Saturday Open Thread

Have fun watching your football team lose.

It’s holiday season so here is some holiday music:

124 replies
  1. 1

    Today I’d like to find a coffee shop and write. I’m in TriBeCa but am ambulatory, if anybody has suggestions. But you kids enjoy your football!

  2. 2
    hitchhiker says:

    I wish someone would tell the Democratic Senate Campaign Committee that they ought to quit lying about Mike Espy’s polling.

    Every day this week I get email claiming that the race was within 1 point on Nov 6th and asking for money to close it out.

    Why the need for bullshit? The race on Nov 6th was within 1 point because another 15% of voters picked someone even more racist and terrible than the Espy’s opponent.

    I like that he’s running aggressively against that pathetic excuse for a woman. I like that her racist past/present is on display. I don’t like that the DSCC is trying to pry dollars out of my bank account by presenting me with phony numbers. They shouldn’t have to insult their supporters’ intelligence; they have a perfectly good story to tell.

  3. 3
    A Ghost To Most says:

    A beautiful, sunny day here. but just a mile or two west, I can’t even see the foothills for the kick-ass snowstorm going on. Excellent, after an exceptionally dry summer.

  4. 4
    Steeplejack says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Jeez, you’re in Manhattan. Isn’t there a coffee shop every three blocks or so? I thought it was a law or something.

  5. 5
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    Just enjoyed watching England trounce Australia in Rugby. 30 something to 13. It got so bad that the manager started putting in his second stringers to give them the opportunity to earn a cap. (Playing for your country is referred to as “being capped”.)

  6. 6
    James E Powell says:


    I need to find a way to watch rugby regularly. My introduction was watching the All or Nothing series on the NZ All Blacks. The more I watch the game, the more I like it.

  7. 7
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    @Steeplejack: We have a coffee roasters here in Lancaster. Established in 1837 in a beautiful old shop on China Street. The shop has not changed in all those years and it has actually become a tourist attraction for coffee lovers. Just walking by the shop when they are roasting is a joy, and I don’t like coffee that much.

  8. 8
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    @James E Powell: I love it. I have never been a fan of football (soccer) but I have always loved Rugby. I was a dedicated fan of the RN/RM Rugby team in Hong Kong the Tigers. I would spend every weekend on the sidelines watching them. When I was still in the US I got up at 3AM to watch the World Cup final several years ago. England v. Australia and Jonny Wilkerson scored a drop kick in the last thirty seconds to win the game, I was about apoplectic. I swear he could score kicking from the parking lot half an hour from the stadium, he was that good.

  9. 9
    trollhattan says:

    @James E Powell:
    One of the more obscure Fox sports channels shows rugby, accessing it kind of depends on your cable company’s mood. Rugby is a gateway drug to Aussie Rules Football.

  10. 10
    germy says:

    @Ocasio2018 said on her Instagram live stream she saw all the Republicans getting off their bus at orientation and that's the real Caravan we need to be afraid of. 😂😂😂😂🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 #facts— Joshua Collins 2020 (@Joshua_4_WA) November 22, 2018

  11. 11
    Steeplejack says:

    @James E Powell:

    If you have the NBC Sports channel on your cable system (it’s different from regular NBC), they show rugby quite a bit on there. Gloucester Rugby vs. Exeter Chiefs at 3:00 p.m. EST today. Warning: It’s a rerun from this morning, so don’t check the score on line!

  12. 12
    Steeplejack says:


    Cool. I love the smell of coffee, but I didn’t start drinking it until I was about 30, and even now I have only three to five cups a week.

  13. 13
    Amir Khalid says:

    From what I’ve seen of it, Aussie Rules is a sport where the brawl is occasionally interrupted by the game.

  14. 14
    Yutsano says:

    @Steeplejack: Interesting. I was allowed to start drinking coffee when I was 10 years old. Been a part of my diet since. Of course it’s impossible to grow up in a Navy household where Mom insisted on working as well. I needed something to keep going after my younger brothers!

  15. 15
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt: Oh and if you get BBC America on your cable they usually show all the big games.

  16. 16
    James E Powell says:

    Thanks for all the tips on rugby watching. I will definitely follow up with cable options.

  17. 17
    HeleninEire says:

    Watching Ireland v. USA rugby. I thought the USA was gonna get trounced but 13 minutes in it’s tied 7-7. All the pubs around the city center are MAD and it’ll be even crazier after the match when the crowd from Aviva Stadium stumbles in

    ETA Aaaaand…it’s 14-7 Ireland.

  18. 18
    trollhattan says:

    @Amir Khalid:
    And the field is oval! Thank god for Aussies, the world would be so very dull without them.

  19. 19
    Steeplejack says:


    Dunno why. Both my parents were coffee drinkers. I just never picked up the habit. Started drinking it in hotels when I was traveling on business in the ’80s. I don’t seek, or get, a big stimulus effect from it.

  20. 20

    @Steeplejack: thought maybe one of them was a hidden gem!

  21. 21
    James E Powell says:

    I started drinking coffee when I was just a kid, slowly decreased the amount of sugar down to zero, the amount of cream to just a touch.

  22. 22
    Yutsano says:

    @Steeplejack: It skipped a generation? At least for a bit.

    I’m a mite jealous. This means you can still get that nice warm buzz right away. Takes about three cups before I even feel something now.

  23. 23
    Steeplejack says:

    @Amir Khalid, @trollhattan:

    It is a physical game, but I don’t see that much brawling in it. It’s pretty tightly officiated.

    I like the team names, e.g., St. Kilda, Geelong, Footscray—which I previously thought was a veterinary disease. Now rebranded as the Western Bulldogs, alas.

  24. 24
    JPL says:

    @James E Powell: The first time that I had coffee it had sugar and cream, and I detested it.
    A few years later I tried it again, but black this time and that’s how I like it. My DIL convinced me recently to try a latte, and it wasn’t bad.

  25. 25
    Steeplejack says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Ah, “hidden” is the key word. Maybe as you move up in the hipster ranks they’ll clue you in. Are you wearing a pork-pie hat yet?

  26. 26
    trollhattan says:

    Did Alabama cops shoot a “good guy with a gun?”

  27. 27
    Steeplejack says:


    I don’t get a buzz. I like the smell, it’s a nice ritual in the morning to make it, and it’s something warm to drink, preferably with a roll or a turnover. And I have to have heavy cream in it! No milk, no H&H.

    My father was a smoker, and I never picked up that habit either. Go figure.

  28. 28
    JPL says:

    @trollhattan: It appears that they did.

  29. 29
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    They’re probably all good or they wouldn’t survive. Especially in Tribeca!

  30. 30
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @trollhattan: he was black, so no Alabama cop saw him as a good guy

  31. 31
  32. 32
    White & Gold Purgatorian says:

    @trollhattan: Be fair. Alabama cops shot a BLACK good guy with a gun. They stop processing at black, ya know.

  33. 33


    P.S. I’m gonna make my own Saturnalia stuff. I’m tired waiting for Hallmark Cards to do the right thing.

  34. 34
    NotMax says:

    re: that video

    Some days you’re just evil,. Mr. C.


  35. 35
    WhatsMyNym says:


    We have a coffee roasters here in Lancaster. Established in 1837

    My dad was from that area (a little further south). I wonder if he ever heard about it, he was dedicated coffee drinker.

  36. 36
    A Ghost To Most says:

    I spent some time in Melbourne and Sydney, and got to like Ozzie Rules Football. Cricket, not so much.

  37. 37
    Brachiator says:


    Who died and made Andrew Zimmern the authority on Chinese food in America?

    Well, the late LA Times restaurant critic Jonathan Gold, who died on July 21, was wonderfully knowledgeable about Chinese food, and yet I doubt that his ghost anointed this knucklehead Zimmern to be the next authority on anything. This guy is truly an idiot, and clearly is just trying to make a buck out of the ridiculous idea that he is uniquely qualified to lead white people to the Chinese food promised land.

    I am a bit annoyed at the author of the story, Ruth Tam, who falls into the silliness of the idea that only white people’s thoughts about Chinese food matter.

  38. 38
    NotMax says:

    @Major Major Major Major

    Found this via Google right off the bat. (source)

    Laughing Man Coffee & Tea

    Let’s just start by saying we love any coffee shop with Hugh Jackman as a founder. To sweeten the deal they’re socially conscious as well. 100% of Laughing Man Worldwide revenue goes back to education, community development and new business development and 50% of Laughing Man Coffee & Tea goes back to Laughing Man Worldwide to further its mission.

    184 Duane St
    (at Greenwich St in TriBeCa)

  39. 39
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Brachiator: I don’t take cuisine notes from someone whose claim to fame is willingness to eat shit that you wouldn’t eat if you had a job.

  40. 40
    CaseyL says:

    Just got back from spending Thanksgiving in Ocean Shores. It was, as always, a wonderful place to spend a few days. Now I’m home and my kitties are deciding whether they’ll forgive me for abandoning then to a stranger (a professional pet sitter).

    I may tune in to a sportsball game at some point.

  41. 41
    Yarrow says:


    Oh and if you get BBC America on your cable they usually show all the big games.

    This is incorrect information. Many years ago BBC America had the rights to the Six Nations tournament but they haven’t had it for some time. They don’t have the rights to any rugby at the moment.

    @James E Powell: The North American rights to the international rugby games change all the time. As someone mentioned above, currently you can watch the Six Nations (that’s in the spring) on the NBC Universal online site. You have to buy the Rugby Pass for the year. They also have all the Premiership Rugby matches and show a handful of them on NBC Sports Channel.

    For the current Autumn Internationals you can watch them two ways: some of the matches are on ESPN+, which costs about $5/month. There’s an app you can download to your TV, Roku, tablet, computer, whatever. It works pretty well. The NZ All Blacks and Irish matches are on ESPN+. The other matches, including all the England matches, are on Flo Rugby. It’s an online site and you have to pay a monthly fee.

    Other options include streams and VPNs, but if you are not watching it live that can be hit or miss.

  42. 42
    Yutsano says:

    @CaseyL: The Cougs lost last night, but I’m not going to be upset about it. The better angels definitely shone brightly last night. I misted up. Was so proud of my old band.

  43. 43
    Litlebritdifrnt says:

    @Yarrow: Sorry about that my information is obviously outdated and I apologize.

  44. 44
    Yarrow says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt: No big deal. I just didn’t want someone to add BBC America to a cable package thinking they’d get rugby. It was great when they had it because they had the BBC feed with all the halftime analysis and interviews at the end. I wish they’d bring it back.

  45. 45
    Mr Stagger Lee says:

    @Steeplejack: Meanwhile the Copa Libertadores is delayed because moron River Plate fans gassed the Boca Juniors bus, just like idiot Boca fans tear gassed River Plate players 3 years ago. And you think American sports fans are over the top?

  46. 46
    Doug R says:

    I’m a little late for the dead thread downstairs, but as a previous resident of Alberta, I can attest to the conservative bent of the entire province and especially the rural areas. The right wing Reform party got its start there and provincially the Conservatives weren’t conservative enough, so someone started the Wild Rose party. Which peeled off just enough votes that the NDP was able to win the last election based on their strength in (R)Edmonton and some in Calgary and break about 30 years of Conservative rule. So now Alberta is run by social democrats, but the oil industry has its tentacles in so deep, their NDP government is fighting with British Columbia’s NDP government about pipelines and wine.

  47. 47
    NotMax says:

    @Doug R

    Personally am in favor of wine pipelines.


  48. 48
    HeleninEire says:

    43-14 Ireland with 12 minutes remaining. Ah well. I can claim VICTORY either way ;)

  49. 49
  50. 50
    A Ghost To Most says:

    @Mr Stagger Lee: So much energy expended for such a slow sport.

    /hockey fan

  51. 51
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Dude, there’s like Google. Don’t be so lazy ; p//s

  52. 52
    Ceci n est pas mon nym says:

    @Major Major Major Major: My favorite lower Manhattan coffee shop is Think Coffee near Union Square. Don’t know if you consider that close by or not. You may have a wait for a table but I think you’ll find that in any New York coffee house.

  53. 53
    NotMax says:

    @Ceci n est pas mon nym

    Read somewhere they’re starting up the Chock Full O’ Nuts coffee shops again.

  54. 54
    Yarrow says:

    @NotMax: According to their website there are two in Brooklyn.

  55. 55
    Yarrow says:

    This is interesting:

    Ecuador’s ambassador to the UK has been forced out, raising questions about Assange’s fate— Natasha Bertrand (@NatashaBertrand) November 24, 2018

  56. 56
    NotMax says:

    Artsy movie theater I worked at while in high school was owned by a coffee company.

    One day, several pallets of bags of ground coffee showed up in the basement. Word was it had gone sour and would be stored there until someone could figure out what to do with it.

    Watched as the assistant manager opened a bag, filled his pipe and smoked the stuff. Not once, but repeated times before it was all whisked to who knows where.

  57. 57
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    🎵 “Better coffee a millionaire’s money can’t buy.” 🎶 🎵

  58. 58
    NotMax says:



    Some things seemingly go away but linger on. A&P is long gone yet still occasionally see their Eight O’clock brand coffee for sale.

  59. 59
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    Eight O’Clock coffee was the staple in my household growing up. Haven’t thought of it (nor of the Great Atlantic & Pacific Tea Company) for many a year.

  60. 60
    NotMax says:


    Eight O’Clock coffee was the staple in my household growing up.

    Ditto. Don’t recall ever seeing any bags of their other brand (Red Circle?) in the house.

  61. 61
    germy says:

    Lol someone asked me why I still had my Beto sticker on my laptop even though he lost 2 days ago

    IDK why do people have the confederate flag still. They lost 150 years ago.

    — Eric Rodriguez (@thefakecarmona) November 8, 2018

  62. 62
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    Don’t recall ever seeing any bags of their other brand (Red Circle?) in the house.

    Yup. Red Circle and Bokar were A&P’s other house brands.

  63. 63
    Jay says:

    @Doug R:

    On the other hand, turns out Albertans are the Real Canadian Potheads, not BC’ers.

  64. 64
    Raven says:

    GO DAWGS! Way to boatrace those insects!

  65. 65
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Yutsano: ,,,,ay

  66. 66
    debbie says:


    Ate there daily when I first moved to NYC.

  67. 67
    debbie says:


    It’s still around. I drink it daily.

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  69. 69
    burnspbesq says:

    The nastiest local rivalry in the world is going on as I write this. Boca Juniors vs. River Plate, the two big football clubs in Buenos Aires, are playing for the Copa Libertadores, the championship of South American club football. This rivalry makes Duke – Carolina, Liverpool – Everton, and Yankees – Red Sox look like ice cream socials.

  70. 70
    HeleninEire says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: My Dad worked for the A&P for 35 years. Their tea called “Our Own” was the best. Even my Ireland born mother loved it.

  71. 71
    burnspbesq says:


    Actually not a bad result for the USA. We really suck at rugby.

  72. 72


    Found this via Google right off the bat.

    Sure, of course, but I was just wondering if anybody here had a particular spot anywhere that they liked personally.

  73. 73
    SiubhanDuinne says:


    That is high praise!

  74. 74
    Raven says:

    @Paulwartenberg: HAHAHA, Go Gators. They suck.

  75. 75
    Yutsano says:

    Since it’s open thread: go look at the WaPo opinions page today. They’re not only still all in on Khashoggi murder, they are ripping the president* apart for the MBS ball washing, It’s almost beautifully devastating.

  76. 76
    Kathleen says:

    @NotMax: Kroger sells it. ETA But I know you don’t have Kroger in Hawaii. It looks like Amazon sells it also. It’s evidently still a thing.

  77. 77
    HeleninEire says:

    @burnspbesq: Yeah but now my Irish friends are telling me that Ireland fielded the “B” team. So, yeah, America double plus sucks.

    ETA: Final score 57-14. Damn.

  78. 78
    JPL says:

    @Raven: Now that Michigan lost, Georgia should be back in the top four. What happens when they play BAMA in the division playoff?

  79. 79
    Ruckus says:

    When I was a kid we had retired next door neighbors. In their 80s he had worked for Standard Oil and traveled around the world, spoke 5 languages fluently, which was rather exotic to me. Every morning the lady of the house would get up at 6am, and make fresh roasted coffee. The smell was a divine way to wake up in the morning. But the taste of coffee makes me sick. Love the smell – which I can’t do any more – can’t stand drinking it at all.

  80. 80
    Raven says:

    @JPL: I’m sure bama will be a double digit favorite since no one has come close to them this year. We certainly will have a punchers chance but I won’t bet betting the farm on this one. We’re coming but it may not be this year.

  81. 81
    Ruckus says:

    Lived with a chinese american lady for almost 20 yrs. Now she knew chinese food, having grown up in a household where her parents didn’t speak english. A food critic in the Times? Pfffft.

  82. 82
    Raven says:

    @Ruckus: My buddy in Oakland is married to a Chinese woman (and Cal Law School grad) and they took us to a joint in Daley City that was awesome!

  83. 83
    JPL says:

    @Raven: This is where the divisional playoffs can upset the playoff scenario though. Ohio State is going to play Northwestern and GA is going to play BAMA. Clemson plays Pitt I think and Notre Dame gets a pass.
    Auburn is hanging tough against Bama, but true to form they have some really nasty players.

  84. 84
    Raven says:

    @JPL: We have a really good team that is loaded with talent but it may not be enough. I didn’t get tix for next week and there has been no word on other post-season.

  85. 85
    JPL says:

    @Raven: That makes sense because unless Notre Dame loses tonight, there will be only one SEC team going to the playoffs.

  86. 86

    @Raven: I’m pretty sure your Dawgs will get a bowl bid. //

  87. 87
    Raven says:

    @JPL: Clemson has South Carolina tonight.

  88. 88
    Raven says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: the consensus is if we lose we play Oklahoma again in the Sugar Bowl.

  89. 89
    JPL says:

    @Raven: Yup and Pitt in the division playoff.

  90. 90

    @Raven: My Dawgs have to play the Utes to see where we’ll play, the Bruins will be able to enjoy the holidays at home.

  91. 91
    rekoob says:

    @Amir Khalid: @trollhattan: Which reminds me of the old observation that American business is like American football — violence punctuated by committee meetings.

  92. 92
    Brachiator says:


    Lived with a chinese american lady for almost 20 yrs. Now she knew chinese food, having grown up in a household where her parents didn’t speak english. A food critic in the Times? Pfffft.

    Unless you know Gold’s work, and have eaten some of the food he writes about, you cannot brush him off so easily.

    I used to watch this Japanese program on broadcast tv. A trio, two guys and a woman would travel all over the country, trying regional specialties. Even though they were natives, they regularly ran into foods and cooking styles that were totally new to them.

    And this was just Japan. China is a huge ass country. And the US has benefited from ethnic diversity. You can visit a few restaurants on a single street in Alhambra and eat food from several different regions of China. Home cooking, even great home cooking, might not always be as varied and expert.

    Also, not everyone could be lucky enough to eat the homemade cooking you may have eaten.

  93. 93
    Yutsano says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA:@Raven: I have to admit a Georgia-WSU game could be fun.

  94. 94

    @Yutsano: UCLA against the Trees is turning out to be an interesting game.

  95. 95
    J R in WV says:


    My thought is that if you go to a Chinese place to eat, and 50% or more of the crowd is Asian/Chinese, you’re kin a good place. Same for Japanese, we visited a Japanese place twice in our NYC vacation, more than half of the crowd was Japanese; wonderful food.

    In Houston TX that’s how we judged Mexican places – if there were Zero Hispanic folks in there, go, leave, don’t risk it. The best places were highly populated by the ethnicity of the chef, otherwise, just go down the street a block to a more genuine ethnic place.

  96. 96
    Yutsano says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Never ever EVER underestimate any Pac-12 team. Even the bottom team is capable of taking out number one.

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    @Brachiator: Sometimes what can be a little irritating is that a white person usually male is presented as a voice of authority for a certain cuisine or as an interpreter of the said cuisine to the average American (there is an unspoken assumption of who is the default too.
    See for example Christopher Kimball’s new show or many of Food Network’s shows. PBS is usually better than Food Network about this.

    It feels like Orientalism lite.

  100. 100

    @Yutsano: Yup, it’s a crazy conference.

  101. 101
    Raven says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: I understand that weed is de-facto legal out there but you guys are nuts.

  102. 102

    @Raven: Haven’t touched that stuff in over 35 years, anything can happen in a PAC-12 game.

  103. 103
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Yutsano: you mean within the PAC-12, right? Cuz I don’t see USC for example beating Bama or Georgia or LSU or Vanderbilt.

  104. 104
    Raven says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: Against each other for sure.

  105. 105
    Raven says:

    @Steve in the ATL: Pretty boy was really good today.

  106. 106
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Raven: indeed. He threw some good balls. Didn’t have to, of course. Wasn’t even a game!

  107. 107
    Raven says:

    @Steve in the ATL: I had a great time!

  108. 108
    Raven says:

    I’d love to see this mediocre South Carolina team beat Climpson!

  109. 109
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Raven: that would be beautiful

  110. 110
    Uncle Cosmo says:

    @Brachiator: Some years ago (& maybe still) there was an Indian restaurant right around the corner from Piccadilly Circus in London that featured 3 regional cuisines – & changed their menu each month to feature 3 different ones – & did that for an entire year without repeating. That’s right, 36 distinct regional cuisines on the subcontinent. No joy searching on line – my google-fu appears to be google-FUBAR.

  111. 111
    debbie says:

    I don’t pay attention to football, but this caught my eye:

    Just like that, @OhioStateFB's Dwayne Haskins breaks Drew Brees' 1998 Big Ten record with his 40TH TD PASS OF THE SEASON 👏— FOX College Football (@CFBONFOX) November 24, 2018

  112. 112
    Raven says:

    @debbie: He’s bum!

  113. 113
    debbie says:


    LOL. I’m sure it will be the first 20 minutes of the local news tonight. //

  114. 114
    Raven says:

    @debbie: Oh are you in Columbus?

  115. 115
    debbie says:


    I am. Tough when you don’t care for the sport.

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    JR says:

    @schrodingers_cat: kimball is a douchebag but his show is well presented and his recipes are generally very very good.

  117. 117
    Raven says:

    @debbie: Our nephew lives there and has gone full Buckeye.

  118. 118
    debbie says:


    Hopefully, this is just a phase he’ll grow out of.

  119. 119
    Steve in the ATL says:

    @Raven: bring him to Athens during sorority rush and he should heal up nicely

  120. 120
    Raven says:

    @Steve in the ATL: He’s “in a relationship”!

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    Ruckus says:

    Like everything else there is good and bad in food critics. What I find is that most of them don’t know their ass from a hole in the ground. The ones that do, like Bourdain did, like a lot of types of food and will try things that are different and that many would not eat.
    Was in Athens, the original one in Greece, and was hungry. A number of places had some sort of meat cooking on a vertical spit and a chunk on a stick was about 25 cents. No one else would eat it, it was great. Dumbasses missed the best meal they’d had in weeks.
    That lady and I went to her sisters reception and of course it was as traditional as mom could make it. First the family goes from table to table, there is no receiving line. Not being family I got to sit up on the stage where the family ate, by my self as the food was brought and served. Ex told me that I had to eat some of everything or it would offend. Ten yrs later she still wouldn’t tell me what I’d eaten that day. But it was all good so it didn’t matter what if any food aversions I had.
    What some food critics show me is that they are prissy about other people and their foods without good cause. And I admit that I’ve eaten some things over the years that I’d never serve to my dog, or your’s either. But I don’t get paid to tell people what to eat or what’s not eatable. It reminds me of whatever politician it was that was drinking $350/bottles of wine, not because it was good or not but because it cost $350 and they weren’t paying.

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    NotMax says:


    had some sort of meat cooking on a vertical spit

    Either goat or lamb, more than likely. Gyro meat.

  123. 123
    Ruckus says:

    It was gray, spicy and good. My best guess then was lamb, but in reality it didn’t matter. I don’t speak Greek so all I could do was point and raise one finger, hand them money. Oh and go back for seconds.

  124. 124
    Bonnie says:

    I am too old to even begin to listen to beloved Christmas songs sung in rap style–or whatever it is called. So, thanks; but, no thanks.

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