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You are here: Home / Politics / America / Another Day in the Third Year After the End of the American Century

Another Day in the Third Year After the End of the American Century

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I’m sure Stephen Miller’s and Kirstjen Nielsen’s parents are so proud…

Open thread!

Reader Interactions

224Comments

  2. 2.

    Brachiator

    I couldn’t stop thinking about little Merolin for the rest of the day.

    I hate shit like this. I fucking hate it.

    Why in the hell is a child appearing before an immigration judge? So that someone could say that the ceremonies of the law are being observed?

    Reminds me of Scalia once writing that an execution was OK as long as a defendant had some form of trial, even if it were manifestly unfair.

    Maybe someone should burn down the fucking court house.

    Meanwhile, Trump is at it again.

    If Mexico doesnโ€™t immediately stop ALL illegal immigration coming into the United States throug our Southern Border, I will be CLOSING…..
    ….the Border, or large sections of the Border, next week. This would be so easy for Mexico to do, but they just take our money and โ€œtalk.โ€ Besides, we lose so much money with them, especially when you add in drug trafficking etc.), that the Border closing would be a good thing!

  3. 3.

    waratah

    Thank you for posting, they just will not stop. Bringing attention to what they are doing does help they closed the childrenโ€™s near El Paso.not because just Democrats protested but because the women in his church base protested too.

  5. 5.

    tobie

    I have a friend who is an immigration attorney and I saw her the day after Kavanaugh was confirmed. I had hardly slept the night before and was in physical pain. She told she had just been to court for her youngest client, a 2-year-old Central American boy separated from his parents. It was a stark reminder–this is why we fight, even when we’re hurting.

  6. 6.

    SiubhanDuinne

    For those who haven’t seen it, here is the obituary for Peter Ross/EFGoldman. No specific date announced yet for the memorial service (some time in April) but I expect EFG Jr will check back in with us, or I’ll get details from Marilyn and share. Would be nice if a contingent of Jackals could be there in tribute.

    As for Stephen Miller and Kirstjen Nielsen … FUCKEMโ„ข

    m.legacy.com/obituaries/bostonglobe/obituary.aspx?n=peter-f-ross&pid=192023253&referrer=0&…

  11. 11.

    Brickley Paiste

    Fortunately, the Mueller report will be release soon an that will solve these problems.

  13. 13.

    Jeffro

    It really is like drinking from a fire hose, with the constant lying/gaslighting and non-stop race to the bottom. The media haven’t even had a chance to ask Betsy DeVos if she feels betrayed by Donnie for doing her best to lie about Special Olympics funding being cut. But we’re back to the blessed “humanitarian crisis on the southern border.” Tell us again, trumpov, about what a great and magnanimous guy you are for not machine-gunning the lot of them at the border.

  14. 14.

    chris

    @SiubhanDuinne: Thanks for that. Life is weird sometimes. I did not know (how could I?) that EFG and I went to the same high school. Ten years apart but still…

  16. 16.

    germy

    Iโ€™m sure Stephen Millerโ€™s and Kirstjen Nielsenโ€™s parents are so proudโ€ฆ

    I don’t think Miller’s family is proud. From what I’ve read, they’re deeply ashamed. I don’t know about Nielsen’s though.

  17. 17.

    cursorial

    This is horrifying, but not new, is it? Immigration courts have been in this territory for a while, definitely before Trump’s creatures decided to turn the faults in the system into features.

    I don’t understand how sane adults can show up for work where this happens, and not run out of the room screaming.

  20. 20.

    Gin & Tonic

    @SiubhanDuinne: That’s very nice. I just sent Marilyn and Kate a card of condolences. Depending on the location, that memorial might be something I could attend – certainly more easily than, say, BillinGlendale.

    Kind of an amusing story – late in the RIP thread from Tuesday, commenter Davis X. Machina was musing that at some point he’d suspected that efgoldman might have been Peter Ross, whom he (Davis) had revered from grad school days (well, nights.) So the other day I was poking around this here site, and found a thread from July 4, 2010, in which DougJ was proposing changing the national anthem. One thing led to another, and there was much discussion of classical music, broadcasting, etc., in which both efgolman and Davis were participating (Subaru Diane was in there too, I think.) Davis mentioned his admiration of nighttime announcer Peter Ross. I don’t think efgoldman tipped his hand at all, but I can’t know for sure, because all of his comments in that thread have been scrubbed. You can see several responses to him, but nothing of the comments being responded to.

  21. 21.

    Steeplejack

    This stuff makes me rage.

    When we eventually (I hope) get around to the Truth and Retribution Commissionsโ„ข, we should have a special court to process all the judges who have been party to these farcical proceedings involving children, even infants, with no legal representation. That none of them (that I am aware of) has stopped these travesties, or even protested them, is some 24-karat โ€œgood Germanโ€ action.

  22. 22.

    opiejeanne

    @Brachiator: I read that the border with Mexico is closed in at least one area and there was a picture of the backup of vehicles trying to get into the US at that point. I don’t remember where it was, dammit.

  24. 24.

    BobS

    These are the same motherfuckers that would have been cheering the Crucifixion or turning on their Berlin neighbors in 1938.

  25. 25.

    Steeplejack

    @Gin & Tonic:

    I donโ€™t think efgoldman tipped his hand at all, but I canโ€™t know for sure, because all of his comments in that thread have been scrubbed.

    This is an oddity in the Balloon Juice database that I have flagged for investigation in the site rebuild. You cannot find a comment by efgoldman anywhere in the archives. I don’t think the comments were scrubbed; I think it’s a software bug of some sort. I don’t know if it affects other nyms; “efgoldman” is the only one I have noticed.

    ETA: I am hoping, of course, that the comments are still in the database but just not being displayed.

  26. 26.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Gin & Tonic:

    You know, I remember that thread! But it was several years before I met EFG, so even if there had been a Peter Ross-shaped Easter egg, I wouldn’t have noticed at that time.

    I’m going to share that with Marilyn. I think it’ll please her.

  29. 29.

    John Revolta

    all of his comments in that thread have been scrubbed

    Deep State! Get InfoWars on the Batphone doublequick!

    Seriously tho, how do you do this? WHO gets to do it?

  31. 31.

    randy khan

    It is just mind-boggling that a 4-year old child has to appear in a hearing like that, where it’s completely obvious she has no idea what’s happening and without a lawyer. I know, as at least one other person has pointed out, that it’s been this way in immigration courts for years, but the Trump decision to tear families apart (I will not call it by the sanitized name they used) has increased the number of kids in this situation by orders of magnitude.

    And, of course, they don’t care.

  34. 34.

    worn

    We have a word for what this country is doing to those children. It is “Evil”. And that is not a word I use lightly.

    This is the thing that I keep on inexorably returning to, and moreover, why it is impossible for me to have a polite, measured conversation about these acts done in our name with literally anyone who wishes to defend any of it.

  35. 35.

    SenyorDave

    Iโ€™m sure Stephen Millerโ€™s and Kirstjen Nielsenโ€™s parents are so proudโ€ฆ

    From this article in Politico (Aug, 2018), he has an uncle who seems pretty angry:

    politico.com/magazine/story/2018/08/13/stephen-miller-is-an-immigration-hypocrite-i-know-because-im-…

    The article is definitely worth a read.

    Dr. David S. Glosser is a retired neuropsychologist: formerly a member of the Neurology faculties of Boston University School of Medicine and Jefferson Medical College.

  36. 36.

    Ohio Mom

    @Steeplejack: As if we donโ€™t miss him enough, having all of efgoldmanโ€™s comments go missing is both eerie and saddening.

    @SiubhanDuinne: Thanks for the obituary link. Makes efgโ€™s death more real and also somehow, easier to accept. At least for me.

  37. 37.

    Gin & Tonic

    @zhena gogolia: Missed you downstairs. Was wondering how much of the Polish dialogue you got in Cold War.? I found myself half-listening and half-reading. And there was a moment that I liked, where the subtitle said “Now we’re talking!” – which, in retrospect seems the best way to translate what she’d said

  38. 38.

    Elie

    It is our solemn duty to bear witness to this and to remember. Justice will be done and it is our job to remember and then to tell these stories to our descendants and to make sure these horrible people are punished and remembered. Our eyes and ears must remain open and our tongues ready to speak with strength and without fear

  41. 41.

    NotMax

    @Steeplejack

    Ghosts in the machine. Spooky.

    Reminded of other past bugs, such as FYWP gagging on nyms containing an apostrophe (which it might still be doing) or the times a nym was mysteriously singled out and any and all replies to that nym were thrown into neverspace.

  43. 43.

    Steeplejack

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Thanks. That makes me think the problem affects only part of the database, before some date that could be discovered. (Why am I thinking of the autumn of 2015?) I’ll do some more cipherin’ on this.

  44. 44.

    smintheus

    I hope that the word goes out, when the Trumplings do die off, that somebody needs to drive a wooden stake through their hearts. We can’t allow their monstrous cruelty to resurrect and resume the horror again.

  46. 46.

    Ohio Mom

    @Elie: The irony of all of this is while the rule of law apparently no longer applies to the presidency, or the rest of the executive branch for that matter, we are applying the law very precisely to the lives of these babies, toddlers and preschoolers. Every T is being crossed, every I is being dotted.

  47. 47.

    currants

    @SiubhanDuinne: Thank you. I still am shocked that he’s gone. I rarely comment but read pretty regularly and you all are part of my community. Not that any of you would know it!

  48. 48.

    zhena gogolia

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Trying again to answer your question — I tried to follow along without reading the subtitles, although of course I needed them most of the time!

  49. 49.

    zhena gogolia

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Ooh, that was exactly where I couldn’t tell what she actually said — what did she say in Polish?

    I’m going to watch it again with my husband, and I was going to try to catch that the second time through.

  50. 50.

    noncarborundum

    @zhena gogolia: I haven’t believed in God or Heaven or Hell for about 40 years. Stuff like this tends both to confirm that position (else why isn’t there some almighty smiting going on?) and to make me wish I believed otherwise and could console myself that there’s a hellish eternity waiting for these bastards.

  54. 54.

    Mary G

    Little Merolin who is eager to attach to any man who is kind and pays attention in a strange foreign world is an ideal target for molestation. Every time I see the evil Kirsten talk about how their policies fight trafficking I want to scream. She is the biggest trafficker of them all.

  55. 55.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @raven:

    BJ donation for EF?

    In lieu of flowers, donations may be made to The Metropolitan Wind Symphony, the Boston Youth Symphony Orchestras, or any local music education program in your community that serves to teach and inspire the next generation of musicians.

    Thanks for asking about this. I was also thinking it would be nice for BJ to agree on one particular recipient and send one biggish donation instead of several smaller ones. Either way, I’ll contribute to the Boston Youth Symphony in his memory.

    If there’s interest, could one of our intrepid FPs set up the mechanism for doing this?

  56. 56.

    Elaine Benes

    Re the shitgibbons border shutdown.

    The entire Pacific coast of Mexico is dotted with RV parks filled with gringos in the winter – and this is *peak* snowbirds-heading-north season. Imagine optics of thousands of American & Canadian retirees in motorhomes/5th wheels stuck at the US/MX border….

  57. 57.

    Steve in the ATL

    @zhena gogolia: not if the deists are correct!

    These days, my belief in karma is about the only thing that gets me out of bed. That and my dog demanding to be fed.

  58. 58.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Depending on the location, that memorial might be something I could attend โ€“

    Depending on the date, I might be able to attend as well. Planning a road trip to Boston in April.

  62. 62.

    WhatsMyNym

    @noncarborundum:

    else why isnโ€™t there some almighty smiting going on?

    I never understand that line of reasoning. Why would God go to the effort of creating humans (or any sentient being) if they needed God’s help for everything?

  63. 63.

    worn

    @Steeplejack: Very strange, using Google, I had mixed luck in locating his comments. Sometimes they will show up; other searches yield nothing.

    For example, the first comment in this thread or #104 in this one.
    balloon-juice.com/2018/10/26/bomber-potentially-in-custody/#comment-7065232

    Curioser and curiouser, said Alice…

    ETA: Apparently specifying a date range in Google’s Advanced Search eliminates all results. Searching for either of the comments referenced yields no hits. And yet I found them via a G.S. w/o a date range specified.

  65. 65.

    khead

    Re: twitter feed – I feel like throwing up.

    Re: efgoldman – Condolences to the family. I missed those threads before. Used to have a lot of fun BSing with him in the college football threads.

  67. 67.

    zhena gogolia

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Oh, so kind of like, “Now THAT I understand.”

    ETA: “Now we’re talking” makes it seem as if she’s happy about it. But “Now THAT I understand” means, yeah, this is the kind of treatment I’m used to. Or something like that. I thought “Now we’re talking meant,” ooh, this is fun. That seemed a little off.

  72. 72.

    Elie

    @Ohio Mom:
    I have to overlook my anguish and just take responsibility to do what I can to make this right. I will remember and there will be opportunity. I will not flinch.

  74. 74.

    danielx

    @Jeffro:

    Actually, if he thought he could order it and have the order obeyed…there probably are ICE agents who would obey such an order, illegal or not.

  75. 75.

    rikyrah

    I was taught that hate is a strong word, and was asked should you ever use it.

    I can say, without equivocation, that I absolutely HATE THESE PEOPLE.

    I have taken to calling them Evil Azz Demons…which is what they are.

    This is monstrous. Absolutely monstrous.

    It’s not that the United States isn’t capable of it, hell, I’m from a people that proves that it is..

    It’s that, we had hoped that we had GONE BEYOND THIS.

    And, for these Evil Azz Demons to do this to these children..
    It enrages me to a level that isn’t healthy.

  78. 78.

    trollhattan

    @SiubhanDuinne:
    That is a lovely remembrance, thanks. Funny to think my brother has probably heard him on the radio many times, being a denizen of The Hub and its surrounding region.

  80. 80.

    celticdragonchick

    Brett was doubtless fapping while he read this and then watched his favorite scenes from Silence of the Lambs where Gum tells his captive to rub the lotion in it’s skin….

  81. 81.

    schrodingers_cat

    @rikyrah: Yes and that is precisely why I don’t want a D candidate who puts the onus of the blame of people who support the man (who currently occupies the Oval office) behind these policies on people like me for merely existing.

  82. 82.

    satby

    @Elaine Benes:

    Imagine optics of thousands of American & Canadian retirees in motorhomes/5th wheels stuck at the US/MX borderโ€ฆ.

    That would spark deep joy. Blowback from that even more. Since we can’t seem to get humane policies unless some white guy is affected by bad ones.

  83. 83.

    SenyorDave

    @rikyrah: I can say, without equivocation, that I absolutely HATE THESE PEOPLE.

    A million times over. It’s not just Trump, it’s the fact that he surrounds himself with people just as bad, if not worse (if that is possible) than he is. Miller, Steve Bannon, Roger Ailes, Kirstjen Nielsen, Manafort, Lewandowski, KellyAnne Conway, SHS. It is so easy to imagine them in the 1930’s in Germany marching lockstep with the Nazis.

  84. 84.

    trollhattan

    Since we’re speaking of monsters in our midst.

    The day after a shooter killed 17 students at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School, a National Rifle Association officer sent a message from his official email to an Infowars writer known for harassing parents of children killed at Sandy Hook. According to emails obtained by HuffPost, NRA training instructor and program coordinator Mark Richardson contacted Wolfgang Halbig โ€” who has made several trips to Newtown, Connecticut, to self-investigate the 2012 shooting where 20 children and six adults were fatally shot โ€” to pitch the Infowars contributor a potential conspiracy theory about the attack in Florida.

    โ€œJust like [Sandy Hook], there is so much more to this story,โ€ Richardson wrote in his email, dated February 15, 2018. โ€œ[The Parkland shooter] was not alone.โ€ In his message to Halbig, Richardson suggested details of a possible second shooter at Stoneman Douglas, to see if the conspiracist would take the bait and pursue the line of questioning on his own:

    Concerning what happened in Florida yesterday, I have been asking the question and no one else seems to be asking it. How is it that Cruz was able gain access to a secured facility while in possession of a rifle, multiple magazines, smoke grenades and a gas mask? To pull the fire alarm, he had to already be inside. Correct? When my Children were in school the only way into the school was through the front door and past the main office. We have been told that he was. Prohibited from entering the building With a backpack. No longer a student, why was he allowed in the building at all? Where was all the equipment, in his back pocket? Just like SH, there is so much more to this story. He was not alone. Just a few questions that have surfaced in the past 24 hours. Thank you for all the information And for what you do. STAY SAFE

  85. 85.

    celticdragonchick

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Nobody wanted to fucking listen when I said Trump was a proto fascist in 2016.

    Now he has arguably left the *proto* phase behind and our media keeps trying to maintain the illusion of normalcy.

  86. 86.

    SenyorDave

    @germy: IMO, yes and no. I fully expect large swathes to be redacted, but if it is too absurd he’ll look worse than if he didn’t release it all. I’m just hoping for enough bad shit about Trump and his spawn so it is hard to say with a straight face that he was exonerated A(which of course Barr went out of his way to say that Trump wasn’t).

  89. 89.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @germy:

    Notice the security detail around her. I guess thatโ€™s how you know youโ€™re doing the right thing, when you need to be surrounded by guards at all times.

    I have a recollection that very early in her tenure — like the first week or so after she was sworn in — she visited a school and was greeted by a small group of protesters. She was so freaked out that she demanded, and got, extra security beyond what normally comes with the job.

  90. 90.

    Gin & Tonic

    @zhena gogolia: It strikes me more as “now we’re clear about this” or “now we all understand.” More of a collective sense – not that now SHE understands, but that now the situation is clear.

  91. 91.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Steeplejack: I’m looking at his comments right now in the dashboard. They’re still there. His last comment was made on December 12, 2018.

  92. 92.

    SiubhanDuinne

    @Kay:

    I have a strong sense that journalist daughter Kate may have had a hand in writing that obit :-)

  93. 93.

    rikyrah

    truth

    Barr wants to be able to decide, unchecked, what parts of Muellerโ€™s report to redact & what parts to release.

    That is unacceptable. The full report should at least go to the Gang of Eight Members of Congress for review. Thereโ€™s no reason to trust Barr. t.co/C5lk3Yp8im

    โ€” PropOrNot ID Service ๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ธ (@propornot) March 29, 2019

  94. 94.

    rikyrah

    Get the ENTIRE Phuck.Outta.Here.

    Barr now says that his 4-page letter last weekend wasn’t really a “summary” of Mueller’s report and he never intended to summarize 400 pages because that wouldn’t have been in the “public interest.” The technical legal term for this is “walking back your story.” t.co/4ZeUkWTnTB

    โ€” Tim O’Brien (@TimOBrien) March 29, 2019

  95. 95.

    West of the Rockies

    @germy:

    Is Trentrunner still around? I kinda recall a really angry episode (or 6) that seemed a bit out if the blue.

  96. 96.

    Ohio Mom

    @zhena gogolia: and LAO, havenโ€™t seen her around in a while.

    Thatโ€™s not to say there arenโ€™t others who have taken their leave, itโ€™s more a reflection of how inconsistent the workings of my memory are.

  97. 97.

    Ksmiami

    @GregB: we need to be prepared to try and punish the people behind this- to the fullest extent. Leave no one alive

  99. 99.

    celticdragonchick

    @schrodingers_cat:

    We were told a lot of people and institutions were going to save us.

    The only ones who will save us are ourselves…and that will become clear when he disregards the results of the next election, declares a national emergency and sics armed troops on us when we shut shit down in protest. (Lawrence Tribe at Raw Story seems to think that is how this might go down)

  102. 102.

    trollhattan

    @rikyrah:
    Do our Legal Eagles have a word on whether Senators, especially those in the minority party, have constitutional sway to overrule/go around the AG?

  108. 108.

    Ksmiami

    @Mary G: youโ€™re nicer than me… every time I see her, I want to grab a baseball bat. Also, Trumpโ€™s supporters are stupid and evil- not misguided or conned.

  112. 112.

    Steeplejack

    @Adam L Silverman:

    1. Dashboard view is different from the peon view, I believe.

    2. As I said above, I now think the problem might be time-limited. His recent comments show up, but try looking for some before, say, 2015.

    For example, look at this thread from May 2014: “Saturday Evening Open Thread: Teamwork.” The nym “efgoldman” appears 10 times, but only in responses to messages that do not appear.

    ETA: Multiple messages that do not appear. Comment numbers are different.

  113. 113.

    Mr Stagger Lee

    I want the Democratic leadership put on notice, no talking about moving on, no talking about keeping our powder dry. I want prison terms for these bastards! And no Whitesplaining from some of you in the peanut gallery.

  114. 114.

    Adam L Silverman

    @Steeplejack: When I run a keyword search in the dashboard, I get every comment in the system for efgoldman. They’re in there. Why they’re not showing up, I have no idea. Unless the blog has become sentient and has decided that since he’s departed, his comments should too.

  115. 115.

    Aleta

    @Steeplejack:
    For example
    August 10, 2018 His comments appear, and responses to them go back to his comment

    April 6, 2015 Responses to him appear, but don’t go back to his comment. And his comments don’t appear.

    (Two random dates. I used my macbook’s ‘find’ to search a page)

    ETA Oh I see your comment about time-sensitive

  116. 116.

    celticdragonchick

    @schrodingers_cat:

    Nobody knows, but he has nothing to lose by trying it since he knows at least 3 states will try to indict him the moment he leaves office.

    His only way out of jail is to go full Mugebe. Seize power for life and keep looting the system.

    Then we see how long before someone with stars on the shoulders in the army has had enough and pulls the plug. The military won’t keep this sort of thing going IMHO, but may see some bad shit and dead ppl in the streets.

  122. 122.

    Adam L Silverman

    @celticdragonchick: No worries. As the designated nat-sec writer, emergency food goddess, back up crazy cat lady, I am also, apparently, the house mother who worries when the regulars don’t check in. That may or may not be due to religio-cultural issues…

  123. 123.

    MisterForkbeard

    @rikyrah: Cripes, the balls on these guys. The “we’re going to highly redact a bunch of things so that the highest members of Congress can’t know what’s going on” is stupidly bad. I expect Republicans to be really into that idea for JUST THIS ONE president and investigation, though.

  124. 124.

    Adam L Silverman

    @zhena gogolia: It was never clear to me if it was permanent.

    Before anyone asks, I emailed Yarrow a couple of days ago. He’s been busy taking care of both his dad and his uncle, so I’m not surprised he’s not been around.

  127. 127.

    Jay

    @rikyrah:

    Marcyโ€™s twitter is also covering all Barrโ€™s ducking, dodging and parseing on his Coverup Letter,

    So the โ€œBarr Reportโ€ only survived for 4 Scaramicciโ€™s.

  128. 128.

    John Revolta

    @celticdragonchick: Shit is bad enough without such paranoid fantasies. Inauguration Day, Trump gets shown out by the Secret Service. Assuming he hasn’t left the day after the election. He hates living in the White House and he never really wanted the job in the first place.

  129. 129.

    Jay

    @MisterForkbeard:

    Itโ€™s how they get โ€œburnedโ€.

    Just like Barrโ€™s current time in the barrel over the Coverup Letter.

    You give them enough time and rope to hang themselves, while constantly pointing out to them that they are not supposed to use the time and the rope, to hang themselves.

    In time, some of the Gang of 8 will sit down with copies of the redacted report and the unredacted report, and go over them chapter and verse, while writing down โ€œhard questionsโ€.

  130. 130.

    Dan B

    @randy khan: They don’t care about “brown” toddlers.

    My hypothesis is they believe anyone black ir brown will grow up to be a terrifying criminal. They believe that any empathy is a weakness. Only the strong survive in their apocalyptic worldview.

  131. 131.

    Nelle

    I keep thinking at some moment, I’m going to see DeVos’s plastic visage melt and drip off the leering, evil skull. Then I need to go check the mirror and say, Is this who you are, really, Nelle. Then I watched that bit where she was getting in the gold elevator and I find myself shrieking curse words at her. I’ve come a long way from my Mennonite girlhood.

  133. 133.

    zhena gogolia

    @Nelle:

    The most chilling part is where she stares right into the camera with a smirk on her face. She really does not believe that she works for us or has any accountability to us.

  137. 137.

    Nelle

    @zhena gogolia: Someone compared that look to the one on the face of that Covington Kentucky maga kid. Yep, same smirk of disdain and contempt, absolute and total self-satisfaction.

  139. 139.

    celticdragonchick

    @John Revolta:

    When his former lawyer says he won’t leave peacefully, I believe him.

    Always believe the tyrant when they show you who they are. If he leaves, he goes to jail. His way to stay out of jail is to declare an emergency, call up the National Guard on a fake pretext as he has already done and then use demonstrators as an excuse to declare martial law….and Turkey and Hungary are the existing examples of how he can do this.

    He isn’t just going to walk himself out of the WH and into a courtroom to be indicted. He will take everything down with him before he allows that.

  140. 140.

    eemom

    @Adam L Silverman:

    So since we’re all doing this, can you find the last time Temporarily Max McGee posted? Really nice, smart guy who was fighting cancer. Hope he’s ok.

  141. 141.

    Steeplejack

    @zhena gogolia:

    I think DeVos’s smile/​smirk is a (possibly unconscious) defense mechanism, like a deflector shield when someone dares to penetrate her reality-distortion field. She wears that same smile in hearings as Democrats are spatchcocking her for her incompetence.

  143. 143.

    John Revolta

    @celticdragonchick: They’re not gonna grab him on the way out of the White House and throw him in the slammer.
    That’s another fantasy, although it’s one I could enjoy myself. He goes back to New York, and the lawyers take over. For years and years.

  144. 144.

    celticdragonchick

    Interview with Lawrence Tribe at Salon:

    In this moment, what gives you the most hope? What are you most afraid of?

    I am most afraid of the fact that Donald Trump may not leave office peacefully, and that there will be no real transition to a new president. I worry that we are on a downward slide that has no foreseeable end. My hope is that we have survived things that seemed at least as scary, in terms of a civil war and World War II, and that the United States has gotten better.

    What would happen if Trump refuses to step down and leave the White House if so ordered? That scenario is often discussed but rarely detailed.

    I am starting a research project examining that question. This is like looking into the face of Armageddon. I simply cannot tell you right now what it would look like. I do not think that Donald Trump would simply hunker down and say, “The Joint Chiefs are going to have to arrest me.” Trump would be a little more subtle than that, stupid though he is. I think Donald Trump would declare a national emergency. He would find an excuse for one. If it looked like Trump was going to lose the 2020 election, he would declare a national emergency as well. This would all be catastrophically messy.

  145. 145.

    Jay

    @celticdragonchick:

    US Military, swear an oath, to the US, not the President, not the President elect, or the Lame Duck President.

    The Insane Clown POSus and his Minions have been running the Nixon Gambit since day one, ( crazy enough to nuke Vietnam), and every time push comes to shove, they roll over, whinging.

    โ€œHis Lawyer sayโ€™sโ€ isnโ€™t a good โ€œauthorityโ€,

  148. 148.

    celticdragonchick

    @John Revolta

    As others here noted, he doesn’t like the White House, but it is a trap for him and I imagine he knows that. He could have gotten away with his criminality for ever, and now, he is being investigated by SDNY, New York AG, probably California, Maryland and Virginia in the near future. He is already an un-idicted co conspirator and there is no pardon power for state crimes.

    So again, now that he is in the trap, his only real option is to stay in it. His lawyers cannot keep him away from the NYAG, not from SDNY and delays didn’t work that well for Paul Manafort.

    I think normalacy bias is still playing some role here with us. We want to think the institutions will work. They only work if people consciously make them work, and Trump, no matter what he does and who he hurts, will have support of every Republican in the Senate (lame duck at least) and 40 percent of the people around you. That is terrifying, and we already knows he will use the military for political props on imaginary emergencies.

  153. 153.

    celticdragonchick

    @rikyrah:

    Bitch can come deal with one of my classes then.

    Fun fact…I had to help arrest a student about a month ago who assaulted another staff member right in front of me because his android phone had been confiscated. Maybe Betsy can come give me a hand with the two hours I spent on police and school district forms or the three days of pain I had after I had tackled the kid and bear hugged him to keep him from hitting the other teacher, then helping hand cuff him while he fought and trying to keep the kid from dislocating a shoulder,

  155. 155.

    trollhattan

    @rikyrah:
    My daughter went to Costco Elementary. We delivered one child in the morning and at night had to pick up a bundle of three. :-)

  163. 163.

    VeniceRiley

    @rikyrah: I had a thought the other day that I was beginning to enter Malcom X territory in my thought processes about these people. Something that would have never crossed my mind a few short years ago.

  164. 164.

    Brachiator

    @celticdragonchick:

    Interview with Lawrence Tribe at Salon:

    In this moment, what gives you the most hope? What are you most afraid of?

    I am most afraid of the fact that Donald Trump may not leave office peacefully, and that there will be no real transition to a new president. I worry that we are on a downward slide that has no foreseeable end. My hope is that we have survived things that seemed at least as scary, in terms of a civil war and World War II, and that the United States has gotten better.

    This is dumb. Trump blusters a lot, but he is ultimately a coward. And his support among the people is noisy, but thin.

    Trump has fooled a lot of people, but in the end he keeps going because the Republican leadership has his back. And even the dopiest of his supporters believe that he is making America great again. They are willing to throw away most of the Constitution and checks and balances, because this stuff is abstract to most of them. But for Trump to ignore an election…. Not even the biggest fool would be able to pretend that he or she was still living in the United States of White Jesus America.

  165. 165.

    celticdragonchick

    @schrodingers_cat:

    That was at a good school.

    Kids are displaying addictive behaviors with respect to their technology, and they have to have their instant fix. If I could, I would ban every fucking one of them from the campus. I have seen several students have melt down incidents over phones that reminded me of a junkie demanding money to get high, and violence was real close to the surface in a couple of those incidents. This was the first time where I saw a student actually go all the way and start hitting another teacher, but I wasn’t surprised. I have had at least three other occasions where I was imminent hazard of a kid trying to hit me over a similar situation.

    1) The technology is designed to be addictive and gave instant pleasure, so we cannot be surprised when kids act like they have addictive issues with the devices…
    2) There are some territorial issue with some of my students that I am not trained or equipped to really diagnose, but I have seen students get right to the edge of getting ready to have a physical fight with me over taking a test paper that I saw them cheating on. Taking anything that is in the possession of the student, including an exam, is grounds for aggression. Somebody here with more sociology and psychology training might have insights here. Anyway, trying to confiscate devices, water bottles or take a book bag that was being swung around dangerously can all start the violence escalation cycle very, very quickly, and I am wary of trying to take things even if I have every right and cause to do so.

  166. 166.

    celticdragonchick

    @Brachiator:

    This is dumb. Trump blusters a lot, but he is ultimately a coward. And his support among the people is noisy, but thin.

    His supporters fill many of the definitions of a cult. You are the very first person I have ever seen as describing his support as thin.

    Jesus, Tbogg the other day had an interview with one of his deplorables stating Trump should be the first dictator and that we needed him to be a dictator.

    His supporters will not abandon him under any circumstance, and anything that shows him taking unilateral action that seems strong is even better.

  171. 171.

    Steve in the ATL

    @celticdragonchick: I had two millennials on my witness list this morning. Every few minutes I reminded them not to bring their two phones each into the hearing room. One guy was starting to twitch and shake after half an hour.

  173. 173.

    Searcher

    @trollhattan: The House should pass HR 1234, “Resolution to Immediately Release the Full Mueller Report to Publicly Exonerate Trump of All Collusion”, send it to the Senate and see what happens.

  175. 175.

    Enhanced Voting Techniques

    @celticdragonchick: And then what is Trump going to do, take the weekend off? Go read up on it, being a dictator is hard work. Once the rule of law ends the dictator is far game for anyone one so they constantly got to be in the palace on the watch for potential enemies. Trump don’t do hard work.

  176. 176.

    celticdragonchick

    @Steve in the ATL:

    Yep. They can’t their hands off the devices.

    When you see a kid in the back of the classroom looking down at his crotch and smiling, you know it isn’t the exquisite cut of his fashionably torn jeans he is looking at….

  177. 177.

    Jay

    @Searcher:

    They donโ€™t need to. Nadler has subpena power for the unredacted Meuller Report and will use that power next week if Barr does not respond in time.

  179. 179.

    Jay

    @celticdragonchick:

    Barrโ€™s been getting his ass handed to him all week. Heโ€™s been ducking, dodging and parseing all day.

    The Barr Coverup Letter on the Meuller report didnโ€™t even survive for 4 Scaramucciโ€™s.

  180. 180.

    Bill Arnold

    @celticdragonchick:

    Barr was the GOP pardon boy for Iran Contra and he is tanned, rested and ready for another go!

    I missed this from Rude Pundit (3/25/2019) but it’s a perfect addendum:
    Random Observations on a Cover-Up: The Barr Letter, Not the Mueller Report

    Barr is a Republican sin eater, engorging himself on a banquet of crimes and betrayals going back decades. He has no moral or ethical standing here, and his legal standing is based on how he was going to wolf down the slop trough of sins of the Trump administration.

  181. 181.

    celticdragonchick

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    That’s the trap of course. In for a penny, in for a pound, and that is why I think declaring an emergency and refusing to recognize the election result is his play. Of course, he threatened that last time, but now he has actual power as CIC and a track record of declaring fake emergencies and deploying troops. If he did that, there is actual very little that can be done to counter it initially. Congress gave a *lot* of power to POTUS to do emergency shit without a lot of oversight.

    Yes, he is a coward. Yes, he has no work ethic and he is lazy. That being said, he has excellent survival instincts and his first move is to attack when he feels threatened.

    If he does this, I think it will be the the military who will finally tell him to go to hell and that they answer to the constitution.

    Also, nobody yet has gone broke betting on his depravity and capacity for evil.

  182. 182.

    JoeyJoeJoe

    @satby: I remember the movie The Day After Tomorrow. Thereโ€™s a scene where Americans are crossing the southern border to escape the cold. Mexico is good enough to let them in

  184. 184.

    Ruckus

    @celticdragonchick:
    I don’t believe Trump has the balls to do it. Others working for him might on the other hand and at that point I’d bet his narcissism would get the best of his hired help. Now maybe I’m just spitballing but still he’s only shown himself to be a coward whenever push comes to shove.

  186. 186.

    Spinoza Is My Co-Pilot

    @BobS:

    These are the same motherfuckers that would have been cheering the Crucifixion or turning on their Berlin neighbors in 1938.

    These are the same motherfucking self-righteous phony-ass “Christians” that would have been cheering the Crucifixion or turning on their Berlin neighbors in 1938.

    I hate ALL the fucking fascists with the heat of 1,000 suns, including family members, neighbors, and work colleagues.

    I know this is considered “fantasy violence porn” or whatever by many, but when (I no longer believe “if”) this current cold war we are in turns hot, I will have no problem manning the barricades and taking out as many of these evil fucks as I can before they get me (I have no illusions about my chances of surviving what I think is inevitable now, if by chance I live long enough to see it).

    It may be years away yet — possibly a couple decades, at most — but, like climate change, I think we’ve passed a tipping point and we’re rolling downhill inexorably toward the way of “sorting through” massive and intractable issues humans have always resorted to. Our institutions are failing us, hugely, and I no longer think we can pull back from the brink.

    And like Brexit (a microcosm of our own much larger political/economic conflict) it didn’t have to be this way, but goddamn rightwing assholes had to fuck it up.

    I have a granddaughter who is 4, and with her mother being Peruvian (and of mostly Qechuan ancestry) my darling little girl (who I love as fiercely as it’s possible for me to love) undoubtedly looks very much like this precious Honduran girl who my government stole from her parents. These fucking monsters. My rage will never go away as long as I live.

  187. 187.

    celticdragonchick

    @Jay:

    Be nice nice to know what they are. I read Brendan Nyhan, but he badly overuses the “conspiracy theory” charge about people he disagrees with (he is something of a civility cop) and he is prone to Broderism/bothsidesdoit. I agree that the Palmer Report is unreliable and is redolent of Louise Mensch. Yes, she is a nut.

  188. 188.

    Ruckus

    @John Revolta:

    he never really wanted the job in the first place.

    I think he wanted the job he thought it was, he for sure didn’t want the actual job, the one where he has to actually do work, something he has no idea about.

  189. 189.

    celticdragonchick

    @Ruckus: In person? Oh yes he is cowardly as hell. That is why I think he tries to hang on, though. He doesn’t have the guts to face criminal charges along with his spawn.

  194. 194.

    celticdragonchick

    @rikyrah
    What, and deprive the NYT of another Cleetus Safari into the road side diners in east Ohio and another front page soft focus think piece on how hard it is for angry racially charged voters?

  195. 195.

    Ruckus

    @zhena gogolia:
    None of Trump’s tribe or enablers feel they work for us or have any accountability to us. That is a part of the reason they are so horrible. Accountability and who pays them are abstract concepts to this group of sociopaths. What drives them is greed and the idea that any idea they have is the bestest idea in the universe. It doesn’t matter if they reverse course several times in a day or in a situation. What is important to them is that they are always right, even when you prove them 10000% wrong. Their real support is thin if aggressive and over bearing. Their second layer of support is not.

  196. 196.

    Steve in the ATL

    @rikyrah: Iโ€™ve spent this week in rural red state culture and my only comment is โ€œfuck this shit!โ€

    Also, I live inland, but my state has an Atlantic coast. Am I a coastal elite?

    What if I live inland but also have a beach house on, you know, the coastโ€”am I a coastal elite?

    Iโ€™m confused as to how elite I am supposed to be.

    May also be relevant that I ate at a rural red non-coastal State Applebeeโ€™s last night.

  197. 197.

    Brachiator

    @celticdragonchick:

    This is dumb. Trump blusters a lot, but he is ultimately a coward. And his support among the people is noisy, but thin.

    His supporters fill many of the definitions of a cult. You are the very first person I have ever seen as describing his support as thin.

    Sorry, the dopes don’t worship him yet. And they get to watch him on TV and laugh and get their wishes fulfilled. When they send their money to him, then we can start calling his supporters part of a cult. Right now, they don’t have any skin in the game.

    And yeah, his support is thin, but noisy and devoted. Everybody knows that. Here’s a recent 538

    If thereโ€™s one thing thatโ€™s been consistent about President Trumpโ€™s time in office, itโ€™s his approval rating. Sure, it has moved around a bit โ€” his average approval has hovered between 36 percent and 45 percent, a fluctuation of 9 points, over practically the entire course of his presidency, according to FiveThirtyEightโ€™s presidential approval tracker. But thatโ€™s a really narrow band, especially compared to previous presidents, and it has meant that his median approval rating is low โ€” only President Harry Truman had a lower median rating.

    Trumpโ€™s approval rating has the least variation of any post-World War II president. Granted, Trump hasnโ€™t yet served a full term, but changes in his approval rating have been remarkably small.

    Trump certainly tries to make it look as though he is beloved by multitudes. Typical of what you get from a high level grifter.

    Jesus, Tbogg the other day had an interview with one of his deplorables stating Trump should be the first dictator and that we needed him to be a dictator.

    His supporters will not abandon him under any circumstance, and anything that shows him taking unilateral action that seems strong is even better.

    I believe that his dopiest supporters will not abandon him. I just don’t see them putting their own asses at risk to help him. He is a coward. He likes to threaten children. His nasty ass supporters like to talk tough and act up if they can bully somebody. But they are also cowards who would run from anything like a real fight.

    Trump is a coward. I don’t think he has ever been in a fight in his life, even though he talks tough. But he attracts people who will protect him. Usually for money. That ain’t loyalty. That ain’t a reliable cult. Trump’s greatest weakness is that he believes his own bullshit. This gives us a small but real advantage.

  198. 198.

    B.B.A.

    This story should end Biden’s campaign all by itself. The fact that it won’t shows how far we have to go – as a party, as a country, and as a species.

    Believe women.

  199. 199.

    Jay

    @celticdragonchick:

    Itโ€™s detailed on the Tribe wiki under โ€œControversiesโ€ and even more detail in the links.

    BTdubs, Lawrence Tribe has never been โ€œTrumpโ€™s Lawyerโ€.

  200. 200.

    Bill Arnold

    Funny!
    Alex Jones claims psychosis is behind his conspiracy theories (Daniel Jativa, March 29, 2019)

    Jones, 45, who was sued by a parent of a Newtown, Conn., elementary school shooting victim, said a three-hour-long deposition with the plaintiff's lawyer, Mark Bankston, that mental illness impacted his judgment.
    …
    "And I, myself, have almost had like a form of psychosis back in the past where I basically thought everything was staged, even though Iโ€™m now learning a lot of times things arenโ€™t staged. So I think, as a pundit, someone giving an opinion, that, you know, my opinions have been wrong, but they were never wrong consciously to hurt people," Jones said.

    Well, then. I guess we have to forgive him. (Not)

  204. 204.

    Jay

    @Brachiator:

    Yup, KKKeyboard KKKomandoโ€™s on line when they can summon hordes of likeminded Flying Moneys Online,

    Gutless cowards and bullies in the RW.

    Thereโ€™s a reason why Insane Clown POSusโ€™s minions all live in one Condo tower, on the wrong side of the tracks, cook their own foor, carpool rather than Uber, and are desperately seeking Deplorable apps so they have safe spaces to eat, get their clothes drycleaned and find fuโ‚ฌkbuddies.

  205. 205.

    celticdragonchick

    Getting out of the house to get some food and cheer up. See you guys a bit later.

  206. 206.

    Jay

    @Bill Arnold:

    So, heโ€™s going for the temporary insanity defense.

    ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿคฃ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿคฃ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿคฃ๐Ÿ˜‚๐Ÿคฃ

  208. 208.

    Ruckus

    @celticdragonchick:
    I really don’t think he has the where with all to make the call. First he doesn’t know how things work, second he is a giant coward and has been for his entire life and third do you really think the military will do this? Because while some in the military would be for this 100%, I doubt many would. You were in the military if I remember correctly, a long time after me, so things could have changed but there was an extreme adversion to working outside the limits and even though some officers were willing to be douchebags, not everyone was. Will cooler heads prevail? I think so.
    I’m saying that even if he wants to, he won’t be able to make it happen.

  213. 213.

    Ruckus

    @Jay:
    Also, unless things have changed we were taught certain things, one being what we could and couldn’t do – being used as policing troops being one no no. The National Guard could, because their commander was the state governor. I just don’t think that the military would go along with him in declaring an election to be null and void.

  214. 214.

    B.B.A.

    @Jay: Ruby Tuesday is the one with a salad bar.

    I don’t know why I know this about these interchangeable bland chain restaurants, but I do.

  217. 217.

    Jay

    @Ruckus:

    Yup, Adamโ€™s gotten tired of debunking these Militarist Red Dawn fantasies and porn.

    The US Military isnโ€™t a 3rd world military over filled with poorly paid Majorโ€™s with delusions of grandeur.

    Insane Clown POSus couldnโ€™t even find the Joint Chiefs with a phone app.

  219. 219.

    Jay

    @rikyrah:

    The poll was from before Wall took their funding, before they spent Christmas on the border, before Wall took their payraises,……

  220. 220.

    Jay

    @Steve in the ATL:

    Remember, Bobo jokes donโ€™t write themselves, Bobo has to write them first.

    When I travelled a lot for work, I became really good at finding local โ€œgood eatsโ€, mostly because after eating a YVR diet for decades, the midlevel sit down chain food left me plugged up for weeks.

  221. 221.

    Spinoza Is My Co-Pilot

    @celticdragonchick: I consider myself to be a generally friendly and even warmhearted person, and think most everyone who knows me would say the same about me (I know, you’ll just have to trust me on this). I was a peace-and-love hippie-type for a while back in the 70s — before I “sold out” to become a regular Joe with a job, family, mortgage, all that — and that spirit of tolerance and even compassion was inculcated (quite imperfectly, of course) deep within my psyche. So, although I always opposed modern movement conservatism and all its works, I saw most (not all) of the people supporting and implementing conservative policies as just that — the opposition, not necessarily the enemy.

    Not anymore. I have come to actually, truly, hate All the fascists: the ones I know personally, as well as the millions and millions I don’t. I didn’t want to, and I’ve tried hard for my 50+ years of real political awareness (since I was a young teen) to not hate the people on “the other side”, but there it is.

    And here’s the thing — they hate us, too, absolutely they do (and hated us first, I’d say). Hate radio, for instance, isn’t some anomaly, or some “fringe” thing. It’s the twisted, evil heart and soul of modern movement conservatism in this country. Millions and millions of people support this shit, and even though they are a (bare) minority, they control most of the levers of power and enjoy unsurpassable (by peaceful means, anyway) structural advantages that just about everyone here knows about full well. They’re all Birchers now, all fascists (and maybe they always were; I didn’t used to think so, but now I think I was probably willfully naive about that). They think we’re the evil ones, we’re the cause of all the problems in the world. So, as I said in my earlier comment, this has become an intractable situation, with a truly horrible outcome that anyone with eyes open has to see as most likely (if not inevitable, as I see it).

    The 21st century is going to make the 20th century look like a cakewalk in comparison, and we’re currently at the beginning of all that. And goddamnit, it didn’t have to be this way. Hope I’m wrong, but don’t think I am.

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