Irish Alzheimers Open Thread: NEVER FORGET


For those of you who didn’t grow up among us, ‘Irish Alzheimers’ is the ‘Scots Irish’ term for the condition where “you forget everything but your grudges.”

227 replies
  1. 1
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    that no puppet clip has been getting a lot of play and I still can’t quite believe people who tie their own shoes would vote for him after that.

    Among many other moments, obviously, but that one was so bizarre…

  2. 2
    dmsilev says:

    He’s probably still whining about having to skip that New Year’s Eve party with his cronies (and bonus foreign spies!) at Mar-a-Lago. “Not leave the White House” really means “not be able to goof off half the time like normal”.

  3. 3
    Corner Stone says:

    I just wanna see HRC go Rambo one good time. Cut off a slice of some pantsuit and tie it like a bandanna around her head. Rip the sleeves of her silk blouse and display the pipes. Then when she breaks into the NYT news room and they try to tell her to calm down, it’s over now, she can look at them and yell, “Nothing is over! NOTHING!” Then start blasting all the artwork and lighting in the building.

  4. 4

    I believed her. I just couldn’t understand how someone could pick T as the candidate over Hillary. I couldn’t sleep for weeks after Agent Orange was elected.

  5. 5
    Kelly says:

    OT: Video review of officials calls in sportsball is primarily there to create more windows for advertising.

  6. 6
    Baud says:

    When I’m president, I’m putting a statue of Hillary next to the Washington monument as a reminder to future generations. It’ll be modeled after this one.

  7. 7
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    because of course he is

    Entertainment Weekly @ EW
    Anthony Scaramucci among 12 new Celebrity Big Brother houseguests

  8. 8

    For those of you who didn’t grow up among us, ‘Irish Alzheimers’ is the ‘Scots Irish’ term for the condition where “you forget everything but your grudges.”

    And here I was guessing it had something to do with alcohol!

    So “foreign policy realist” twitter is starting to line up behind Gabbard, I think.

  9. 9

    @dmsilev: Yeah, he means travel for fun–golf, Mar-a-lago, whatever.

    ETA: He keeps saying he’s alone in the WH. Do his wife and son no longer live there?

  10. 10
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I don’t think his son ever has.

  11. 11
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: Do his wife and son no longer live there?

    There are rumors that the kid spends most of his time at his grandparents’ new house in the DC suburbs. Anything is possible with this crew, but it’s hard to imagine they’d be able to keep that a secret what with secret service and all. Neighbors would notice.

  12. 12
    Millard Filmore says:

    (either a crazy WEB server or a crazy reader)

  13. 13
    Michael Cain says:

    @Kelly: The last time I was at a live NFL game (won tickets in a lottery), what I particularly noted is just how much dead time there is on the field. And it’s not just commercial breaks. I’m curious about cause-and-effect: are the long gaps between plays needed by the teams so the TV crews have to artfully fill them with replays and inane comments; or do the TV crews need time for replays and inane comments, so the teams have to stand around for a bit?

  14. 14
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Millard Filmore: I blame Russians.

  15. 15
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    Bolshevik Bernie

    I’m totally stealing this.

  16. 16
    debbie says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I still can’t quite believe people who tie their own shoes would vote for him after that.

    Wasn’t it the NYT article last week where the Trump supporter said she was disappointed with Trump because he hadn’t yet hurt the people she wanted him to hurt?

    There’s your answer.

  17. 17
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Michael Cain:
    Does the waiting around happen in non-televised football?

  18. 18
    Kelly says:

    @Michael Cain: I’ve been to one live NFL game (San Diego) and yeah what a lot of dead time plus the group I was with had seats in the very highest row. At least the weather was nice and I enjoyed sitting in the sun.

  19. 19
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Too bad for them she (probably) won’t be the nominee and won’t last until even the first debate.

  20. 20
    Gin & Tonic says:

    I hardly ever watch gridiron football, and I know a lot of you hate my local team, but I’m killing time and have this game on, and it is positively surgical.

  21. 21
    Chyron HR says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    So “foreign policy realist” twitter is starting to line up behind Gabbard, I think.

    Great, but she needs “The human race deserves to die if our messiah doesn’t win the primary” Twitter.

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    his grandparents’ new house in the DC suburbs

    Must be pretty sweet being the chain migrated family of a mail-order bride.

  22. 22
    Elizabelle says:

    I hope Trump has even less opportunity to roam in the future. I hope he has the securest of government-provided housing.

    If you get my drift.

  23. 23
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Gin & Tonic:
    Fuck the Cheatriots.

    OT: There’s a commercial for a drug to stop delusions from Parkinson’s. Every time it comes on, I think ” Did you try turning off Fox first?”

  24. 24
    Martin says:

    Man, the Superbowl Patriots finally showed up after a pretty weak season for them. 35-7 at the half. Chargers aren’t playing poorly, other than one turnover.

  25. 25
    Corner Stone says:

    @Gin & Tonic: Chargers don’t seem to much want to win this game.

  26. 26
    Corner Stone says:

    @Martin: Committing two holding calls on incomplete pass attempts on Pats 3rd downs never seems to make things better.

  27. 27

    @Chyron HR: she’ll obviously get that if he doesn’t run (he’s running).

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: why wouldn’t she make it to the debate?

  28. 28
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Corner Stone:
    Funny how NE always gets those calls just when they need them. Too bad their opponents don’t.

  29. 29

    @Major Major Major Major: I wouldn’t call Greer a realist. He’s kind of quirky, doing his own thing, more conservative-libertarian than anything else. He does give a realist interpretation there, though.

  30. 30
    Kelly says:

    Football has always gone with family gatherings for me. Back in the 1970’s my maternal Granddad had 2 TVs to watch more than one game. I used to go over to read scores and add a little play by play as his vision started failing when he was 90.

  31. 31
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @A Ghost To Most:
    But but but… America’s Team!!!!

  32. 32
    Tenar Arha says:

    @Anne Laurie, Andy Richter noted on Twitter that

    When he says he hasn’t left the WH in months, he means it in the sense that the big baby hasn’t been able to play golf. To his mind, being in Iraq is effectively being in the WH; it’s all not-golf.

    and even though there’s absolutely no reporting to confirm it, it feels true. I mean I know he’s been to Camp David & multiple trips elsewhere in the Presidential helicopter. IOW The stupidest reason usually applies with him, lack of golfing fits.

  33. 33
    Martin says:

    @Corner Stone: Yeah, they’ve had some pretty bad penalties, but even without that they’re just getting picked apart.

  34. 34
    khead says:

    @Michael Cain:

    The play stoppage and commercials become even more noticeable and irritating during the playoffs if you spent the regular season watching the NFL via RedZone.

  35. 35
    James E Powell says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Who is T Greer when he’s not on Twitter? And it takes more than one person to line up.

    What Gabbard has going for her is that the Democratic base doesn’t like her. So, she will receive soft, glowing coverage from the Village and donations from people who never like the Democratic nominees.

  36. 36
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:
    Don’t even get me started on those fucking Cowboys homers, Buck and Aikman.

  37. 37

    @James E Powell: he is an Asia policy wonk followed by among others Cheryl Rofer and Noah Smith. It’s an example. Her domestic policy is what will sink her, plus her horrific history of saying things out loud.

    ETA I personally think her foreign policy is motivated in no small part by islamophobia, especially if you consider it in context with her strong support of Modi. I’m just reporting the movements I’m seeing on twitter. I imagine an anti-interventionist message might resonate with people like Cole, though of course she has all her domestic/Dem-bashing baggage.

  38. 38
    sukabi says:

    @Gin & Tonic: don’t think he has either…and TLOTUS only visits occasionally, after the media has started to wonder where she’s gone off to.

    But do you really think drumpf notices or even cares that those 2 aren’t around? He’s more concerned that he can’t hold court and golf.

  39. 39
    Josie says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I can totally envision this, and I love it.

  40. 40
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I love it!

  41. 41
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Gin & Tonic: I hate your team, but who doesn’t love Sony Michel?

  42. 42
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Her domestic policy is what will sink her, plus her horrific history of saying things out loud.

    I’ll be surprised if registers at all in polling, unless she’s more of a star to the Wilmer/Stein faction than I’m aware of.

  43. 43

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: my friends from SF who visited this weekend, who were big enough Bernie fans that they voted for him as late as the CA primary and to this day think he’s helping the liberal cause, were very excited. I don’t know how representative that is but she made big inroads with her DNC-bashing Bernie wingman’ing.

  44. 44
    sukabi says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: looking forward to his lasting .25 scaramoochis on that show.

    And no I’m NOT watching.

  45. 45
    The Dangerman says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    …Anthony Scaramucci…

    I saw his book at B&N recently and my jaw hit the floor.

    I mean, Trump is a lot of things …but, Blue Collar? Seriously?

  46. 46
  47. 47
    West of the Rockies says:

    @A Ghost To Most:

    Kinda weird, isn’t it?

  48. 48
    sukabi says:

    @Elizabelle: walls, big beautiful steel and concrete walls, with guards that are getting paid.

  49. 49
    Gin & Tonic says:

    Think I’m going to turn this off and go for a walk. Not really even fun to watch any more.

  50. 50
    StringOnAStick says:

    It’s shitty, but I will admit that I want the whole Drumph thing to blow up so big that not even FOX can ignore it, because then my FOX-bot father will have to deal with it. OF course I want this nightmare and period of extreme danger to our democracy to end more, but I will admit to wanting the satisfaction of his having to admit it is true. My entire life he’s been a screaming RW jerk to anyone (especially his kids) who didn’t agree with his revanchist and retrograde political opinions (a Bircher from way, way back), but one thing he was adamant about in the 1980’s was how much he hated Russia and that anything that Reagan did was “OK as long as it terrified the Russians.”

    I hear from my younger sister that he said he was “very disappointed in Trump”, but he wouldn’t elaborate and as soon as she started to talk about the bad things the Mango Moron has done, he immediately started defending him so she stopped. We never talk politics anymore because that is the rule if he wants me in his life anymore, but I’ll never trust him to not be a split second from a complete screaming meltdown over his precious Rethuglican party. It’s sad that the R’s matter more than his relationships with everyone, including with his kids.

  51. 51
    Corner Stone says:

    @A Ghost To Most: One was well away from the play but it was blatant. You can’t turn the guy 210degrees when he has a step+ on you. The other was much more more questionable. I’m not a Pats fan so I look around when they call shit off the ball.
    But as Martin and G&T have said, the Pats are power ballin’ right through the LAC DB’s and then using play action to eat chunk plays. Just like you draw it up.

  52. 52
    The Dangerman says:

    @Corner Stone:

    Chargers don’t seem to much want to win this game.

    Did they fly back to LA after Baltimore? I assume so. They look it.

  53. 53
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Major Major Major Major: is it too soon to say “arrogant, ignorant, isolationist bitch”? Would that be considered uncivil?

  54. 54
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    She’s very unpopular among the party base?

  55. 55

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: haven’t seen polling but the “professional left/liberal” types (Vox, even Jacobin and the Intercept) dislike her.

  56. 56
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I have the same impression from my BernieBro friends. They absorbed that she was “anti-Hillary” and everything else has sort of revolved around that with the best possible interpretation.

    She was alternately for and against intervention in Syria? She was non-interventionist but patriotic. She was super friendly with Assad? She was trying to discover the truth that the corporate media was hiding (that Assas didnt attack his own people). She’s progressive but her voting record doesn’t reflect it because she has principles. She constantly attacks Democrats and is friendly to Ttump because she knows how awful Democrats really are. Etc.

    She already has a cult following. And they’ve decided all criticism is secretly that she’s not “likeable” and that we’re corrupt and sexist for opposing her. Not gonna end well.

  57. 57
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @A Ghost To Most:
    I’ve seen articles that say the Patriot’s are America’s Team now. I think it’s a stupid and insipid term. I’m not even a football fan and I feel I’m being lumped in because hey, America’s Team.

  58. 58
    patrick II says:

    @Michael Cain:

    I have started watching the 10 minute recaps on Youtube they started showing this year (following the NBA’s lead I think), The videos are usually posted within an hour after the game is finished. They show the 30 or so top plays with no commericials. I will watch about 3 “games” in one half hour and call it a day. I do that or watch a recorded game and fast forward thru everything but the plays. Anyhow, yea, football has very little “play” time compared to dead time.

  59. 59
    sukabi says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: yeah well they (by the media) were declared “America’s team” after 9/11 too. Who better to use as a prop to keep the flags waving than “The Patriots”?

  60. 60
    Suzanne says:

    @StringOnAStick: I think a lot of Trump voters are disappointed, but they can’t admit it. Admitting that you voted the wrong way is essentially admitting that you got conned, and that is painful.

    I really want Trump voters to admit that they voted for him because they look around and they see that white dudes are getting their asses whupped by minorities and women, and it’s because they got so comfortable with white patriarchy that they allowed themselves to get soft and weak and lazy. Seriously, I look around at the successful professional people I know, especially those who are 40 and below, and 90% of them are racial minorities and/or women, all of whom were taught from an early age that it was a white dude’s world and that they were going to have to kick some ass to earn their place in it. I don’t think that most white dudes were ready for that. Oh well.

  61. 61
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: She’s going to be a star.

    Because no matter who the Democratic frontrunner is, they’ve all got these bizarrely vehement hater squads, and reasons that are being pushed hard to reject them. There’s going to be a huge faction who are yearning for some excuse, any excuse, to reject the establishment’s choice without nominally supporting Trump. It almost doesn’t matter who serves as the focus of that yearning, as long as they have some sort of quirky outsider/heretic status. Also, the Russian trolls will support that person, whoever it is.

    Bernie Sanders was the focus of that in 2016. This year Bernie’s used up, and it’s going to be Gabbard (since she has zero chance of being the actual nominee, and her foreign-policy positions please the “anything the foreign policy establishment says is wrong” crowd).

  62. 62
    Corner Stone says:

    @The Dangerman: Baltimore committed the sin of talking themselves into believing Lamar Jackson is an NFL level QB. He is not.
    I am afraid the Texans are doing the same thing with DeShaun Watson. They need to add two pieces to their O-line and also hire the guy that worked with Russell Wilson after RW got hurt a couple years ago from taking too many hits while running. Have him beat that out of Watson in the off season and the sky is the limit for DW.

  63. 63
    debbie says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    From your tweet:

    Gabbard’s position is this: we cut deals with the dictators SO THAT we can get out. The United States has no interests in this region, our presence is unwelcome there, and (by and large) only makes things worse. We need to cut ourselves our of this mess altogether.

    Have any of them given thought to the fact that we are significantly responsible for the ongoing conflicts and that if we were the upstanding nation we say we are, we would stay engaged and work to resolve all of the conflicts?

    Republicans and Bros: Perfect cowards together.

  64. 64
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Suzanne: Admitting that you voted the wrong way is essentially admitting that you got conned, and that is painful.

    there’s a book about how con artists work from the early 70s, IIRC, that was getting talked about a lot in the tubes a couple of months ago, mainly because the author stresses that one of con’s biggest strengths is that the suckers don’t want to admit they were suckers. Their first response to people pointing it out is to dig in.

  65. 65
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    Re: Gabbard and non/anti-interventionism. I think it’s very a complicated issue. I think military intervention often leads to worse outcomes. That doesn’t mean it should never be an option. Non-violent solutions (soft power) should be exercised first. I think it’s important to be involved with the outside world and try to make it a better place. To do so is not just the morally right thing to do, but also best for our own national security. A secure, stable world that provides happiness for as many people as possible provides the United States with stability and security.

    After all, evil triumphs when good men do nothing.

    I don’t think we should just unilaterally pull out after we’ve done so much damage. We need to try to make these countries whole again.

  66. 66
    debbie says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Art of the Deal? //

  67. 67
    sm*t cl*de says:

    @The Dangerman:

    I mean, Trump is a lot of things …but, Blue Collar? Seriously?

    A working-class Nero is something to be…

  68. 68

    @debbie: indeed they have and some think that our attempts at damage control often make things worse as well. Further, chasing our tails doing damage control is subject to the same kind of mission creep by embedded evil interventionists.

    (This is covered some in that twitter thread if you click through and go up a ways. Try to ignore the DNC-bashing upthread; we aren’t discussing the views of our comrades here after all.)

    ETA also these are “realists” who tend to think that following one’s heart is what gets us into these messes in the first place.

  69. 69
    prostratedragon says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Jim, I fixed the Manchurian Candidate link and addressed your other question. (Direct to clip here)

  70. 70
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    What would these “realists” think of the quote: “Evil triumphs when good men do nothing?”

  71. 71
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:


    Glenn Greenwald’s outfit even hates her? That’s pretty bad. I haven’t seen any polling either. I just can’t see such an obvious phony like her getting anywhere.

  72. 72
    The Dangerman says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I am afraid the Texans are doing the same thing with DeShaun Watson.

    I didn’t see Chargers/Ravens. I did see a lot of Colts/Texans and Watson looked like the hypothetical lovechild of Doug Flutie and Mark Sanchez. Truly uninspired…

    …and then he shows up at the NC game. OK, fair enough, seasons over, he has free time, but, damn, be in mourning for a few weeks after that kind of performance.

  73. 73
    germy says:

    Glenn dipped his big toe into the waters

    The people who were furious at @davidsirota for reporting on Beto O'Rourke's voting record & funding sources have – with @TulsiGabbard's announcement – apparently decided it's OK to attack the voting record & ideology of Dem candidates after all. Seems like an odd double standard— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) January 13, 2019

  74. 74
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @prostratedragon: thanks, I’d seen the movie, but so long ago I’d forgotten a lot, like Inspector Lugar was in it!

  75. 75

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: his outlet does but GG himself is probably a fan since she’s the clear Russian front runner right now.

    ETA see above.

  76. 76
    StringOnAStick says:

    There was a commenter here last night who said there was a good guy who ran against Gabbard in the primary, scientist, good liberal cred, and she still got 80% of the vote; WTF, Hawaii? I also read that the D party of Hawaii is going to run someone against her in the next primary; it might be easier to defeat her in 2020 after she’s had some time to flap her gums on a bigger stage. Anyone from Hawaii have any comments?

  77. 77

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: probably that 1) you shouldn’t govern via slogan and 2) sometimes you gotta let a little evil triumph.

  78. 78
    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho says:

    @Miss Bianca: My vote is “NO” to both. She’s not helping.

  79. 79
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @sukabi: Ugh. So were all of the Pats’ opponents “with the terrorists” during the 2001 season?

    That’s even dumber than just declaring them ‘America’s team’ this year.

    Psst…stupid article writers…. they’re all America’s teams. It’s not the round ball kind of football, and there are no Canadian teams.

  80. 80
    lollipopguild says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: They voted for him because he was going to punish/hurt all of “Those people”(you know who you are).

  81. 81
    Suzanne says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    suckers don’t want to admit they were suckers

    Mr. Suzanne and I were discussing this at dinner last night, how we both feel that the Dems suck at messaging and marketing, and how they really should have hit the whole “He’s a con artist, and he thinks you’re a stupid mark” line much harder in 2016. Say it over and over and over, until it becomes a hashtag, then keep saying it. Put it on a hat or a T-shirt. Make it a brand. People don’t like feeling like they got conned. They really backed off the “deplorable” thing when they would have leaned the fuck in to that. That had potential.

    The Dems, for the most part, also suck at turning their rhetorical negatives into positives. They get all apologetic and wonky and try to respond with facts. Fuck that. No Dem should ever cede an inch of ground here. They should be the “spends without paying their bills GOP”, the “fiscally irresponsible GOP”, the “character matters until it doesn’t GOP”, the “free speech for me but not for thee GOP”, the “religious freedom for me but not for thee GOP”. Seriously. We are the party of the American dream. We are the party of equal opportunity, hard work, fairness, equal rights, and success. We are really the party of capitalism and market competition.

    Mr. Suzanne pointed out that the Dems who are, say, age 50 and below have never lived in a time when the GOP was even partially sane and internally consistent, and that is why they are totally different than the older crew. I am not sure if this is true, but it seems as likely an explanation as any.

  82. 82
    germy says:

    During my exclusive interview with Pres Trump I said Speaker Pelosi was in Puerto Rico with a bunch of her Democrat colleagues. I based that on numerous reports that turned out to be wrong. The Speaker’s office says she has been in DC all weekend and I take them at their word.— Jeanine Pirro (@JudgeJeanine) January 13, 2019

    Fox News should change its tagline to "Numerous Reports That Turned Out To Be Wrong."— Dave Bartoletti (@DaveBartoletti) January 13, 2019

  83. 83
    bemused says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    A good book on my shelf is Mistakes Were Made (but not by me): Why We Justify Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions, and Hurtful Acts, Carol Tavris and Elliot Aronson, 2007. Humans have a tough time admitting we were wrong, self-deluded, conned. The chapter called Law and Disorder fascinated me because I have never understood how prosecutors/law enforcers will fight so hard to stop people from being released from prison who have been completely exonerated of the crime they were convicted of.

  84. 84
    Starfish says:

    @Baud: You better be pushing her as a nominee for a seat on the Supreme Court immediately.

  85. 85
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    In which Paul Krugman subtweets his political reporting colleagues at the Times

    Paul Krugman @ paulkrugman
    People who now admit that the GOP has spent decades exploiting racism to sell plutocratic policies, but remain contemptuous about those who said exactly that in, say 2007 or earlier 2/
    And, of course, people who now concede that the obsessive focus on emails and the failure to connect the dots on Trump-Russia were big failures of 2016 campaign coverage, but are still furious at those who pointed it out in real time 3/
    There is no sin quite as offensive as challenging conventional wisdom early, and then being proved right 4/

    it’s hilarious how defensively indignant NYT reporters get– I’m looking at you, Nick Confessore– when people criticize their coverage of the 2016 race

  86. 86
    prostratedragon says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Inspector Lugar? The movie had a great cast, down to the bit parts.

  87. 87
    Baud says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    sometimes you gotta let a little evil triumph.

    I think I might use that for Baud! 2020!

  88. 88
    Gex says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: Well she’s homophobic so I can see way Greenwald draws a line here.

    She says she hasn’t changed her views on gay rights, but that she’d no longer attempt to impose her views. I trust that’s largely because she can’t as a legislator. No telling what she’d do if she could issue executive orders though.

  89. 89
    JPL says:

    @Corner Stone: Don’t count out Philip Rivers. After all they did just score a touch down. I thought that today might be Brady’s last game. His age is showing and it would not surprise me if he retired. The odds are that he will play another week.

  90. 90
    Baud says:

    @Suzanne: Older Dems lived through the period when the GOP built their dominance over white people. That explains the difference to me.

  91. 91
    Baud says:

    @Starfish: Too old. Chelsea on the other hand….

  92. 92
    JPL says:

    @Suzanne: There’s some truth to that, because I often tell my son in the olden days, the republicans believed in paying their bills.

    btw that was before Reagan

  93. 93
    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho says:

    @Suzanne: Mr. Suzanne is correct about the age thing in that none of the under 50 Dems have reason to hope the GOP would behave in an internally consistent/partially sane fashion. They have no consistent experience of such a thing. That does make them different from the old crew. They need to learn from Nancy Smash how the place works, and if they listen, they’ll be able to do great things by knowing how it is done.

    Boehner looks like a pillar of statesmanship today.

    @Baud: That is also an important point; thanks for making it.

    Baud 2020!

  94. 94
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @prostratedragon: Inspector Lugar?

    James Gregory’s character on Barney Miller, a cranky but maudlin old cop who always cracked me up

  95. 95
    Gator90 says:

    @Steve in the ATL: I can’t say I love him that much, for reasons I assume are obvious.

  96. 96
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @JPL: bible humping quiverful asshole versus friend of trump. Can both quarterbacks please go away forever?

  97. 97

    @Gex: her about-face on gay rights and abortion are just raw politics. FWIW many Dems say the same thing at least regarding abortion (Biden, Kaine). Not trying to defend her just trying to take a less-spiteful look at her since I think we’ll be talking about her a lot soon.

  98. 98
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @germy: “I based that on bullshit we just made up out of thin air because the people who watch Fox will believe they should marry someone today and murder that person tomorrow if we tell them to through our propaganda channel.”

    Fixed it for her.

  99. 99
    tobie says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Gabbard’s position on Iran has not been consistent as far as I can tell. She was a very reluctant yea vote on the Iran deal. This doesn’t really align with her current position. If Iran’s a threat to the US–“The power most hostile to the US–the Iranians–is growing”–wouldn’t you want to diminish that threat by developing friendly relations and tying your opponent up in multilateral agreements?

  100. 100
    JPL says:

    @Steve in the ATL: Giselle seems to have tamed her hubby’s views which is why he was busy didn’t the last visit to the White House. Give the gal some credit. Rivers prayers just don’t seem to be working.

  101. 101
    Miss Bianca says:

    @sm*t cl*de: Congratulations, where do you want your Internets delivered?

  102. 102
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Suzanne: Jack Germond– old school political reporter turned pundit who went to his reward a decade or so ago– said that in the Nixon years, Gerald Ford and Bob Dole were considered part of the far right. My mother said it was Dole on the Ford ticket that made her vote for Jimmy Carter, the last time she considered voting for a Republican. And of course, now Dole is a trumper, which surprised me. I remember when he got booed by other Republicans for saying Clinton was his opponent, not his enemy.

    @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: Boehner looks like a pillar of statesmanship today.

    I’d say yes, but… if Boehner had been willing to bring a floor vote to one of the immigration bills that had passed the Senate (I think there were at least two in the term before he left?) before he zippity-doo-dah’d his way out the door, we’d’ve been spared a whole lot of grief, maybe even president trump.

  103. 103
    RSA says:

    @Tenar Arha:

    When he says he hasn’t left the WH in months, he means it in the sense that the big baby hasn’t been able to play golf. To his mind, being in Iraq is effectively being in the WH; it’s all not-golf.

    I’m surprised so many Twitter comments suggest that he’s ignoring Iraq and Germany, because Trump rambles on to say “except…” for going to Iraq and Germany. I stopped listening then, so I don’t know about Texas.

  104. 104
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @JPL: she told him to stop talking about it; not sure if his views changed

  105. 105
    germy says:


    “I based that on bullshit we just made up out of thin air”

    Their business model.

  106. 106
    Suzanne says:

    @Suzanne: Edit function isn’t working, but I should note that I meant to say that the younger crew of Dems seems to be “tonally different”, not “totally different”.


  107. 107
    Burnspbesq says:

    @Miss Bianca:

    is it too soon to say “arrogant, ignorant, isolationist bitch”? Would that be considered uncivil?

    No and who cares.

  108. 108
    Suzanne says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: There is no convincing or reasoning with any of the GOP, because they aren’t basing any worldview on facts. They are basing it on (justified) fear that a plural, empowered society means that they will lose social status, and that no one will view them in an aspirational way.

    Rod Dreher (sp?) has already written that piece about how white evangelical Christians need to plan to retreat and get used to being on the fringes of society again. At least that mofo is honest.

  109. 109
    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: No question that he should have done (much) better, but honestly, I cut him a little slack for refraining from homicide . Which would have been my response to some of those Tea Party/Freedumb Caucus fools.

  110. 110
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Dare I say that I believe – or maybe that’s just another word for “hope” – that we *won’t* be talking about her much, at all, soon? Aside from the fact that she appears to be a completely repellant human being, when was the last time anyone made the leap from the House to the White House? It’s not going to happen. Her only role is to be some nasty spoiler, and the sooner she gets bitch-slapped back into well-deserved insignificance, the better.

  111. 111
    Suzanne says:


    I just enjoyed the image going around with the text “The is how America should be…..cowboys, guns, steeds, wilderness, and not a city dwelling liberal in sight!”.

    The image is a still of Heath Ledger and Jake Gyllenhaal from “Brokeback Mountain”.

    I’m still laughing.

  112. 112
    SC54HI says:

    Gabbard got into Congress at first because she won a primary against Mufi Hanneman, a DINO who is widely hated across the state. Since then, the power of incumbency (which is strong in Hawai’i) has got her re-elected.

    You have to remember that Tulsi is ONLY about Tulsi and the Chris Butler Cult; she does what they tell her to do. The Cult is a right-wing, homophobic nest of secretive paranoids, headed by the even-more-paranoid-and-secretive Chris Butler who is seldom seen in public nowadays. Once in a while, one of his subordinates (besides Tulsi) occasionally makes the news but the Cult is generally out of public view. Butler has long been rumored to have dreams of national domination via a cult member getting elected to higher office.

    What Butler & the Cult haven’t figured out is that pushing Tulsi into the 2020 limelight is going to give them a sunstroke with all of the daylight that will be shown upon them once the media gets a hold of their history, the Gabbard family’s decades-long role in the Cult, and just how tied to it Tulsi is.

  113. 113
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Burnspbesq: Hmm, didn’t think I actually needed to include the sarc tags on that one, but I guess I’ll know better next time.

  114. 114
    Cacti says:

    Who is Tad Devine managing this campaign cycle? Once we know that, we know Moscow’s choice for disrupting the Dem primary.

  115. 115
    zhena gogolia says:


    I guess that’s his term for James Gregory!

    Just like for me Jonathan Banks is McPike, while he’s Mike Ehrmantraut to all you young ‘uns.

  116. 116
    Amir Khalid says:

    I understand that there is in fact a Canuckistani version of handegg, although I have no idea how popular it is.

  117. 117
    JPL says:

    It would have been nice if the Patriots were able to get a first down.. Oh well..

  118. 118
    TriassicSands says:

    Clinton’s performance in that debate is aging terrifyingly well.

    I disagree. She’s guilty of tremendous understatement. Of course, no one could have believed it would be this bad so it’s not really her fault. She tried.

  119. 119
    raven says:

    @Gator90: How bout that Dawg!!!!

  120. 120
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Major Major Major Major: …This is actually a good point. I really, really don’t like Gabbard. BUT I think I owe it to the Dems at large not to do to her what the Bros/Media/Right did to Hillary.

    She gets a chance and I’ll look carefully at her record. I’m pretty sure I know what I’ll find there, but I’ll be a good person and give her an honest look.

  121. 121
    Ruckus says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I still can’t quite believe people who tie their own shoes would vote for him

    Who do you think they designed velcro straps on shoes for?

  122. 122
    Redshift says:


    They really backed off the “deplorable” thing when they would have leaned the fuck in to that. That had potential.

    But that’s in large part because pointing out how horrible Trump supporters are wasn’t actually what that remark was about. In that speech Clinton was really taking about the half who weren’t deplorable, who we could have some sympathy for. Wingnut media took it out of context and the mainstream amplified it.

    It could have been useful, but I can’t really fault Democrats for not immediately realizing that a wingnut distortion of the intended message could actually be a good thing to double down on.

  123. 123
    Gator90 says:

    @raven: I think he averaged like 20 yards a carry against UF a couple years ago.

  124. 124
    sukabi says:

    @Cacti: think he’s on team bernie again. An article the other day had him disavowing one of the former BS campaign state leads over his sexual abuse of female staffers.

  125. 125
    TriassicSands says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I still can’t quite believe people who tie their own shoes would vote for him after that.

    We may have to blame Velcro for Trump.

  126. 126
    Miss Bianca says:

    @MisterForkbeard: I, on the other hand, am leaning far more toward the sentiment expressed in this tweet:

    Tulsi Gabbard is the coleslaw of the Dem primary; no one asked for it, but it’s showing up with your food anyway.

    Actually, the whole thread that that tweet is in is worth a gander, if you need convincing that Tulsi Gabbard is no dove, and certainly no progressive, despite what the BernieBros may think:

  127. 127
    Gbbalto says:

    @Amir Khalid: There is, and it is popular, but no college machine equivalent to the USA (though there are college teams) to hone really good players. Many American players who missed out on the NFL. There are occasionally ones who get back and the occasional Canadian player in the NFL. Not sure if the latter come from the CFL.

    ETA There doesnt seem to be the alumni $ interest that there is in the US, IMO

  128. 128
    Sloane Ranger says:

    @Kelly: The amount of dead time is one of the reasons I have never been able to get on with American Football but it’s a fast growing game here in the UK. I don’t know if there’s the same amount of wasted time over here though.

  129. 129
    TriassicSands says:

    Tulsi Gabbard, a household name, for president.

    It’s beginning to look like the Dems will have to have three or four separate debates to accommodate all the candidates. That’s with at least 10 in each debate. This is shaping up to make the 2016 GOP field to be starved for candidates.

    Who will make the A-Squad? The B-Squad? Who will decide? What will the criteria be?

  130. 130
    Jay says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    #2 and growing.

  131. 131
    Eli says:

    @Major Major Major Major: @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: Well, some people at the Intercept don’t like her. Jeremy Scahill is certainly a fan (or at least was a couple years ago, I don’t know if he’s written about her more recently) because her friendliness to Assad fits with the narrative of “foreign leader who everyone else agrees is a murderous asshole is really just being framed by the US for imperialistic reasons” which he is always fond of (see: Milosevic). And Greenwald seems to be doing his best to avoid saying anything substantive about her beyond this “Dems are hypocrites for not liking her record, when they also don’t like that we don’t like Beto’s record” shit; all of a sudden he just doesn’t think it’s his place to have any opinion about a Democratic candidate’s actual policy positions.

  132. 132
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @germy: Yup.

  133. 133
    Immanentize says:

    Does anyone know where there is a place where I can find Trump’s tweets about the investigation in chronological order? I try not to follow him at all. Any recommends?

  134. 134
    Yutsano says:

    @Jay: My friend in Calgary loves him some Stampeders. So yeah the Grey Cup is still a thing I guess.

    Also: need to go visit him for Stampede some time. Maybe I can talk my mom into going.

  135. 135
    raven says:

    @Sloane Ranger: It’s the same.

  136. 136
    B.B.A. says:

    @TriassicSands: I’d suggest making all the cis het white dudes ineligible to run, but even then we’d still have too many. (Which is a good thing!)

  137. 137
    catclub says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    And here I was guessing it had something to do with alcohol!

    it probably does.

  138. 138
    WaterGirl says:

    I just saw this on LGM – is this how you guys think of Julian Castro?

    Right now, it’s fun to poke at clown car candidates such as Julian Castro and Tulsi Gabbard; the first an empty suit whose literal only claim to a shot is his ethnicity, the latter an offensive horrible person.

  139. 139
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @Amir Khalid: Canuckistani! Hehe

  140. 140
    Aleta says:

    Slim chance, but thought I’d ask for help about a strange Unix problem in case someone in this universe has an idea. It’s caused by my work mate’s upgrade to (but of course) Mohave. It’s not a hardware problem, not processing power or storage.

    After upgrading two machines Fri and Sat from 10.9 Mtn Lion to 10.14 Mohave, the Mac Pro (of the garbage can variety) is working (after installing GFortran 8.1 to make it work); but the MacBook Pro (needed by tomorrow for class) isn't.

    Both are brand new installations of Mohave (aka Mofo//). They both have XQuartz.

    The C program that's called from Fortran uses X11 with a layer of open gl on top of that. The issue is that the compile of the C program fails during the include gl.h It’s not finding the secondary includes, the cinttypes. So it never gets past its first line and the graphics program can’t be compiled.

    The Fortran compiler is working, it will compile Hello World (GFortran 8.1) no problem; the issue is when you try to connect to the graphics system. Again, this now works fine on the Mac Pro but doesn’t work on the laptop. It doesn’t find the link.

    X11 by default gets installed in a folder /opt /local, but the system uses /usr/local . So there’s a link in the /usr/local to the /op/local/X11 .

    Is that link maybe wrong? Is it to do with where the link is pointing? But (on both) it was an installation package for Quartz that installed all that, so it should be right. But …

  141. 141
    Yarrow says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Dole is a trumper, which surprised me

    Paul Manafort was an adviser to the Dole campaign. Oleg Deripaska hired Dole to lobby the State Dept for a waiver to his visa ban. Dole introduced Manafort to Deripaska, who in turn introduced Manafort to Yanukovich, and thus he ended up working in Ukraine. So yeah, Dole’s a Trumper.

  142. 142
    Martin says:

    @TriassicSands: I thought the plan was a pretty good one. They’ll set a debate size (let’s say 8 candidates) and then randomly draw 8 names, and they get debate 1 night 1, then 9-16 get debate 1 night 2, and on. For debate 2, they redraw names. With 12 debates, we should see a lot of combos. Hopefully should take some of the horserace bullshit off as well and allow for more substantive debates.

  143. 143
    Yarrow says:

    @WaterGirl: Was that in a comment or on the front page? I think Castro is smart and talented but I think he’s running for VP. Tulsi Gabbard is a traitor. They’re not even close to the same.

  144. 144
    Baud says:

    @WaterGirl: Personally, I would prefer a coronation.

  145. 145
    catclub says:


    What Butler & the Cult haven’t figured out is that pushing Tulsi into the 2020 limelight is going to give them a sunstroke with all of the daylight that will be shown upon them once the media gets a hold of their history

    ummmm, isn’t that what is happening to Rump and Co – but only after our fellow citizens elected the criminal.

  146. 146
    JPL says:

    @WaterGirl: Not at all, because he has been in public service a long time. That use to count for something. Because of the damage that trump has done abroad, I do think it’s important that someone with foreign policy experience be at the top of the ticket.

  147. 147
    Martin says:

    @WaterGirl: I really like Julian Castro, but I’m struggling to see him get the kind of A list support that he’ll need here. His best bet it to grab Betos team before Beto does. When Dems start dreaming of winning Texas, they’re not going to see Julian as the vehicle to do that, but Beto. And that’s going to (unfairly) bury Julian.

  148. 148
    raven says:

    April 18, 2015 Atlanta – U.S. Congressman Hank Johnson speaks during a funeral service of Nicholas Thomas, who was shot and killed by Smyrna police officer Sgt. Kenneth Owens, at Historic Ebenezer Baptist Church in Atlanta on Saturday, April 18, 2015. HYOSUB SHIN / HSHIN@AJC.COM Photo: HYOSUB SHIN / AJC/
    Hank Johnson defends comments comparing Trump to Hitler

    ‘That’s a fair comparison, and I think it’s a necessary one.’

    4 hours ago
    By Tamar Hallerman, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
    Share on FacebookShare on Twitter…More
    Georgia Congressman Hank Johnson isn’t apologizing for a recent speech that drew parallels between President Donald Trump and Adolf Hitler, and he says the chorus of critics who have assailed him for the comparison are missing the underlying point of his remarks.

    “I don’t think Hitler or a discussion about Hitler is off-limits to anybody,” the Lithonia Democrat told the Atlanta Journal-Constitution. “That’s a fair comparison, and I think it’s a necessary one, because if you do not understand history and how history can repeat itself then you’re bound to repeat history.”

  149. 149
    Yarrow says:

    @Suzanne: I completely agree with all of this. The Dems are not good at messaging and I don’t know how to fix it. There is SO much to work with with the Republicans and the Dems just seem to rely on facts, which is okay but it doesn’t sell. Part of being a good candidate is selling your candidacy. You have to get elected to get to do what you want to do.

  150. 150
    Miss Bianca says:

    @WaterGirl: I saw that over there too, and I thought lumping them together like that was kind of offensive.* as far as I can tell Tulsi is an asshat who like Bernie actively seeks to establish her brand by slagging Democrats – and even tho’ I honestly don’t know enough about Julian Castro to have an opinion one way or another about his candidacy, I don’t think he’s engaged in *that* kind of behavior. That being said, where I’d agree with Loomis is on this point: trying to make the leap from Mayor to President seems even more quixotic than trying to make the leap from the House to President.

    *then again, I seem to find Erik Loomis’s take on things to be offensive more often than not.

  151. 151
    sm*t cl*de says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    There is no sin quite as offensive as challenging conventional wisdom early, and then being proved right

    “Premature anti-fascist”.

  152. 152
    Ruckus says:


    I don’t think that most white dudes were ready for that.

    When one lives in a white bread-American cheese world, one gets used to the blandness. Then one begins to think that’s the only world there is. Next of course, one has to defend that world at any cost. And all the while it’s white bread-American cheese – tasteless, almost colorless, devoid of nutrition or substance.

  153. 153
  154. 154
    Doug R says:

    @tobie: Yup. Trade agreements are the best way to stay out of wars…..and you’d think a Middle East “expert” wouldn’t conflate Iran with Arab.
    Lot of “irish alzheimers” in that part of the world too.

  155. 155
  156. 156
    WaterGirl says:

    @Yarrow: It’s the second sentence of this post:


    edit: Thanks to everyone who replied to my question about Julian Castro. I thought the comment on LGM was incredibly dismissive.

  157. 157
    Robert Sneddon says:

    @Sloane Ranger: For various reasons I’ve recently been involved in working at rugby games a lot (Rugby Union that is). The game runs for 90 minutes clock time, two 40 minute halves and a ten minute interval. Typically, with stoppages for injuries and some penalties the game lasts whistle to whistle about 100 minutes.

  158. 158
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Aleta: Hm …. so, from your description, the problem is with the developer libraries for X11, not so much with GFortran, right? I’m not a Mac user — but been using UNIX continuously since 1982, so some of my questions might be remedial on a Mac:

    (1) is there a way to uninstall X11 and reinstall it? Preferably with “extreme prejudice”? Or just “force reinstall” X11 ?

    (2) is there a way to get a list of all the packages (with version-numbers) installed on each machine and compare those (suitably sorted) lists?

    (3) Your C compile step is failing to find a C header file — where is it on the (working) MacPro? is there a way to ask which package owns that pathname? Then you could try to reinstall that package on the MacBookPro?

    (4) Can you do a “find” and see if the missing file is on your MacBookPro? Then you could just modify the Makefile and add the “-I” to CFLAGS? I’m betting you’ll get a link failure, and you’ll have to do the same for a “.so” file (maybe a “.a” file too) but this would be the -fastest- way to get going, though it wouldn’t *correct* the problem, so you’d want to figure out who the culprit is anyway.

  159. 159
    The Midnight Lurker says:

    For those of you who didn’t grow up among us, ‘Irish Alzheimers’ is the ‘Scots Irish’ term for the condition where “you forget everything but your grudges.”

    I’m still mad about things I can’t remember. Grrrrrr.

  160. 160
    Yarrow says:

    @WaterGirl: Thanks. I rarely go there these days. I skimmed the article and his description of Castro as being in the clown car with Gabbard is poor. The general themes of focus on state candidates, build the bench and destroy the Republican party seem okay.

  161. 161
    Burnspbesq says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    I understand that there is in fact a Canuckistani version of handegg

    Indeed there is, and it’s even stranger than box lacrosse.

    That said, nothing is stranger than Gaelic football.

  162. 162
    WaterGirl says:

    @Martin: I agree.

    I think Beto needs to make up his mind sooner rather than later. About a month ago I read that some very high quality people were holding off signing up for campaigns, hoping that Beto would decide to run. If he waits too long, he may not be able to get the team he needs. I’d hate to see him lose the folks that were with him in the senate run.

    I was happy to see that Beto hadn’t really live-streamed his dental cleaning on instagram – there’s a lot of bullshit out there and people believe a lot of it.

  163. 163
    Doug R says:

    @Gbbalto: Doug Flutie
    Warren Moon
    Carl Weathers
    Angelo Mosca
    Vince Ferragamo
    Joe Kapp
    all played in the CFL.

  164. 164
    Gex says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Where did she reverse opinion on gays? I know she’s said she is dropping the anti-gay policy push, but last I read she hasn’t even pretended a change of heart about us.

    And frankly, like I said, dropping it politically is easy to do when you are in the House and have no power to impose your views unilaterally. If, FSM forbid, she had the power of executive orders, I would be very worried.

  165. 165
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Suzanne: @Yarrow: I’m not sure I’m on board with more “Democrats suck at” messaging.

    For one thing, it’s remarkably easy to criticize a campaign after the fact. I’m not sure that, given the fact the so many people were so willing and eager to *be* conned, standing there and saying, “you’re being conned!” in lieu of any other actual message would have been a winning strategy. Maybe *now* it would be, since so many more people can actually see it – but *now*, people don’t seem to need it. If Democrats suck so badly at messaging, why did they win at so many levels during the mid-terms? I don’t recall hearing any “you’ve been conned!” messaging – I heard messaging about health care, jobs, trade. Real, actual concerns that real, actual people have.

    Also, even if Democrats had been standing there screaming, “you’re being conned!” – do you really think the media would have given them room to get that message out? No. They would have been scolding us for our “incivility.” Again, *now* it’s different – because *now* we have enough people who got pissed off enough to elect enough Democrats who *are* saying these things, who *can* say these things – who are still getting scolded for it, btw.

    Yeah, I read what’s his name’s book about how we have to appeal to the id of the electorate like the Republicans do, and maybe he’s right, but HRC and Obama both said *a lot* about Trump’s manifest unfitness for office, and they got fucking nowhere with it. Maybe we just really are dumb enough as a society that we have to be sat on that red-hot stove till we start screaming, and *then* we listen to the Mommy Party saying, “didn’t I tell you not to let Donnie talk you into sitting on the stove? Didn’t I?”

  166. 166
    Ruckus says:

    Those of us in the well over 50 crowd did see a time when republicans were not obviously insane and yes I’ll say it traitors, to their country and fellow citizens. And yes they still were actually insane and traitors, just not as obvious. Many got conned and wouldn’t and won’t admit it and drumpf keeps making that harder and harder. He may be the thing that saves the country, making it so obvious that he and his party are traitors, legally or not, that far too many actually see what is going on and start to act a bit more responsibly towards each other. Even if they won’t admit they got scammed.

  167. 167
    Amir Khalid says:

    It’s a common usage around Balloon Juice. I learned it here.

  168. 168
    Millard Filmore says:

    @Aleta: I do Linux, not Mac … look for the missing includes with “find / | grep (a missing file)” and copy it to a location where it should be.

    Or if the file is missing, copy it from the working computer.

  169. 169
    Burnspbesq says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    Handegg season will soon culminate in the Superb Owl.

  170. 170
    Fair Economist says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    it’s hilarious how defensively indignant NYT reporters get– I’m looking at you, Nick Confessore– when people criticize their coverage of the 2016 race

    Not really. They should be fired, and they know it. That’s why they raise such a ruckus about criticism – they are trying to avoid the consequences they so richly earned. Upton Sinclair’s line x2.

  171. 171
    Dan B says:

    @Suzanne: Excellent! We’re off to my very wise political communication friend. She bemoans the fact that the Dem leadership doesn’t have a 24/7/365 communication plan or infrastructure. Also… facts and truth persuade people outside the base… sigh. Liberals and progressives haven’t embraced cognitive science even though they love the rest of the sciences.
    Had an interesting discussion with a contractor who is libertarian conservative, sorta part of evangelical christian power player group (Casey Treat got his start from the contractor’s family.)

    He believes liberals are weak and rely upon government. But he’s really fallen in love with electric tooks and cars, partly because the new crop are incredibly powerful and also because they are clean. He’s got his heart in the right place and likes my take on global warming. He’s driven big rigs in Alaska and is noticing the changes there and in Wa state. He’s gkad for an explanation and for solutions.

  172. 172
    Fair Economist says:

    @Miss Bianca quotes, not says:

    trying to make the leap from Mayor to President seems even more quixotic than trying to make the leap from the House to President.

    That’s a very dishonest take, because he was in Obama’s Cabinet for 3 years heading one of the larger departments (HUD). That is very credible national experience; perhaps a bit light but not obviously less than Obama’s own 4 years as Senator (because Cabinet secretaries really have a lot to do.)

  173. 173
    Chetan Murthy says:

    @Millard Filmore:

    copy it to a location where it should be.

    Uh, I’d strongly recommend against this. A file that is supposed to be managed by the “system package manager” that you start managing yourself …. is a recipe for chaos and an eventual need to do a clean reinstall. Much better to uninstall/reinstall the relevant packages, and try to force the package-manager to do its job correctly.

    It’s a not-uncommon thing for “package upgrade” to screw things up, where a clean uninstall/reinstall would get it right. It’s a corollary of Jim Gray’s “many Heisenbugs can be fixed by system restart”.

  174. 174
    hueyplong says:

    @Fair Economist: And Castro hasn’t hosted a reality tv show, so he’s obviously unqualified.

  175. 175
    Yarrow says:

    @Miss Bianca: I have to head out so can’t expand on it, but Dan B has commented below your comment and has had other good comments about the cognitive science behind good messaging. I have bemoaned Dem messaging before, during and after campaigns so it’s not new for me and it’s certainly not just looking backwards at a campaign. There does not seem to be coherent messaging, nor do they tend to turn rhetorical negatives into positives, as Suzanne mentioned. There are a lot of skills that could be improved there.

  176. 176
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Fair Economist: “very dishonest”? Wow, that’s not the least bit defensive or inflammatory.

    Huh. All right, name me one or two things he accomplished as HUD secretary. Right off the top of your head, that people are going to remember him for.

    Pro-tip: No one takes “Cabinet level position” seriously as a prep for Presidentin’ unless it’s one of a scant handful of positions – such as SOS.

  177. 177
    Geeno says:

    @Michael Cain: As a former Bills season ticket holder I can tell you. There’s a guy on the sideline with big orange oven mitts – even in the hottest weather – if he is holding one of his mitts across his chest, that’s telling everyone in the game that TV stuff is happening and the game can’t restart yet. By my estimation about 3/4 of the down time is that guy, and in really shitty weather, you just want someone to take him out with high powered rifle.

  178. 178
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Yarrow: Really? “Cognitive science!” says “you’re being conned!” is a winning message for Democrats?

  179. 179
    Raven says:

    @Geeno: At Georgia they went to the guy holding a big digital clock , kind of like soccer, so you can see how much time left in the TO.

  180. 180
    A Ghost To Most says:

    Longtime UNIX geek here, but not up on those flavors. First question: is your CLASSPATH (or equivalent) env variable set correctly?

  181. 181
    A Ghost To Most says:


    X11 by default gets installed in a folder /opt /local, but the system uses /usr/local . So there’s a link in the /usr/local to the /op/local/X11 .

    Hard link or sym link? Sometimes that matters.

  182. 182
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Dan B: OK, how do you square the fact that you say,

    facts and truth persuade people outside the base… sigh.

    with the example of your right-wing friend who you say is “glad for an explanation and for solutions” when it comes to global warming? On the one hand you say, “oh, facts don’t convince anyone outside the base when it comes to issues”, and then on the other you say that this person outside the base is apparently open to observable truth – ie, facts – and looking for “solutions”? How exactly are you persuading him if not with “facts and solutions?”

  183. 183

    @Miss Bianca: I am not buying whatever bullshit Dan B is shoveling, either. Good to know that I am not alone.
    I agree with you about Democratic messaging also. T would never be able to sell me anything, I am not interested in the product he is selling. Naked xenophobia and racism.

  184. 184
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @A Ghost To Most: I also recall other env variables necessary for linking X programs, but I wrote my last XWindows code 25 years ago, so maybe it is time to dig into the man pages about it.

  185. 185

    @Miss Bianca: To continue my earlier comment. Most R voters, like the marketing and also the product that R candidates sell. They are not being conned.

    ETA: The media is also not our friend. To succeed Ds have to go over their heads like President Obama did and like Beto did in his senate run. The media hates the messenger and the message when it comes from the Ds. (Bill Clinton, Barack Obama were gifted and persuasive speakers but the media hated their guts)

  186. 186
    Miss Bianca says:

    @schrodingers_cat: It’s not that I don’t think that there needs to be some sort of emotional push when it comes to messaging – it’s just that I’m honestly puzzled: the “cognitive science” types seem to all be saying, “Democratic voters are motivated by different types of messaging than Republican voters” and talking about how we have to promote our values – which tend to be heavy on protecting people’s rights, protecting the environment, promoting “general welfare”. That’s THROUGH government. We believe in functioning, functional government. Right-wingers don’t, or don’t seem to, anyway. I’m honestly not sure what slagging their politicians with “you’re being conned” is supposed to accomplish, and I’m not sure how, if they’re *not* reachable through reason, you’re supposed to persuade them – ye gods! – that electing government officials that tell them government is bad is…a really bad idea.

    ETA: wrote this before I saw your second comment, and I agree with you: R voters *don’t* think they’re being conned – they think they’re in on the con. And I don’t think they’d believe a Democrat who *told* them they were being conned.

  187. 187
    Phil says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    There is no non televised professional football.

  188. 188
  189. 189
    Ken Kohl says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: so, who pays for their house?

  190. 190
    James E Powell says:

    @Doug R:

    Joe Theismann, also too

  191. 191
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Ken Kohl: follow the (inauguration) money

  192. 192

    @Miss Bianca: This is my second encounter with Dan B. First time around he was explaining how if only climate scientists knew how to speak about global warming and climate change it would convince the recalcitrant Rs who dismiss all the evidence about it. His example of how to do it right was some woman on Christian Amanpour’s show.
    I do agree that Ds or climate scientists or anyone for that matter could work on better communication skills. But to say that’s what keeps us from getting through to our opponents or those who disagree with us is a bit much. Sometimes we disagree because we want different things. Period.
    Fossil fuel companies dismiss climate science because their bottom line is at stake.

  193. 193
    TriassicSands says:

    For all those discussing “Democratic messaging,” it is important to remember that the typical B-J commenter has very little in common with the average Democratic voter. Much of the difference is measured in intensity and commitment but that makes all the difference in the world. And there is an abyss between the B-Jers and those who don’t bother to vote — the huge pool of theoretically potential Democratic voters.

    Trying to expand the Democratic electorate through messaging is fraught with problems. There are millions of people in the US who should be voting for Democrats but they don’t vote at all. Most of them are as unreachable by messaging as are Trump voters (for Democrats or B-J commenters for Republicans). I know some of the non-voters and they are impervious to facts, logic, and the evidence right before their eyes. The one thing in this country that can change voter behavior — and it may be the only thing for millions of Americans — is for them to experience real hardship or suffering that is directly attributable to a candidate or party. And many Trump supporters seem to be immune even to this. Due to stupidity and/or ignorance, I suspect that immunity isn’t limited to Trump supporters.

    The wife of a friend of mine is an educated person whose values seem to be strictly Democratic. But she didn’t and won’t vote. Not in 2016 or 2018 (or 2008 or ’12 or before that). Her problem may be that her family was/is Republican as are some if not most of her friends (where she lives there aren’t a lot of Democrats). It may be that she can’t vote Republican (values) and excuses not voting Democratic, which would go against her upbringing, by claiming “they’re all crooks” and “they’re all the same.” Pointing out that both shoplifters and armed bank robbers are crooks but with a big difference falls on deaf ears. She’s too old to fall afoul of anti-abortionists (she has no children) or anti-contraception fanatics, has a secure job, and is nearing retirement, which will depend more on a pension than on Social Security. In short, she is relatively safe from facing direct hardship or suffering because of Republicans or Trump.
    And she is not alone. Even worse are the people who are at risk and are just too stupid to recognize their vulnerability.

  194. 194
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Burnspbesq: I reserve that opprobrium for cricket. People in fancy clothes drinking while the players take batting practice.

  195. 195
    Miss Bianca says:


    Folly, thou conquerest, and I must yield! Against stupidity the very gods/Themselves contend in vain.

    Yep, Friedrich Schiller had us nailed, all right.

  196. 196
    A Ghost To Most says:

    Arena football is barely televised, thankfully.

  197. 197
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Miss Bianca: They not only prefer being lied to, they insist on it.

  198. 198
    TriassicSands says:

    @Miss Bianca:

    A beautiful and apt quote.

    The modern version — You can’t fix stupid — pales by comparison.

    Thank you for that.

  199. 199

    @TriassicSands: If T and his antics haven’t opened the eyes of people like the woman you describe no amount of pretty messaging is going to achieve that.

  200. 200
    Mike in Pasadena says:

    @Immanentize: try for a timeline, but i am uncertain whether he includes tweets

  201. 201
    TriassicSands says:


    Yes, that’s the point and the majority of the population that should be susceptible to Democratic messaging is, in one way or another, as unreachable. What Democrats have to concentrate on is the sometimes voter — the people who come out in presidential years (maybe) but not for midterms and lesser elections. Some of those people face genuine difficulties — jobs, transportation, childcare — which is why Democrats need to push — hard — for making election day a holiday (won’t help at all with the committed non-voter), early and mail-in voting, and other assistance to smooth the way.

  202. 202
    debbie says:


    I’m glad someone has finally said that. Hope Johnson can weather the blowback.

  203. 203
    debbie says:

    @Miss Bianca:

    I don’t see how someone who presents herself as a Progressive candidate can get around her past homophobic remarks.

  204. 204
    TriassicSands says:

    People change…especially before political campaigns.

  205. 205
    TriassicSands says:

    At this point, it is important for people to differentiate the Adolf Hitler of the late twenties and early thirties from the AH of 1939-45. What happened in the early years made what happened later possible, but it didn’t mean those events were inevitable.

    To me, Trump is clearly a fascist. But he’s not a Nazi, nor has he committed genocide (yet). The comparison with the earlier Hitler is fair and should give people pause. Johnson’s problem is that people immediately jump to the genocidal Hitler of WWII. Johnson should know that and make allowances.

  206. 206
    Chetan Murthy says:


    To me, Trump is clearly a fascist. But he’s not a Nazi, nor has he committed genocide (yet). The comparison with the earlier Hitler is fair and should give people pause.

    Well, Shitler’s not a Nazi only inasmuch as literally there’s no NSDAP. But he’s got all the other attributes down. As you described, the Nazis of the 20s/early-30s weren’t the same as the Nazis of the war years. And why? Because they were just getting started. Kristallnacht was in 1938. But even when they took power in 1933, they tried an anti-Jewish boycott. Which failed, b/c the German people weren’t ready to let their freak flag fly. That took time, too.

    Also, I have to disagree with you about the inevitability of what happened. Hitler was always committed to two things: race purity/cleansing, and a Greater German Empire. He explicitly drew inspiration from the USA and Manifest Destiny, our cleansing of the indigenous Native Americans. He wanted to do the same thing to European Russia — kill all the Slavs and turn it into a settler state. The only way he’d have been dissuaded, was at the point of a gun.

    So yeah, I think Rep. Johnson is spot-on. It’s is critics who are wrong, thinking that unless it’s literally Auschwitz, it doesn’t count. Hitler didn’t start with Auschwitz.

  207. 207
    prostratedragon says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Aha, thanks. Didn’t watch much tv during those years, but have been appreciating Gregory lately on the rerun stations and Hitchcock dvds.

  208. 208
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Chetan Murthy:

    Hitler didn’t start with Auschwitz.

    This, and everything else you said, too. When you actually read the history, it’s very clear that the Holocaust happened because of a gradual series of decisions, not the pre-planned endpoint. That’s what the infamous Wannsee (sorry, sp) Conference was all about: figuring out what a “Final Solution” to their Jewish “problem” should be, because the Nazi leaders were at a standstill and didn’t know what to do next.

    Again, I recommend the companion book to the BBC docuseries The Nazis: A Warning From History. It does an extremely good job of explaining for a layperson the slow and gradual steps that led to the Holocaust and how chaotic the Nazi regime really was.

  209. 209
    J R in WV says:


    The people who were furious at @davidsirota for reporting on Beto O’Rourke’s voting record & funding sources have – with @TulsiGabbard’s announcement – apparently decided it’s OK to attack the voting record & ideology of Dem candidates after all. Seems like an odd double standard— Glenn Greenwald (@ggreenwald) January 13, 2019

    I thought we were pissed because they lied about and distorted both Beto’s voting record and sources of funding? Being accurate about a wing-nut is fine by me, while lying about a real progressive Democratic candidate is not.

  210. 210
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @debbie: he’s in a safe district

  211. 211
    J R in WV says:

    @Sloane Ranger:

    The amount of dead time is one of the reasons I have never been able to get on with American Football but it’s a fast growing game here in the UK. I don’t know if there’s the same amount of wasted time over here though.

    I think in Europe they cut out most of the dead time, so that a 60-minute game on the game clock actually takes 60 minutes to watch, or just a little more, but not the 3.5 hours it takes here.

  212. 212
    Yarrow says:

    @Miss Bianca: I didn’t say that and Suzanne didn’t say that. “Trump is a con man” might have been a useful message in 2016 because it’s about the candidate. Saying, “You’re being conned” is about the voter, it essentially says they’re stupid, and that’s not going to work. “You’re too smart to fall for the Trump con” says the same kind of thing in a different way.

  213. 213
    J R in WV says:


    edit: Thanks to everyone who replied to my question about Julian Castro. I thought the comment on LGM was incredibly dismissive.

    Well, he was a cabinet secretary long before he was mayor, wasn’t he?

    LGM folks are academics, and hence feel entitled to be dismissive of those they dismiss… i disagree with regard to both Texas Castro brothers.

  214. 214
    Gbbalto says:

    @sm*t cl*de: This@Doug R: Thanks, you are better informed. One hopes that talent gets recognized

  215. 215
    Watergirl says:

    @J R in WV: I think he was mayor before he was in the cabinet.

  216. 216
    Ruckus says:


    “You’re too smart to fall for the Trump con” says the same kind of thing in a different way.

    I understand what and why you are saying this that way. But isn’t that just continuing with a lie? They really weren’t smart enough to not fall for the con. Or they knew it was a con and wanted to be a part of it.
    I don’t think you can reach them. You have to reach the people that didn’t vote for either side and are losing. The facts alone will turn some and the ones who actively wanted drumpf are not going to be swayed by a democrat. It’s possible they may sway themselves or that they weren’t totally convinced but switched because all they heard was someone or many someones telling them shit. They didn’t buy the con because they made a decision, they bought the con because that’s all that was presented to them.

  217. 217
    J R in WV says:

    @J R in WV:

    Don’t know how my last paragraph got quoted, that’s pure me speaking there. And I do think LGM front-page guys do tend to be a little over dismissive of folks that aren’t in total agreement with them all the time. Many academics do that, esp. those not really qualified to be dismissive.

  218. 218
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Yarrow: Nope, everyone I know who voted for Trump was absolutely impervious to *any* argument – full of “we need to shake things up!” “Crooked Hillary!” – even the people who *should* have been too smart to be conned by Trump, to whom I, in fact, *did* say “you’re too smart to fall for this BS” – wouldn’t hear it. They *wanted* to be conned, they knew I was a misguided libtard, and nothing I could have said would have dissuaded them.

    Finally I was reduced to sarcasm. To the guy who thought that “Trump not being a politician” was a plus, I said, “next time I need to get an operation, I’m going to ask my plumber to do it, because experience and expertise are so overrated, am I right?”

    Now he’s awfully quiet about Trump. But that’s only because he’s had the experience of seeing how achingly stupid and incompetent the man actually is. But nothing – NOTHING – I could have said would have convinced him without his seeing for himself just what a fucking disaster the guy is.

    So, if you and Suzanne have some brilliant idea for how you convince people who are that willfully misinformed about the need for competent governance, great. But don’t tell me that “you’re too smart for this” is going to cut it – it won’t, because they.are.not.

    ETA: tl,dr version: “what Ruckus said”.

  219. 219
    J R in WV says:

    @Miss Bianca:

    This, so much this!

  220. 220
    Aleta says:

    @Chetan Murthy: @Millard Filmore: @A Ghost To Most:

    Two days of grief but it’s working now. Sincere thanks; it was very helpful to read those ideas. It’s always amazing here to get such help and knowledge.

    In case this might be useful:

    Finally decided to look at the directory structure of the user on each, to see what was different in the structure.

    He normally goes to the download site HPC for links to the different compilers. It’s usually a good site (name stands for high performance computing). On Friday (when he did the Mac Pro), for some reason the HPC site didn’t come up for him on G*gle. GitHub came up instead so he used that. (Good thing too. That’s the one that worked. GitHub turns out to be a really good site, which everyone else probably knew already … )

    When he upgraded the MacBook the next day, that time the HPC site did come up, so he used it. The versions that the HPC site said to install for Mohave were the ones that didn’t work.

    Btw, those ones didn’t have the “walk you through the installation process” steps on them, which are usually there. It turned out that they made a /user for the gfortran that worked, but it wasn’t right for connecting to the graphics things for some reason.

    Going back through the web history to see what he’d gone through for installing gfortran on the other computer, to recreate what he’d done on the Mac, he found a dmg for fortran. Went back to that site and used that to install it on the notebook.

    The good copy of gfortran from GitHub had a dmg that worked. Maybe it had do with setting some internal flags that hadn’t gotten set with the manual installer that came from HPC.

    Site that worked:

    Site whose compilers didn’t work for Mohave:

  221. 221
    TriassicSands says:


    Careful. One of the things he said was that the Hitler of ’39-’45 was inevitable,

    Also, I have to disagree with you about the inevitability of what happened.

    but your comment, instead of agreeing with everything he wrote, seems to accept that where Hitler and the Nazis ended up was neither predictable nor inevitable. Unconstrained by laws and norms and with a supportive “majority” behind him, Trump has the personality disorders and reprehensible qualities that could allow him to take this country to a place as horrifying as Hitlers ’39-’45 Germany. But that is simply potential and far from inevitable. To assume that the Hitler/Germany of ’39-’45 was inevitable is to assume that Hitler was the only variable involved. Likewise, Trump exists in a very different condition and culture than Hitler’s Germany. There are many things that could (and very likely will) stop Trump of reaching a similar destination. For one thing, it seems unlikely that he will be president (or even alive) for that long.

    For Chetan Murphy to say it was inevitable is to say that nothing could have prevented it. That isn’t really true. Hitler’s premature death could have prevented it. The Brits standing up to Hitler earlier might have prevented it. Any number of things that were out of Hitler’s control could have stopped what did happen. Is everything inevitable once it happens? Does “inevitable” even mean anything under those conditions?

    The point of my comment was that Trump today can (and should) be compared to the Hitler of the late twenties and early thirties with full knowledge of where that ended up. But if people try to compare the Trump of today with the Hitler of WWII and the Holocaust, the real danger that Trump poses may be dismissed.
    Where’s the World War? Where’s the Holocaust? See, they’re nothing alike. But Trump is just getting started and there are many things that could stop Trump. Foremost among those is defeat in 2020. But the GOP has been Trumpified and they do pose an ongoing threat.

  222. 222
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Let’s put this way, how can someone chose Trump over say Rubio? Yes, Rubio sucks, but only in a useless, not actively destructive way.

  223. 223
    sm*t cl*de says:

    @A Ghost To Most:

    They not only prefer being lied to, they insist on it.

    “Mundus vult Decipi” is not only a good explanation for the state of the world, it’s also the name of my next D&D character.

  224. 224
    J R in WV says:


    Very interesting. Sourceforge has always seemed like a very solid source for, well, everything. But I guess many outfits now use it as a storage/source for their installs, so it all depends on the company and their code base.

    Github also has a great reputation, but I imagine they also depend upon the quality of the code base being deposited and the work done before it is uploaded.

  225. 225
  226. 226
    Hob says:

    @J R in WV: I don’t get how a blogger saying that they have a low opinion of a particular politician is an example of being “over dismissive of folks that aren’t in total agreement with them all the time.” But I also don’t really get why people bother to make judgments like that. I mean, anyone who starts a political blog is presumably an opinionated person, and if they don’t take me seriously because I don’t agree with them about something, so what? They’re not my elected representative or anything. If I read their blog I expect it to reflect their point of view, not to affirm mine.

  227. 227
    Origuy says:

    @Aleta: I’m glad it worked out. I haven’t done Unix programming in a few years; I’m on Windows these days. I was going to suggest posting a question on Stack Overflow. I’ve gotten over several problems with help there.

Comments are closed.