A Penetrating Glimpse Of The Obvious

Thirty six years ago, on September 12, 1982, a Lebanese Maronite militia invaded two refugee camps occupied by Palestinians.  As The New York Times remembered on the 30th anniversary of the disaster,

In the ensuing three-day rampage, the militia, linked to the Maronite Christian Phalange Party, raped, killed and dismembered at least 800 civilians, while Israeli flares illuminated the camps’ narrow and darkened alleyways. Nearly all of the dead were women, children and elderly men.

That reference to the flares points to the miserable truth behind the blood and broken bodies:  the people on the spot, those militiamen handled the killing.  They pulled the triggers, broke the women, shattered the bodies. They were guilty of those crimes; they did the worst that human beings can do.

But there were others who stood aside, hands nominally clean while the predictable result of their actions and their studied inactions played out in Sabra and Shatila.

After the fact, the Israeli government ordered an investigation into the massacres, and they got a real one.  It concluded that

Israeli leaders were “indirectly responsible” for the killings and that Ariel Sharon, then the defense minister and later prime minister, bore “personal responsibility” for failing to prevent them.

Sharon didn’t fire a single shot; no blood spattered the shoes of his colleagues, and the Israeli soldiers on the front lines in Lebanon did nothing more than stay out of the way.  But as the report concluded, those in charge in Israeli knew what would happen if the Maronite militias gained free rein in the camps, and they let events unfold anyway. They were guilty not of murder, but of enabling the killings, of giving permission for an atrocity.

Adam, below and elsewhere, has laid out a compelling case that Donald Trump is similarly guilty of complicity in the ongoing racist and anti-Semitic violence occurring now in America’s civic space.  When you tell armed and angry supporters that they have enemies, that those enemies are ruthless, relentless, and Jewish or Black or Brown, then for all that Trump himself never slams home a magazine, he’s the man giving those who do kill a target list and permission to go after it.

What I want to add to that is that this responsibility, this complicity in the slaughter of innocents lies with the entire public apparatus of the Republican Party.  They have had every opportunity to push back on Trump’s white supremacy, his barely-coded demonization of Jews, his overt and explicit racism.  Concerned Jeff Flake and sincere Susan Collins — and the more important figures, the Paul Ryans and the Mitch McConnells and the Mitt Romneys and the rest — all had opportunity after opportunity to say no.  Just no: that this isn’t what the Republican Party is about; that it’s dangerous and hateful and so on.

Instead we got the pieties, “incivility” policing and the rest.

And now we have a body count of at least ten in just the last two days, not even to mention the assassination campaign that fortunately did not succeed.  They were all victims of exactly the kind of hatred Trump explicitly fomented as recently as last night — after the two deaths in Louisville, KY.

Democrats’ condemnation is important, because the country has to hear that hate is vicious, deadly, and to be reviled.  But as a matter of effectiveness, the Republicans have a far greater duty here: they can hold Trump priorities hostage, and they give permission to the GOP “tribe” to recognize that there are, there need to be, lines beyond which our politics should not go.

That’s the duty the Republican party has entirely failed. It’s why the current GOP must go, root and branch.  And it is why each Republican in power — the elected officials and their staffs, the party apparatus, all of them — bear exactly the same kind of indirect responsibility carried by the Israeli commanders and politicians who presided over those massacre.  It didn’t take a genius to realize that a nightly incitement to violence would end in actual murder. As it has, repeatedly over the last two years, and ten more times in the last two days.

I got nothing more. The US government is in the hands of a cabal that is, so far, willing to trade street murder for tax cuts and Supreme Court seats.  That rule has to end.  Which we knew.  Hence the PGO.

Images: Nicholas Poussin, Massacre of the Innocents, before 1665.

Mattia Pretti, Pilate washing his hands, 1663.

173 replies
  1. 1
    Mike in DC says:

    The Faustian bargain between capitalist robber-barons and white nationalist extremists that is the modern GOP is protected by an ever-thinner veneer of “reasonable” Republican politicians and pundits who cosplay normalcy and decry incivility and depravity while doing absolutely nothing to stop it.

    Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.

  2. 2
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    The Republican party is now an active terrorist organization. It should be dealt with as one deals with Al Qaeda.

  3. 3
    Tom Levenson says:

    @Mike in DC:

    Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.

    I really, REALLY don’t. Both for the obvious reason: massacres are an objective, unequivocal evil. And for the almost as obvious reason: a shooting civil war is not how you want this to go.

  4. 4
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Mike in DC:

    Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.

    That happened last year basically. The GOP Congressional Baseball Practice shooting, remember? Didn’t change a thing and went down the memory hole.

    For these people to change, there would have to be some kind of invincible higher power threatening them with death. And that’s never happening

  5. 5
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Tom Levenson: But that is precisely where we are headed right now. The GOP is complicit in encouraging it.

  6. 6
    Tom Levenson says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: This is true in the sense that a one very small core of committed ideologues commit the violence, but they are nurtured and enabled and indoctrinated and sheltered by concentric circles of direct and indirect supporters. That larger penumbra surrounding a terrorist core has a pretty good Venn diagram overlap with the GOP.

    That’s IMHO, of course. Talk to Alan if you want an informed analysis.

  7. 7
    NotMax says:

    @Tom Levenson

    Yes and yes again. Ballots, not bullets.

  8. 8
    Mike in DC says:

    @Tom Levenson: Yeah, I had thought of that. Just saying it would be nice if assholes actually reaped what they sowed once in a blue moon. I am objectively anti-mass murder. But it’s frustrating to the extreme that the government isn’t much more gung-ho on cracking down on these violent extremists. Hell, even Twitter and Facebook suck at kicking these guys off their platforms.

  9. 9
    Citizen Alan says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    The Republican party is now an active terrorist organization. It should be dealt with as one deals with Al Qaeda.

    So you want us to bankrupt ourselves while effectively giving into all of their demands?

  10. 10
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @NotMax:
    For playing Devil’s advocate purposes, what if elections were irrevocably rigged, the courts stacked, and the GOP determined to oppress their opponents “legally”? What then?

  11. 11
    sdhays says:

    Can we please revoke Secret Service protection from Spankee and his people? Our Terrorist in Chief blames the victims at the Pittsburg synagogue for not having armed guards, so I’d like him to show the way by personally taking on the burden of protecting himself and the people he pretends to care about. If he wants us all to have our own private militias, let him be first to show the way.

    Fucking monster!

  12. 12
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Mike in DC:
    I agree. Mass murder is awful and karma isn’t real, unfortunately. I do think the (hopefully) new Dem House should launch investigations into the alt-right and other violent right-wing networks. They should press the FBI to crackdown on these terrorists as well. The curbstomp happy Proud Boys are also a group I’d like to see disbanded.

  13. 13
    debbie says:

    There was nothing “indirect” about Israel’s responsibility for this.

  14. 14
    Brachiator says:

    Trump never backs down, never apologizes, never admits to a lie. He will point fingers at his enemies and never accept responsibility for anything that goes wrong. This is who he is.

    As president, he can direct that aides lie for him, deny reality, declare uncomfortable facts to be fake news.

    Conservative pundits and every Republican politician will protect his back. They will lie for him and dissemble. They think that they are insulated from any negative consequence by the protection they receive from Fox News and the conservative media propaganda machine, by right wing money, by political gerrymandering and voter suppression tactics.

    We are two countries. Trump supporters will never abandon him, and they are now the core of the GOP. They fully endorse Trump’s politics of resentment and want desperately to see his dream fulfilled of a new Fortress America.

    Ideally, pundit shows would kick Trump enablers off their programs as soon as they uttered the first lie or tried to spin the facts or utter lame conservative talking points. If they want to retreat to Fox News, let them. There’s no real point in pretending that any of these people will do anything other than defend Trump policy.

    Fortunately, Trump, his enablers and defenders can be defeated. The November midterms are the first step.

  15. 15
    NotMax says:

    @Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)

    Anyone can what if. Some prefer what is.

  16. 16
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Tom Levenson: An informed analysis??? What the hell is that good for? I want fact free speculation and conspiracy theories!

  17. 17
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a tram. Stop it.

  18. 18
    satby says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: no one is in the mood for your bullshit little mind games today.
    Jeezus.

  19. 19
    JaySinWA says:

    Reiterating a story about a problematic candidate for WA Supreme court justice. An off the radar election with a qualified incumbent Steven Gonzalez facing Nathen Choi who appears to be singularly unqualified. https://www.kuow.org/stories/deep-state-or-deep-sixed-the-washington-supreme-court-race-that-s-getting-buried

  20. 20
    Mike in NC says:

    Whatever self-serving lies and other blather Trump had originally planned for tonight’s rally, I think he’s going to call himself ‘Defender of the (Holy) Second Amendment’ and accuse all Democrats of wanting to confiscate guns. After all, the NRA spent over $30 million to elect this amoral demagogue and they need to hear him continue to advocate for more guns, everywhere, all the time.

  21. 21
    CaseyL says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: The federal government did do a study on RW terrorism, which made clear it was a growing threat. The GOP forced them to bury to study and not act on it.

    It would be a good thing if we can get rid of these monsters using the normal electoral process. But I have a growing sense of dread that normal electoral processes aren’t – that our elections are compromised, particularly in the key swing states – and the morning after November 6th will be, not so much a wake-up call, but proof that we have fallen so far down that armed action is the only recourse.

  22. 22
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @NotMax:
    Fair enough. And I agree: ballots before bullets.

  23. 23
    Brachiator says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    For playing Devil’s advocate purposes, what if elections were irrevocably rigged…

    Leave this for your novel. It’s where this kind of speculative fiction belongs.

  24. 24
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @satby:
    See my comments at #12 and #21.

  25. 25
    Brachiator says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    An informed analysis??? What the hell is that good for? I want fact free speculation and conspiracy theories!

    Trump is getting some Twitter messages ready for you. Meanwhile, you might have to make do with a David Brooks column.

  26. 26
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Brachiator:
    Fair enough. I guess I was just curious of what people thought would need to be done since we appear to be heading towards that scenario. It’s pretty scary and I don’t want to see it happen.

  27. 27
  28. 28
    Brachiator says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    I do think the (hopefully) new Dem House should launch investigations into the alt-right and other violent right-wing networks.

    The Democrats can’t afford to get bogged down with investigations that go nowhere.

    They should press the FBI to crackdown on these terrorists as well. The curbstomp happy Proud Boys are also a group I’d like to see disbanded.

    The president and the Justice Department set FBI priorities. It will be interesting to see if the House can exert any influence on Trump if the Democrats take control.

  29. 29
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Stupid typing skills and stupid lack of ‘nym permanence, I am in moderation. Help!

  30. 30
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Brachiator: Oh NOOoooooooo, Not David Brooks!

  31. 31
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Brachiator: It will be interesting to see if the House can exert any influence on Trump if the Democrats take control.

    They can. The power of the purse is very strong. It will be interesting to see how they wield it and which battles they choose to fight.

  32. 32
    tobie says:

    I haven’t watched TV today, and I don’t think I’m inclined to, but has any major Democratic figure or elder statesman (Obama, Biden, Bill Clinton, Carter, Kerry, etc.) tried to call an impromptu press conference to make a statement regarding the bombings and shootings to say that our nation will not be broken by those who fan the flames of hate? It’s scary right now and we seem to have no one on the Democratic side at the (symbolic) helm. Mr. tobie tells me the cable networks are showing tRump’s brownshirt rally in Indiana.

  33. 33
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Brachiator:

    It will be interesting to see if the House can exert any influence on Trump if the Democrats take control.

    Since all revenue bills must originate in the House, I imagine the Dems can hold the budget hostage and even defund certain agencies to extract concessions, in addition to investigations into the Trump administration. I read that this was not new and pre-exists modern GOP obstruction. Obstruction was common in 19th century American politics; it’s how posse comitatus became law. It was a concession the Dems forced out of the Republican administration at the time.

    The Democrats can’t afford to get bogged down with investigations that go nowhere.

    Why do you assume they’ll go nowhere? Because they wouldn’t have the cooperation of federal law enforcement?

  34. 34
    Brachiator says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    Why do you assume they’ll go nowhere? Because they wouldn’t have the cooperation of federal law enforcement?

    That’s one of the many reasons.

    A number of people want to see House Democrats get even with the Republicans. This will only feed into public perception that both sides are the same and don’t do anything for the voters. This will hand Trump reelection on a silver platter.

  35. 35
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: First of all, work hard to do whatever we have to do to prevent such a scenario. I’m not saying there shouldn’t be a plan B somewhere. But it’s up to us to use the peaceful power that we have for as long as we have it-and in doing so, we can continue to have it. The #Resistance has lasted as long as it has because we have been peaceful and organized and civic.

    Armed revolt doesn’t work unless we turn the Army on our side, and that’s not happening anytime soon. Also if voting is seen as too hard, something like this would seen impossible in comparison. And peaceful actions keep out the psychopaths that are attracted to violence-like Stalin, for instance. Too many revolutions turn into repressive regimes that victimize free thinkers-think Iran, for instance.

  36. 36
    MagdaInBlack says:

    @Citizen Alan:
    Isn’t that pretty much whats already happened?

  37. 37
    Jay says:

    @tobie:

    “Elizabeth Warren
    @SenWarren
    My heart goes out to the families of those killed today in Pittsburgh, & to the brave officers who risked their lives to protect others. The attack on the Tree of Life Synagogue was a horrific act of evil. We must recognize this hatred for what it is, & come together to fight it.
    10:16 AM · Oct 27, 2018”

    The Media caters to ReThugs and Nazi’s.

  38. 38
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Brachiator:

    A number of people want to see House Democrats get even with the Republicans.

    But what if that’s part of the reason why they were voted into the majority in the first place? That would be their mandate. And anyway, who says we can’t walk and chew bubblegum at the same time? We can pass good progressive legislation (that won’t pass because Trump is a POS and the Senate is Rethug controlled) AND investigate these violent RW groups. Trump should be beaten over the head for his inaction (and frankly for his instigation of this shit) Anybody who tries that bothsides bullshit, just shout them down and point them to the MAGAbomber.

  39. 39
    Brachiator says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    The power of the purse is very strong. It will be interesting to see how they wield it and which battles they choose to fight.

    One of the things that Republicans fear most is that Trump might cooperate with Democrats because, more than anything else, he doesn’t want to look like a loser.

    I really want to see if the House can stick it to Trump.

    Of course, the Senate becomes even more important, and here things become very interesting if Trump tries to go mainly for a win over anything else.

  40. 40
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @CarolDuhart2:
    I honestly don’t disagree with any of that.

  41. 41
    catclub says:

    @Brachiator:

    The president and the Justice Department set FBI priorities.

    and it is scary immigrants all the time.

  42. 42
    JPL says:

    @tobie: You can’t let an act of evil prevent you from holding your hate fests. Trump will have another rally this evening.

  43. 43
    Jay says:

    @Brachiator:

    “A number of people want to see House Democrats get even with the Republicans. This will only feed into public perception that both sides are the same and don’t do anything for the voters. This will hand Trump reelection on a silver platter.”

    Unlike Emailz!!!!!!!!, Benghazi!!!!!!!!, The Clinton Foundation!!!!!!!!!! there is a there, there. Investigation’s into the Insane Clown POSus’s Administration and appointee’s will find crimes. Prosecutions can happen at the State level if Session’s survives and the DOJ remains corrupted.

    The Media can “bothsides” their precious little hearts out, but those American’s with half a brain will note that unlike “nothingburger” mock trials, these cases resulted in convictions for actual crimes.

    Those ‘Merkin’s with less than half a brain will wank off to “derp State” and MAGA, but guess what, they were going to do that anyway.

    At this point in time The Insane Clown POSus’s supporters are a “lost cause” and unredeemable as citizens.

  44. 44
    tobie says:

    @Jay: I’m glad Warren tweeted this but a tweet’s not enough right now. This is not her fault. The media are not interested in hearing from Democrats. If someone like Rev. Barber is able to get on one of the talk shows, he will address the issue with all the gravity and moral clarity it deserves.

  45. 45
    Brachiator says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    A number of people want to see House Democrats get even with the Republicans.

    But what if that’s part of the reason why they were voted into the majority in the first place?

    Congress’ approval rating is always low, and nose dives when the political parties indulge in endless in fighting.

    Political junkies dream of Beltway battles, but I have never seen that the average voter cares about this shit. To the contrary, they are repulsed by it.

    Assuming that the Democrats retake the House, it will be interesting to see what Pelosi does. I am counting on her to be smart and crafty.

  46. 46
    Matt McIrvin says:

    I’ve been told the synagogue shooter was anti-Trump, so Trump’s hands are clean.

    Yeah. The guy was anti-Trump because he thought Trump was too easy on immigrants and Jews; he posted on alt-right fora. This movement didn’t just happen at random.

  47. 47
    Mnemosyne says:

    @tobie:

    Both Obama and Hillary made public statements. The MSM doesn’t give a shit.

    The journalists who didn’t bother to cover Obama’s speeches while he was president sure aren’t going to jump to do it now that he’s out of office.

  48. 48
    boatboy_srq says:

    @Tom Levenson: The “shooting civil war” has already begun, and our side is woefully underarmed. The fact that it’s all small-skirmish-grade engagements does not diminish the fact that the Reichwing are acting on impulses to terrorize or exterminate all opposition. We should be thankful that they are such slackers at their own crusade, and that they are so inept in their efforts, that the death tolls are not significantly higher; but make no mistake: this is a collective effort and a broad theatre of combat, and GOTV alone will not stop them.

  49. 49
    Raoul says:

    @Brachiator: Going straight at DJT will just give him more oomph. To the extent that anyone in his admin is capable of shame (doubtful!), the key play IMO is to investigate the hell out of every cabinet level department. Uncover as much corruption as can be found. Push at every aspect of incompetence. The immigrant child separation stuff should be damn juicy. Lots of so-called moderates were pretty shocked by that sh*t, and when actually looked at with subpoena power, will probably look even more gruesome, terrible, and corruptly wasteful.
    Build a narrative that these contemptible fools are ruining everything (because they are).

    Other than that (no small task, of course!) the other target needs to be McConnell. He’s the enabler who is doing the most damage.

    My armchair play call, anyway.

  50. 50
    Brachiator says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Both Obama and Hillary made public statements. The MSM doesn’t give a shit.

    Social media cares.

    And going into the midterms, Democrats don’t have to depend upon the msm to get their message to voters and would be foolish to do so.

  51. 51
    Starfish says:

    @Mnemosyne: Chelsea Clinton was in town with her children’s book, and I think having some people follow Obama and the Clinton’s around watching them be normal human beings is my kind of escapism right now.

  52. 52
    clay says:

    So I’m watching the Georgia-Florida game (go Dawgs!) with the sound off. A commercial comes on that’s antu-Stacey Abrams.

    (That’s the only way to describe it: anti-Abrams. It isn’t PRO-anything. I don’t even think it mentioned her opponent’s name.)

    The ad shows a close up of her speaking with a transcript printed below. It intercuts it with the scare words “liberal” blah blah… the usual.

    Anyway it starts with her saying “There is a blue wave coming to Georgia… This wave consists of the documented and undocumented alike.”

    Well, wait a minute, I thought. Did Stacey Abrams really give a speech talking about how a bunch of illegal aliens are going to be voting in this election? Seems unlikely.

    So the next time the ad comes on, I turn the sound on and pay closer attention. There is a subtle but clear edit in the middle of the second sentence

    I know I shouldn’t be surprised, but the blatant dishonesty threw me. They really don’t have anything other than fear and lies, do they?

  53. 53
    efgoldman says:

    test

  54. 54
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Brachiator: I wouldn’t say the investigations would go nowhere. Not everyone wants to go down with the Trumptanic, and at least hearings would inform the public.

    Trump is L.Ron. Trump, the head of a cult. In recent years cults like Scientology. the Jehovah’s Witnesses and others have lost a lot of membership and power. What caused that loss? Information from heretics and whatnot. Information and support for defectors. A growing internal realization that all that craziness did not lead to a better world.

    Congressional hearings can become the equivalent of defector boards, a way to let people know there is a better and more grounded way to live in America, that people who doubt have a way out.

  55. 55
    Lyrebird says:

    @Mike in DC:

    Hell, even Twitter and Facebook suck at kicking these guys off their platforms.

    Yeah… So I’ve been awkwardly writing postcards to North Dakota voters, and even before the Kroger killings or the synagogue attack, I’ve just been wishing that at least, I don’t know, maybe the NYT, instead of blaming people for “inviting” bombs, they’d point out the awful NON equivalence between what I’m mailing, my cramped and rather dorky little “please vote” cards, and actual bombs? Actual bullets?

    How is any news organization reporting without critique these Republican smears of me as an angry mobster for having called my senators to opine that perjury should be disqualifying for a judge, when they – the Republicans – are out encouraging mobs?

  56. 56
    efgoldman says:

    have t0 shut down, I AM CONFGURED wrong

  57. 57
    satby says:

    @efgoldman: hello, good to see you! And farewell until next time!

  58. 58
    Brachiator says:

    @Raoul:
    I’ve pretty much spelled out why I think that an endless round of investigations might cost the Democrats the 2020 election. I’ve never said that the Dems should go directly at Trump.

    It will be interesting to see what Pelosi will do.

    It will also be interesting to see how potential presidential aspirants in Congress play this.

    I think that Trump and the Republicans can stumble and fuck things up. Democrats need to offer themselves as coming to the rescue.

    I also think that Democrats can help point out Trump corruption without wallowing in endless investigations.

  59. 59
    Ken Shabby says:

    Am reading all of you.
    I don’t have the knowledge of politics some of you have. I want to come back to that, but-

    Am also facing somewhat more fully, this: Another part of me has a big blank spot for What Next. It’s difficult for me to imagine, to fully begin going through all this because, it’s without precedent in my lifetime. I’m not naive at all. But it occurs that my thought process reaches a certain point and then – switches over to a) never happen here and b) there are more ‘good people’ – in and out of and running for office. I don’t lack for imagination, and ability to conjecture or speculate but this has me locked up, to an extent; subjective overtakes objective, if you like.

    Speculation about violence, about real civil …war or terrorism within our country is not something I visualize very well.

    Voting, I very much do. I put an enormous value on that and into very real abilities to slowly bring this around. Add to that a speculation that regardless how dangerous a lot of these people are or, have become is They Are Cowards. Not in the Mr Touchdown, take that hill and strike a pose in the sunrise but, instead, scurrying vermin in dark places who only come out in the light when there is safety in numbers of like kind. This somewhat goes right up to and includes most Senate GOP and many House GOP. The rest are somewhat verifiable tea party fanatics and other obsessive nutters and or molestors…

    So, it’s def above my pay grade. In event, Now is Voting. 2020 is manage toward each and every opportunity to regan what a mandate truly is. And keep it. But, I do issues, not politics. I’m not a pacifist ….but, discussions of violence, with any expectation of immediate or even longer term positive outcomes IS truly and terribly naive, at best and, off strategy, at worst. And, further, outside most of us in terms of anticipating, planning, executing (word choice!) and cleaning up after.

    Wanted to stop by and both ask and add this –

  60. 60
    Lyrebird says:

    And hey, I love this response... note that Maryknoll Sisters were murdered in El Salvador, they know some sh_t about why caravans of refugees might form:

    Maryknoll Missioners

    @MaryknollFrsBrs
    Follow Follow @MaryknollFrsBrs
    More
    Prediction: the first politician suggesting “thoughts & prayers” for the victims of the senseless shootings at #TreeOfLifeSynagogue will be drowned out by the sound of nationwide vomiting.

  61. 61
    trollhattan says:

    @efgoldman:
    We configured so? Do come back soon. There’s cookies!

  62. 62
    debbie says:

    @efgoldman:

    Aren’t we all?

  63. 63
    debbie says:

    @Brachiator:

    Obstruct, obstruct, obstruct!

  64. 64
    Ken Shabby says:

    Lincoln’s example is the best of its kind. That president did not run for office on a platform of violence. As President, he didn’t seek it out, either. He was both shrewdly lawyerly and within responsibility of office, seeking to reason our way out of a terrible contradiction and back into polity and comity (If I have those words correct. I mean Civil Democratic Republic and, as somewhat then an ongoing experiment).

    Anyone looking for surety or immediacy is looking in the wrong place, wrong way, wrong methods and …wrong outcome.

    One of the tragedies of the Civil War is we had to beat the hell out of the South and burn half of it to the ground. Another is the cynical failure of Reconstruction.

    When I’m in a …good mood, I somewhat …enjoy that the Confederacy got its whole ass beat like a rented mule. But, that’s for cheap seats, not grown ups.

    ok, I lied: I enjoy it a lot.

    But, still –

  65. 65
    Kay says:

    @Lyrebird:

    I don’t know, maybe the NYT, instead of blaming people for “inviting” bombs, they’d point out the awful NON equivalence between what I’m mailing, my cramped and rather dorky little “please vote” cards, and actual bombs? Actual bullets?

    It is a kind of balm, though, normal political things, isn’t it? We canvassed this morning- the last one, where we hand out the ballot cards, and I met this sweet 22 year old woman (the only D voter at an address where she appears to live with her parents) who has never been asked to vote before. I told her that’s an outrage and to consider herself invited :)

  66. 66
    Brachiator says:

    @CarolDuhart2:

    I wouldn’t say the investigations would go nowhere. Not everyone wants to go down with the Trumptanic, and at least hearings would inform the public.

    Which Democratic candidate has made “I promise to investigate Trump” a central part of their political campaign? Or any part?

    This is an honest question. I’ve been focusing on the California elections. Also, I don’t see a lot of tv political ads, or listen to regular radio.

    Also, when did Jehovah’s Witnesses ever have any power? And as far as I can tell, they are formally apolitical. I’m not even sure that the most observant Witnesses even vote. Their literature certain plays down the value of political participation.

  67. 67
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Brachiator:

    I’ve pretty much spelled out why I think that an endless round of investigations might cost the Democrats the 2020 election. I’ve never said that the Dems should go directly at Trump.

    It will be interesting to see what Pelosi will do.

    It will also be interesting to see how potential presidential aspirants in Congress play this.

    I think that Trump and the Republicans can stumble and fuck things up. Democrats need to offer themselves as coming to the rescue.

    I also think that Democrats can help point out Trump corruption without wallowing in endless investigations.

    This.

    I am really struggling with this today. Not as a shrinking violet but, this is crazeballs off the map. And, am terribly Angry. Which is not an emotional state helpful to imagination or reason or, really anything, except perhaps motivation. But, that’s short term not long. And not communally useful.

  68. 68
    CliosFanBoy says:

    @Citizen Alan: hey, we did that already! Mission Accomplished!

  69. 69
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @clay:

    They really don’t have anything other than fear and lies, do they?

    And surprise. And the Comfy Chair.

  70. 70
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Brachiator: What I was trying to say was that we are dealing with a cult, not normal politics. Trumpism acts like a cult, except that the cult leader has real power.

  71. 71
    Brachiator says:

    @Ken Shabby:

    One of the tragedies of the Civil War is we had to beat the hell out of the South and burn half of it to the ground. Another is the cynical failure of Reconstruction.

    Yep. We should have burnt all of it to the ground.

    It might have made Reconstruction easier.

  72. 72
    CarolDuhart2 says:

    @Brachiator: Why should they? Elections are won on local issues mostly. Promising investigations move few voters at the moment-and those are already voting Democratic. Take care of those issues, and one can do other things as well.

    Personally, I would leave most of this up to the California and other Blue State delegations with inassailable seats anyway, folks that right now are up to 20 points ahead and don’t need to worry. Let the Blue/Purple dogs work on healthcare and transporation and funding the Federal Government properly.

  73. 73
    lamh36 says:

    @brianklaas
    Unspeakably vile and callous. Trump says he considered canceling his political rally not because 11 people were murdered in an anti-Semitic act of terrorism, but because he had a bad hair day due to answering questions about the murders of Jews in the rain

    3:38 PM – Oct 27, 2018
    https://twitter.com/brianklaas/status/1056284115840962560

  74. 74
    debbie says:

    @lamh36:

    Heh. He always has a bad hair day.

  75. 75
    JPL says:

    Trump is holding his rally because he feels he’s obligated to prove that evil doesn’t win. Now think about that when you consider whether or not the democrats should hold hearings.

  76. 76
    Suzanne says:

    I enjoy it a lot.

    Yeah, me too.
    I have been detaching a bit from politics and current events because I feel like I don’t like the person I’m becoming.

    I have been saying for months that the core of this issue is that Americans hate each other, and ergo, we (the global we, not the commenters here) care less about governance than we do about punishing, humiliating, or at the very least cutting all ties to those we don’t like. And I am just as guilty of this. I actively hope for Trumpy people to reap what they have sown, and I have no interest in softening the blows that I think they’re going to feel. I’m not a very nice person.

  77. 77

    Democrats should hold hearings and provide oversight, that is why there is so much energy behind them right now.. The bully can smell your fear and that just emboldens him.

  78. 78
    Ruckus says:

    @Mike in DC:
    Twitter and facebook get eyeballs from them. You will have to drag those eyeballs away from them because that’s what those platforms sell is eyeballs. Just like TV and even this blog.
    All these social media/information structures costs electrons and silicon to support. They have a way to support that and make money. That ain’t going away.

  79. 79
    satby says:

    @Suzanne: well, neither am I. Because I feel the same way.

  80. 80
    Brachiator says:

    @Ken Shabby:

    You ask some damn good questions. Not sure if there are any good answers.

    I recommend a recent podcast of Larry Wilmore: Black on the Air. This might also be available at his website. A remarkable interview with Doris Kearns Goodwin, who has some good insights about Lincoln, along with FDR, LBJ and Teddy Roosevelt.

    One thing that hits me about Trump in the light of recent tragedies is his total lack of empathy. He can’t even mutter pieties about thoughts and prayers without quickly falling back on his standard hate messaging and self promotion.

    There is an emptiness at Trump’s core that is terrifying. The only things he seems to care about is the abstract concept of winning, the Trump brand, and Ivanka.

    My greatest fear is that he will pull the country into a disaster that he cannot bullshit his way out of. Or that he will leave the country so damaged that it will be exceedingly difficult for the next president to make repairs. Probably why the best next president might be a woman. There will be a lot of shit that needs cleaning.

  81. 81
    gene108 says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷:

    I do think the (hopefully) new Dem House should launch investigations into the alt-right and other violent right-wing networks. They should press the FBI to crackdown on these terrorists as well.

    Congress can’t direct the FBI to do much, see the FBI investigation into Kavanaugh.

    Second, Republicans have worked against the FBI focusing on right-wing terrorists for at least 10 years. The public display has been sort of (Foghorn Leghorn voice) “how dare…I say…how dare you impugn my honor…as a right winger to say other right wingers are dangerously violent…I await your apology and the topic is closed… I say…”

  82. 82
    TS (the original) says:

    @tobie:

    the cable networks are showing tRump’s brownshirt rally in Indiana.

    Free advertising to the GOP – doesn’t matter how much money the democrats raise – they have a massive task to overcome the free time given to the party of hate. trump hates on the media and they STILL cover his Nuremberg rallies fenced off in a pen.

  83. 83
    lamh36 says:

    I still think Cruz has a likely chance of getting re-elected.

    At this point it will come down to whether Texas GOP voters hate Tom Cruz more than they hate the idea of a Dem being their Senator.

    To be honest, I don’t think anyone in Texas, even Republicans like Ted Cruz…but as I said…do they hate him enough ot overcome their hatred of voting for Dems?

    @thehill
    2h2 hours ago
    More
    JUST IN: Fort Worth Star-Telegram becomes Texas’ third largest newspaper to endorse O’Rourke over Cruz http://hill.cm/QtlySFD

  84. 84
    debbie says:

    @JPL:

    I just want him gone and I want everything he broke to be fixed. Far better to spend the next two years passing legislation and then just voting him out.

  85. 85
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Suzanne:

    That’s it. That’s all of it:
    Focus on governing. Do the job you interviewed for.
    It’s supposed to be Hard; things that are worth a lot, cost a lot.

    And, stop molesting people

    % o

  86. 86
    Ken Shabby says:

    @debbie:

    Yes.

    Ultimately, we can marginalize these malignant idiots and send them back into their own filth.

  87. 87
    Brachiator says:

    @JPL:

    Trump is holding his rally because he feels he’s obligated to prove that evil doesn’t win. Now think about that when you consider whether or not the democrats should hold hearings.

    Trump holds rallies because it makes his dick hard. He feels that he can let loose and really be himself.

    He needs these rallies to get off on, to wallow in the worship of the crowd (even though the crowds are getting smaller). He also comes closest to revealing his thoughts or directions about policy here, because he always goes away from anything that has been scripted for him.

  88. 88
    Ken Shabby says:

    @lamh36:

    And, voting machines. Thus far, 82 out of 254(?) counties report straight D voting works but…flips Beto to c’mon ….Ted.

    Truth.

  89. 89

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: As someone who’s spent the week seriously considering whether I may end up having to leave the country for my personal safety, I really don’t need this sort of “what if” wankery right now. Give it a rest.

  90. 90
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:

    @Sister Golden Bear:
    I apologize if I’ve caused you any distress. See my comments at #12 and #21 and #26. I don’t want to see that scenario come to pass and I know I won’t be the first or even second or third to go if this regime goes full metal Nazi. It’s scary for me as a white male. I can’t imagine how you must feel as a trans woman. I’m sorry once again.

  91. 91
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Brachiator:

    I said this in another thread:
    I think his primary motivation/get off is dragging people down into the hole he’s in.
    He is gleeful at and with depravity. That gets him off. Everything else seems to be means to that end. Everything else is tools and tactic. He’s one dimensional as hell.

  92. 92
    Ruckus says:

    @clay:

    They really don’t have anything other than fear and lies, do they?

    Fear and lies have been the corner stone of the republican party for my entire life – that’s going on 7 decades. I’m going out on a very sturdy limb here and say that fear and lies have been the corner stone of conservative politics since the first two people discussed the idea of politics eons ago. Look at every conservative/republican “policy” issue for the last 70 yrs and tell me if you can find one that fear and lies weren’t what every policy idea was based upon.
    I’ll wait.

  93. 93
    TS (the original) says:

    @debbie:

    Obstruct, obstruct, obstruct!

    And someone needs to explain to Sen Schumer what that means.

  94. 94
    Jay says:

    @Suzanne: @satby:

    Nope. You are good people.

    It’s not wrong to want to have evil people face consequences for the evil they do.

    They hate you because you want good done in the world, it’s okay to hate them back.

  95. 95
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    One of the First things Democrats CAN do is restore Law. LBGTQ is either settled or settling Law. Math and good people are on your side.

  96. 96
    Brachiator says:

    @lamh36:

    At this point it will come down to whether Texas GOP voters hate Tom Cruz more than they hate the idea of a Dem being their Senator.

    Texans, like most conservative white Southerners, hate Democrats because they love racism.

    If Beto wins, goddam it will be something!

    I see that the Dallas Morning News also endorses Beto. Police groups either endorse Beto or no one.

  97. 97
    Ken Shabby says:

    @TS (the original):

    Someone needs to show Schumer the door and, take his donors with him.

  98. 98
    JPL says:

    @debbie: I erased part of my comment but imagine if you will the use of a vise grip.

  99. 99
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷 says:

    @Brachiator:

    Police groups either endorse Beto or no one.

    That’s really something, isn’t it? The Fraternal Order of Police, a group I have no great love for, is endorsing Rich Cordray for governor here in Ohio. It’s true he was the attorney general but so was Mike DeWine, his opponent. It says a lot about what police think of DeWine.

  100. 100
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Ruckus:
    Fiscal responsibility, equal protection, non or less interference in private life, freedom both from and or to worship…there’s a few more but, that’s about it. You gave me seven decades but, those things all flushed down the toilet forty years ago. We’re on the same page. But, as per above, we need those things. I hope they reassert themselves.

    The current GOP is essentially the bankrupt, confused and failed ‘platform’ of The Confederate States of America. Which, by 1864, couldn’t even get along with itself.

    They can drown in red piss –

  101. 101
    Ken Shabby says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷:

    A lot of police are realizing what their responsibility and role would look like in partial or open rebellion….enlightened self interest.

    What A Concept.

    Just as our military has been consistently taking a cold, hard look at climate change.

  102. 102
    dogwood says:

    This morning on one of the cable show discussions about Trump and the GOP’s level of responsibility for this violence someone quoted Victor Hugo from Les Mis. To paraphrase- Men will sin in the dark, but those who sin in the dark are less guilty than those who provide the darkness.

  103. 103
    J R in WV says:

    @Brachiator:

    ………. you might have to make do with a David Brooks column.

    Well, David doesn’t have to worry any more about right wing fascist violence.

    You see, he’s not a Jew any more, he converted to Catholic in order to marry his much younger former employee second wife, so no problem, for David. Right? Right?

  104. 104
    Gerald D Richardson says:

    @Mike in DC: “Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.”

    These fools hate each other as much as Jews, blacks, Muslims, etc., so you may get your wish.

  105. 105
    germy says:

    @J R in WV:

    in order to marry his much younger former employee second wife

    He should write a book about that.

  106. 106
    Ruckus says:

    @Brachiator:
    I think some of your fears are already a reality.
    There are ways out of this mess but none of them are easy or quick.
    Next do remember this is his one and only demonstrable talent, the ability to turn everything and anything to shit, all the while thinking that he’s making it all better. That anyone so grossly unqualified at everything manages to breathe and walk is amazing.

  107. 107
  108. 108
    lamh36 says:

    MY PRESIDENT!

    @BarackObama
    We grieve for the Americans murdered in Pittsburgh. All of us have to fight the rise of anti-Semitism and hateful rhetoric against those who look, love, or pray differently. And we have to stop making it so easy for those who want to harm the innocent to get their hands on a gun.

    https://twitter.com/BarackObama/status/1056303165610618880

  109. 109
    germy says:

    @J R in WV:

    You see, he’s not a Jew any more

    “I knew a fellow named Otto Kahn,” Groucho Marx once recalled. “His close friend was Marshall P. Wilder, who was a hunchback. One day they passed a synagogue on Fifth Avenue and Kahn turned to Wilder and said, ‘You know, I used to be a Jew.’ ‘Really?’ said Wilder. ‘I used to be a hunchback.'”

  110. 110
    Brachiator says:

    @Ruckus:
    Trump has a talent for grift and bullshit. Working in the tax and accounting business, I’ve seen how victims get taken.

    And the absolute best grifters can get some of their suckers to defend and protect them.

    Trump knows how to surround himself with these people. He also attracts other grifters who will happily support Trump in exchange for a piece of the action.

  111. 111

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷: Thank you. Now spend all that mental energy on writing a scene instead.

    @Ken Shabby: Agreed. I’m in California, so I’m more protected. And likely administrative attacks on me will result in lawsuits that will take awhile to work their way through the courts.

    But given both the reactionaries being packed onto the appellate court and the Supreme Court, I’m not counting on the courts to protect me — and there’s already cases on the docket that could be used to legalize discrimination against me. And who’s to say the administration won’t pull and Andrew Jackson and simply decide to ignore the courts. We’re a tiny minority, and liberal allies have thrown us under the bus many times in the name of focusing the greater cause. (For example when leading LGB groups offered to drop us from ENDA and told us to wait our turn.)

    I’m genuinely spooked by the likelihood of the feds fucking with my passport (and Social Security info, which is referenced by other legal IDs) because that can be done with a simple change of administrative policy. They’re things that the Talibaptists have long talked about doing, and have already done in a number of states.

    Because my contingency exit plans don’t work if I’m stateless.

  112. 112
    Ruckus says:

    @debbie:
    Not to be a downer but remember than even if we take the house and senate, all legislation has to be signed by, wait for it, the shitgibbon. So best case, we are still in a holding pattern. I believe that we can’t take 2/3 of the senate, not that many repubs running, so really there isn’t a whole lot other than making sure nothing bad gets legislated for the next 2 years. That’s the upper limit.

  113. 113
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Brachiator:

    My greatest fear is that he will pull the country into a disaster that he cannot bullshit his way out of. Or that he will leave the country so damaged that it will be exceedingly difficult for the next president to make repairs. Probably why the best next president might be a woman. There will be a lot of shit that needs cleaning.

    Yes, to first. Defo second. Add two + decades to to do list. On a sunny day. Third, I confess a) shame like, really guys? We gotta be like this? b) bring it because, hell yes there are some formidable ladies and, I do mean Ladies. And, yes, folly up – decades of cleaning and maybe even infrastructure week and a few nice things….

    Cake or Death

    And, to turn a phrase
    It will piss all them off something awful.

  114. 114
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Ruckus:

    And, I’ll take it.
    For now, that works.

  115. 115
    Skepticat says:

    @Mike in DC:

    Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.

    No. No. No.

  116. 116
    Jay says:

    @J R in WV:

    Didn’t work during WWII, won’t work in the Fourth Reich.

  117. 117
    Brachiator says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳🌷:

    Fuck! I am sorry that I posted in error.

    I meant to say that police groups either endorse Cruz, or no one.

    This week, the 27,000-member strong Texas Municipal Police Association will endorse the sitting senator over his Democratic challenger, El Paso Congressman Beto O’Rourke. But the Combined Law Enforcement Associations of Texas, or CLEAT, which bills itself as the largest police officers union in the state, will not endorse either man because of concerns about their policies.

    The one hopeful sign here is that the second group passed on endorsing Cruz because they felt that he didn’t address their concerns when speaking to them. Being an oily ass-wipe who dodges direct questions will really hurt you with most Texans.

    https://www.dallasnews.com/news/2018-elections/2018/10/25/cops-back-ted-cruz-police-groups-disagreeon-top-texas-endorsements

  118. 118
    Jay says:

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    Yes, they do. Canada takes the stateless.

  119. 119
    B.B.A. says:

    Burn it all down. Kill kill kill kill kill kill kill.

  120. 120
    lamh36 says:

    @AP
    5m5 minutes ago
    More
    BREAKING: President Trump tells reporters he will travel to Pittsburgh in wake of synagogue shooting, offers no details

    Let me guess, Ivanka and Jared witll travel with him

  121. 121
    Barb 2 says:

    “Everything Trump Touched Dies” by Rick Wilson

    Wilson is a conservative – a true conservative. I listened to this book while knitting. Naturally I do not agree with everything Wilson says but his observations about Trump and his enablers in the GOP seemed spot on target.

    Wilson ends his book with a list of actions the GOP must take to save the party post Trump. The racism of the Trump lead party makes Wilson ill as does most of not all of Trump chaos and hate.

    Someone at BJ recommended Everything Trump Touched Dies – thank you for the recommendation!

    Trump’s grotesque responses to hate crimes may wake some people up??

  122. 122
    Ruckus says:

    @Brachiator:
    And what direction does his gift for grift and bullshit always go? To shit.
    He has the capacity to grift and bullshit but if he was really any good at it he’d be worth a hell of a lot more, not beholding to Russian money laundering, or you know, actually successful. He didn’t as much win the presidency as stumble into it by being the last racist standing when the bell rung. That is his life’s work, stumbling into everything and turning it to shit.
    He was born on third, stole his way back to first and walked from there to the plate when the inning ended. And thinks he scored a winning run and all on his own. He took his half a billion inheritance and has become a whiny racist shit in debt to the Russian mob.
    I’m a nobody, I started with nothing and have most of it left.

  123. 123
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @B.B.A.: That sounds helpful.

  124. 124
    chris says:

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    my contingency exit plans don’t work if I’m stateless.

    Come to Canada, we’re good with refugees. Also you might like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Canada

  125. 125
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Sister Golden Bear:

    Because my contingency exit plans don’t work if I’m stateless.

    Thank you for your patience with me.

    Yes. That is it, all of it. I’m glad you’re in Cali, because Reasons. I’m in Minnesota so I both get it and, Get It. Kinda. I’m old, white, male, married and straight but I’ve spent an aggregate three out of four decades of my life working with among other things, Not Me.

    Both my mind and heart bend toward justice and love and that guides else.

    I don’t have to completely understand to completely understand the humanity that binds us to one another. That’s all that matters.

    PS/ another history geek! yAy!

  126. 126
    Ruckus says:

    @Ken Shabby:
    Well good, because the only other non option is a civil war, and that won’t turn out as well as the first one did.

  127. 127
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @lamh36: Maybe he can stand over the scene and say “I’m not supposed to say this, but I’m a nationalist. And they brought it on themselves by attacking anti-Semites and paying for caravans through Mexico.”

    Maggie Haberman will follow that up with a “Trump read a speech from Stephen Miller and doesn’t actually mean it. Also, anonymous sources say Ivanka doesn’t agree at all and thinks this is terrible but loves her father and thinks his presidency is doing real good in the world.”

  128. 128

    This. All of this. Allies, now is the time we need you to step up.

    https://www.advocate.com/commentary/2018/10/22/trans-plea-lgb-and-q-help-us

    I’m at the point now where I can’t yell in anger about this. I can’t freak out. I’m just tired. All of us transgender people are tired. We have fought and fought and fought, and with a few memos and policy changes the rights we were given by the Obama administration are gone. Poof. Pencil-whipped out of existence. Yeah, we’re gonna keep fighting because we have been fighting, we’ve been fighting this whole time literally and nothing has changed in this regard because there wasn’t even a cease-fire called; so please don’t tell us to fight back. What the hell do you think we’ve been doing for our whole lives?

    At this point we’re trying to hold our lines because we’re about to get overrun. I could write up one of those “Go Vote, Call Your Congressman” type articles, but I can barely even muster the will to write this sentence, much less punch out a thousand words on the importance of voting and civic engagement. You should already know how important it is already and if you don’t I can’t even wrap my head around that anymore. There is no point in slippery slope warnings or comparisons to monsterous times or places in our past, we see it in so many other things.

    I’m at the point now where all I can muster is: “Help us.”

  129. 129
    Ruckus says:

    @Ken Shabby:
    I said conservative policies, not liberal policies. All of those you mentioned come from what we now term the liberal side of the aisle. All of them were fought by the conservatives. And every chance they get they try really hard to get rid of them.
    ETA Unless of course I misunderstood your point. Which is entirely possible. And probable.

  130. 130
    Brachiator says:

    @Ruckus:

    And what direction does his gift for grift and bullshit always go? To shit.

    The tax cuts will make Trump wealthier, even though he lies about his net worth.

    And every aspect of the tax cuts will benefit the wealthiest Americans. It is amazing to see how comprehensively it gives the .1 percent every break they ever dreamed of.

    His judicial appointments make evangelicals jump for joy.

    It’s not just that everything Trump does turns to shit. He will make a few happy at the expense of everyone else.

    And he encourages cruelty. It reminds me of what happened in the Balkans when people were encouraged to let loose and tape or kill their neighbors because of their religion or ethnicity.

    Trump doesn’t care what he unleashes. He thinks that he and his buddies will be able to escape whatever happens, and have plenty of loot to tide them over.

    This would be worse than shit.

  131. 131
    Betty Cracker says:

    Amen to every word, brother. Excellent post.

  132. 132
    H.E.Wolf says:

    @B.B.A.:
    Bless your heart.

  133. 133
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Ken Shabby:

    PS/ another history geek! yAy!

    You’ll find that quite a few commenters are fairly knowledgeable.

  134. 134
    Steeplejack says:

    Trump’s rally in Murphysboro, Illinois, got started a little while ago. Daniel Dale (@ddale8) reports live.

    Note: To update the live feed in Twitter, click Dale’s most recent tweet—the last one before other people’s comments—and Twitter will fill in his newer tweets. If you hit “page refresh” instead, (I think) you end up back at the top of the feed and then have to find your place again.

    And you don’t have to have a Twitter account yourself. You can go to the page and read it just like any other Web page.

  135. 135
    PST says:

    @lamh36:

    BREAKING: President Trump tells reporters he will travel to Pittsburgh in wake of synagogue shooting, offers no details

    He’s not going to Louisville I wouldn’t suppose. Come to think of it, I haven’t heard him utter a word about that racist multiple murder. Maybe I missed something.

  136. 136
    germy says:

    Unbelievable — Trump doesn't know how to close an umbrella, so inside of closing it and bringing it aboard Air Force One with him, he just dropped it outside the plane. pic.twitter.com/G5AtmPaRvz— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) October 27, 2018

  137. 137
    guster says:

    I’m too sick to read this again, but this is what my horrified first glance took away:

    A) Jews are murderous.
    B) It’s terrible that Jews were murdered.

  138. 138
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Steeplejack: Daniel Dale has been doing yeoman’s work. If only an American journalist were as committed.

    “Remember the New York Stock Exchange,” Trump repeats. The NYSE was closed until six days after 9/11. He’s asking people to remember something that didn’t happen.

  139. 139
    Ruckus says:

    @Brachiator:
    Was going to argue with you on our differing definitions of shit, right up until your last line.
    It will be and is worse than shit.
    I was just using the word a bit more inclusively.
    My life has been shit, but it could have been and can get a lot worse. I look around and see people far worse off than me, who did nothing to arrive at that worse off place, other than being born, just like me. And then I see asswipes like shitgibbon, who was born on third and managed to fuck up more than what a million normal human beings could possibly do, maybe 2 million. He’s a shit factory, has been his entire life. As I said above, the old line, I started with nothing, and have most of it left. He started with a lot, a whole lot, and has fucked up every bit of it completely. Fred would be proud. His son, the racist in chief.

  140. 140
    Jay says:

    @guster:

    Digby quotes Marshall about the hate laden anti-Semitic ad the Insane Clown POSus Campaign ran in 2016.

    https://digbysblog.blogspot.com/2018/10/recall-trumps-closing-steve-bannon.html?m=1

    Now I’m not saying Trump is a Nazi, but the Nazi’s think Trump is a Nazi.

  141. 141
    Ken Shabby says:

    @chris:

    ++1

    Bring your CV. They want that in their country.

  142. 142
    Mike in NC says:

    NBC News reporter was just stopping random people at Fat Bastard’s rally. They all still love him because “he tells it like it is” and all the other usual horseshit. Just a sea of white faces waving Trump signs.

  143. 143
    lollipopguild says:

    @PST: He wants to throw paper towels at the members of the congregation.

  144. 144
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Gin & Tonic:

    Running to catch and dig the train.

  145. 145
    lollipopguild says:

    @Jay: Racists think trump is their kind of racist, because he is.

  146. 146
    Raoul says:

    @Brachiator: Well, I’m not one for wallowing. “Investigate the hell out of” may have been too much hyperbole. I do think each House committee should, golly, be committee-ing. Which includes calling in cabinet members and high administrators to testify at hearings. I know that’s not how Ryan has run the House the past two years, but it is normal governance.
    I don’t think we win by having a dozen Bhengazi-esque repeat circuses. But bringing in DHS and finding out what the frunk happened with child separation is, IMO, a winner. Likewise looking at all the ways CMS may not be following the ACA (tattered tho it may be).
    And so on. Not a million kleig light showtrials, but active, engaged governance. And finding incompetence, graft and corruption will just spill out of that work.

    Meanwhile, yes, we have to walk and chew gum: Give a positive vision for America w/o Trump. Part of that is showing what a house of Congress looks like when it runs things rather than running away from everything, ala Pauly pretty eyes.

  147. 147
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Ruckus:

    Look again: those are old, Republican tenets.
    In all the avalanche of bullshit in yours and my life, those got covered years ago –

    You’ll still hear it when you talk to a moron who’s stuck at 1959. He/she ain’t wrong, just in the wrong fucking time warp. Unless we’re discussing black folks, at which point it’s ridiculous. PS/ women and Everybody else not at the Cleaver’s or Donna Reed’s house.

    See: Pleasantville

  148. 148
    J R in WV says:

    @Suzanne:

    I actively hope for Trumpy people to reap what they have sown, and I have no interest in softening the blows that I think they’re going to feel. I’m not a very nice person.

    Suzanne, there’s nothing mean or not nice about what you’re feeling. Believing in Karma, that evil will come to those who do evil, is not in its turn evil. Refusing to feel sympathy for evil fascists around us — that’s not evil, good people cannot be faulted to hating evil around us.

    You are good people!

  149. 149
    germy says:

    @Mike in NC:

    NBC News reporter was just stopping random people at Fat Bastard’s rally.

    I just saw that. Lots of young people wearing MAGA hats. “He is what he is” etc.

  150. 150
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Mike in NC:

    See: ‘enabling’

    Sometimes, I hate on those slobs more than anyone –

  151. 151
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    It may be worth mentioning that the Atlanta Temple Bombing occurred 60 years ago this month. Mercifully, no one was killed or injured in that horrible event.

  152. 152
    CCL says:

    Okay, from Daniel Dale’s tweet thread, this one scares me.

    Trump on the border: “You’re going to be so happy next week. You’re going to see something happen next week, you’re going to be very happy. You’re going to be very happy. And you know the military is going to the border.”

    What the heck does the orange obscenity plan for next week?

  153. 153
    🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷 says:

    @Ken Shabby:
    @Mike in NC:
    “He is what he is”. That’s the banality of evil, right there. Fuck these people. I’m glad the crowds at those rallies are shrinking

  154. 154
    Mike in NC says:

    @CCL: Several so-called militia groups in Texas are planning to dispatch 100-200 ammosexuals to the border, where a bunch of out-of-shape, pasty-faced guys in camo would not at all get in the way.

  155. 155
    Jay says:

    @CCL:

    Nothing. The Caravan’s 3+ weeks away from the Border.

    The law say’s that the President can send the Military including the National Guard to the border, in unarmed support roles.

    We already saw this stunt from the Insane Clown POSus last year. The shit funnel seem’s to have erased it from memory.

    Most State Governors told Treason Twitler to fuck off and told their Guard units to “stand down”.

  156. 156
    Jay says:

    @Mike in NC:

    The ammosexuals have only managed to “dispatch” handfulls in the past, many got arrested for criming.

  157. 157
    Mike in NC says:

    @🇺🇸🌎 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)  🗳🌷: The idiotic lies just never end. He can’t half fill a junior high school assembly hall, but insists that they had to turn away thousands of supporters who stood in line for hours.

  158. 158
    Ruckus says:

    @Ken Shabby:
    My congressman 45-50 yrs ago was a John Birch Society member and he was good with constituent issues. Seemed honest and sincere. But wanting the same things as liberals? No. Sure there were some republicans who weren’t raving lunatics, more in the center than right or left, sort of like Joe Manchin is a Democrat. But who got those things done? And remember we have to leave off the R or D, those roles have changed massively. Use conservative or liberal, which itself wasn’t used. But conservatives have always been conservative and are around the world. Liberals have had a number of monikers over the years, and a lot of people associated the word with communism or socialism so didn’t want to be called liberal at all or used it with distain.

  159. 159
    chris says:

    @Ken Shabby: CVs are for immigrants, not refugees. In my country.

  160. 160
    Ken Shabby says:

    @chris:

    Thank you for clarification. When I looked into Vancouver, from a couple that grew up there and, she, way north Manitoba, old school farm, this was their best advice.

    Same in Australia, and, that from two Sask. Canadians, 20 something, tried to extend.

    “No, and, bring a marketable skill”

    I mean I get that but, you can’t just show up and say “I like hockey and gravy on spuds”

  161. 161
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Ruckus:

    Right but, what’s happened is neither group finding out common ground and value. John Birch has always been fucked no matter else.

    I don’t think trad Conservaves are always Wrong somewhat anymore than Liberals are always right. Monolithic anything gives me hives. But, I can’t wait to send these fucks to ash heap of history.

    If that helps.

    A true conservative would have both understood and embraced much of this, years ago.

    They Ain’t.

    Neither side has any business fucking up people’s lives like this. And, NO, I am not Both Sides. One side can go fuck off, and earned it.

  162. 162
    Ken Shabby says:

    @Jay:

    Or, a thousand miles.

  163. 163
    Jaqen H'ghar says:

    @Mike in DC: Just once I’d like to flip on the tv and hear about a mass shooting of racists at a Klan rally or Neo-Nazi gathering. Would be a nice change of pace.

    Good luck getting a mass of Neo-Nazis or KKK together. There can’t be more than a couple thousand of them scattered around the country, and they have no money or political influence. Whenever they gather in public they are not only heavily outnumbered by Antifa counter-protestors, but they are also outnumbered by the police and the media.

    At least 90% of the antisemitism in America comes from the Left. Louis Farrakhan is not a white nationalist. The BDS movement on campus is a leftist movement. Racists are shunned by the mainstream GOP. Trump’s favorite child, his son-in-law and 3 of his grandkids are Jewish.

  164. 164
    Jay says:

    @Ken Shabby:

    That’s Immigration,

    Refugee’s just need to show up at the Border, a Port or Airport with one piece of photo id, preferably.

  165. 165
    JR says:

    @Brachiator: If we are at the point where we set aside the rule of law for political expediency, we might as well call an end to the republic.

  166. 166
  167. 167
    Karen says:

    @Jaqen H’ghar:

    At least 90% of the antisemitism in America comes from the Left

    Prove it.

  168. 168
    Karen says:

    @guster: And so it’s begun.

  169. 169
    Bill Arnold says:

    @Jaqen H’ghar:

    Louis Farrakhan is not a white nationalist.

    I don’t see much evidence that he’s a leftist though. That the American left does not adequately condemn his antisemitism, anti-gay, etc bigotry is a structural defect. But it doesn’t make him a leftist. (Your comment reads like it was written in a bubble, by the way.)
    (Sorta-interesting easy read on medium while doing a little search on this – White Leftists Have a Farrakhan Problem – “Unlike Robeson, Farrakhan has no socialist leanings. Unlike Farrakhan, Robeson — despite his support of Soviet Russia during a time of anti-Jewish persecution — was not accused of virulent anti-semitism” )

  170. 170
    Melusine says:

    @Brachiator:
    If Dems take the House and don’t start investigations, they’re going to lose a lot of votes in 2020. I’m not voting for shrugs and, “Well, what can you do, we’re helpless without the Presidency and the Senate too, so vote for us in 2020 and THEN we’ll fix this. We’ll just sit back and see how many more horrific mistakes the GOP makes. Hey maybe they’ll put toddlers in cages, or openly support Nazis, or erase transgender and intersex people, or incite assassination attempts and mass murder! Yeah, they’ll have to give up and go home if they stumble that badly!”

    I’m voting so that we can start to set things right. That’s impossible without accountability, and you can’t have accountability without investigations. Repubs aren’t going to suddenly start cooperating and working with Dems to govern. Too many of them are in too deep. They’re going to keep lying and obstructing and hate-mongering and nothing the Dems can do will change that except holding them responsible. And that requires evidence. Unless they manage to take the Senate too, they’re not going to have the votes to get major legislation passed. The only thing they can do is start dragging the rot out into the light, and if they won’t do that…This shit HAS to stop or our democracy won’t survive. We just had multiple major assassination attempts and yet another mass shooting to add to the list of domestic terror attacks for the last two years. It will only get worse. If the House won’t start the process now it will be too late by 2020. There won’t be a country left to save.

    @Brachiator:

  171. 171
    Melusine says:

    @Suzanne:
    I understand where you’re coming from. But when you have people in your life who are TAKING ACTION to negate your civil rights, even your right to exist, by voting for people who have repeatedly openly stated that they’re going to fuck you over, or even kill you by taking away your access to health care, and then excusing/justifying that vote and continuing to support policies that fuck you over because, “at least they’re on the right team!” – well, people who don’t think that I have the right to live don’t deserve a place in my life.

    Trump never hid what he was. They knew what they were voting for. They knew that, AT BEST, they were voting for a con man who cheated contractors and customers, bragged about committing sexual assault, called his own daughter “a piece of ass” with real tits, took a massive shit on every POW and on a grieving military family, was openly racist, incited violence at his rallies, and encouraged gun owners to take out his opponent if she won.

    AND THEY STILL VOTED FOR HIM.

    Never forget. Never forgive. Move forward as best you can. You may feel sorry for a dog that’s rabid, but that doesn’t mean you let it get close enough for the infection to damage you or anyone else. Especially if it’s a dog that liked chasing rabid bats.

    Be kind to yourself, and do whatever you need to do to take care of yourself to get through this. You can’t reason with or fix them. They have to fix themselves. You need to take care of you and help the people you CAN help.

  172. 172
    marc says:

    Don’t forget those despicable NRA white power arise videos for the last how many years?

  173. 173

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