Keeping the Shit at Shoe Level

If we’re still talking about abortion, here’s a dispatch from my current heartland location, where “Abortion Kills a Beating Heart” and “It’s a Child Not a Choice” billboards herald your arrival to a lot of little towns.

The South Dakota legislature has at least one anti-abortion bill on their to-do list every year. This year, they had two. One required that women wanting an abortion sign a 13 page document prepared by the Department of Health, and initial every page. This one was simple fuckery – the single Planned Parenthood location that provides abortions had its own consent form, but apparently it wasn’t enough of a waste of time and paper. That bill passed and is now law. The other bill was an attempt to force women to have an ultrasound prior to an abortion, and also to hear the fetal heartbeat. This one failed because the anti-abortion lobby thought it was unconstitutional.

The reason that the anti-abortion advocates here are sensitive to whether a law is constitutional, no matter whether the Supremes are now wired to overturn Roe, is because they played with fire and got burned in the last decade. A law prohibiting abortion was overturned by a referendum (with a healthy 56-44 majority) in 2006. One of the arguments in that referendum was that litigating Supreme Court challenges is an expensive waste of time. (Another was that this bill didn’t have the exceptions for rape and incest – only the life of the mother.) Since then, legislators have pretty much stuck to throwing as much sand in the gears of what little abortion machinery is left in the state, without causing a court challenge.

Even in this red state, a good majority of people are not ready to overturn abortion. People will vote for legislators who want to overturn it, because of party affiliation, but those legislators are handcuffed by popular opinion, at least in this state.

The lesson I take home from this little bit of politics is that, at some point, even in the fucked up political environment that we’re experiencing today, popular opinion matters.






127 replies
  1. 1

    Re-upping from thread below because I am horrified by increased use of propaganda.

    The FDA confirms that it’s now required to keep all TV sets on site tuned to FOX

    BREAKING: "The current administration's administrative officials has requested that all monitors, under our control, on the White Oak Campus, display FOX news," the email reads.https://t.co/hhcQNbpyFi— Sandy By The Beach (@sandy06906) May 9, 2019

  2. 2
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    Even in this red state, a good majority of people are not ready to overturn abortion. People will vote for legislators who want to overturn it, because of party affiliation, but those legislators are handcuffed by popular opinion, at least in this state.

    Not so in Misery.

  3. 3
    tamiasmin says:

    Popular opinion matters, but it is subject to every form of influence and can change with the wind. So it really mostly matters on election day.

  4. 4
    Brachiator says:

    The lesson I take home from this little bit of politics is that, at some point, even in the fucked up political environment that we’re experiencing today, popular opinion matters.

    Let Trump fill up the courts with right wing goons and public opinion won’t mean a damn thing.

  5. 5
    Parfigliano says:

    SD born and bred. I escaped.

  6. 6
    laura says:

    Who’s going to be the next Becky Bell in this rush to protect the babby?
    The distain and hatred for women is on full display – and when someone tells you who they are, you best believe them. I have no idea where they intend to go – outlawing contraception, and then denying credit, property owning, work, driving?
    Seriously, what is the end game when you hate women this much?

  7. 7
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: If I was in charge of the FDA, I’d solve this by removing the TV sets. Why do they need them?

    Why we need TVs everywhere is beyond me. Doctors’ offices, car repair shops, the Post Office, hotel lobbies, restaurants, the list goes on.

    Cincinnati has a town square downtown, and it has a giant screen mounted atop the building across the street.

    Okay, I get you have be able to watch sports at bars. I don’t frequent bars all that much anyway. But the rest of them can go. They are invading my brain space.

  8. 8
    oatler. says:

    Maybe if the anti abortion bills pass we’ll be able to boot out those motherfuckers from popular outrage.

  9. 9
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    Why we need TVs everywhere is beyond me.

    I would say illiteracy but I think it’s really pure laziness.

  10. 10
    White & Gold Purgatorian says:

    Popular opinion can be a check on idiots who get elected by exploiting “hot button” issues or just being of the “right” party affiliation, but only if there is a path for that public opinion to be expressed. Letters to the editor and calls to legislators are fine, but I don’t think they move the needle very much. It sounds like the referendum in SD is what made the legislature a little more cautious. Living in a highly gerrymandered state with no referendum and no recall, I promise you our legislators are only interested in pleasing their most rabid supporters. The opinion of the rest of the public is irrelevant— even if they should happen to hear it.

  11. 11
    Kay says:

    @laura:

    “to prevent a serious risk of the substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function.”

    It’s not subtle. The mother is subordinate to the birth. She comes second. Most of the statutes don’t mention the woman at all. She’s seen as a pregnancy. That’s her only value.

    But Republicans and conservatives have been extreme om pregnancy laws forever- the sainted John McCain sneeringly referred to the “the health” of the mother. His assumption was the bitches were all lying. He needs to see them at death’s door before he’ll allow medical intervention, and then only to save their lives. “Permanent impairment” doesn’t concern him.

  12. 12
    Mike in NC says:

    Ironic that the wingnuts are so confident about banning abortion these days, when their Fat Bastard employed a fixer to arrange for abortions for the undocumented women that he impregnated.

  13. 13

    @Brachiator: I don’t buy this narrative that the RW is all powerful and that they have gamed out every eventuality and that they always win. They may be formidable but no one is invincible and all knowing.

  14. 14
    SRW1 says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Rare case of a government owned by a TV channel, not the more common other way round.

  15. 15
    White & Gold Purgatorian says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: I suspect there is a component of addiction to the visual stimulus television offers. TV people know this and spend a lot on visually interesting sets, not to mention wardrobes, makeup, plastic surgery, etc., so they can offer eyeball grabbing visuals to attract and hold attention even when the sound is off.

  16. 16

    @Kay: Yeah and these so called liberal media gatekeepers like Whory Woodruff at the Snooze Hour cried for McCain and Bush I at their funerals. Doubt she will do that for a D politician or a president.

  17. 17
    kindness says:

    Yet those same citizens vote for representatives that are happy to try to eliminate abortion.

    The dicotomy isn’t us. The paradox here is moderate Republicans will happily vote for people that aren’t representative of their views. And in a crowd, they won’t speak up to defend their own positions and just allow the forced birthers to control the issue. My whole clan was NE Republicans but they thought abortion was an individual’s choice and no one else’s. Times & the party have changed.

  18. 18
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    Even in this red state, a good majority of people are not ready to overturn abortion. People will vote for legislators who want to overturn it, because of party affiliation, but those legislators are handcuffed by popular opinion, at least in this state.

    Sure, they want forced pregnancies for the sluty slut slut she harlots who secretly enjoy their rapes at hands of well meaning white men who acted indiscreetly in a moment of understandable weakness, not for their own little princess who get by knocked up by some boy at a party who took advantage of little princesses innocence.

  19. 19

    Even in this red state, a good majority of people are not ready to overturn abortion. People will vote for legislators who want to overturn it, because of party affiliation, but those legislators are handcuffed by popular opinion, at least in this state.

    This. This bothers me to no goddamned end. I remember seeing just within the past year a chart of all 50 states where they tried to mark which ones showed a majority of residents supporting banning abortion outright… and not a single state had a majority of residents who did. If someone can find that map, please repost it.

    What’s happening here is a minority of residents – the bible-thumping hardcore wingnuts – are obsessed on this issue and want to ban abortions AND also ban birth control and God knows anything else that favors women. And they don’t care anymore that there COULD BE – hell, WILL BE – a massive backlash if they carried through on their threats to harm women’s access to health care. Because they’re now convinced of two things: 1) they have control of the courts from top to bottom and 2) the Republicans will suppress voter turnout enough to ensure control of state gov’ts and even parts of the federal (especially a Senate that’s doomed to be dominated by small rural (Red) states forever) to make sure their bans stay in place.

    Welcome to Conservative-Rule Hell

  20. 20

    @kindness: A lot of those Rs are Ds now, migrating over after Bush II, funny how our R media never does elebenty and one profiles of them.

  21. 21

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    funny thing, enforcement of these harsh anti-abortion laws will likely inflict the most harm on women of color, who are disproportionately poor and lacking in health care essentials. Those are the women most likely to miscarry and face the wrath of legal systems eagerly searching for scapegoats/targets to prove they are enforcing such laws.

    actually, it’s not funny at all.

  22. 22

    @SRW1: @Ohio Mom: Just the anti-science nature of FOX makes them completely unfit for the FDA. I’d also get rid of the TVs before I let that garbage in my building.

  23. 23
    Aleta says:

    reposting

    When I hear certain Republicans in Congress claim they (read: personally) “would not ban abortion in the case of rape,” I can clearly imagine how this loophole (*for themselves*) would be used to torment women in front of judges.

    They never mention the sexual and racial and class politics of reporting … going to trial (often required just to have a chance of a judgement of rape)… the tendency to offer the accused a plea down … and (under our system of fairness) how long this all takes when both woman and prosecutor decide to go through it.

    So how would this work, this offer and decision of abor tion allowed in the case of rape? How would it work “in the case of medical necessity,” when the GOP already refuses to give final authority to doctors and women, and treats science as irrelevant.

    (To be clear, this is an example of GOP hypocrisy, and those limitations are not at all acceptable.)

  24. 24
    rikyrah says:

    @Kay:

    It’s not subtle. The mother is subordinate to the birth. She comes second. Most of the statutes don’t mention the woman at all. She’s seen as a pregnancy. That’s her only value.

    Just absolutely enraging.

  25. 25
    rikyrah says:

    @PaulWartenberg:

    AND also ban birth control

    The birth control should be the flashing neon sign for the squishy middle. Yes, these muthaphuckas are coming for your BIRTH CONTROL, LIKE WE TOLD YOU THEY WERE.

  26. 26
    Aleta says:

    reposted

    Some (even a few progressive men wtf) say ‘at least abortion will still be available in some states’ … .

    As a way to study how to approach the politics in the fight — courts and particular judges, and how to write and try to pass laws, and who to trust with your vote, it’s useful; and as Imani Gandy says, it’s a way to have hope.

    As a reason to say ‘most women will be OK,’ it’s deplorable.

    Most women can’t leave their jobs, their kids, pets and other dependents, and in some cases a suspicious partner; or afford the cost of travel at least twice to 2-3 appointments and of lodging for 2-3 days. On top of the medical and prescription costs.

    Insurance coverage depends on a woman’s residence state, her work or her partner’s, and whether she is hiding it from anyone else on her policy. And on her fear of privacy invasion by her employer or other violation of her records if she does file for coverage.

    A few people are dedicated to, or planning to, help women in these states. They won’t be able to reach many women, for obvious reasons.

  27. 27

    @rikyrah: Serious question so is Georgia going to administer pregnancy tests to all women of child bearing age every month? How are they going to know otherwise whether or not you are pregnant. Who is going to do the testing?

  28. 28
    Baud says:

    @Brachiator:

    Let Trump fill up the courts with right wing goons and public opinion won’t mean a damn thing.

    That makes no sense in this context. If the courts overturn Roe, public opinion will be what matters most in deciding how draconian the restrictions are.

  29. 29
    MJS says:

    @PaulWartenberg: No, it’s not funny at all, because part of me thinks that the prison-industrial complex sees their cash-cow dying (jail time for even minor drug offenses), and their benefactors (Republicans) are helping them out by passing these laws, knowing that the poor won’t be able to fight charges, but the rich will never be bothered, much less charged.

  30. 30

    @Baud: That is the MSM mantra too, Rs win no matter what they do. We don’t have to propagate that propaganda ourselves. Its self defeating.

  31. 31
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: at the Patent Office cafeteria, which is open to the public, there are several TV screens behind the cashiers, so that the customers in line to checkout are faced with the screens. One screen is set permanently to Fox and can’t be turned off with a TV-B-Gone.

  32. 32
    Brachiator says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I don’t buy this narrative that the RW is all powerful and that they have gamed out every eventuality and that they always win.

    I don’t believe this either. Never have.

    People are fighting back. Sometimes the battle is tougher. There is 1 legal abortion clinic in South Dakota and 19 crisis pregnancy centers.

  33. 33
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Kay: In an earlier thread, you rightly pointed out that these are pregnancy regulation laws, not abortion laws. We need to adopt that framing for discussing them. These people are fanatics who are trying to impose their religion on the rest of us. Consequently, we’re under no obligation to treat their outrageous demands as just another political opinion. They are enemies to be defeated.

  34. 34

    @Kayla Rudbek: That’s Orwellian level propaganda distribution.

  35. 35
    trollhattan says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:
    Still in effect? Article dateline is 2017.

  36. 36

    @trollhattan: Good question. Kayla’s comment at #34 suggests yes. That is, if it’s enforced in one federal agency, I assume it is in others.

  37. 37
    ruemara says:

    Sorry Mix, but this is bullshit. Women have watched their rights erode through access laws, now we have outright murder laws connected to our wombs. Popular opinions especially from menfolk don’t mean diddly squat. Stop minimizing it and recognize that they can give their opinions about it – because they like the rights for themselves. What they won’t do is not vote for pro-women’s rights legislators and that’s all you need to know about their goddamned fucking opinions. So fuck them and fuck minimizing what’s happening.

  38. 38
    bemused says:

    From Rewire: Ohio Rep John Becker, aka This Fucking Guy defends his anti-abortion bill claiming contraceptives cause abortion (false) and ectopic pregnancies can be fixed by simply sticking the errant embryo into the pregnant person’s uterus (no medical technology exists and ectopic pregnancies are not viable).
    These people are insanely stupid and evil.

  39. 39
    Brachiator says:

    @Baud:

    Let Trump fill up the courts with right wing goons and public opinion won’t mean a damn thing.

    That makes no sense in this context. If the courts overturn Roe, public opinion will be what matters most in deciding how draconian the restrictions are.

    I wasn’t really referring to overturning Roe. I am not even sure that this would be a big deal, apart from the symbolic aspect. I was thinking more of lower court rulings, and all the little bullshit restrictions that are being placed on women’s reproductive rights. And gerrymandering and other state level games produce Republican majority state legislatures that can fight or nullify public opinion.

    As noted, South Dakota citizens are fighting back. But as I also noted, there is 1 abortion provider and 19 crisis pregnancy centers in South Dakota. Those are tough odds for women needing reproductive services.

  40. 40
    Matt McIrvin says:

    The GA law was signed by an illegitimately elected governor who ran his own election as state secretary of state. If the election is rigged it takes, at the very least, a bigger backlash.

  41. 41
    sherparick says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: In every department and agency, Trump’s and Mulvaney’s Heritage minions, who are essentially idiots and twits from America’s prep schools and Evangelical campuses, but with a low cunning instinct to pleas their masters, are slowly destroying the Government and country. have been remiss in not bringing people’s attention to this purge. From Politico:

    Economists in the Agriculture Department’s research branch say the Trump administration is retaliating against them for publishing reports that shed negative light on White House policies, spurring an exodus that included six of them quitting the department on a single day in late April. https://www.politico.com/story/2019/05/07/agriculture-economists-leave-trump-1307146

  42. 42
    ruemara says:

    @schrodingers_cat: They’re not, but giving up is liberal brand.

  43. 43
    mad citizen says:

    @Ohio Mom: Totally agree with you. Not having so many screens might make us focus on human-human interaction. I’ve reported on the tv in my large Indy office building before–it was very visible above an open lobby to a large space. The office side shares the giant space with one of those large, tall Hyatt Hotels from the 1970s. For a decade when my job moved to this building, it was on Fox News; then for a short time it would have CNN or even MSNBC on it, then they tried ESPN. A few months ago they removed the tv and put up three nondistinct abstract canvas thingys in the spot. I guess we’re all happier for it–probably their way of dealing with complaints about the content. Personally with the electric connection there I think they should have done some cool electronic art.

    As for the patent office cafeteria Fox News screen, maybe some wayward salad dressing or worse (spray paint?) might hit the screen. Save it for your last day of work there.

  44. 44
    Jager says:

    A couple of personal anecdotes:

    In 1973 when Roe V Wade became law, my 75 year old grandmother was visiting, she made a wonderful comment, “Finally someone besides the rich girls can get help”.

    When my oldest girl was a senior in high school, My Mother and I walked her through a line of screaming protestors outside an abortion clinic. Today she runs the student guidance and counseling program at a top flight California high school and is the mother of three great kids. And yes, her 90 year old great grandmother agreed with her decision.

  45. 45

    @ruemara: PTSD from the Reagan era?

  46. 46
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @mad citizen: I am moderately surprised that the electrical engineering patent examiners haven’t come up with a override for the TV screen. They can’t all be Republicans or apolitical.

  47. 47

    OT: My bed in a box is arriving any minute! I’m getting ready to take pics.

  48. 48
    Brachiator says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Serious question so is Georgia going to administer pregnancy tests to all women of child bearing age every month? How are they going to know otherwise whether or not you are pregnant. Who is going to do the testing?

    This is not a totally fanciful question. I could easily imagine a bartender refusing to serve any woman alcohol on the chance that she might be pregnant. I could see intrusive interventions to try to make sure that a woman was not traveling out of state to try to obtain an abortion.

    Reproductive rights is a civil rights issue. This should increase the Democrats’ advantage and even energize sane progressives.

  49. 49
    Dr Ronnie James DO says:

    @Ohio Mom: Much like how USA Today became “America’s #1 newspaper” by being given away free at hotels, I’m convinced Fox News gets a disproportionate share of its ratings by being left on km hospital rooms.

  50. 50
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @mad citizen: unfortunately my last day is far too forward in the future for the spray paint. I would settle for the weather channel or ESPN at this point, and yes I have complained about the channel choices. I think that many of the customers tend to get into the lines that face either the CNN screen or the internal notices screens.

  51. 51
    WhatsMyNym says:

    @Kayla Rudbek: Most work cafeterias I’ve been in just want to get you thru the line as fast as possible, because they’re busy. They don’t want the customer to be distracted by TV screens.

    Maybe they’re trying to encourage you to move along? /s

  52. 52
    mad citizen says:

    @Kayla Rudbek: Ha! Yes, if I had a choice of lines, I would willingly wait longer to avoid having the Fox News in front of me. Next time I’m in D.C. maybe I’ll have lunch at the cafeteria there :)

  53. 53
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @schrodingers_cat: You won’t be shocked to learn that one of my strongest formative political memories is watching Reagan’s 49-state landslide of 1984 while living in a white white conservative neighborhood where most people adored him. My default assumption, even living in Massachusetts, is still that most people around me are fire-breathing conservatives and will find my liberal opinions off-putting and bizarre. And it’s still a little surprising whenever I find out they don’t.

  54. 54
    ruemara says:

    @Brachiator: I can see testing reqs becoming an add on

  55. 55
    Jess says:

    Here’s good question to ask anti-abortion folks: If it turns out that you are the one perfect potential kidney donor for someone who will otherwise die without it, should it be illegal for you to refuse to give up your kidney? Of course not, because it’s YOUR body, and you get to say how it will be used. Are you a murderer if you refuse to give your kidney? Maybe, but that’s for YOU to decide, not the state. Body autonomy–it’s a thing.

  56. 56

    @Brachiator: Coming to a red state near you. Moral Police sanctioned by the R junta.

  57. 57
    rikyrah says:

    Schiff proposes heavy fines for stonewalling congressional probes
    Rep. Adam Schiff, chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, talks with Rachel Maddow about how in some cases the Trump administration’s refusal to share information with his committee violates the law, and suggests Congress use heavy fines or imprisonment for contempt to compel cooperation.
    May 9, 2019

  58. 58
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @Jess: Or to put it bluntly, a woman’s corpse has more rights than a woman’s living body.

  59. 59
    tobie says:

    Josh Marshall just posted a terrifying statement about how the Trump admin is using all its leverage to get Ukraine to furnish material to be used against the President’s enemies. They’ve set their sights on Hillary and Biden, and no matter how flimsy the evidence that they dig up is, it will air 24/7 on Fox and talk radio.

    As you know, Ukraine remains highly dependent on the United States, diplomatically, economically and even militarily, at least in the sense of arms sales. Russia continues a de facto occupation/insurgency in the country’s east…There’s already substantial evidence that Trump used his leverage to get the Ukraine government to end its cooperation with the Mueller probe in 2018. There’s really little question this happened. The open question is whether the President or his representatives had to ask explicitly or whether the government didn’t need to be told.

    ETA: Paul Waldman has got an op ed in the Post on this too. Glad the story’s getting attention. It’s ominous.

  60. 60
    Kay says:

    “Students for Trump” founder is going to prison:

    Last month, Lambert, now 23, showed up in the news again. This time, he had been arrested in Tennessee on charges of wire fraud. According to the federal government, at the same time he was building a nationwide political network and serving as one of the most visible young faces of Trump’s populist movement, Lambert was also posing online as a high-powered New York lawyer, eventually making off with tens of thousands of dollars in fees he stole from unwitting clients seeking legal services.

    Count yourselves lucky- he was headed to law school. He would have been on the Supreme Court.

  61. 61
    Jess says:

    @Kayla Rudbek: Don’t know whether to laugh or cry…

  62. 62
    ruemara says:

    @Kay: Is there no… well, not decent, but at least not an utter crook, connected to Trump?

  63. 63
    Kent says:

    Folks, I lived for over a decade in Fundi-land (Waco TX). A couple of points of clarification here.

    1. They aren’t worried about universal enforcement of these sorts of draconian bans. The WHOLE POINT is discriminatory enforcement, just as is the case with drug laws. Of course middle class white women aren’t going to get pregnancy tested or be subject to any of this for the most part. The laws will just sit there on the books to be employed from time to time by racist GOP DAs who want to make examples of women of color or white druggies or other “fallen” types. That is when the full draconian weight of the law is going to be deployed and you’ll see the poor black or Hispanic mom with the drug dealing boyfriend get hauled into court for illegal miscarriage due to drugs or whatever. Discriminatory (discretionary) enforcement is a FEATURE not a bug of these sorts of laws.

    2. The ONLY way to fight this sort of thing is through the pocketbook. Women’s groups and other liberal groups need to absolutely start boycotting states that don’t protect women’s health. Stop the conventions, stop the travel, boycot the Superbowl, boycott companies that move to these locations. That sort of thing they do notice. No woman should EVER schedule a vacation or attend a convention or business meeting in Georgia if this sort of atrocity remains on the books. And no man should either for that matter.

  64. 64
    Kay says:

    Along with an unnamed co-conspirator, Lambert allegedly created a business called “Headline Consulting” to offer legal services over the internet and proceeded to create a profile on a freelancing platform under the alias Eric Pope, who was initially described as a legal consultant. Later, Lambert allegedly changed the profile to describe Pope as an attorney.
    Despite this alleged undertaking, Lambert did not neglect the presidential campaign, continuing to pump Trump on social media and at campaign events. Hillary Clinton’s supposed criminality was an ongoing theme. That same month, August, Lambert tweeted, “#WheresHillary – Drumming up lies to answer questions about her server. Amazing how a federal judge can ruin your day right @HillaryClinton.”

    We stopped this white collar criminal early in his crime career. Imagine if Donald Trump had been investigated earlier.

  65. 65
    Kay says:

    @ruemara:

    So funny. The group’s founders split up almost immediately over who got a cut of the funds. Then Trump sent the group a cease and desist letter because they were selling Trump-branded merch.

    Okay, so this is the President of the United States and a 22 year old college student battling over which one of them gets the cash from the Trump-supporting rubes. They run the grift right out of the Oval Office.

  66. 66
    sherparick says:

    @Kay: About their own daughters, spouses, and girlfriends this changes, and I am sure the White, Wealthy, Republican “gentlemen” will get them to a state where the “matter” can be taken care of discreetly. And no bothersome Georgia prosecutor will be snooping around with an indictment for conspiracy to murder in such cases. But if a relative or friend buys a Black woman gets bought a bus ticket to get to state where abortion might be legal, you can be sure the white prosecutor will bring every charge he can to bear on the family. Every felony conviction is one less voter, and one or more unpaid worker for the private prison industry.

  67. 67
    Kay says:

    @ruemara:

    The presidency will never be the same. The Trump Family have made the whole place so sleazy it’s irredeemable.

  68. 68
    ruemara says:

    @sherparick: Yep.

    @Kay: It’s amazing how much destruction has happened in just 3 years.

  69. 69
    rikyrah says:

    @Kay:

    Count yourselves lucky- he was headed to law school. He would have been on the Supreme Court.

    No lie told

  70. 70
    rikyrah says:

    @Kay:

    Okay, so this is the President of the United States and a 22 year old college student battling over which one of them gets the cash from the Trump-supporting rubes. They run the grift right out of the Oval Office.

    not surprised by this at all

  71. 71
    Kay says:

    @sherparick:

    They want to regulate all aspects of pregnant women’s lives, and these laws allow them to do that. The Republican monitors will be in place 2 weeks after conception, overseeing pregnant women and sniffing around medical records looking for crimes.

    The status of being pregnant now means you are subject to investigations by random religious nuts, armed with state law.

  72. 72
    rikyrah says:

    🤔🤔🤔
    A top @BernieSanders adviser and negotiator on the campaign’s historic labor contract was convicted of embezzling union funds in 2013. When reached for comment, Jeff Weaver said @vtdigger was upholding systemic racism by reporting on Rocha’s past.https://t.co/4svz4jzBgU

    — Kit Norton (@KitNorton) May 9, 2019

  73. 73
    germy says:

    Lol. Clarifying my prediction: It will be @kenvogel of the @nytimes who peddles what Mr. Giuliani makes up in the Ukraine.

    Feb 23 2017: The New York Times launched their new marketing campaign: “the truth is more important now than ever”. https://t.co/n4slP1it3v— Soledad O'Brien (@soledadobrien) May 10, 2019

  74. 74
    joel hanes says:

    @Kayla Rudbek:

    I would settle for the weather channel or ESPN at this point

    You can’t change the channel, but you can discreetly turn the shit show off.
    https://www.tvbgone.com/

  75. 75
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    I have said time and time again there is one way to solve this. On December 31 of every year everyone in the US has to register as “anti abortion” or “pro choice”. As of January 1, all abortion (and perhaps birth control) is banned. The first child born after the abortion ban is then delivered to the door of the first name on the “anti abortion” list to raise until age 18. No exceptions, no giving up for adoption. This will carry on for the rest of the year until December 31 when everyone has to re-register as “anti abortion” or “pro choice”. I can guarantee you after the second year when the “anti abortion” gang have three or four children to raise they will change their minds, fast and in a hurry as Major Payne says.

  76. 76
    Kent says:

    @Kay:

    @sherparick:

    They want to regulate all aspects of pregnant women’s lives, and these laws allow them to do that. The Republican monitors will be in place 2 weeks after conception, overseeing pregnant women and sniffing around medical records looking for crimes.

    The status of being pregnant now means you are subject to investigations by random religious nuts, armed with state law.

    You are wrong about this. That’s not how it will work. These laws are deliberately broad and open to discretionary enforcement. What that means in practice is that good god-fearing middle class white women will have nothing to fear at all. The racist good old boy DAs who enforce these laws will use them to target the wrong kind of women. Women of color, poor women with substance abuse issues. Perhaps college radicals and other “uppity” women. They will go hunting through the records of women who have come to their attention for other reasons and use these laws as a massive hammer to punish and make examples of those who stray. It will be very selectively enforced for political reasons.

    That’s how it will actually work. And the GOP flocks who attend fundie churches will cheer them on.

  77. 77
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ruemara: Of course public opinion matters. At the moment, we cannot trust that the court system at the federal level will rule in favor of people having control over their own bodies. If an abortion case comes before the current Supreme Court, I would expect that it would either explicitly overturn Roe or gut it completely. In either case, the issue would be handled at the state level. If public opinion is strongly in favor of a woman’s right to control her own body, legislators and elected judges would need to think about that before choosing to limit women’s rights. Is it complete bullshit that public opinion comes into play here? Yes, it is.

    FWIW I believe that adults have a right to total autonomy over their bodies – from tattoos and cosmetic surgery to birth control, abortion, and euthanasia. At this point, the courts don’t agree with me.

  78. 78
    AM in NC says:

    I want every non-zealot lawmaker to introduce legislation stating that every man who impregnates a women must be forced to undergo organ-match testing, and if they match someone, they must be forced to donate bone marrow, or one kidney, etc. to keep another person alive. If the state can deprive women of bodily autonomy in order to force them to keep another person alive simply because they had sex and created a zygote, then it should apply to men who create a zygote as well. Equal. Fucking. Protection. Assholes.

    This is personal for me. I had a miscarriage at the 11-12 week point in my first pregnancy – fetus died, and it was discovered in an ultrasound at the doctor’s office. I could have waited until I spontaneously ejected the fetus and placental tissue, or I could have had a D&E – an abortion. I opted for the D&E, rather than risking sepsis, or having my body expel the fetus while I was driving, or at work, or on an airplane. Under GA law, I could easily be suspected of and prosecuted for murder. And my two actual children would never have had a chance to be born. I am so mad I want to burn shit down.

  79. 79
    ruemara says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: It does not. It has not. Do you not see the laws currently on the books? Christ.

  80. 80
    Wayne Marks says:

    Going through with an abortion is heart-rending, most especially for the woman, but also for the man (if he even cares to stick around – often not). I took my college girlfriend for one. She had dropped out (re-started later successfully), and I had no intention of not completing my education. Unintended pregnancies carried to term create poverty and violence. I’m sorry about it every day, but the alternative may well have been much worse. What kind of child will you raise if everyday you look at he/she as a burden? As your spouse as a burden? As her family a burden? And she to you feeling all the same things. Eff those anti-abortion people – it’s none of your damned business.

  81. 81
    rikyrah says:

    😂😂😂
    Sometimes , the truth is simple

    Trying to beat Biden by claiming Obama was actually bad is a fool’s game. You can’t win the Dem Primary without Black people and it is impossible to convince Black voters that Obama was bad. If those are your only arguments you are going to lose badly.

    — Marcus H. Johnson (@marcushjohnson) May 10, 2019

  82. 82

    I’m not sure D voters vote based solely on abortion access, but increasingly, women are voting because the Rs are driving them back to the stone age. These laws add to that fury.

  83. 83
    Soprano2 says:

    @Kay: They see the mother as a vessel for their precious offspring, that’s all. The minute she becomes pregnant they believe she’s not a separate person anymore – she’s a pregnancy, full stop. It’s enraging and disgusting.

  84. 84
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @rikyrah: Team Trump must be worried about Biden – they’re sending Rudi Giuliani to Ukraine to try to get the newly-elected President to provide damaging information about Hunter Biden’s business interests there.

  85. 85

    @Gin & Tonic: How do you think we should react to his fear of Biden? Are his animal political instincts telling him something? Is he saying another old white guy who’s not Sanders and thinking obviously he’s the biggest rival? I’m not sure.

  86. 86
    Catherine D. says:

    What Georgia et al are proposing is actually the law in El Salvador, and women are in jail following miscarriages.

    I’m glad I sent a check last week to our local Planned Parenthood and specified it for the abortion fund.

  87. 87
    Regine Touchon says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:
    As well here in Gilead,Alabama. Praise be.

  88. 88
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @joel hanes: no, I bought one, it briefly worked, and then they disabled the display response to it. So I need an electrical engineer or computer scientist to work out how to turn the screen off when a TV-B-Gone won’t work

  89. 89
    Betty Cracker says:

    @AM in NC:

    I am so mad I want to burn shit down.

    Same. I went through a high-risk pregnancy that could have gone bad at any moment, killing me and the then-fetus. Things turned out fine for us, but for months, it was a hideously stressful ordeal, and the only thing that would have made it even worse was if religious zealots had a say in the outcome. Fuck every one of those busybody assholes with every rusty farm implement in the shed — sideways!

  90. 90
    TenguPhule says:

    @Kay:

    Count yourselves lucky- he was headed to law school. He would have been on the Supreme Court.

    What makes you think a criminal conviction would be a disqualifier these days?

  91. 91
    mali muso says:

    @Betty Cracker: Add me to the list of the furious. After going through two miscarriages (one ectopic), I am more insistent than ever on the sanctity of privacy in personal medical decisions. As a mother of a daughter who will be growing up in these dystopian times, I’m even more passionate about these issues than ever. Feels like I have been walking around the past few days reading these stories about “heartbeat bills” and pregnancy laws in a blind rage.

  92. 92
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I have no idea, and can’t run the risk to my own mental health of attempting to put myself in the mind of that asshole. It’s just that, as you’re aware, I follow events in Ukraine and Eastern Europe pretty closely.

  93. 93
    TenguPhule says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    I have said time and time again there is one way to solve this. On December 31 of every year everyone in the US has to register as “anti abortion” or “pro choice”. As of January 1, all abortion (and perhaps birth control) is banned.

    Uh, one of the reasons women get abortions is so that they don’t DIE.

    Perhaps you’d like to rethink this?

  94. 94
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ruemara: Yeah, and those laws are on the books because enough people in those states either support the laws or don’t give enough of a shit about them to vote out the god bothering assholes.

    Fundamental rights shouldn’t be subject to a vote, but too many people don’t think that bodily autonomy is a right.

  95. 95
    Cacti says:

    @TenguPhule:

    The nature of his crimes will likely prevent him from ever holding a law license.

  96. 96
    TenguPhule says:

    @Cacti:

    The nature of his crimes will likely prevent him from ever holding a law license.

    This too is no longer a bar to a federal judgeship these days.

  97. 97
    catclub says:

    At SLATE – forced arbitration taken to the infinity.

    The game gets going when a corporation adds an arbitration clause to contracts governing its consumers and employees. Thanks to the Supreme Court, these clauses are enforceable—and dramatically restrict individuals’ ability to enforce the law. Just ask employees of Lamps Plus, a California lighting company. In 2016, a hacker posing as a company official stole the tax filings of about 1,300 workers. Last month, the Supreme Court held that the workers could not come together to seek compensation for their employer’s slipshod security practices. When it comes to enforcing their rights, victims of data breaches, wage theft, and sexual harassment are forced to go it alone in secret—which usually means not going forward at all.

    Next, a federal agency treats arbitration as if it were the only way to enforce the law.

    I just want the owners of Maximum Security to be forced into arbitration when they want to sue Churchill Downs

  98. 98
    catclub says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    but too many people don’t think that bodily autonomy is a right.

    well, bodily autonomy for other people.

  99. 99
    Immanentize says:

    @Kay:

    to prevent a serious risk of the substantial and irreversible impairment of a major bodily function.

    You realize this is the definition John Yoo (now UC Berkeley Law Professor) and John Bybee (now US District Court Judge) came up for when they considered something was actually, legally (in this country alone) “torture.”

    So sick.

  100. 100
    Gravenstone says:

    @laura:

    Seriously, what is the end game when you hate women this much?

    Somewhere between Lysistrata and Lorena Bobbitt.

  101. 101
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @TenguPhule: It is harder to take a law license away than it is not to let someone get one in the first place.

  102. 102
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @catclub: That is true

  103. 103
    Cacti says:

    @TenguPhule:

    Link to any sitting Federal Judge who is a non-lawyer?

  104. 104
    Gravenstone says:

    @Kayla Rudbek:

    can’t be turned off with a TV-B-Gone

    A rock would probably work.

  105. 105
    James E Powell says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I don’t buy this narrative that the RW is all powerful and that they have gamed out every eventuality and that they always win. They may be formidable but no one is invincible and all knowing.

    How about this narrative: They are stupid and corrupt and they don’t have all the money, but they have tons of it and are more than willing to spend it to win elections. They control almost all of the press/media. They are persistent. They are without morals or any ethical restraints. Their voters are insanely loyal. Their grip on white people seems to increase every year. We have been losing to them over and over since 1980. Our only victories are one president who spent eight years trying to please the RWers and another president who spent two years trying to please RWers and six years being totally handcuffed by them.

    I could go on, but why?

  106. 106

    @James E Powell: The past is not a good predictor of the future.

  107. 107
    rikyrah says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:
    I am curious about it. Please post and tell us about it.

  108. 108

    @rikyrah: These are foam mattresses that they somehow compress, wrap in plastic, and suck all the air out of. Then they stick it in a box. Ours is king sized. When they deliver, they cut away all the wrapping and it expands. They told me it would continue to expand for another couple of hours. We’ll see what it’s like to sleep on and whether it’s durable. I posted pics to my FB page. I tried to take a video but I screwed it up.

  109. 109
    TenguPhule says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    The past is not a good predictor of the future.

    In a better timeline, this would be true.

  110. 110
    gvg says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Sounds like it would be a good idea to conceal all pregnancies as long as possible, even if you want it and are getting medical care. Docs may keep it confidential due to privacy laws..but don’t tell your friends family or coworkers until you have to in case you have a miscarriage. This is stupid and evil.
    Oh and when I was a teen, at least twice somebody started I was gossip I was pregnant. Mind you I was shy, not dating anyone either time, skinny and it was pretty stupid. I think some girls just liked to talk so much they had to make things up about boring people. My point is rumors are common, casual and wrong among the younger generations. that will have some consequences.

  111. 111
    rikyrah says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    So, you already have the box spring, and this is just the mattress?

  112. 112
    David Evans says:

    @Kay:

    “The status of being pregnant now means you are subject to investigations by random religious nuts, armed with state law.”

    Well, of course. You have now become a boarding house, and subject to periodic Health & Safety inspections.

  113. 113
    rikyrah says:

    I didn’t know this …did you?🤔🤔🤔

    I’ve read so many headlines about this “fake heiress” from Russia yet find it interesting that the fact that she’s in the U.S. illegally, according to ICE, is hardly ever mentioned. That tidbit was buried way deep into this story. https://t.co/08Qh1Qg8F2

    — Tatiana Sanchez (@TatianaYSanchez) May 9, 2019

  114. 114
    ruemara says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Which means, popular opinion means shit and the votes do. They can be ok with abortion rights all they want in polls. They vote every time against a woman’s right to choose. And that is all that matters.

    @rikyrah: I knew about her, did not know she was yet another illegal alien. And russian to boot? Ok, then.

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Mine from Amazon came that way. I will never get it back in the box, but OMG, I have a bed. Of course, I got laid off the minute I got a bed but correlation doesn’t equal causation unless you’re me & filled with PTSD

  115. 115

    @Kay: Is this a catholic theocracy? What about the fucking first amendment?

  116. 116
  117. 117
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ruemara: I am not going to fight with you over semantics.

  118. 118
    rikyrah says:

    😒😒🤔🤔
    Scoop: Through FOIA litigation, I’ve obtained docs showing what Russian agents Maria Butina and Alexander Torshin discussed in the 2015 meetings with Fed, Treasury officials.

    Hint: They couldn’t stop talking about the NRAhttps://t.co/zIj5EKHzeg

    — Tim Mak (@timkmak) May 10, 2019

  119. 119
    O. Felix Culpa says:

    @Brachiator:

    I am not even sure that this would be a big deal, apart from the symbolic aspect.

    Are you kidding? Overturning Roe v. Wade would be an ENORMOUS deal for women.

  120. 120
    Gravenstone says:

    @rikyrah: From the advertising I’ve seen, those types of “mattress in a box” systems don’t use box springs. Although I suppose you could mate one with an existing springs if you have them.

  121. 121
    WhatsMyNym says:

    @Gravenstone: You can also usually buy foam and a zip on cover to make your own mattress from a local foam supplier. The benefit of buying local is you can choose a denser foam.

  122. 122
    ruemara says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: This isn’t semantics. The difference between opinion and action is huge. Both have consequence, but only one has huge legislative consequences. You’re a man. You think that opinion is a big risk factor for this legislation. I’m a woman. And I’ve seen solid opinion that abortion is a right as legislation continues to impact abortion rights. One of us is more invested in the reality of the situation just due to sheer biology.

  123. 123
    J R in WV says:

    @Gravenstone:

    We bought a TempurPedic (sp? dunno) foam mattress some time back, and after sleeping on it for a while, I began to have low-grade back pain. Which looked to get worse over time.

    In the past I’ve had severe back pain, and so I lobbied hard to move the foam mattress to the guest room, and get a standard firm mattress for our bedroom. Much better. Cannot do foam for more than a bare few nights. And now hotels advertise those memory-foam mattresses! Blech!

  124. 124
    Brachiator says:

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    I am not even sure that this would be a big deal, apart from the symbolic aspect.

    Are you kidding? Overturning Roe v. Wade would be an ENORMOUS deal for women.

    I should have expanded on this. I think some focus on Roe and ignore the actual attacks on women’s reproductive rights happening in various states. You could have Roe re-affirmed all day long, but how does that help if a state has no abortion providers or women can be forced to endure pointless or even medically dangerous procedures in attempts to force them to give birth?

    But I should have emphasized that the battle is for all federal courts, not just the Supreme Court.

  125. 125
    O. Felix Culpa says:

    @Brachiator:

    I think some focus on Roe and ignore the actual attacks on women’s reproductive rights happening in various states.

    Perhaps among the proverbial low-info individuals, but not those of us who are engaged in protecting women’s access to health. The state-specific attacks are getting significant attention. In fact, the right wing’s goal to overturn Roe has heightened focus on state and local access. That said, thank you for your clarification.

  126. 126
    Ruckus says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:
    If the quality is good they last quite a while. And they are comfortable right up to the moment that they aren’t, no matter the quality.
    I’ve tried a couple and finally found what works better than the thicker and thicker that many try and sell. I have a 1 in memory foam over a somewhat stiff 1 in std foam mattress that is comfortable as all get out. Good support and no hot spots at all.

  127. 127
    Ruckus says:

    @J R in WV:
    The mattress I talked about in #126 is on a sheet of 3/4 plywood. No lower back issues at all and I’ve had a herniated disc. And it’s comfortable as all get out. We keep getting sold that a thicker mattress is better but it’s often not true at all. The quality of the mattress is. And there is little way for a customer to find that out except to purchase and sleep on it.

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