I went to the orchard this afternoon, and along the way thought about this article I read a few days ago:
Bite into a Honeycrisp apple and you understand why consumers are willing to pay so much for a piece of fruit: the crunch.
That’s no accident. In the pre-Honeycrisp era, apples had just two textures: “soft and mealy (that nobody liked), and then we had the good apples, the hard, crisp and dense,” said David Bedford, one of the original breeders of the Honeycrisp.
Unlike the vast majority of modern commercial produce, the Honeycrisp apple wasn’t bred to grow, store or ship well. It was bred for taste: crisp, with balanced sweetness and acidity. Though it succeeded beyond anyone’s wildest dreams, along the way it became a nightmare for some producers, forcing small Northeastern growers to compete with their massive, climatically advantaged counterparts on the West Coast.
If you read more than the excerpt, you will learn that the Honeycrisp, while a good apple and apparently in super high demand, is a total kick in the dick for growers. While I was picking out what I wanted, I asked the guy about them, telling him I had read an article about them. He asked “the one online?” and I responded yes, and his eyes narrowed, face reddened, and he got the same look I get whenever someone brings up Trump or the 2016 primaries- “That article didn’t do it justice.”
He then went on an extended but polite rant about them- they only fruit every other year, they get sunburnt, they grow too big and break branches on young trees, they are susceptible to sunburn and basically anything that can plague any other apple tree, and even storing them is a colossal pain in the ass. You pick them, store them outside for two days, then move them inside for a couple days, then you can refrigerate them, and even then they can start to decay. So the next time you bite into a delicious honeycrisp, just remember that apple growers think you are an asshole.
I browsed around the place for a bit- I just love it. It’s a little garage like building on the outskirts of the orchard, with large 3 foot tall 4-5′ wide bins just filled with all different types of apples, and as soon as you walk into the place the aroma of apples and ciders just takes over. It’s a no fuss operation. Just one guy, a folding table with some bags and a tin for the cash, and the big bins for apples and a couple refrigerators for the cider.
I picked up a couple different varieties- including some small fuji’s for mom (she likes tiny apples, and the galas were done for the season) and a gallon of cider for Harry up the street at the general store. For myself (and I will share a few with dad), I got a bag of Ruby Frosts and a bag of Nittanys. The Ruby Frost is a deep burgundy colored apple, of medium size with good crispness, a nice sweet tart first bite, and then a semi-sweet finish with a solid flavor of what I can only describe as the essence of apple. They are a new variety from New York (although I don’t know how long my guy has been growing them), and I think they are very pretty:
I also picked up a five lb bag of Nittanys. They are also a very pretty apple- a bright red with patches of yellow and orange through out, almost sun kissed, that closely resemble the apple version of a properly mixed tequila sunrise. They are crisp and juicy, with a nice tart taste.
And then, of course, I got a bag of honeycrisps, because we all know I am an asshole and there’s just no hiding it.
TenguPhule
Considering how many bad apples I had to eat as a child because they decided mealy crap was acceptable sales product, fuck em.
Gravenstone
Dude, I love when honeycrisps come in season around here. A sliced honeycrisp and a couple tablespoons of peanut butter to dip it in, and I’m in heaven.
JPL
Now I want pie with some indictments.
Wapiti
I dislike the size of the Honeycrisps. It’s about two or three servings. I can understand why the grocers seem to like them – they’re selling them by the pound.
I also dislike the huge onions that they sell these days. Hook a couple of those on your belt and you’ll need suspenders to keep your pants up.
sheila in nc
Way back when I was in graduate school in western Massachusetts, I got to know a bunch of different apples that weren’t available to me growing up in the mid-Atlantic. I fell in love with Cortlands — tangy, white-fleshed, perfect for pies. I don’t ever see them here in NC. Also, at the time, Cornell had something called a Department of Pomology (but I think it is called something different now).
Gin & Tonic
The best apple is the Macoun. The Orange Pippin is great, too, but super hard to find.
zhena gogolia
@sheila in nc:
I like Cortlands and Macouns.
syphonblue
Cameo > Honeycrisp
Sab
I miss winesaps: crisp, tart, not huge.
zhena gogolia
@syphonblue:
Ooh, yeah, but I never see those here.
TenguPhule
@JPL:
Pumpkin or Custard?
trollhattan
Holy Christ, you lurve you some apples. I hope they all keep.
Growing up in Washington State I watched the broad array of autumn apple varieties collapse into the maw of Big Delicious forever, and it’s been decades since I’ve eaten a fresh, say, winesap to pick a childhood favorite. We have an Apple Hill area in the Sierra foothills but they can’t equal the quality of eastern Washington, I think because the dormant period is too brief and not especially cold anymore. Out deliverance is the Fuji, which IIUC tolerate warmer climates and are the most reliable type now. Not for baking, however.
Ceci n est pas mon nym
When I moved to MD and then PA, I fell in love with a PA apple called the Stayman. Or the Winesap. Or the Stayman Winesap. I’m a little unclear as to whether Stayman Winesap is its whole name or those are hybrids of two separate varieties called Stayman and Winesap.
Anyway, it got to be November and I still haven’t seem them in the produce stores this year (last time I checked was 1-2 weeks ago, so maybe they’re in now). I’m used to seeing them in September or October. A guy in one of those places told me years ago that they don’t ripen until you get some cold nights. So I guess it hasn’t been cold enough for the local apples here in PA. One more sign of global warming.
ruemara
ok, but I like Jazzes & Fujis. Plus the super secret fave Pink Pearls, that have a beautiful pink interior.
Schlemazel
The reason the badly misnamed”red delicious” was so popular was that it shipped well and lasted forever. Green under the skin, cardboard flavor and the texture of gritty paste.
I can’t imagine why people prefer honeycrisp.
kitfox2
Also good: Jazz, cortland, winesap, sweetango, opal.
Tim C.
“And then, of course, I got a bag of honeycrisps” New rotating tag?
Ceci n est pas mon nym
@sheila in nc: I think Cortlands are originally a NY variety. We had them growing up in NY, in fact my parents had a couple of Cortland trees out back. We see them occasionally down here in PA, some growers grow them.
Corner Stone
Let’s make this clear: I DO.NOT. GAF what they think. Honeycrisps are the superior apple. Full stop.
Corner Stone
@Schlemazel: The red delicious didn’t last forever. It went bad almost before you paid for it at checkout and then got more mealy inside every day. The perfect skin was nice but it basically turned me off apples for over a decade or so.
Peter
This claim that honeycrisp is the firsr crisp apple is insane. Northern spy. Boskoop. Lots more.
Corner Stone
@Wapiti:
My local store sells the mongo sized ones but also the lunch bag size. They are not all that huge size, at least here.
JPL
@TenguPhule: I’m not sure that I can look at a pumpkin this Thanksgiving.
I blame trump
Wag
So the consumer is the asshole for demanding a delicious apple that doesn’t suck? The red “delicious,” the worst excuse for an apple EVER, and he is complaining that we want one that requires care to provide a quality product? Sorry, I’ll stick to apples that don’t suck.
Not that I’m opposed to little-known varieties. When I lived in Minnesota i frequented apple stands this time of year, and reveled in the shear deliciousness of the many varieties. Including, one year, a little known new variety bred by the University of Minnesota, the Honeycrisp.
frosty
John, I LOL’ed at work at your last line. I never expect it but you throw it in every time.
Just for the record, you’re not an asshole no matter how hard you work at it. Thanks for the site, it’s a lifesaver.
burnspbesq
If I ever move back to the northeast, McIntosh apples will be a big part of the reason why. They are nearly always beat to shit by the time they get to SoCal. For now, Grannies will have to do.
Corner Stone
@Gravenstone:
Or a nice couple slices of sharp or extra sharp cheddar cheese. Mmmmm…
JPL
McIntosh apples are great.
schrodingers_cat
I like Braeburns, but I hardly if ever see them in stores these days.
Wag
@JPL: @ruemara: @syphonblue: @zhena gogolia:
I like Harlsons from MN
MattF
If you see Topaz apples, try them out. Very tasty, not as huge as Honeycrisps.
mattd
Haven’t had honeycrisp, but I get a variety at the Mountain View farmer’s market called a Sundowner that has all those characteristics. I get it from a family that grows a huge variety of organic apples. They haven’t complained about having to grow sundowners.
indycat32
Honeycrisp were my favorite even at $3.00/pound, until I tried a Rave – also $3/pound but not as large as the Honeycrisp. My local Meijer had Rave apples for about two weeks a couple months ago and I haven’t seen them since.
lamh36
Look what I got in the mail today!!
Can’t wait to read #Becoming @MichelleObama
Can’t wait to read it. I’m saving it for my trip to LA in December. So I can dig into it without having to worry bout something else I have to do!
Oh, and if any of the FPer is planning to post a thread bout it (paging Anne Laurie)…check this out:
Schlemazel
@Corner Stone:
Same here. Honeycrisp was developed here and we have had them for years. Not all are huge, I wonder if growers are trying to recoup the expense of the new trees and time before they produced.
@Corner Stone: dad used to keep a box in the cellar, wrapped each in a sheet of newspaper because they were cheaper in bulk. I had one in my lunch bag every damn day of school. They don’t get better with age
geg6
I admit it….I am addicted to Honeycrisp apples and I don’t care if it makes me an asshole. They are some of the most delicious things I’ve ever eaten. My perfect lunch is a Honeycrisp with some Jif peanut butter slathered on.
Cathy W
My husband is one of the “Honeycrisps Are The Only Valid Apples” people. But I do the grocery shopping and I refuse to pay literally twice as much for them when there are other kinds of apples right next to them in the produce department that are almost as good. He’s acknowledged that Piñata, Cortland, and Pink Lady (Cripps Pink) are very good, and I had an Opal the other day that I liked a lot.
schrodingers_cat
No love for Granny Smiths? I love their crisp texture, and the sweet and sour taste.
gvg
reading on line, Honeycrips is a very cold climate apple developed by the University of Minnesota. That would be a reason a grower in WV has trouble with it. recommended 800-1000 chill hours.
zhena gogolia
@geg6:
My supermarket won’t carry Jif Extra Crunchy for some reason, no matter how many times I’ve asked them. (I’ve been shopping there for 26 years.) So now I order it from Amazon.
Walker
In our house, we prefer Sansa and Jonagold. But then the local university does have an orchard that produces a wide variety.
I have planted a few apple trees on my property and taken classes in how to take care of them. Nothing super commercial, but just enough for baking or cider production. For cider, I really like Red Rome. When you press it, it produces a bright red liquid that tastes like Apple lemonade.
sheila in nc
I will say that one BIG problem with Honeycrisp is that I don’t like them in pie. I made a pie with Honeycrisp and they basically never cooked down! They stayed crisp, all right, but sometimes you want the apple to cook up and mix with the spices and basically turn into apple pie filling. Honeycrisps will NOT do that. Argh.
Corner Stone
@Cathy W:
Knock Knock Knock. Hello, this is a constable needing to serve you divorce papers. Thanks so much. Have a nice day.
schrodingers_cat
@frosty: He is a jackfruit. Thorny and rough on the outside, sweet on the inside.
opiejeanne
@TenguPhule: I’m with you; it’s the same thing breeders did for commercial growers with tomatoes.
They want to grow apples that are easy to ship and can be stored for up to a year in the refrigerator. The apples that do that best have no flavor and even if they started out crisp, by the time those apples come out of cold storage most have become a bit mushy.
We grow apples at our house in Western Washington. The first year our Honey Crisp produced the most wonderful apples, because we buy more mature fruit trees for our garden; this was at least 5 years old. Then it skipped a year, and we figured it was just like most young fruit trees that may skip the second year they’re in the ground, and most fruit trees seem to have a heavier production every other year anyway. Now the Honey Crisp all seem to have cork spot, which is exactly what it sounds like, and not just on the peel but scattered throughout the flesh. It’s true that the apples are gigantic now, but none were edible. It’s a shame. We are considering starting over with a new one, away from the other fruit trees.
We also grow Williams Pride and Melrose and Akane.
Williams Pride is not likely to ever be a huge commercial apple because of its unruly growing habit and the fact that it doesn’t “crop”, requires more than one picking, but the fruit is a delight. The skin is dark red to purple, the scent is like perfume, and they are delicious and crisp. They are an early apple, ready usually in mid-September. This year they were almost ready in late August and this was not a big production year for the tree so we ate the entire crop pretty quickly.
The Akane was an unnamed tree that we picked up cheap two years ago because the label had been lost, and have been very pleased with it; last year we took a couple of pieces of fruit back to the nursery (Flower World in Maltby) and they helped us figure out what it was, based on the characteristics of the varieties they had carried the previous years. Small crop and small apples this year because of the intense heat, but good and tart.
Melrose is just a damned good apple. We are eating the last of them now, and will probably finish them off in early December. They are stored in our garage, away from sunlight. It’s always cold in there, even in mid-summer. They make decent pies or you can eat them as is. They were afflicted with something that damaged some of the flesh just under the skin, and the birds attacked them before they were ripe so we lost a lot, but the two trees are prolific so we still have about 30 pounds left.
I really miss living in SoCal and being able to go to SnoLine in Oak Glen to get a box of really good apples. $3.49/pound for Honey Crisps at the local grocery store is a bit too steep and the farm stand called Yakima is closed now for the winter. They had them for under $2 last time we went and I wish we’d bought more than we did.
artem1s
looks like a good thread to mention ‘A Botany of Desire’ as a great read. Michael Pollen has a great chapter about the propagation of apple varieties and how unique a plant they are. Also how they are so tightly bound to the settlement of the ‘near’ west states in the early 1800’s.
Mai Naem mobile
I like Pink Lady apples. Also Kanzis and Fiestas. I’ve never liked Red Delicious.
Avalune
That’s a bummer – I really like Honeycrisp. But I’m also happy to eat Pink Lady quite a bit. Tried a jazzy? Or something like – it was ok. I just hate red delicious (anything named delicious is suspect – if you have to try to convince me it is delicious it probably isn’t).
bluefoot
Mmmm…fresh picked apples. I grew up in NYS with apple trees of different types in the backyard. I love trying varieties of apples I haven’t had before, which is half the reason I go to my local farmers market. Out of the more common varieties, for eating out of hand, lately I like fuji and macouns. For pies, it’s mutsu plus some more tart variety mixed in. Now I want pie.
geg6
@zhena gogolia:
I’m not a crunchy peanut butter person, but I won’t eat any other peanut butter. Jif is, to me, the champagne of peanut butters. And don’t try to foist that crappy organic, oily crap on me that you have to stir and it still tastes like crap. Jif forever!
Schlemazel
I assume everyone knows this but it comes up here tangentially.
All fruits and vegetables not local get picked unripe and then made to look ripe while in shipping.
I stopped buying granny Smith’s because they were palming off crap apples two weeks shy of ripe. They came from South Africa ffs!
So if you know when stuff is ripe locally that is the time to buy.
Best exay: we took the kids to spring training games in Ft.Mayer one year. Driving home we got behind a giant dump truck full of green softballs. We could not figure out WTH they were but a lot came bouncing out and rolled down the highway. Finally the kids convinced me to stop and get one. It was a tomato. Turns out a lot of them come from there and are gassed to turn red. It is no wonder grocery store tomatoes taste like cardboard
Walker
@sheila in nc:
It is now the Horticulture Section of the School of Integrative Plant Science. The Cornell orchards are the public facing store.
Jeff
I like Pink Ladies and Fuji apples better.
zhena gogolia
@geg6:
I’m with you!
zhena gogolia
@Avalune:
How are things going?
kentropic
From the description, that has to ne Brown’s out in Hickory – a local treasure! The next time you’re in the neighborhood, be sure to stop by Bedillion’s for some fresh, real honey. And I agree with the commenters above who recommend Macouns – my favorite apple.
donnah
@schrodingers_cat:
Big fan of Granny Smiths, and they’re my go-to choice for baking an apple pie or cobbler. They maintain their integrity in baking and their tartness balances so well with nutmeg and cinnamon.
Just to eat? Honeycrisp, and also Granny Smith with caramel dip.
Gelfling 545
Sorry. Only McIntosh really taste like apples to me. I can make do with a Cortland or a Golden Delicious but I prefer to just enjoy McIntosh in their rather short season.
West of the Rockies
In non-apple news, anyone hear any rumors as to the supposedly-impending Mueller indictments?
TenguPhule
@opiejeanne: I am envious.
Mnemosyne
Once upon a time, I found a favorite new apple called the Pacific Rose. It was both sweet and crunchy and became my favorite apple of all time.
Sadly, it vanished from grocery store shelves because it doesn’t seem to have been commercially viable — it didn’t travel well, and if you stored them too long, they wizened really fast.
But they were damn good apples while they lasted.
Mnemosyne
For my fellow Fuji fans, I suspect that may be a variety that stays west of the Mississippi for the most part. Here in So Cal, we can buy them at farmers markets directly from the growers.
Corner Stone
@West of the Rockies: They’ve got 15 minutes if they’re coming today. IMO, it’s just that – a rumor mill of Fitzmas hopefuls.
Avalune
@zhena gogolia: Up and down really. He had a blood clot in his leg so that was an adventure. Then we were chasing a fever again so they installed another drain and put him on antibiotics. Today we confirmed tibia plateau fracture in the “good knee” along with MCL tear, to go with the shoulder fracture and all the other known fractures and whatnots. So they had to adjust PT again because he’s now unable to put weight on either leg. In spite of frustrations he is staying upbeat and doing what he can to strengthen his muscles so they are ready when he can put weight on things again. Day at a time.
chopper
@Corner Stone:
it was bad before it even got picked off the fucking tree if you ask me.
stinger
A Red Delicious picked ripe from a tree is a very different critter from the mushy, flavorless crap in the store that has been picked too early, shipped, stored, then gassed to “ripen” and shipped again. A real Red Delicious has a flavor different from that of most apples, light and sweet, and a decent texture. I’ve avoided buying Honeycrisp as the name implies sweetness where I prefer tart/spicy, but I may give them a try.
I’ve been planting apple trees for about the past 7 years, and the older ones are beginning to produce. I’m planting mostly heirlooms and avoiding varieties that can be found in the grocery store year round. So far I have one each of Red June, Lady, D’Arcy Spice, Paulared, Cox’s Orange Pippin, Mother, Northern Spy, Pomme Grise, Calville Blanc d’Hiver, Spitzenburg, Macoun, Hudson’s Golden Gem, Arlet, Gravenstein, and, what may be my favorite, Ashmead’s Kernel. The names are so great! In the spring I’ll plant Maiden Blush, Pitmaston Pineapple, and Melrose. When they’re all producing, I’ll have my own fresh apples from August through October.
James Kakalios
@gvg:
Yup – came here to say that. It was created at University of Minnesota (you’re welcome!), where cold climate in fall is not a problem (this morning is was 11 ° when I got up).
There was a vineyard here in MN – not sure if they are still around. Their motto was: Where the Grapes Suffer!
low-tech cyclist
AFAIAC, Honeycrisps are pretty disappointing. You get that one in every batch that’s really good, that reminds you of why everybody goes apeshit over them. And then the other four or five in that basket will be crap. Not quite to the “I’d rather eat a Red Delicious apple” level, but close.
I’ve been a fan of Fujis, which up until about a year ago, had been reliably crunchy, juicy, and sweet. But lately I’ve been running across the occasional mealy batch. I bought a basket of Fuji apples at my local farmer’s market two weeks ago, and they were totally mealy. I may just have to make a pie or two from them.
SiubhanDuinne
@artem1s:
One of my all-time favourite books. If you hadn’t mentioned it, I would have.
In the same vein, A History of the World in Six Glasses by Tom Standage is also fascinating, informative, and a most enjoyable read.
A Ghost To Most
Before I went in the service, I worked in an applesauce factory. That experience was enough to convince me that I had to find a way to get to college.
Ked
Not a massive honeycrisp fan, but they are certainly a massive upgrade over red fucking delicious. Growing up in northern IN we seemed to only have red and yellow delicious available. Yellow are just inedible, reds kept tasting more and more like detergent every year – and lately seem to foam like it too.
I don’t care what you buy – enjoy your apples! But don’t buy those red fucking delicious bars of soap and the market will take care of itself.
Neldob
I’m partial to Zestars these days. It has its own symphony of flavors, on the tarty side, and red. There are so many varieties to try! Moving up here I’ve traded oranges and avocados for apples and pears and berries. Not a bad trade.
Victor Matheson
@Wag: Back when I was grad student at the University of MN in the early 90s, one of my students from the ag school gave me a proverbial apple to the teacher. She said it was their new, top secret apple and would change my life.
Best apple I ever had at the time. Lots of decent competitors today, but then it was the greatest thing I had ever tasted. It was at least a decade before I could get them in the store, but it was nice to know for many years that greatness was on the way.
Dorothy A. Winsor
@Avalune: All the best to him and to you too. What a journey.
opiejeanne
@Gin & Tonic: I have never had a Macoun or an Orange Pippin.
There was a great article in the Los Angeles Times about 10 years ago about a couple of orchardists in a Ventura county canyon with just-right condition for growing apples, and bringing a lot of very old varieties to the Farmers Market in Santa Monica. One very old woman was described as near tears as she ate a Belle of Boskoop apple for the first time since she left either Belgium or Holland.
ruemara
@schrodingers_cat: I love sour but I just can’t deal with Granny Smiths. The Pink Pearls are nice & tart & crisp. I’ve found the Grannys were often a bit mealy or dry.
Victor Matheson
@stinger: holy crap! You are obviously an apple conisuer and you have never had a Honeycrisp?
That’s like saying you like movies about the mafia and you might get around to watching The Godfather someday.
opiejeanne
@Schlemazel: The original red delicious were pretty good. That was bred out of them in favor of the bright. dark red skin which became tough and bitter.
opiejeanne
@burnspbesq: We grew Mackintosh apples and Fujis in Anaheim.
We grew Granny Smith in Riverside, of all places.
Oh wait, never mind, not Macintosh. It was a Braeburn tree. Never see those apples in our store these days.
Victor Matheson
@sheila in nc: Yeah, never cook with Honeycrisp. The cooking ruins the crispness and the year cost twice as much. If you are going to cook the apples down into crisp or pie with spices and sugar, I say use anything you can get cheap in bulk. IT’s eating raw where the perfect Honeycrisp has no match.
The Moar You Know
Jif? The cheap dog food of nut butters? Damn. You people need to learn what decent food is.
ruemara
I can’t believe we all have so much to say about apples.
Keith P
Last year I did an experiment to see how many different organic apple varieties HEB Central Market had. it took me 20 minutes to grab a sample of every type, but I ended up with 23 bags of apples and, yes, the honey crisps were the best.
Ps I’m f****** tired of hearing about how the people I’m buying food from don’t like how or what it is.
JanieM
Drive-by offering for people interested in apples — articles about John Bunker, who grows heirloom varieties of apples in Maine. I’ve gone to his talks a couple of times. Great stuff.
https://bangordailynews.com/2017/09/09/homestead/maine-man-working-to-save-the-states-apple-heritage/
http://www.mofga.org/Publications/The-Maine-Organic-Farmer-Gardener/Fall-1999/John-Bunker
There are even apple stories in Bunker’s eulogy for Russell Libby, former executive director of the Main Organic Farmers and Gardeners Association:
http://www.mofga.org/Publications/The-Maine-Organic-Farmer-Gardener/Spring-2013/John-Bunker
Victor Matheson
I am looking forward to the new cosmic crisp. Apparently they have planted millions of these on a wing and a prayer that they will be the next Honeycrisp. Should be online in a few years.
Yutsano
@ruemara: I’m doing a store run tonight after work too. And they had some really interesting varieties when I was in there last. There go all the munnies…
Raven
@opiejeanne: I went to Huntington Beach a couple of years back, I was chatting with one of the rental shop owners and I told him I used to come there when I was a kid. He said “it was all butterbeans back then”!
Irony Abounds
Great, now the purity police will be after anyone wanting honeycrisp apples. I’m sure Josh Barro will be on this in a nano second as another reason why Democrats always lose.
Heidi Mom
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: Glad to meet another fan of Stayman-Winesaps. I think they’re a hybrid of the two varieties. They’re my favorite, along with Nittanys — both tart and crisp. This fall I’ve also tried and liked Crimson Crisps and a variety I’ve never seen or heard of before, Gold Rush. At the fruit stand we frequent about 12 miles south of Carlisle, in Adams County — part of the “Historic South Mountain Fruit Belt” (if you’ve seen the movie Gettysburg, you’ve seen this beautiful landscape) — Stayman-Winesaps are listed as an October apple, and they were there about 2 weeks ago.
Curtis Adams
I love almost all the newer apple varieties – Fuji, Gala, Opal, Pink Lady – they are all so superior to the Gold Delicious of my childhood, never mind the borderline inedible Red “Delicious”. I don’t have one favorite and buy different ones all the time because I like variety. I rarely buy Honeycrisp because I don’t find them particularly superior to the other modern apples and they cost more. We are living in a golden age for desert apples and I’m grateful for it.
m31
Roxbury Russet, for me. Kind of a unique ‘foxy’ taste and weird green skin with brown ‘russetting’ rusty spots. So good.
I have a scour the farmer’s markets for them though, they are hard to find.
One of my neighbors’ brother used to come sit on her porch and sell honeycrisps from his backyard trees, but he hasn’t been around this year, which is a bummer, they were seriously good.
Kristine
I always hunt for MacIntosh. My Mom always used them for baking. Yeah, they fall apart, but they’re nice and tart. I’m not a fan of overly sweet apples.
NotMax
For baked apples, Rome. For other cooking/baking needs, Granny Smith. Mostly harbor a velleity for any other type; think the last time I bought an apple to eat uncooked, the Beatles were still together.
Keith P
@Victor Matheson: That I think is the real importance of the honey cris. It is an absolutely amazingly delicious apple but it is also changing the demand towards really good-tasting apples rather than good looking or long lasting ones. I think there are several years of bad ass apples on the horizon
opiejeanne
@TenguPhule: When we bought this place there were no fruit trees other than a gigantic elderly cherry that produces undersized cherries because it’s old and the bees are never around when it’s in bloom; there was no garden other than a narrow strip next to the house. There wasn’t even a rhododendron, which is extremely odd in this area. It’s just under an acre of land, but a sizable area at the north can’t be used because it is our septic system, located in a large mound. The vegetable garden is located in a flat area to the south of it, and so are the apples and the younger cherries and pears. The cherries are starting to shade the veggie garden quite a bit. The apples are being crowded by a pretty tree we grew from the seed of an Opal apple, but it produces inedible fruit the size of a small cherry. It has to go but I’ve been saying that for 5 years now and it’s gotten really big. I think it’s shading some of the other apple trees and causing problems.
We’ve been working on this place for 8 years and we’ve had some successes and some huge disappointments. Climate change has been playing hob with our garden and the past 3 years the trees at the perimeter of the property have started dying for no apparent reason. These are big, mature pine trees and they are effing expensive to have removed. I noticed today that we are losing two more.
jl
Cole doesn’t understand that farm people gripe about everything related to the crops they grow?
My first thought reading the link is that it’s a press release by nurseries who are trying to push sales of Honeycrisps. And since when did the breeder not think, or at least say, that a profitable variety they came up was the greatest invention since food, shelter, sex, fire, clothing and the wheel all wrapped up into one?
I don’t think what the articles says about the quality of apples is true, either, unless you are talking about the slim selection you get in supermarkets.
And, I think I have now proven my first point, which is that farm people gripe about everything. And I haven’t lived on one for years and years. But the griping sticks.
Litlebritdifrnt
Bramleys for pies, crumbles, etc. There is nothing better than Bramleys.
different-church-lady
Meh — Macs for eating. If I want crunch over everything else I’ll eat a cracker.
ruemara
What’s funny is, I’m a sucker for trying new apples. After a year on HCG, I became an apple coin-er-sure. When that’s your primary dessert, you get both picky and desperate.
Interrobang
I love Honeycrisp apples. The growers also think we’re assholes because Honeycrisps are patented.
If you get a Red Delicious apple off an old tree, slightly underripe, it’s actually delicious. Not otherwise. And growers really have to stop hybridizing with Golden Delicious, which is bar none the worst apple cultivar in existence. I literally won’t eat cultivars I know are Golden Delicious outcrosses, because you don’t improve an apple by adding dogshit to it.
I really like Northern Spys, Spartans, and Empire apples, but they’re not necessarily easy to find, and I no longer live near anywhere with a lot of apple orchards. The most uncommon apple cultivar I ever had was an Anna, which is a native Israeli cultivar, but not overly good. Then again, Israel doesn’t really have the climate for apples.
Curtis Adams
@opiejeanne:
I’ve heard that, but how do you breed an apple variety? Each one is all clones – when you breed from seed, even from two sweet apples, they almost always revert to the ancestral condition, which is sour and bitter to the point of being nearly inedible. Breeders breed trees by the thousands and pull out the “sports” that aren’t sour or bitter, but when you do that other genes get jumbled around and it’s a new variety.
I suspect what really happened was that when it came out, the Red Delicious compared well to other available fruits. As they have improved, Red Delicious has become less delicious, by comparison.
Raven
While the years they come and go
Now, your love must surely show me
That beyond all time and space
We’re together face to face, my Apple Scruffs
Apple Scruffs, Apple Scruffs
How I love you, how I love you
West of the Rockies
@A Ghost To Most:
I worked in an apple orchard in the now-gone Paradise, CA when I was a kid. They made juice and apple sauce, too, in smaller batches.
It is surreal to know it is all gone now.
jl
So, X is too expensive to grow, or, too cheap and too many getting in and the market’s wrecked.
The price is too low, or it’s too high and too many will come in wreck the market.
X takes too much work work and fuss, or it just grows itself, but nothing you can do to change what the weather or bugs do to it.
Too much soil prep, you have to pre-irrigate for the damned stuff at the end of winter. Too perishable, or too shippable and low quality junk coming in from all over. Growers association on everyone’s ass and wrecking the market, or too free market and the market is wrecking the market.
They ain’t marketing it right. Need more market penetration.
The packers, the supermarket chains, the gummint inspectors game you on the quality inspection and you always get cheated on this crop. Shippers wreck it.
Always something to gripe about with crop X.
Raven
@West of the Rockies: My friend lost his house of 42 years.
Sandia Blanca
@opiejeanne: So happy to hear that someone else knows about Oak Glen! We used to drive up their every Fall to get a box each of Red Romes and Granny Smiths. My Mom would make pies and applesauce and apple crisp for months.
opiejeanne
@stinger: You’ll like the Melrose, if your climate supports it.
That is a very impressive collection of varieties.
Mary G
O/T, but scary:
Hope Adam has something on this.
Peter
That honeycrisp is the first crisp apple is a ridiculous claim. Macoun, Northern soy, Boskoop, etc–these are all crisp and better than honey crisp. They are all old breeds, and certainly don’t take ridiculous amounts of pesticide.
opiejeanne
@Sandia Blanca: We got a 10# bag of Jonagolds one time up there that had three apples in it, the largest one weighed just shy of 5 pounds. They were cheap because no one wanted such huge apples.
Mike Adamson
Apple nerd
MaryLou
My neighbor across the street turned me on Gravensteins, used to be on every acre in Sebastopol, now replaced
by grapevines, but they are available briefly in some farmers markets in SF and make a delicious pie!
Raven
At one time, an encyclopedia company gave away free parcels of land (with the purchase of a whole set for $126) in the Huntington Beach area.[20] The lucky buyers got more than they had bargained for when oil was discovered in the area, and enormous development of the oil reserves followed. Though many of the old reserves are depleted, and the price of land for housing has pushed many of the rigs off the landscape, oil pumps can still be found to dot the city.
Huntington Beach was primarily agricultural in its early years with crops such as lima beans, asparagus, peppers, celery and sugar beets. Holly Sugar was a major employer with a large processing plant in the city that was later converted to an oil refinery.
raptusregaliter
Honeycrisps are usually too tough for my aging teeth. Once I found the Pink Lady I never looked back. Just the right balance of sweet and tart.
Raven
@MaryLou: Lead singer of Electric Flag?
p.a.
Honeycrisp +++. I’m 59+, I swear I remember red delicious as being OK. Now they don’t deserve to be used as target practice. Have my standards gone up so much, or were they once ok?
Roger Moore
@Sandia Blanca:
My former boss lives in Yucaipa and likes to take people up to Apple Annie’s in Oak Glen when they come to visit. I was very surprised to see some of the varieties they’re growing there. I was especially gratified to see them growing gravensteins, which I know are a rare breed outside the Sebastopol area.
Raven
@p.a.: I’m 69 and i used to eat APPLES!!!
ruemara
@p.a.: You matured in tastes and they shrank in quality
Schlemazel
So many great apple choices. It is funny though with all the new varieties I never see winesap or cortland anymore.
But I really do try to stay with local in season because almost anything else is a disapointment
opiejeanne
@Ked: Washington apple growers started cutting down their Red Delicious orchards more than 20 years ago because the current variety had become inedible.
When I first encountered a red delicious I was about 7, so that would be about 1957. A neighbor had a box of them in her service porch and when I was playing with her granddaughter, the kid went and got us each an apple. Now, I was a child who was not that impressed with a piece of fruit most of the time, but when I tasted that apple it was a revelation. It was crisp and juicy and had a dry sweetness that was distinctive, but it was not sugary. It was not the inedible mahogany red things you get in the stores now, it was striped red and light green, the skin was crisp but not tough nor bitter. I don’t know what apples we had been eating up until then, probably fruit shipped into SoCal from someplace in the east (go figure).
opiejeanne
@ruemara: My kids will eat Granny Smiths out of hand, but I believe they are only good for baking.
The apples, not the kids.
jl
@p.a.: So much can happen to quality depending on grower, shipping, and handling, whether the market you shop at cares or not, making money off it or not and the hows and whys of what they think the customers care about, it’s hard to say. Depends on where you buy them and what are the industry trends and economics of product marketing.
Corner Stone
@p.a.:
That’s funny to me because 30 or so years ago I took a bag of red delicious with me on a pre-hunting trip as my healthy snack(s). I choked down a few but ended up using them as actual target practice. It was more enjoyable watching them explode than it was to try and eat them.
The raccoons…that is another story.
Corner Stone
@opiejeanne:
Sure, sure. You’ve given the game away now, Grandma Gretel!
MazeDancer
I live in NY.
Have never seen or heard of a Ruby Frost apple. Wish I had.
But not available in this area.
Schlemazel
@Mary G:
At one level you really have to admire the work Putin is doing. He reminds me of the bug in “MIB”
stinger
@Victor Matheson: LOL. It’s because the Honeycrisp is a recent variety and I’m focusing on heirlooms. I doubt if I’d ever plant it, but I’ll give it a go in the grocery store!
JCJ
@schrodingers_cat: I’m thinking more like a durian. Big, spiky, and smells bad.
debbie
Summer weather was not kind to the Ohio apple crop this year. However, I suffered through a shortened Melrose season (the tastiest apple in the universe) while wishing I could get Empires out here in flyover land.
NotMax
@MazeDancer
Ruby Frost would be a good stage name for a stripper.
ruemara
@opiejeanne: Kids are also good roasted.
Walker
@MazeDancer:
Where are you in NY? Cornell orchards is selling them right now.
opiejeanne
@Raven: I remember going to HB when I was a kid and there was no freeway. We used to drive from the San Gabriel Valley down through Turnbull Canyon, past the dry hills that seemed to burn every couple of years. There was an alligator farm on that road, a wooden painted sign by the road at an old house with peeling white paint.
There were still orange groves and strawberry fields everywhere down near the beach, and at least one house had an oil derrick in the yard.
We spent the night there in a friend’s beach house once and they warned us that the water was terrible, and they were right. Ack!
opiejeanne
@Raven: Irvine was all asparagus farms until sometime in the 80s.
Raven
@ruemara: I like children, as long a they are well cooked!
Sab
@Litlebritdifrnt: Aren’t orange pippins a British apple. I remember them from 1975 or 1976. Tiny, crisp and a bit tart. So small that you couldn’t sell them in US, but probably great to cook.
Barbara
@zhena gogolia: Cortland, Macoun and Nittany apples are my favorites. I also like Arkansas Blacks but they are hard to find. I talked to one of the farmers in our market who used to have them and he told me that they fruit so late in the season that it is hard to justify continuing to cultivate them. A local organic store gets them from California. Really, however, I will eat almost any apple.
Brachiator
One Bad apple don’t spoil
The whole bunch, girl
I don’t care what they say
I don’t care what you heard
I could make you happy, baby
And satisfy you, too
—The Osmonds
Barbara
@stinger: One of the vendors had Spitzenburg last year but did not return to the market this year. They also had a kind of Pippin heirloom.
TenguPhule
@Curtis Adams:
Uh no. There have been news articles about how the “Red Delicious” is a good looking crappy tasting apple which was bred for shipping, not eating.
It tastes terrible. Dry, mushy/woody (sometimes at the same time!) and very little sweetness to the point that its not a fruit so much as a punishment for required daily fiber.
Barbara
@Keith P: Elstar, GingerGold, Cameo and Pink Lady are newer varietals in the same vein.
stinger
@Litlebritdifrnt: I’ve read that Bramley is the preferred cooking apple in Britain. I’d like to plant one here in the US midwest and see how they do!
schrodingers_cat
@JCJ: I haven’t met JGC, but the dude gets pedicures. I don’t think he would smell bad.
The Gray Adder
My cow-orkers were so jealous the day I brought a real New York State apple to work. In Texas. There really isn’t anything like it, and it ruins you for those sad, crummy store apples you usually get to eat.
geg6
@SiubhanDuinne:
I love The History of the World in Six Glasses! Great book with a very different angle than most histories.
Suzanne
A big Honeycrisp with some good-quality peanut butter is about one of the best meals I have ever had ever. So goddamn delicious.
Raven
@opiejeanne: Yep, we lived in Whittier then! This is probably 65.
Barbara
@stinger: York apples are good cooking apples, but I tend to mix apples in pies so that I get a combination of textures. Some make sauce while others retain their crispness.
stinger
@opiejeanne: The Melrose is the “state apple” of Ohio, which is not where I live and I’ve never tasted it. My sister has eaten them, though, and says it’s her favorite apple. So I’m planting it, and even if I don’t love them, I know someone who will!
There’s a local orchard that carries some heirlooms as well as the modern raves, which is where I tasted some varieties that I’ve now planted. Others I just read about in nursery catalogues/on websites, and fall for the descriptions!
zhena gogolia
@NotMax:
I was watching Trottie True on YouTube yesterday because it’s one of the few films starring James Donald, and he was lunching in a restaurant with a showgirl named Ruby Rubato. I thought that was pretty good.
TenguPhule
@p.a.:
Nostalgia filters aren’t that good.
Barbara
@The Gray Adder: My daughter worked for an apple vendor in a farmer’s market around Albany. Those apples were the highlight of the fall and I am sad that she has moved on. Not really, but I loved being there during peak autumn.
SiubhanDuinne
@geg6:
Yeah! I’ve just started reading his Edible History of Humanity, but so far it is equally engaging.
opiejeanne
@Curtis Adams: Red Delicious apples do not look like they did in 1957. The original red delicious has been around for more than 100 years. A different but related variety replaced the original red delicious that we used to get, bred for looks, bred for that pretty red skin. New varieties of anything are bred the same way, crossing the old variety with something else, planting thousands of seeds and growing them just long enough to find the “improved” variety. They do not revert. I’ve been involved with rose breeders for many years and apples are similar to roses in this respect. I know about sports. Sports that are marketed, such as Climbing Peace and Chicago Peace, do not revert to the original. The “improved” red delicious that were hybridized and marketed that way do not revert to the original. The original never had skin that color.
We are now starting to see red delicious that look like the original fruit. They smell and look very different from those red things, and they are advertised as the older variety. I don’t buy them because even if they are as good as that first one I had as a child, there are better apples available now,
stinger
@opiejeanne:
There’s only one way to be sure!
zhena gogolia
@Avalune:
Wow. All good thoughts to you and Leto.
Roger Moore
@opiejeanne:
There’s still a tiny working orange orchard in Sierra Madre. They’re mostly a jam making business, but they still grow some Seville oranges there for their marmalade.
NCSteve
@West of the Rockies: All rumors of impending indictments come solely from the potential indictees or their lawyers trying to shape a narrative or fish for pardons because Mueller doesn’t leak.
opiejeanne
@Mary G: OMG! That is terrifying.
TenguPhule
@JCJ:
Cole can’t help the ball sweat as he lives in WV.
ruemara
I had no idea so many of my friends have a strong anti-red delicious apple opinion.
Suzanne
And as for peanut butters, I am a fan of Once Again American Classic on my Honeycrisp.
Now I am drooling.
Gin & Tonic
@Mary G: While the current PiS government is authoritarian and nationalist, and there were probably some pretty extreme elements among the marchers, taking that pic and saying it was 200,000 fascists and Nazis is a total exaggeration.
stinger
@Barbara: A lot of varieties are biennial, and Spitz is one of them, so maybe this year’s crop was too small to bother taking to market. Hopefully they’ll be back next year for you!
NeenerNeener
Empires and Cortlands for pies because they can handle an hour or more in the oven. McIntosh for apple crisp, which only bakes for 30 minutes. Also McIntosh for general eating, and in cider. The Golden and Red Delicious apples are an abomination and we will speak no more of them. I try new varieties sometimes, but I always go back to the old favorites.
opiejeanne
@MaryLou: The nice green pippins with the russeted tops have all but disappeared from the markets here. I used to buy them for pies, even though they were a little smaller than Granny Smith and you had to peel one more apple to get enough slices because I didn’t want them to disappear from the market. I’ve never seen them here in Western Washington, but we are down to one market now, owned by Albertsons because someone greedy in the Haggens company wanted a big payout but miscalculated wildly. I suppose they ended up with a big chunk of money anyway, and we lost the only competition in town as a result. The people who live here are trying to keep it from turning into a 14 choices of green things, two types of onions, three apples, what’s a shallot? what’s creme fraiche? etc. type of store.
stinger
@Barbara: I do that too! More richness of flavor, as well.
opiejeanne
@p.a.: They were once ok.
JCJ
@schrodingers_cat: Your point about the pedicures definitely goes against him smelling like a durian. No one would go near his feet if he smelled like that.
jl
@opiejeanne: yes. I love pippins. What happened to them? I gotta go look for them at farmers markets now. I don’t live in a big apple growing area, so I get no gossip from people in my ancestral stomping grounds. Used to be some Fuji’s around, but not enough profit in them grown around here so they got torn out. Where I come from in Central Valley, we can grow very good apples of some varieties. But the heat the sun don’t make for marketable cosmetics.
schrodingers_cat
Apples are okay. My favorite fruit is mango. Best mango is Hapoos, nothing else comes close. The best mangoes easily available here are the smaller champagne mangoes
opiejeanne
@Roger Moore: They had black Arkansas last time I was at the big touristy place; I think that was Los Rios. There were samples of many of the apples on little plates all over the place, but I think a lot of the apples were from Washington.
Now a lot of the lower orchards are gone for housing.
Sandia Blanca
@opiejeanne: Wow! One of those in a lunchbox would crowd everything else out.
@Roger Moore: We used to stop at one place for cider, and sometimes ate at the restaurant that had the following motto on their placemats: “Apple pie without some cheese, is like a kiss without the squeeze!” However, we never put cheese on our pie. We bought our apples from a couple of different stands, the names of which I no longer remember (it’s been nearly 50 years since I was there).
jl
In central San Joaquin Valley and further south, you need to keep the fruit more shaded to keep it from getting sunburned. So, with Fujis for example, even though the taste, moisture, and texture are all you could want, the fruit isn’t considered the ‘correct’ color. Not enough red in it because you need to keep the pruning light to keep the fruit in the shade. For green apples, they are too dark a green.
So, you have to take discount to sell them.
James Kakalios
By the way – forgot to mention, the University of Minnesota (where the Honeycrisp was developed) has a new apple that getting a lot of love. It’s called First Kiss and is supposed to be superior to the Honeycrisp. I haven’t had a chance to try one yet, but you may be arguing over this one in a few years time.
TenguPhule
@ruemara:
I had to eat those things for 6 years from intermediate to high school. It took a long time to eat fresh apples after that experience.
Lee
I’m sad to hear winesaps are gone. We had those down here in Texas for a few years and Ioved then.
opiejeanne
@Raven: I think you’re right, based on the two cars I think I recognize. It looked like that for a long time after, too. That looks like the state beach, based on the parking arrangement. We used to park beside the chain link fence on the side of the road to avoid paying 50 cents for parking, and walk to one of the gates. We usually ended up somewhere south of the big plant creating a lot of steam on the other side of the road.
TenguPhule
@schrodingers_cat:
Those are a real hit or miss fruit. Worst of all (or so I’m told) is that some of the best looking fruit turn out to be the most watery. Its all dependent on the individual tree and growing conditions.
Sandia Blanca
@Raven: We probably crossed paths in Whittier! I was born there, and had lots of family there until the ’90s. And that beach scene looks very familiar. We used to go to Huntington and Balboa the most.
West of the Rockies
@Raven:
Sorry to hear that, Raven. My sister and niece lost their homes, too. I wonder how many will rebuild and how many will just say F it, and move on.
Roger Moore
@schrodingers_cat:
I was very surprised to see mangoes at my local farmer’s market. I didn’t realize they would grow in California, but I guess they do if you know where to grow them.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@opiejeanne: All I remember about Irvine was Lion Country Safari. Of course, more recently the kid lived there and her sister still does.
opiejeanne
@Roger Moore: I remember when West Covina was new, and I remember the orange groves in the Covina area when I was very little.
I lived in Riverside for 23 years, starting in 1970, and watched the orchards disappearing from town. I think it was in the 80s that they passed the minimum 5 acre hill lots zoning law and started giving orchards a break on their property taxes so they didn’t have that as pressure to sell to developers. That helped, but most of the orchards still went away.
Some developers saved some of the trees, which was nice of them, except they were in blocks at the edges of the tracts and they didn’t set up a system to maintain and water them, and they looked like crap within about 5 years.
cleek
Macintosh are my favs.
but i can only get good Macs in NC for about three weeks every year. and this is the third week.
when i lived in NY, we’d go apple picking and get them by the bushel.
alas.
Keith P.
We’re in a Golden Age of peanut butter too. I can walk into my grocery store pick a grinder and get fresh ground nut butter of about 5 different varieties. Glorious!
debbie
Ginger Gold are pretty good apples too. They are early summer apples around here.
NotMax
One of the few things I miss about living in the NYC area is traveling not too far upstate each autumn to get Concord grapes from the farmers’ markets or roadside stands
Tangentially apple related nostalgia for those who traveled to or through the Catskills.. Everyone stopped there to stretch the legs and grab a nosh.
TenguPhule
@Roger Moore:
They’ll grow anywhere hot enough that has sufficient water provided. Whether or not the fruit is actually edible is a whole different story, of course.
Barbara
@Ceci n est pas mon nym: Stayman and Winesap are different. Stayman is more common, but you can still find Winesap. A lot of Pennsylvania and Virginia growers have both of them out now where I shop at the farmer’s market.
Schlemazel
@opiejeanne:
I visited my Great aunt in San Mateo about 1957. They lived in the middle of an apricot orchard & across the road was an almond orchard. Today I believe you could walk across the entirety of San Mateo going from rooftop to rooftop & never touch the ground
ruemara
@schrodingers_cat: MANGOES! Although, star apples.
opiejeanne
@Sandia Blanca: We have three kids, so we sliced those big things in half, stored them all in the fridge, and sliced them up for us and the kids. When I used to go to the grocery store when the youngest was 4 and the oldest was 17, it looked like I was buying for the monkey house at the zoo I had so much fruit in the basket on every trip. The youngest, a tiny girl, could eat as much as the oldest, a growing teenage boy. It was amazing.
Honus
I like a nice Black Twig apple to eat. If I’m making a pie, I’ll use them and some albemarle pippins.
You can eat the pippins too. And if you’re a little farther south you can substitute Black Arkansas for the black twigs.
zhena gogolia
Wow, you guys are still talking about apples.
Roger Moore
@opiejeanne:
They’re still growing at least some citrus in Riverside. The farmer I buy from at the farmers’ market is located there. It’s a relatively small farm- I think they’re only about 10 acres- but they have a wider variety than I’ve ever seen in the supermarket.
Mary G
Chuck Wendig is just finishing up a Twitter thread of heirloom apples he started at the end of August:
?BillinGlendaleCA
@zhena gogolia: How about them apples.
opiejeanne
@Roger Moore: There was a house in Anaheim on La Palma with a couple of big mango trees in the front yard. It took us a long time to figure out what they were until the fruit got big enough. I had my husband pull over just so we could gawk at them.
Schlemazel
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
See, that right there is why we need upvotes on comments!
BlueNC
What a great apple shopping list!
+1 for Arkansas Black, which are hard to find and have a short season.
and I’ll throw in Limbertwigs, which appears to be an heirloom variety from the NC mountains. Yum.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Schlemazel: …and nested comments.
NotMax
@BlueNC
Of course, Rs would call them Arkansas Blahs.
;)
raven
@opiejeanne: We used to drag big burlap bags up and down the beach and collect coke bottles for the deposit!
NotMax
@raven
Collecting bottles for deposit was one way to get my comic book and Walnetto fixes during kid days. Pulling a Radio Flyer wagon while making the rounds of likely spots was a necessity.
TenguPhule
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Hey now, let’s not get carried away here.
TenguPhule
Has anyone else ever tried baked apples, onions & carrots together?
It tastes surprisingly good.
Yutsano
@zhena gogolia: I guess there are worse subjects to attempt to TBogg with.
Schlemazel
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Yeah, I actually like not having to scroll back 50-60 comments but that is also a losing battle so I’ll live with it. But the upvote thing could be different. Whatever the old gawker media is now (Splinter, TheRoot, Gizmodo) has a star by each comment. So instead of saying “Me Too!” or the like you just star them & move on
NotMax
@TenguPhule
Surrounding a pork loin, very tasty.
opiejeanne
@Roger Moore: They’re most likely just outside the city limits. Riverside county to the southeast toward March AFB and Lake Matthews. There was a huge orchard owned by the Mormon church out to there but they sold it after a disastrous cold snap. We could see how the cold air had moved almost like water, settling at the bottoms of lower places and killing the trees there.
TenguPhule
@NotMax:
Actually there’s a dessert in the LHOTP cookbook for apples and onions. I added some baked carrots to it and made a fairly healthy tasty treat out of it.
And then my dad threw it out of the fridge when I wasn’t looking because the apples were all brown.
trollhattan
@NotMax:
Let’s take that for a spin.
“She’s hot. She’s red, She’s red-hot. Give it up for Ruby Frost!”
Yup, works. Do not give Donny Ruby’s number.
Schlemazel
@raven:
City kid. We used to troll the allies for bottles. Sometimes it would take all afternoon but we always came up with a few to exchange for penny candy. I feel bad for kids today, not running feral all summer long, scrounging up 5-10 cents to buy candy.
opiejeanne
@NotMax: We walked down the railroad tracks at the far back of our property on Sunday afternoons, collecting bottles to pay for penny candy at the liquor store next to the In’n’Out on Francisquito in Baldwin Park, CA.
Funny, I never ate at an In’n’Out until I was well into my 30s.
TenguPhule
@Schlemazel:
No wonder France and Britain are so upset.
opiejeanne
@Schlemazel: We ran feral in our neighborhood but never on the train tracks. Mom always came with us because there were tramps and hoboes that showed up sometimes out back. One of them ate my grandpa’s banty rooster. We found his feathers and bones after hunting for him when he didn’t come to the coop at sundown a couple of nights in a row.
ruemara
@TenguPhule: I used to craft an emergency breakfast of onions & apples fried in butter. That’s when I was hunger insecurity poor. That over some homemade bread could give you a good feeling of being full for quite a while & it was tasty.
NotMax
@opiejeanne
Dredged up memory: Puttin’ pennies on the train tracks.
TenguPhule
@ruemara: That still sounds delicious.
Barbara
@Mary G: Go here to see a Canadian orchard that has 365 varieties of apples most of which it has for sale: https://www.saltspringapplecompany.com/orchard/
Avalune
@TenguPhule: I love apples or pears baked with red onions for chicken or pork. Mmmm I could see where carrots would be good in there too.
Sloegin
Old timer pile on from an Eastern Washington native – the Red Delicious from 40 years ago was a very different thing from the mealy flavorless mush of today. Hard as a rock, you bit into it and you weren’t sure if you were going to wiggle a tooth lose, a big chunk of the apple would snap away with your bite. Nothing really comparable to it. I can’t eat anything but fresh Granny Smiths these days, I’m *still* mad about what the state apple growers did all these years later.
JR
Honeycrisp grows better in colder northern climates and in fact was developed in Minnesota. It also stores well (in deep storage at least). The big drawback is that it is an early season, lower yield apple.
Also, there have been lots of sweet-tart desirable apples bred before, particularly in Europe. Cox Orange Pippin is an early variety and there are descendants that are somewhat newer (but older than Honeycrisp) like Rubinette. The real problem with apples grown in the US is that we became infatuated with the pretty but absolutely awful disgusting Red Delicious apple. And mediocre high yield varieties like McIntosh. Russetted apples have never caught on here even though many are very tasty.
J R in WV
@opiejeanne:
I think your pine trees are dying from insect infestations that used to be controlled by harsh cold temps in the winter, which don’t happen much anymore.
I like Honeycrisp apples because they are tart, juicy, not mealy. Recently we have had a new variety called Swet Tango which is also tart and good, interesting to us as there is a tiny nearly extinct town near us called Tango, and a road called Tango Road.
For cooking, my grandma had the best very early apples, Yellow Transparents, which I never see at the stores. Not so great for hand eating, but for apple sauce and pies, WOW! She had an orchard with a couple of dozen trees, a grape arbor, etc.
Got to NYC, late, luggage didn’t make my plane even though we were an hour late taking off from Charlotte. Otherwise a nice flight, I got a window exit row seat, no one next to me.
Friends were supposed to get in just after I did… nope, they were even later than I was, not here yet. Hoping they get here soon to go for dinner. Or else we could order in… quite a list of nearby restaurants that deliver.
The airport in NYC is a wreck, worse than Penn Station, which is also a mess.
NotMax
@Avalune
Substituting prunes for the apples when doing pork is also quite, quite nice. With chicken, not so much, but green grapes play well with chicken. Apricots also work for either.
raven
@ruemara: We’d go horseback riding at stables in the riverbed and they would just put us kids on the horses and let us rip.
TenguPhule
@JR:
What is this “we” thing?
NotMax
@J R in WV
Must be LGA?
NYC tip if you’re going to any B’way/off B’way shows – If you buy tickets at the half price booth in Times Square, you can avoid the line for another show on another day by holding on to the stubs and presenting them to the guard next to window #1, so long as it is no longer than a week after the first ones were purchased.
The Penn Station project is rather a massive one, once over the improvement will be like night and day.
BTW, How to get to and from NYC airports without getting ripped off.
J R in WV
More apple lore: Johnny Appleseed, who planted apples all across the east, ie Ohio, Pa, Va, etc, back in colonial times, was planting sour and bitter apples that no one would ever eat.
They were specifically for cider, more specifically for hard cider to get drunk on over the winter. IIRC, of course.
WaterGirl
In all my years at BJ I don’t think I’ve ever seen a thread of 231 comments (and counting) that stayed so on topic.
NotMax
@J R in WV
In colonial times, every house, hut or hovel had barrels of cider at the ready, freely available to quench the thirst of any travelers or visitors. Preferred over well water (for obvious reasons).
NotMax
@WaterGirl
Yeah, usually staying primarily strictly on topic is (wait for it)
fruitless.
TenguPhule
@NotMax:
You’re a bad seed , Notmax. //
TenguPhule
@J R in WV:
Actually it was more about the fact that the locals needed something to kill the bacteria in the water they drank alongside it.
Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.
@schrodingers_cat: agreed. I adore Braeburns (perfect balance of sweet & tart, crisp as anything), but haven’t seen any in ages. Maybe the Honeycrisp drove them out of production? “Envy” apples are a new variety I really enjoy.
Dr. Ronnie James, D.O.
@stinger: hear, hear. The Red Delicious isn’t the problem, it’s what the industry does to it.
Gvg
And because of this thread I checked for honeycrisp at the chain grocery store tonight, and they were $1.69 a pound which I have never seen before, so of course, I bought some.
opiejeanne
@J R in WV: When we had the first two pine trees taken down there was no evidence of what went wrong. No insect damage, none of the blue streaking seen in bark beetle infestations, nothing. but the first two trees died following a three year drought and I think the current ones may be dying of the drought too.
The pretty birch trees out front are being killed by a beetle but we seem to have rescued the survivors by hiring a company to treat them. We’ll have them back again in February for a repeat because the results were very good this year. .
Bostonian
One year I found a peculiar apple at the supermarket. Lemonade apple. It was delicious. Kind of tasted like lemonade.
I look for them, but have never seen them again. If your market has them, I recommend it.
It might be harder to grow Honeycrisps, but I think we can thank the Honeycrisp for making apple producers look harder for varieties that actually taste good. It seems like there were a good couple decades there where, unless you went to an orchard, yellow and red “delicious” were your only choices.
Cheap Jim
I did not know that. And, since this is here, thanks for the heads-up about ginger golds; they are indeed tasty.
Ol'Froth
If you get back east, the Hopewell Furnace National Historic Site (Its off the PA Turnpike between Harrisburg and Philadelphia) maintains an heirloom apple orchard. Give them a few bucks, and you get to fill a bucket with old style apples not normally available. Its also a really well preserved example of an 18th-19th century iron furnace.