein. People simply can’t deal with the Clintons rationally.

  22. 22

    Burn it all down.

  23. 23
    Ruckus says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    I’d say it’s possible that he is. But. I also don’t think we should point fingers until we see the documents. It will be enraging enough that it has been happening and covered up and I imagine that the list of people will be farther ranging than many want to believe. But jumping on the band wagon with no evidence other than supposition? Bill Clinton was a governor and president. He probably knows a lot of people who are in no way acceptable people. And he may be one of them. Or he may not. I’m keeping an open mind.
    ETA I can get enraged at the drop of a hat. When it’s necessary. Just not sure jumping on the bandwagon with no evidence is wise.

  24. 24
    opiejeanne says:

    @Adam L Silverman: The speculation on the previous thread about this was disgusting as people seemed to slaver over the possiblity of Bill going to prison for it.
    . I think Baud pointed out that Epstein threw parties and “parties”. Bill Clinton was certainly at a party* but there’s no evidence that he was at a “party”.

    I will point out again that Bill Clinton has a type, and underage girls are not it.

    *I think Hillary was at one of the regular parties too.

  25. 25
    Baud says:

    If we have to speculate, let’s focus on this guy.

    Trump said of Epstein in 2002: “I’ve known Jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy. He’s a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side.”

  26. 26
    opiejeanne says:

    @Ruckus: Thank you.

  27. 27
    Patricia Kayden says:

    Pedophile scum. He needs to spend the rest of his days in prison. I wonder who else will go down with him.

  28. 28
    opiejeanne says:

    @Baud: And thank you.

  29. 29
    Gin & Tonic says:

    It would be a crying shame if Alan Dershowitz were to be indicted in this as well.

  30. 30
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    Jesus Effing CHRIST.

  31. 31
    geg6 says:

    I don’t give a shit who is unmasked, this is the best news in ages. Bastard needs to pay.

  32. 32
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Baud: Trump sure loves him some scummy people. I guess Epstein is one of “the best people” he boasted about.

  33. 33
    Another Scott says:

    who were treated cheated of the chance

    – maybe?


  34. 34
    plato says:

    @Baud: Yup.

  35. 35
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Gin & Tonic:

    My fucking heart is fucking breaking.

  36. 36
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @opiejeanne: I’m pretty sure ol’ Bill was a horny bastard, but I doubt he was an idiot.

  37. 37
    Baud says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    His freaking Secretary of Labor is already implicated in this mess.

  38. 38
    Mandalay says:

    @Baud: Well said, yet again. (And my views on Bill Clinton haven’t changed at all in the last 20 minutes.)

  39. 39
    geg6 says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    I’m fine with that. This is rape and child abuse. Fuckem.

  40. 40
    Chetan Murthy says:

    [there’s a …. canon for this kinda thing, but I don’t know where to look for it …]

    This news, it makes me wonder, and I don’t wanna get too far out onna ledge here, but still, don’t jump all over me for this, but …. is there ANY male-dominated field/institution/area/etc that ISN’T a hotbed of sexual iniquity?

    And are there any parallels with -truly- female-dominated institutions? [so the Magdalene Laundries don’t count, b/c they were overseen by -men-].

  41. 41
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Patricia Kayden:
    I guarangoddamtee that the first time he’s asked about Epstein, his answer is going to be some kind of riff on “Epstein? Think I’ve heard the name, but I’ve never met him. I have no idea who he is. Possibly he brought me a Diet Coke once.”

  42. 42

    @Baud: That should be posted daily on every social media site by everyone, until the media has no choice but to talk about how it’s trending. And is there video of him saying it? Even better.

  43. 43
    plato says:

    @Baud: Most likely that ‘appointment’ was a payoff for keeping his mouth shut.

  44. 44
  45. 45
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    is there ANY male-dominated field/institution/area/etc that ISN’T a hotbed of sexual iniquity?

    No. SATSQ.

  46. 46
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Baud: I thought he was an excellent president despite his personal foibles. And whole heartedly supported Secretary Clinton’s campaign for the presidency. Not sure how that is not dealing with the Clinton’s rationally. But, perhaps, in light of @opiejeanne: comment I need to clarify. What I think is going to happen is that a disinformation and misinformation campaign is going to quickly be spun up, I expect it has been waiting to go for a while. And its purpose will be to influence for effect. It will center around the allegation that the Clinton’s attended a party or were on Epstein’s yacht or in his plane. Regardless of what Clinton’s type might be. This will start with the usual suspects, as I outlined the other night, make its way through the chans, conservative, alt-right, and far right social media, then through the fringe conservative news media like Breitbart, The Daily Caller, The Federalist, The Blaze, the Daily Signal, Gateway Pundit, where it will then be repicked up on social media, amplified buy Russian trolls and bots, as well as the RNC, the President’s reelection surrogates, his other surrogates, and then pushed into the mainstream news media starting with Fox and CNN and The New York Times. Which will then force everyone else to cover it. By the time the actual evidence comes out, at least one, if not both Clinton’s will be convicted in the court of public opinion and that will be weaponized against the Democratic Party, the Democratic National Committee, and the Democratic candidates for president and other offices. And it won’t make one bit of difference that there will be notable Republicans and conservatives, in and out of office, that will actually be implicated.

  47. 47
    Another Scott says:

    @Baud: PBS Newshour:

    “Jane Doe” aka “Katie Johnson” – 1994. Lawsuit filed June 2016, refiled October 2016 as reported by Buzzfeed and others, then dropped in November 2016.

    Jane Doe is an unnamed plaintiff, who has also gone by “Katie Johnson” in legal papers. She claims she was repeatedly raped by Trump and Jeffery Epstein at Epstein’s New York City apartment in 1994, when she was 13 years old. A witness, also given a pseudonym — “Tiffany Doe” — said she recruited “Jane Doe” and others. Doe, using the name “Johnson,” gave an interview to the Daily Mail in which she said she did not know who Trump was at the time of the alleged attack but identified him later when she saw him on television. It is not known why she withdrew the lawsuit. She has not spoken publicly or withdrawn her rape allegation since then.

    Where’s that 16 ton weight when you need it?



  48. 48
    plato says:

    Cassandra again.

    "Donald Trump is friends with at least five pedophiles, most of whom were involved in sex trafficking or blackmail schemes. There's Epstein, Casablancas, Arif, Nader, Cohn. Who the hell is friends with five pedophiles?!"— Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) December 5, 2018

  49. 49
    lamh36 says:

    @Chetan Murthy: do we really believe Chump understands the difference? all he know is NYC…and Black lady AG

  50. 50
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Another Scott: Good catch.

  51. 51
    B.B.A. says:

    @Chetan Murthy: Testosterone is the root of all evil.

  52. 52
    Scottinnj says:

    I am not a lawyer but why wouldn’t the indictment not also cover those that were involved with the young girls?

    And if one of the alleged participants was politician X but they were not indicted, I cant think the indictment would name the name I e it will say John Doe 1 John Doe 2 eyc

  53. 53
    TS (the original) says:

    Former U.S. Attorney Alex Acosta, now President Donald Trump’s secretary of labor, never told sex abuse victims of a lenient plea deal for Jeffrey Epstein.

    trump surely has all the very best people working for him & the GOP congress confirmed so many of them. I never give up hoping there is an afterlife so each one of them pays the price of what they have done.

  54. 54
    plato says:

    A reminder that Alex Acosta is STILL Labor Secretary after a judge ruled months ago that he and others broke the law to help Jeffrey Epstein, a known sex trafficking pedophile. I won’t let this disgusting story be forgotten. Ever.— Ricky Davila (@TheRickyDavila) July 5, 2019

  55. 55
    Ohio Mom says:

    @opiejeanne: I didn’t see the previous thread, these are good points.

    The fallout from this trial will be a reflection of the cold civil war we are in, with each side cheering when someone from the other side is implicated, and up in arms when someone from their side is named. It’s going to get very noisy.

  56. 56
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    If our media are any good, they will hammer Trump on this at his next presser

    Oh, wait.

  57. 57
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @B.B.A.: @SiubhanDuinne:

    Testosterone is the root of all evil.

    No disagreeing. Just … y’know, it’s something, isn’t it? It’s not -only- that the most urgent task any woman faces, is telling apart the rapists from the decent men. But that any organization run by men is so invariably going to end up covering up for rapists.

  58. 58
    Gvg says:

    Rigor reporting gave me the impression Epstein hung around powerful people so that cops and such would hesitate to bother him. It has also been published before that Clinton wasn’t known to be at that kind of party.
    On the other hand because the GOP went so nuts when Bill was elected, I assumed the Lewinski story was a lie, until the blue dress proved it, so i’ll wait and see this time. Hard to believe he would let Hillary run is he had that kind of secret. Bill is not as stupid as Trump.

  59. 59
    frosty says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    …is there ANY male-dominated field/institution/area/etc that ISN’T a hotbed of sexual iniquity?

    I’m going to take a flyer here and say engineering.

  60. 60

  61. 61
    Jay says:

    Don’t forget to keep the victims and their lawyers in mind who’s dogged pursuit of justice for over a decade has resulted in these events.

  62. 62

    Regardless of whose ox gets gored as a result of Epstein’s pending indictment on Monday and the forthcoming release of the court documents from Guiffre’s suit, we should all be pleased that these women are one step closer to justice that has been too long denied.

    … and that a two-bit ratfuck soulless criminal is off the street, going to where he can’t hurt anyone else.

  63. 63
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @frosty: I don’t know what you did to that comment, but I’ve fixed it.

  64. 64
    Amir Khalid says:

    There could well have been parties Epstein threw that included a “party” for a select subset of his guests. If Bill and/or Hillary attended such a party, it might be hard to establish if they were among the innocent guests or the select subset.

  65. 65
    Another Scott says:


    Unicorn Riot @UR_Ninja

    Video: Drag queens use hand fans to drown out a far-right media host who had been antagonizing #AllOutDC protest crowd

    11:44 AM – 6 Jul 2019

    Good, good.

    (via Cole’s twitter feed)


  66. 66
    Mike in NC says:

    Maybe Bannon, Miller, & Gorka will be named…

  67. 67
    frosty says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    …. is there ANY male-dominated field/institution/area/etc that ISN’T a hotbed of sexual iniquity?

    I’m going to take a flyer here and say engineering.

  68. 68
    B.B.A. says:

    @frosty: No, it’s “just” a hotbed of libertarianism and fascism (but I repeat myself).

  69. 69
    Jay says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    We will see if it has any semi MSM legs given Pizzagate and QAnon has been chaseing this snark since 2014.

    With out actual evidence, any claims along this line put the accusers/allegations/ratfuckers in the same camp as the Pizzagaters/QAnon CT/Flat Earther bag o nuts.

    QAnon/Pizzagate may have cut the legs off of this attack angle.

  70. 70
    The Dangerman says:

    If names like Dershowitz (and maybe Trump) are discussed regarding their “friendship” with Epstein, I have no problem adding in Clinton, too.

  71. 71
    Another Scott says:

    @Scottinnj: IANAL either, and the Daily Beast site seems to have crashed, but this seems to be a “trafficking” indictment. Presumably the partiers/abusers/rapists would be charged under a different law.


  72. 72
    debbie says:

    @Another Scott:

    That story is why I think Adam’s scenario won’t play out. Trump’s too close to it. Make noise about Clinton and it will only remind people that Trump’s in it too. Bigly.

  73. 73
    frosty says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Thanks, sorry for the duplicate. It wasn’t worth reading twice.

    We return you to your regularly scheduled comments.

  74. 74
    Another Scott says:

    @debbie: It would be kinda interesting to hear if Michael Cohen “fixed” that little problem for Donnie, also too. I get suspicious when lawsuits suddenly go away…


  75. 75
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Jay: Except Epstein’s crimes were real, can be documented, and will be delineated in the court filings. Pizzagate and QAnon are complete fabrications.

  76. 76
    Ruckus says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    I don’t doubt a made up story about Bill Clinton will happen no matter the evidence, even after it’s widely available. That’s not actually what you said at first. Yes I know you didn’t accuse him of anything but from the comments, including my own that is not how you sounded even though you specifically didn’t say that. We know Epstein has been an asshole pedophile for a long time. We know that Bill Clinton cheated on his wife in the Oval office. About Bill Clinton’s sex life that is what we know.

  77. 77
    frosty says:

    @B.B.A.: I haven’t personally seen the fascism, but yes, libertarians now and again. And people who vote Republican.

    The younger ones we’re hiring now in my discipline are at least 50% women, a huge change from when I started out. And I don’t know but I strongly suspect not a single one would ever vote R.

  78. 78
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Baud: The higher the monkey climbs, the more his behind is exposed. He’s climbed way too high.

  79. 79
    GxB says:

    White, obscenely wealthy “alpha-male” hetero (albeit with tastes that tends to the “young” side) may actually face consequences for his actions. Large portion siding with his wealth as a shield: “If he’s worth so much – how can he be bad?”

    Queue 27% of Merkins focusing onto the “-stein” surname.

    Well, you know, THOSE people… Suddenly everything is a-ok in their world.

    [Author’s note: Awaits a BJ pendant bitch-fest as commenters rage over whether I used “queue” vs “cue” properly. Point being: we’re all in this raging, flaming, shit-fire together. Know your enemy. I ain’t one of them.]

  80. 80
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    I will actually be quite surprised if it turns out that Bill was messing around with underage girls, because that has never seemed to be something that interested him and it didn’t come up during the Whitewater investigation.

    I am fully expecting that Bill being friends with and accepting donations from a child trafficker will be portrayed as a worse crime than anything Epstein and his Republican cronies did.

    But let the chips fall where they may.

  81. 81
    Spanky says:

    Two words: Presidential pardon. Too much money, too many Master of the Universe.

    Not guaranteeing one will be offered – there may be someone in the White House who can successfully make the point that to do so would be a complete shitstorm, but I fully expect to hear the idea being floated.

    (If not Epstein, certainly Acosta if it comes to him.)

  82. 82
    Jay says:

    @The Dangerman:

    Epstein was a Billionaire Socialite. Some of the parties he threw in New York had 1,000 attendees. He bankrolled most of the Met Gala one year.

    He has/had luxury estates across the US, in the Carribean, in Europe.

    He invited socialites, financiers and politically powerful people to Private Gala’s at his estates.

    He also had a small clique of people, fellow powerful pedofiles, that he would invite to “rape events” at his Estates.

    So when people are bandying around alleged names, ( other than Dersh, Dolt45, Nadler, Dolt Jr, etc) like Bill Clinton and Prince Andrew, with out evidence and charges, to back it up, it’s just QAnon bs.

  83. 83
    Ruckus says:

    Men and women both make and have testosterone in their bodies. Men of course have a much higher level. And it is entirely possible that men can be fucking assholes because of testosterone. But I’ve met some women who it must be said in that context, must have an overabundance of it. Not as many women as men for sure but still there is evidence to me that being a fucking asshole may not have as much to do with testosterone and more to do with personality and upbringing.

  84. 84
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: That’s important to note. Barr is much sleazier than I anticipated.

  85. 85
    Spanky says:

    @Ruckus: The only reason that it seems like there are more male assholes is because they seem to have a much greater opportunity to display it. As women gain parity in the professional world, I expect that to even out somewhat.

  86. 86
    chris says:

    Twitter trolls were on the Bill Clinton angle as soon as the article came out. “Bill Clinton took 26 trips on Epstein’s private jet.” Et fucking cetera. Gonna be a big stinking mess.

  87. 87
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Pizzagate and QAnon were created to confuse the issue and preemptively tar Democrats with Trump’s known pedophilia. The fact that they were able to draw cultists into it only makes it more pernicious.

  88. 88
    Jay says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    What comes out of the Courts is a far cry from the bs. that would come from Still Dead Briebart, The Daily Caller, Laura Inghram, Tucker Carlson.

    Unlike Clinton Cash, Uranium One, there is a an already lined up defence for unsubstantiated rumours and allegations, (plus liability) that may cause the RWMedia and the MSM not to go chaseing off after the faux RWNJ scandal du jour.

    Outside of the ususal suspects, Pizzagaters and QAnoners, the “taint” may prevent Mags or Tapper from chasing mere allegations and innuendo.

  89. 89
    The Dangerman says:


    So when people are bandying around alleged names, ( other than Dersh, Dolt45, Nadler, Dolt Jr, etc) like Bill Clinton and Prince Andrew, with out evidence and charges…

    There are charges and evidence against “Dersh, Dolt45, Nadler, Dolt Jr, etc”?

  90. 90
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @B.B.A.: If I had to guess I’d say a lot of the really hardcore libertarians and fascists are also pedophiles, whether or not they’ve actually done anything with those proclivities. It seems to go with the territory, just based on the stuff they say in online fora.

  91. 91
    Adam L Silverman says:

  92. 92
    Steve in the ATL says:


    Bill Clinton was a governor and president. He probably knows a lot of people who are in no way acceptable people.

    It’s true—I spent an evening boozing with him when he was governor of Arkansas!

  93. 93
    Jay says:


    Twitter trolls are taken as a joke by 90% of twitter.

  94. 94
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @chris: In 2016 the Trump fans were already out in force trying to tar Hillary Clinton by association with Epstein, even though his ties to Trump are a hundred times stronger. It’s what they do.

  95. 95
    Jay says:

    @The Dangerman:

    Both Dersh and Dolt 45 have been accused by victims, Dersh goes to Court tomorrow on defamation charges that will open the gate to his victim testifying.

    Nadler was busted with several phones full of kiddie porn by the FBI and is a convicted pedofile and sex offender.

  96. 96
    Mnemosyne says:

    Sorry to say, but I am cynical about the chances of this new prosecution going anywhere. There are way too many rich and powerful people involved, most of whom have strong ties to media outlets like the New York Times that have a vested interested in, say, Alan Dershowitz not being unmasked as a creepy pedophile.

    I wish the prosecutors all the luck in the world, because they’re going to need it.

  97. 97
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Jay: *cough* surely s/Nadler/Nader/ (no “l”) yes?

  98. 98
    Ruckus says:

    Well testosterone does account for some of the reason males are generally larger than females – muscle mass. That said I used to have a customer who was about 6’5″ and a really wonderful lady. Who took shit from no one. She also didn’t give out any that I know of. I do think that there is a certain amount of truth to what you say and is one reason that so many men are against women having equality. The women will show them up. Another way to think about it is that for many men all they have to give to women is shit. That’s the sum total of their value. They have been taught from a young age that men triumph over women. When I was in boot camp one of the idiots in my company made a pass at a E3 walking by, she read him the riot act and I almost started laughing at him, it was obvious that he understood asshole maleness but hadn’t gotten the concept of rank – respect is earned by how far you’ve gotten, not any other way.

  99. 99
    Juice Box says:

    It’s not “Nadler”, it’s George NADER. I was really confused for a few minutes there.

  100. 100
    Jay says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    Yup, btw, I’m Steve Bittern at LGM and other sites.

  101. 101
    Ruckus says:

    @Steve in the ATL:
    I ate dinner with someone who drank with Bill Clinton. Well that is the final straw, my life is officially shit in a skin suit.
    Of course it could just mean that you’ll eat with anyone. Oh wait I did that too, in the navy. Damn it how do I get out of this? Wait I know. My mom once shook hands with Bill Clinton. And I’m pretty sure she thought that was one of her best days. I saw the smile on her face when she said it.

  102. 102
    chris says:

    @Jay: It’s the other 10% I’m worried about.

    While I have your attention, I trust you know the difference between Nadler and Nader?

  103. 103
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Ruckus: the dude OOZES charisma. It’s inescapable.

  104. 104
    Kay says:

    Both the Epstein and Maxwell cases mention Maralago, which is kind of an ..odd coincidence, that there were so many pedophiles running around the Trump family compound down there. Out of all the gross “clubs” they could choose from they chose Donald Trump’s club.

    I’m pleased because I think the status of the victims mattered here. These (then) girls, now women, were considered throwaways because they were lower class, even by the federal prosecutors, which is just appalling.

  105. 105
    Ruckus says:

    @Steve in the ATL:
    Did you sleep with him?

  106. 106
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Ruckus: a gentleman never tells! And neither do I.

  107. 107
    Jay says:


    Dersh goes to Court tomorrow on a defamation case, that will open up the ability for his accuser to testify in Court. In previous cases, he’s caved after the preliminay hearing and settled out of court. He’s used the defamation cases to stall the victims Civil Cases from going forward. He’ll cave on this one too, which will buy him 8 months to a year on one of the cases where he’s named as one of the perps.

    The wheels of Justice grind slow,……

  108. 108
    Kay says:

    Maurene Comey, the daughter of former FBI director James Comey, is one of the prosecutors, according to a source with knowledge of the case.

    Oh, no! Catastrophe. Don’t let her do any press conferences and we should all be fine.

  109. 109
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Kay: Funny, my first thought was “if she redeems her family’s good name, I won’t be unhappy”.

  110. 110
    Ruckus says:

    And any of the other lawyers here.
    How many lawsuits/trials are won by the rich and wealthy when against someone much less so or a criminal case that is the least bit difficult to prove? They have the money to waste a lot of court/prosecutor/attorney time. Hell that’s how drumpf has done business for years. Waste enough time and money and quite often the case goes away. It just isn’t worth it to the victim, it consumes them, while the rich asshole just has to pay lawyers.

  111. 111
    Ruckus says:

    @Steve in the ATL:
    Glad you added that last part. You had me worried that things had gone to your head.

  112. 112
    Kay says:

    I can’t even imagine Qanon. There it was, right in front of them, and they missed the real pedo ring. They were on the right CONTINENT….other than that, not great sleuthing on their part.

  113. 113
    Kay says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    “Oh, no!” was my actual first reaction. It’s not fair of me. Sins of the father, and all that.

    Just to be safe, have someone else do any press conferencing. Better safe than sorry.

  114. 114


    Of course it could just mean that you’ll eat with anyone.

    Not BillinGlendaleCA.

  115. 115
    Kay says:

    Kyle Griffin
    ‏Verified account
    29m29 minutes ago
    A senior law enforcement official briefed on the case says that Jeffrey Epstein is expected to face two federal charges for “dozens” of victims.

    Incredible Mr. Acosta missed “dozens” of victims, huh? Must not have been looking too hard.

  116. 116
    laura says:

    Man, I wish Dominic Dunne was alive to document the atrocities.
    Sunday shows, cover or nah?

  117. 117
    Jay says:


    Epstein’s victims and their lawyers have been chasing justice in Civil Court for over a decade.

    The victories starting with the Miami Herald series, the documents releases, Acosta’s exposure, the ratfucking involved in high level protection of Epstein and his wrist slap, are all the product of their courage, determination and persistence.

  118. 118
    Chetan Murthy says:


    Sins of the father, and all that.

    IIRC Comey pere fessed up that his wife and daughters really put a hurt on him about Shitler. So I’d give ’em [the womenfolk] all the benefit of the doubt. They recognized an unmitigable piece-of-shit even if Comey pere did not.

  119. 119
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    Sins of the father, and all that.

    Just to be clear: their family name -does- need to be redeemed, or it’ll go down in history with Benedict Arnold. Heck, might still do so despite her best efforts.

  120. 120
    hervevillechaizelounge says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    I hate that a Comey is involved; now the whole Epstein saga will be construed as more evidence of deep state shenanigans.

    Christ, James fucking Comey is a shit sandwich that keeps repeating:(

  121. 121
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Steve in the ATL: It’s true—I spent an evening boozing with him when he was governor of Arkansas!

    I thought Bubba didn’t drink ? not that he was a teetotaler like Biden or trump, just didn’t care for alcohol

  122. 122
    Kay says:


    Poor and middle class people find it very difficult to win against wealthy people because they are outspent and perhaps worse, they are timed out. They can’t wait that long. They have to give up and get on with their lives.

    Do you remember The Paint Spot? The painting contractor Trump screwed? It came out during the campaign. They’re a small business. They can’t spend 5 years suing Donald Trump. They won’t stay in business. They “won” – they got some kind of mechanics lien on one of his shitty properties, but I doubt they’ll ever get paid. They have to get paid, and rather quickly, or it just isn’t worth it to them.

    These girls – they’re now all grown women- were amazingly persistent.

  123. 123
  124. 124
    sdhays says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Indeed. My assumption, though, is if there actually as any “there” there with Bill Clinton, there’s no way Acosta would have allowed that to stay under wraps.

  125. 125
    Cacti says:

    I’m sure that somehow, the librul NYT will make this Bill and Hillary Clinton’s fault.

  126. 126
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @Gvg: Wasn’t Lewinski coached by L Goldberg, who hated dems? Arranged for her to frequently cross paths with Bill? Told her to save dress, etc?

  127. 127
    Mnemosyne says:


    IMHO, it’s one of two things:

    (A) The Clinton allegations are so thin that Republicans know they’ll only fly in the QAnon fever swamps and will never be accepted by the general public, including most Republican voters.

    (B) There is some meat to the Clinton allegations, but they’re so entwined with the more dangerous Trump allegations that they don’t dare try to use them as a weapon because it would bring Trump down, too.

  128. 128
    joel hanes says:


    He didn’t inhale

    He couldn’t inhale.
    WJC has asthma — always has had.
    That’s why “I didn’t inhale” was one of his jokes: he actually didn’t inhale, but everyone assumed he was lying.

  129. 129
    joel hanes says:


    Yes. And betrayed by Linda Tripp, whom she thought was her friend.

  130. 130
    seaboogie says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Yep. I appreciate your dispassionate analysis of how things tend to go.

    Also, there are so many good men here on BJ. If all y’all can understand what it is like for women to fear and be on the alert for predatious men, and call out predatory behaviors in your fellow menfolk, that is helpful.

    I still remember being very young and walking home one long dark block from the High Park subway station in Toronto, keys grasped firmly and protruding between my fingers in a fist if in the event I confronted the High Park rapist and killer. At one point I was reading a book on the open public lawns by the tennis courts, and felt someone creeping through the bushes to spy on me or anyone else. Took a circuitous route home and called the cops. They met me and drove me through the park in search of him, and I saw where the one woman was raped and killed – so close to families enjoying a day in the park – and how easy that would have been to do.

    There will always be a dark underside to humanity, and also men need to rise up and say this is not what a man does – this is not how a man who is a credit to his gender behaves. Women can walk and protest and out the bad guys, but we also need you good men to intercede and teach what is acceptable male behavior, so we women do not have to spend our lives in fear of being raped or killed.

  131. 131
    Origuy says:

    @Another Scott: Not just any drag queens, those were the Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence. They were founded in 1979 in SF.

  132. 132
    jl says:

    I predict that the names Kamala Harris, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie, and Joe Biden will not appear in the docs. So, who cares? Will Barack Obama’s name appear?

    How long can the GOP use the Clintons as bogey people to bash Democrats? How long can that be a thing? Serious question. The GOP has absurdly used them as semi-legendary folkloric cartoon villains for decades. For the wingnuts, they’re like krampus, or the grinch.

    Why would anyone care except QAnon lunatics.

  133. 133
    PeakVT says:

    From the DB article, it sounds like Epstein’s “charities” are either incompetent or highly suspect. Were they fronts?

  134. 134
    Cacti says:


    Every serious Dem candidate will be asked about it within the week.

  135. 135
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    is it possible that after more than 25 years, we’re gonna start talking about Bubba’s li’l bubba again?

  136. 136
    sdhays says:


    How long can the GOP use the Clintons as bogey people to bash Democrats? How long can that be a thing? Serious question.

    At least a generation after both Bill and Hillary are dead and Chelsea shuts herself up in a remote village in tropical Alaska.

  137. 137
    Jay says:


    Tradesmen Liens can be very powerful tools.

    A local Lawyer stiffed me on a $32k reno job on a rental house, and offered me $10k instead. I walked away and filed a lien. Here, all I need to do to file is a copy of the contract, invoicing, and proof that work was done. ( it doesn’t have to be completed).

    The lien attaches to title and the property cannot be transferred or refinanced with out the lien being discharged.

    I get to attach any legal costs to the lien, can charge up to 32% interest a year, ( accrued monthly) and can borrow against the lien.

    They tried to take me to arbitration, but that’s volentary, and rigged, so I passed.

    They won’t take me to Court, because they will lose.

    They are now trying to reach out for accomodation, because next September, they are up for refinancing. They now owe $110,000 on the lien debt on a house worth $270,000.

  138. 138
    sdhays says:

    @PeakVT: Wasn’t there some other supposedly rich guy whose charitable foundation was shut down recently? Name escapes me. Whatever happened to that guy?

  139. 139
    J R in WV says:

    My worst experience on a jury, ever, was a grand jury session here in Sw WV, because there were several molester to be indicted.

    The worst was a toss up between the monster with photos of his daughter and a younger man who specialized in rape of young retarded girls in town, mostly because they couldn’t really describe what he did to them.

    I was on two petit juries for capital murder cases, neither one was as bad as that one day of grand jury work. OMG it was horrible to see things you can’t unsee — you have to look at the evidence to be able to determine whether or not to hand up indictments.

    No punishment is sufficient adequate for those who attack children in my book!

  140. 140
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Jay: If only Shitler’s creditors could do that. Sigh.

  141. 141
    Mary G says:

    I have infinite respect and admiration for the victims and their attorneys for hanging in with dogged pursuit of making this human slug pay for his crimes. They probably were offered big money settlements to shut up and go away, nevertheless they persisted.

    Also for reporter Julie Brown and everyone at the Herald.

    But Bob Barr is shameless amoral fixer and I imagine he will slow walk letting the investigation go beyond Epstein and use his “Republican presidents are above the law” creed to keep Twitler, and probably Acosta out of the story using the massive disinformation campaign that Adam describes.

  142. 142
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @Baud: Trump likes them on the young side, just saying.

  143. 143
    PeakVT says:

    @jl: The media will care because it has a colossal double-standard: Dems are expected to be uniformly good, Repukes are expected to be comprehensively bad. Deviations are punished and rewarded respectively.

  144. 144
    Juice Box says:

    @jl: The GOP used Carter as an example of the certain failure of Democratic presidents until the Obama administration.

  145. 145

    @joel hanes: Yeah, I read Bill’s book too.

  146. 146
    Spanky says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: I have long suspected that’s what’s on the P tape. “P” does not stand for “pee”.

  147. 147
  148. 148
    sukabi says:

    @Kay: the massage parlor that Kraft was busted in also has a huge Maralago connection.

  149. 149
    Juice Box says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Pretty much. Given the age demographic in the party, there’s a high percentage of dementia. Or maybe they just get themselves so spun up over HRC and AOC that they can’t be bothered with Carter.

  150. 150
    Martin says:

    @frosty: I’d say it’s on the light side, but certainly not immune.

  151. 151
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Martin: I/T firms are notorious for sexual harrassment. Notorious.

  152. 152
    Martin says:

    @Chetan Murthy: Yeah, I was thinking more traditional engineering. Tech is a shitshow, no question.

  153. 153
    Jay says:

    The brain hemorrhage and not being able to perform simple tasks like holding a plate of food won’t stop Andy Ngo from flying across the country to bait counter protestors.— CascadianGroyperRadar (@WestWAFrogHunt) July 6, 2019

    Because everybody knows, when you are allegedly suffering from bleeding on the brain and neurological damage the approved treatment is to climb into a low pressure tube for 5 hours.

  154. 154
    plato says:

    The so called creamy layer is so creepy and sleazy. The rotten stench starts with the head.

  155. 155
    hitchhiker says:


    Lewinsky didn’t know Lucianne Goldberg, but Linda Tripp did. Tripp and Goldberg had been trying to do a book deal about the death of Vince Foster in 93 and 94, and they got to be friends. (Tripp worked at the White House, and Goldberg was a publisher’s agent.)

    It was Goldberg’s idea to (illegally) tape Lewinsky when she told Tripp about her affair with Clinton, and Goldberg who thought it would be important to hang onto that dress.

    Tripp is one of the most evil people in this story, imo. Clinton is because he knew that Lewinsky was persuading herself that they were in love and he let her think that while taking what he wanted from her. Goldberg is because she didn’t know any of these people but was happy to see them all destroyed. Starr is because he certainly knew these were not crimes against the nation but went for impeachment recommendations anyway. Kavanaugh is because he authored the soft porn creative non fiction known as the Starr Report.

    But Linda Tripp is the worst, because she encouraged the young Lewinsky to confide in her and then taped her — and THEN turned the tapes over to the Starr attorneys. Lewinsky, to her credit, has never been in doubt about what a betrayal that was.

  156. 156
    Raoul says:


    Trump in 2002, NY Magazine: “I’ve known Jeff for fifteen years. Terrific guy. He’s a lot of fun to be with. It is even said that he likes beautiful women as much as I do, and many of them are on the younger side. No doubt about it – Jeffrey enjoys his social life.”— Steven Beschloss (@StevenBeschloss) July 7, 2019

  157. 157
    Jay says:

    Residents in a West Philadelphia neighborhood are accusing the far-right, neo-fascist organization the Proud Boys of making armed “house calls” to harass and threaten private citizens.

  158. 158
    Emma says:

    @hitchhiker: I am amazed at the rewriting of Monica Lewinsky’s history. This is a young woman who told at least one friend that she was going to Washington “to get her presidential kneepads.” I remember that specifically because someone had to explain the colloquialism to me. Yes, she was young and she was manipulated that those two unholy w(b)itches, but she was not a sweet young Harlequin romance heroine either.

    I do resent Clinton’s role because, dammit, he should have known that the ratf(u)ckers would be gunning for him. And he still couldn’t keep his pants zipped. I have always hoped that Hillary did brain him with that lamp, enough for stitches and an almighty headache.

  159. 159
    patrick II says:


    Neither Clinton nor Lewinsky had a lot to be proud of, but adventurous young women have affairs with powerful men sometimes. If that was all that happened, she would have eventually looked at the affair with regret — or not, but either way, it would have diminished with time and she would go on to do whatever she was going to do — be a career person, or get married and have kids, or whatever. The affair would have been a small part of her life. However, Republicans with a political agenda used her to get to the president and publicly humiliated her and sent her to therapy for years, not because of what she did, but because they could use what she did to embarrass the president.
    Bill Clinton had a sexual affair with Lewinsky, the Republican party committed sexual abuse of Lewinsky.

  160. 160
    Starfish says:

    @frosty: You were saying?

    The people who do not ask before they start talking about their polyamory as if they are explaining something that is either new or interesting are often engineers.

  161. 161
    Gregory says:

    This has the potential to expose a lot of powerful men in the US and elsewhere. Democrats, Republicans, politicians, businessmen, as well as other elites and/or notables. And, most likely as was the case with Ghislaine Maxwell, some women who enabled or covered up this crime spree as well.

    Let justice be done though the heavens fall.

  162. 162
    Another Scott says:

    @Mary G: William, not Robert.

    Robert is another, er, unsavory character.


  163. 163
    Searcher says:

    @joel hanes: It just now occured to me the man smoked cigars, not cigarettes.

  164. 164

    @Spanky: You’re probably right since power does seem to corrupt. But I suspect asshole women in power will commit abuses of a different kind. Rape is much less likely.

  165. 165
    Ruckus says:

    I’ve owned two small businesses. The first was significantly bigger than the second and we had to sue a couple of times to get paid. Lost just over $20,000. on one and collected on the other. The one I lost on cost $5,000. just to lose. I understand about collecting on debts with bigger customers. One of the reasons that I got out of that when the getting was good.
    On your second point. I lost money. I could have spent more money chasing money but at some point you cut your losses and move on, it’s just more profitable. For a big company or a fat cat like drumpf thinks he is, it’s almost a joke, “Hey look, I fucked another one!” That’s winning to him and his brethren, the real people cut our losses and hopefully learn something about trust, who too and who not too.
    On your second point. Those women lost a lot more than I ever did out of my bank account. And the company that screwed me, they did that to a lot of vendors, because they were assholes. And it cost them, they are no longer in business. They were kind of a household name, now gone. Eventually they screwed enough people that no one would build tools for them and they were gone. But those women got figuratively and literally fucked. You can’t earn more of what they lost, it’s not a bank account. But to their attackers everything is about money, how to get more, how to buy stuff and people with it, how to be BMOC because of how much you’ve got, how to buy power to hold over people. Not everyone with money is like this but most seemingly are to some degree.

  166. 166
    Ruckus says:

    They use the Clintons because they were a couple of political people on the other side they could demonize. And they were democrats from the south. That gave them an extra bit of seasoning in the mix. But mainly the Clintons were rising stars in the democratic party and shutting them down would seem like a huge deal to ratfuckers. And both of the Clintons were never apologetic about their politics because they didn’t need to be, while republicans have nothing to run on but hate. Their policies are horrible for economically normal people. Their ethics register at zero on any scale. The Clintons were the ideal hate recipients for the republican party. The Clintons are now history but there is an entire Clinton hate apparatus section of the republican party, they are one track minded people who haven’t been redirected to someone else to hate, primarily because the republican party is too busy trying to steal everything not tied down and a bunch of stuff that is.

  167. 167
    wasabi gasp says:

    Whether it turns out he was involved or not, the circling of the Clinton wagons here is a sad display of your collective yas qween brain rot.

  168. 168
    Ted Mills says:

    Maxwell, by the way, is the daughter of former newspaper magnate (and currently successful corpse) Robert Maxwell.

  169. 169
    Ruckus says:

    @wasabi gasp:
    I would do that for anyone accused without any proof. And there seems to be no proof for Bill to be involved, other than he, a powerful person knew, Epstein at some level. If you have or know of any proof that he was more than a consenting adulterer, I’d like to know.

  170. 170
    wasabi gasp says:

    @Ruckus: It’s like you’re captioning your cat scan.

  171. 171
    Tnwin says:

    @Adam L Silverman: u
    I’m ready. If Clinton’s guilty then he’s as big a scumbag as the others. Let him fry.

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