The President’s Address from the Oval Office January 8, 2019

Despite what’s been leaked and teased all afternoon, I don’t think anyone really knows what the President will or will not say in just a few minutes despite what has been fed into the teleprompters. The President’s address will be followed by an official response from Speaker Pelosi and Senate Minority Leader Schumer, the Democratic leaders in Congress.

Here’s the live stream:

Open thread!

240 replies
  1. 1
    Adam L Silverman says:

    And he’s started on time!

  2. 2
    Keith P. says:

    Does Immigration really encounter thousands of illegal immigrants every day?

  3. 3
    Corner Stone says:

    “When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.” “The question is,” said Alice, “whether you can make words mean so many different things.” “The question is,” said Humpty Dumpty, “which is to be master—that’s all.”

  4. 4
    Chris says:

    I tremble with anticipation.

  5. 5
    Anya says:

    Who is delivering the Dem response?

  6. 6
    Jackie says:

    My Fellow Americans.
    I spewed wine.

  7. 7
    Corner Stone says:

    Well, you may not be able to end it but you could sure as fuck stop making it all worse.

  8. 8
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Keith P.: Only if you really massage the data.

  9. 9
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Anya: Pelosi and Schumer.

  10. 10
    Adam L Silverman says:

    Physical barrier! Drink!

  11. 11
    Adam L Silverman says:

    Also, which Democrats asked for a steel wall instead of concrete?

  12. 12
    Corner Stone says:

    @Anya: Senator Shouty McWigglefingers is doing a separate response from Pelosi and Schumer.

  13. 13
    Yarrow says:

    Daniel Dale is live fact checking it, as usual. https://twitter.com/ddale8

  14. 14
    Emerald says:

    Does anybody believe he’ll actually stick to eight minutes? I mean, he has verbal diarrhea and he won’t be able to resist stepping on Nancy’s time. (not watching myself)

  15. 15
    Adam L Silverman says:

    The wall will not pay for itself, nor will it be paid for by the slightly revised NAFTA that hasn’t even been accepted by Mexico, Canada, or the US Congress.

  16. 16
    DanH says:

    More die from pharmaceuticals than heroin. You know, legal corporations, killing Americans. Fuck you, Trump.

  17. 17
    JWR says:

    @Keith P.:

    Does Immigration really encounter thousands of illegal immigrants every day?

    I noticed that. He couldn’t even make it through the first sentence without lying.

  18. 18
    HumboldtBlue says:

    You couldn’t pay me to watch that shit. Ya’ll are hardier than I will ever be.

  19. 19
    Adam L Silverman says:

    And there’s the blackmail demand. The government is shutdown and will stay shutdown because the Democrats will not finance border security. This is a lie.

  20. 20
    Corner Stone says:

    @HumboldtBlue:

    Ya’ll are hardier than I will ever be.

    It’s all the canned soup.

  21. 21
    Adam L Silverman says:

    Walls around people’s homes is not the same as a border wall.

  22. 22
    Carolina Dave says:

    Nice job networks allowing this partisan BS.

  23. 23
    JPL says:

    @Adam L Silverman: What about Bernie?
    I’m watching Joanne Weir making a fig and olive tapenade. It does look really good.

  24. 24
    Baud says:

    Has he even mentioned the Wall yet?

  25. 25
    Keith P. says:

    Amusing that Trump referred to methamphetamine as “meth”, particularly in light of that Apprentice producer claiming that Trump snorts speed.

  26. 26
    MomSense says:

    Wonder if his new WH doc took away his Adder all. He seems low energy tonight. Sad!

  27. 27
    Adam L Silverman says:

    And here comes the tally of all the people killed by undocumented immigrants.

  28. 28
    Baud says:

    “At the request of Democrats…”

  29. 29
    Corner Stone says:

    Jowly Fearmonger – my new slam punk cover band.

  30. 30
    MomSense says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    But the love inside is the same.

    //s

  31. 31
    Carolina Dave says:

    The new Kates. Again, great job networks

  32. 32
    Baud says:

    The Wall will make your farts smell good.

  33. 33
    Aleta says:

    He says it’s terrible that women are assaulted on the trip north; this tragedy concerns him so much that so he authorizes their mistreatment in custody?

  34. 34
    debit says:

    The response to this litany of awfulness is “If it’s so bad, why didn’t you do something two years ago?” Lamesauce.

  35. 35
    Carolina Dave says:

    So sad, so terrible. Yes that sums it up. BTW, he’s gone over his allotted time. Complete BS

  36. 36
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @JPL: He’s live streaming a response on social media.

  37. 37
    ChrisH says:

    The sniffing is driving me crazy

  38. 38
    JWR says:

    Gawd. He’s not even looking at the friggin’ camera. Probably too busy trying to follow Stephen Miller’s cue cards.

    And, it’s over.

  39. 39
    MomSense says:

    @Corner Stone:

    Oh my god. I just realized that trump’s skin looks like that orange congealed fat at the top of a can of Campbell’s chicken noodle soup.

  40. 40
    Corner Stone says:

    @JPL: I love figs and I love olive tapenade. But not sure about both together.

  41. 41
    Emerald says:

    It’s 6:12. Has he stopped yet?

  42. 42
    Adam L Silverman says:

    Another fine piece of factual inaccuracies written by Stephen Miller.

  43. 43
    DanH says:

    Death and fear mongering. Scare tactics. Be afraid, America. Fuck you, Trump.

  44. 44
    notoriousJRT says:

    Such an earnest mother fucker.

  45. 45
    steppy says:

    It’s much easier just watching his pie-hole move with the sound off and keeping track of the sniffing.

  46. 46
    donnah says:

    Yeah, he’s pulling out all the favorites…his scare tactics and threats on parade. What an ass head!

  47. 47
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Emerald: Yep. 11 minutes start to finish.

  48. 48
    plato says:

    No way watching this shitshow either. Has Kasporov been proved right?

    A few things to listen for tonight.
    1) The words "crisis," "threat," "emergency," & "enemies" without evidence or on "secret" evidence.
    2) Framing Trump's base as victims of these threats.
    3) Blaming predecessors & opponents for not dealing with the threats, or for causing them.

    — Garry Kasparov (@Kasparov63) January 8, 2019

  49. 49
    Emerald says:

    Thanks! It’s safe to go back to MSNBC.

    So glad I missed it.

  50. 50
    Steeplejack says:

    I clocked him at just under 9:30. I’ll be sending $93 to RAICES.

    And it was 9½ minutes of complete bullshit. No surprise there.

  51. 51
    plato says:

    Oh, Sarah. If only…

    Advice for networks to minimize their utility as propaganda tools:

    1) Before the speech, get a panel of experts on autocracy to explain what rhetorical devices autocrats use, so the audience will recognize them

    2) Use a time delay. Check facts and correct lies during speech.

    — Sarah Kendzior (@sarahkendzior) January 8, 2019

  52. 52
    Quinerly says:

    Did he even use the word “wall?”

  53. 53
    Emerald says:

    Oh Gawd. Schumer looks like a wax dummy.

  54. 54
    Baud says:

    The electorate of the 80s would have eaten this up.

  55. 55
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @plato: Pretty much.

  56. 56
    Steeplejack says:

    Rachel Maddow, Chris Hayes and Nicolle Wallace on MSNBC. Now throwing it to Nancy Smash! and Chuck “Good Cop” Schumer.

  57. 57
    Chris says:

    So, no new measures announced, just the usual “Messicans are scary?”

  58. 58
    Corner Stone says:

    @plato: Yes but it didn’t exactly take a Chess Grand Master to figure that formula out.

  59. 59
    sukabi says:

    @JPL: I’m watching Wild Scotland on NatGeo.

    Better to watch wildlife than crazed monsters

  60. 60
    Baud says:

    Schumer is shooting laser beams out of his eyes.

  61. 61
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Emerald: Disney forgot to reset his animatronic sequencer when they loaded his remarks for tonight.

  62. 62
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Didn’t watch, gonna be hard enough to watch the clips

    @ TheRickWilson
    4m4 minutes ago
    Totally.
    Defeated.

    TheRickWilson
    5m5 minutes ago
    This man is utterly defeated.

    ETA: there was a twitter rumor this afternoon that he wrote it himself– anybody who watched think he wrote any of it? and talk of how well he’s done defending the border and that’s why we need a wall?

  63. 63
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Quinerly: He did.

  64. 64
    debit says:

    @Steeplejack: Chuck is not being a good cop. He’s being a big meany!!

  65. 65
    Quinerly says:

    @Baud: one of those laser beams just scared Poco.

  66. 66
    Elie says:

    This was a total waste (what I saw and heard of it). This will do nothing to help him with his base or move any other needle. At least he didn’t call the state of national emergency — YET. And he better never.

    He is a stinking pile of shit but dangerous to us. We had better stay ready and sharp. His sheer ruthless atavism is hurting our democracy and its institutions. We cannot endure this forever and even as I dread it, I hope he pushes his limits to a point where we can no longer deny what needs to be done.

  67. 67
    plato says:

    Lisa Murkowski is now calling to end the shutdown: "I think we can walk and chew gum" by reopening government while continuing to debate border security.https://t.co/i7fpbY2OSu

    — Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) January 9, 2019

  68. 68
    Quinerly says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I came late. Oops.

  69. 69
    Adam L Silverman says:

    I don’t even need to look to know this is Florida!

  70. 70
    Adam L Silverman says:

    And Pelosi and Schumer are done.

  71. 71
    Baud says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    IT’S WILMER TIME!

  72. 72
    JR says:

    @Emerald: how about not going back? People can just not watch the networks that enable this nonsense

  73. 73
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Adam L Silverman: is Outback the home of the bloomin’ onion? or some manner of cheese-covered bread? Either way, I get it.

  74. 74
  75. 75
    Emerald says:

    @JR:
    I always watch Rachel and Lawrence. The rest of it, not so much.

  76. 76
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @plato: And there’s the crack in McConnell’s wall.

  77. 77
    hilts says:

    Can’t bring myself to watch CNN. Did The Gergenator aka David Gergen say that Trump acted presidential tonight?

  78. 78
    FelonyGovt says:

    So he had networks give up all this airtime for nothing. They must be pissed. But serves them right for going along with this nonsense.

  79. 79
  80. 80
    plato says:

    @Adam L Silverman: And hopefully one that would split him wide open. Literally.

  81. 81
    sukabi says:

    @Adam L Silverman: is she competing with the guy the other day who beat his father with pizza for helping deliver him when he was born?

    You seriously need to check the water down there…pretty sure there might be an abundance of lead in it.

  82. 82
    trollhattan says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    Aw dayumn. So, Applebee’s instead?

  83. 83

    @Baud: Why is he even speaking?

  84. 84
    Chris says:

    @Baud:

    And great bolts of lightning from his arse?

  85. 85
    sukabi says:

    @schrodingers_cat: because Elizabeth Warren is stealing his populous thunder.

  86. 86
    oatler. says:

    After the speech and the “rebuttal” came the sordid ABC compromise called “The Connors”.

  87. 87
    RobertDSC-Mac Mini says:

    I watched Stormy instead. Thank you all for enduring the orange atrocity.

  88. 88

    @sukabi: Has he combed his hair?

  89. 89
    Barbara says:

    @hilts: A wild storm just broke out in the DC area. I’m watching Shetland on Netflix.

  90. 90
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Woman attacks parents for not taking her to Outback

    I mean, I can see attacking them if they don’t take you to Peter Luger, but Outback? Really?

  91. 91
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Baud: Narrator: It is never Wilmer time.

  92. 92
  93. 93

    No state of emergency.

  94. 94
    randy khan says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    And there’s the crack in McConnell’s wall.

    It would be stunning if the shutdown play is what separates the Republicans in Congress from Trump.

  95. 95
    trollhattan says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    The renowned Tholian punctuality?

  96. 96
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Bloomin onion.

  97. 97
  98. 98
    Anya says:

    @Adam L Silverman: oh no. But they can’t be worse than the racist demagogue.

  99. 99
    sukabi says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Don’t know, not watching him. Had enough of shouty pointing men growing up. But since “Einstein hair” seems to be his trademark I doubt it.

  100. 100
    Baud says:

    @Anya: They weren’t exciting but they weren’t bad.

  101. 101
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @sukabi: Crystal meth and synthetic pot.

  102. 102
    Barbara says:

    @plato: Just start looking at who is up in 2020. Joni Ernst and Thom Tillis come on down!

  103. 103
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Gin & Tonic: It’s Lake Worth. Everything is relative to the human geography.

  104. 104
    dexwood says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:
    Not true. president Asshole still occupies the Whitehouse.

  105. 105
    joel hanes says:

    @JPL:

    What about Bernie?

    Not a Democrat.

  106. 106
    hilts says:

    @Elie:

    For me, Norman Ornstein nailed it when he described Trump’s administration as a kakistocracy (A system of government run by the worst, least qualified, or most unscrupulous individuals)

    Hopefully, Trump will be led out of the Oval Office in handcuffs or a straitjacket in the near future.

  107. 107
    sukabi says:

    @Adam L Silverman: that would also explain the MaraLoco resident…

  108. 108
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Adam L Silverman: A town I’m probably glad I’ve never heard of.

    ETA: Despite your edit, still a town I’ve never heard of.

  109. 109
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: At least not yet. We’ll see what happens when Pelosi parks his tuchas in the cheap seats at tomorrow’s meeting.

  110. 110
    lamh36 says:

    Surprised, surprised…the nets got played…not really…

    @ThePlumLineGS
    22m22 minutes ago
    More
    Great job, networks. You are complicit in amplifying this absurd display of destructive disinformation & demagoguery. You knew this was coming, but acquiesced because Trump spent two years trying to destroy your profession’s institutional role, perversely rewarding him for this.

    https://twitter.com/ThePlumLineGS/status/1082822587783303171

  111. 111
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Anya: You understand that Pelosi and Schumer are the two most senior Democratic officials in the US?

  112. 112
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @hilts: Norm is good people. And a good friend.

  113. 113
    lamh36 says:

    @JuddLegum
    The networks were played.

    They aired 8 minutes of newsless rhetoric, filled with obvious lies.

    The Democrats got a response but obviously were not able to correct the record in a short amount of time.

    Curious if anyone would continue to defend the decision to air this.

    1,212
    8:26 PM – Jan 8, 2019

  114. 114

    @Adam L Silverman: Yeah, that’s what Killary wants you to think.

  115. 115
    plato says:

    @lamh36: One thing I will give to the totus thug, he is master at playing the corrupt & complicit media.

  116. 116
    JWR says:

    @lamh36: Absolutely. I mean it’s not as if they could’ve recorded it for a later viewing should it prove consequential. (But then they’d have been accused of determining the “News”” ahead of time.)

  117. 117
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    It’ll be interesting to see what the ratings on this shitshow will be.

  118. 118

    @Adam L Silverman: He even got a theme song on the O’Franken Factor, “Norm in the USA”.

  119. 119
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @sukabi: That’s flaka in the water.

  120. 120
    Adam L Silverman says:

    From the very well resourced Gabriel Sherman:
    https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2019/01/trump-aides-fear-the-wall-will-be-his-alamo

    The shutdown has pushed the Russia investigation out of the news cycle. But Trumpworld knows it hasn’t gone away. Rudy Giuliani recently told a friend that he expects Mueller’s report to be “horrific,” a person briefed on the conversation said (Giuliani did not respond to a request for comment). “You’re already hearing people speculate Trump could do a deal and resign.”

  121. 121
    Peale says:

    @Adam L Silverman: were it Sizzlers, I’d kind of take her side

  122. 122
    AThornton says:

    I was expecting dumbass to throw the country into a constitutional crisis. Instead we got a Nothing Burger with stale Cheetos

  123. 123

    Come on, media! Be best.

  124. 124
  125. 125
    guachi says:

    If such a wall could be built, I’d pay for a wall to protect me from the avalanche of Trump’s lies.

  126. 126
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @plato: The Trump Doctrine!
    From something I wrote up for someone based on my posts here going back to spring 2016:

    In April 2016, then candidate for president Donald Trump gave a speech to delineate his national security and foreign policy approach. The meandering remarks touched on a number of his long standing national security and foreign policy beliefs: America’s allies are taking advantage of our treaty and other obligations in the national security space; America’s allies and peer competitors are ripping the US off through our trade agreements; the US should go it alone if it can’t renegotiate better deals; and only a President Trump could guarantee that the US would be treated fairly – or else. That only a President Trump could guarantee that the US would be treated fairly, whether in national security arrangements or global trade, was simply an extension of one of the major, if not the major themes of his campaign: Donald Trump would be treated fairly or else and only Donald Trump could guarantee that Americans, especially the forgotten men and women, as he phrased it, would be treated fairly or else.

    That the US will be treated fairly or else, and that only a President Trump could guarantee that happening as the central, unifying theme of his national security and foreign policy approach was actually a stroke of strategic communication genius. A significant amount of the President’s initial strategic communication approach was through tying his primary opponents, the Republican National Committee, and the broadcast and cable news networks in knots about treating him fairly. This included trying to get Megyn Kelly removed from debate moderation after he felt she treated him badly, as well as actually dropping out of a GOP primary debate on Fox News and holding a competing charity event for veterans because he did not like that Fox wouldn’t comply with his demand. And if others failed to treat him in the manner he felt he deserved, he’d deal with them harshly. Then candidate Trump threatened his fellow primary opponents and the RNC by making it clear that if he didn’t feel he was being treated fairly by them, then the “or else” would be his running as an independent candidate. This would then split the Republican vote for president, which would hand the election to the then presumed Democratic front runner, Hillary Clinton. By making this the dominant theme of his national security and foreign policy approach, he was able to make a singular through line for his campaign – I, Donald Trump, will be treated fairly or else by the GOP, the RNC, and the news media; only I, Donald Trump, can guarantee that you, the forgotten men and women of America, are treated fairly in regards to domestic politics and policy; and only I, Donald Trump, can guarantee that the US will be treated fairly, or else there will be serious and severe repercussions for the GOP, the RNC, the news media, elected and appointed officials, and America’s allies, partners, and peer competitors. Here was the simple through line to connect Make America Great Again both domestically and internationally by placing America first. It is also the essence of the real Trump Doctrine: President Trump and, by extension, the forgotten men and women of America, as well as America itself, will be treated fairly or else.

  127. 127
    Baud says:

    Ted Lieu

    @tedlieu

    ·

    10m

    I smile every time I think of how Democrats crushed Republicans last November and obliterated the xenophobic dreams of Stephen Miller.

  128. 128
    Timurid says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    And the Village will praise Trump as a hero for not doing it.

  129. 129
    Ohio Mom says:

    @AThornton: Thank god for small favors.

  130. 130
    Adam L Silverman says:

  131. 131
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    I’m guessing that enough people told him that it would be an empty gesture that he changed his mind. Narcissists hate looking weak in front of other people, so telling him that it would get immediately vacated and ignored would be enough for him to tell Miller to re-write the speech. He didn’t want his big emergency declaration to be a public fiasco like the visa fight has been.

  132. 132
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Minnesota to be precise.

  133. 133
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Peale: Given Florida, could’ve been Golden Corral.

  134. 134
    Vince says:

    Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
    With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
    Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
    A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
    Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
    MOTHER OF EXILES. From her beacon-hand
    Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
    The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.

    “Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
    With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
    Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
    The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
    Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
    I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

  135. 135
    chopper says:

    @AThornton:

    we’re already in a constitutional crisis. second act is just starting.

  136. 136
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: the O’Franken Factor, “Norm in the USA”.

    I wonder if Franken will wind up podcasting

  137. 137
    Ken says:

    @FelonyGovt:

    So he had networks give up all this airtime for nothing. They must be pissed.

    Like the time they all showed up at a campaign event and he tried to sell them Trump steaks. Or the time they showed up for an announcement and he tried to take them on a publicity tour of one of his buildings. Or the time….

    You know, the news organizations should start making a list. Maybe when it gets tlong enough, they’ll remember the old saying “fool me ten twenty fifty a ridiculously large number of times, shame on you…”

  138. 138
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Adam L Silverman: The looks on Schumer’s and Pelosi’s faces remind me of parents who waited up after you missed your curfew and are starting off with the old line, “We are very, very disappointed in you…”

  139. 139
    lamh36 says:

    I see folks like Tapper tweeting snarky pics of the Dem response.

    Not surprising…they’d rather focus on that rather than his net and the others being playing by Chump

  140. 140
    The Dangerman says:

    Which happens first, Government fully reopens or Muellermas?

    I’m not hearing an out for Trump in the highlights (lowlights? lowlife?) and the Democrats seem firm on fuck you and the horse you rode in on.

    I thought Trump would man up and declare an emergency but … gutless.

  141. 141
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @chopper: Been in one since his hand came off the bible at the inauguration. By taking the oath, he violated the oath.

  142. 142
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Adam L Silverman: You know him?? I am so jealous!!!!!! WTF is he doing at AIE???

  143. 143

    @Mnemosyne: That could be. I’m also getting some responses to that on Twitter to the effect that he balked. He is a coward, and perhaps he just couldn’t stand up to his own big talk.

  144. 144
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    CNN Newsroom @ CNNnewsroom
    “Jared Kushner, I am told by a source familiar with the matter. is making the case that after the President’s speech tonight, and after he goes to the border on Thursday, public support will grow towards the Republican side,” reports @ mkraju

    best advice Jared has given Dad since “Fire Comey. The Dems will love it and you’ll have heard the last of this trump/Russher stuff”. You can see why The Beast keeps him around.

  145. 145
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    I saw someone on Twitter say they looked like parents who just caught their teenager breaking into the liquor cabinet. 😂

  146. 146
    gwangung says:

    @Mnemosyne: Heh. And apparently he looked liked deflated, wilted lettuce tonight.

    That’s not the look of strength, either.

  147. 147
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Ohio Mom: Tomorrow they’re going to ground him and send him to the residence with no scoops of ice cream and no McDonald’s hot apple pies!

  148. 148
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: I wonder if McConnell, or someone, told him, you do that and you’re on your own. He does have a survival instinct, and even he must see that McConnell is propping him up at this point

  149. 149
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    He would have had to stand up and take responsibility for his actions. That’s why he punked out.

    @gwangung:

    Yes, but in his tiny narcissist’s mind, he stood firm against his enemies, therefore WINNING!

  150. 150
    oatler. says:

    @Vince: WE’LL HAVE NO IAMBIC PENTAMETER AROUND HERE!

  151. 151
    Adam L Silverman says:

  152. 152
    lamh36 says:

    Nah my dude…it’s just easier for the nets to focus on that rather than the fact that they got played AGAIN by Chump co.

    @greenfield64
    It’s appropriate to call journalists to account for focusing on “optics” rather than substance. But considering how substance-free tonight was–from Trump and from Schumer and Pelosi–perhaps we can be forgiven for noting that the two Democratic leaders appeared to be embalmed.

    779
    8:24 PM – Jan 8, 2019
    https://twitter.com/greenfield64/status/1082825496054747137

  153. 153
    Fair Economist says:

    I wasn’t watching. Have we always been at war with Eastasia yet?

  154. 154
    Adam L Silverman says:

  155. 155
    sukabi says:

    @guachi: no need. The appropriate walls are already built. We’ve just got to get drumpf and crew behind them.

  156. 156
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Mnemosyne: Yes, it could be that too. Whatever the triggering event was, the siblings are watching from another room with their mouths wide open.

  157. 157
    gwangung says:

    @Mnemosyne: True. But I think the growing volume of laughter at his antics is gonna deflate his core. They’ll never turn on him, but the mocking (and not anger, either) will deflate them.

  158. 158
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @CliosFanBoy: They pay him to study Congress. That’s what he’s doing there.

  159. 159
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    if trump has lost WEST By God Virginia…

    atherine Miller @ katherinemiller
    “Senator Shelley Moore Capito of West Virginia, who is chairwoman of the Appropriations subcommittee on homeland security, expressed frustration with the shutdown and ‘how useless it is’

  160. 160

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Jared Kushner, I am told by a source familiar with the matter. is making the case that after the President’s speech tonight, and after he goes to the border on Thursday, public support will grow towards the Republican side

    Yep. Kushner is exactly that stupid.

  161. 161
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I know that, but given AEI I am surprised he would fit there. He’s so reasonable!!!!

  162. 162
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @oatler.:

  163. 163
    lamh36 says:

    it’s much easier on their egos for the nets to focus on the optics rather than the fact that they got played by Chump Co AGAIN! Let’s not let them get away with it! Keep the focus on keeping their feet to the fire for allowing this bullshit free propraganda on the air

  164. 164
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @CliosFanBoy: It grew out of a project he and Thomas Mann started early in their careers when they were university professors dealing with freshman members of Congress. AEI and Brookings sponsored it. Eventually he went to AEI and Mann went to Brookings full time.

  165. 165
    Punchy says:

    @Baud: WTF does Lieu have against Steve Miller? The Joker was a classic, and everyone knows the words to Fly Like an Eagle. Abracadabra was a bit kitchy, but still pretty solid. Bad take by Theodore.

  166. 166
    sukabi says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Who said Jared was the smart one of the bunch?

  167. 167
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    my god, the bats in his belfry have split into factions and are going to war!

    Michael Tackett @ tackettdc
    NEWS HERE. Trump privately “dismissed his own new strategy as pointless.” Told TV anchors before at an off-the-record lunch he wasn’t include [ed, inclined, cause I’m wrapped a little tight] to do the speech or go to Texas, but his advisers talked him into it

    and as Lawrence O’Donnell is pointing out right now, trump/pence 2020 sent out a fund-raising blast email, to the networks were now that much more complicit in a campaign stunt

  168. 168
    lamh36 says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Was just reading Maggie’s stenograpy…

    Oh please..c’mon now Maggie…

    “Yet privately, Mr. Trump dismissed his own new strategy as pointless.”

    https://twitter.com/psddluva4evah/status/1082836933020135424

  169. 169
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @sukabi: future Republican primary candidate Nikki Haley, among others. I think she called him “quietly brilliant”, or some such?

  170. 170
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    with no scoops of ice cream and no McDonald’s hot apple pies!

    Those things are pretty good. That’s cruel and unusual punishment, Adam. But it’s Trumpie getting punished in this joke, so yay!

  171. 171
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Adam L Silverman: used to enjoy him on Al Frankin’s old radio show.

  172. 172

    @Adam L Silverman: Unfair comparison. The GOPs been honing their game for 40-50 years since then.

  173. 173
    gwangung says:

    @sukabi: Not seeing any evidence contradicting that, though.

  174. 174

    @sukabi: Here’s the big problem, Jared is the smart one.

  175. 175
    lamh36 says:

    Wait..is this more than just the redacted stuff from earlier?

    @RVAwonk
    Following Following @RVAwonk
    More
    NEW: Both Paul Manafort & Rick Gates sent polling data to Russian operative Konstantin Kilimnik in the Spring of 2016, as Trump clinched the nomination. Manafort then asked Gates to tell Kilimnik to pass the data to Russian oligarch Oleg Deripaska.
    https://twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/1082833542105780230

  176. 176
    sukabi says:

    @gwangung: this is true. But damn! They’re giving the 10 toothers competition.

  177. 177
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @lamh36: as I understand it, the evidence is now there not just from Manafort to Kilimik, but now on to Deripaska. Which was always obvious, but the trick now as it always has been, is to get enough evidence that Lindsey and Susan et al have to stop pretending they don’t see it.

  178. 178
    Jeffro says:

    Steve Schmidt brought the bats just now on MSNBC…the bats and the cliches and the hyperbole and damn…

    He thinks GOP officials will be breaking any day/hour/minute now. I guess we’ll see…

  179. 179
    sukabi says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: To which I’d politely suggest that Ms. Haley ain’t all that bright either.

  180. 180

    @sukabi:

    Who said Jared was the smart one of the bunch?

    Jared.

  181. 181
    Mnemosyne says:

    @sukabi:

    I’m going to terrify you for a moment: Jared probably IS the smartest of his advisors.

    The horror … the horror …

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    That’s the narcissist talking again. Any plan of the narcissist’s that doesn’t go well was someone else’s fault the whole time. Everything is ALWAYS someone else’s fault and the narcissist is blameless.

    One of the insane narcissist stories that sticks out from my time lurking on the Raised By Narcissists message board on Reddit was the woman whose narcissist father got drunk at her wedding, drove his car into a stone fence at the venue, and refused to pay for the damage because he absolutely insisted that the bride had done it herself and he would. not. back. down. She was seriously contemplating paying the bill herself just to get him to shut the fuck up and stop calling her and screaming at her. Because that’s what narcissists do: they push their version of reality on other people until the other people finally give in because they can’t take the abuse anymore.

    IMO, the problem in this situation is that Stephen Miller digs the abuse. He enjoys being reviled. So he’s going to keep pushing his racist positions because he enjoys it when Trump abuses him AND he enjoys that liberals hate him. It’s win/win all around as far as he’s concerned.

  182. 182
    The Dangerman says:

    @Jeffro:

    He thinks GOP officials will be breaking any day/hour/minute now.

    Doesn’t matter unless McConnell folds.

  183. 183
    Aleta says:

    https://twitter.com/JoyAnnReid/status/1082829641906311172

    That money is going to disappear into financing Kushner-owned housing for wall workers or asylum-seeker-patrols or something like that.

  184. 184
    randy khan says:

    @The Dangerman:

    McConnell will fold if the votes aren’t there for him. He will throw some fig leaf into the bills to create cover, they’ll pass with 90+ votes and someone will explain to Trump that a veto is a bad idea. It’s not like this is a matter of principle for him or anything.

  185. 185
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: he thinks those “He went to Jared!” ads are about him…

  186. 186
    Steeplejack says:

    @debit:

    He was doing the (relative) “good cop” thing of “You don’t want me to go get a cup of coffee and leave you alone in here with her, do you?”

  187. 187
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Mnemosyne: IMO, the problem in this situation is that Stephen Miller digs the abuse. He enjoys being reviled. So he’s going to keep pushing his racist positions because he enjoys it when Trump abuses him AND he enjoys that liberals hate him. It’s win/win all around as far as he’s concerned.

    Can we start a Go Fund Me to hire a full time Dominatrix? I’d chip in if it’d get him away from policy-making.

  188. 188
    debbie says:

    Based on what I’m reading on Twitter, if this doesn’t get his ratings below 40, nothing will.

  189. 189
    Steeplejack says:

    @Steeplejack:

    Just did my donation to RAICES: $95, not $93. Math is hard. Procedure quick and painless.

  190. 190
    hilts says:

    @lamh36:

    FUCK Jeff Greenfield and FUCK Jake Tapper. Trump’s administration is a crime against reason, truth, and rationality and these assholes are obsessed with optics and other trivial bullshit.

    Jared Kushner is dumber than a horse’s ass and I look forward to his indictment.

  191. 191
    joel hanes says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    enough evidence that Lindsey and Susan et al have to stop pretending they don’t see it

    Gonna be ugly.
    Loss-aversion has led them to hold the line for far too long,
    so the walkback will be painful.
    “For over two years, I supported and resolutely defended a vulgar, lying, disloyal, bigoted, criminal, unbalanced demagogue, and protected him while he attempted to loot the US, evade the law, and trade US policy for favor from Vladimir Putin”

  192. 192
    hilts says:

    @sukabi:

    Jared Kushner is so fucking dumb he wouldn’t know how to pour piss out of a boot if the instructions were printed on the heel.

  193. 193
    Ken says:

    @AThornton:

    Instead we got a Nothing Burger with stale Cheetos

    Now we all know how Stormy Daniels felt.

  194. 194
    hilts says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: @lamh36:

    Trump is a criminal waste of protoplasm and hopefully Mueller’s investigation will yield enough evidence for his administration to be swept into the trash bin of history or flushed down the toilet of history.

  195. 195
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Josh Marshall @ joshtpm
    I think the full meaning and impact of the Times revelation about that polling data hasn’t sunk in yet. Trump’s campaign manager was secretly sharing confidential campaign polling data with oligarch closely tied to Vladimir Putin. Probably bigger than Trump Tower meeting.
    Another point in the Times article. “Both Mr. Manafort and Rick Gates, the deputy campaign manager, transferred the data to Mr. Kilimnik in the spring of 2016…” This suggests **multiple and on-going** transfers of data.

  196. 196
    HumboldtBlue says:

    @sukabi:

    Better to watch wildlife than crazed monsters

    You’ll enjoy this fellow foraging along the shore for dinner.

  197. 197
    sukabi says:

    @hilts: I wonder if those 2 were on that email chain with Glenn Greenwald that was coordinating an effort to kill Eichenwald’s trump/russia story prior to the 2016 election.

  198. 198
    sukabi says:

    @Ken: no, she saw him nekkid.

  199. 199
  200. 200
    Ruckus says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Golden Corral

    I had finally gotten that shithole of a restaurant out of my memory. And you had to bring it up. For those of you without the displeasure of ever eating at one, Sizzler is better. And yes I understand that is at best, faint praise.

  201. 201
    Anya says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I do. I know who they are. I was just thinking that they’ll have someone respond to Trump, like SOTU.

  202. 202
    Ruckus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:
    Who’s the EVIL one?
    I mean the evil puppet master. It ain’t shitgibbon.

  203. 203
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Anya: the tandem response wouldn’t have been my first choice, but I can’t really think of anyone else who would have been an obvious choice, especially with fifty-seven potential presidential candidates on the lookout for someone being “anointed”

  204. 204
    Mary G says:

    I didn’t watch any of it, but this is a great response:

    What the President didn't talk about tonight. pic.twitter.com/dskGnfd8tl— Amy Klobuchar (@amyklobuchar) January 9, 2019

    I like her, the little I’ve seen – she looked at Kavanaugh like he was gum under her shoe when he was trying to intimidate her, and this is wonderful. Just “cut the bullshit” in nicer words.

  205. 205

    They had Holiday decorations that hadn’t sold on sale at Home Depot for 75% off, I picked up a Bluetooth enabled laser light show projector. You control it with an app on your phone. It has light shows for all the holidays.

  206. 206
  207. 207
  208. 208
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Anya: Pelosi and Schumer did respond. Their remarks didn’t quite sync with Trump’s since they didn’t know what he would say, but they were pretty close.

    I got the feeling they were prepared for the version of Trump that shouts at rallies and that they wanted to be solemn and dignified in contrast. Trump did his best impression of a reasonable person, so maybe Pelosi and Schumer came off a little stiff. But Schumer laid on the inspirational rhetoric at the end, if anyone watched that far into it.

    I can’t be objective about these things. I can’t imagine what it’s like to believe Trump or not go gaga over Pelosi.

  209. 209
    Ruckus says:

    @CliosFanBoy:
    I’m sure we’d be willing to provide one for him at this place in CO that is easy to check into but difficult to check out of. It’s part of a chain, this one is called SuperMax.

  210. 210
    Yarrow says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Just wait until the story begins to involve the Mercers and Erik Prince. That’ll be fun.

    I didn’t watch Trump because I avoid him. I did watch Chuck and Nancy’s response. I thought they did a good job. They did look like parents who are Very Disappointed In You, but that’s actually not a bad look for this situation. I liked what they said.

  211. 211
    Ruckus says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:
    I didn’t mean his boss, more like his minder then. Babysitter if you prefer.

  212. 212
    Ohio Mom says:

    This is off-topic, irrelevant and catty, but I couldn’t help but notice Trump had his hair extra fluffed up tonight.

  213. 213
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    good lord, MSNBC is dragging Carville out of whatever box Matalin keeps him in again? last seen sneering that there was no blue wave? the man’s last achievement was in 1992, fercrissake.

  214. 214
    chopper says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    all the holidays? even El Malagueña?

  215. 215
    Anya says:

    @Ohio Mom: I love Nancy Smash. I was not insulting her in any way. I just thought maybe give it to Rep Ayana Pressley or maybe Ilhan Omar who was a refugee.

  216. 216
    goblue72 says:

    @Anya: Most definitely would have preferred to hear from someone like Rep. Pressley. As the Fab 4 (Pressley, Omar, Tlaib, & AOC) have said…”We did not come here to play.”

    https://www.boston.com/news/politics/2019/01/08/ayanna-pressley-trump-government-shutdown

  217. 217
    Yarrow says:

    @Anya: This wasn’t a standard SOTU response. I think they wanted to have the senior most Democrats in Congress give the response jointly to emphasize that Congress is a co-equal branch of government.

  218. 218
    Quinerly says:

    Watching John Brennan on MSNBC.
    Never thought I would be in love with an old spook.😈 Plus, gorgeous tie, great knot.
    Seriously, he truly hates Trump, knows shit, he can’t share that shit at this point.
    This is the stuff that gives me comfort.

  219. 219
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Ohio Mom: Self defense mechanism like a puffer fish. Poofs up to make him look larger and intimidating to dissuade predators. This is also the reason for the bright orange colors.

  220. 220
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @goblue72: Just to dance. Like Kevin Bacon…

  221. 221
    chopper says:

    @Yarrow:

    exactly. this isn’t a SOTU here, the government is shut down. shit is too real to hand it over to some up-and-comer.

  222. 222
    elm says:

    How does McConnell walk this one back? His only political skill this far has been to br huge, obstructive asshole.

    Up until a couple of weeks ago, he could count on the House Freedom Caucus to be bigger jackasses and dodge blame, but now the Senate has been in session for 2 days and I don’t think he has much room to maneuver left.

  223. 223
    Quinerly says:

    @Ohio Mom: I caught that too. It was aeorated.

  224. 224
  225. 225
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @elm: How does McConnell walk this one back? His only political skill this far has been to br huge, obstructive asshole.

    McConnell doesn’t want or give a shit about Wall. He wants to hold the Senate for the sake of the courts, whatever happens in 2020, and toadying to trump on this isn’t going to help with that goal, and might hurt. I think we’re at half a dozen R Senators who have tip-toed out of line (Gardner, Collins, Alexander, Murkowski, Capito and Tillis). Poltico reported last night at least 25 R-MoCs are ready to jump ship. If Romney’s not a moron, he’ll play Senator Big Boy in the next two days, the never trumpers and ‘radical centrists’ can say this is the man who might have been President! and Mitch can pretend it’s out of his control.

  226. 226
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    If Romney’s not a moron

    That’s just crazy talk!

  227. 227
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Anya: Oh, I get what you mean. I think our side will (and should) give the new Congreswomen platforms. It’s a point of pride that our party’s elected officials reflect the country’s diversity. And we want to help them develop as stateswomen.

    But for the demographics of the group most likely to have watched tonight’s speeches, I think it was wise to have the two senior members, with all the gravitas they bring. The subtext of them standing there like parents, ready to bring order, will work on a lot of people, even as I found it sort of silly.

  228. 228

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Maybe “Multicolor” would be appropriate.

  229. 229
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: @chopper: Dia de los Muerta? Yom Kippur? Vesak? Diwali?

  230. 230
    chopper says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:

    ”it’s for spanish jews”.

  231. 231
    Emma says:

    @Anya: It would have set off all kinds of flares in several groups, not all Republicans. And the discussion in the corporate press would have been about their “presidentiality.” This needed a clear visual shout of equality between the branches of government.

  232. 232
    Homer says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    “Also, which Democrats asked for a steel wall instead of concrete?”

    My feeling is that one of his advisors said something like “in order to get the Democrats to agree to fund the wall, you are going to have to give up something concrete” and this is how his brain processed it.

  233. 233
    VOR says:

    @Ohio Mom: the vibe I got was that Chuck and Nancy are so tired of Trump’s bs. They seem to be having trouble holding in their contempt.

  234. 234
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Homer: Most likely.

  235. 235
    Yarrow says:

    @VOR: I can’t even imagine what it must be like to actually have to deal with him.

  236. 236
  237. 237
    jl says:

    Guess I didn’t miss much. Glad Trump didn’t try to pull the national emergency stunt. That might have brought this Trump presidency farce to a crisis and if we lucked out, might get him out of there sooner rather than later. But maybe it might not, so better that, so far, he is not going to take the country there.

    Media needs to start treating Wall like he complete fraud that it is. Has there been mention in the media that one of the negotiating sessions broke down because the WH didn’t even have a plan written down on paper for what they would do with the $5 billion plus change? So the Trump Wall ‘plan’ is worse than the underpants gnome game. It is
    Trump wants Wall
    Trump gets $5.7 billion
    ????
    That that’s it, folks!

  238. 238
    Ruckus says:

    @jl:
    Trump wants Wall
    Trump gets $5.7 billion
    ????
    That that’s it, folks!

    By George I think he’s got it!
    Yes, that really is all there is to it. It’s his same bullshit but on the largest scale he’s ever tried. He thinks he’s king, and not in the way of any current kings, the old ones who could screw any one they wanted, physically – politically – financially, who owned everything they wanted – including the people, and who everyone obeyed or was beheaded.

  239. 239
    Frankensteinbeck says:

    @Ruckus:
    And as it always comes down to: All narcissists think they’re kings, and their lives are a never ending cascade of acting out because they’re miserable they don’t always get their way 100%. Note similarity to the conservative base. They deliberately elected a giant version of themselves to show everyone who is boss.

  240. 240

    @sukabi: If only the hair made you into an Einstein!

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