Get back, motherfucker

Also too, this will leave a mark.






265 replies
  1. 1
    TenguPhule says:

    Also said wall is “like a manhood thing for him. As if manhood could ever be associated with him.”

    The first cut is the deepest.

  2. 2
    Yutsano says:

    JFC. How could Dolt45 live in New York all of his life and think he could cross a fucking nonna?It’s zero wonder Pelosi ate his lunch.

  3. 3
    Gemina13 says:

    God, yes! THIS is why I wanted Nancy for Speaker. She will crush Trump and get shit done besides.

  4. 4
    japa21 says:

    @TenguPhule: He will feel forced to respond to that. She knows exactly what she was saying and what she wanted to have the result be.

  5. 5
  6. 6
    Gemina13 says:

    @Yutsano: Heh. My grandmother, a Calabrian woman, ruled her sons if not her bastard husband. They towered over her, and cowered before her.

  7. 7
    kindness says:

    This! I would like a word with those ‘progressives’ that keep saying Nancy is a terrible leader for House Democrats. Maybe perhaps we can meet. I know of several dark alleys.

  8. 8
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Gemina13: My paternal grandmother was referred to as the Little General. And not because she always had food and drinks ready to go like the convenience store.

  9. 9
    waspuppet says:

    It’s a manhood thing. It’s also the “My cult members are starting to see through me and I have to do SOMETHING I said I would do.”

  10. 10
    dmsilev says:

    Pelosi was going nail Trump’s balls to the wall as a trophy, until she realized that nobody makes sufficiently small nails.

  11. 11
    scav says:

    @Yutsano: Unlike most New Yorkers, Trumpette probably didn’t really interact with people.

  12. 12
    Yellowdog says:

    @Gemina13: Even though I am two generations distant from Sicily, my adult sons still know to cower before “the Look”.

  13. 13
    Mnemosyne says:

    @japa21:

    Yep. It’s not a leak, it’s a “leak” designed to enrage him while giving her plausible deniability.

    She is from a co-equal branch of the government. He’s not the boss of her, and he’s going to find that out the hard way. 😂

    I hope that every one of the House freshwomen are gathered around her to learn in real time how this shit is done.

  14. 14
    Mike in NC says:

    2019 will mark the beginning of the end of Fat Bastard’s Reign of Error. If only they can keep his small fingers away from the nuclear button.

  15. 15
    rikyrah says:

    This poor baby 😪😪😪😪

    NBC News (@NBCNews) Tweeted:
    A 4th-grader in Alabama died by suicide after being bullied with racist taunts, according to the child’s family

    . https://t.co/fXivrmDgin https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1072534999121977344?s=17

  16. 16
    Kay says:

    It’s always a pleasure to watch someone who is good at something when they’re entirely in their element.

  17. 17
    rikyrah says:

    Aide in rm when Pelosi described Oval mtg to colleagues said she crowed about Dems having gotten him to “fully own” a shutdown. Also said wall is “like a manhood thing for him. As if manhood could ever be associated with him.”

    — Julie Davis (@juliehdavis) December 11, 2018

    KAPOW!!!

  18. 18
    West of the Rockies says:

    OT, but do the Vice trailers make Cheney look sort of like a cool rascal rather than the vile toad he is? I find the preview to be very irksome.

  19. 19
    rikyrah says:

    So many make the mistake…

    Nancy LIVES in San Francisco….

    She will forever be…

    Nancy FROM BALTIMORE…

    Don’t know what that means…better ask somebody.

  20. 20
    yam says:

    Trump is in white, NANCY SMASH in green: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_vOHy_uoQA

  21. 21
    Kay says:

    Trump never dealt with a real congress before, and he’s a terrible negotiator. Republicans could have done him a favor by being something other than a rubber stamp.

    This is his first day at work and like all first days, it’s a disaster.

    They coulda eased him in with training wheels. Too late now.

  22. 22
    Martin says:

    I don’t know how the sum total of the responses to Trumps request isn’t “You promised Mexico would pay for this. Go talk to them. We’re not paying for it.”

  23. 23
    C Stars says:

    @japa21: He will have to respond to the whole thing, not just the insult to his masculinity. How does this play out? Does he actually shut the fucking government down, now, out of principle? Or what? Seems like he’s cornered.

    Republican legislators have gotten away with being manipulative, virulent little shits for a long time, but it seems to me the “I’m gonna shut down the government” ploy has never worked in their favor, since Newt’s first display.

    (Which is not to say they won’t try it again, because hey, the definition of insanity….)

    As for responding to Nancy’s attack on his manhood–a guy who is facing criminal indictment for bribing two women he had transactional affairs with is…maybe not in a great PR position to start spouting the misogynistic vomit that his base is expecting.

    Again, not to say he won’t do it anyway….or that he even has enough self-control to resist…

  24. 24
    rikyrah says:

    Nancy Pelosi just did something that not a single Republican has had the guts to do in 2 years.

    Stand up to Trump, in public, to his face. pic.twitter.com/jtLrE5Sir5

    — Judd Legum (@JuddLegum) December 11, 2018

  25. 25
    Jager says:

    Ah, strong women. My grandmother, married to the “Judge” more than once told him, “This isn’t your courtroom”. Somehow at 5’2 she seemed taller than his 6’3

  26. 26
    jl says:

    I don’t have time to watch the clip in previous post. Will do that later. Would be better to negotiate something reasonable to avoid a shutdown, but it’s Trump, so not sure what the point of an attempt would be. If he wants to walk into owning, prolly not much you can do to stop him.

    As for the Trump Wall, I don’t understand why, whenever he brings it up, you just don’t ask/say, over and over and over again “You assured everyone in the whole world that Mexico would pay? Didn’t you say you had a plan for Mexico to pay? But…. Mexico is paying for it, you said so… No, sorry, I don;’t understand why Congress has to throw in a dime, you said Mexico would pay” and so on and so on and so on. That should be the one and only response to the Mexico wall nonsense.

  27. 27
    Corner Stone says:

    @Kay:

    Trump never dealt with a real congress before, and he’s a terrible negotiator.

    Even after the repeated failures to move legislation, mainly because they weren’t cruel enough for the Freedumb Caucasians, Trump still thinks Congress is like Trump Org. He tells them to get him a Diet Coke and they do.

  28. 28
    Burnspbesq says:

    Hard to imagine that Pelosi and Kellyanne Conway graduated from the same college, but it’s true.

  29. 29
    Corner Stone says:

    @rikyrah: Speaker Pelosi *owns* Trump’s ass come Jan 3. And if he doesn’t know it now, he’s gonna find it out real soon.

  30. 30
    SFAW says:

    @dmsilev:

    Pelosi was going nail Trump’s balls to the wall as a trophy, until she realized that nobody makes sufficiently small nails.

    I have some pins she can borrow, their points are small enough.

    Of course, she’ll also need a magnifying glass. I think an SEM would also work, but it might be overkill.

  31. 31
    Kay says:

    Jury recommends life plus 412 years, which is of course a crazy-long sentence.

    The problem is he isn’t remorseful. I think he’d do it again if he got out:

    A taped phone call from jail between Fields and his mother was also played for the court. In it, Fields is heard lashing out at Heyer’s mother, Susan Bro, calling her a “communist” and “anti-white supremacist” who was trying to slander him, according to the NBC 29.

    He really thinks he’s in a war.

    I bet they’re feeding him his martyrdom while he’s in jail too. I don’t think they can ever let him out. He’s just getting more and more radicalized.

  32. 32
    Corner Stone says:

    I’m going to look for a transcript of this WH meeting later. It’s always a much more insane level of insane insanity to read the insane shit Trump says.

  33. 33
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @C Stars:

    but it seems to me the “I’m gonna shut down the government” ploy has never worked in their favor, since Newt’s first display.

    I think the last time this happened, Democrats were getting blamed for it in equal measure by the press. This resulted in a compromise on Dreamers and a reliance on the courts to save them from Donald, which luckily happened.

    Basically, the press will bend over backwards to bothsides every altercation, even when it’s Trump who’s making new demands. It’s the Democrats fault for not giving in, you see?

  34. 34

    @Kay: @rikyrah: It’s not just the last 2 years though. Trump has never really in his whole adult life had to deal with anybody who wasn’t his Daddy telling him no and meaning it. He’s not going to react well, to say the least.

  35. 35
    jl says:

    Discouraging news today is Trump roll back of water conservation progress imposed on a poor helpless country by liberal Democrat communists Obama, Dub, Clinton and G.H.W.

    And maybe Carter, Ford, and Nixon. I think some of the regs removed go back to 1972.

  36. 36
    Mnemosyne says:

    @MisterForkbeard:

    Last time, the Republicans controlled the House. It’s a whole new ballgame now.

  37. 37
    cliosfanboy says:

    @Adam L Silverman: she sold car insurance on television?

  38. 38
    JanieM says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Are you part Italian?

    My paternal grandparents were born in Italy, and my grandma was one of those grandmas too. The matriarch, “Ma” to an entire neighborhood. Despite the fact that my mom was a rural Baptist, I grew up in such a uniformly Italian Catholic world that I was in (Catholic) high school before I realized there were *Irish* Catholics too. (J/K)

    That’s preliminary to saying that until I went to college, my world was pretty homogeneous. Then one year during college I went home for Thanksgiving with a Jewish friend, and all of a sudden I felt……right at home. :-)

  39. 39
    bobbo says:

    She can’t even with him

  40. 40
    BC in Illinois says:

    Nancy Pelosi should re-release her 2008 book: Know Your Power: A message to America’s Daughters. It tells of her first run for Congress, when “Daddy” (Thomas D’Alesandro Jr., Mayor of Baltimore) sent “Tommy” (Thomas D’Alesandro III, in his own time Mayor of Baltimore) to see how the campaign was going:

    When he called our father, Daddy asked, “So how is it? What’s her campaign like? Does she have a good organization?”
    “Yes,” Tommy said. “She’s true to her roots. She’s going to give them a run.”

    The rest of the page talks about “the most important D’Alasandro rule of all: Count Your Votes.”

    When Speaker Pelosi called out Trump’s BS . . .

    Trump: “If I needed the votes for the wall in the house, I would have them in one session. It would be done.”
    Pelosi: “So go do it.”

    . . . she knows that he doesn’t have the votes. Yes, there are more than 318 Republicans in the House, but (1) there are Freedom Caucus idiots who will vote against any bill for some dumbass reason; (2) there are “moderates” who don’t want a shutdown vote hanging around their necks; and (3) there are some of the November losers who may not even show up.

    Never go against a D’Alasandro when vote-counting is on the line.

  41. 41
    Kay says:

    @Corner Stone:

    When I hear foreign leaders compliment him I just cringe because I know they know they’ll be able to to take him for everything.
    The Japanese PM! I don’t blame them at all. I would do the same thing in their shoes. They have their own objectives. If it means complimenting him on a made up historic victory in the midterms or giving Kushner an award I would do it :)

  42. 42
    cliosfanboy says:

    @rikyrah: anyone from the mid-Atlantic knows what that means…..

  43. 43
    SFAW says:

    @Gemina13:

    God, yes! THIS is why I wanted Nancy for Speaker. She will crush Trump and get shit done besides.

    Meanwhile, according to a story I saw at TPM this AM, the Quislings concerned Dems trying to oust her are trying to get her to agree to “no more than four years as Speaker,” with the same for Hoyer and Clyburn (in their roles).

    I wonder how Moulton is going to make that stick after he gets primaried out.

  44. 44
    chopper says:

    dang they are just DARIN him to shut the shit down.

  45. 45

    For those of you who want to ask Trump why Mexico isn’t paying for the wall –

    That is framing the issue in his terms. Using your opponent’s terms is always a losing proposition. Pelosi and Schumer, in the video, frame it in terms of “Democrats are for border security” and “Let’s keep doing what we’re doing.” They’re defining the argument.

  46. 46
    C Stars says:

    @jl: These are proposed rollbacks, right? Which will hopefully get caught up in lawsuits. It’s upsetting, but I’m wary that this is perhaps an example of Bannon’s “flood the media with shit” tactic, in which the latest Trump-generated outrage of the day shatters the public’s focus on the *real* outrage (Trump’s criminal activities).

  47. 47
    germy says:

    Leon Panetta: "We have just seen a perfect example of how not to govern the country. To have that kind of dispute and to do it openly before the press … to have everybody yelling at one another, I think that it has just sent a terrible message to the American people." @MSNBC— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 11, 2018

    I disagree. I don’t care for the “behind closed doors” stuff. Our taxes pay their salaries; let’s hear what they have to say to each other.

  48. 48

    @Yutsano: My Indian grandmother ruled with an iron paw. All she had to do was give a look! We called her Indira Gandhi. She was a softie where I was concerned, as her oldest grandchild, I was her favorite and could do no wrong, but not so with her 3 sons and one daughter. She worked for the state tax department, when women having careers was unheard of.

  49. 49
    germy says:

    A $5 billion border wall is a waste of money. Stop the government shutdown threats and let's invest in domestic priorities like infrastructure, health care, and paid family and sick leave.

    — Kamala Harris (@KamalaHarris) December 11, 2018

  50. 50
    TenguPhule says:

    @Kay:

    I bet they’re feeding him his martyrdom while he’s in jail too. I don’t think they can ever let him out. He’s just getting more and more radicalized.

    As I said before, may his life be unexpectedly short.

    Some people require the death penalty for the good of the general public. This guy is one of them.

  51. 51
    jl says:

    @C Stars: Yes. Thanks. I need to take a deep breath and go read about it. The news blurb didn’t specify what had to be reviewed and what could be imposed. But it did rattle off the previous administrations whose policies and reg are supposed to be dumped. When you roll back what little Dub did, that is a bad sign. I think that has something to do with river delta/seashore conservation. But they did specifically say Trumpsters want to throw away regs going back to 1972, or propose to throw away.

  52. 52
    MattF says:

    My sister reminded me at Thanksgiving that gramma taught herself to read and write English. Of course when you tried to read what she wrote, you had to read it with a Yiddish accent to understand it. “You Jew?”, she’d say, “Talk Jew.

  53. 53
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Mnemosyne: Agreed, but if the press will blame the Democrats even when the Republicans instigate the problem and the Democrats don’t even have the House, it’s going to be MUCH worse this time unless played very carefully.

    If anyone can do it, it’s Nancy Smash. But I’m still skeptical – our press is just too awful.

  54. 54
    C Stars says:

    @MisterForkbeard: I guess I remember the last episode of threat being more favorable for the Dems in terms of public perception; I seem to recall a lot of Republicans getting flustered and dissembling about it. But that’s just my memory of how it went down. The good news is that this time the Dems have corroborating evidence (with this video) that Trump wants to take on the mantle of the shutdown.
    Not to say that the NYT isn’t as we speak formulating some ridiculous headline implying that the Dems are eager for a shutdown….

  55. 55
    trollhattan says:

    @rikyrah:
    Nancy SMASH has a grand political pedigree, daughter of Thomas D’Alesandro and thus savvy to not only Balmore politics but also the Maryland state house and US House. But her craft was honed being a protege to Phil Burton, considered the true genius of California Democratic politics. It’s his seat she holds now, having succeeded his widow, who took the seat after he died.

    SF may have a squishy reputation today but it was very bare-knuckles back in the day. I got to know the place during the Joe Alioto era, which to be honest was a lot more interesting than today.

  56. 56
    SFAW says:

    In the CNN.com article where they writ “sparks fly,” Sen. Linseed Graham has decided that Manliest-of-All-Men, Preznit Shitgibbon, should just stare down that shrieking harpy Pelosi and the rest of the Dems.

    As Shakespeare or someone else said: “Go for it, asshole, and we’ll see how that works out for you.”

  57. 57
    Corner Stone says:

    @germy:

    A $5 billion border wall is a waste of money.

    I feel like I’m old enough to remember when the ask was $25B for the border wall or the entire country would die.

  58. 58
    TenguPhule says:

    @jl: It really is that bad.

    Basically its one big “FUCK YOU” to water pollution restrictions.

  59. 59
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @SFAW: To be fair, Nancy probably SHOULD only spend that much longer as Speaker and I don’t think she wants to – she’d planned on retiring if Hillary won the presidency, if I remember right. But we need to actually bring up a new leadership team, and it looks like she’s trying her best to do that.

    The dumb thing (of course) is that now Seth Moulton is trying to make her look weak, like he pressured her into doing something she’d probably do anyway. Because it’s all about him, as opposed to party or country.

  60. 60
    TenguPhule says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I feel like I’m old enough to remember when the ask was $25B for the border wall or the entire country would die.

    MS-13 was going to come and rape the cat and burn the women.

  61. 61
    cliosfanboy says:

    @schrodingers_cat: sounds like my paternal grandma. Only child of her son, not to mention eldest of the eldest. I was dead last In the eyes of my maternal grandma because I was a damn yankee,…

  62. 62
    cain says:

    I think the big takeway is that Trump looked weak to his supporters. Supporters main attraction to Trump is that he’s a negotiator and he doesn’t take shit. That exchange, the swarmy look on Schumer’s face knowing he’s pwning Trump. It’s going to get to them. They like backing winners. Trump looked like a complete loser. You cant spin that very well because it’s clear as day. Trump is going to shut down the govt and he and the Republicans are going to own it.

    Trump showed himself as being effeminate to his supporters. The other take away is that without a Chief of Staff to guide him, he’s going to be making more and more mistakes in front of the camera. Basically, next year is going to be a bitch for him and his supporters. Democrats should make sure that they have the cameras running when they speak to him.

  63. 63
    Corner Stone says:

    @germy: I don’t have any time for this soft sell politics bullshit some D’s are pushing. We get it bad enough from the media, we don’t need a recognizable D like Panetta or Lord Axelrod lecturing us on backroom BS. Reporter Sahil Kapur tried that “bipartisan dreaming” bullshit on his twit feed and got dragged for it.

  64. 64
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Kay:

    “anti-white supremacist”

    Jesus Christ. I didn’t realize the rightwing bubble was that bad.

  65. 65
    TenguPhule says:

    Gap continues to widen between Trump and intelligence community on key issues

    Sleep tight, folks.

    Trump continues to reject the judgments of U.S. spy agencies on major foreign policy fronts, creating a dynamic in which intelligence analysts frequently see troubling gaps between his public statements and the facts laid out for him in daily briefings on world events, current and former U.S. officials said.

    The pattern has become a source of mounting concern to senior U.S. intelligence officials who had hoped that Trump would become less hostile to their work as he settled into office and more receptive to the information that spy agencies spend billions of dollars and sometimes put lives at risk gathering.

    Instead, Trump’s distrust that once seemed confined mainly to the intelligence community’s assessments about Russia’s interference in the 2016 election has spread across a range of global issues. Among them are North Korea’s willingness to abandon its nuclear weapons program, Iran’s nuclear and regional ambitions, the existence and implications of global climate change and the role of the Saudi crown prince in the murder of a dissident journalist.

  66. 66
    Corner Stone says:

    @TenguPhule: “We pruned the hedges of many small villages!”

  67. 67
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Adam L Silverman:My grandmother was a big woman, big enough that she played woman’s pro basketball in NYC in the 30s. Her team beat the Harlem Globetrotters in a straight up game. She was called Gabby by everyone (out of earshot) because of her loud and bossy ways.

  68. 68
    TenguPhule says:

    @Steve in the ATL:

    I didn’t realize the rightwing bubble was that bad.

    That’s no moon.

  69. 69
    TenguPhule says:

    @Corner Stone:

    “We pruned the hedges of many small villages!”

    Shrubberies!

  70. 70
    trollhattan says:

    The “Where’s Mexico’s wall cash?” question is a good one to keep in the public’s eye but I’m more interested in a high-and-hard throwback against “Democrats want open borders!”

    Our current border is so not open, wall or no fucking wall. It hasn’t been particularly “open” in my lifetime, nor Trump’s. Name one Democrat who supports abandoning our border security by pulling the Border Patrol away and opening every gate. Go on, name one or shut the fuck up.

    “Open border” to the media is like that one “scientist” they pull in to refute human-caused climate change.

  71. 71
    TenguPhule says:

    “Trump receives regular briefings and takes counsel from his national security advisors, including the CIA Director,” White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said in a statement. “Whether it was deciding to move the U.S. Embassy to Jerusalem, standing up to Iran’s malign activities, or a host of other actions, Trump makes decisions based on a full spectrum of information.”

    Its the flat out lying that gets me.

    Daniel Coats, the director of National Intelligence, said that Trump “remains an active and regular consumer of intelligence. Any notion that he and his National Security team are not fully engaged in the [President’s Daily Brief] is false and clearly not based on direct knowledge.”

    Nobody sane believes them. Nobody.

  72. 72
    Barbara says:

    @Kay:

    I bet they’re feeding him his martyrdom while he’s in jail too. I don’t think they can ever let him out. He’s just getting more and more radicalized.

    My family is peripherally acquainted with one of the somewhat notorious hate killers over the last 20 years, and one of the things that is hardest to understand is how much “fan mail” he receives from all over the country, all over the world for all I know. He shot completely innocent people (and some of his would be victims showed true bravery responding to his craziness). It’s just sick. Fields is most likely going to have the exact same kind of existence.

  73. 73
    HeleninEire says:

    Y’all are gonna make me watch this, ain’t ya? I tried. I swear. But I hate his fucking voice. Maybe after another drink or 5.

    I’ll report back.

  74. 74
    Corner Stone says:

    @cain:

    Supporters main attraction to Trump is that he’s a negotiator and he doesn’t take shit.

    Not disagreeing with your argument but I would contend that at least as powerful a draw for Trump supporters has been proven to be that they like he’s a racist bigoted misogynist who hurts brown people and is cruel at every opportunity.

  75. 75
    trollhattan says:

    @TenguPhule:
    “Full spectrum” means they give Donny the red, orange, yellow, green, blue and purple crayons and ask him to draw some orders for them to carry out.

  76. 76
    MomSense says:

    @rikyrah:

    Yup. I’m just glad she’s on our side.

  77. 77
    TenguPhule says:

    Transcript now out.

    Its worse then we thought.

    TRUMP: So we’re going to see. But I will tell you the wall will get built. We’ll see what happens. It is not an easy situation because the Democrats have a different view, I think that I can say, the Republicans. We have great Republican support. We don’t have Democrat support. But we’re going to talk about that now. We’re going to see.

    One thing that I do have to say is tremendous amounts of wall have already been built, and a lot of wall when you include the renovation of existing fences and walls renovated a tremendous amount, and we’ve done a lot of work. In San Diego we’re building new walls right now. And we’ve — right next to San Diego, we’ve completed a major section of wall, and it’s really worked well. So a lot of wall has been built. We don’t talk about that, but we might as well start because it’s being built right now. Big sections of wall. And we will continue that. And one way or the other it’s going to get built. I’d like not to see a government closing, a shutdown. We will see what happens over the next short period of time. But the wall is a very important thing to us. I might put it a different way. Border security is extremely important, and we have to take care of border security when you look at what happened with the caravans and the people and a lot of people. We shut it down. We had no choice. We shut it down. But it could be a lot easier if we had real border security.

    I just want to pay my respects to the Border Patrol agents and officers. They’ve been incredible. The ICE agents and officers, they’ve been incredible, and very importantly, our military, our military went in and they did an incredible job. They have been really, really spectacular.

    No, this isn’t a duplicate copy, he really did basically repeat himself.

    TRUMP: We’re going to talk about the wall. I wanted to talk about criminal justice reform just to let you know how positive that is. I want to talk about the farm bill how positive that is, and I want to talk about the wall. And I will tell you, it’s a tough issue, because we are on very opposite sides of — I really think I can say border security, but certainly the wall.

    But the wall will get built. A lot of the wall is built. It’s been very effective. I asked for a couple of notes on that. If you look at San Diego, illegal traffic dropped 92 percent once the wall was up. El Paso, illegal traffic dropped 72 percent, then ultimately 95 percent once the wall was up. In Tucson, Arizona, illegal traffic dropped 92 percent. Yuma, it dropped illegal traffic 95 to 96 percent.

    I mean, and when I say dropped, the only reason we even have any percentage where people got through is because they walk and go around areas that aren’t built. It dropped virtually 100 percent in the areas where the wall is. So I mean, it’s very effective. If you really want to find out how effective a wall is, just ask Israel: 99.9 percent effective that our wall will be every bit as good as that, if not better. So we’ve done a lot of work on the wall, a lot of wall is built. A lot of people don’t know that. A lot of wall is renovated. We have walls were in very bad condition and they are now in A-1 tip-top shape. And frankly, some wall has been reinforced by our military. The military has done a fantastic job. So the wall will get built, but we may not — we may not have an agreement today. We probably won’t. But we have an agreement on other things that are really good.

  78. 78
    TenguPhule says:

    @Barbara:

    and one of the things that is hardest to understand is how much “fan mail” he receives from all over the country, all over the world for all I know. He shot completely innocent people (and some of his would be victims showed true bravery responding to his craziness). It’s just sick. Fields is most likely going to have the exact same kind of existence.

    And this is one of the many reasons why I still support capital punishment, if only with the highest of standards enforced.

  79. 79
    Raven says:

    @A Ghost To Most: And she took the rock to the rack!

  80. 80
    Raven says:

    @TenguPhule:

    WASHINGTON — President Donald Trump’s threatened government shutdown over his border wall would leave most federal workers untouched but would, ironically, hit those who actually guard the border: agents for ICE and Border Patrol, who would likely have to work without pay for the duration of the impasse.

  81. 81
    TenguPhule says:

    PELOSI: …I think the American people recognize that we must keep government open, that a shutdown is not worth anything, and that you should not have a Trump shutdown.

    You have a

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: Did you say “Trump?”

    (CROSSTALK)

    PELOSI: You have the White House. You have the Senate. You have the House of Representatives. You have the votes. You should pass it.

    TRUMP: No, we don’t have the votes, Nancy, because in the Senate we need 60 votes, and we don’t have it (ph).

    PELOSI: No, no, but in the House, you could bring it up right now.

    TRUMP: Yes, but I can’t — excuse me, but I can’t get it passed in the House if it’s not going to pass in the Senate; I don’t want to waste time.

    PELOSI: Well, the fact is, you can get it started that way.

    TRUMP: The House we could get passed very easily, and we do.

    PELOSI: Okay, then do it. Then do it.

    And then he does it again.

    TRUMP: If I needed the votes for the wall in the House, I would have them in one session; it would be done.

    PELOSI: Well, then go do it. Go do it.

    TRUMP: It doesn’t help, because we need 10 Democrats in the Senate.

    PELOSI: No, don’t put it on the Senate; put it on — put it on the negotiation.

    TRUMP: Okay, let me ask you this, just — and we’re doing this in a very friendly manner. It doesn’t help for me to take a vote in the House where I will win easily with the Republicans.

    PELOSI: You will not win.

    TRUMP: It doesn’t help to take the vote, because I’m not going to vote the vote of the Senate.

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: I need 10 senators. That’s the problem.

    PELOSI: Mr. President, you have the White House, you have the Senate

    TRUMP: I have the White House. The White House is done.

    PELOSI: You have the House.

    TRUMP: And the House would give me the vote if I wanted it. But I can’t because I need

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: Nancy, I need 10 votes from Chuck.

    SCHUMER: All right, let me say something here.

    PELOSI: Let me — let me say one thing. The fact is that you do not have the votes in the House.

    TRUMP: Nancy, I do, and we need border security.

    PELOSI: Well, let’s take the vote and we’ll find out.

    TRUMP: Nancy, Nancy, we need border security. It’s very simple.

    PELOSI: Of course we do.

    TRUMP: We need border security. People are pouring into our country, including terrorists. We have terrorists. But we caught 10 terrorists. These are over the last very short period of time — 10. These are very serious people. All of our law enforcement have been incredible, but we caught 10 terrorists, these are people that were looking to do harm. We need the wall. We need — more important than anything, we need border security of which the wall is just a piece, but it’s important.

    Chuck, did you want to say something?

    SCHUMER: Yes, here’s what I wanted to say. We have a lot of disagreements here. The Washington Post today gave you a lot of Pinocchios, because they say you constantly misstate how much of the wall is built, and how much there (ph).

    But that’s not the point here. We have a disagreement about the wall.

    TRUMP: The Washington Post

    (CROSSTALK)

    SCHUMER: Whether it’s effective or it isn’t. Not on border security, but on the wall.

    We do not want to shut down the government. You were called 20 times to shut down the government. You say, I want to shut down the government. We don’t. We want to come to an agreement. If we can’t come to an agreement, we have solutions that will pass the House and Senate right now and will not shut down the government, and that’s what we’re urging you to do, not threaten to shut down the government.

    TRUMP: But you don’t want to shut down the government, Chuck

    (CROSSTALK)

    SCHUMER: Because you can’t get your way.

    TRUMP: The last time you shut it down you got killed.

    SCHUMER: Yes, let me say something, Mr. President. You just say, my way or we’ll shut down the government. We have a proposal that Democrats and Republicans will support to do a C.R. that will not shut down the government. We urge you to take it.

    TRUMP: And if it’s not good border security, I won’t take (ph) it.

    SCHUMER: It is very good border security.

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: And if it’s not good border security I won’t take it.

  82. 82
    jl says:

    @TenguPhule: Insane. If I were there, I couldn’t help but smear his face in his nonsense and lies.
    “I’m sorry Mr. President, isn’t Mexico paying for the wall….?”
    “No, I still don’t understand, you said Mexico would pay for the wall and everything is going according your great plan, so I don’t understand why Congress has to appropriate any money….?”
    “But, you said Mexico would pay, right? What am I missing….?”
    “But Mexico is paying, one of the first things you did was unveil a foolproof plan for Mexico to pay. Why don’t we implement that? Congress would be happy to help you with that.”
    “No, sorry, I still don’t understand… You said Mexico would pay….”

    That is really all I would ever say in response to Trump on his dumb wall.

    Or maybe finally I would say: “I read several reports that even you thought the Mexico wall was a dumb waste of money, but your supporters cheered so much for it, you decided to go with it, dumb or not. So, since apparently even you think it’s stupid, why don’t we just drop it? On the other hand, you promised Mexico would come up with the money, so if they’re paying, then we can talk about building it, maybe Let us know when you have the Mexico wall money.”

  83. 83
    Kent says:

    The last time it was Dems who were making the “ask” for a DACA fix to be included or they wouldn’t provide the votes necessary for the budget. In a sense it was THEIR shutdown when there was a budget to vote for sans-DACA.

    This time is is Trump (and only Trump) making the ask for billions more for his wall. When there is an existing budget agreement with lesser amounts of border security funding. So in reality and in terms of optics, it is indeed his shutdown.

    What is he going to do when both the house and the Senate pass a budget or continuing resolution that gives him token $$$ and then adjorn to go home for Christmas? Is he really going to veto it and try to call them all back to Washington on Dec 24 or whatever?

  84. 84
    Gemina13 says:

    @Adam L Silverman: It takes a strong understanding of logistics and strategy to effectively manage a household. Sounds like your grandmother had that down pat.

  85. 85
    TenguPhule says:

    TRUMP: Without a wall — these are only areas where you have the walls. Where you have walls, Chuck, it’s effective. Where you don’t have walls, it is not effective

    Batshit bugfucking bonkers.

    QUESTION: You say border security and the wall. Can you have border security without the wall?

    TRUMP: You need — you need the wall. The wall is a part of border security.

    QUESTION: Can you define (ph) what it means to have border security.

    TRUMP: Yes, we need border security. The wall is a part of border security. You can’t have very border security without the wall.

    PELOSI: That’s not true. That is a political promise. Border security is a way to effectively honor our responses.

    QUESTION: And the experts say you can do border security without a wall, which is wasteful and doesn’t solve the problem.

    TRUMP: It totally solves the problem, and it’s very important.

    Its like watching a train crash into an exploding plane as it flies into a Sharknado that is hit by a rogue comet.

    TRUMP: And we gained in the Senate. Nancy, we’ve gained in the Senate. Excuse me, did we win the Senate? We won the Senate.

    (CROSSTALK)

    SCHUMER: When the president brags that he won North Dakota and Indiana, he’s in real trouble.

    TRUMP: I did. We did. We did win North Dakota and Indiana.

    PELOSI: Let me say this — let me say this, this is the most unfortunate thing. We came in here in good faith, and we’re entering into a — this kind of a discussion in the public view.

    TRUMP: But it’s not bad, Nancy. It’s called transparency.

    PELOSI: No, and — I know — it’s not transparency when we’re not stipulating to a set of facts, and when we want to have a debate with you about saying — we confront some of those facts, we have

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: You know what, we need border security. That’s what we’re going to be talking about, border security. If we don’t have border security, we’ll shut down the government. This country needs border security. The wall is a part of border security. Let’s have a talk. We’re going to get the wall built, and we’ve done a lot of wall already.

    QUESTION: (OFF-MIKE)

    TRUMP: It’s a big part of it.

    QUESTION: Is it everything that you need?

    TRUMP: It’s a big part of it. We need to have effective border security. We need a wall in certain parts, no, not all parts, but in certain parts of a 2,000-mile border, we need a wall.

    QUESTION: How much money?

    TRUMP: We are doing it much under budget. We are actually way under budget of the areas that we’ve renovated and areas that we’ve built. I would say if we got — if we got $5 billion, we could do a tremendous chunk of wall.

    QUESTION: Are you willing to accept less though, and are

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: Well, we’re going to see. We’re going to see. Look, we have to have the wall. This isn’t a question; this is a national emergency. Drugs are pouring into our country. People with tremendous medical difficulty and medical problems are pouring in, and in many — in many cases it’s contagious. They’re pouring into our country. We have to have border security. We have to have a wall as part of border security. And I don’t think we really disagree so much.

  86. 86
    trollhattan says:

    BTW, didn’t testing of the demonstration wall segments in San Diego reveal they’re all breachable?

    “Show me a 20-foot wall and I’ll show you a 21-foot ladder.”

  87. 87
    jl says:

    @Kent: If Trump thinks that would look ‘strong’.. he’d do it in a second.

  88. 88
    tobie says:

    @MisterForkbeard: I’ve never understood why Kathleen Rice decided to join forces with Seth Moulton and Tim Ryan. She’s more liberal than the two.

    @Corner Stone: I’m trying to think of former White House staffers who’ve been good TV pundits and can’t think of anyone. Axelrod, Van Jones, Panetta are terrible at it. John Brennan is better at it but being the head of the CIA is not the same as being White House staff. Am I missing an obvious choice?

  89. 89
    TenguPhule says:

    SCHUMER: One thing I think we can agree on is we shouldn’t shut down the government over a dispute. And you want to shut it down. You keep talking about.

    TRUMP: I — no, no, no, no, the last time, Chuck, you shut it down.

    SCHUMER: No, no, no.

    TRUMP: Twenty times.

    SCHUMER: Twenty times — 20 times, you were called for I will shut down the government if I don’t get my wall. None of us has said

    TRUMP: You want to know something?

    SCHUMER: You said it.

    TRUMP: Okay, you want to put that (inaudible).

    SCHUMER: You’ve said it.

    TRUMP: You know what I’ll say? Yes. If we don’t get what we want one way or the other, whether it’s through you, through a military, through anything you want to call, I will shut down the government, absolutely.

    SCHUMER: Okay, fair enough. We disagree. We disagree.

    TRUMP: And I’ll tell you what, I am proud to shut down the government for border security, Chuck, because the people of this country don’t want criminals and people that have lots of problems, and drugs pouring into our country.

    So I will take the mantle. I will be the to shut it down. I’m not going to blame you for it. The last time you shut it down it didn’t work. I will take the mantle of shutting down, and I’m going to shut it down for border security.

    SCHUMER: But we believe you shouldn’t shut it down.

    (CROSSTALK)

    TRUMP: Thank you very much, everybody.

    This…this isn’t SNL. My gods this is not SNL.

  90. 90
    germy says:

    It’s almost like The Wall is nothing but a symbol—a monumental middle-finger for White America to put on display for the rest of the world. And it’s almost like making Mexico pay for it was just part of that symbolism, a bit of extra Fuck You! atop the resentment sundae. Nobody at those rallies, it seems, was particularly focused on the financial details.

    https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a25474337/president-trump-wall-meeting-chuck-schumer-nancy-pelosi/

  91. 91

    @TenguPhule: And you choose to magnify Trump’s words rather than Pelosi and Schumer’s brilliance?

  92. 92
    Miss Bianca says:

    @germy: Strangely, I find myself unable to give a shit what Leon Panetta thinks.

  93. 93
    TenguPhule says:

    @jl: I would have borrowed a page from President Obama’s debate with Romney with the whole navy thing.

    “You see Mr. Trump, there are these new fangled inventions called boats, they sail on water and can land on the shores of the USA, are you proposing we build walls all along our shoreline, Mr. Trump? And these other devices, we call them airplanes, they fly through the air like birds do, Mr. Trump. How do you intend to build a wall tall enough to keep them out?

  94. 94
    TenguPhule says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: Didn’t want to break the blog in one mega post. The slicing and dicing followed shortly.

  95. 95
    SRW1 says:

    To solve the issue with The Wall, can’t Congress give some bling to Javanka? That seems to have gotten the Messikans off the hook!

  96. 96
    geg6 says:

    This is why Nancy Pelosi is the awesomest of the awesome and anyone who thought she shouldn’t be speaker should be drummed out of the Democratic Party forever. Idiots.

  97. 97
    germy says:

    "The press is all there! Chuck is really shouting out. I was trying to be the mom. I can’t explain it to you. It was so wild. It goes to show you: 'you get into a tickle contest with a skunk, you get tinkle all over you," Pelosi to her members after, per aide in room.— Josh Dawsey (@jdawsey1) December 11, 2018

    I kind of love that Pelosi is unified with the Nanas of the nation in still using tinkle. https://t.co/VGqk3posf4— Schooley (@Rschooley) December 11, 2018

  98. 98
    Kent says:

    @jl:

    A bunch of them are lame ducks who have already moved out of their DC digs. You really think they are going to want to get back on a plane and skip Christmas because of Trump’s ego? Especially all those GOP house members who lost because he was hanging around their necks?

  99. 99
    jl says:

    @TenguPhule: No. I don’t know if would be good politics, but from the first time this came up, I just would not be able to help myself. Every response would start with “But you said you had a foolproof plan for Mexico to pay….” That would have been my first response in January 2017, and it would be my only response as long as Trump is in the WH.

    “Sorry, I don’t understand, you promised very strongly and bigly that Mexico would pay. period…”

    I just could get any substantive response out at all, his wall doesn’t deserve it. Just always “Isn’t Mexico paying?” “Didn’t you yourself think it was dumb?” I wouldn’t be able to say anything else. I know my limits, I guess.

  100. 100
    jl says:

    @TenguPhule: I’m probably not a good politician. From Jan 2017 to now, all I could get out of my mouth would be “But you promised Mexico would pay.” and “Didn’t you yourself think the wall was a dumb idea?”

  101. 101
    TenguPhule says:

    Top U.S. border official defends use of tear gas, says walls are ‘important tool’

    U.S. Customs and Border Protection commissioner Kevin McAleenan told senators Tuesday that his agents’ use of tear gas last month to stop a mass illegal crossing was a justified response to an “assaultive” crowd, and said the United States continues to face a “border security and humanitarian crisis” because so many Central American families and children continue to arrive seeking asylum.

    Testifying before members of the Senate Judiciary Committee, McAleenan fielded questions on an array of enforcement topics, from the separation of children from their parents at the border this year to border wall cost projections and sweeping demographic changes in the composition of those taken into custody by U.S. agents.

    When asked by Sen. Dianne Feinstein (Calif.), the committee’s top Democrat, whether CBP agents and officers targeted children with tear gas Nov. 25, when hundreds of people in Tijuana rushed toward the border in a chaotic melee, McAleenan told her “absolutely not.”

    “We did not target young children,” he said, insisting that agents responded with gas and pepper ball rounds after “agitators” threw rocks at them in an attempt to force their way through the border. CBP said last month that four of its agents were struck by rocks but uninjured, however McAleenan said Tuesday that one agent ended up needing knee surgery.

    Nobody believes them. As Kay has said, they’ve spent the government’s credibility and didn’t bother to make any deposits.

  102. 102
    Joy in FL says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: That’s a very good reminder to make the Truth Sandwich. Don’t let 45* frame the discussion/argument.

  103. 103
    TS (the original) says:

    @jl:

    As for the Trump Wall, I don’t understand why, whenever he brings it up

    People don’t ask what was happening for the past 2 years. GOP Senate – GOP house – GOP President – why didn’t the GOP fund the wall? Were they waiting for Mexico to pay? Nothing to do with democrats – they didn’t want a wall.

  104. 104
    TenguPhule says:

    @jl: Cheryl is right that the Mexico pay is falling into Trump’s framing.

    The goal has always been to make the whole idea a sick joke. The best way to destroy support for “the wall” is to keep pointing out all the stupid things about it. People don’t like to support things that make them look stupid.

  105. 105
    dmsilev says:

    @germy: Trump is a germaphobe among other things. I really really hope someone quotes Pelosi’s words to him directly and completely.

  106. 106
    Corner Stone says:

    @tobie: Josh Earnest was pretty good at it, but that was kind of his job in the Obama WH. I don’t mind Matt Miller too much but Jeremy Bash takes himself a little too seriously for my tastes.
    I’m really just out of evens from being told “dry powder” and “bipartisanship” and other bullshit. It’s a good thing I recently restocked with some Reese’s miniature PB cups.

  107. 107
    ruemara says:

    @Kay: They all are. And as long as social media outlets like YouTube & Twitter let the neonazis earn money, & the far left feels they’re fighting oligarchs so maybe we can have a little alignment – they’ll continue to be a dangerous threat. I don’t know what the solution is.

  108. 108
    tobie says:

    @geg6: She is, and yet the Sunrise Movement has chosen to target her for a second day in a row. Yesterday they staged a sit in at the Capitol under the banner, “No more excuses.” Today, they’re blocking the front and rear entrances to her San Francisco office:

    ‘Sunrise Movement 🌅
    ‏@sunrisemvmt
    Speaker @nancypelosi we’ve been outside your office for over an hour and we’re not going away!
    “We’re gonna rise up, rise up ‘til it’s won!
    When the people rise up, the powers come down!
    They try to stop us, but we keep coming back!”

    Brave activists are risking arrest outside @nancypelosi’s offfice in SF in a moral act of civil disobedience until she does the right thing and embraces the #GreenNewDeal.

    The @sunrisemvmt won’t back down. #NoExcuses! #timeisup!
    Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Justice Democrats, Bill McKibben and 4 other’

    Note the link: Sunrise Movement, Justice Democrats, AOC. Wilmer’s new platform is the Green New Deal. The proposed selected committee will serve to craft a proposal that will be used as a litmus test in 2020. One thing I’m sure of is that Nancy knows what they’re up to and that’s a good thing.

  109. 109
    jl says:

    @TS (the original):@TS (the original): Plausible points. I don’t think repeatedly pointing out that everything Trump ever said about it is a fantastical lie, so a dig about Trump saying Mexico would pay always has a place.

    But, I can see how you need to be following the politics closely, and go with the flow, in order to say whatever makes Trump look worst in the moment.

  110. 110
    Brendan in NC says:

    @yam: i prefer this:

  111. 111
    TenguPhule says:

    @tobie:

    Brave activists are risking arrest outside @nancypelosi’s offfice in SF in a moral act of civil disobedience until she does the right thing and embraces the #GreenNewDeal.

    Brave activists target an ally who won’t arrest them rather then the Moral hazard that is the current Senate majority leader. Or Paul Ryan.

  112. 112
    TenguPhule says:

    Tucker Carlson: Trump is a crime victim

    …………

    Is it five o’clock yet?

  113. 113
    Kay says:

    @Barbara:

    I followed his case because he lived in Maumee, Ohio.

    I lived in Maumee when my two oldest were little and we were really happy there. It’s right outside Toledo. It has a nice library, parks, good schools. He really wasn’t in some hopeless rust belt hellhole. It’s not a bad place at all. The narrative about him was wrong, how he was portrayed as a justifiably angry member of the white working class. He would have done okay there, with even a minimum effort. It’s affordable. We had a big house and a huge garden and we were renters and fairly low income. It’s a good place to be working class. My kids remember it fondly.

  114. 114
    Immanentize says:

    @Kay: The real racists in prison, like the Aryan Brotherhood, will munch on him like a chew toy. He is a sad suburban wanna be

  115. 115
    tobie says:

    @TenguPhule: There were arrests yesterday but I don’t know at whose instigation. Presumably if you block the halls in the Capitol, the Capitol Police step in. I could be wrong here.

    I think we’re well past the point of deciding whether they’re agitating against Pelosi. The question is to what end. Were this really about climate change, the activists would be having sit-downs with the members of the House who’ve been working on decarbonization. Ted Deutch and Suzanne Bonamici come to mind; apparently newly elected Sean Casten (IL) worked as a clean energy specialist and ran on an environmental platform. But this seems more like an effort to lay claim to the issue as their own to the exclusion of everyone else.

  116. 116
    dmsilev says:

    @TenguPhule:

    Is it five o’clock yet?

    Somewhere, yes.

  117. 117

    This is why you don’t ask Trump about Mexico paying for the wall. I know it seems to feel gratifying if you are working with a frame of reality, but he’s not.

  118. 118
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Raven: Ha! She was force of nature. I have no doubt she intimidated the Globetrotters.

  119. 119
    artem1s says:

    @Kay:

    He’s just getting more and more radicalized.

    There is a very ‘special’ brand of militia, white supremacist, conspiracy theory, nutjob being bred in southern Ohio (and many other mid west rural areas, I imagine). I grew up southeast of Columbus and have been seeing this developing my whole life. I have family members and kids I grew up with that I expect to one day see do something this stupid. Some of them, I can’t imagine how they have managed to stay out of trouble this long. And everyone of their family members will deny seeing it coming. Guys who have been fed a daily diet of cray-cray about black helicopters and the Federal Reserve and the New World Order coming to grab their guns and ruin their country. They have been waiting their whole lives for the day when they get to take back their government. It’s way more common than most people want to know.

  120. 120
    TS (the original) says:

    @geg6: Nancy rang rings around every male in that room. Logical, accurate and to the point. She gave nothing away & said all that was needed to be said.

    Edit: to NOT too

  121. 121
    Yarrow says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    For those of you who want to ask Trump why Mexico isn’t paying for the wall –

    That is framing the issue in his terms. Using your opponent’s terms is always a losing proposition. Pelosi and Schumer, in the video, frame it in terms of “Democrats are for border security” and “Let’s keep doing what we’re doing.” They’re defining the argument.

    Yes, this. Nancy and Chuck did exactly the right thing. Talk about the subject on their own terms. There’s no reason to let Trump define everything. He gets to do plenty of that anyway.

  122. 122
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @artem1s:
    So you’ve met my family?

  123. 123
    Yarrow says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: Exactly. If they had said, “Mexico is supposed to pay for the wall” he would have been right on to whatever the New NAFTA is called and tariffs and down the track to China and whatever. It would have been the opening he wanted. They did exactly the right thing.

  124. 124
    jl says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: I listened to some of the meeting. Pelosi and Schumer did a great job, they hit the right points. They know better what to do than I, as I grudgingly admitted. So don’t elect me Speaker, I’d just do nothing but razz and bait him nonstop rubbing his nose in all his lies, and would have to practice it as time went on, because it is an ever and rapidly growing list to get through. I’d love to get him to say that for the cameras, and then ask exactly where that was that Mexico pays bit in his new NAFTA BS agreement, because no one has ever mentioned it before.

    So, might be gratifying to my sense of vindictive fun, but maybe not the best politics.

  125. 125
    Yarrow says:

    @tobie: We desperately need some enterprising reporters to look into who’s funding this Sunrise Movement. That collection of people definitely gives me pause. And yes, I’ve been pleased that AOC has done some smart things but I’m still skeptical of her. She’s not even seated yet so we’ll see what she does when she’s actually a Representative.

  126. 126
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Tommy Vietor @ TVietor08
    Trump said they caught 10 terrorists trying to come across the border. Demand their names, photos, and terrorist affiliation before repeating that claim.

    Sam Stein @ samstein
    We asked the Trump administration for data to back up the president’s suggestion of terrorism at the border. They said only that they face daily threats from land, sea, and air.

    I was wondering if he made that up on the spot, or if it was something Kellyanne, Bill Shine and Jethrene had been cooking up. Looks like the former

  127. 127
    Corner Stone says:

    Man, Nancy ate Trump’s lunch and then stole his two scoops in the after press event.

  128. 128
    geg6 says:

    @tobie:

    I have no idea who the Sunrise Movement is (and don’t know a single person IRL who does) and, based on how stupid they sound, I’m not interested at all in finding out. Considering that Pelosi already is on the side of the environment and battling global warming, they are idiots who are wasting their time demonstrating against an ally. Perhaps they should protest someone who actually is hostile to their agenda. But that would be smart, so obviously they won’t.

  129. 129
    Corner Stone says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    Tommy Vietor @ TVietor08
    Trump said they caught 10 terrorists trying to come across the border. Demand their names, photos, and terrorist affiliation before repeating that claim.

    Another waste of time. Nothing to be gained by letting Trump repeat the word terrorist 6 more times.

  130. 130
    Ruckus says:

    @germy:
    The people that cheered for his wall probably didn’t think it was going to be built, but they like the idea. Numbnuts is the one who has no idea of the cost or the complexity.

  131. 131
    ruemara says:

    @tobie: The ratfucking started immediately. I had to disenchant someone from sharing David Sirota criticizing the Dems for losing in 2016. They are going 100% towards helping us lose in 2020 and continuing the fascism.

  132. 132
    germy says:

    @Corner Stone: Yes, I was wondering about that number when he blurted it out. Ten of them? Is this verifiable in any way?

  133. 133
    trollhattan says:

    @germy:
    Step 1: read list of names to president.
    Step 2: stop reading once he runs out of fingers.

    Ten it is.

  134. 134
    TenguPhule says:

    @geg6:

    I have no idea who the Sunrise Movement is

    Originated from former Wall Street Protesters way back in 2006

  135. 135

    @germy: That’s a very specific — and round — number.

  136. 136
    ruemara says:

    @TenguPhule: Why have they chosen now to make themselves known?

  137. 137
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Corner Stone:
    It’s a waste of time to fisk Mr. Creosote’s words. They are “full of sound and fury, signifying nothing”.

    Find a way to peel off 20 R senators, and this shitshow will be over. Watergate showed the way.

  138. 138
  139. 139
    tobie says:

    @Yarrow: @geg6:The Sunrise Movement was formed a year and a half ago so they’re new to the environmental scene. Their endorsements for the midterms matched up with the Justice Democrats’ list. AOC has since become their face on the Hill — I believe this was negotiated in advance — and they’ve managed to score some big supporters for their proposal for a Select Committee to draft a Green New Deal–people like Barbara Lee, Eleanor Norton Holmes, and Kennedy. Reading around I get the impression that their real aim is to draft a plan that can be used as a litmus test for candidates in 2020. Should the subcommittee be formed, some serious legislators with environmental expertise better be put on it. Otherwise the committee will do nothing but divide the party.

  140. 140
    TenguPhule says:

    @ruemara:

    Why have they chosen now to make themselves known?

    The founders have been bouncing around every futile protest movement for the last 10 years.

    Apparently they got some serious funding in the last 2 years.

  141. 141
    tobie says:

    @ruemara: You’re so right!

  142. 142
    hueyplong says:

    There is a reason why Republicans goose turnout by invoking the name of Nancy Pelosi. She’s a spook story criminals tell their kids at night. She’s Keyser Souze.

    My hero.

  143. 143
    TenguPhule says:

    @A Ghost To Most:

    Find a way to peel off 20 R senators, and this shitshow will be over.

    As well ask for the Moon and Stars while you’re at it.

  144. 144
    tobie says:

    @TenguPhule: do you know where the funding came from? @Yarrow was asking just this question.

  145. 145
    ruemara says:

    Hmm. Checked out the Sunrise Movement’s website and they’re, um, shall we say very light on details while rich on copy, social media presence & strangely managing a lot despite just turning up. Heavy promotion of AOC as the originator of the Green New Deal, but no text of the proposals. Lots of actions to do – targeting Dems – but lacking details on who they are? Just two names connective via email, an Erin & a Steve, but nothing about them. Curious.

  146. 146
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @TenguPhule:
    Find a way, make a way, or get out of the way.

  147. 147
    TenguPhule says:

    @tobie:

    do you know where the funding came from?

    No, I don’t. I did some casual digging and came up with nothing. And their site does not disclose either. Only says “donor funded” without disclosing any donors.

    Naturally, I am suspicious as hell.

  148. 148
    Barbara says:

    @Kay: My family acquaintance had every possible advantage it was possible to get. The problem is that he was unable to make anything out of them. And his solution was to externalize that failure onto others.

  149. 149
    germy says:

    Even a Washington Post reporter knows that not 1 inch of Trump's wall has been built. Does Trump think his supporters are dumber than a WaPo reporter? https://t.co/iCbior7yFp— Ann Coulter (@AnnCoulter) December 11, 2018

    Yes.

  150. 150
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: That’s a very specific — and round — number.

    Just like his list of CoS candidates, ‘more than ten!”

  151. 151
    ruemara says:

    @tobie: I just tried to find out. They’re asking for donations but the site itself & the staffing it would take requires funding. Since outrage requests counts as very lefty, I have no doubt they’re getting donations as their star rises. They’ll get them. The last anti-HRC diehard just fought me about Russia because that’s laughable that social media has an effect, so our left has learned nothing but the same blindness as our right.

  152. 152
    TenguPhule says:

    Kelle Ann Conjob decides that Kelly didn’t go far enough and took a potshot at AOC.

    AOC is making the right enemies.

  153. 153
    TenguPhule says:

    @ruemara:

    They’re asking for donations but the site itself & the staffing it would take requires funding. Since outrage requests counts as very lefty, I have no doubt they’re getting donations as their star rises.

    The burning question of course is that if what the founding members claims are true, they’ve been in the protesting gig for over a decade, so where did the startup money come from?

  154. 154
    ruemara says:

    @TenguPhule: Maybe. Sometimes the enemy of my enemy is not my friend. IDK why she’s a cause celebre for the same folks who fall into a paroxyism at the mere idea of Bernie being a saint, but the fact that she is means I’d rather watch her closely than get fond of her.

    @TenguPhule: Who the fuck are the founding members? Why aren’t they proud enough of their record of successful activistin’ to put their names in the about section?

  155. 155
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @TenguPhule:
    AOC is also starting to make the right friends. Is our AOC learning?

  156. 156
  157. 157
    tobie says:

    @ruemara: I’m on my phone and I don’t know how to cut and paste so I’ll just say that the four page proposal for a Select Committee contains only 7 or so lines about what the actual climate goals would be and they amount to complete decarbonization and switch to renewables in 10 years. Even the UN’s IPCC sets a target date of 2050 so the proposal for 10 years is wildly ambitious.

    Re funding: I have no idea where they get their money.

  158. 158
    TenguPhule says:

    @A Ghost To Most: As long as she votes the right way and doesn’t fall out of line, I don’t care about anything else.

  159. 159
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @ruemara: she has some good instincts. I believe she was the first MoC to point out the absurdity of the Harvard/Kennedy School (I believe) orientation for new members– they brought in Gary Fucking Cohn to talk an incoming class of Democrats, no labor leaders, no environmental leaders, to reform advocates. But I’m not sure if her instincts have realized that the county as a whole is very politically different from Queens, and that Mitch McConnell and the Mercers are not going to sleepwalk through the next two years like Joe Crowley did in her primary.

  160. 160
    gwangung says:

    @ruemara:

    A) Dark money, huh? Warning bell.

    B) Not a trace of wonkishness here? Warning bell #2.

  161. 161
    catclub says:

    OT: Sexual abuse in an authoritarian church, hoocoodanode? independent fundamental Baptist churches

    McClatchy

    For decades, women and children have faced rampant sexual abuse while worshiping at independent fundamental Baptist churches around the country. The network of churches and schools has often covered up the crimes and helped relocate the offenders, an eight-month Star-Telegram investigation has found.

    More than 200 people — current or former church members, across generations — shared their stories of rape, assault, humiliation and fear in churches where male leadership cannot be questioned.

    “It’s a philosophy — it’s flawed,” said Stacey Shiflett, an independent fundamental Baptist pastor in Dundalk, Maryland. “The philosophy is you don’t air your dirty laundry in front of everyone. Pastors think if they keep it on the down-low, it won’t impact anyone. And then the other philosophy is it’s wrong to say anything bad about another preacher.”

    The Star-Telegram discovered at least 412 allegations of sexual misconduct in 187 independent fundamental Baptist churches and their affiliated institutions, spanning 40 states and Canada.

  162. 162
    TenguPhule says:

    ErikWemple

    @ErikWemple
    On scaling back WH press briefing: @presssec saying there are a lot of ways to communicate that didn’t exist before, also says it’s ideal to have president himself speaking to the press.

    2
    11:25 AM – Dec 11, 2018

    SHS has apparently decided absurdity is the new normal.

  163. 163
    A Ghost To Most says:

    Re funding: I have no idea where they get their money.

    Selling the rendered fat of billionaires as biodeisel? It’s carbon-neutral.

  164. 164
    TenguPhule says:

    Jake Crandall
    @jakevcrandall
    Former U.S. Attorney General Jeff Sessions quotes rapper Kanye West while talking about @realDonaldTrump during the Montgomery Area Chamber of Commerce annual meeting in Montgomery, Ala.

    1
    10:55 AM – Dec 11, 2018 · Montgomery, AL

    Why the fuck is this asshat not being pelted with rotten produce. Even if it is Alabama.

  165. 165
    TenguPhule says:

    Chris Geidner

    @chrisgeidner
    JUST IN: Federal judge orders Stormy Daniels to pay Donald Trump $293,052.33 in attorneys’ fees in her defamation case against the president, which the judge tossed out.

    796
    10:56 AM – Dec 11, 2018

    This is bullshit and all sorts of fucked up.

  166. 166
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @MisterForkbeard:
    That’s hilarious. The Republicans were the majority in both chambers and Dems were getting equal blame for the shutdown by the media. That’s… incredible.

  167. 167
    TenguPhule says:

    Zoe Tillman

    Verified account

    @ZoeTillman
    Follow Follow @ZoeTillman
    More
    The Senate has confirmed 8th Circuit nominee Jonathan Kobes 50-50, with VP Pence breaking the tie. Kobes is one of only a handful of Trump judicial nominees to get a “not qualified” rating from the ABA committee that vets picks for the federal bench

    Another Nazi is in the judiciary.

  168. 168
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @TenguPhule:
    “Ah say, ah say, Kayne West is one of the good ones and will be spared in the coming race war.”

  169. 169
    TenguPhule says:

    Trump said in the Oval Office at a bill signing just now. “If we have to close down the county in border security I actually like that in terms of an issue.””

    Odds of shutdown just rose significantly.

  170. 170
    TenguPhule says:

    John Kelly is now staying on as chief of staff into 2019. In an interview with Fox News, Kellyanne Conway said: “He will stay on the job through January 2 at least, and I think there will be a very peaceful and pragmatic transition to the next chief of staff.”

    Translation: Someone’s gonna get killed. Perhaps not metaphorically either.

  171. 171
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @TenguPhule:
    The Republicans don’t give a damn if the nominee is qualified or not, just that they’ll rule in their ideological favor.

    Also, Pence sure is a busy bee breaking all these ties. He’s already done 10, and it’s barely been 2 years. Most VP’s have only cast 6 or 8 tie-breaking votes in one or two terms.

  172. 172
    ruemara says:

    @TenguPhule: Thanks. I always check the fine print, the funding and names. … And I’ve read it and I am utterly unimpressed. Fucking great. Love his disappointed in Obama bonafides.

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: & yet her instincts still say pal around with Bernie and go campaign against a fellow female candidate who knows her area, for a white male carpetbagger whose best recommendation is he liked bernie. Again, I will just keep an eye on her. She can take point & let’s see if she has the chops. But I do not become a fan of anyone until they’re proven.

    @A Ghost To Most: Hmmm. I’d support that.

  173. 173
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @TenguPhule:
    Oh my god. This just keeps getting better and better. Why didn’t Kelly just tell him to fuck off?

  174. 174
  175. 175
    tobie says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: I think she’s unbelievably canny at messaging but most of the messages don’t hold up to scrutiny if you check. One example is the forum at Harvard. She called it an orientation, implying it was an event hosted by Congress. But it was an optional private event hosted by AEI. No surprise that a conservative think tank would invite Cohn. What was more surprising is that they also invited members of the Obama White House. So much of AOC’s outrage ends up being self-serving virtue-signaling. Let’s see what happens when the new Congress is on session. You need partners to get bills passed.

  176. 176
    germy says:

    Trump and his attorney's attempt to fool the public about the importance of the attorneys' fees in the defamation case, which are a fraction of what they owe my client in the main NDA case, is an absolute joke. People are smarter than that.https://t.co/oo3kkjVzPU via @YouTube— Michael Avenatti (@MichaelAvenatti) December 11, 2018

  177. 177
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @tobie:

    So much of AOC’s outrage ends up being self-serving virtue-signaling.

    So like Alan Grayson and Bernie himself? I really want to like her. I want to see a lefty like her that’s willing to push the party a little further left that isn’t a moron or a fraud.

  178. 178
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @geg6: There seem to be a lot of people who believe themselves to be progressive and will follow anyone/any group who dubs itself progressive without using what brains they might have to analyze the context and the underlying support of stances they’re being pushed to take.

    Also all these stories appearing in the media–people who earn $$$ by pushing a narrative of ‘dems in disarray’, etc. By focusing on this sort of story they divert attn from what’s actually going on and from the people and groups who are raking in the dough from the stories and from things the stories are distracting from.

  179. 179
    Mike in NC says:

    The meeting transcript is simply more proof (not needed) that Trump is a rambling, lying, incoherent buffoon. He needs to get it in writing next month that there will be no precious wall, and no Space Force or similarly named bullshit waste of money.

  180. 180
    different-church-lady says:

    Reading the reports and scanning the headlines, it seems to me what’s really significant about this is Trump has lost one of the panels of his screen. When it was GOP all the way across, they could protect him with a veneer of legitimacy. Now he’s going to be forced to interact with people who want to pants him* or look as though he’s hiding from them. The reward for taking the house is more than just grinding his agenda to a halt — it’s going to be regular exposure.

    *(forgive me for that image)

  181. 181

    Dear god, how is it possible these people are in charge?

    Steve King just asked Google CEO Sundar Pichai why his granddaughter got spammed on her iPhone. Pichai: "Congressman, iPhone is made by another company.”— Dusty (@DustinGiebel) December 11, 2018

  182. 182
    MomSense says:

    “Like a tinkle contest with a skunk”. I Fucking Love Nancy Smash.

    ***

    Baud, thinking of you and your fur baby. Sending big hugs to you. 💜💙💚❤️🧡💛

  183. 183
    TenguPhule says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Dear god, how is it possible these people are in charge?

    Their supporters are dumber then they are. let that sink in.

  184. 184
    Aleta says:

    @rikyrah: The NBC reporter or editor left out this part:

    McKenzie’s mother, Jasmine Adams, told WIAT CBS 42 in Birmingham, Ala. that her daughter had notified her teachers and her assistant principal about the bullying.

    “She told me that this one particular child was writing her nasty notes in class. It was just things you wouldn’t think a 9-year-old should know,” Adams said. “And my baby, to tell me some of the things they had said to her, I was like, ‘Where are they learning this from?’”

    Adams said she feels like her family was let down by the education system.

    “I just felt that our trust was in them that they would do the right thing,” Adams said, “And it feels like to me it wasn’t it wasn’t done.” (From CBS.)

  185. 185
    ruemara says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor: You can elect a wombat with enough votes. Iowa, of course, elected something dumber than a wombat.

  186. 186
    tobie says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: look at how much more liberal the Democratic caucus as a whole is after the midterms. There’s plenty of reason to hope on that score.

  187. 187
    different-church-lady says:

    Regarding AOC:
    * I don’t trust the people beating the hell out of her, and i also don’t trust the people canonizing her.

    * She is clearly catnip for editors ravenous for clickbait. This, I feel quite certain, is driving a lot of the antipathy.

    * I am still having a hard time sorting out the impressions I get directly from her from the impressions I get about her from her dipshit cheerleaders. A lot of the former are positive, and a lot of the latter are very negative.

  188. 188
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @tobie: But it was an optional private event hosted by AEI

    Ah, that’s very different. She got a lot of people amplifying the idea that it was an official congressional function.

  189. 189
    different-church-lady says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Dear god, how is it possible these people are in charge?

    The big problem with democracy is that everyone* gets to vote.

    (*supposedly)

  190. 190
    Yarrow says:

    @tobie: @TenguPhule: @ruemara: I have seen something showing that Justice Democrats are Russia-funded. I read it late at night so I am not sure I can find it again easily. However, it left me suspicious of any groups and people that are grouped together or allied with them. We know that Russia will ratfuck us on the left just as much as on the right.

    I knew nothing about the Sunrise Movement, but a quick look at their Twitter feed left me with the distinct impression they’re lefty ratfuckers.

  191. 191
    TenguPhule says:

    @Yarrow:

    but a quick look at their Twitter feed left me with the distinct impression they’re lefty ratfuckers.

    Worse, from the article I linked to, they’re the true believers who seemed to have made a career of joining every failed protest up to and including Occupy Wall Street.

    Zealots interested in martyrdom.

  192. 192
    germy says:

    This moment is… pretty, pretty, pretty good https://t.co/E6TzYIkCEw pic.twitter.com/9Pu3v6SdWI— The Daily Beast (@thedailybeast) December 11, 2018

  193. 193
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @TenguPhule:Gods, Pelosi is outright telling Trump a press conformance isn’t how a government debate is done and Trump thinks it’s an episode of The Apprentice and he can all resolved it before a commercial break. Trump is completely out of touch.

    SCHUMER: When the president brags that he won North Dakota and Indiana, he’s in real trouble.

    Is just there make Trump squirm

  194. 194
    trollhattan says:

    @germy:
    Chuck’s aside to the camera was perfect and the “Curb” treatment takes it to another level.

  195. 195
    Ladyraxterinok says:

    @catclub: Check out Bruce Gerencser’s blog. He and his wife grew up in Independent Fundamental Baptist churches. He was a preacher in the denomination for yrs.

    He and his wife left the denomination and then left christianity. He posts a lot about the denomination’s belief system and its toxic effects. Good intro into mindset/worldview indoctrinating many more people than most of us realize.

    And as they emphasize ‘we vote!zx

  196. 196
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @jl: Go read the transcript, Trump kept claiming the Democrats shut the government down the last time, and Schumer said, no they didn’t and it’s you wants to shut the government down now. Trump just kept on repeating himself. Trump even tried pretending last November was a rout for the Democrats.

  197. 197
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    You do a fair Foghorn Leghorn.

  198. 198
    Starfish says:

    @TenguPhule: White House press briefings will now be tweets since the press keeps treating Tweets as if they are press briefings anyway.

  199. 199
    TenguPhule says:

    ‘There were times I didn’t have a lot to do.’ Trump loyalist at VA forced out after collecting pay but doing little work

    Peter O’Rourke’s departure marks an unceremonious fall for a Trump loyalist once seen as a rising star at VA where he nonetheless had a rocky tenure, first leading a high-profile office handling whistleblower complaints, next as chief of staff and then, for two months, as the agency’s acting secretary.

    Since August he has held the nebulous role of senior adviser, with an uncertain portfolio and senior executive salary as high as $161,000. VA Secretary Robert Wilkie asked for his resignation Friday.

    Nothing but thieves all the way down.

    While he did not serve in roles that required Senate confirmation, O’Rourke, a former press lead for Trump’s presidential campaign, wielded huge influence. But his star faded following clashes with lawmakers, VA’s inspector general and other agency officials.

    O’Rourke was a central figure during a tumultuous period from which VA has not yet fully recovered, when infighting at its senior levels threatened the president’s agenda for veterans. When Wilkie arrived in late July, he tried to sideline O’Rourke.

    When Trump would not fire him, O’Rourke became a senior adviser to the secretary after turning down at least one low-profile job Wilkie offered, people close to VA said. But O’Rourke was rarely in his office at VA headquarters in Washington, according to four people with knowledge of the arrangement, and by last week White House officials had grown concerned that O’Rourke was getting paid but not working, creating an optics problem in a corner of the government where the president has promised greater accountability.

    “I don’t think he has any actual responsibilities at work,” one senior administration official said of O’Rourke days before he left.

    It drives me crazy. It really does. Kids across the country are growing up and seeing this happen and how the fuck can their teachers tell them to “study and work hard for a good life” when these fucking crooks do NOTHING and run away laughing without being punished?

  200. 200
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @catclub: Authoritarian cults suck. Especially those whose core beliefs are magic

  201. 201
    Yarrow says:

    @TenguPhule: Just opened that article in a new tab but haven’t read it yet. A group full of zealots is exactly the kind of group that would be targeted by Russia, through intermediaries probably. Remember, they don’t create the divisions; they amplify already existing ones. So they “donate” a ton of money to this group, that means the group can do more, hence louder ratfucking.

    @ruemara:

    & yet her instincts still say pal around with Bernie and go campaign against a fellow female candidate who knows her area, for a white male carpetbagger whose best recommendation is he liked bernie. Again, I will just keep an eye on her. She can take point & let’s see if she has the chops. But I do not become a fan of anyone until they’re proven.

    100% with you on this. She may be great! I don’t know. She hasn’t voted on anything yet. She may turn out to be a self-serving annoyance, like BS. We don’t know yet. I didn’t like what I first saw but I’ve liked a few other things I’ve seen her do. And not liked some. Jury is out. We’ll see what she does.

  202. 202

    Wonkette on what bad ass Nancy Smash! is.

    First paragraph: Y’all saw that crazy shit that happened at the White House today when Chuck ‘n’ Nancy went to visit Trump to talk about averting a government shutdown, and Chuck ‘n’ Nancy ended up playing foosball with Trump’s face while he screamed “WALL!” over and over again? It was so great.

  203. 203
    ruemara says:

    @Yarrow: Ditto. Not fully sure about the russian funds but very sure that they are ratfuckers. I’ve decided Justice Dems, DSA & Our Revolution as the sort of allies who’d gladly knife you in the back, right in front of your face, but for your own good. Which means anyone they adore, I have deep levels of suspicions about. She’s damned lucky she’s under 30 & telegenic. It gives her a lot of power to say & do whatever for a long time. The power to fuck up is one people don’t appreciate. My hope is that she proves to be as effective as a Sherrod Brown, even if she doesn’t evolve into a Nancy Smash in her own right. I have to keep some hope up.

  204. 204
    MoxieM says:

    @tobie: Well, slap my ass and call me Nancy … young Master Evan went to Punahou and Wesleyan, and drew on his connections at the Sierra Club for startup help. Environmental activism = good stuff; priv young white guy (assumptions, here) reinventing the wheel and pointing with pride, maybe not so much. But that’s me. And there is a gang of sidekicks.

  205. 205
    debbie says:

    Just from the bits I’ve heard on NPR, what an embarrassment for our country. Glad for everything Nany said. Schumer a little less, but I did cheer his saying Trump had a temper tantrum.

  206. 206
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    Can Somebody Hold Nancy Pelosi’s Beer While She Dick-Punches Trump Some More?

    Now there’s a headline. Might explain the mushroom dick.

  207. 207
    debbie says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor:

    I also enjoyed hearing Trump trying to end the session by thanking everyone and Pelosi and Schumer totally ignoring that and continuing on.

  208. 208
    TenguPhule says:

    Pelosi told Democrats privately today, “He said at the end of the meeting, he said, ‘We can go two routes with this meeting: with a knife or a candy. I said, ‘Exactly.’”

    She went with the knife.

    A woman after my own heart.

  209. 209
    different-church-lady says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    Trump even tried pretending last November was a rout for the Democrats.

    “If that were true do you think Nancy and I would be cluttering up your office right now, you dumbfuck?”

  210. 210
    TenguPhule says:

    @A Ghost To Most:

    Can Somebody Hold Nancy Pelosi’s Beer While She Dick-Punches Trump Some More?

    New Rotating Tag?

  211. 211
    different-church-lady says:

    @Starfish: The press only cares about tweets now, and it started long before Trump.

  212. 212
  213. 213
    Platonailedit says:

    "I was trying to be the mom," Pelosi said, but "it goes to show you: you get into a tinkle contest with a skunk, you get tinkle all over you.""It's like a manhood thing with him — as if manhood can be associated with him," she said. "This wall thing."https://t.co/7HbxlGXWay— Kyle Griffin (@kylegriffin1) December 11, 2018

    Daymn. The dumb scummy pos thought he could bully and browbeat her on live teevee and got his nuts sacked. Yet another low bar not cleared. At all.

  214. 214
    Aleta says:

    @catclub: These fundamentalist pastors also counsel abused women who come to them, that they must stay in a marriage with a violent spouse. If there are children in the family the pastors should be prosecuted for not reporting children at risk. (I wish it could be so for the women as well, but at least there’s a law about protecting kids.)

  215. 215
    Jinchi says:

    @kindness: It was the conservative Democrats who tried to oust Nancy as speaker, not the progressives.

  216. 216
    debbie says:

    @rikyrah:

    How does a fourth grader even know how to commit suicide? Jesus, what a fucked up world.

  217. 217
    zhena gogolia says:

    @MoxieM:

    Don’t have the patience to read this, but

    http://wesleyanargus.com/2018/.....is-office/

  218. 218
    debbie says:

    @lamh36:

    I hope that runs on every GOP ad in 2020!

  219. 219
    David 🎅🎄Merry Christmas🎄🎅 Koch says:

    it ain’t the size of the dog in the fight, it’s the size of the fight in the dog

  220. 220
    Starfish says:

    @ruemara: Our Revolution is “stupid Bernie bros.” I followed Justice Dems for a time, but they were not effectively doing much. The noisiest DSA members were usually attractive young women in major cities. I did not understand why that was.

    I am not sure which of these things Ocasio-Cortez is affiliated with now, but I think that dismissing her due to her affiliations is not smart because she is good at what she is doing, and she is being transparent about some of the things she is learning.

    She has mastered the online platforms. On Twitter, she is making clear and specific points. On Instagram, she is humanizing the legislative process by talking to voters while she cooks about what type of support she needs from them so they stay engaged. A number of the Parkland kids were really excellent at Twitter too.

  221. 221
    David 🎅🎄Merry Christmas🎄🎅 Koch says:

    @lamh36: Like a Boss

  222. 222
    zhena gogolia says:

    @MoxieM:

    This is what I get when I google “Sunrise Movement Founders”:

    Movement activists across the progressive landscape are throwing themselves into political organizing with enthusiasm unlike anything we’ve seen in our lifetimes. We can’t help but see this as a silver lining to the social and environmental catastrophe that is Trump’s presidency.

    We’re worse off now than with Clinton, to be sure. But under Clinton, the climate movement would have fallen back into the Obama-era playbook: push the President to do the right thing, but constantly fall short due to a Republican Congress and a Democratic establishment that refuses to go after the fossil fuel companies and banks who profit from climate change. Would the movement have thrown itself into continuing the political revolution, into throwing the climate deniers and corporate Dems out of office? We’d like to think so, but that certainly wasn’t our plan at the time.

    Instead, Trump’s victory has blown over the barriers between young people and political engagement, pointing towards the possibility of a sea change at every level of government.

  223. 223
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @David 🎅🎄Merry Christmas🎄🎅 Koch:
    Yup. The story of my yoot.

  224. 224
    TenguPhule says:

    @zhena gogolia:

    pointing towards the possibility of a sea change at every level of government.

    That would be because the Arctic Icecap has FUCKING MELTED.

  225. 225
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @zhena gogolia: Heighten the contradictions.

  226. 226
    ruemara says:

    @Starfish: What is it about “I will wait & see” that seems dismissive? And no, I don’t think she’s good at what she’s doing. Not until I know what she’s doing.

  227. 227
    debbie says:

    @debbie:

    Remember that video where the heads of Trump and Co. were Photoshopped into bits of cop-show arrests (“It’s Mueller Time!”)? That GIF would make the perfect final shot, wouldn’t it?

  228. 228
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @TenguPhule: To be completely pedantic, as is the custom on B-J, the Arctic ice cap melting won’t change the sea level. The Greenland ice cap melting, that’s a different story.

  229. 229
    trollhattan says:

    @lamh36:
    Too perfect!

    Reminds me of Peggy coming down the new agency hallway at the end of “Mad Men,” smoking and toting Roger Sterling’s porny painting. Owning the joint.

  230. 230
    cain says:

    @Corner Stone:

    Not disagreeing with your argument but I would contend that at least as powerful a draw for Trump supporters has been proven to be that they like he’s a racist bigoted misogynist who hurts brown people and is cruel at every opportunity.

    Oh sure, but he has to look manly cuz you know he’s representing the white male race.

  231. 231
    trollhattan says:

    @lamh36:
    Check out this take. :-)

  232. 232
    rikyrah says:

    @ruemara:

    Uh huh
    Uh huh 🤔 🤔

  233. 233
    StringOnAStick says:

    @zhena gogolia: Wow, I’ve never heard the old “enhance the contradictions” trope stated in such a convoluted, not really looking for blood in the streets* sort of way. They did manage to shit on Hillary one more time though, and so nice that they have it in writing on their website. //

    * My ex-friend the anarchist was only interested in social change with some blood in the streets as part of the “fun”. Yes, he’s white and while poor by choice was from a wealthy background, why do you ask?

  234. 234
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    Blame Canada now.

    On the campaign trail, the president had vowed that Mexico would pay for any southern barrier — not the United States. Pelosi and Schumer reminded him during the rare public meeting Tuesday that he failed to keep this vow.

    In private, however, Trump suggested both U.S. neighbors would pay for the construction with the new NAFTA agreement.

  235. 235
    ruemara says:

    @StringOnAStick: That strain of progressiveism is way too attractive to folks who don’t really weather the risks.

  236. 236
    MomSense says:

    @debbie:

    Children at that age are like sponges. They soak up everything they are exposed to. My youngest started saying very concerning things in 7th grade. It came on so quickly which makes it very easy to miss. I think we are in denial about how influential peers and social media are for the very young. It’s not enough to be against bullying. We have to create, really be intentional, about the environments we create for our children.
    Right now we have handed our schools with all the social issues we don’t want to or can’t deal with. They do not have the resources nor are they the only institutions that should be dealing with mental illness, bullying, poverty, food insecurity, wealth inequality, gun violence, etc. Parents need more support. They need living wages, flexible scheduling, better housing, mental wellness help, job counseling, and more. They need the financial stability to be able to spend more time with their children!!

    I could go on all night about what we could do but as a nation we have decided to opt out of participation in the basic things that make a modern society possible. So much fucking drama all the time.

  237. 237
    Old Dan and Little Ann says:

    I check out red state each day for kicks. Their take on Pelosi today is as horrible as you would think.

  238. 238
    Aleta says:

    Regret to say BBC’s world news edited out every Pelosi sentence (left a few hand signals) and made Schumer, and his and Trump’s raised voices, the central point.

  239. 239
    different-church-lady says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    In private, however, Trump suggested both U.S. neighbors would pay for the construction with the new NAFTA agreement.

    Which, uh… (a) doesn’t change the fact that it was a campaign lie, and (b) ain’t gonna happen either.

  240. 240
    David 🎅🎄Merry Christmas🎄🎅 Koch says:

    An early straw poll of members of the progressive group MoveOn.org shows a wide-open competition for liberal voters in the 2020 Democratic presidential contest, with Rep. Beto O’Rourke narrowly beating out former Vice President Joe Biden.

    The most popular potential candidate was O’Rourke, D-Texas, who was selected by 15.6 percent of respondents, followed by Biden at 14.9 percent, and then Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., with 13.1 percent.

    It’s another sign of O’Rourke’s surprising popularity among national Democrats and a potentially troubling indication for Sanders, whom MoveOn endorsed in the 2016 Democratic primary. That year, 78 percent of MoveOn members voted to back Sanders over Hillary Clinton

    The three men were followed by Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., who garnered 10 percent support, and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., with 6.4 percent. Meanwhile, three Democratic senators, Sherrod Brown of Ohio, Amy Klobuchar of Minnesota and Cory Booker of New Jersey, and former New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg were each selected by about 3 percent of members. (link)

    Beto!

    Also too, note how old man Wilmer collapsed from 78% to low teens.

  241. 241
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @different-church-lady: Of course, but I think Trump just went full opium addict on this one.

  242. 242
    different-church-lady says:

    @zhena gogolia: Clinton lost two years ago: why even bring her up?

  243. 243
    debbie says:

    @MomSense:

    Actually, I tried killing myself in 8th grade, and looking back, I cannot for the life of me figure out how the thought ever even occurred to me. There was nothing in popular culture about suicide back then. Fourth grade, though!

  244. 244
    Bill Arnold says:

    @TenguPhule:
    Another much older investigative piece:
    As Divestment Movement Collapses, Activists Shift To Campaign Trail (NOVEMBER 3, 2017)
    (In this case the fossil-fuel divestment movement). I haven’t seen anything so far that sets me off; guess I’d be bothered if it were funded and secretly micromanaged by fossil fuel interests but otherwise, I’d approve since they’re focused on the emerging crisis that is most certain (physics!) and the most severe/civilization changing (or worse).

    Sunrise itself has direct ties to the divestment movement. Prakash led her campus’s UMass Fossil Fuel Divestment campaign for two years and later worked for the Divestment Student Network (DSN) coordinating various divestment campaigns throughout the country. DSN is a project of the Alliance for Global Justice, which has received grants from 350.org and the George Soros-backed Open Society Foundations, and also has ties to Occupy Wall Street.
    Several other staffers are alums of their own campus’s divestment movements, while others have volunteered for organizations like 350.org and Climate Truth.

  245. 245
    different-church-lady says:

    @David 🎅🎄Merry Christmas🎄🎅 Koch:

    Beto! Starbursts!

  246. 246
    different-church-lady says:

    @Bill Arnold: In my gut I feel the bubble professional protestors live in becomes a real problem when it comes to winning general elections.

  247. 247
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Aleta:

    Commenter Tony Jay has been illuminating about how bad the BBC is on U.S. politics.

  248. 248
    zhena gogolia says:

    @different-church-lady:

    It’s an article from May 2017. I just thought this Sarandon-esque quotation was helpful in understanding who these people are.

    https://medium.com/sunrisemvmt/welcome-sunrise-c63943c00f37

  249. 249
    different-church-lady says:

    @zhena gogolia: OK, makes more sense in temporal context.

  250. 250
    Starfish says:

    @ruemara: She is pushing the concept of a Green New Deal. She is bringing light to instances where black people are being mistreated by police.

    But this is the thing I really appreciated. She gave us a little transparency into the orientation process.

    This Harvard session has been going on for new Congressmembers since the 70s.This year we heard things like “the $2T tax cut was great” and “$15 wage is a bad idea.”No labor reps were there.Was this a multi-decade, pro-corporate lobbyist project the entire time? https://t.co/TgGR0sR4u4— Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (@Ocasio2018) December 9, 2018

  251. 251
    Bill Arnold says:

    @Aleta:

    Regret to say BBC’s world news edited out every Pelosi sentence (left a few hand signals) and made Schumer, and his and Trump’s raised voices, the central point.

    That’s worth complaining to the BBC about. She did fine and had a few really strong moments. In particularly N. Pelosi can count votes, and, well, Trump Does Math. (TBH it’s an easy mistake, very loosely akin to a bit of mental dyslexia, but he’s so … confident. )

    Re your structural origami link days ago (i didn’t click yet), this (very small scale) has been sitting in my bucket of links (posting it in the question context would have been self-doxing), and it (and subsequent work) is interesting.
    A three-dimensional actuated origami-inspired transformable metamaterial with multiple degrees of freedom (pdf 2016)
    which is cited by a bunch of newer papers, e.g.
    Morphable 3D mesostructures and microelectronic devices by multistable buckling mechanics (pdf 2018)

  252. 252
    MomSense says:

    @debbie:

    Damn I’m so glad you are here with us. There are so many factors and that is a tough age. Suicide has always been with us – as long as people have felt despair and hopelessness. It’s no wonder you are such an empathetic person.

  253. 253

    I take Scott Dworkin with a grain of salt, but he gets some things right, so maybe this is too.

  254. 254
    Yarrow says:

    @Starfish: See upthread for how this was an optional session private event hosted by AEI. She misrepresented it.

  255. 255
    ruemara says:

    @Starfish: Starfish. There is nothing to the “Green New Deal”. Please review where I said I went to the Sunrise Movement to look for the Green New Deal’s proposals. If there’s a deal to support, I would guess that there’s some level of proposal. With regards to the Harvard Orientation, it’s presented by Harvard and run by the American Enterprise Institute and Center for Strategic International Studies, source provided. She went to a corporate event and found corporations. Woo. Again, this isn’t the earthshattering bold new progressive actions to me that they are to you. Why are you so threatened by me deciding that I need a wait and see strategy to determine if she’s got heft? This isn’t because I DON’T pay attention. It’s because I DO pay attention. My lack of fanhood does not affect yours. Go enjoy her wondrous effect on things. I am simply holding off until I see something worth lauding.

  256. 256
    Yarrow says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: It was pretty obvious Pence was going to get the brunt of Trump’s wrath after that meeting. Pence looked like he wanted to disappear into that chair.

  257. 257
    MoxieM says:

    @zhena gogolia: I just scanned the article at link provided by TenguPhule, #157. Initiator is a young Punahou/Wesleyan feller who was vastly disappointed in Prez Obama. Hence my comment.

  258. 258
    zhena gogolia says:

    @MoxieM:

    I’m not arguing with you, I’m supplementing your info in the same direction.

  259. 259

    That meeting has made my day.

  260. 260
    Yarrow says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: It was the best. Nancy SMASH is going to be Trump’s worst nightmare that isn’t Robert Mueller.

  261. 261
    Kathleen says:

    @Kay: Yes, but prior to that he had his soul sucked out in Boone County, KY.

  262. 262
    Kathleen says:

    @Yarrow: Russian RoPro Part Deux.

  263. 263
    sukabi says:

    @Yarrow: Pence was probably instructed by trump prior to that meeting to not say anything but look stern and “watch the master”…

    Not surprised he’s blaming pence for blowing it, pence was always going to be the 🐐.

  264. 264
    Ruckus says:

    @SFAW:
    Don’t need no stinking pins or nails. 22oz hammer and a full swing, those tiny little things will be permanently part of the wall. Of course if it’s drywall you will have a hole in the wall. But don’t worry, they’ll still be attached to that wall.

  265. 265
    Waynski says:

    @rikyrah: It means she’s Avon Barksdale.

Comments are closed.