Wednesday Morning Open Thread: Sad Trumpone Noises

The Washington Post, sensibly, had a TV critic cover the speech (she panned it, bigly).

82 replies
  1. 1
    John S. says:

    Will Sen. McConnell listen?

    No. SATSQ

  2. 2
    Baud says:

    ❤️ Hillary.

    Trump is concerned that if he loses this, he loses the Senate trial on impeachment. The only thing the GOP has left is their own solidarity.

    Good morning again, rikyrah.

  3. 3
    trnc says:

    I wasn’t watching tv last night, but for about 12 minutes after 9 I could swear I heard the sound of self-owning in the distance.

  4. 4
    Ken says:

    The reviews were in five centuries ago: “A tale told by an idiot, full of sound an fury, signifying nothing.”

  5. 5
    randy khan says:

    McConnell’s calculation has been that Republican Senators (including him) are better off if he can deflect blame to Trump and the Dems because any vote risks alienating voters they need to get re-elected. My guess is that he’s re-evaluating that calculation more or less daily, and things like the Murkowski and Capito statements may start to push him towards allowing a vote on something.

  6. 6
    Sebastian says:


    And so it comes to an end. All they have is the loyalty of thieves. Right now they are all looking around in barely hidden panic who will make the first move.

    Mueller’s hammer is about to come down like a ton of bricks. Congressional hearings will uncover gory details. Once the American public starts paying attention and begins realizing what really happened (that takes a while) public rage and fury will come down like the Wrath of God.

    Have you seen the edited clip of his speech where they isolated all his sniffles and breathing? Look at his eyes. He is afraid, so so afraid.

  7. 7
    OzarkHillbilly says:


  8. 8
    JPL says:

    Mediate has a clip of Colbert .. Bird Box 2

  9. 9
  10. 10
    Snarki, child of Loki says:

    @Baud: “The only thing the GOP has left is their own solidarity.”

    So, encase in concrete? Sounds like a plan.
    I’m sure there’s a teeny-tiny concrete wall that could use a few more blocks, somewhere.

  11. 11
    rikyrah says:

    Good Morning, Everyone 😄 😄😄

  12. 12
  13. 13
    MattF says:

    Trump’s speech was a replay of his public non-apology for birtherism. We see again that Trump has a limited behavioral repertoire. As do the TV networks.

  14. 14
    Sebastian says:


    Yup, that got lost yesterday because the networks were busy sucking off Donny the Dipshit.

    Have you seen this?

    Personally, I’d prefer oligarch superyachts sunk by Tomahawk cruise missiles but I’ll take arrests as consolation price.

  15. 15
    Kay says:

    Matthew Yglesias
    ‏Verified account
    11h11 hours ago
    More Matthew Yglesias Retweeted Dan Pfeiffer
    The view that rich powerful media executives continually get “played” like this seems to me to be a seriously weak analysis of the situation.
    They derive concrete material benefits from Republican Party election wins.

    I agree, yet there’s still a possibility that they’re just very bad at their jobs and wildly, wildly overpaid. I wish I could say that the fact that they’re paid tens of millions of dollars annually means they are at least competent in their core duty; decision-making on media, but I feel like the connection between “what people are paid” and “what they do” has been broken so the whole premise no longer holds.

  16. 16
    MattF says:

    @Kay: What these executives actually ‘do’ is get paid a lot of money. Nice work if you can get it.

  17. 17
    oatler. says:

    @MattF: That’s what Cybill said! Seriously let’s keelhaul Andy Lack and his Chuck Todd barnacles.

  18. 18
    TS (the original) says:

    @Kay: They get paid to make the big decisions. Do not broadcast a speech from President Obama. Broadcast a speech from president& trump.

  19. 19
    Uncle Cosmo says:

    I for one would like to see Trumpolini a year or two from now on a prison work gang building a brick wall – he can use a pitchfork to mix the mortar for the bricklayers. Which would identify him, incontestably, as a mortar-forker

    (I’ll let myself out…)

  20. 20
    Kay says:

    “Rich” and “powerful” isn’t really a contradiction to “got played” or “bad at their jobs”, without more. In fact, assuming “rich” and “powerful” means something more than rich and powerful is why we’re in this mess.

    Just put rich and powerful aside and ask “bad decision”? Yes. Unequivocally. Then I suppose you have to ask “so why are they rich and powerful if they make such poor decisions over and over?” which is a very dangerous question :)

  21. 21
    rikyrah says:

    Kumar Rao (@KumarRaoNYC) Tweeted:
    Didn’t watch Trump last night, but am watching some @AyannaPressley this morning. You should too 👇🏾

  22. 22

    @Kay: “Behind every great fortune, there is a crime.” (Mario Puzo and sort of Balzac)

  23. 23
    Kay says:

    @TS (the original):

    Trump gave them a special private lunch, as a reward. Is that a FOIA-able event? I’d like someone to request what the president told the guardians of transparency secretly, at their special reward luncheon, after they gave him a campaign ad.

    This whole thing is fucking ludicrous. I’m supposed to man the barricades to protect these peoples industry from Trump? Why? So they can have private lunches with him? If they don’t care about their credibility I certainly don’t. The First Amendment will still exist if they all go out of business. New people can (and will) enter the market. Maybe they’ll be better.

  24. 24
    rikyrah says:

    Anyone been following the Twitter feed of AP after they tried the both sides bullshyt 😡

  25. 25
    plato says:

    May be the dems should start framing this stupid shutdown as how it affects the stupid voters (49% of whom blame both sides even now) than the 800k govt workers.

  26. 26
    A Ghost To Most says:


    With as much dignity as he could muster, the Old Man gathered up the sad remains of his shattered major award. Later that night, alone in the backyard, he buried it next to the garage. Now I could never be sure, but I thought that I heard the sound of “Taps” being played, gently.

  27. 27
    rikyrah says:

    You are absolutely right, Kay

  28. 28
    rikyrah says:

    I did see that and wondered what it was about.🤔🤔

  29. 29
    TS (the original) says:

    @Kay: I will never understand why the media does this – unless they really do celebrate having a moron in charge of the country – and how anyone except trump and McConnell can be blamed for the current impasse relates to media misinformation – believed by 40% of the population.

  30. 30
    Jeffro says:


    I wasn’t watching tv last night, but for about 12 minutes after 9 I could swear I heard the sound of self-owning in the distance.


    Also today:
    – Marc “The Hack’s Hack” Thiessen in the WaPo: “Trump Won The Night, Pelosi and Schumer Lost”. No link necessary, it’s basically him saying ‘neener neener I can’t hear you’ 800 times.
    – Fox News dot com: “Gauntlet THROWN: Trump Calls Out Dems, Goes Straight to America to Make Case For Southern Barrier”. Also no link necessary, because none of us live on that planet.

    Nobody bought Trumpov’s BS, and most every major media outlet called it recycled garbage/fundraising material/trying to shore up support with his base. The end, when it comes, will seem like it came quickly but whew getting this jackass out of office continues to be a long time coming…

  31. 31
    Waldo says:


    The only thing the GOP has left is their own solidarity.

    I find this both reassuring and terrifying. Like knowing a rabid animal will eventually drop dead.

  32. 32
    Jeffro says:

    @rikyrah: thanks for this clip – she is wonderful! Keep going Rep Pressley!

  33. 33
    plato says:

    @Kay: The media minions are all corrupt and complicit. The very reasons why the totus thug is able (and has been able to for so long) to play them so easily. They are his main enablers.

  34. 34
    chopper says:

    @randy khan:

    mcconnell knows those two, and others, have gotten squishy. that’s why trump isn’t likely to go with the ‘national emergency’ gambit. mcconnell can’t guarantee him the votes, and i dunno if he could come up with a way to keep the resolution off the floor when the house votes it down.

  35. 35
    Steeplejack says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Yet another ubiquitous quote that sort of mangles the original. Dunno about Puzo, but Balzac was talking about great fortunes (or success) without apparent cause.

    Le secret des grandes fortunes sans cause apparente est un crime oublié, parce qu’ il a été proprement fait.

    The secret of great wealth with no obvious source is some forgotten crime, forgotten because it was done neatly.

    Hashed out on the Google.

    Who is going to point out the great crime behind, say, J.K. Rowling’s fortune?

  36. 36
    germy says:

    “Our government may at some time be in the hands of a bad man. When in the hands of a good man it is all well enough. We ought to have our government so shaped that even when in the hands of a bad man we shall be safe.”

    – Frederick Douglass

  37. 37
    SFAW says:

    Speaker Pelosi (and others) called this a “manufactured” crisis. While that’s certainly true, I’m wondering if adjectives such as “pretend,” “fake,” “bullshit,” “bogus,” or possibly “yet another bullshit crisis from the Oval Office occupant” (yeah, I realize the last one is not just adjectives) might work better, or at least provide additional reasons for McConnell’s Minions (Mitch’s B**ches?) to revolt. As opposed to being revolting, which they already are, of course.

  38. 38
    SFAW says:


    The only thing the GOP has left is their own solidarity.

    Maybe they can go on a “fact-finding” trip to Gdansk. And not come back.

  39. 39
    SFAW says:


    Who is going to point out the great crime behind, say, J.K. Rowling’s fortune?

    That lawsuit was thrown out, I think, or the plaintiff lost.

  40. 40

    @Kay: They are not the guardians of free speech. They are guardians of the R kleptocracy, mostly because they are a part of it.

  41. 41

    @Steeplejack: Yeah, that’s why I said “sort of” Balzac. Puzo’s version fits The Godfather and we seem to be in a Godfather world.

  42. 42

    @TS (the original): They do it because R rule lines their pockets and in many cases they are fellow travelers. R agenda is their agenda.

  43. 43
    sherparick says:

    I would really be interested in watching TV ratings on that speech last night. I did not watch it (I had a DVR episodes of Silent Witness and Wallander to watch). If the ratings were bad, perhaps the Suits will realize that the Trump as President Reality Show has jumped the shark. I think bad ratings terrify Trump more than Mueller.

    For a long time folks believed that the corporate media elite (Networks, Non-Fox Cable news, NPR, NYT, WaPo, and AP) were simply bad at their job. But critics going back to to Christopher Lasch in the 1970s and Neil Postman in the 1980s pointed out that the news business evolving out of the broadcast TV age was increasingly focused on entertainment and grabbing attention in order to make money. Yglesias is right, the managers of the news business are comfortable with Republican and oligarchic rule, and prefer those policies, even if they deplore Trump’s style or find the White Evangelicals awkward and gauche.

    Jay Rosen comments on the post mid-term rush of MSM to return to “Both Siderism” in the Age of Trump.
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    Alongside the production of news and analysis, journalists in the major media are constantly engaged in another manufacture: the production of their own innocence. They feel they have to continuously prove they are being even-handed and not on anyone’s side. We all know this. 13/
    11 replies 206 retweets 944 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    By leading a hate campaign against the press, by emerging as the most potent source of misinformation in the culture, and by attacking the other institutions of American democracy in asymmetrical fashion, Trump has played havoc with the production of innocence in journalism. 14/
    10 replies 183 retweets 859 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    Along with the reality of one-party control in Washington after the 2016 election, Trump’s war on institutional democracy — and his attack on the very possibility of a fact-based debate — made it impossible for journalists to stay in the safety zone between opposing sides. 15/
    5 replies 145 retweets 731 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    That picture didn’t fit. They had to push back, even as their companies saw a surge in revenue from greater attention to politics and shock at the sheer awfulness of the Trump phenomenon. The production of innocence ground to a halt. Trump vs the press became a daily reality. 16/
    2 replies 100 retweets 602 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    But journalists were never comfortable with it. Marty Baron, editor of the Washington Post, spoke for his colleagues when he said, “We’re not at war, we’re at work.” Having to take the side of democracy against Trump’s campaign to undermine it was not where they wanted to be. 17/
    3 replies 113 retweets 663 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    Now the picture has changed; it has been normalized. Divided government in Washington — plus a field of 2020 candidates who can be examined and found wanting as plausible contenders to Trump — means the production of innocence has come roaring back, along with the horse race. 18/
    3 replies 123 retweets 672 likes
    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu
    Jan 6

    The case for taking the side of democracy against its undermining by Trump is as strong as ever in journalism. Maybe stronger, as he begins to melt down under pressure. But with “partisan warfare” revived as story line, and the primary campaign ready for Gameday treatment… 19/
    5 replies 140 retweets 684 likes

    Jay Rosen
    ‏Verified account @jayrosen_nyu

    … the conditions are in place for an even bigger debacle than 2016 was for journalists in the political press. Left to their own devices, they will go back to being above it all. (“Is she likable enough?”) Meanwhile, our civic emergency rages on. So what we are to do? 20/

  44. 44
    Immanentize says:


    Who is going to point out the great crime behind, say, J.K. Rowling’s fortune?

    Hell, Voldemort killed Harry’s parents in cold blood and then tried to kill the little baby Harry too!

  45. 45
    A Ghost To Most says:

    I won’t even click with Theissen. That rabid dog needs to be chained to a tree out in the woods.

  46. 46
    Betty Cracker says:

    @rikyrah: I saw it. Infuriating. But the most hideous spin so far comes from Fox & Friends, with the current perky blonde all but inciting genocide. I’ll put up a post on that later, most likely.

  47. 47
    plato says:


    Meanwhile, our civic emergency rages on. So what we are to do?

    For a change, the voters can start thinking for themselves instead of being brainwashed every time by the media hacks.

  48. 48
    Steeplejack says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Not criticizing you. Just sitting here in my velveteen smoking jacket with my foot up on the gout stool ruminating on literary topics.

    As usual, Puzo sucks the nuance out of everything.

  49. 49
    Tenar Arha says:

    @Kay: I’ve changed my views towards them. I think they’re not very bright.

    See if they were bright & good at making money, they wouldn’t have been regularly leaving $$$$$ on the table by sticking with a-hole & repetitive white male writers, directors etc. entertainment & news for so long. Even though there’s plenty of evidence for the potential viewership they could have from Shonda Rimes, Michelle Wolf, Sandra Bee, Rachel Maddow…etc. if you can’t override your own prejudices to make $, you’re not smart, you’re just a good copycat.

  50. 50
    plato says:

    Lloyd Gardner, who voted for Trump and wants a wall, works for the Bureau of Prisons. He may not vote for Trump again.

    “He's saying the government workers are OK with this? I haven't met one who say they are OK … and I know plenty that voted for him."

    — Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) January 9, 2019

    The best reply.

    Trump supporters in a nutshell. They do not care about others. Only when the policies affect them.

    — Melissa (@melissaann5761) January 9, 2019

  51. 51
    Kay says:

    Philip Rucker
    ‏Verified account
    1h1 hour ago
    “As skillful as he is at dominating the national conversation, he has been singularly ineffective in this battle to change public minds or weaken the will of his Democratic opponents” — @danbalz on Trump and the wall

    “As skillful as he is at totally dominating our coverage, to the exclusion of everyone and everything else…”

    Trump’s singular victory is over media. He beat them- utterly and completely dominates them- and for almost 3 years, that was all he needed.

    I think back to that 72 hour period where they covered the new congress fondly- it is the only non-Trump coverage we have gotten for 3 years.

  52. 52
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @rikyrah: In this thread there is statement that 2 Russians involved in polling data transferals are steel magnates. Also that Wilbur Ross has aluminum investments. The implication, I think, is that they will benefit from wall construction.

    Whole thing murky. Some input from people here would be helpful

  53. 53
    Yarrow says:

    Has anyone heard of MediaWise? Sounds like their mission is along the lines of things I’ve been saying about needing education on propaganda, etc.

    To fully combat the spread of misinformation online, we must teach a new generation to be fact-checkers.

    Enter MediaWise, Poynter’s groundbreaking endeavor aimed at helping middle and high school students be smarter consumers of news and information online.

    MediaWise is a partnership between Poynter, the Stanford History Education Group, Local Media Association and National Association for Media Literacy Education, supported by Google Inc. MediaWise will feature a research-based curriculum to be taught in classrooms and a teen-led fact-checking initiative. YouTube creators like Ingrid Nilsen, the Green Brothers and Destin Sandlin from Smarter Every Day will help this project reach its goal of 1 million students, with at least 50 percent coming from underserved or low-income communities.

  54. 54
    Tazj says:

    Chris Cuomo said that Trump put forth a compelling argument for the wall at that private luncheon. Tapper and others seemed to think it was hilarious to criticize Schumer and Pelosi for looking older and too serious. They’re horrible at their jobs and many people are suffering the consequences.

  55. 55
    Kay says:


    Maybe it was just me, but I never actually contemplated failure of the constitutionally protected institution ITSELF, prior to Trump.

    We succeeded in retaining their legal protections to operate- the 1st amendment wasn’t abrogated or weakened, but they failed WITHIN those protections. My assumption was you hold up the 1st and the rest takes care of itself – the ‘market’ part of the free press would take the protections and handle the functions and operations side, to put it in those terms. Now I’m watching it fail and I realize the legal protections weren’t the vulnerable area at all. It was the institution itself.

  56. 56
    Jeffro says:

    A good bit of local (NoVA) news: Dems keep Jennifer Wexton’s old state senate seat. Now that’s a twofer: give Barbara frickin’ Comstock the book AND keep a VA state senate seat in Dem hands. We. Are. Coming. For You, VA Republicans.

    ETA: and this was on top of the hilarious news that Corey Stewart – who lost by 16 points to Tim Kaine last November – has decided to give up on VA politics “unless and until Virginia voters are more aligned with his views” or some similar nonsense. Don’t let the door hit you on the way to your wingnut welfare as a Fox commentator, Corey.

  57. 57
    Yarrow says:

    @Tazj: Chris Cuomo is a horrible media person. He was somewhat tolerable on the morning show, which is supposed to be lighter and fluffier. In the evening he tries to have this tough journalist persona and he fails at it completely. He’s the epitome of having a job because of family connections–the Governor of NY (his brother) showed up on the last day of his morning show to do a segment wishing him well. It’s pathetic how obvious it is.

    Oh, one of the ways they try to make him look “tough” is by emphasizing his muscles in various lighter pieces like showing his pre-show warm up routine of pushups or whatever. Just terrible.

  58. 58
    mali muso says:

    @Jeffro: Yaaaas! That makes me smile. Did you see the photo of Wexton’s office in Congress with a transgender flag outside the door? Feels good to finally be properly represented in VA-10.

  59. 59

    @Kay: But the media landscape is not a competitive market( free market in non-econspeak) at all. There has been so much consolidation that the remaining media houses act like an oligopoly. Banking sector has the same problem.

  60. 60

    @Tazj: And T is a youthful Adonis? WTF?

  61. 61
    bemused says:

    @TS (the original):

    Money trumps morals.

  62. 62
    Yarrow says:


    Trump’s singular victory is over media. He beat them- utterly and completely dominates them- and for almost 3 years, that was all he needed.

    As one of the Advice Ladies used to say, “No one can take advantage of you without your permission.” The media wasn’t conquered. They willingly went along with it. They love the drama and the ratings. They don’t even have to pay writers and they still get the drama. It’s a win for them.

  63. 63
    p.a. says:

    GOP Senate and prisoners’ dilemma. Or is other game theory more relevant?

  64. 64

    @Yarrow: They threw their panties at him, and went against HRC, hammer and tongs. They manufactured, Her Emailz…controversy.

  65. 65
    bemused says:


    I still want to know if the NYT reporter who wrote piece on FL federal prison employees asked one employee, Crystal Minton, to elaborate what she meant by “He’s (trump) not hurting the people he needs to be hurting”. We can guess who she meant but the reporter just left it right there.

  66. 66
    Yarrow says:

    @schrodingers_cat: They certainly did.

  67. 67
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @sherparick: When did NBC suits make the decision to no longer treat the news division as a separate division but as part of the entertainment division? I think it was in the era of the Huntley-Brinkley Report.

    There was quite a lot of discussion about how that change would switch the focus from news gathering and its publication to the entertainment value of its presentation.

    Would appreciate comment from those better informed (and with better memories!).

  68. 68
    Jeffro says:

    @mali muso: I didn’t see that pic, but good for her. And good for VA-10, getting rid of fake ‘moderate’ Comstock. She was just as wingnutty as the rest of the GOP House.

  69. 69
    WaterGirl says:

    @rikyrah: Terrific statement. Great speaker.

    Who was the person that chided her at the end?

  70. 70
    WaterGirl says:

    @rikyrah: Can’t tell from your mad face whether you are mad about the both sides do it bullshit from AP or are mad about the comments being made in response.

  71. 71
    Tazj says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Tapper had a picture of Pelosi and Schumer on his Twitter feed that people were mocking. This is how one other journalist responded to the criticism directed at them for their remarks on Pelosi and Schumer’s looks.
    Jeff Greenfield @greenfield64 12h
    It’s appropriate to call journalists to account for focusing on “optics” rather than substance. But considering how substance-free tonight was–from Trump and from Schumer and Pelosi–perhaps we can be forgiven for noting that the two Democratic leaders appeared to be embalmed.

  72. 72
    randal m sexton says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Worth understanding wrt the current media landscape: . It was a big deal at the time, and did many things – helped the rise of the broadband internet, and cell phone industry (good ? ) . and changed the media ownership and media concentration-of-ownership laws ( in retrospect, BAD! ). Any scheme for fixing the propaganda networks that mass media has morphed into goes thru changing this law. But its obscured as shit I guess, and so no one knows about it.

  73. 73
    Yarrow says:

    @Tazj: I saw that last night and NO it they will not be forgiven. If the media had noted they looked serious that would be acceptable. But commenting on their makeup and their age? Not forgiven. Never.

  74. 74

    @Yarrow: They will never be forgotten for what they did in 2016 and their cheerleading for W in the buildup to the Iraq War. Hell no.
    @Tazj: Jeff Greenfield can DIAF, along with Tapper and MAGA Habs

  75. 75
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @sherparick: This is why my nym.

    Wipe them out. All of them.

  76. 76
    Chris Johnson says:


    Who is going to point out the great crime behind, say, J.K. Rowling’s fortune?

    Capitalism, and the publishers. Rowling is good and super readable, especially at first, but she’s not THAT good. Not ‘billions of times more worthy than the other fantasy writers of the world’ good. The crime is the capitalist media system that seeks to find the single most marketable thing, and do a zillion units of sales on that thing. Rowling must’ve had a good lawyer to not end up with about 350,000 all told, but for whatever reason she ended up able to get a decent chunk of all that revenue being made.

    Off not-garbage, not-great, extremely marketable and capable books. In NO way does Rowling deserve to seize all the discretionary income of fantasy-readers, but because capitalism is the way it is, it looks for a winner and tries to award the entire world to that winner, and Rowling is probably THE nicest possible outcome you can get from that (as she is not an awful human, and has actually gotten some reasonable proportion of the revenue the system generated on her back).


    I feel like the connection between “what people are paid” and “what they do” has been broken so the whole premise no longer holds.

    Maybe it did hold once, a little? What I’m saying is, you’re describing capitalism (and market economics) and your observation is entirely correct. I think it’s MORE likely for the hugely wealthy to be monstrous, and this sure holds for Trump and for lots of the media people who are keeping him so important.

  77. 77
    NotMax says:


    Excepting the early morning news shows, which have always had a slant towards entertainment (J. Fred Muggs on Today during the 50s, for example), the trend for the rest of the news divisions’ output was accelerated by three things:

    Sale of each of the three major networks by the original owners or their heirs
    Founding and subsequent growth of CNN and 24/7 news broadcasting
    Demise of the Fairness Doctrine.

  78. 78
    lethargytartare says:


    Who is going to point out the great crime behind, say, J.K. Rowling’s fortune?

    I’d call Quidditch a crime against humanity, or at least sport.

  79. 79
    rikyrah says:


    Trump supporters in a nutshell. They do not care about others. Only when the policies affect them.

    — Melissa (@melissaann5761) January 9, 2019

    That is the GOP, in its entirety.

  80. 80
    rikyrah says:


    Also that Wilbur Ross has aluminum investments. The implication, I think, is that they will benefit from wall construction.

    Whole thing murky. Some input from people here would be helpful

    Wilbur Ross is a straight up crook that has been allowed to skate. Methinks that’s about to change.

  81. 81
    Uncle Cosmo says:

    @Ladyraxterinok: Dunno about NBC, but IIRC ABC went full-mental-moneygrubbers when they installed Roone Arledge (creator of Wide World of Sports) as head of the news division, & he said, in effect, Fuck the public-service loss-leader bullshit, this is gonna be a profit center!

  82. 82
    WereBear says:

    @Kay: I recommend the most recent Gaslit Nation podcast, which covers exactly this.

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