Afternoon Open Thread: Cory Booker on Ellen

One of the things about this rich field of Democrats is getting to know them. Corey Booker had a good interview on Ellen that airs today.  Here’s the full interview:

Kamala Harris was on Jimmy Kimmel last night, but I haven’t had a chance to watch that yet. I may post it later if someone else doesn’t. Looking forward to it.

I like the casual nature of the talk shows and seeing them semi-relaxed. But I also think the town halls are really important for understanding their policies. I’m invigorated by the intelligence and compassion of these candidates. Such a contrast from what we’ve been faced with daily since 2016.

Now I need some candidates to remember we need to take back the Senate and they are needed there, too.

Open thread






183 replies
  1. 1
  2. 2
    rikyrah says:

    Booker is on Ellen today

    …………………….

    Cory Booker gushes over girlfriend Rosario Dawson and teases that they may have a White House wedding if he wins the 2020 election

    The Democratic presidential candidate, 49, appeared on Ellen on Wednesday
    He gushed over Dawson, 39, as an ‘incredible human’ who had taught him how to ‘love fearlessly’
    Booker was coy when Ellen DeGeneres asked if they might become engaged soon
    She joked that they should hold off any wedding plans until after the election in case he is elected president
    Booker said he would ask her to preside over their hypothetical White House wedding
    By JENNIFER SMITH FOR DAILYMAIL.COM

    PUBLISHED: 10:28 EDT, 20 March 2019 | UPDATED: 12:42 EDT, 20 March 2019

  3. 3

    @rikyrah: Republicans DO NOT WANT people to vote. Unless they are old, white and racist.

  4. 4
    WereBear says:

    I think having so many voices and a deep bench is going to work out well. Sure, some will fall by the wayside and some will turn out not to “have the stuff” but leadership is not lacking, I hope.

  5. 5

    @WereBear: I am surprised how much I am relieved by all of them. Sure there are a few that should probably rethink their candidacy, but for the most part each one is bringing something to the discussion that needs to be said.

  6. 6
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @rikyrah: @TaMara (HFG):

  7. 7
    Barbara says:

    I like Cory Booker but I am not loving the Rosario Dawson connection. In fact, I would say anyone who associates with Rosario Dawson in a significant way is not going to be the recipient of any money from me until they have actually secured the nomination. I don’t want to overstate her influence but she and Susan Sarandon have a lot of gall trying to pretend that their preference for “principles” were inconsequential to the situation we find ourselves in, where people they claim to care about have been actively harmed by Trump.

  8. 8
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    ELECTORATE-RIGGING IS RENT-SEEKING

    Excellent article. Though last I checked the efforts in Michigan had failed as they were vetoed by the outgoing R governor. Had that changed?

  9. 9
    Mayur says:

    @Barbara: Wait what did Rosario Dawson say?

  10. 10
    Jeffro says:

    @WereBear:

    I think having so many voices and a deep bench is going to work out well.

    FLOODING THE ZONE! ;)

    No seriously, I agree with you – it’s awesome that there are a gazillion Dems out there all talking about issues that matter to people, and collectively offering a more positive vision than either trumpov or the Rs overall. And it’ll drive them (the trumpublicans) nuts not to know who to focus their lies and smears on for at least the next year.

  11. 11
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷: I don’t know if they overrode his veto. Perhaps you should/could look it up.

  12. 12
    rikyrah says:

    @Barbara:

    I don’t want to overstate her influence but she and Susan Sarandon have a lot of gall trying to pretend that their preference for “principles” were inconsequential to the situation we find ourselves in, where people they claim to care about have been actively harmed by Trump

    You nailed it. Absolutely

  13. 13
    Keith P. says:

    @Barbara: plus there’s that whole “starring in ‘MIB 2′” thing

  14. 14
    Barbara says:

    @Mayur: Use the google machine. I don’t mean to be snippy but it’s not hard to find.

  15. 15
    Mandalay says:

    @Barbara: But what did Dawson do specifically? Are you talking about her support for Stein over Clinton in the 2016 election?

  16. 16
    Barbara says:

    @Mandalay: It was more than just support for Stein and it’s not hard to find.

  17. 17
    rikyrah says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    thanks for that..will spread the word.

  18. 18
    Mandalay says:

    @Barbara:

    Use the google machine. I don’t mean to be snippy but it’s not hard to find.

    Your comment reminds me of that old husband-wife joke:

    Husband: But why are you so upset with me? What have I done? What did I say?
    Wife: Well if you don’t know I’m certainly not going to tell you!

  19. 19
    geg6 says:

    @rikyrah:

    I watched him on Hardball with Chris Matthews the other night in an interview that was most of the show. As we all know, Matthews is very difficult to discuss anything with because he does nothing but talk over everyone. However, I think Booker did a great job in a bit of a weird venue, a diner in Iowa. I have always liked him. I’ve been keeping an eye on him for a decade or more and, although he has done things I don’t like, I just can’t help but like him. He’s always optimistic and seems to really connect with people. I would have no trouble voting for him. Right now, on my scorecard, he’s #2 or #3. Of course, that scorecard is very liable to change.

  20. 20
    Old School says:

    @Barbara: I used the Google machine and Rosario Dawson gave Jill Stein a campaign contribution and endorsed her. Is that what I am supposed to find? Or is there another search term I should be adding?

  21. 21
    geg6 says:

    @Old School:

    Yeah, I’m not seeing it either. Do I like that she supported Stein? No, but she isn’t running for anything. Her boyfriend is. And I like him.

  22. 22
    Barbara says:

    @Mandalay: When someone asks me “what did Rosario Dawson say,” I don’t see why I need to do the work for them. It’s easy to find what she said and engage from there. I don’t particularly want to relitigate the 2016 primary, and my first comment pretty much explains my view, which you can fill in the details on (and you seem to have deduced anyway). Dawson is a pampered celebrity who apparently thought it was more important to shit on Clinton than to protect the very same people that she claims to be in solidarity with. In a world with many compelling and interesting candidates, the last thing I want to do is reward anyone connected with Rosario Dawson.

  23. 23
    VeniceRiley says:

    Rosario Dawson is hot. That’s the nicest thing I can say about her. But she basically called Hillary a racist; so forgive me if I don’t want her in the white house. hard NOPE on Booker. And I’m smelling a lot of “any man over any woman” in the media and on twitter response threads. I cannot. It inflames me. If you were a lesbian in the gay rights movement back in the day, you’d even see it in how the white men always ended up running everything. And if not white, then men. The people in charge and who had power to say where they money was spent and what the priorities are. I’ve had it. Absolutely. All these men can have some administration jobs if they want. But I am drawing a line and demanding female leadership.

    Case in point: Buttigieg just lied and said HRC slogan was “Imwithher” but it wasn’t. That was a defense and defiance by her voters and supporters in response to insane press, Wilmerites, and the right. HRC campaigned on the message “STRONGER TOGETHER.” So; Pete may be smart, but he ain’t all that.

  24. 24
    Barbara says:

    @geg6: Oh sure, it’s Booker who is the candidate, so it’s okay with me if you call it payback for Dawson trying to use Monica Lewinsky to harm Hillary Clinton. What goes around comes around.

  25. 25
    germy says:

    Bernie Sanders Is Hiring a Former Hillary Clinton Staffer As Research Chief

    Bernie Sanders is preparing for the coming onslaught of attacks by hiring someone who knows the material best. The Vermont senator’s campaign is bringing on a veteran of Hillary Clinton’s research department who helped pull together the former secretary of State’s opposition-research book on Sanders in 2016, according to Democrats familiar with the decision.

    Tyson Brody, Clinton’s deputy research director during the last election cycle, will direct Sanders’s research operation, Sanders campaign manager Faiz Shakir confirmed to Intelligencer on Wednesday. Brody, who worked on Clinton’s self-research as well as the Sanders oppo files last cycle, is the first Democrat to go from Clinton’s camp to Sanders’s 2020 campaign after their bitter primary fight.

    http://nymag.com/intelligencer.....chief.html

  26. 26
    Jeffro says:

    @Adam L Silverman: it’s a good article. Hopefully the Dems will continue onward with these themes in 2020 and every election until the election rigging is undone completely.

  27. 27
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Barbara: I don’t know who Dawson is but I guess I am going to/have to find out. So far, all I have is what you said and that’s not doing anything for me.

    ETA: Reading more of the thread, see that she voted for Stein. Yuck x 10.

  28. 28
    Barbara says:

    @Ohio Mom: She is a celebrity whose movies I have never seen who is the younger, hipper version of Susan Sarandon in terms of her connection to the Sanders campaign in 2016. She pursued a scorched earth policy when it came to anything Clinton, including people who supported Clinton like Dolores Huerta.

  29. 29

    I like Booker’s personality but the ONE thing that gives me pause is the very thing that Ellen praises in him and that is his desire to say, “we’re basically all the same…there is no you’re wrong and I’m right”. I completely disagree. The hardcore 30/40% that still support Trump due to their “economic” anxiety are wrong. The white nationalists and neo-nazis are wrong. The sycophantic GOP that puts party before country is wrong. The hypocritical evangelicals are wrong. They are all flat out wrong and I want a Presidential candidate who is brave enough to say it. Am I reading Booker wrong here? What do you all think?

  30. 30
    Mandalay says:

    @geg6:

    He’s always optimistic

    That for me is Booker’s greatest strength. He is definitely an upbeat can-do glass-half-full kind of guy. It is very, very appealing quality in a politician, as long as he can avoid the risk of being portrayed as a lightweight.

    Perhaps he should talk at length on one of his more controversial positions (Get out of Syria? End the war on drugs?) where he can display some gravitas and spine to complement his friendly, upbeat persona.

  31. 31
    germy says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: I’m hoping he means voters, and not people like McConnell. Because if he thinks he can “reach across the aisle” and reason with the current GOP, he’s in for disappointment.

  32. 32
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @germy:

    Brody, who worked on Clinton’s self-research as well as the Sanders oppo files last cycle,

    Given how 2016 went down, I’m not sure these are actually positive examples of Brody’s abilities.

  33. 33
    rikyrah says:

    she stole from Rodgers and Hammerstein?

    Ariana Grande is paying owners of Rodgers and Hammerstein’s catalog 90 percent of 7 Rings songwriting royalties
    By ADAM S. LEVY FOR DAILYMAIL.COM

    The organization that owns the Rodgers and Hammerstein catalog is getting 90 percent of the royalties on Ariana Grande’s chart-topping single 7 Rings, which is heavily influenced by their 1959 song My Favorite Things from The Sound of Music.

    The song’s credits list a total of 10 writers, including the late composers, Richard Rodgers and Oscar Hammerstein II; the thank u, next singer, 25, and seven others.

    Grande’s team and label, Republic, hammered out an agreement with the organization, named Concord, late last year ahead of the single’s release in January. Grande’s camp did not make a counter offer when Concord asked for 90 percent of the royalties, according to The New York Times, noting that it illustrates the leverage music publishers have with pop artists when it comes to evergreen classics.

  34. 34
    Adam L Silverman says:

    OT: I’m not sure this name screams chief design architect. Chief apparel removal specialist perhaps…

    Chief Design Architect Anna Areola

  35. 35

    @Barbara: So what I’m seeing is, you don’t like Booker because of Dawson, but whenever anyone asks you to elaborate you get defensive and say find it yourself.

    And several people have and reported they found nothing as disturbing as you seem to be implying, but you still won’t elaborate.

    Not really helping your argument.

  36. 36
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    I wasn’t directly asking you. Just wondering aloud. The latest article on the Michigan power grab is Dec 28 from the FTFNYT, so I’m assuming they didn’t have the votes to override.

  37. 37
    Barbara says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: In fairness to Booker, I think that most black men seeking statewide or national political office feel somewhat compelled to be unity candidates so as not to be stamped by the press as the angry black man. I don’t hold it against him exactly, but I think it does hamper his ability to speak to the moment, to be rhetorically somewhere between Obama and Sanders (to name someone who is all vitriol all the time).

  38. 38
    Barbara says:

    @TaMara (HFG): It’s not an argument. It’s a position statement and you don’t have to agree.

  39. 39
    Mayur says:

    @Mayur: Got it. You also could have said “she endorsed Jill fucking Stein,” which would have been everything I needed to know. I honestly wasn’t aware. The Bernie celebrity supporters I can remember seem to have been perfectly willing to stick their eventual “BOTHSIDES! NEOLIB!” crap in my face, so Dawson not coming to mind made me think she hadn’t been quite that dumb.

  40. 40
    germy says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    While Clinton never went negative on Sanders in paid advertising, her team did compile a full opposition-research book on him. When New York asked Sanders last year about how he’d prepare for negative attacks ahead of 2020, he brushed the idea aside. “Look, you don’t even need [opposition research],” he said. “If I were a choirboy, it doesn’t matter, because they lie all the time.”

  41. 41
    rikyrah says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    The sycophantic GOP that puts party before country is wrong. The hypocritical evangelicals are wrong. They are all flat out wrong and I want a Presidential candidate who is brave enough to say it. Am I reading Booker wrong here? What do you all think?

    This is what I wrote elsewhere as to why I am truly ‘ meh’ about Booker:

    Whether I agreed or disagreed with Barack Obama on an issue, I never doubted his judgement, and I respected that, even if I disagreed, I could trust the decision making process.

    When someone asks you if Donald Trump is a racist, and, as a Black person, you don’t say YES in a nanosecond, you are suspect and can’t be trusted.

    Simply put, I don’t trust him.
    Would I vote for him if he became the nominee? Of course.
    But, I don’t trust him, and I don’t think he’s living his truth.

    The most accurate description of Booker came from a Black Conservative Blogger- Booker Rising- the night of Iowa Caucus, 2008.

    ” Somewhere, in a Newark Project, Cory Booker is scribbling notes furiously. “

  42. 42

    @germy: That was one of Pres. Obama’s flaws (whom I miss terribly). He always thought if he was reasonable and reached across the aisle they would end up meeting him. But they never had any intention of doing so and by the time he’d figured that out, he’d missed a lot of opportunities. We just don’t have time for that kind of naivete anymore.

  43. 43

    @Barbara: How can I agree or disagree when you won’t elaborate??? I’m going to go with the people who actually did as you asked and googled and reported back what they found. We are all asking you what brings you to this opinion and you won’t elaborate.

    And you were kind of rude to anyone who asked you about it. So, yup, I’m pushing at you. You are welcome to your opinion, but don’t be rude about it.

  44. 44
    WaterGirl says:

    @TaMara (HFG): Exactly right. I wish that could fit on a bumper sticker.

  45. 45
    Ohio Mom says:

    @VeniceRiley: Frankly, If you has asked me what Hillary’s slogan was just before I read your comment, I wouldn’t have remembered “Stronger together.”

    Looking at what has happened since, it’s sadly pretty obvious that a fair portion of the electorate had a long list of people they did not want to be together with under any circumstances.

    Right wingers are still chortling over Obama the campaigner saying he had visited 57 states. I’m willing to cut Mayor Pete some slack. Maybe if someone calls attention to this minor gaffe, he’ll correct himself.

  46. 46
    Barbara says:

    @TaMara (HFG): I’ll keep that in my file the next time I get castigated for pushing back at commenters like Omnes. And honestly, I am polite to the point of fault nearly all the time. And now I’m out of here.

  47. 47
    WereBear says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: [President Obama] always thought if he was reasonable and reached across the aisle they would end up meeting him. But they never had any intention of doing so and by the time he’d figured that out, he’d missed a lot of opportunities.

    One of the hardest things in the world is for a fully formed and mature human to realize that the envelope of plasma before them does a reasonable facsimile of humanness, but is utterly lacking in any humanitarian dimension; and thus, will happily do the most heinous things without a qualm.

  48. 48
    rikyrah says:

    @TaMara (HFG):

    @Barbara: So what I’m seeing is, you don’t like Booker because of Dawson, but whenever anyone asks you to elaborate you get defensive and say find it yourself

    Not Barbara, but here’s a list for me:
    His association with the Manhattan Insitute
    His devotion to the charter school movement (for this alone, he should be dead meat in a Democratic Primary)
    His mismanagement of the Zuckerberg money
    His devotion to Wall Street
    Lack of spine.

  49. 49

    @germy:

    Bernie Sanders is preparing for the coming onslaught of attacks by hiring someone who knows the material best.

    More like he’s trying to hide from the onslaught of attacks by hiring the person who has spent the most time researching his weaknesses in the hopes that will prevent anyone else from finding them. Tough luck, Bernie; there are too many of them for them not to be found.

  50. 50
    WaterGirl says:

    @TaMara (HFG): Thank you.

  51. 51
    WaterGirl says:

    @rikyrah: I completely agree with your blockquote.

  52. 52
    EmbraceYourInnerCrone says:

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/04/23/politics/rosario-dawson-monica-lewinsky-hillary-clinton/index.html

    “Outspoken Bernie Sanders surrogate Rosario Dawson said Saturday she stands with Monica Lewinsky’s fight against bullying, and suggested that the Clinton campaign is engaging in such behavior. Sanders on Sunday defended Dawson’s overall speech, but declined specific comment on the Lewinsky reference.”

    Apparently Rosario felt that the Clinton campaigns work to help their voters fight against online harassment by Bernie bros was “Bullying”
    She also complained about a “media blackout” of Sanders during the run up to the election to which I reply – Bwahahahahhaahahahahaha! Seriously!?!

  53. 53
    tobie says:

    @VeniceRiley: Buttigieg not only criticized Clinton but also Amy Klobuchar in a way that felt to me like two guys (Ryan Lizza and him) yucking it up in the dorm room:

    [Birch Bayh] was famous for carrying a spoon in his suit pocket to be ready for stops at Dairy Queen. He had that kind of nice retail touch. But also —

    Interviewer: If only Amy Klobuchar had adopted a version of that.

    Eeeeeeewww, uh, yeah.

    You should have taken the high road on this, Mayor Pete.

  54. 54

    @rikyrah: Okay, thought I might be “too angry” and letting that get in the way. Angry about the long wait to get rid of Trump. Angry that we’re having new men continue to push themselves forward for the nomination (just no Joe, no). And even Booker’s promise to put a female on the ticket as his VP annoyed me. Was it condescending and paternalistic? I honestly don’t know. That’s just how angry I am. I can’t really tell anymore. So I need some help in interpreting stuff. Your perspective is most welcome.

    That anger is why I like Kamala and Warren. They seem like they push back but not in an angry way, but in all the right ways, via policy and tough stances on moral issues. Whereas, Booker just seems to be singing kumbaya a little too often.

  55. 55
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @rikyrah: Can’t help wondering how much Coltrane paid in royalties when he played what I’m guessing couldn’t have been R&H’s favorite rendition of My Favorite Things.

  56. 56
    WaterGirl says:

    @VeniceRiley: If you gave me a multiple choice test with Hillary slogans as a question, and told me to check all that apply, I would have checked Stronger Together and I’m with Her.

    If somebody truly lies, and does it deliberately, then by all means, call them a liar. But what you’re doing here with that statement about Buttigieg is worse than the bullshit they were puling with Elizabeth Warren “lying” about her ancestry.

    Every imperfect statement is not a LIE. If you are going to hold Democratic candidates to that standard, we are going to be left with ZERO candidates standing. Get some perspective, please.

  57. 57
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    Barack Obama is not naive and never has been.

  58. 58

    @WereBear: LOL, agreed. It’s why I keep slapping myself in the face whenever the GOP throw the country under the bus again so they can stay in power. I just can’t wrap my head around it.

  59. 59

    @zhena gogolia: I wavered over using the word “naive” because I figured it might piss someone off. So what would be a better term for thinking the other side would be patriots and act rationally? Optimistic? I’m not being sarcastic or a smart a$$. I’m seriously asking.

  60. 60
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    Optimistic is good. Trying to be president of the entire country is another. We now see what it’s like when a president doesn’t do that.

  61. 61
    Brachiator says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    I wavered over using the word “naive” because I figured it might piss someone off. So what would be a better term for thinking the other side would be patriots and act rationally? Optimistic? I’m not being sarcastic or a smart a$$. I’m seriously asking.

    Hopeful?

  62. 62
    WaterGirl says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: Well, whatever word you guys decide on, I think Barack Obama lost that about 2 years in. He certainly gave them more chances to be decent than I would have, but I suspect that as a black man in power, he had to give them extra rope before he could safely start to say anything about that or he would have been accused of being the black man with a chip on his shoulder.

  63. 63

    @zhena gogolia: Thanks!@Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: You should try living somewhere where you are a visible minority and then you will find the answer to your question.

    ETA: Obama was pragmatic, that’s the word I would use.

  64. 64
    piratedan says:

    for me, the most compelling question has yet to be asked of any candidate and in all likelihood, it will NEVER be asked.

    What do we do to restore our faith in the electoral process now that we’ve effectively been hacked and had our country taken over by the agent of a foreign country?

    I want to have an idea on what they intend to do about Putin and in all of those that turned traitor in order to subvert our process.

    For me, a candidate like Booker doesn’t appear to have the chops to honestly answer that question.

  65. 65

    @EmbraceYourInnerCrone: Thank you. I really was trying to get her to just provide some context instead of snapping at anyone who asked. It’s not helpful.

    So she got down and dirty while supporting Bernie. Check. If that’s enough to make you dismiss Booker, I completely understand. What happened to Hillary was awful – but I will flip that a bit and say if you held everyone to the same standard during the primary, you might never vote for anyone again.

    Things got ugly in 2008, if I remember correctly, and some nasty things were said by Pres. Clinton – enough to make me lose some respect for him – and yet we didn’t (at least I didn’t) hold that against Hillary in 2016. She was the best candidate in the race.

    BTW, I’m not on team Booker. I’m just enjoying getting to know these people. This reminds me of when I posted about Kamala. Lots of no way, no how, comments because of her record as a prosecutor.

    I feel like we are on a first date with all these people. For me it’s just to soon to say yes or no on anyone (well, with one huge exception).

  66. 66

    @zhena gogolia: @Brachiator:
    But do we REALLY want a President to care about the support of neo-nazis who would kill him/her just as soon as acknowledge him/her and evangelicals who base their choices on bringing about Armageddon? Optimism and hopefulness are wonderful qualities. But one can have those qualities without suffering fools and without letting them get in the way of progress. I don’t think Booker has the ability to find that balance. I think that Harris and Warren do.

  67. 67

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:
    I think you’re wrong about Obama’s desire to reach across the aisle. He may have been naive at the very beginning of his term and expected the people who had been willing to negotiate with him in the Senate to still be willing to negotiate when he was in the White House, but I think he figured out what was happening pretty quickly. His bigger problem was that the media is deeply unfair in their treatment of partisanship. They always gave Republican intransigence cover by playing bothsiderism, while they would have roasted Obama alive if he hadn’t at least gone through the motions of trying to get Republican buy-in to his policies.

  68. 68
    Another Scott says:

    ICYMI – Reuters:

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) – The Federal Reserve held interest rates steady on Wednesday and its policymakers abandoned projections for further rate hikes this year as the U.S. central bank flagged an expected slowdown in the economy.

    In a major shift in its perspective, the Fed also now expects to raise borrowing costs only once more through 2021, and no longer anticipates the need to guard against inflation with restrictive monetary policy.

    After a two-day policy meeting that sealed the switch to a less aggressive posture, the Fed also said it would slow the monthly reduction of its holdings of Treasury bonds from up to $30 billion to up to $15 billion beginning in May.

    It said it would end its balance sheet runoff in September provided the economy and money market conditions evolved as expected. Redemptions of mortgage-backed securities would at that point be reinvested in Treasuries up to as much as $20 billion per month, moving the Fed generally toward a Treasuries-only approach to its assets.

    (Emphasis added.)

    They must be really spooked about the strength of the economy, given the way they were pressing to raise interest rates for so long.

    Or perhaps the White House is pressuring them to keep the “Obama Recovery” (such as it is) going through November 2020….

    In a way this is good news – it shows that they are actually paying attention to the data (finally). But it confirms that the economy is weaker than it should be and that they don’t have many tools at the Fed to make it healthier.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  69. 69
    dr. bloor says:

    @Adam L Silverman: “Hire the guy who knows where all my skeletons are hidden” seems pretty sound, actually.

  70. 70
    tobie says:

    @WaterGirl: I couldn’t care less if Buttigieg got HRC’s campaign slogan wrong. It was his interpretation of her defeat that got me. I posted this below but I’m reposting only because it’s a propos your comment:

    What I was objecting to was the blitheness with which he said, “It was all about our own nominee. “I’m with her,” was literally the button.” Who made it “all about our own nominee”? Not the Clinton campaign. They were trying desperately to get the press to cover her when she was talking about her objectives and programs but all we ever heard about were her emails. The forces arrayed against Clinton were staggering from the media to Russian bots to BernieBros and purity ponies, and to blame her relentlessly for the defeat when neither John Kerry nor Al Gore ever faced anything like this is just shameful IMO.

  71. 71
    J R in WV says:

    @VeniceRiley:

    Case in point: Buttigieg just lied and said HRC slogan was “Imwithher” but it wasn’t.

    Well, actually NOT TRUE. He said “The Buttons were “I’m with Her!”” which was even in your comment as such. So calling that a lie is itself a dishonest distortion of what Buttigieg said.

    Are you a homophobe, or do you have a thing against people from Malta? Or Indiana? Or want to disrupt the Democratic process? Perhaps a Bernie Bro? Working against all the real Democratic candidates in favor of the Russian Stooge candidate?

    Because I’m confused as to why you would create a lie about Mayor Pete AND Hillary’s campaign slogan and buttons worn by many of her supporters. Unless you are working against Democratic candidates in general.

  72. 72
    tobie says:

    @Another Scott: Saw this. Inflation’s rising, the economy is slowing, job growth is down. BREXIT will also have ripple affects.

  73. 73

    @schrodingers_cat: While I do benefit from white privilege, I have lived my entire life as a minority as a woman. And not just a typical woman, but a VERY tomboyish, highly intelligent and outspoken woman who grew up in the South and has always worked in male dominated careers. Some of my earliest memories are ones of myself, my mother and other loved ones (in particular POC) being discriminated against. Note: I’m NOT claiming that I know what it’s like to be a POC.

    I THINK, correct me if I’m wrong, that you’re saying Booker (and Obama) were being conciliatory because he is a POC. If that’s the case, why isn’t Harris? Why wasn’t Abrams? I agree that Obama was damned if he didn’t show emotion and damned if he did and that was a direct result of his being a POC. And there were many instances of this kind of dynamic. But his optimism that McConnell would compromise at some point? I simply disagree that was a result of his being a POC and more of a personality characteristic.

  74. 74
    trollhattan says:

    @TaMara (HFG):
    Agreed. I’ve not had a single “Thank God, my perfect candidate!” moment but am practically reveling in how many are in the hopper I have no qualms about supporting. (And a couple of “NO WAY”s and several “Uh, who?”s, leaving a dozen.)

    So why am I drifting towards Warren? Was it the golden retriever?

  75. 75
    Another Scott says:

    @VeniceRiley: I understand reacting to buttons being pushed, but I still have a couple of “I’m With Her” car magnets from her official campaign store. It was one (of many) slogans her campaign gladly associated with.

    Calling Mayor Pete’s statement “a lie” is a bit strong.

    My $0.02. YMMV.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  76. 76
    geg6 says:

    @Barbara:

    I didn’t know she did that. However, I reiterate that I don’t vote for the candidate’s girlfriend, boyfriend, wife, husband, kids or grandparents. I vote for candidates. As far as I know right now, he’s not even engaged to her, so I guess I’m at a loss as to why you are sure she’ll be living in the White House, should he win. They apparently just started dating. Whatever, I’m not interested in arguing about it.

  77. 77
    WaterGirl says:

    @VeniceRiley: Here is the full text for what you must have based this comment on:

    “Buttigieg just lied and said HRC slogan was “Imwithher” but it wasn’t. That was a defense and defiance by her voters and supporters in response to insane press, Wilmerites, and the right. HRC campaigned on the message “STRONGER TOGETHER.” So; Pete may be smart, but he ain’t all that.”

    I don’t think that “Buttigieg just lied” is in any way an accurate reflection of his answer:

    QUESTION: One of the hallmarks of the campaign so far has been a really rich and detailed debate about policy within the Democratic Party. Is that what’s important right now? Or should the Democratic Party simply be organized around the simple premise that Donald Trump is a national emergency and must be defeated above all else and that the policy particulars should take a back seat to that?

    BUTTIGIEG ANSWER: So actually I don’t agree with either of those approaches. The problem with making it all about him is that’s what we did in 2016, and when we make it all about him, then there’s a lot of voters in places like the industrial midwest, where I live, who say, “Okay, but who’s talking about me?” Part of how we lost our way in 2016 was, first of all, it was all about our own nominee. “I’m with her,” was literally the button.

    Then when we realized who the Republican nominee was going to be, the message became, “Don’t vote for him.” And we just left a lot of people out because it didn’t seem like we were talking about the lived experience of Americans.

    For the same reason I don’t think that we should do the usual Democratic thing, which is experiencing your competition through competing policy proposals. I think that policy matters, I’m a policy guy. But I think that you need our altitude to be both higher and lower. Higher in the sense that I think we need to talk about values and principles, that’s why I’m out there talking about what freedom and democracy and security mean before we get into the depth of any policy idea. And at the same time also be talking in terms that are nearer to the ground, really explaining what we believe in in terms of everyday lived experience and how different under us it will be than under them. And that’s how good political narrative works.

    Just putting it all together here so everyone can judge for themselves.

  78. 78
    geg6 says:

    @Mandalay:

    If you had seen him on Hardball, he did that. I find him quite compelling.

  79. 79

    @Roger Moore: I agree with you that the Media played a major role in the way that all played out. And I agree that Obama discovered his error sometime in his second year and sought to correct that. But by then it was too late. I’m not talking about all the environmental factors that went on. I’m specifically addressing the fact that Obama came into the Presidency with an unwarranted optimism considering the racism that was so present in the campaign, considering our history as a country, and considering the fact that McConnell directed the GOP to simply say no to everything the day Obama was sworn in. And I’m saying that Booker has that same quality and we should have learned that lesson already–no optimism that traitors will stop being traitorous and racists will stop being racist. Hope, maybe. But no policies waiting for them to come along and meet us in the middle.

  80. 80
    germy says:

    @WaterGirl: Can you imagine our current president putting sentences together like that?

  81. 81
    Barbara says:

    @geg6: You know, I don’t think I am ever going to get over what happened in 2016. And for me, Dawson and Sarandon represent the worst version of women I can possibly imagine: personally comfortable, willing to risk other people’s well-being, and holding other women to a standard of conduct and virtue that they never demand from themselves or from men, and going out of their way to make sure everyone knows it and to use their celebrity in the most destructive way possible. I think Booker is okay but I like others better and I am viscerally repelled by the idea that Booker sees something wonderful in Rosario Dawson. It makes me question my erstwhile view of his character.

  82. 82
    WaterGirl says:

    @geg6: You said you don’t vote for for the candidate’s girlfriend, boyfriend, wife, husband, kids or grandparents.

    I don’t, either, and I certainly don’t hold them responsible for what siblings or extended relatives say or do. But I do look at the people they surround themselves with because I think that’s a good view into who and what they value.

    In our primaries last year for our state rep to go to washington, I listened to several of them talk at meet and greets at small local venues. There was one who said all the right things but I still felt that he was “off” somehow. Then he brought his wife and two boys up to introduce them to the crowd. His wife stood there preening like a little girl would for her daddy – her feet in one place on the ground, but swaying back and forth like a little girl would showing off her new fancy dress. There was absolutely nothing in the demeanor together that said “hey, we are two people in an equal partnership of love and family.” Ugh.

    So I think the people you choose to have around you is important, and it does influence the way I see a candidate. If Pete or Beto or Harris chose Ted Devine to run their campaign, I would first vomit, and then reassess everything else I had previously thought of them. Maybe you would think that’s wrong?

  83. 83
    geg6 says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    But one can have those qualities without suffering fools and without letting them get in the way of progress. I don’t think Booker has the ability to find that balance.

    What has he done or said in office that would make you say that? Are you a constituent? Did you live in Newark when he was mayor?

  84. 84

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: No I am not saying that at all. My comment was only with respect to Obama. I have no opinion on Booker. I haven’t paid much attention to him. You called Obama naive and I don’t think he is naive. When you are different, you try to see where other people are coming from. Trying to bring people together was Obama’s brand, remember his convention speech. He had to show that he tried working in good faith with the Rs before giving up that approach.
    After T no D has to assume good faith from Rs.

  85. 85
    Gin & Tonic says:

    This is good, lots of candidates mean we have the excitement that the R’s had in ’16, when they had a stage full and all we had was that boring lady.

  86. 86
    WaterGirl says:

    @germy: Ha! Every time I listen to Buttigieg I find myself thinking that Trump couldn’t even come up with one single complex thought out of the hundreds Pete expressed in the CNN town hall.

    I am not certain that Trump has ever had a single abstract thought in his life.

  87. 87
    J R in WV says:

    And as an old white guy living in the country, I just want to say I’m pretty much determined to work for Kamala Harris for President. I think she’s got the grit to face up to the Nazis and racists and Trumpistas, both during the election and after, in order to flush all the grifters and facists out of the government.

    Fixing things that the Fascists have broken will be hard, and we’ll need someone willing to prosecute the offenders who have been committing war crimes on our border, the child abusers and traffickers, and the people like De Vos using contracts to steal from the people’s pockets.

    This won’t be like the normal change of administrations. This will be like opening that big old chest in the spare bedroom and finding it full of snakes and scorpions and rabid bats. Only worse, past my ability to describe it in common English. We will need someone who has dealt with child abuse professionally as a routine part of the job, for one example of what the next non-Fascist president will have to deal with. Jeffery Epstein and Madam Yang are real criminal-political problems, and someone will have to be assigned to take care of them.

  88. 88
    Mandalay says:

    OT, but finally a Republican in Congress (Sen. Isakson) has really ripped into Trump in full honey badger mode:

    I don’t know what is going to be said in the next few days about John McCain by whomever is going to say it or what is going to be done, but anybody who in any way tarnishes the reputation of John McCain deserves a whipping because most of those who would do the wrong thing about John McCain didn’t have the guts to do the right thing when it was their turn. We need to remember that. So I would say to the president or anybody in the world, it is time to pause and say that this was a great man who gave everything for us. We owe him nothing less than the respect that he earned, and that is what I intend to give John in return for what he gave me.

    It’s taken over two years for anything stronger than a wimp like Flake being “troubled” by Trump, but that was a real attack, clearly tagging Trump as a draft dodger who deserved a “whipping”, and daring Trump to escalate things.

    Fan, meet shit. Shit, meet fan.

  89. 89

    @schrodingers_cat: I admitted to zhena that naive was a poor word choice. I’m happy to use optimistic. And I agree with your reasoning that he did have to try. But try for two years? Of course, it’s easy for me to second guess him. I will grant that I’m armchair presidenting more than a little.

    I think most of us would agree that after T we don’t have to assume good faith from R’s.

  90. 90
    rikyrah says:

    @Barbara:

    @geg6: You know, I don’t think I am ever going to get over what happened in 2016. And for me, Dawson and Sarandon represent the worst version of women I can possibly imagine: personally comfortable, willing to risk other people’s well-being, and holding other women to a standard of conduct and virtue that they never demand from themselves or from men, and going out of their way to make sure everyone knows it and to use their celebrity in the most destructive way possible

    CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP

    THEY were never going to have to live with the RESULTS if things went bad.

    I’ve said it from the get go…
    Those on the left that helped bring Dolt45 into office
    WILL NEVER EVER BE FORGIVEN

    anymore than the deplorables who pulled the lever for him.

  91. 91
    geg6 says:

    @WaterGirl:

    I’m not going to take a candidate off my list for dating someone I’m not fond of, especially if they just began dating. Hell, if I judged people by who they dated or who they married, I’d have very few people in my life. Most of my friends, male and female, are living with or married to people I’m not particularly fond of but I don’t cut them out of my life because of it. And I just love how everyone is judging this actress I know nothing about and not wondering why, if she is a Susan Sarandon doing Hispanic cosplay, she would be with the guy some of the same people are slamming for being some kind of corporate whore.

    Jesus. I may have just quit commenting until the primaries are over. Except in pet threads, I guess.

  92. 92

    @geg6: I am not a constituent. I have seen him in many interviews (like this Ellen one) where he simply refuses to call the racists, racist. I’m reflecting something that other people have noticed as well. I point you to Rikryah comment to me above…..@rikyrah:

  93. 93
    Doug R says:

    @Barbara:

    It’s not an argument. It’s a position statement and you don’t have to agree.

    First of all, Rosario isn’t running for anything. Second, what has she said lately? She may have moderated or learned something. I mean, Elizabeth Warren used to be a Republican.

  94. 94
    Kent says:

    As a teacher I’m not thrilled with Booker as a candidate. He was WAY too cozy with the charter school industry including Betsy DeVos and a bunch of the charter school grifters. As in worse than Arne Duncan. He is good on criminal justice and I’d be happy to see him as Attorney General perhaps. But he isn’t my top candidate by a long shot. We get the same thing in a better package with Kamala Harris.

    As for Rosario Dawson? I don’t really much care. Yes the Green Party nonsense is abhorent. I don’t know what kind of bubble she lives in. I would have to see some mea culpa from her to be comfortable. Some evidence that she has learned something and matured. Otherwise she comes across as a dilettante.

  95. 95
    Barbara says:

    @Doug R: I want an apology. Full stop.

  96. 96
    Mandalay says:

    @Barbara:

    I am viscerally repelled by the idea that Booker sees something wonderful in Rosario Dawson.

    I had never heard of her before this thread, but now I understand why she bothers you.

    A possibility that is even worse than Booker seeing Rosario Dawson as wonderful is that if he is shamelessly using her as a stage prop to help his campaign. I have no evidence for that, but it’s irresponsible not to speculate. (It’s not fair, but running for the presidency as a 49 year old single man is surely a liability, whereas talking about a White House wedding is surely a vote winner.)

  97. 97

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: Perhaps two years was too long a time. Hindsight is 20/20. Even if I disagreed with President Obama, which I did on many issues, I was sure that he was not operating with malign intent unlike the present occupant of the WH.

  98. 98
    trollhattan says:

    Speaking of “I can’t evens”–Donna Brazile

    A tidbit.

    So you don’t feel like Fox is sui generis among news or journalism networks, if we are going to call it that?

    Look, you are asking me to condemn Fox without looking at the entire media landscape? You are talking to somebody who saw reporters take bait and food from WikiLeaks and turn it into a front-page story. They built their political narrative on hacked, stolen e-mails. Are you calling the right person? I am saying to you, as a journalist, that I have seen the media itself tear us apart by using material that was stolen. I mean, c’mon. Don’t call me and say, “Donna Brazile, can you now explain to us the Fox business model?” I can’t explain MSNBC, CNN, any cable channel.

  99. 99
    Doug R says:

    @rikyrah: Black men aren’t ALLOWED to speak their truth.

  100. 100
    geg6 says:

    @Mandalay:

    Wow. Just…wow.

  101. 101
    EmbraceYourInnerCrone says:

    My biggest problem with Cory Booker is his stance on Charter schools and the fact that most of the $100 Million dollar Zuckerberg donation for Newark public schools did not go to the local schools to be used for what they needed. 60 million went to charter schools…

  102. 102
    Salty Sam says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    I like Booker’s personality but the ONE thing that gives me pause is the very thing that Ellen praises in him and that is his desire to say, “we’re basically all the same…there is no you’re wrong and I’m right”. I completely disagree. The hardcore 30/40% that still support Trump due to their “economic” anxiety are wrong. The white nationalists and neo-nazis are wrong. The sycophantic GOP that puts party before country is wrong. The hypocritical evangelicals are wrong. They are all flat out wrong and I want a Presidential candidate who is brave enough to say it. Am I reading Booker wrong here? What do you all think?

    You nailed it 100%. The idea that “we’re basically all the same” is Both-Siderism of the highest order.

  103. 103

    @J R in WV: I find myself leaning toward her. Let’s just say, if I was going into a fight, I’d want her on my side.

  104. 104
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @trollhattan:

    I have seen the media itself tear us apart by using material that was stolen.

    She’s not wrong.

  105. 105
    WaterGirl says:

    @geg6: I hope you didn’t take my comment as hostile or accusatory in any way. I was trying to have a real conversation with you that might be enlightening for both of us.

    But I’m with you in general about the tone of some of the discussions about the candidates. In general, if a person has to lie or exaggerate or represent a candidate in a misleading way in order to promote their preferred person or denigrate someone else’s preferred candidate, I wish they would just STFU.

    If your point is a valid one, you shouldn’t have to lie or misrepresent or exaggerate. And if I see someone doing any of those things, then I think their point is full-on bullshit.

    So they aren’t doing themselves any favors by doing that — unless they are truly disingenuous and are trying to win over people who are less discerning.

  106. 106
    geg6 says:

    @rikyrah:

    ” Somewhere, in a Newark Project, Cory Booker is scribbling notes furiously. “

    See, here’s the problem. You find this damning. While I find the idea to be exactly what I’d expect of any politician who wants to be successful. I don’t believe that there is a politician alive who isn’t scheming his/her whole life for how to get higher office. And I really don’t want a politician who doesn’t have ambition, as long as they don’t destroy others on their way up. If you know anything about extremely successful American politicians, from Washington to Lincoln to FDR to Kennedy to Obama, you have to know that they have thought about running for president their entire political lives. And if you think they aren’t, you are the one being naive.

  107. 107
    cwmoss says:

    @Barbara: What she said three years ago? I don’t know wtf you’re talking about either and if you’re not willing to help out a sincere questioner, then I guess you don’t want more people to know about this apparently disqualifying infraction committed by some second tier People Magazine regular. So I guess Rosario Dawson said something a long time ago that some assholes on a top-10,000 political blog didn’t like. Knowing the details is a shibboleth for your squad, I guess.

  108. 108
    Gelfling 545 says:

    I haven’t been too fond of Booker because he was heavily into promoting charter schools in his area. That’s my only gripe but it’s a seriouse one to me.

  109. 109
    Mandalay says:

    @geg6: I’m overthinking it in bad way? Maybe I’ve become far too cynical here.

    WaterGirl wrote an excellent comment yesterday about how we should focus on the positive aspects of the candidates, yet I’m rolling around in the sewer 24 hours later. My bad – I’m going to stop right now.

  110. 110
    WaterGirl says:

    @geg6: Is that “wow” as in I shocked about that and I totally agree with your point? Or is that “wow” as in the opposite of the first sentence?

  111. 111
    Salty Sam says:

    @rikyrah:

    His association with the Manhattan Insitute

    Wait, WHAT?!? I did not know this.

    To quote a frequent and valued commenter here:

    PHUQUE OUTTA HERE!

    Seriously, that is an immediate disqualifyer for any Dem in my book.

  112. 112
    Mandalay says:

    @WaterGirl: Heh. See post #109.

  113. 113
    Barbara says:

    @Gelfling 545: I actually chalk Booker’s charter school initiatives up to the desperation that many people feel about large urban school systems, and their willingness to try anything to salvage as many kids as they possibly can. I give him the benefit of the doubt on this issue, even if I absolutely disagree with him on it and especially disagree with the idea that charters can be seen as anything other than a desperation measure. Resorting to charters is like admitting utter failure. For anyone with kids in a public school that is not failing, charters are an existential threat. I don’t like that Arne Duncan, Cory Booker and yes, even Barack Obama, seem unwilling to admit any of that.

  114. 114
    WereBear says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ: And not just a typical woman, but a VERY tomboyish, highly intelligent and outspoken woman who grew up in the South and has always worked in male dominated careers.

    As someone who shares these characteristics, I wanted to chime in with my own experience that this is far more of an outsider than some might be able to grasp. I did have my sexual orientation questioned, was told no one would ever want to marry me, and dealt with outright hostility because the Deep South norms for white women were so narrow and uncompromising.

    And WOC had it worse, of course.

  115. 115
    Gelfling 545 says:

    @VeniceRiley: Surely “lied” is a bit strong there. Was mistaken, sure.

  116. 116
    Gelfling 545 says:

    @Barbara: In many places it’s been more than that. It’s been a money grab and a resegregation tool.

  117. 117
    Brachiator says:

    @Mrs. D. Ranged in AZ:

    But do we REALLY want a President to care about the support of neo-nazis who would kill him/her just as soon as acknowledge him/her and evangelicals who base their choices on bringing about Armageddon?

    Damn good question. The short answer is Yes, obviously.

    These people are not going away. They are still citizens. Fools got nervous and stirred up all kinds of racial anxiety when Obama was elected. The worst explicitly fanned the flames of racism, sexism, anti-gay bigotry. We have a president, the Great Orange Turd, who not only believes in the false dichotomy of winners an losers, but also believes that he has the right to define who should win and who should lose.

    Good people rejected this noxious idea and fought back in the mid-terms. The battle continues.

    Optimism and hopefulness are wonderful qualities. But one can have those qualities without suffering fools and without letting them get in the way of progress.

    It requires great courage. And sometimes you fail. Abraham Lincoln was one of the most complex of presidents, and one who deliberately and specifically refused see his fellow countrymen and women as enemies of the people in perpetuity.

  118. 118
    Barbara says:

    @Gelfling 545: Yes, understood. Like I said, I disagree with him on it utterly, I just don’t think his support is being made in bad faith or because he is trying to direct money to for profit operators. Charters are pernicious, and all the more so for not being regulated or required or to spend a minimum percentage of their revenue on their actual educational operations. They suck.

  119. 119
    Citizen Alan says:

    @zhena gogolia:

    Optimistic is good. Trying to be president of the entire country is another. We now see what it’s like when a president doesn’t do that.

    I will not vote for someone who is overly concerned with being president of 40% of Americans who want to burn the nation to the ground. The #1 thing I now look for in a Democrat is whether they understand who the enemy is.

  120. 120
    JustRuss says:

    @geg6:

    …on Hardball with Chris Matthews the other night in an interview that was… in a bit of a weird venue, a diner in Iowa.

    Oh JFC, have we reached peak Chris Matthews yet?

  121. 121
    rikyrah says:

    Steadman™ (@AsteadWesley) Tweeted:
    Exclusive: Ahead of his speech today, I talked with Andrew Gillum about why he’s not running for president, how he plans to turn Florida blue in 2020, and why Beto O’Rourke, he said, “enjoys a set a privileges” that allows him to be “taken seriously.”

    https://t.co/8OYQqpjClH https://twitter.com/AsteadWesley/status/1108458365422837761?s=17

  122. 122
    ballinger says:

    @Barbara:

    Your criticism of Booker by way of Rosario Dawson is counterproductive and pointless.

    I wish folks here could simply accept the fact that Hillary was a horrible candidate who gave us Trump thanks to her clueless and incompetent campaign. I don’t like dwelling on the past, but I find it infuriating that most of Hillary’s supporters blame everyone but Hillary for her defeat. Hillary Clinton is surely the sorest loser in presidential campaign history and has demonstrated a remarkable lack of self awareness. I voted for her over Trump, but I wish she’d go away and enjoy her retirement.

    Booker is not my first choice, but he’ll definitely have my vote if he’s the nominee. Anyone who voted for Jill Stein made an incredibly stupid mistake, but Hillary should never have made so many dumb mistakes herself during the 2016 race.

  123. 123
    Jay says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    After Merrick Garland no D should assume any “good faith” from any ReThug.

    But they still need to play the bipartizanship game for the MSM Bothsiderists, Mean Girls and Purity Ponies, along with the low intormation voter,

    And they need some kind of nudge, nudge, wink, wink signalling for those of us who “get it”.

  124. 124
    zhena gogolia says:

    @J R in WV:

    What you say makes a lot of sense.

  125. 125
    trollhattan says:

    @JustRuss:
    You’ll recognize it when he broadcasts from Tip O’Niell’s crypt.

  126. 126
    jk says:

    @JustRuss:

    Have we reached peak Chris Matthews yet?

    Astronauts will set foot on a planet in another galaxy before we reach peak Chris Matthews.

  127. 127
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Mandalay:

    Get back to me when he actually does something about it.

  128. 128
    Kent says:

    @Gelfling 545:

    @Barbara: In many places it’s been more than that. It’s been a money grab and a resegregation tool.

    Exactly. The charter industry in New Orleans has been used to lay waste to thousands of middle class black unionized teachers and replace them with young white out of state “teach for america” temps. And the results have been disastrous.

  129. 129
    satby says:

    As bad as we suspected things would be if by some bizarre twist Trump won in 2016, two years later we now have been dealing with mindnumbingly worse than we could have foreseen in every conceivable way. The entire country has PTSD, even the morons who support Trump are a little fearful of what unhinged thing he might do next. We, as a group, need to be a little less instantly reactive to every perceived misstep or nuanced thing some Democratic politician says; at least until there’s time to get context around the issue. The reflexive irritability and jumps to nastiness aren’t going to help.
    And remember, there’s a foreign country that’s working hard to help that irritability and intra-party nastiness flourish.

  130. 130
    Nicole says:

    @Barbara:

    I actually chalk Booker’s charter school initiatives up to the desperation that many people feel about large urban school systems, and their willingness to try anything to salvage as many kids as they possibly can.

    I respectfully disagree on this point- when politicians go the charter school route, it’s because they’re looking for an easy solution to poverty. And there is no easy solution to poverty and I don’t want my politicians looking for the easy solution if it’s not also the one that actually works. I was willing to accept that Booker has realized his charter school folly, but in a thread from a couple of weeks ago on him (I think the one where he announced he was running), Kay posted that in fact, he’s still supporting them. Which is a big mark against in my book. The charter school movement in NYC and Newark has mostly been a big money grab for hucksters, but the kids have not benefited. Nor has the public school system.

    (And look, I know, I know, #notallcharters so don’t come at me. I’m talking the big ones here in the cities.)

  131. 131
    rikyrah says:

    @Doug R:

    @rikyrah: Black men aren’t ALLOWED to speak their truth.

    Not true. It’s hard – sure.
    Difficult – yes.

    I said that he’s not living his truth. I was watching the show Billions over the free Showtime weekend. The Paul Giamatti character was doing a deal with the Black Attorney General of New York. They were teaming up to go against the Attorney General of the United States. While discussing their plan, they went through the possible reactions of the Attorney General. They said that one thing he was going to do would be to investigate both of them…the Black Attorney General said ‘ all he’ll come up when he looks at me is a bouquet of begonias. I knew that if I was going to go where I wanted to go that I had to be Jackie Robinson. ‘

    I nodded at that line.

    A Black candidate has to live their truth…even if they can’t express it, because, as a Black person, I have to feel, bottom line, that this Black person will have the community’s back, and not be pushed into betraying us.

    For all the derision of Barack Obama by the Hotep Crowd, looking back, over 8 years, I can’t ever point to a time where I believed that he betrayed the Black community.

    I do not trust Cory Booker. I just don’t.

  132. 132
    rikyrah says:

    @Kent:

    The charter industry in New Orleans has been used to lay waste to thousands of middle class black unionized teachers and replace them with young white out of state “teach for america” temps. And the results have been disastrous.

    say it for the bleacher seats.

  133. 133
    Brachiator says:

    @Barbara:

    I think Booker is okay but I like others better and I am viscerally repelled by the idea that Booker sees something wonderful in Rosario Dawson.

    Well, she is smokin’ hot, and a good actress.

  134. 134
    rikyrah says:

    @Citizen Alan:

    The #1 thing I now look for in a Democrat is whether they understand who the enemy is.

    ICAM.

    The field has changed. We don’t give two shyts about looking across the aisle.

  135. 135
    Barbara says:

    @Nicole: I am not going to waste my breath defending charters when I think they are easily the worst public policy development of my lifetime! What gives the game up is when politicians demand accountability from public schools but just shrug their shoulders when charters are shown to be failing their students and spending money on things other than education, including lobbying. So I said what I said, which is simply that I don’t think Booker is acting in bad faith, but that doesn’t mean his support of charters should be viewed as noble or not worthy of criticism.

  136. 136
    Jay says:

    @ballinger:

    Hillary won the popular vote by 3 million, despite:

    – Emailzzzz!!!
    – Bengazhi!!!!
    – Clinton Cash!!!!!
    – Uranium 1!!!!!!
    – Bernie Bros,
    – Putin
    – ReThugs treason

  137. 137
    Dan B says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Pragmatic fits well.
    Politically astute, especially when most of the country wanted the anger to stop, but it all too quickly became a liability like standing on Omaha Beavh and shouting, “Can’t we just get along?” The majority of the country wants stability and fairness but the plotocrats want power and that is easy to skim when our institutions and societal cohesion are under attack.

  138. 138
    piratedan says:

    @Jay: waiting on the elaboration of the fatal mistakes that she made….

  139. 139
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    I find Booker appealing in many ways, although he’s far from the top of my list.

    But just about anyone in the Democratic field is light years ahead of this ineffable motherfucker.

  140. 140
    Immanentize says:

    @Jay:
    Yeah well maybe, but only 3 million in her column? Worst candidate ever, or so I hear.😎

  141. 141
    Immanentize says:

    @piratedan: I think looking to Pynchon’s book, “V” might suggest a clue.

  142. 142
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @ballinger: Ballinger, just go away. She has every reason to be bitter, but instead she powers on, trying to do her best. Yes, she made mistakes, but not anticipating the sheer sexism is not one of them. Nor is being able to overcome a well-earned cautiousness and a lifetime of dodging nastiness is another.

    Nor could she-or anyone else-anticipate Russian involvement and the rat-fucking that would involve. And as for incompetence, she lost due to the fluke of the Electoral College, not because people didn’t like her. Three million extra votes. If it weren’t for that College-and a mere 77,000 in three states, we would have had President Hillary Clinton, no caging of children, choice preserved, and a steady foreign policy.

  143. 143
    Kent says:

    @Nicole:

    I respectfully disagree on this point- when politicians go the charter school route, it’s because they’re looking for an easy solution to poverty. And there is no easy solution to poverty and I don’t want my politicians looking for the easy solution if it’s not also the one that actually works. I was willing to accept that Booker has realized his charter school folly, but in a thread from a couple of weeks ago on him (I think the one where he announced he was running), Kay posted that in fact, he’s still supporting them. Which is a big mark against in my book. The charter school movement in NYC and Newark has mostly been a big money grab for hucksters, but the kids have not benefited. Nor has the public school system.

    (And look, I know, I know, #notallcharters so don’t come at me. I’m talking the big ones here in the cities.)

    Imagine if we treated law enforcement as we did education. Crime rates must fall every year and for every subpopulation in every city and reach zero or else each police department will be declared “failing” and get reorganized. All the union cops are fired and we bring in non-union Eric Prince’s (Betsy DeVoss’s brother) nonunion and unaccountable Blackwater mercenaries to replace them. Millions of public dollars vanishes unaccountably and we stop monitoring these privatized police forces under any metric that they used to be monitored because “trade secrets”.

    Bush’s No Child Left Behind law expected 100% results across every subpopulation in every school. Essentially the same thing as saying we expect zero crime for every subpopulation in every town and city in America. After all, the population the schools are dealing with is exactly the same as what law enforcement deals with, just a couple years older for the most part.

    Anyone who advocates for charter schools in this day and age automatically loses my vote.

  144. 144
    Immanentize says:

    @Kent: I like your police force analogy. Stealing it. Thanks

  145. 145
  146. 146
    JPL says:

    These are the folks at the bottom of my list, Tulsi and Bernie. I will vote for the democratic nominee but I doubt that either will be it.

  147. 147
    Barbara says:

    @Immanentize: I don’t like it because I think a lot of people would say “fuck yeah” and be quite happy at the thought of having a militarized private police terrorizing not quite random citizens if the “real police” can’t bring crime down. Except for the firing and outsourcing part, that’s pretty much where things have been going.

  148. 148
    rikyrah says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    THEY NEVER PHUCKING LEARN!!!

    Is this the 2019 version of DERIVATIVES?

  149. 149
    JPL says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Well that put a knot in my stomach.

  150. 150
    MomSense says:

    @Roger Moore:

    The notion that Obama was naive is my pet peeve. First, we all need to be aware of the racist history with using that word to describe BIPOC. It’s also absurd to think that the first black President was anything but incredibly fucking cognizant of the political dynamics. He didn’t talk about working with Republicans because he thought they would (although a few did work with him early on) he said it because voters want to believe it. He also relied on a lot of Republican voters and elected officials in the 2007-2008 campaign. I traveled to multiple states – I saw this first hand. Republican former governors, legislators, etc were involved in his campaign.

    Even though it’s a zombie lie that both sides are to blame, it’s a widely held belief. And both sides working together is what voters want.

  151. 151
    VeniceRiley says:

    @J R in WV:

    Are you a homophobe

    I AM A LESBIAN. ARE YOU A FUCKWIT? Huge signs everywhere that say STRONGER TOGETHER and you know that he only saw some buttons? Why bring it up? Too-clever-by-half was signal criticizing Hillary for a wink with media bros while trying to be subtle about it. he should stop.

  152. 152
    MagdaInBlack says:

    @rikyrah:
    They learned that theyll walk away and someone else will clean it up.
    Again.

  153. 153
    Kent says:

    @Immanentize:

    @Kent: I like your police force analogy. Stealing it. Thanks

    As a teacher it always astonishes me when we have politicans and other leader saying we should expect 100% results from public schools, every kid should leave knowing how to read, write, and do math to national standards or the school is failing. Then turn around and demand we throw the book at those same exact kids one year later when they are encounted in the criminal justice system under “tough on crime”

    Poverty is a very tough nut to crack. In both education and in the criminal justice system. Which are the two places were most people encounter government. And there are no easy shortcuts or answers.

  154. 154
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Mandalay:

    I am amazed — and pleased — that it was Johnny Isakson who said this. Good for him.

    I’ve called his Georgia and DC offices numerous times about numerous issues. We have never been on the same side of those issues, and my calls have been an unending exercise in futility.

    But credit where due. I’ll phone his offices first thing tomorrow to applaud him.

  155. 155
    Jay says:

    @piratedan:
    @Immanentize:
    @CarolDuhart2:

    Yup.

    I though Hillary Clinton would be a “bad cantidate” because the MSM’s 40 year Witch Hunt of the Clintons would cost her votes.

    I thought that some of her Foreign Policy actions would cost her some votes.

    But she was the best Cantidate and with out Russia, Israel, Sawdi Arabia ratfucking and ReThug’s treason, she would be President.

  156. 156
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Immanentize: She went to Valletta? And now Buttigieg is trending? Plots within plots.

  157. 157
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Another Scott:

    Calling Mayor Pete’s statement “a lie” is a bit strong lie.

  158. 158
    Aleta says:

    @Immanentize: No one ever mentions V. Respect.

  159. 159
  160. 160
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Kent: I think charters are argueably worse than your theoretical example of privatizing a police force, as long as the city council of that jurisdiction had oversight of the force.

    My suburban city outsources garbage collection to a private company. If this company was to start skipping streets, spilling trash and leaving it there, whatever — city council would hear a lot of complaints from their constituents. They would begin reviewing whether that contract should be continued, with the thought that if things did not improve, they could be voted out. In short, there is accountability.

    With charters, an entire level of democratically-elected government, tne local school board, is effectively erased and replaced by a private concern without any accountability to the citizenry.

    Some people might call that fascism. I would.

    Republicans may favor this sort of approach but Democrats should know better (looking at you Booker).

  161. 161
    hueyplong says:

    Isakson might have just ripped Trump, but didn’t he also just vote to give Trump emergency powers?

    Will he now vote to override?

    To ask the question is to answer it.

  162. 162
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    There are some really unhinged, doctrinaire people in this thread.

  163. 163
    rikyrah says:

    @Jay:
    And , with all that, without the denial of the franchise to loyal Democratic Party voters, in those key states, due to VOTER SUPPRESSION 😠 😠….

    She would be President.

    The number of voters denied the franchise was 2-3 times the margin of Dolt45’s ” victory” in those states

  164. 164
    geg6 says:

    @WaterGirl:

    Wow as in exactly how Mandalay understood it. He basically called Dawson Booker’s beard. I just can’t with this stuff. Glad to see he’s rethinking it.

  165. 165
    JPL says:

    @Ohio Mom: Where I live the public schools have intense accountability, and the charter schools none. One fallacy is that they are non profit. Charters often borrow from a higher authority outfit that is very much a profit making scheme.

  166. 166
    Ohio Mom says:

    @piratedan: I would like to see ANY of our contenders focus even a little attention on foreign affairs.

    Just mention something in passing about how they will deal with our newly-antagonized allies, or North Korea, or strengthening our trade agreements, and so on, and yes, someone has to carefully explain that our sovereignty is at risk when other countries interfer in our elections (including via funding enabled by CU).

    Maybe this stuff doesn’t fly in focus groups?

  167. 167
    Aleta says:

    @JPL: Charters often borrow from a higher authority outfit that is very much a profit making scheme.

    This.

  168. 168
    JPL says:

    @hueyplong: Nope. Isakson is a conservative republican who believes in tax cuts and lax regulations. He called out trump on his shithole comment also, but still votes solidly with him. He has nothing to lose by calling him out, because I doubt he runs again.

  169. 169
    Kent says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    @Kent: I think charters are argueably worse than your theoretical example of privatizing a police force, as long as the city council of that jurisdiction had oversight of the force.

    The whole point of charter schools is that they don’t answer to local elected bodies like school boards or city councils. To make the analogy accurate you would have to have state legislatures prohibit any local oversight of privatized police forces making them only accountable to out-of-state corporate interests.

    I would actually have no problem at all with local charter schools that answered to local school boards and operated publically in the same manner as other public schools. But that would eliminate the grift and union busting so pretty much defeat the entire purpose of charter schools. In my experience with education in 5 different states, I have only come across one single charter school that was entirely locally run and mangaged and seemed to be locally accountable. That was the Rapoport Academy in Waco Texas which was built on the abandoned former campus of Paul Quinn College, an historically black college that moved from Waco to Dallas in the 1980s. The charter school is part of a whole neighborhood revitalization project in a high-poverty mostly black part of Waco and they are doing interesting things restoring and repurposing the old crumbling college buildings. https://www.rapoportacademy.org/ But the examples of charter schools like this are extremely few and far between.

  170. 170
    Ohio Mom says:

    @JPL: It is hard to make blanket statements about charters because each state that allows them has a slightly different set of laws governing them (some allowing loopholes like sham non-profit oversight).

    But lack of accountability is certainly a hallmark everywhere.

  171. 171
    geg6 says:

    @rikyrah:

    I’ll say only this…his community in Newark trusts him. Other African American politicians in New Jersey trust him. I know this because I know some and, to a person, they think he’s the real deal.

  172. 172
    Jay says:

    @rikyrah:

    Yup, the list goes on and on.

  173. 173
    hueyplong says:

    @JPL: Exactly.

    The invertebrates make a mewling noise on their way out the door but they don’t have the courage to cast a vote against Trump, regardless of the gravity of the subject. It was McCain’s thumbs-down that has him forever on Trump’s revenge list, alive or dead.

  174. 174
    Uncle Cosmo says:

    @ballinger: Who the fuck invited you, troll?

  175. 175
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @rikyrah: Same concept, different type of debt. And exact same set of stupid mistakes being made.

  176. 176
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @JPL: It’ll be fine if it turns into a major economic crisis. The President has Kevin Hassett, Larry Kudlow, and Peter Navarro as his senior economic and trade advisors and Wilbur Ross running the Commerce Department. The best people. THE BEST PEOPLE!!!!!

  177. 177
    tobie says:

    A propos of nothing, I was happy to learn that today is Carl Reiner’s 97th birthday. I still like the clip where he says he starts every day by reading the obituary column to see if his name is mentioned. Here’s his son’s tweet:

    @robreiner
    97 yrs. ago today my father was born. He served in WW2. He was on TV before we owned a TV. He’s won 12 Emmys. He loved my mother for 65 yrs. He has 3 kids & 5 grandkids that he loves. He is my hero. I love him. The best gift he could get would be the removal of the WH cancer.

  178. 178
    Another Scott says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I’m no expert, but the Fed has been watching CLOs and there seem to be some inherent issues with them to keep the market for them from getting gigantically huge as CDOs were in the Housing Bubble days.

    E.g. Reuters from November 2018:

    […]

    The CLO market, which performed well during 2008’s credit crisis, was boosted by regulators earlier this year when CLOs were made exempt from a Dodd-Frank risk-retention requirement that forced managers to hold some of their funds. The decision opened the door to increased issuance by allowing firms to access the market that previously lacked the required capital for retention.

    The US Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia Circuit, including Supreme Court justice Brett Kavanaugh, ruled in February that CLOs backed by broadly syndicated loans do not need to comply with ‘skin in the game’ rules that were intended to align investor and manager interests. Regulators did not appeal the decision.

    The court ruling “has been a game changer for the ease of execution of deals,” said Paul St. Lawrence, a partner at law firm Cleary Gottlieb Steen & Hamilton. “All the major market participants are comfortable that there are ways to do all the (CLOs) they want …without accidentally triggering risk-retention rules.”

    But the strength of the market could hinder future issuance. CLO spreads have widened due to a glut of new funds and a finite set of investors, which is making the economics less attractive to buyers of the most junior portion of the funds, the equity slice, who are paid last with the interest leftover after all debtholders are paid.

    Spreads on the senior Triple A CLO tranche widened 2bp in October to an average 119bp from an average of 107bp in June, according to LPC Collateral.

    Widening spreads have exacerbated dwindling interest payments. US companies refinanced more than US$246bn of loans in the first nine months of the year, to cut borrowing costs, and also switched to shorter-dated benchmark rates. This cut interest payments to CLOs that still have to make high payments to their own investors.

    […]

    Although the arbitrage remains challenging, banks are expecting another strong year in 2019. Wells Fargo, Deutsche Bank and Nomura are predicting US$110bn of US CLO volume, while Barclays is forecasting US$100bn-US$110bn of new US broadly-syndicated CLOs and US$15bn-US$20bn of middle-market CLOs next year. JP Morgan is expecting US$135bn of issuance and Morgan Stanley is predicting US$90bn.

    […]

    Of course the banksters love them because they don’t have to retain capital. But it seems like the problems with the economy are much bigger than whatever is going on with CLOs (which are still rather small).

    My go-to guy for information on the strength of the economy, and the housing market in particular, is Bill McBride at Calculated Risk. He’s noted the slowdown in many indicators, but he’s not worried. Yet.

    My $0.02.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  179. 179
    Jay says:

    @hueyplong:

    Arn’t inveribrates defined by having a spine?

  180. 180
    hueyplong says:

    @Jay: I thought it was the opposite.

    Which calls to mind Lindsay Graham, who will be defending the honor of his BFF John McCain in 3, 2, 1…

  181. 181
    Jay says:

    @hueyplong:

    You were right,

    I was less right,

  182. 182
    Irony Abounds says:

    @WaterGirl: You raise a good point, and when you look at some of the people the Clinton’s surrounded themselves with you can see why there were concerns about Hillary. I mean Bill used Dick Morris. Hillary had Mark Penn, an absolute asshole, as her chief strategist in ’08. Lanny Davis has been in the Clinton camp like forever. With that said, Clinton was the obvious choice in ’16 and I’m not going to let Booker’s girlfriend disqualify him. The Dems are going to let the purity police reelect Trump.

  183. 183
    Barbara says:

    @Irony Abounds: If you read my first comment I said that I wouldn’t consider funding his campaign until he was the actual nominee. I am not a purveyor of purity politics, but in distinguishing Booker from 8 other candidates for the nomination, I think it is absolutely appropriate to look at the people who are important in his campaign. And frankly, Dawson’s behavior in 2016 was beyond the pale and I have yet heard that she has acknowledged error.

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