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You are here: Home / Because You Were Not Stressed Out Enough

Because You Were Not Stressed Out Enough

by John Cole|  December 21, 201812:57 pm| 148 Comments

This post is in: Serenity Now!

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Life needs to stop fucking with us:

Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg had two cancerous nodules removed from her left lung Friday at a New York hospital, the Supreme Court announced.

There is no evidence of any remaining disease, says a court spokesperson, nor is there evidence of disease elsewhere in the body.

The 85-year-old justice was hospitalized last month after a fall in her office, in which she fractured three ribs.

Get well, RBG.

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Reader Interactions

148Comments

  1. 1.

    WereBear

    December 21, 2018 at 12:59 pm

    Best to her.

  2. 2.

    PaulWartenberg

    December 21, 2018 at 1:00 pm

    I am not an alcoholic, never developed a habit, can’t handle the SMELL of beer for God’s sake.

    It’s news like that in this environment that’s driving me to buy whiskey, lots of it, and downing it in a single gulp.

  3. 3.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 1:01 pm

    Baud (I think) posted a longer story in the thread below that said that they found the nodules by chance when she fractured her ribs a few months ago, so that turned out to be a weirdly lucky accident.

  4. 4.

    rikyrah

    December 21, 2018 at 1:01 pm

    Best to her.

    Both my parents had lung cancer.

    One had a lung removed – lived another 30 years
    The other died within 6 months.

    Hoping and praying for RBG.

  5. 5.

    Martin

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    RBG will decide for herself when to leave this earth.

  6. 6.

    Quinerly

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    @PaulWartenberg: A smooth craft rye is nice in a strong Sazerac. Get your muddler out!

  7. 7.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 1:02 pm

    Like I said in the previous thread and have been telling friends, it sounds like she and we got incredibly lucky when she broke those ribs. It let them catch the cancer early. At her age, the common follow-up is the doctor telling her ‘You will get cancer again in 5-10 years’ and the patient saying that’s acceptable.

  8. 8.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 1:03 pm

    @PaulWartenberg:

    What, that they were able to accidentally discover cancerous nodules in the very early stages and remove them before they spread?

    If it’s going to drive you to drink, make sure you’re clear that the drink you’re taking is, Phew! That was a close one!

  9. 9.

    Mary G

    December 21, 2018 at 1:03 pm

    Holy Mother of Fuck. She is tough. Be well, RBG.

  10. 10.

    Elizabelle

    December 21, 2018 at 1:05 pm

    Recover well, RBG. Wow.

    We gotta get the Republicans outta the White House before they get another USSC nomination. As if not enough angst and chaos afoot already.

  11. 11.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 1:07 pm

    I bought a bottle of Clase Azul Reposado as a gift for a client. Now I’m tempted to just say fuck it and crack it open. He can get a card.

  12. 12.

    mad citizen

    December 21, 2018 at 1:09 pm

    No more SCOTUS picks from any Republican president–it’s an ILLEGITIMATE regime and our nation cannot and will not stand for it. NO MORE!

    Just getting on BJ today, but on the budget meltdown, I feel like trump is writing is immediate future. If he forces this shutdown, I think he could be out of office by the end of January.

  13. 13.

    Nicole

    December 21, 2018 at 1:09 pm

    A relative had a similar kind of thing- started taking blood thinners in preparation for a treatment for a-fib, and then began peeing blood. Went in to get it checked, and had a cancerous kidney removed. Because it was caught early, that was that, and the cancer has not returned so far (a few years now). Were it not for the a-fib (treatment was postponed a few months, obv), they might not have known until it had spread.

    Also, fuck cancer. And keep up the good fight, RBG! Let’s have it not come back for ten years, at least, what say?

  14. 14.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 1:12 pm

    @Mnemosyne:
    I had a freaking heart attack before I found the full story and not just the headline.

    EDIT – Thank the Sun Pony she is much tougher than me.

  15. 15.

    Fleeting Expletive

    December 21, 2018 at 1:14 pm

    Mnem, I wondered about that at the time, that her excellent recovery would be a blessing in a lot of ways. May the universe be gentle with her.

    As for me, I’d like to go back to 1997, I don’t like this reality we’re stuck in. My then husband and I went to Clinton’s 2nd inaugural. We’d fancied ourselves important enough to do so from Oklahoma. It was both lovely and yet…we stayed in a basement apt of a big old Georgetown house and went to a fancy party–I met Lloyd Bentson and got a picture with him, there were a lot of tribal officials and a good subset of the state party. We went to one of the Balls, Hillary and Bill made an appearance and danced for a minute.
    Ah, good story—our group dodged the big-hair blondes with cowgirl hats republicans who were on the flight up there, and went to a winery in Virginia, maybe, where the vintners and we enjoyed good Democrat conversation.

    Friday afternoon. Here’s to better times.

  16. 16.

    Spanky

    December 21, 2018 at 1:14 pm

    A glimmer …

    “Fox and Friends” host Brian Kilmeade on Friday morning tore into Trump’s other controversial decision this week — to pull U.S. troops out of Syria — and he did it right to the face of Trump’s own press secretary, Sarah Sanders.

    Kilmeade even went so far as to say that the president was paving the way for a revitalized Islamic State, also known as ISIS.

    “He also is doing exactly what he criticized President Obama for doing,” Kilmeade told Sanders. “He said President Obama is the founder of ISIS; he just re-founded ISIS, because they have 30,000 men there and they are already striking back with our would-be evacuation. The president is really on the griddle with this.”

    “Leaving is helping,” Kilmeade added, repeating: “Leaving is helping.”

    Trump was listening:

    I’ve done more damage to ISIS than all recent presidents….not even close!
    — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 21, 2018

    (Side note: As Trump’s own “founder of ISIS” talking point noted, the terrorist group didn’t really exist, as currently constituted, before the Obama administration. So “all recent presidents” really only includes one other president.)

    Sooooo, maybe he’ll walk the Syria withdrawal back too. Not that it helps our standing, but it just might help save Kurdish lives.

  17. 17.

    Doug R

    December 21, 2018 at 1:14 pm

    @Mnemosyne: I was just thinking that-chest xray picked up the nodules so yay I guess.

  18. 18.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 1:17 pm

    Just so everyone knows, I did ask Santa to indict Pence first, and then the President after the next session of the house is in order. President Nancy will then appoint the next Supreme Court Justice. I gave up all material gifts for this wish, so it was not without sacrifice on my part.

  19. 19.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 1:18 pm

    She’s welcome to have one or both of my lungs. Seriously, it would be unbearable if Trump got to replace Ruth Bader Ginsburg on the Supreme Court. I don’t expect life to be fair, but I don’t expect the universe to deliver one goddamned travesty after another either.

    Here’s the deal, FSM: If You see fit to keep RBG in good health and allow her to attend Trump’s funeral with her colleagues, I will wear a colander on my head as a symbol of my devotion to you, every Sunday from 11 AM to noon.

  20. 20.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 1:19 pm

    @Spanky:

    Sooooo, maybe he’ll walk the Syria withdrawal back too.

    That was always likely. He’s an incredible chickenshit and likes to say dramatic things, then do nothing. The pressure he is most vulnerable to is looking bad on television. Let us hope he does fold on the Syria issue.

  21. 21.

    James E Powell

    December 21, 2018 at 1:27 pm

    I am, pretty much, a peaceful, non-violent, easy-going kind of guy. But every time I think of the supreme court I want to find Jim Comey, slap the shit out of him, then head for the New York Times with mayhem on my mind.

  22. 22.

    feebog

    December 21, 2018 at 1:28 pm

    I lost one of my best friends to lung cancer in March. Vietnam Nam vet, exposure to Agent Orange. It was his third fight with cancer, kidney and a tumor in his leg before the lung cancer. Hope they got everything, lung cancer is hard to deal with.

  23. 23.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 1:30 pm

    I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. It was incredibly shortsighted and selfish of Justice Ginsburg not to retire during the Obama years.

  24. 24.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 1:31 pm

    @PaulWartenberg:

    I am not an alcoholic, never developed a habit, can’t handle the SMELL of beer for God’s sake.

    It’s news like that in this environment that’s driving me to buy whiskey, lots of it, and downing it in a single gulp.

    Or, as Lloyd Bridges’ character in Airplane! famously said: “I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue”.

  25. 25.

    rikyrah

    December 21, 2018 at 1:31 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    Syria wasn’t his decision. It was Putin’s decision.

  26. 26.

    Llelldorin

    December 21, 2018 at 1:32 pm

    @PaulWartenberg: My pancreas decided that I’d had quite enough whisky, thank you very much, a few weeks ago, and complained by trying to digest itself. I’m now watching all this horror sober and decaffeinated. Thanks, Trump.

  27. 27.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 1:34 pm

    @Cacti:

    I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. It was incredibly shortsighted and selfish of Justice Ginsburg not to retire during the Obama years.

    I agree with you – but fans of RBG will yell at you for saying this. So be prepared for one or more folks coming down on your ass hard for being so arrogant / unprogressive / unappreciative / (variants of “who the Hell are you to criticize/try to kick to the curb RBG?!) for daring to diss her.

  28. 28.

    Sherparick

    December 21, 2018 at 1:34 pm

    As Lloyd Bridges playing Steve McCroskey stated: “I picked a bad day to stop sniffing glue!” Get well Notorious RBG, the race is not yet finished.

  29. 29.

    Rylan Futch

    December 21, 2018 at 1:34 pm

    @Cacti: Watch out! You’ll get flamed for speaking that truth. Check out this article: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/ruth-bader-ginsburg-can-learn-something-from-brett-kavanaugh/2018/10/15/b8974a86-cd77-11e8-a360-85875bac0b1f_story.html?utm_term=.b11ac8ec9505

    Now I should add that, as everyone knows, women can be obnoxiously conservative and so can black folks. Gender and skin color, etc. should NEVER be the basis for hiring someone for a position like this. In the end it would be better to have a bench full of old liberal white men than one full of Clarence Thomases.

  30. 30.

    Sherparick

    December 21, 2018 at 1:35 pm

    @cmorenc: I see you beat me to it. It’s Just Another Infrastructure Week.

  31. 31.

    Mai Naem mobile

    December 21, 2018 at 1:38 pm

    @Mnemosyne: what happened with your mom? I hope it wasn’t bad news.
    I saw the RBG story trending on Twitter a little while ago. Jeezus,Trumpov has taken 20 years of my life and fuck Mitch McConnell.

  32. 32.

    Citizen Alan

    December 21, 2018 at 1:38 pm

    @Cacti:

    Fuck off and die.

  33. 33.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 1:38 pm

    @cmorenc: Because it would have been a cakewalk to replace her, amirite? See Merrick Fucking Garland. Unless you mean that she should have stepped down just after his inauguration?

  34. 34.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 1:39 pm

    @Spanky:
    “than all recent presidents”?!?

    But LBJ kicked ISIS’s ass!

  35. 35.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 1:39 pm

    Actually, let’s just put this out there: to anyone who says RBG should have stepped down, MERRICK FUCKING GARLAND.

  36. 36.

    Adam L Silverman

    December 21, 2018 at 1:40 pm

    Everybody just take a deep breath!

    re RBG: If you’re 85 and you break a rib and get a CT, the radiologist will very likely find pulmonary nodules. Most aren't removed. Since hers are now out and there’s apparently no evidence of metastatic disease, the primary issue is recovery from the procedure.

    — James Hamblin (@jameshamblin) December 21, 2018

  37. 37.

    tokyokie

    December 21, 2018 at 1:41 pm

    RBG had a similar stroke of luck with her pancreatic cancer. With pancreatic cancer, by the time symptoms appear, it’s already too late. But in certain cases, if the cancer is confined to a single, specific location (I want to say the neck of the pancreas, but I can’t remember), the success rate is pretty high. And once agin, I believe that her pancreatic cancer was found when she was being examined for something else.

    I’m not sure I know of anybody, including myself, I’d rather see have such an extraordinary run of good luck than the Notorious RBG.

  38. 38.

    Amir Khalid

    December 21, 2018 at 1:43 pm

    @Cacti:
    Scalia retired from the Supreme Court bench during the Obama years. Do you remember what happened after that?

  39. 39.

    Mai Naem mobile

    December 21, 2018 at 1:44 pm

    @cmorenc: you guys say this but were the votes there with what McConnell was doing. We got Kagan and Sotomayor. After that you had the ACA fight and you had Kennedy dying and the Scott Brown election. I honestly don’t remember the period of time and McConnell was playing hardball.

  40. 40.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 1:44 pm

    @Sherparick:

    @cmorenc: I see you beat me to it. It’s Just Another Infrastructure Week.

    Another “third rail” of posting that can be risky to touch, unless you are of very sturdy constitution, is to diss folks who voted for Nader in 2000 or Gary Johnson in 2016, although at least on this site, you’ll probably get lots more folks backing your view on that one than to lay critical fingers on RBG.

  41. 41.

    tokyokie

    December 21, 2018 at 1:45 pm

    @Amir Khalid: Hell, Scalia didn’t just retire from the Supreme Court, he retired from the world of the living!

  42. 42.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 1:46 pm

    @Amir Khalid:
    Retired in the most pleasing possible way, too.

  43. 43.

    enplaned

    December 21, 2018 at 1:47 pm

    RBG is great, but made major error in not stepping down when Obama was in power. Everyone views themselves as indispensable, and it’s almost never true.

  44. 44.

    Soprano2

    December 21, 2018 at 1:49 pm

    @Mnemosyne: That happened to my sister-in-law; they were doing surgery to remove a non-cancerous cyst and found that she had stage 1 ovarian cancer. Four years later and she’s still cancer-free. If not for that surgery, she would probably be dead by now.

  45. 45.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 1:49 pm

    @enplaned:
    So what should she do today?

  46. 46.

    NotMax

    December 21, 2018 at 1:49 pm

    @Amir Khalid

    Retired?

    ‘E’s passed on! This justice is no more! He has ceased to be! ‘E’s expired and gone to meet ‘is maker! ‘E’s a stiff! Bereft of life, ‘e rests in peace! ‘Is metabolic processes are now ‘istory! ‘E’s off the twig! ‘E’s kicked the bucket, ‘e’s shuffled off ‘is mortal coil, run down the curtain and joined the bleedin’ choir invisible!! THIS IS AN EX-JUSTICE!!

  47. 47.

    Ohio Mom

    December 21, 2018 at 1:50 pm

    RBG is amazingly lucky: this is her second cancer found extremely early by sheer chance.

    Remember when the doctors found a tumor on her pancreas? She was having a scan for something else (I don’t think we were ever told what) when they spotted that.

    I understand she’s also had colorectal cancer removed but I imagine that was found during a plain old colonoscopy.

    Maybe the thing to do isn’t to wrap RGB in bubble wrap, it’s setting up a Go Fund Me so she can have regular CAT scans and MRIs.

  48. 48.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 1:51 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Scalia retired from the Supreme Court bench during the Obama years. Do you remember what happened after that?

    Scalia didn’t retire – he was on some sort of hunting junket where he went to bed alive one night and was found dead in his bed the next morning. Alas, this happened on 2/13/2016 rather than during the period from 2009 until the 2014 elections, when Ds held both Presidency and Senate. But even then, we only briefly had 60 votes (to break McConnell’s certain filibuster of a nominee who would upset the right’s 5-4 control of SCOTUS) until Kennedy died in August 2009 and the hapless Martha Coakley lost the special election to fill his seat.

  49. 49.

    Frankensteinbeck

    December 21, 2018 at 1:52 pm

    @cmorenc:

    is to diss folks who voted for Nader in 2000 or Gary Johnson in 2016

    The vast majority opinion on this blog is that the former is an act of dangerous foolishness, but if people repent that mistake they are absolved and do not get further shaming. I haven’t seen anybody admit they voted for Johnson, or that topic even come up, but certainly voting for Stein is viewed as unforgivably stupid and assholish, contributing heavily to us having to deal with this mess now.

  50. 50.

    JPL

    December 21, 2018 at 1:52 pm

    Hindsight doesn’t help. McConnell should have stepped up and defended the country from the Russian attack, but guess what he’s a traitor and didn’t. Comey should have kept his mouth shut before the election, but guess what he didn’t. And don’t get me started about Bill and Loretta.

  51. 51.

    GregB

    December 21, 2018 at 1:53 pm

    @Amir Khalid: By retired you mean died at a hunting lodge.

  52. 52.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 1:53 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Scalia retired from the Supreme Court bench during the Obama years. Do you remember what happened after that?

    I honestly believe RBG should retire when she’s damn sure ready and wants to do so. However, what cacti proposes is not really comparable here, since it would have provided closer to 4 years McConnell would have had to hold out rather than the larger part of 1.

    Still, we’re going to be hearing about this until a D president is elected or unless Ginsburg survives Merrick Garland in the end. Woe betide us if she is *erm* similarly made to retire before Trump gets out of office.

    Also, am I the only one who wonders if she was pushed? If so, that person will now have to live with the knowledge (s)he may have saved Ginsburg’s life. Won’t be the same to this imagined someone as one of us may feel, though.

  53. 53.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 1:53 pm

    @cmorenc: Sarcasm. Do you know how it works?

  54. 54.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2018 at 1:53 pm

    @cmorenc: Anybody who voted for Nader in 2000 is a fucking moron, full stop.

  55. 55.

    Gin & Tonic

    December 21, 2018 at 1:55 pm

    @debit: Lots of people here, even some regular commenters, who seem to assume Amir Khalid is an idiot. Tis a puzzlement.

  56. 56.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 1:55 pm

    @cmorenc:

    More like, “Explain how you get her replacement past Mitch McConnell.”

    I’m still waiting for you guys to explain that. You can start any time.

    Hint: “She should have known the Democrats would lose control of the Senate in the 2010 midterms” is not a valid answer.

  57. 57.

    Immanentize

    December 21, 2018 at 1:56 pm

    For RGB, I will pray regardless of my lack of belief. It is a Pascal’s Wager Hail Mary.

  58. 58.

    jl

    December 21, 2018 at 1:59 pm

    @Mnemosyne: That is my question too.

    Edit: and for several reasons, personal interest in any person’s well being among them, as well as political, I hope RBG recovers.

  59. 59.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 1:59 pm

    @Cacti:

    Same challenge for you: what was your strategy for getting a new justice past Mitch McConnell’s filibuster once the Democrats lost their supermajority? Details, please.

  60. 60.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:01 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Hint: “She should have known the Democrats would lose control of the Senate in the 2010 midterms” is not a valid answer.

    Well, holding the seat open would not have been tenable after a certain length of time, especially where it would not have substantially changed the ideological balance on the court. McConnell may have even ultimately wound up with a marginally more conservative jurist.

    Again, I’m glad she stayed nonetheless.

  61. 61.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 2:01 pm

    I don’t understand why anyone would gloat about this today. I guess it’s gratifying to the folks doing the crowing in the same sense my dog thinks licking his balls makes the world a better place. But my reaction to both spectacles is the same: GROSS.

  62. 62.

    Elizabelle

    December 21, 2018 at 2:01 pm

    @trollhattan: LOL.

    I will never tire of Dead Scalia. Never.

  63. 63.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 2:01 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:
    Avin’ a larf, ‘e is.

  64. 64.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:04 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Right on cue, the flying monkey brigade swoops in to fling feces.

    A thousand pardons my progressive better. Ruth Bader Ginsburg is immune to the ravages of time and disease, and it was very wise of to give no thought to the future after surviving her second round of cancer at age 75.

  65. 65.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 2:05 pm

    More evidence we have defeated ISIS.and everything they stand for and their various followers, also, too.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46645348

    Why do I no longer see formatting controls in Chrome? Anybody else having the issue?

  66. 66.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 2:05 pm

    Progressives have suffered an astonishing run of unlucky breaks at crucial close moments in history ever since 1968:
    1) Robert Kennedy being assassinated in 1968 (RFK would likely have defeated Nixon in the fall election)
    2) Next one is counter-intuitive, since the bad break actually turns out that the Ds won this election! Jimmy Carter narrowly defeats Gerald Ford in 1976 – and this observation isn’t really a diss on Carter so much as it is that he was the incumbent during a period where several difficult factors would have converged to work heavily against whomever was POTUS 1976-1980. A stagfating economy (deep recession coinciding with inflation and high interest rates) + the Iran hostage crisis. Had Ford won, these events would have fallen on his head, and Ted Kennedy would likely have become president in 1980, and the Reagan would never have been president, and we’d have had some version of universal health care in the 1980s and a much different SCOTUS between then and now.
    3) Al Gore losing Florida by just over 500 votes – in critical part an unforced own-goal by a democratically controlled local elections board in Palm Beach County and the idiotically designed “butterfly ballot” which resulted in confusing enough elderly voters in heavily Jewish precincts in voting for the overtly anti-Semitic Patrick Buchanan by mistake! (7k votes for Buchanan). Or, Gore’s decision to forbid Bill Clinton for campaigning for him in Florida b/c of fear of contamination from the blowjob affair – which meant that Gore didn’t get some critical extra black turnout. Yeah, there were other factors as well, such as suppression of many black voters and the purists who voted Nader in Florida, but without the butterfly ballot fiasco, Gore would have narrowly won anyway despite these other factors.
    4) those 80K votes aggregate total in Pa, Wi, and Mi who gave Trump the election instead of Hillary Clinton, as well as deluded progressives who voted for Gary Johnson or (worse) Jill Stein.
    5) Scalia failing to drop dead two years sooner, while Ds controlled POTUS and Senate.

    We can only hope that the one good thing that comes out of Trump’s elections is that he will prove the albatross that terminates the conservative-dominated period begun by Reagan in 1980 – be careful what you (Rs) wish for, you might get it etc.

  67. 67.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:05 pm

    @Amir Khalid:

    Scalia retired from the Supreme Court bench during the Obama years

    I suppose you could call that a retirement.

    In which case, RBG seems to have a similar retirement strategy.

  68. 68.

    Amir Khalid

    December 21, 2018 at 2:07 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Lots of people here, even some regular commenters, who seem to assume Amir Khalid is an idiot.

    Sometimes I wonder about that myself.

  69. 69.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 2:07 pm

    @Cacti: Asking you to back up your argument isn’t flinging shit.

  70. 70.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:08 pm

    @Cacti: Hey, how about for once in your life you engage someone who has a disagreement with you rather than fling insults?

    Meanwhile, I’m over here making arguments for your conclusion that I disagree with because you won’t. And I’ve thought you were a flaming asshole for years. I’m more than convinced at this point you’re only here to pick fights.

  71. 71.

    Elizabelle

    December 21, 2018 at 2:08 pm

    @Cacti: Your last line is so mean, but I am laughing too.

    Be well, RBG. You blew it with assuming HRC would be inaugurated in 2017, so now you have to live until 100 if need be.

    Mostly, I rather hope we are discussing the precarious situation of Anthony (Deutsche Bank) Kennedy before too long. Bring it on.

  72. 72.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 2:09 pm

    @Cacti:
    You’re in the wrong Oz, pal.

  73. 73.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:10 pm

    @Cacti:

    Repeating for the people at the back:

    Same challenge for you: what was your strategy for getting a new justice past Mitch McConnell’s filibuster once the Democrats lost their supermajority? Details, please.

    Why is this an unreasonable request? You’re the one insisting that it would have been simple and easy to get her replacement though the Senate after the 2010 midterms. Show your work. Prove us all wrong and explain why it would have been easy.

  74. 74.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:10 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    Meanwhile, I’m over here making arguments for your conclusion that I disagree with because you won’t. And I’ve thought you were a flaming asshole for years. I’m more than convinced at this point you’re only here to pick fights.

    Oh, okay. Whoever you are.

  75. 75.

    Carol

    December 21, 2018 at 2:14 pm

    @Cacti: Agree with you and enplaned about RBG. Have thought for several years now that she should have retired during Obama’s terms, and as we know now during the beginning of his second term would have been best. Her age and her previous health issues were enough to make most people think about the possibility for future problems. We’re up the proverbial creek now because I doubt she can hold on another 2 1/2 years.

  76. 76.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:14 pm

    @Cacti: Think back a couple years. I would think you’d remember. My name was different then and for the first 8 years I posted here.

    Of course flaming asshole picks so many fights he doesn’t pay attention.

  77. 77.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 2:14 pm

    @Gin & Tonic:

    @cmorenc: Anybody who voted for Nader in 2000 is a fucking moron, full stop.

    Agree with you completely. But the point is that the progressive cause is unfortunately saddled with too many such idiots at crucial moments (like the 2000 and 2016 Presidential elections). We can only hope that the “freedom caucus” types on the right prove to have equally or greater death wishes of stubbornness on behalf of their causes moving forward.

  78. 78.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:16 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Why is this an unreasonable request? You’re the one insisting that it would have been simple and easy to get her replacement though the Senate after the 2010 midterms. Show your work. Prove us all wrong and explain why it would have been easy.

    Your request is facile, because her pancreatic cancer was diagnosed within days of Obama’s inauguration. Plenty of time, friendly Senate, and it wouldn’t have altered the balance of the Court. That was the moment, but pride won out over pragmatism.

  79. 79.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:17 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    Well, holding the seat open would not have been tenable after a certain length of time, especially where it would not have substantially changed the ideological balance on the court.

    There’s a whole lot that the Republicans have been doing for the past 10 years that a normal human would have assumed would be untenable for them to do, but they kept getting away with it anyway.

    Once the Republicans were back in control of the House and could grind business to a halt in the Senate after the 2010 midterms, they used that power every chance they got. I honestly don’t think they would have made an exception for the Supreme Court, especially if they thought that blocking Obama’s nominee for 2 years would fulfill McConnell’s dream of making him a 1-term president.

  80. 80.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 2:17 pm

    @Frankensteinbeck:
    The real danger will be when there’s a serious national-security crisis (9/11) and this clown is spinning like a weathervane in the wind, in a constant state of not knowing what to do.

  81. 81.

    cmorenc

    December 21, 2018 at 2:18 pm

    @Cacti:

    As predicted, plenty of monkey poo is being flung your way for suggesting RBG should have retired while Obama was POTUS and Ds controlled the Senate. You might as well walk into a fundamentalist church and diss Jesus as suggest in here that RBG should have timely retired.

  82. 82.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:20 pm

    @Cacti:

    Your request is facile, because her pancreatic cancer was diagnosed within days of Obama’s inauguration.

    So she should have known that her easily-cured cancer meant she would still be alive and actively hearing cases 10 years later and therefore she should have retired?

  83. 83.

    tobie

    December 21, 2018 at 2:20 pm

    @Elizabelle: yes regarding investigations of Anthony Kennedy’s shameless selling of his seat to protect his son, Trump’s personal banker at Deutsche Bank. I was filled with glee when I heard Adam Schiff would be looking into Trump’s finances. Callow Republicans like Kennedy who act as if they are moral authorities need to be named and shamed!

  84. 84.

    The Moar You Know

    December 21, 2018 at 2:21 pm

    If he forces this shutdown, I think he could be out of office by the end of January.

    @mad citizen: Please explain the mechanism by which that happens.

  85. 85.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 2:21 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Shhhhh. Logic has no place here. Obviously.

  86. 86.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 2:22 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    There’s a whole lot that the Republicans have been doing for the past 10 years that a normal human would have assumed would be untenable for them to do, but they kept getting away with it anyway.

    Nothing lasts forever. It really does seem like the wheels are starting to come off the bus and the GOP is beginning to crack up due to ideological contradictions. Fox News is starting to get on Trump for reneging on promises on the Wall as well as his withdrawal of troops from Syria. I could see Trump tearing the right-wing coalition that makes up the modern GOP apart.

  87. 87.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:22 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    Think back a couple years. I would think you’d remember. My name was different then and for the first 8 years I posted here.

    Of course flaming asshole picks so many fights he doesn’t pay attention.

    And you would expect me to have kept track of your name changes in the comment section because?

  88. 88.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:23 pm

    @cmorenc:

    Jesus, you’re a delicate flower. Asking you to show your work and explain your plan for getting RBG’s replacement past Mitch McConnell is “flinging poo”?

    You should probably retire to your fainting couch so you can clutch your pearls more comfortably and whimper about the incivility of it all.

  89. 89.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 2:24 pm

    @The Moar You Know: I think that poster should find the other poster (Chris Johnson?) who was convinced that Trump and family were going to force Air Force 1 to fly to Moscow during the G-20.

  90. 90.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:26 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    There’s a whole lot that the Republicans have been doing for the past 10 years that a normal human would have assumed would be untenable for them to do, but they kept getting away with it anyway.

    The worst part about working with counterfactuals is that you can only ever guess at the outcome. Yes, they get away with virtually every awful thing they do. Still, I don’t think the stakes would have been high enough for them to play that card in a Ginsburg retirement situation. Especially if she would have continued holding that seat in the meantime like Kennedy did. I’m glad she’s still there but I’m not going to stand here and pretend there’s no reason someone might disagree.

    @cmorenc:

    As predicted, plenty of monkey poo is being flung your way for suggesting RBG should have retired while Obama was POTUS and Ds controlled the Senate. You might as well walk into a fundamentalist church and diss Jesus as suggest in here that RBG should have timely retired.

    That’s not why I’m flinging poo his way. I’m taking more time to support his argument than he is. I just don’t like his attitude.

  91. 91.

    The Moar You Know

    December 21, 2018 at 2:27 pm

    My pancreas decided that I’d had quite enough whisky, thank you very much, a few weeks ago, and complained by trying to digest itself.

    @Llelldorin: My drummer had this happen, it went septic. He should have died. He didn’t. Two years later, he’s about 70-90% of his drumming game, which is perfectly acceptable.

    Of course, he’s got several million dollars of medical bills he will never be able to pay hanging over his head, but it’s not like he’s got any assets to take, and he’s alive. He’s fine with the situation.

    Glad you’re better. That’s a real bad one to get.

  92. 92.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:29 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    I just don’t like his attitude.

    And I care. Deeply. ;-)

  93. 93.

    Brachiator

    December 21, 2018 at 2:30 pm

    @Spanky:

    Trump was listening:

    I’ve done more damage to ISIS than all recent presidents….not even close!
    — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 21, 2018

    What an idiot. What a total freaking idiot.

  94. 94.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:30 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    As I said, I think they would have sat on her replacement and used it against Obama in the 2012 election. It might even have worked and we would have had President Romney.

    I don’t get why people assume that RBG’s retirement after the 2010 midterms would not have affected the 2012 presidential election. You can’t change one action and assume that nothing else would have changed in response to that action.

  95. 95.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:32 pm

    @Cacti:

    And you would expect me to have kept track of your name changes in the comment section because?

    My new name is not entirely dissimilar from my old one which I used here starting 11 years ago, you’ve been here much if not all of that time. Also, there’s the fact that you left such a large impression on me, for the worse, that I thought I could reasonably assume there was a chance you may remember my old name at the very least and make the connection./insert overused joke about inductive reasoning here/

    Then you could always ask…

    And I care. Deeply. ;-)

    Glad I could be of service.

    @Mnemosyne:

    As I said, I think they would have sat on her replacement and used it against Obama in the 2012 election. It might even have worked and we would have had President Romney.

    I understand them to mean they think she should’ve retired in early 2013.

  96. 96.

    trollhattan

    December 21, 2018 at 2:33 pm

    O/T this Gatwick drone thing front-pages a big vulnerability and the gizmos themselves are cheap and plentiful. Ugh.

  97. 97.

    germy

    December 21, 2018 at 2:34 pm

    Imagine being 86 and working through lung cancer so you can protect women 70 years younger than you from men like Kavanaugh, Alito, Thomas and Gorsuch.

    — Laurie Kilmartin (@anylaurie16) December 21, 2018

  98. 98.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:37 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    My new name is not entirely dissimilar from my old one which I used here starting 11 years ago, you’ve been here much if not all of that time. Also, there’s the fact that you left such a large impression on me, for the worse, that I thought I could reasonably assume there was a chance you may remember my old name at the very least and make the connection./insert overused joke about inductive reasoning here/

    I’m going to have to burst your bubble. You just don’t matter to me that much.

    But you have a healthy self-esteem level. Good for you.

  99. 99.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:39 pm

    @Cacti:

    But you have a healthy self-esteem level. Good for you.

    Either your reading comprehension or your empathy level is really low.

    I believe it’s likely both.

  100. 100.

    ?BillinGlendaleCA

    December 21, 2018 at 2:40 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    You can’t change one action and assume that nothing else would have changed in response to that action.

    It’s like these folk never watched Star Trek.

  101. 101.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:42 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    Cacti just said that she should have retired after her successful pancreatic cancer surgery in 2009. Why? Because he knows that it’s the only tiny window where she could have retired and had a Democratic supermajority in the Senate to vote for her replacement.

    Of course, when she had her surgery, there was NOT yet a Democratic supermajority — Al Franken wasn’t certified and sworn in until 4 months later. But apparently RBG has ESP, knew the Democrats would end up with a supermajority, and willfully refused to act on her foreknowledge of future events. ?

  102. 102.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:46 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Cacti just said that she should have retired after her successful pancreatic cancer surgery in 2009. Why? Because he knows that it’s the only tiny window where she could have retired and had a Democratic supermajority in the Senate to vote for her replacement.

    Of course, when she had her surgery, there was NOT yet a Democratic supermajority — Al Franken wasn’t certified and sworn in until 4 months later. But apparently RBG has ESP, knew the Democrats would end up with a supermajority, and willfully refused to act on her foreknowledge of future events.

    Keep moving those goalposts. ;-)

    It’s not possible that your secular saint could have made an error. Her unassailable judgment that time would always be on her side has really left the rest of us in a good place.

  103. 103.

    Kraux Pas

    December 21, 2018 at 2:47 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    Cacti just said that she should have retired after her successful pancreatic cancer surgery in 2009.

    Sorry I missed this bit.

    Then that would have put her replacement at roughly the same time span Sotomayor and Kagan were nominated and confirmed.

  104. 104.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 2:49 pm

    @Cacti:

    secular saint

    WTF?

  105. 105.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 2:49 pm

    @?BillinGlendaleCA:

    You gotta love how they’ve been totally convinced for the past 10 years that this time will be the one that forces RBG off the court, and yet she just keeps chugging along and hearing cases. ?‍♀️

    It’s hard to say “I told you so” when the bad thing you fear hasn’t actually happened yet, but they just can’t stop themselves. Almost like there’s something that freaks them out about powerful women. ?

  106. 106.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:50 pm

    @cmorenc:

    As predicted, plenty of monkey poo is being flung your way for suggesting RBG should have retired while Obama was POTUS and Ds controlled the Senate. You might as well walk into a fundamentalist church and diss Jesus as suggest in here that RBG should have timely retired.

    Yep, she left things to chance that she shouldn’t have, content to leave the rest of us to pay the price if she was wrong.

  107. 107.

    Burnspbesq

    December 21, 2018 at 2:51 pm

    @Cacti:

    I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again.

    You were wrong then, you’re wrong now.

  108. 108.

    VincentN

    December 21, 2018 at 2:53 pm

    @Cacti: I get tired of this argument coming up every time RBG gets so much as a sniffle. We are where we are. People keep wanting to blame or absolve her. Why? The past isn’t going to change. Better to focus on mitigating the damage that comes if Trump gets a chance to replace her.

  109. 109.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 2:54 pm

    @Mnemosyne: How is your mom now?

  110. 110.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 2:55 pm

    @VincentN: Word. This debate is boring, RBG doesn’t really care what we think.

  111. 111.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 2:55 pm

    @cmorenc: Only because she admitted to it previously will I drag her good name into this but the luminous Betty and I (Florida residents both) would both beg to differ and defer to the judgement that years and years of mea culpas and (at least on my part) eternal inner shame should exempt us from more public shame.

    Also, too, I’m disheartened by all the squabbling going on in here, Trump and the holidays notwithstanding. I don’t recall it ever being this bad in the few years I have been visiting these pages…sad.

  112. 112.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 2:57 pm

    @Kraux Pas:

    Then that would have put her replacement at roughly the same time span Sotomayor and Kagan were nominated and confirmed.

    The Justices replaced were Stevens and Souter. Stevens was urgent, at 90 years old and the longest serving member of the court.

    Souter wasn’t urgent at all. Younger than Ginsburg and in fine health. Still in fine health AFAIK.

  113. 113.

    raven

    December 21, 2018 at 2:58 pm

    What the fuck is the difference what she should have done. Stupid motherfuckers.

  114. 114.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 2:58 pm

    @Mnemosyne:
    You know I wasn’t arguing with you at #86, right?

  115. 115.

    ??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??

    December 21, 2018 at 2:59 pm

    @cope:
    I guess you weren’t here for the primaries in 2016, then?

  116. 116.

    debit

    December 21, 2018 at 3:00 pm

    @raven: How else can they be smugly self righteous if they don’t assign fault?

  117. 117.

    Skepticat

    December 21, 2018 at 3:01 pm

    @Cacti:

    I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. It was incredibly shortsighted and selfish of Justice Ginsburg not to retire during the Obama years.

    So Merrick Garland could have had company just waiting around while McConnell blocked another nominee?

  118. 118.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 3:01 pm

    Open thread up for anyone who’s tired of this bullshit argument.

  119. 119.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 3:04 pm

    @Skepticat:

    So Merrick Garland could have had company just waiting around while McConnell blocked another nominee?

    What was the partisan makeup of the US Senate as of 2/2009?

    Kthxbai.

  120. 120.

    schrodingers_cat

    December 21, 2018 at 3:04 pm

    @Betty Cracker: Thanks Betty C. I loves ya!

  121. 121.

    TS (the original)

    December 21, 2018 at 3:20 pm

    @Spanky:

    Sooooo, maybe he’ll walk the Syria withdrawal back too. Not that it helps our standing, but it just might help save Kurdish lives

    The unbelievable (but true) part is that he gets his policy – for everything – from Fox News!

  122. 122.

    glory b

    December 21, 2018 at 3:24 pm

    @Cacti: I know, right? Sure, I like her well enough, but did she learn nothing from Thurgood Marshall?!?!?
    I always gave her warm friendship with Scalia the side eye. I couldn’t be friends with someone who wanted to destroy my life’s work.
    And her dissing Kapernick was disappointing.

  123. 123.

    glory b

    December 21, 2018 at 3:25 pm

    @Skepticat: She should have done this when Dems held the Senate.

  124. 124.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 3:30 pm

    @Cacti:

    The Democrats only had 58 seats, which is why Sotomayor wasn’t confirmed until 8/2009. Why do you remember everything incorrectly?

  125. 125.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 3:34 pm

    @schrodingers_cat:

    My brother in IL hasn’t called me back from yesterday, which oddly is probably a good sign, because that means there’s no new news.

  126. 126.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 3:36 pm

    @glory b:

    The Dems held the Senate for 2 years and were able to get 2 new justices confirmed 2 years apart. I’m still going to need an explanation of how they were going to get a 3rd confirmation crammed in there between July of 2009 and December of 2010.

  127. 127.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 3:44 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??: ??? Sorry, I don’t follow. I have been voting in Florida since 1990, primaries and general elections. I am guilty of an enormous mistake in 2000. I don’t get your point.

  128. 128.

    Another Scott

    December 21, 2018 at 3:46 pm

    @Gin & Tonic: Hey, watch the verb tense there, Buster!

    Ms. Cracker, and I, both did. (In my case, it didn’t matter as I lived in VA (won easily by W) .)
    As did many others who learned from that mistake. The current idiots are those who did so and continue to vote 3rd Party after that experience.

    ;-)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  129. 129.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 3:56 pm

    @??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  ??: Oh, sorry, I got you now. By here, you mean BJ, not Florida. Yes, yes, things were a bit snippy in 2016.

  130. 130.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 3:57 pm

    @Betty Cracker: HEE HEE, good one. I hope I didn’t use your name in vain earlier.

  131. 131.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 4:03 pm

    @raven: It’s like one of those drunken sports arguments in a bar: “And I say if Babe Ruth had been a right-handed shortstop and Jack Dunn had sold him to the Baltimore Terrapins in the Federal League…”

  132. 132.

    cope

    December 21, 2018 at 4:05 pm

    Half time is over, back to the Liverpool game.

  133. 133.

    scottinnj

    December 21, 2018 at 4:12 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Simple – Harry Reid could have used the same nuclear option that McConnell used to seat Gorsuch.

    Whether that would have been a good idea, or not (i.e would we have got President Romney in 2012?, is a different question. But it was an option.

  134. 134.

    Uncle Cosmo

    December 21, 2018 at 4:12 pm

    @Cacti: @cmorenc: @Rylan Futch: All of you can go fuck yourselves with a rusty chainsaw. Especially you, Futching Shithead.

  135. 135.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 4:19 pm

    @scottinnj:

    Whether that would have been a good idea, or not (i.e would we have got President Romney in 2012?, is a different question. But it was an option.

    Thank you for at least attempting to answer the question. I suspect that if that had happened and 2010 had gone down the exact same way it did, we would have people screaming about how she screwed us by retiring too early. ?‍♀️

  136. 136.

    J R in WV

    December 21, 2018 at 4:27 pm

    Now, now, no need to put irritating regulars in the same class as Fultch!!

    Tut, tut!

    ETA: After all, sometimes I’m irritating ~!!~

  137. 137.

    Fair Economist

    December 21, 2018 at 4:33 pm

    @Mnemosyne: Who would seriously complain about somebody in their mid seventies retiring after their second camcer diagnosis at the best time to get a good replacement in a generation?

  138. 138.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 4:46 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    The Democrats only had 58 seats, which is why Sotomayor wasn’t confirmed until 8/2009. Why do you remember everything incorrectly

    And was confirmed 68-31.

    Any other specious points you’d like to make?

  139. 139.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 4:51 pm

    @Fair Economist:

    The people who would argue that her retirement was what lost us the 2010 midterms and/or the 2012 presidential election. Because if you haven’t noticed, it’s kind of fucking insane to argue that someone who is currently active on the court is totally going to screw us when she does eventually retire because apparently these people have perfect precognition and know precisely when that’s going to happen.

    Guys, it’s been TEN YEARS. Let it go already. Your alternate history was made inoperative by subsequent events since at least 2012, if not 2010, and unless you’re hiding a DeLorean in your garage, you’re not going to be able to change either the past or the future.

  140. 140.

    Mnemosyne

    December 21, 2018 at 4:54 pm

    @Cacti:

    And was confirmed 68-31.

    And she was not confirmed earlier because …. ?

    Seriously, the amnesia you guys have developed about the Senate from 2008-2009 is a little frightening. I guess Scott Brown has already vanished down the memory hole and the only thing you remember is that the Democrats in the Senate just inexplicably stopped doing what you wanted for no reason at all once he joined the Senate.

  141. 141.

    WaterGirl

    December 21, 2018 at 4:54 pm

    @Cacti: Come back after you get in your time machine and we have a different reality than the one we have now.

  142. 142.

    Cacti

    December 21, 2018 at 5:12 pm

    @Mnemosyne:

    And she was not confirmed earlier because …. ?

    Because Souter’s seat didn’t actually become vacant until the end of the SCOTUS term on June 29.

  143. 143.

    Chris Johnson

    December 21, 2018 at 5:18 pm

    @TS (the original): I’m just waiting to find out that the orders from Russia come directly over the air through Fox News. It’s just as plausible as the NRA being Russian puppets. Watch how it turns out that no private channel is necessary: various Foxers are literally conveying what direction Putin wants on any given day.

    It would mean that when Trump went to the summit (and yeah, I did think he wasn’t coming back, but I didn’t bargain on Putin smacking him around like that) and returned, the other part of the punishment was having Fox turn against him.

    And that was early December, a couple weeks ago.

    And now look at what Trump’s doing. He yanked troops out of Syria and is brainlessly escalating everything, prepared to shut down the government.

    Stimulus/response?

  144. 144.

    Gex

    December 21, 2018 at 5:44 pm

    @VincentN: Agree with being tired of the argument but very interested in your ideas on mitigating a third Trump appointee on the court.

  145. 145.

    Gex

    December 21, 2018 at 5:49 pm

    @Gex: BTW not a sarcastic request. I literally have no idea what can be done if we have a Supreme Court that refuses to uphold legislation passed by Dem legislatures.

  146. 146.

    Betty Cracker

    December 21, 2018 at 5:50 pm

    @cope: God, no. Part of my penance is to serve as a cautionary tale.

  147. 147.

    VincentN

    December 21, 2018 at 11:33 pm

    @Gex: court packing is an idea that has been floating around. And yeah that will require getting the Senate

  148. 148.

    Rylan Futch

    December 23, 2018 at 10:38 pm

    @Uncle Cosmo: Go play your skin flute you dimwit. Not a single one of you idiots has answered the underlying question. Obama got two judges confirmed as I recall. No reason why RBG replacement would not have gone through as well. Look out 6-3 here we come. Them’s gonna be some bitter apples for sure.

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