The Only Kind of Record Trump is Going to Break

As Trump tries to figure out if he can divert disaster aid to build a wall, the House is about to go out of session which means that this will be the longest shutdown in the grand history of stupidity.

116 replies
  1. 1
    Derelict says:

    My wife just asked me if I was making airline reservations for a trip to Florida next month. I’m not–I’m planning on driving to Florida because who knows if we’ll even have an air transportation system by this time next month?

  2. 2
    WaterGirl says:

    So we’re talking about maggots in the morning thread, we have a second thread titled “let them eat shit” and now yet another thread where we are talking about Trump. (aka more shit and maggots)

    Depressing day at Balloon Juice.

  3. 3
    Elizabelle says:

    @Derelict: Yeah. I was planning to fly cross country next week. Delaying that trip.

    I think we have a lot of company there. And I think stuff like that might bring an end to this ridiculous shutdown.

    Would you like to take a plane when federal aviation inspectors have been deemed “inessential” employees? I sure do not. Further, even though they will eventually get paid, don’t you think controllers and other employees might be a bit overstressed and distracted by this shit?

  4. 4
    Elizabelle says:

    @WaterGirl: I agree. Makes for lurking.

  5. 5
    Jeffro says:

    Oh I think he is going to break a lot more records before this is all over

  6. 6
    mapaghimagsik says:

    The shutdown has taken down NIST provides security guidance (for free). From how to do risk assessments and what are the current best practices in security controls. Technology agnostic, its one of the most helpful sites out there.

    So the shutdown hurts our national cybersecurity as well.

  7. 7
    Jeffro says:

    Still having a hard time figuring out why media people are discussing whether a wall is medieval or not, whether it is cost-effective or not, and who is going to pay for it or not. Plenty of Dems are doing it too.

    Don’t argue about it. It is absurd on its face. Just point out that the president has been steadily deteriorating for the past couple of years, and this is just one more example of his irrationality, and he needs to seek help or go.

    Psychiatrist, 25th amendment, or impeachment, Trumpov. Next question…

  8. 8
    Emerald says:

    He’ll be proud of it. It’s the biggest!! The longest!! The one that did the most damage of them ALL!!

  9. 9
    Aleta says:

    @Derelict: If airline reservations, travel bookings fall off significantly it might encourage some deep Republican thoughts.

    Also drops in consumer purchases, car sales, destination golf ! Maybe non-fed workers could join them in solidarity by refusing to shop for big things until the shutdown ends?

    I will never forget the demented battle cry from liars Bush + Cheney: Keep shopping or else the terrorists win! The truth is more like, listless consumers give Republican terrorists pause.

  10. 10
    mad citizen says:

    I worked with NIST last year to host a regional meeting on smart grid standards. Interesting.

    My next flight is Feb 27 so surely we’ll be back to normal by then.

    I regularly think about the movie Idiocracy.

  11. 11
    Brachiator says:


    So we’re talking about maggots in the morning thread, we have a second thread titled “let them eat shit” and now yet another thread where we are talking about Trump. (aka more shit and maggots)

    Depressing day at Balloon Juice.

    Kind of a shitty day for the country.

  12. 12
    WaterGirl says:

    @Brachiator: I can’t argue with that.

  13. 13
    mad citizen says:

    As an economics student I always thought it funny things like “The Panic of 1873”. Now we know what it’s like living in one. Maybe we’ll call this “The Great Stupidity of 2019.”

  14. 14
    A Ghost To Most says:

    Go long on hemp. We’re gonna need the rope.

  15. 15
    mapaghimagsik says:

    @mad citizen: We’ve gotten a lot of mileage out of the Cybersecurity Framework (CSF) Its certainly approachable. I’ve been recently tearing into 800-37 (I found a downloaded copy). Some of my team, not used to the language complain about government speak. They have no cyber experience whatsoever, so I help them through the document, stopping when they complain about how “useless” it is.

  16. 16
    Derelict says:

    The average front-line TSA employee might be able to miss one paycheck. But if this goes to the end of the month, my guess is that about 70% of TSA screeners will have no choice but to quit and take other jobs. They have to survive!

    (Oh, and thanks to GOP policies, those TSA people who might think about applying for public assistance to help them through the shutdown will be unable to qualify for any assistance unless they’re actively looking for work.

  17. 17
    catclub says:

    @mad citizen:

    My next flight is Feb 27 so surely we’ll be back to normal by then.

    Depends on what is normal.

    And don’t call me Shirley.

  18. 18
    tobie says:

    OT–I was kind of disturbed by reports that Beto O’Rourke sent out an Instagram of him getting his teeth cleaned. Ends up that the picture of him on the dentist’s chair was taken completely out of context. Here’s what the video was about:

    2h2 hours ago
    How Twitter works: Beto didn’t “live stream his teeth-cleaning.” He’s been interviewing people in El Paso about life on the border. Including his dental assistant. It wasn’t live. There was a split second selfie shot of him with his mouth open that was screengrabbed by a reporter

    Good for him for trying to draw attention to “life on the border.” Damn the reporter who distorted this and CNN for broadcasting the distortion.

  19. 19
    sukabi says:

    @Jeffro: the ULTIMATE in bothsiderist bullshit. We can’t have an actual discussion of how utterly unfit for office the bloated buffoon is, so let’s discuss whether or not walls are medievil….

    If they’re going to discuss walls in reference to drumpf the best and only discussion they should be having is whether a set of 6 padded white walls or 1 barred steel wall with 5 concrete walls would best serve the public.

    My preference would be the steel bar / concrete combo.

  20. 20
    Quaker in a Basement says:

    The House has done their job. They passed a bill. It’s the Senate and Mitch McConnell who are shirking.

  21. 21
    gvg says:

    Media does a lot to shape opinions. I wish they would start programing that we need like idiocracy, Dr. Strangelove, more Watergate movies, historical stuff on the causes of the Great Depression, the corruption of the gilded age, stuff about cults and yellow journalism and spies and mobs. Maybe some stuff about how capitalism breaks down when contracts aren’t enforced (Trump). It’s just been amazing to me how ignorant my fellow citizens are. These self titled conservative trade war approving morons actually think liberals like me are anti capitalist! There are plenty of ways the entertainment industry could make a lot of points about Trumps authoritarianism.
    They could also make fun of him being an idiot and insane too.

  22. 22
    Gozer says:

    I have an international flight coming up on the 20th (MX vacation) that we’ve been planning for months. Now trying to figure alternate ways to get back into the US if there aren’t flights. I’m thinking we can fly to Montreal and rent a vehicle to drive back to Jersey.

    Everything is terrible.

  23. 23
    Quaker in a Basement says:

    @Aleta: Hmm. Fed workers. Golf courses. I think I see the seeds of an idea there.

  24. 24
    Cacti says:

    I think we need to stop thinking of this as a shutdown and start regarding it as a soft coup attempt by the radical right.

    Glad to see the Dems standing firm, because if they don’t, separation of powers under the Constitution is effectively dead.

  25. 25
    Aleta says:

    Daniel Dale Retweeted
    Robert Barnes. @scotusreporter
    No remaining signs of cancer for Justice Ginsburg, and no additional treatment required, Supreme Court says. She’ll miss next week’s arguments but continue to participate in cases from home

  26. 26
    rikyrah says:

    @Quaker in a Basement:

    The House has done their job. They passed a bill.


  27. 27
    rikyrah says:


    I think we need to stop thinking of this as a shutdown and start regarding it as a soft coup attempt by the radical right.

    Glad to see the Dems standing firm, because if they don’t, separation of powers under the Constitution is effectively dead.


  28. 28
    opiejeanne says:

    @Derelict: We were going to buy tickets to Paris for May on Wednesday, but now we’re only going to go places we can drive to.
    Not only are the lack of airplane inspections and the air traffic controllers not being paid a problem, no one is inspecting our food now. Soon we’ll be eating canned goods and frozen food we already have on hand, making lentil soup and baking our own bread, and not eating out. I have several friends who are already freaking out about this. I know it takes a while for the norms of food safety to break down, but it’s really not reassuring. I figure fresh produce that’s in the stores that you intend to cook is probably ok right now, but who knows in another couple of weeks.

  29. 29
    Elizabelle says:

    @gvg: Media helped get us into Trump’s clutches.

    And I like your programming ideas.

  30. 30
    VeniceRiley says:

    I was going to fly up to see mom and give my sister a brief break, but no way am I flying now. And no way will I drive to Salt lake in the winter. Nope. The airlines must be fuming about this. I hope they’re burning the ears of whatever senators they own. First the tourism hit we’ve taken because dolt45 is an ahole mfer, and now this.

  31. 31
    Elizabelle says:

    @opiejeanne: I think there is a lot of that happening.

    Look at what a mess it was with that ridiculous drone at Gatwick a few short weeks ago. Disruptions all up and down the system, and it was right before Christmas, so no excess capacity.

    If I lived near a national park, I would gather there with friends with electric candles (in case real ones are too dangerous) and organize a vigil until it was reopened. Good TV and media fare.

  32. 32
    chris says:

    Pay attention to the long-term, cumulative damage of the shutdown, including the effect on the census.The Trump admin has long sought to manipulate the census in an effort to reallocate resources and annihilate rights. This isn't just a shutdown — it's a hostile restructuring.— Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) 11 January 2019

  33. 33
    Mnemosyne says:

    At my office, we have someone flying to Europe for a business trip next week. Now I regret that we booked it so that his connections happen in the US.

  34. 34
    geg6 says:


    I good news, I have finally used the pie filter for the first time ever. It’s quite freeing.

  35. 35
  36. 36
    Aleta says:

    “Ain’t gonna be no wall” Rocky XXIII

    and this lawyer: Can All Lawyers Just Admit The Wall Will Never Be Built Because Of The Fifth Amendment?
    We’re fighting about something that will never be built, and every lawyer knows it.

    A whole canon of law has been built up around the Fifth Amendment’s commandment, “nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.”

    We can debate the finer points: I do not happen to think that Kelo v. New London is the worst Supreme Court decision in the history of mankind, as some conservatives do. … But it isn’t great!

    And there are conservative justices sitting on the Supreme Court who have figuratively been bred to oppose that decision. Add them to the progressives who will view Trump’s Wall as the bigoted monstrosity that it is, and I think you’re looking at 8-1 decisions against the government in eminent domain cases to build the wall. Only Justice Brett, he of the monarchical theory of executive power, can be reasonably be expected to side with the government on this issue. And even then, we know Kavanaugh seems to like to follow along with whatever the “cool” kids are doing.

    People who risk losing their land to Trump’s Wall will go to court to defend “their property.” I mean, Jesus, have you ever met a Texan?

    But I worry about the people who’re being pressured right now but don’t have the resources to withstand. I read that civil rights workers are going door to door and publicizing the info that they don’t have to sign, that they should stand together. There will be people who aren’t reached or are afraid of the racist administration and their police-impersonator reps, or are protecting relatives. Once they sign away their land, will they be able to buy it back at the same price if the wall is not built? Or will the feds auction it off to the highest bidder ? Will even that be a crooked arrangement?

  37. 37
    Lulymay says:


    I live in Canada and am planning to cross the border next week and head south. Been doing this for 20 years now. The US border guards have always been more than courteous to deal with but with this serious slap in the face by their current Prez, I wouldn’t blame them if they didn’t have their best ever smile on.

    As we usually do, we will answer their queries honestly and once given the right to enter the US, I hope they don’t mind if I sincerely wish them “good luck”.

  38. 38
    Elizabelle says:

    @Lulymay: You will have to let us know if you see a long line of US license plates lined up to get into Canada, in the other lanes.

    Are you a snowbird? Met a lot of Canadian snowbirds in Palm Springs, CA a few years ago.

  39. 39
    sukabi says:

    @gvg: yes, they ‘condition’ their viewers with their choice of programming, which is why abc decided to air a mini series on “Bill and Monica” ….

    If they wanted to actually be useful to the country and the public how about devoting a primetime hour each week into disecting drumpfs ‘business empire’ and how countries like Russia, Saudia Arabia, China and the others have poured $$ into his pockets. Or if they want to keep it current, how that $$ still influences and sets his agenda as president. There are so many opportunities for for ratings and clicks and therefore $$$$$ that they are leaving on the table that what’s left is that the media heads are more than ok with the repub agenda, they support it and embrace it.

  40. 40
    Mnemosyne says:


    Theoretically, you could take Amtrak, but it would take you 2 days, because it’s 10 hours to Emeryville on the Coast Starlight, stay overnight, and then another 18 hours to SLC on the California Zephyr so you can arrive at 3 am.

  41. 41
    The Pale Scot says:

    @catclub: is Feb 27 so surely we’ll be back to normal by then@mad citizen:

    is Feb 27 so surely we’ll be back to normal by then

    I’m trying not to let my paranoia run amok. On Jan. 15 British Parliament votes on PM May’s “Working Agreement” AKA transition period as the UK secedes from the EU on March 29. She doesn’t have the votes, there is not even a kernel of consensus about what to do next except the only alternatives are unacceptable. So some international businesses will hit the panic button, any plan will end up in court by entities who’s oxen are being gored. And look, the SEC isn’t open, what could go wrong.

    Vlad’s going to get his money’s worth sur’nough. On the bright side BoJo and Moogs will have introductions to nearby lamp posts

  42. 42
    Bill Arnold says:


    Don’t argue about it. It is absurd on its face. Just point out that the president has been steadily deteriorating for the past couple of years, and this is just one more example of his irrationality, and he needs to seek help or go.

    In DJT’s mind, the National Emergency is Nancy Pelosi serving as Speaker of the United States House of Representatives. He also believes everything he thinks, which is stongly suggestive of a defective mind.

    Rubio got one thing right; there is a real global and therefore also national emergency, climate change.
    How fast are the oceans warming? (PDF, 2019/01/11)
    Oceans are warming even faster than previously thought

    Dark note: A wall on the Southern border of the US could be considered to be an early response to the future emergency of climate refugees streaming north, an attempt to to harden emotional responses in the US to such refugees. This would presume that Rs or key GOP backers have a long game. (Fossil fuel interests, perhaps; large FF companies often think in terms of decades.)

  43. 43
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Elizabelle: I am at the airport at the moment. Things are proceeding more or less normally, although a bit more non-uniformed TSA people, presumably management, working the lines.

  44. 44
    The Pale Scot says:


    My preference would be the steel bar / concrete combo.

    I’d go with the submerged bamboo cage from Deer Hunter

  45. 45
    Patricia Kayden says:

    Who could have known that a con artist, know nothing, loud mouthed bigot wouldn’t make a good President? When do enough Deplorables get hurt by this shutdown to make Trump blink? Since he only cares about his base, this is the only question that matters.

  46. 46
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @The Pale Scot: Submerged in a septic tank.

  47. 47
    Aleta says:

    @WaterGirl: I loved your idea this morning and will do it.

    January 11, 2019 at 11:18 am
    @BroD: Anyone in the DC area that is furloughed or being forced to work with no pay needs to contact every single congress critter asking if they can walk their dogs.

    No, make that EVERYONE. Every single person who is doing that should call every single member of congress. Every single day. And then report the results of their calls to the media.

  48. 48
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Patricia Kayden: I believe that the only question that matters is when do 20 R senators choose self-preservation over party?

  49. 49
    Quaker in a Basement says:

    I’m thinking that any furloughed federal workers in NYC need to drop in for lunch at Trump Tower. When the bill comes, just slip ’em one of those “let’s make an arrangement” letters. It’ll work out. It always does.

    Meanwhile, down in south Florida, a picnic on the 13th green at Mar-a-Lago sounds like a nice way to spend the afternoon. Yes, it might be inconvenient for any golfers who’d like to also use the course, but hey, The Wall is a bigger priority, right?

  50. 50
    Elizabelle says:

    @Gin & Tonic: Happy jet trails!

  51. 51
    Bill Arnold says:


    But I worry about the people who’re being pressured right now but don’t have the resources to withstand.

    and their police-impersonator reps…

    Do you have a good link for this?

  52. 52
    germy says:


    No remaining signs of cancer for Justice Ginsburg, and no additional treatment required, Supreme Court says. She’ll miss next week’s arguments but continue to participate in cases from home

    I read yesterday that folks in the trump administration were quietly preparing for her replacement. They must be disappointed.

  53. 53
    sukabi says:

    @Patricia Kayden: That’s the thing, he doesn’t care about his base. He’s hurting those “good Americans” at the same pace as he’s hurting immigrants. Coal and steel workers aren’t doing so great. Neither are farmers. Now you’ve got border patrol, coast guard, tsa, treasury and a whole bunch of other folks that are getting screwed and the ONLY THING drumpf cares about is himself.

  54. 54


    This isn’t just a shutdown — it’s a hostile restructuring.

    You people continue to vastly overestimate Trump. It’s a temper tantrum.

  55. 55

    @A Ghost To Most:
    Long before enough Senators peel off to publicly force McConnell’s hand, he’ll bring it to a vote himself to avoid the public embarrassment and potential loss of his position. Veto overriding numbers will be easy to get, assuming Trump vetoes at all. Right now, only two people have actually taken actions to prevent the government reopening – Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell. Trump has only run his mouth.

  56. 56
    The Pale Scot says:

    @Quaker in a Basement:

    When the bill comes, just slip ’em one of those “let’s make an arrangement” letters. It’ll work out

    That would be great guerrilla theater, if only I was younger and employed by the feds,

  57. 57
    catclub says:


    no one is inspecting our food now

    all the more reason to go to France!.

  58. 58
    john fremont says:

    @opiejeanne: Don’t forget, companies that build and service biomedical equipment for hospitals, medical laboratories etc. are under federal inspection authority as well. Those HHS, FDA and OSHA inspection teams are on reduced manpower right now.

  59. 59
    catclub says:

    @germy: an 85 year old woman with a recurrence of cancer.
    I am thinking average life expectancy is measured in weeks. Here’s hoping she is above average!

  60. 60
    Amir Khalid says:

    During the US Government shutdown, are staff abroad — e.g. embassy personnel, including Americans and locals — also affected? It seems to me that salaries stop for them too. This may put Uncle Sam in violation of employment laws around the world.

  61. 61
    Elizabelle says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: Excuse me. Why can’t it be both?

    Trump is a moron. The people behind the scenes, and the money types, may not be.

  62. 62
    Elizabelle says:

    @Amir Khalid: Yes. They are affected.

    This may put Uncle Sam in violation of employment laws around the world.

    Excellent point. (1) Those playing chicken may not have thought of that and (2) if some have, they care so little about the rule of law or norms.

    I actually think this whole thing is going to blow bad on Trump and the GOP, majorly, but it is nerve-wracking to watch it play out.

  63. 63
    raven says:

    Someone just posted pictures of the empty shelves at the huge DeKalb Farmers Market in Atlanta.

  64. 64
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: I’m referring to the entire shitshow. 20 R senators, and this is all over, except for the trials.

  65. 65
    chris says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: I’m not so sure that trump is running things. Consider Vladimir for instance.

  66. 66
    Comrade Scrutinizer says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: One doesn’t preclude the other.

  67. 67
    tobie says:

    @raven: Are the empty shelves linked to the cut of funds from the Ag Dept during the shutdown? I hadn’t given much thought to whether the shutdown would affect the national food supply. Is it time to start stockpiling?

  68. 68
    raven says:

    @tobie: Yep, it’s mostly fresh produce.

  69. 69
    MP says:

    @raven: Huh. Just around the corner from me. They ship in a ton of produce from overseas – I thought those FDA inspectors were still at full strength.

  70. 70


    I am thinking average life expectancy is measured in weeks.

    No, apparently this kind of cancer is the norm rather than the exception in women her age, and if you get through the surgery and immediate recovery okay, it has no further effect on lifespan.

  71. 71
    catclub says:


    I actually think this whole thing is going to blow bad on Trump and the GOP,

    Important if true! People were saying the same about the 2013 shutdown that was caused by the GOP. They punished in 2014 by winning 9 new senate seats.

  72. 72
    Elizabelle says:

    @catclub: In Virginia, it elected Terry McAuliffe. By a pretty narrow margin, but he turned out to be an excellent governor.

    Virginia is full of feds and contractors, and they have good memories.

  73. 73
    snoey says:

    Everything slows down at that age, including tumor growth.

  74. 74
    Barry says:

    @A Ghost To Most: “I believe that the only question that matters is when do 20 R senators choose self-preservation over party?”

    The real question is when to 20 R Senators decide that opposing Trump *is* self-preservation?

    Right now, I can see the overwhelming majority deciding to stay on the ship.

  75. 75
    Elizabelle says:

    @catclub: Hmmm. And those seats are up in 2020.

    I cannot speak to why people elect Republican senators. It does not reflect well on them.

  76. 76
    opiejeanne says:

    @catclub: Yes, the food is awesome, but we can’t drive to France. We fly out of Seattle on Iceland Air and while I trust them, I don’t know what we’ll be dealing with by May.

  77. 77
    Spanky says:

    Oh look! Frances Urquhart is running for PM President:

    Senator Kirsten Gillibrand of New York has hired several senior aides for an expected presidential campaign, a sign that she is all but certain to join the race against President Trump and that her entry may be imminent.


  78. 78
    Lymie says:

    Both Minneapolis and Boston airports were a cinch today, but today was the first missed pay check. Seemed completely normal.

  79. 79
    tobie says:

    @raven: Wow. If this goes on, we’re going to start seeing diseases like scurvy again.

  80. 80
    trollhattan says:

    I’m waiting for Trump to experience actual consequences, personally, for his two years of serial shenanigans. I don’t mean missing two rounds of golf, I don’t mean having most of his staff flee at the drop of a hat, I don’t mean losing the House, I don’t mean Muller still functioning and not in jail because reasons, I mean actual consequences to He, Trump. As has been the case his entire life, he is getting away with all this crap. All of it. Only now his victims count in the tens of millions.

  81. 81
    raven says:

    @MP: @MP: Rut ro, I clicked on the original FB poster and it looks like it may be fake.

  82. 82
    Aleta says:

    @Bill Arnold: No, the concerns are my projection, though I’ll look for the story that mentions the efforts of civil rights workers to contact as many people as they can. The info about what feds do if an em.dom. project doesn’t go through after they have seized land (auction it off) came from an answer from @BillinGlendaleCA last night to my question.

  83. 83
    satby says:

    @Gozer: I leave for Mexico on the 16th and come home on the 25th… And every single day I wonder if I’ll be able to go. My exchange sons have already arranged time off from their jobs for my visit.
    I’m trying not to be depressed about it because at least I currently have SS coming in when the furloughed folks have nothing, but I will be really depressed if I can’t go. Not so much if I go and can’t get back though.

  84. 84
    Mainmata says:

    @Derelict: One Miami terminal has already closed because of a lack of TSA workers so, yep, could be a real problem.

  85. 85
    J R in WV says:


    Ooh, Ooh, who’d you pie? We all want to know who finally pushed you over the line, and how and why…

  86. 86
    Yutsano says:

    @trollhattan: Ready to be more depressed? I came across this video that shows what we’re losing in the sciences by his stupid mnemonic. I’m actually more pissed about this than missing work.

  87. 87
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @J R in WV: I assume it was me.

  88. 88
    Elizabelle says:

    Re the blogpost title:

    I think Trump is going to be his own record for most criminal indictments lodged against a “President”, sitting, squatting, or former.

  89. 89
    Mnemosyne says:


    Not necessarily. My mother in law has had two different cancers so far — a thyroid cancer with a 99 percent survival rate if treated promptly (it was) and a recent mouth cancer that was surgically excised with complete success and will not require further treatment.

    If these things are caught early, they can be very survivable, even for 85 year olds.

  90. 90
    Mnemosyne says:


    They punished in 2014 by winning 9 new senate seats.

    What, you thought the Russians only started meddling in 2016? They started as soon as Citizens United let them send untraceable dark money to Republicans.

  91. 91
    MP says:

    @raven: I’m headed there this weekend, so I’ll know for sure in a day or two.

  92. 92
    JPL says:

    @raven: Why?

    I see several others asked before me. Thanks for the heads up.

  93. 93
    JPL says:

    @MP: If you live in GA, call and thank Lucy McBath whether she is in your district or not. You could simply thank her for her support of background checks. Someone posted her number on the local nextdoor and several mentioned that they were going to call about the wall. I feel the office might need some good calls also.
    Lucy McBeth’s number is 202-225-4501

  94. 94
    opiejeanne says:

    @tobie: Fruit like oranges and apples have been in cold storage for several months, so they’re as safe to eat as they were a month ago. Lettuce and other veggies usually eaten raw, not so much. We are going to wash and cook any veggies we deal with until things go back to “normal”.

  95. 95
    tarragon says:


    Actually, I don’t understand this. They passed the senate bill, why does the senate need to take this up again.

  96. 96
    Dan B says:

    @opiejeanne: I’ve been buying all our produce at our Columbia City PCC (co-op). And organic at Red Apple (small local chain). The certification for organic is government but the controls for the safety if the produce are mostly small scale. Organic from outside is almost entirely agri-business, according to a friend who works in the field of organic farming – upper management consultation. So even organic from California will be suspect very soon.

  97. 97
    catclub says:

    @tarragon: That was the bill passed by the senate in the previous session. They have to start over in the new session. the bill passed in the old session is a deceased parrot, it has joined the choir invisible.

  98. 98
    opiejeanne says:

    @Dan B: There’s a PCC in Redmond, but not very close to us. I’ve been considering dried, canned, and frozen foods, foods like beans and corn and peas. I’ve got a turkey and a standing rib in the freezer, and we are currently working on a ham. The bone will go into lentil soup along with the “horse” carrots left from Christmas that someone left in our fridge.

    (The definition of eternity is two people and a ham.)

    We are almost out of the produce we grew last year, just a handful of small potatoes and onions are left. Some strawberries and cherries in the freezer. It’s going to be a while before it’s warm enough to start seeds for the garden. I’m baking bread for the heck of it today, but that could become a standard thing around here.

  99. 99
    Dan B says:

    @sukabi: MSM exposes on Trump’s international business schemes would be great but would expose the pubkic to how It’s done. Some might question how common it is. If Trump does it where did he learn how to launder money, and work with corrupt governments, and oligarchs, and mafias?

    Might expose the US elite.

  100. 100
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:


    And even then, we know Kavanaugh seems to like to follow along with whatever the “cool” kids are doing.

    The conservatards finally figured it out about why Judge Mc Rapey Crybaby sucks the south end when it’s to damn late. Who would have thunk a no principle scoundrel has no principles. Total idiots.

  101. 101
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:


    You people continue to vastly overestimate Trump. It’s a temper tantrum.

    I am with him, this is all because Trump is upset that the Dems are refusing to kiss his south end and that’s were it begins and ends. If Trump had a sekret’ agenda, he would have babbled about it by now.

  102. 102
    A Ghost To Most says:

    Think Washington, DC, early 1974. Noxin still enjoys broad support in both Houses. The heavy investigations are just ramping up. Then, everything starts coming out, and by August, Noxin. Is. Toast.

    This case makes Noxin look like a Boy Scout.

    I may be preparing for the worst, but I now think that the gears of our bureaucracy will gobble up Mr. Creosote and his co-conspirators. Assuming govt gets opened before it collapses.

  103. 103
    randy khan says:


    Long before enough Senators peel off to publicly force McConnell’s hand, he’ll bring it to a vote himself to avoid the public embarrassment and potential loss of his position.

    I think this is right. McConnell doesn’t want to risk having it look like he’s losing control of the Senate. He’ll probably slip some face-saving but actually meaningless provision into the bill to make it look like he got something.

  104. 104
    randy khan says:


    Frankly, if she were as good at politics as FU in the original Game of Cards – minus the bodies, of course – it would be great news.

  105. 105
    Karen says:

    @germy: I can see it now…

    Trump calls and offers the nomination to his next Conservative man. Then he calls McConnell so they can set up the nomination. Then he hears that RBG is coming back and is like F**k!!!!

  106. 106
    Redshift says:

    It’s not the only record Trump has broken. He got rejected by the most women at one time, just after his inauguration.

  107. 107
    Aleta says:

    @Bill Arnold: If you like, here’s a couple of things I read this week (skimmed the 1st one ) that gave me a sense of what the admin is doing / can do to pressure individuals, even before it has full funding or the rights to all the land it needs.

    1. The Civil Rights Implications of Eminent Domain Abuse
    A Briefing Before The United States Commission on Civil Rights Held in Washington, DC

    2. The Condemnor usually orders a real estate appraisal of the entire property and the specific property rights sought by the Condemnor. A land acquisition agent for the Condemnor uses the appraisal amount to make an offer to purchase the property needed for the project. That is all that is needed to satisfy the requirement that the Condemnor negotiate “in good faith” with the landowner.

    The “offer” may have (or claim to have) a time limit that requires the landowner to respond by a particular date to add pressure to the landowner. The landowner can accept or reject the offer. The offer letters sent by condemning authorities can be confusing and intimidating to property owners who do not understand the condemnation process. They also typically make no effort to notify the landowner of the scope of the various impacts to the landowner’s remaining property from partial takings for projects such as power lines and pipelines.

    3. The Texas Civil Rights Project is now trying to let people know that they are not required to sign over access to their land. They are going door-to-door in some neighborhoods, letting people know their rights, and they are running digital ads and spots on local radio stations. They also plan to host town-hall style meetings.

    “If you don’t have a lawyer, you’re just going to get railroaded,” Olivares said. “We’re trying to make sure this isn’t going to happen.”

    But there are hurdles to challenging the government, he said, and courts often side with federal authorities when a seizure is related to national security. … When the seizure is allowed, owners can dispute the amount of money they are offered, but Olivares said the government often files a motion telling the court that it will pay whatever the court determines to be a fair amount, but they also argue that they need immediate access to the land.

    The Trump administration, he said, has filed about 10 or 12 cases against landowners in South Texas asking for access to the land to conduct soil sampling and measuring.

    “It’s all in anticipation of taking the land,” he said.

    Those in court fighting the government include the Roman Catholic Diocese of Brownsville, Tex., which is contesting a request to survey land that includes La Lomita chapel, a small church built more than 150 years ago where Mass, weddings and funerals are held and a Palm Sunday procession takes place each year.

    Mary McCord, a visiting professor at Georgetown Law and former Justice Department official now working on the diocesan case, said Bishop Daniel E. Flores believes that allowing the government access to the property would be an implicit endorsement of allowing it to take the land. That, she said, would violate his firmly held religious beliefs and Catholic doctrine. …

    The government filed a motion asking for the right to go on the property for up to a year to survey the land. A hearing is scheduled for February.

    This effort for La Lomita Chapel is related to the attempted seizure of land belonging to the National Butterfly Center. (Destruction has already begun, with major destruction scheduled for Feb.) A few links after this about how the feds have been rushing destruction. The Center didn’t succeed in its recent court challenge (which the SC refused to hear a few weeks ago).

    (The N. Butterfly Center has a go fund me. )

  108. 108
    Hoodie says:

    @randy khan: I doubt it. McConnell is more afraid of the Trump caucus in the senate and the house. He saw what happened to Boehner and Ryan. If he passes a bill that Trump vetoes, the votes for override aren’t there and the gop fractures. Defections by “centrists” like Collins and Gardner are harmless, as they will always come back to the fold because they like being in the GOP club and Mitch holds the money. Ironically, McConnell may be the guy most hoping Mueller has something big on Trump, which could give him leeway to turn on Trump while keeping his caucus intact. I doubt he wants to be Trump’s full time lackey, because he knows Trump is thoroughly unreliable as an ally. But he will keep playing it this way because he is a shitty, power obsessed excuse for a human being and hopes Nancy folds or Trump gets indicted.

  109. 109
    mapaghimagsik says:

    heard my first predatory load company offering easy payments because of the government shutdown.

    mini-drumfs that need to learn a little empathy.

  110. 110
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:


    But there are hurdles to challenging the government, he said, and courts often side with federal authorities when a seizure is related to national security.

    Even when there’s not an actual serious national security threat? It’s fucking Trump. Everybody knows he’s lying. Everybody knows that there’s no legitimate reason for the type of border wall he’s proposing and that there is no immigration crisis at the southern border. Federal judges should just tell the Trump admin to fuck off.

  111. 111
    tarragon says:

    Ah. Got it. Thanks.

  112. 112
    randy khan says:


    My underlying premise is that McConnell will know when his caucus is about to fold and act accordingly to preserve his power, not that he will act against the will of the caucus. I’d also note that the Senate has fewer committed Trumpers than the House, which is different from saying that they’re not wary of what Trump supporters can do to them in a primary.

    I believe that what he really is hoping is that it doesn’t come to that, and that either Trump or Pelosi blinks before then. He understands that any vote that the Senate takes causes significant electoral problems unless Trump is signed off on it.

  113. 113
    Aleta says:

    1. From Aug 2018
    While President Trump’s wall along the United States-Mexico hasn’t yet been given a green light, in March, Congress did approve portions of wall, including a 25-mile stretch that would run through Hidalgo County near the Rio Grande.

    The [National Butterfly Center] center sits on 100 acres of land, and according to Trevino-Wright, the center would lose about 70 acres due to the wall.

    Trevino-Wright says construction crews have already shown up on their land. The center has filed a lawsuit to stop further action.

    2. From October 2018
    The Trump administration announced today that it will waive dozens of environmental laws to speed border-wall construction through protected Rio Grande Valley property, including a national wildlife refuge and famed butterfly center.

    Border walls in Hidalgo County, Texas, would cut through the Lower Rio Grande Valley National Wildlife Refuge, National Butterfly Center, Bentsen-Rio Grande State Park, and the grounds of the historic La Lomita Chapel, as well as hundreds of family farms and other private property.

    …The waiver, to take effect Thursday, is intended to speed about 18 miles of border-wall construction by sweeping aside 28 bedrock environmental and public-health laws that protect clean air, clean water, public lands and endangered wildlife. This is the fifth time the Trump administration has used the REAL ID waiver. The Center is considering whether to challenge the waiver in court.

    The waiver is being issued during a comment period for border-wall construction in Hidalgo County, where so far more than 8,500 people say they oppose the plan. U.S. Customs and Border Protection opened the comment period in September after the Center and 42 groups requested public input. Comments remain open until Nov. 6.

    “It’s appalling that the Trump administration is willing to seize family farms by eminent domain and bulldoze beautiful nature reserves that support the local economy,” Jordahl said. “Trump is ripping the Rio Grande Valley in two for political sport. His despicable disregard for the law and the borderlands must be stopped.”

    The Center is suing the Trump administration over its use of the long-expired waiver for border-wall construction at the Santa Teresa Port of Entry in New Mexico. The Center is also appealing a federal court ruling in its lawsuit to stop the border wall replacement project near San Diego.

    (2. Cont.) The proposal seeks to waive these laws:
    The National Environmental Policy Act
    The Endangered Species Act
    The Clean Water Act
    The National Historic Preservation Act
    The Migratory Bird Treaty Act
    The Migratory Bird Conservation Act
    The Clean Air Act
    The Archeological Resources Protection Act
    The Paleontological Resources Preservation Act
    The Federal Cave Resources Protection Act
    The Safe Drinking Water Act
    The Noise Control Act
    The Solid Waste Disposal Act
    The Comprehensive Environmental Response, Compensation, and Liability Act
    The Archaeological and Historic Preservation Act
    The Antiquities Act
    The Historic Sites, Buildings, and Antiquities Act
    The Farmland Protection Policy Act
    The Coastal Zone Management Act
    The Federal Land Policy and Management Act
    The National Wildlife Refuge System Administration Act
    The National Fish and Wildlife Act
    The Fish and Wildlife Coordination Act
    The Administrative Procedure Act
    The River and Harbors Act
    The Eagle Protection Act
    The Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act
    The American Indian Religious Freedom Act

    3. From Dec 13 2018
    A July letter sent from US Customs and Border Protection to a not-for-profit environmental group and seen by the Guardian describes the route and possible components of the project as including a 30ft-tall concrete and steel wall, roads, and a 150ft “enforcement zone” where all vegetation will be cleared.

    Trump has expansive federal powers to construct the border wall on both private and public land. Since 2005, the Department of Homeland Security has had the power to waive numerous environmental laws in the name of national security.

    “We fully anticipate that they will seize the land by quick take,” said Wright, referring to a Depression-era provision of the eminent domain law that gives federal agencies the right to take property without compensation or adjudication. “Legal claims are not addressed or settled. You don’t get your day in court. You don’t get to negotiate appraisals or offers. Nothing,” said Wright.

    4. From Dec 6 2018
    Bulldozers are expected to soon plow through the protected habitat of the National Butterfly Center along the Rio Grande to clear the way for President Trump’s border wall, which got a green light from the Supreme Court this week.

    The high court let stand an appeals ruling that lets the administration bypass 28 federal laws, mostly to protect the environment, to build the wall in the Rio Grande Valley. The Animal Legal Defense Fund and two other organizations had sued the government.

    Some of the laws that were waived include the Endangered Species Act, the Safe Drinking Water Act and the Native American Graves Protection and Repatriation Act. Environmental activists argue the wall could lead to the extinction of endangered species such as the ocelot, contamination of drinking water and destruction of indigenous historical sites.

    By refusing to hear the case, the Supreme Court upheld a February ruling by U.S. District Court Judge Gonzalo Curiel of San Diego in favor of the government.

    Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielson said in an October notice that the flow of undocumented immigrants and drugs along the border demonstrated “an acute and immediate need” for a wall.

    The immigration reform act of 1996 and a 2005 update, the Real ID Act, grants the government broad powers to waive federal laws to expedite construction projects on the U.S.-Mexico border.

    The butterfly center sued the government after contract workers appeared unannounced on its property in July 2017. Chainsaws in hand, they began clearing out protected habitat where the border wall was planned.

    “That is criminal. And unconstitutional,” Wright said.

    Surveying began before Congress approved $1.6 billion for 100 miles of new and replacement fencing, with 33 of those miles in the Rio Grande Valley.

  114. 114
    Karen says:

    Can he call for the Emergency then instead of using the money for the wall, the money accidentally goes into one of his slush funds?

  115. 115
    Bill Arnold says:

    Thanks! I’ll give it all at least a skim.

  116. 116
    joel hanes says:


    They are orcs.

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