Saturday Evening Open Thread: THANKS, Repubs!

You knew he was a snake — he said so himself, many times! — but I guess it seemed like a good idea at the time…

159 replies
  1. 1
    Mnemosyne says:

    Argh. I was shopping at Target and managed to lose the glasses case with both my sunglasses AND my reading glasses. Now I only have my distance glasses. This sucks.

    They didn’t have the case at the service desk, so I’m going to call them after dinner and see if they got turned in after a shift change.

    Anyone who found them and decided to keep them for themselves is going to be in for a big surprise, because I have 20/200 vision (-6 in one eye and -8 in the other). Good luck with that, potential jackass!

  2. 2

    Rs are in power. They need to govern or resign if they can’t or won’t govern.

  3. 3
  4. 4
    Plato says:

    Pelosi writes to her colleagues: "Until President Trump can publicly commit to a bipartisan resolution, there will be no agreement before January when the new House Democratic Majority will swiftly pass legislation to re-open government."

    — Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 22, 2018

    Chuck Schumer: "It will never pass the Senate. Not today. Not next week. Not next year. So, Mr. President … if you want to open the government, you must abandon the wall, plain and simple." Via ABC.

    — Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 22, 2018

    Corner the creepy coward.

  5. 5
    Mnemosyne says:


    She’s home, and she starts her physical and speech therapy tomorrow. Luckily, it was a mild stroke, but she’s still going to need a lot of therapy to overcome the afteraffects.

    The doctor had a very stern talk with her and explained that if she keeps smoking, she will die, so hopefully that will have an effect and she won’t backslide again like she did after her heart surgery.

    We love her but damn do we get frustrated with her stubbornness sometimes. 😤

  6. 6
    craigie says:

    I think we are in Wag the Dog territory now. Look for an invasion of Canada, Mexico, or Alaska in the next week or so.

  7. 7
    Mike in NC says:

    Two years ago Lyndsey Graham predicted Trump could destroy the GOP. Mission (Almost) Accomplished!

    Imagine Fat Bastard’s state of mind two or three months from now, where the House is investigating him every time he farts.

  8. 8
    Punchy says:

    I too dont see how this ends. Past presidents have actually given a shit about how much pain and bad optics a shutdown brings. This one only cares that he “wins”. With the Dems steadfast in not providing a $5 billion check that will largely end up in Trumps bank account, this could go on for a LOOOOOOOONG time (3+ months?)….

  9. 9
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Mike in NC:

    TFW you’re under oath in front of a Congressional committee and have to answer the question “Who farted?”

  10. 10
  11. 11
    mrmoshpotato says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Republicans governing! *falls off couch* Stop stop! I’m going to pull my spleen from laughing.

    They didn’t become the ‘steal everything not nailed down’ party when the dotard slithered down the escalator. :)

  12. 12
    Jay says:

    Read a tweet earlier today,

    Only 1:85 of Trumpentariate supporters actually believed Wall would be built and was a “real” promise.

    The Insane Clown POSus and the ReThug’s arn’t being held hostage by the Trumpentariate,

    They are being held hostage by Faux “News”.

  13. 13
    Ohio Mom says:

    I don’t know what he thinks it accomplishes, but my far-right Congressional Rep sent out two (!) emails today, one about 11 am and one a few minutes ago, each explaining how essential border security is.

    What does he think his constituents in southwest Ohio can do about this? We are already represented by a tea-partier, we know he’s for the wall.

  14. 14
    NotMax says:

    Separation of powers.

    Was nice while it lasted.

  15. 15


    This one only cares that he “wins”.

    But ‘wins’ is not as straightforward as it seems, with Trump. He’s totally external. It hurts him when he’s publicly shamed, hurts him in a way we can’t really imagine. If he gets enough flak on the news, he’s not winning. And he’s a lazy coward. Holy shit, is he a lazy coward. I don’t quite know what to expect.

  16. 16
    Patricia Kayden says:

    I really hope that Schumer doesn’t cave in to this blatant blackmail. Call Trump’s bluff. He owns this shutdown.

  17. 17
    debbie says:


    I’ve been wondering whether Trump will ever turn against Fox.

  18. 18

    I’ve been wondering whether Trump will ever turn against Fox.

    He is 100% transactional. He has no loyalty. The moment he thinks Fox has turned against him, he will turn against them. But… come on, when will THAT happen?

  19. 19
    JPL says:

    Mnuchin tweeted that although the president didn’t agree with the rate hikes, he has no plans to fire Powell. hahaha.. That statement surely will calm the markets.

  20. 20
    JPL says:

    @Patricia Kayden: If trump wins, he now realizes that all he has to do is shut down the government to get his way. You don’t reward bad behavior.

  21. 21
    jl says:

    Hope it’s not inappropriate to ask a facty type question. But I am curious, and our worthless corporate media is turning the whole business into a donkey and elephant kicking each other. Can’t get any useful information out of them. Note even, what I think is the important detail that the whole idea of Wall spanning the whole southern US border started out as a Trump campaign stunt to get more noise out of his precious goofball and hate speech rallies.

    But anyway, does anyone know if Wall got even 50 GOP votes out of the Senate? I suppose it will in the new Congress, so the question is just out of historical (that came out as hysterical at first, but I changed it), interest now.

  22. 22
    Spanky says:

    Well, if your goal in life is to shrink government until it can be drowned in a bathtub, and you see that by leaving Federal workers hanging without pay, they by necessity take other jobs and drain the institutional knowledge, I think you could make a case that you were successful in actually drowning it.

    Not that this is Trump’s goal or plan (as though he had any), but Republicans in Congress might decide that there are advantages to letting him keep the govt shut for weeks or months. Plus, he collects all the blame.

  23. 23
    Juju says:

    @Mnemosyne: Before I had LASIK I was -8:50 in my right eye and -8:95 in my left eye. Now when I lose or break, run over or have a dog run off with my readers, I just get a new pair. All those things have actually happened. Also, I love to be able to read my alarm clock without putting my glasses on. I feel for you. It’s tough to misplace your glasses. I hope you find them.

  24. 24


    does anyone know if Wall got even 50 GOP votes out of the Senate?

    47-47 with Pence breaking the tie on the vote to debate, McConnell didn’t even bother with a cloture vote.

  25. 25
    Mnemosyne says:


    And the problem with publicly shaming a narcissist is that they are incapable of doing what a normal person does and adjusting their behavior to avoid being shamed again. Instead, they lash out and try to get revenge for being shamed, because their feelings of shame must be the other person’s fault.

  26. 26
    Mnemosyne says:


    Yeah, I’ve been thinking about it for a few years, so this may finally be the year I get LASIK. My one fear is that the reading glasses I get now don’t seem to allow me to focus as closely as I can with no glasses on, so I worry about losing that ability to look at something very close up without needing a magnifying glass. But I suppose that’s a fairly minor issue compared to being able to see most things clearly most of the time.

  27. 27
    Jay says:


    The interesting point is that The Insane Clown POSus and the ReThugs are “being held hostage” by their own Propaganda Arm,

    And their own Lugenpresse believes their own propaganda, hook line and sinker,

    Even though the Trumpetariate knows it’s all just BS to pwn the libs.

  28. 28
    jl says:

    Heard a news report that another DoD official resigned in protest of Trump Syrian withdrawal. I forget the guy’s name.
    Might be topic for a post from AS or CR.
    While I approve of general direction of Trump’s withdrawal orders, the why and how it’s done are both important. As I noted, you can agree with your toddler that there is a problem with furnace, but still disagree with the toddlers idea of blowing up the furnace because that would be fun way to fix it. Despite professed puzzlement from savvy millionaire corporate news actor frauds, there is no contradiction.

    We know the why of the Syrian withdrawal is sketchy, Erdogan called up Trump and demanded he do it, and bribed or threatened him.
    I’d be interested to know whether the ‘how’ of Trump’s Syrian and Afghanistan orders are FUBAR, and if so, how FUBAR”d.
    I expect the military and the corrupt war hawks in the media to protest any withdrawal from anyplace, so I don’t put much stock in what they say.
    Would be interested in a more objective analysis.

  29. 29
    Yarrow says:

    @Ohio Mom: It’s so weird that your Rep in Ohio is so concerned about border security, when people in states along the Mexican border just aren’t that concerned.

  30. 30


    blowing up the furnace because that would be fun way to fix it.

    I fail to see a problem with this.

  31. 31
    Juju says:

    I had that fear as well. I solved that by having readers that I read and do most close up work with, and really strong, thread the needle readers that I use for detailed tiny work. It’s a bit annoying, but you learn to cope. I really enjoy my better than perfect distance eyesight now. I can see where the hummingbirds land in trees and driving at night is so much better than it was before my LASIK, and holy cow, I have no trouble with street address signs. It was one of the best things I have ever done.

  32. 32
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    So Melania flew to Mar-a-Lago yesterday at dog-knows-how-much cost to the American taxpayer, but tonight she’s flying back to D.C. at dog-knows-how-much cost to the American taxpayer so she and her loving, faithful husband can spend Christmas together as a family. Like, yesterday, when just about everybody else on the planet knew a shutdown was looming, she couldn’t have delayed her flight for a few hours until there was a resolution one way or the other? I hate these people.

  33. 33
    Juju says:

    @Mnemosyne: oops. Forgot the reply part.

  34. 34
    Yarrow says:

    @Mnemosyne: Along those lines:

    If you want to win the entire pot and take all the chips in a battle with a narc, you’ll die of old age before they concede.

    If you take a win; give them a means of claiming it wasn’t a loss; and move on… you’ll make gains while staying sane and living to fight another day.
    — The Hoarse Whisperer (@HoarseWisperer) December 21, 2018

  35. 35
    jl says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: ” I fail to see a problem with this. ”

    OK, you damned kids out there in the BJ commentariate, let this be warning to all of you about the dangers of formal training in economics.
    You can see what it does to the mind.

  36. 36
    mapaghimagsik says:

    I’ve been reading editorials regarding “dramatic action” in Sacramento regarding California’s favorite utility. I wish I had more faith in dramatic action, but then I read the comment sections and realize the PUC is probably just as smart. I know what I’d do, but I might be just as dumb.

  37. 37
    Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho says:

    @Mnemosyne: Glad to hear your mom’s doing better. The stubborn part is hard. You’re in my thoughts

  38. 38


    And the problem with publicly shaming a narcissist is that they are incapable of doing what a normal person does and adjusting their behavior to avoid being shamed again.

    Not exactly. How much willpower and bravery they have comes into play here. They are capable of cut-and-running. When they lose, they tend to hide. The thing is, that requires them to know they’ve lost, so it’s usually after the ‘screaming fit’ phase. What is much, much harder to get them to do than any regular person is admit they’re wrong. McConnell and Ryan have maneuvered Trump into a ‘rock and a hard place’ position where he has to publicly say ‘uncle’ and not just quietly sign a bill and pretend nothing happened. That is the hardest thing to get him to do. At the same time, he’s in agony as he is constantly yelled at and treated with contempt and stewing in anger at not getting his way and seeing himself discussed on the news as a fool doing a stupid thing politically. It’s an enormous pressure to do the thing he least wants to do, and it doesn’t stop, only increases.

  39. 39
    Amir Khalid says:

    Corruption. Cruelty. Ignorance. Incompetence. Recklessness. There’s a hard core that won’t be dissuaded from supporting Trump by any amount of these core attributes of his, and there are those who profit by him. But I take heart from knowing they are outnumbered by sane people who will defeat him, and who now have a Democratic House on their side.

    In sports news, Malaysian owned Cardiff City FC were thrashed 1-5 at home by a Manchester United whose manager is on loan from his club in Norway. It’s United’s first five-goal haul since Sir Alex Ferguson’s last match in charge, and goes to show just how bad Jose Mourinho’s effect on the team was. .

  40. 40
    Jay says:


    Brett McGurk, the U.S. envoy to the coalition fighting the Islamic State, has announced his resignation, reportedly in protest of President Trump’s decision this week to withdraw all U.S. forces from Syria.

    McGurk, a veteran diplomat with more than a decade of experience in Iraq, had worked with the 79-member global coalition led by the U.S. to reclaim territory seized by the Islamic State in both Syria and Iraq.”

    (Reuters) – Turkey said Kurdish militants east of the Euphrates in Syria “will be buried in their ditches when the time comes”, after President Donald Trump began what will be a total withdrawal of U.S. troops from Syria.”

  41. 41


    If you want to win the entire pot and take all the chips in a battle with a narc, you’ll die of old age before they concede.

    Yes, but this isn’t a game. It’s a torture session. This is how you break narcissists and reduce what a pain in the ass they are. Keep up the torment until they do concede, and from then on they’re too scared to be as bad as they were. In rare cases, it can be used as a ‘rock bottom’, a path to recovery. Obviously that’s not applicable here. With narcissists, you avoid the normal result that this kind of cruelty breeds hidden resentment, because that’s the default state you were already at.

  42. 42
    Mike in NC says:

    @Yarrow: Mexican Boarder [sic] Wall was a big hit across the Rust Belt.

  43. 43
    jl says:

    @mapaghimagsik: This wouldn’t have to do with a certain utility I’ve nicknamed ‘Peculation, Greed and Explosion’ (so as to avoid any legal problems for the blog), would it?

    Pec Greed and Explo has racked up a remarkable record over the last month or so. Three items I remember are
    1) National (or maybe Western US) public utility association recommends it be broken up. So, even other greedy ruthless private utility companies think Pec Greed and Explo stink up the joint. That is saying something…
    2) Outside review of their executives finds that the execs of their safety and logistics division, and not well trained in safety and logistics. OK… Wonder what the were well trained in doing? (See item 3 beow)
    3) Got tagged in court for not keeping track of their underground gas pipeline distribution system, and lying and covering it up. This was result of investigation into incorrect gas piplein maps that got a bulldozer operative blown up, burnt and killed a while back. Pec and Greed had to pretty much cop to the plea and they said they were really really sorry and try not to do it again (how many times have we heard that one?). So, apparently, everyone, local governments, contractors, BLM, God knows, everyone who has to deal with their mess is furious with their BS.

    They need to broken up, obliterated, made history. Break it up and turn it into a system of publicly owned utility companies

  44. 44
    Yarrow says:


    BREAKING: The company owned by a foreign country that is challenging a grand jury subpoena in federal court in DC, and lost its challenge at the DC Circuit, has asked the US Supreme Court to step in. The case is under seal, so we have no additional information at this time.— Chris Geidner (@chrisgeidner) December 22, 2018

  45. 45
    Kathleen says:

    @Mnemosyne: I’ve been behind on threads but I just wanted to add my Jackal wishes for recovery, peace and healing for your mother and you and your family. Family illnesses/crises are so stressful.

  46. 46


    she and her loving, faithful husband can spend Christmas together as a family

    Was there a divorce and remarriage that I hadn’t heard of?

  47. 47
    Yarrow says:

    @Mike in NC: It certainly was. Well, with white people anyway.

    @Frankensteinbeck: Unfortunately the narcissist in question has nukes, so caution might be wise.

  48. 48

    @jl: Don’t leave out their Southern California brotheren, they’ve been sued for starting the Woolsey fire.

  49. 49
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    Corrected version follows:

    she and her loving, faithful husband can spend Christmas together as a family

  50. 50
    Just One More Canuck says:

    @jl: He’s from UCLA – don’t hold that against the rest of us

  51. 51
    jl says:

    @Jay: Thanks for info and links.

    Re comments on how to deal with a narcissist: I think it is hard to figure out when the narcissist has so much power. You can give advice it is not good to corner a narcissist. And that can be arranged for a family narcissist, one can avoid confrontations in front of others and finagle ways to negotiate face saving withdrawals that don’t involve high stakes and high profiles.

    But Trump has the power, for example, to call a private negotiating session, and then unexpectedly open it up to national press, and then start some idiotic public showdown (which he promptly flubs even on his own childish terms). That was the big nationally televised meeting with Pelosi and Schumer, both of whom ate his lunch in front of the whole country.

    At some point, you have to confront him, or out wit him. IMHO either can be done. There isn’t a lot at stake anyway, since the Wall is a stupid Trump campaign stunt, it is not a feasible policy. So, I think only goal the Dems need is not handing him an unnecessary PR victory. And, to some extent it is out of our hands, since Trump can always change his mind an break a deal, if racist grifters like Ann Coulter or Limbaugh decide its in their media professional interest to oppose any deal that Trump makes.

  52. 52


    let this be warning to all of you about the dangers of formal training in economics.

    jl knows of what he speaks.

  53. 53

  54. 54
    Sab says:

    So I went in to sign up for medicare since I turn 65 early next year. I went in early in November, but they scheduled me for the earliest available telephone appointment on December 20. I had that , so I am sort of signed up but I still have to sign paperwork when it comes in the mail and pay my premium.

    I am curious to see if I squeaked under the wire or not with the government shutdown. My health insurance premiums are $1300 a month next year. I sure would like to get on medicare and a medicare supplemental next year and not have to pay extra months of regular insurance.

    Oh well. Most people have worse problems. I really thought I had outlasted insurance issues, but the government shutdown proved me wrong.

  55. 55
    Yarrow says:

    Wow, I’d missed this:

    In the wake of the Kaepernick ad, Nike announced that it had crushed earnings expectations, leading to a market surge Friday that found Nike's stock as the sole gainer in the entire Dow.— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 22, 2018

  56. 56
    mapaghimagsik says:

    @jl: Lets go with a hypothetical business that spends no small amount of money scouring social media for its mention. I’m not exactly against any plan like that, I just don’t think that’s enough to *really* address the problem.
    Greed is a problem, and I think that a certain board could be dissolved. I also think changes in a certain commission are in order. But there’s also this thing called “obligation to serve” and the fact that vegetative management can be stopped by one stubborn homeowner, the number of people it puts at risk be damned. There would be employees that want to do the right thing and are frustrated and incensed that they cant.

  57. 57

    @Just One More Canuck: IIRC, jl spent some time in Westwood.

  58. 58
    mapaghimagsik says:

    @mapaghimagsik: no edit, and poor writing on my part. “any plan like that” refers to breakup.

  59. 59
    oatler. says:

    ABC news is reporting “both sides”.

  60. 60
    debbie says:


    I know! I’m still laughing!

  61. 61
    Eric S. says:

    @schrodingers_cat: I know I’m leaving to the choir but it is always worth remembering Rs go into government to make sure government does NOT work.

  62. 62
    jl says:

    @Sab: I think HHS is funded, and that would include CMS, which runs Medicare. Here are the agencies that have not been funded and affected by the shutdown.

    Nine federal departments will be shuttered as the government shuts down this weekend. They are:

    Department of the Treasury
    Department of Agriculture
    Homeland Security Department
    Department of the Interior
    Department of State
    Department of Housing and Urban Development
    Department of Transportation
    Department of Commerce
    Department of Justice

    It’s hard to figure out from internet, since been so many shutdowns recently, you have to look for the date to make sure you have the right shutdown.

  63. 63
  64. 64
    jl says:

    @mapaghimagsik: Yes, that is the one issue where a certain CA public utility has a small point, there are cases where local regulations make it harder than it should to control hazards. And around SF Bay Area there are people who are completely insane over preserving supposedly precious and historic treasures, like old eucalyptus windbreaks. These miserable old relics could be replace by something using native vegetation, and that did not produce a fire hazard, not create a dank and uinpleasant environment to hike through, and not create invasive sprouts that had to be rooted up. Some SF Bay people are nuts over that kind of thing.

    But, still there are systematic problems this utility’s executive management.

    I am happy to report that my experience with the front line workers, the people who actually do the damned work, at a certain utility named Pacific Gas and Electric, has been uniformly great. They have always done wonderful work when I’ve had problems, and they deserve to have better bosses. I wish them better bosses for Christmas, and I appeal to Santy Claus that this be accomplished.

  65. 65
    Sab says:

    @jl: Thanks. Vox article from last shutdown said SS and Medicare are funded, but the signups aren’t.
    I guess we will see.

  66. 66
    jl says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I went to the good UCLA, BillenGlendaleCA went to the bad UCLA. I just want to make that important detail clear.

  67. 67
    waratah says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: thank you for posting this.
    I have just finished reading the whole thing and I think he is asking them to override Trumps veto.
    He is not happy. First he says president no name and later just Trump.

  68. 68

    @jl: This is true, I did spend quite a bit of time on south campus.

  69. 69
    mapaghimagsik says:

    @jl: glad to hear that your front-line experience is good. Unfortunately, mentioning Voldemort by name force me to drop out of the conversation.

  70. 70
    rikyrah says:

    So sad for you 😪😪

  71. 71
    Ruckus says:

    We may have discussed this before but laser surgery was the best thing I ever did. And that was just before Lasik came along. Seems strange saying old fashioned laser surgery. I wore glasses, hard contacts, soft contacts, disposable contacts for over 45 yrs before surgery and I’d had enough.
    Of course there are other things that happen to your eyes that Lasik doesn’t fix, and I’ve got a few of them. Cataracts, PVD…… Oh well no one ever said getting old was easy.

  72. 72
    Jeffro says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: Please FSM no…Beto, no long winded stuff about the blessed wall, however well-intentioned.

    Just point out that it’s stupid on it’s face: it won’t do us one bit of good at stopping illegal immigration, drugs, or crime, and then point out that even Trumpov’s supporters know that it’s just a metaphorical middle finger to brown people. Lather, rinse, repeat.

    This is dumb.

  73. 73
    FelonyGovt says:

    @Sab: I just turned 65 and got on Medicare. It will be a lot better than your $1300, but (with a supplemental plan plus drug plan) still not cheap. I recently had to explain to a Bernie-curious Millenial friend who thinks “Medicare for all” is a great idea that Medicare is not, in fact, free. She was shocked.

  74. 74
    jl says:

    @Jeffro: Yes. I think every news report involving Wall should start out with ‘The Trump Wall, which started as a campaign rally stunt that even Trump thought was stupid…”

  75. 75
    Amir Khalid says:

    Ouch. That hurts. I hope you are soon reunited with the shades and reading glasses. I know how costly it can be to have to replace them.

  76. 76
    japa21 says:

    @FelonyGovt: There are a lot of folks over 65 that think it is free because they never see a premium notice. It’s automatically taken out of SS payments.

  77. 77
    jl says:

    @japa21: I know some reactionary old fools who claim to think their Medicare payments come out of a private program. They insist it’s some bigger version of a local credit union, or some such nonsense. None of that damn commie federal gummint has anything to do with, no sirree. Hell, if the feds ran it, it would just have to be a damned mess, wouldn’t it? Came to mind, since some of these people my parents’ friends, and run into them every year around this time.

  78. 78

    @Jeffro: Did you actually read what was in the tweets?

  79. 79

    @FelonyGovt: My brother was a doctor and when he retired, he was surprised to find Medicare wasn’t free.

  80. 80
    The Dangerman says:


    I went to the good UCLA, BillenGlendaleCA went to the bad UCLA.

    Is this a North Campus vs. South Campus thing? Because I tried to spend as much time as possible (not nearly enough) on North Campus for reasons I’m sure you understand.

    Plus Pauley, since one of the basketball players was gorgeous.

    ETA: First name Suzie, not Stuart.

  81. 81
    Lady raxterinok says:

    @Mnemosyne: My SIL from China had a mini stroke over a yr ago. Fortunately my brother was there and got her to the hospital at once. She is now nearly 100% recovered.

    She worked ‘religiously ‘ at PT. Her ability to speak Chinese recovered more quickly than her ability to speak English.

    She’s in her mid 60s.

  82. 82
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Mnemosyne: I had cataract surgery in my left eye and even though I told the doctor I wanted to remain nearsighted, I ended up losing my near vision in that eye. That is why I am putting off having my right cataract removed.

    Being able to see clearly up close is my superpower. I’ve had prescription readers and they are nowhere near as sharp as my right eye is, even with its cataract.

    I don’t understand people’s obsession with being able to see distance without glasses. Glasses work just fine for distance, they don’t work all that well for up close.

  83. 83
    jl says:

    @The Dangerman: I’m not sure what the North/South campus thing BillinGlendaleCA is talking about. But I let it pass. I charitably assumed he meant that he spent a lot of time partying at bars in Westwood. Or maybe he was a frat rat, which IIRC is ringed around the SW of the campus.

    Maybe BillinGlendaleCA will explain, since he probably would deem my guesses to be biased against how he spent his time there.

    Edit: There may have been a hard/soft sciences thing that supposedly split the campus into N and S, but I don’t think it was every really true, and not sure which was what. I think STEM was SW, and medical definitely on south side.

    But BillinG is econ, that was a north thing, for sure, unless they moved the department.

  84. 84
    Gretchen says:

    @Mnemosyne: I have no idea how old you are but if you’re close to 60 it might be worth just waiting until you need cataract surgery. My cataracts got suddenly very bad when I was 61. Afterward, for the first time I bought non-prescription sunglasses, passed the drivers test without glasses, and sometimes forget to put my glasses on. I was very nearsighted before surgery. It’s amazing.

  85. 85

    @The Dangerman: Though I spent time on both sides of campus, I did work on the north(the restaurant by URL) side of campus.

  86. 86
    FelonyGovt says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: I was too!

  87. 87
    Plato says:

    "They're really horrible hostage-takers," Lisa Murkowski said of House Republicans.

    — Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 22, 2018

    And you and your senate thugs are different how, Lisa?

  88. 88
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Yarrow: Oh District 2 Rep Wenstrup is so obsessed with the border, he’s written a four-part series — I’m going to get two more emails. Nothing says “long Christmas weekend” like right-wing ranting.

    What is motivating him, I can’t begin to guess, I never read past the first paragraph of any of his missives.

  89. 89
    WaterGirl says:

    @Patricia Kayden: I think Nancy SMASH may have helped Chuck find his balls. We shall see.

  90. 90
    Lady raxterinok says:

    @Patricia Kayden: Clinton did NOT cave when Newt tried to hold him hostage.

    Trump KNOWS that he can do whatever any Clinton ever did. Times 100% !!

  91. 91

    @jl: South campus is the Court of Sciences area and the medical center. North campus is the area north of that. Me a frat rat? I lived my first 2 years in Dykstra and then off campus in an apartment.

  92. 92
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    This has to be an example of how the GOP is being screwed by outsourcing their base mobilization to the Wingnut media – they made The Wall a live and die moment for them and it all depends on the Demcrats who just had a manadate to stop the GOP. This is beyond stupid.

  93. 93
    jl says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Oh the Court of Sciences! OK, sure… I guess I remember that. There was STEM on N side of campus too.

  94. 94
    WaterGirl says:

    @Yarrow: It’s disgusting how now that the rapey justice has been added to the court, all the conservatives want to skip the usual process and jump right to the SC, which they obviously assume will side with them. It’s disgusting.

  95. 95

    @Lady raxterinok: So I guess the government will be shut down for the next 2 years then.

  96. 96
    Plato says:

    All my beautiful hardworking people of the Federal Goverment, come to any of my places with your families at the bar between 2-5 pm for a free sandwich.Everyday until back to work! @oyamel @zaytinya @AmericaEatsTvrn @chinachilcano @beefsteak @jaleo

    — José Andrés (@chefjoseandres) December 22, 2018

    Chef Jose is a true liberal.

  97. 97

    @jl: My undergrad major was Econ/System Science, so I had Econ in Bunche and my Engineering courses down south.

  98. 98
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Ohio Mom:
    Bill Johnson?

  99. 99
    HinTN says:

    @japa21: Part A is free. Part B for Mrs H is $185 per month, which includes a $50 per month IRMA because we’re middle class and I still work. Because I work and have good insurance, we don’t subscribe to Part D, so I can’t speak to that.

  100. 100


    There was STEM on N side of campus too.

    STEM north of Math/Sciences? Where? Unless you call GSM(now Anderson) STEM.

    I guess there is Knudsen, but we always classed that as part of south campus.

  101. 101
    Eric S. says:

    @jl: i’m 22 years into my professional career almost all of it in public utilities. It is an interesting sector. There are good arguments for having monopoly ownership of the distribution system across large land areas. It is why they have developed into monopolies and then regulated monopolies.

    Then came St. Ronaldus and his revolution. (To be clear I do not know if he pushed any utility changes.) Deregulation got its fingers into the business. Wall St got involved. No longer was a stable stock with good dividends enough.

    Maintaining that infrastructure often gets back burnered in name of profits even though those maintanance costs are built into consumer rates. But looking at thr infrastructure government is supposed to maintain doesn’t inspire confidence they’d do better than the utilities.

    While I generally support public ownership or strong regulation and over sight in the sector i’m sure how public ownership would actually turn out.

  102. 102
    jl says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: ” I guess there is Knudsen, but we always classed that as part of south campus. ”

    I think we see how this works. A lot of theater arts is very much on the south side, but let’s classify it as north.

  103. 103
    Jeffro says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: yes, of course

    The fact that they weren’t super short and to the point is kind of a giveaway that they’re not A-team material, but yes, I read them

  104. 104

    @jl: Theater Arts is Melnitz, that’s about as far north as you can get without ending up in the middle of Sunset.

    ETA: Knudsen is just north of the road that is on the north side of Math Sciences, so it’s not a far stretch. It’s not like they teach Physics in Rolfe.

  105. 105
    The Dangerman says:


    I charitably assumed he meant that he spent a lot of time partying at bars in Westwood

    I don’t recall The Spot in Westwood? Crystal Palace comes to mind. Never went there. Mothers was fun but that was Brentwood.

    I was more a Falafel King kinda guy. I loved me some Falafel King.

  106. 106
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    Are some narcissistic sociopaths capable of being self-aware that their impulses are unacceptable to wider society and acting “normal”?

  107. 107
    sukabi says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: he’s not wrong.

    Also, refreshing that he can speak (write) in coherent sentences. And that he’s fleshed out his views in something other than a 10 second sound bite.

    It’s only been 2 years but it seems like a decade since we’ve been treated to a functional adult.

  108. 108
    Ohio Mom says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: No, my Rep is Brad Wenstrup, the erstwhile army podiatrist.

    It’s the seat Mean Jean Schmidt used to have, and it’s very gerrymandered.

    Cincinnati used to send Democrats to Congress until the Republicans in Columbus redrew the district, splitting Cincinnati in two. Each half is attached to a big rural area and each half sends Rethugs to DC.

  109. 109
    Brachiator says:


    Re comments on how to deal with a narcissist: I think it is hard to figure out when the narcissist has so much power.

    I agree with you big time on this. In fact I think it is largely pointless to describe Trump as a narcissist as though he suffers from some social or psychological disorder. He is, if anything, a successful narcissist and more so now that he has the ultimate power of the presidency behind him.

    He cannot be restrained or boxed in. Not as long as the GOP leadership support and sustain him. And they still see it as advantageous to do so.

    At some point, you have to confront him, or out wit him. IMHO either can be done. There isn’t a lot at stake anyway, since the Wall is a stupid Trump campaign stunt, it is not a feasible policy.

    The Wall is only part of Trump’s immigration policy. All of it is stupid, but he has already shifted public opinion against helping refugees. And many agree with his hateful views on immigrants who he thinks are not worthy of being Americans.

    So, I think only goal the Dems need is not handing him an unnecessary PR victory. And, to some extent it is out of our hands, since Trump can always change his mind an break a deal, if racist grifters like Ann Coulter or Limbaugh decide its in their media professional interest to oppose any deal that Trump makes.

    It is insane that Trump has given renewed power and significance to old fools like Coulter and Limbaugh and the Fox News crew. Simply insane.

    I don’t know who’s happier about this, Putin or Rupert Murdoch.

  110. 110
    jl says:

    @Eric S.: My experience living in various parts of Pacific Coast, including Alaska, is that a certain privately owned public utility in Northern California is the worse of all systems. It is really substandard, except the front line people I’ve personally dealt with have been great. I’ve had good and reliable consumer service with small to medium sized public utilities.

    I remember very reliable electric service as a kid from public agencies run by irrigation districts in Central Valley. I don’t remember asking myself, ‘why are there always these little blackouts around town’ like we had recently in SF Bay Area.

  111. 111
    Plato says:

    Why does @realDonaldTrump keep retreating? It started as a wall from sea to shining sea, to a wall in some places, to a steel picket fence, to now just $2.1b in funding?

    Because public sentiment. Overwhelming majority of Americans oppose US taxpayer funds for Trump's vanity wall

    — Ted Lieu (@tedlieu) December 22, 2018

  112. 112

    @Eric S.: We do have city run electric utilities here in Southern CA. LADWP, here in Glendale, Burbank…

  113. 113
  114. 114
    Mandalay says:


    no…Beto, no long winded stuff about the blessed wall, however well-intentioned.

    Agreed 100%. No disrespect, but Beto’s views are unwanted noise for this specific issue at this time.

    All Democrats except Schumer should say nothing beyond “Congress is not wasting $5 billion on a wall that nobody except President Trump wants”. This is actually a useful test of messaging for the Democrats.

    And I specifically hope that all potential presidential candidates STFU – no grandstanding. Let Schumer and Pelsoi handle this nonsense until it withers and dies.

  115. 115

    @Ohio Mom: Do you have voter initiatives in Ohio? If so, you should do what we did here in CA and take the drawing of districts away from the Legislature.

  116. 116
    jl says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Theater arts’ classy venues are down by Westwood. How old are you, anyway? You go back to the olde tymey days when they filled up the ravine that ran through the campus?

    Edit: if only Mr. Silverman were here. He’d put a stop to pointless debates over UCLA academic geography. That is about as drab a topic as can be, fitting for ‘Chicago West’ University.

  117. 117
    The Dangerman says:


    liked La Salsa by lot 32.

    Lot 32 was Fatburger. Fatburger. Yummmmm (/homer simpson). I guess I was all about the calories and not alcohol as an undergrad.

    There was a place on Broxton that Google now has as a BJ’s. That place was happening. Never went there. Crystal something. Hard partying. Some football player got into a heap of shit there.

    ETA: Fatburger is still there per Google. Well, hell, I think a Road Trip is required here.

    ETA: Well, shit, Falafel King is still there, too. Next to Stan’s Donuts. Road Trip!

  118. 118
    HinTN says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: What kinda engineer are ye?

  119. 119

    @jl: No, I don’t remember the ravine, however I have been under the bridge. I saw Teddy Kennedy speak at Ackerman when he was running against Jimmy Carter my sophomore year.

  120. 120
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: We just passed the same thing here in Colorado. Seems unlikely to happen in the occupied states.

  121. 121
    jl says:

    @Mandalay: I think it should always be made clear that Wall is nothing absolutely nothing, but a Trump campaign rally stunt. If I were a bigshot writing or talking about it, that point would always be upfront and emphasized. I’d routinely refer to it as a Trump campaign stunt.

  122. 122
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Ohio Mom:
    The gerrymandering is absolute bullshit. Is the Assembly still slow walking the legislation for implementing Issue 1?

  123. 123
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    Issue 1 in May took the wind out of anti-gerrymandering in Ohio imo for now.

  124. 124

    @The Dangerman: La Salsa was right next to Lot 32, a few doors down from Fatburger(yum). I have no idea what was there on Broxton, obviously I didn’t party well enough.

    @HinTN: I’m not an engineer, my major required a bunch of Systems Engineering courses.

  125. 125
    Ohio Mom says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Though we haven’t had voter initiatives to the extent that you do in California (who does?), a redistricting initiative did pass recently. I don’t think it’s clear yet how effective it will be, and there have been some noises in Columbus about making citizen initiatives just about impossible. Maybe another Ohio commentator knows more than I do.
    ETA: see Goku’s comment above.

  126. 126

    @The Dangerman: Never went to Falafel King, we’ve got good falafels here in Glendale. I haven’t had Fatburger in decades, might be worth a road trip(or a trip on Metro for me).

  127. 127
    Kathleen says:

    @Ohio Mom: My damned zip code is split into 2 legislative districts based on the 4 digit code following the zip. I used to have Dem representation in the state legislature but my end of the zip code is “represented” by Rethug (ironically named “Blessing”) while the other end of my zip code is represented by African American Democratic woman.
    OT, but didn’t Kasich veto Stand Your Ground bill?

  128. 128
    debbie says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    It’s been further slowed down while they focus on the 75% pay raise they want to give themselves.

  129. 129
    debbie says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    I heard something about restricting when signatures can be gathered, as in not in the summer. Can you imagine?

  130. 130
    NotMax says:

    @The Dangerman

    Fatburger opened here a few years ago. Lasted just about 6 months before going dark, only long enough for anyone with an interest to blanch at the prices, try it once and say never again. One time was glad I don’t have a dog anymore, because he or she would have run away full tilt in horror had I offered the 3/4 of what they called a burger which I ended up tossing into the trash

  131. 131
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again: I hate this state.
    I’m not sure what can be done aside from overthrowing the government in Columbus. I hope that redistricting reform passed in May solves this eventually.

  132. 132
    Kathleen says:

    @Ohio Mom: There have been 2 initiatives passed in Ohio to change the process on how districts are drawn. The first initiative, which passed in 2015, covered state house seats. The second initiative, Issue 1, which was passed in 2016, deals with Congressional seats. Here’s a nice summary from Huffington Post which includes this salient quote:

    And the Brennan Center has found that Ohio has one of the most gerrymandered congressional maps in the country.

  133. 133
    Brachiator says:

    Fatburger is more a brand name disconnected from any real product.

    And I’m not sure that the Los Angeles original was ever really great. It was good and reliable. Maybe that was good enough.

  134. 134
    The Dangerman says:


    Fatburger is more a brand name disconnected from any real product.

    I don’t recall it being a chain, but it’s been a long time. Maybe they sold the brand and went franchise.

    Besides, if we are talking burgers, it begins and ends with Tommy’s. An original Tommy’s, not one of these copycats.

  135. 135
    Kathleen says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: In the last 2 elections Hamilton County has been one of the few (if not the only) bright spot for Ohio Dems. Here’s a wrap up summary from Hamilton County Democrats:
    – Statewide Democratic Candidates carried Hamilton County though they lost statewide with exception of Sherrod Brown.
    – We elected the first African American (who is also female) to County Commission, which, for the first time in I think forever, has all Democratic commissioners.
    – All Dem state reps were re-elected.
    – Dem backed judicial candidates did very well locally and state wide and for the first time in my memory there was coordinated effort (which a friend of mine managed) to focus on
    judicial races which included sample ballots for judges. Here’s summary of the results:

    We also did extremely well when it comes to the Judiciary. This was a historic year in that regard. Five of our seven endorsed candidates for Judge won. Marilyn Zayas won re-election convincingly (with 61% of the Vote) to the Ohio First District Court of Appeals. She will be joined on that Court by Pierre Beregeron and Candace Crouse which means that possibly for the first time ever Democrats hold 50% of the seats on the Court. Ginger Bock ran a very strong race for that Court as well and came up just short. If we can win another seat in 2020, Democrats will hold the majority which would be a very big deal.

    Terry Nestor and Tom Beridon won seats on the Court of Common Pleas meaning Democrats will now hold 5 out 16. Not so long ago we only held one.

    We’re not perfect down here but a lot of people are working to get Democrats elected and their efforts are paying off. There is hope.
    ETA: Forgot to add the turnout numbers.
    By the time we have the official tally on Wednesday, the number of ballots cast will be just over 340,000.
    Looking back, the the highest previous mid-term vote we can find in Hamilton County was 300,860 in 1958. That’s a huge jump! Over 100,000 more people voted in Hamilton County this year compared to just four years ago in 2014.

  136. 136
    Chris Johnson says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: Do you see him doing that? No.

    They’re the cut-out. They’re how he gets his instructions. Post-summit, after he got rejected by Putin and cut dead by him, Fox ‘turned on him’ as well. Do you see him turning away from Fox now or do you see him glued to Fox in a panic, desperately waiting for some kind of good news that will tell him his boss is pleased?

    He will not turn against Fox News, or Putin. He’s too owned.

  137. 137
    Eric S. says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I know of some rural electric co-ops that run reasonably well. There’s at least 1 large suburb of Chicago that negotiates a rate with the utility and bills their residents directly. I think the co-ops generally own their own lines. The suburb I mention does not. None of them generate electricity that I know.

    I like the suburbs solution. They cannegotiate a discount rate based on volume and putting various generators against each other.

    If the towns running an electric utility in SoCal are running a substantially different model I’d be very curious to learn more about it.

  138. 138
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    That’s good to hear. Dems did really well with judicial elections. We won both Supreme Court seats that were up. Gaining control of the Ohio SC will be important going forward I think.

  139. 139
  140. 140
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Kathleen: Thanks for the link.

    For a while, I was represented in the statehouse by Democrat Connie Pillich, who was less progressive than I would have liked but probably anyone liberal enough for me wouldn’t have been electable.

    Still, she was a Democrat, and that wouldn’t stand, those ratfinks in Columbus redrew the district around her house, basically evicting her from the district. Grrrr….

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: You’re young, finish that degree and move someplace hip and happening in a Blue state. We’ll all cheer you on.

  141. 141
    Kathleen says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: Absolutely. I was glad to see races for judiciary were given same attention as the other slots. As I said, a friend of mine was instrumental in getting that started and managing it through to the election.

  142. 142
    Stuart Frasier says:

    There’s a Fatburger here in Koreatown next to the Wilshire/Vermont station. It has a full bar, which is pretty weird. It’s odd getting a cocktail from a bartender in a Fatburger uniform. The only burger chain I go to regularly is The Counter, though. It’s on a totally different level to any of the fast food places.

  143. 143
    Kathleen says:

    @Ohio Mom: I was represented by Denise Driehaus, part of a prominent Democratic family from the west side. Her brother Steve served before her, then he ran for congress in 2008 and actually beat Combover, then lost because of his support of ACA (“Right To Life” threatened his life over that). Denise then won his spot in the legislature. She can tell you how many doors she knocked on (in the thousands). Rethugs gerrymandered the hell out of my State house and Senate districts and her new district ended up in Sharonville and beyond. She now is on the County Commission. I really like her as a rep and as a person.
    Both she and Steve are very bright, hard working and dedicated (they were trying to establish measures to deal with housing bubble which they had foreseen before it was discussed in mainstream)..

  144. 144
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Kathleen: Yes, I know Hamilton County just gets bluer and bluer, which makes the gerrymandering even more infuriating.

    I never expected Stephanie Dumas to win — my only regret about there finally being three Democratic commissioners is that they got the hot potato, there is a big mess to clean up, and they are going to get blamed for fixing it (raising one kind of tax or another).

  145. 145
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Kathleen: Yeah, I like Denise too.

    Knocking on.every.single.door was also Connie Pillich’s M.O. Clearly, it’s a powerful technique.

  146. 146
    Kathleen says:

    @Ohio Mom: The other issue is poor Tod Portune, who has cancer. That man has been struggling with health issues for so long (I worked on his campaign in 2008) and still working so hard. One of the interesting things about him is how much both Republicans and Democrats love and respect him.

  147. 147
    FlyingToaster says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    You’re young, finish that degree and move someplace hip and happening in a Blue state. We’ll all cheer you on.

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    What she said.

    It’s what I did, though one state west. I did my time at IU, and then moved to Bwahstin (well, technically, Somerville, just like that law student Barack Obama).

    You need a degree, because it demonstrates perserverance. Employers want to hire someone who can be trained, and will stick around long enough after training to be a positive ROI.

    Please remember that “blue state” is a moving target. Colorado is a blue state now. Any number of cities in “red states” are totally blue (KCMO, ahem). If you find that Ohio, like Missouri for me, is just not a fight you can take on, do plan on moving right on along with your diploma.

  148. 148
    Kathleen says:

    @Ohio Mom: Connie was co-chair but party also announced she’s taking a job in Washington. She probably played a key role in the success of the party. I’d love to know why they’re getting different results down here.

  149. 149
    a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio) says:

    @Sab: I saw an email from the Commissioner (or Acting Commissioner—it’s hard to keep track in this administration) saying SSA had had its funding appropriation approved & signed back in September, so they wouldn’t be affected by this. I hope this is true, for both the employees and the beneficiaries.

  150. 150
    Ohio Mom says:

    @Kathleen: I heard about Connie moving but not about Portune. Now I will have to google his cancer. Hopefully it’s a relatively easy one to treat (crosses fingers).

  151. 151
    Bill Arnold says:



    I do (seriously) wonder what would happen if DJ Trump read one of these Horse Whisperer threads in a lucid moment.
    How does a narc deal with an in-their-face description of them that is predictive of their behavior?

  152. 152
    Michael Cain says:

    @a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio): Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid are permanently appropriated. Most states’ Medicaid money is also permanently appropriated, since the federal penalties for not paying promptly enough are pretty severe.

  153. 153
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Ohio Mom:

    Thanks for the advice! That’s exactly what I plan to do.

  154. 154
    Kayla Rudbek says:

    @a thousand flouncing lurkers (was fidelio): yes they are funded until February

  155. 155

    @Stuart Frasier: Ate there (no boozin’ ‘though) just last wk. Burger was as good as & tasted just the same as the first ones I had 40 yrs. ago at the white folks’ Fatburger at La Cienega & San Vicente.

    And the Xmas tunes (mostly R&B/Soul) are better than anywhere else.

  156. 156

    @Stuart Frasier: There used to be one in Glendale/Eagle Rock, but that’s been gone for a while. I did a search and saw the one at the Vermont/Wilshire station, there’s also one on Fig near the 7th Street Metro station.

  157. 157
    Stuart Frasier says:

    I didn’t know about that one. Of course, there’s a Counter right there. Smashburger too, which I haven’t tried yet.

  158. 158
    NotMax says:

    @Stuart Fraser

    Link to all their locations given above at #139.

  159. 159
    AnotherBruce says:

    @Juju: Maybe the dog just wanted to learn how to read. It’s not like the dog could wander into a store and ask for reading glasses.

    But yeah, as a reader glass user, I can’t stand misplacing them and being too blind to find them.

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