Trump: the press is the enemy of the people and i wish i could put them in jail
Ocasio-Cortez: one (1) event will be closed to the press so I can speak to constituents from vulnerable communities about sensitive issues that impact them
Mainstream reporters: these are the same
— Kate Aronoff (@KateAronoff) August 17, 2018
The other day, AOC held a public event for her future constituents, focusing on issues of domestic violence, immigrants, etc. The forum was closed to the press, and our intrepid media HAD A FUCKING SHIT FIT:
Our community is 50% immigrant. Folks are victims of DV, trafficking, + have personal medical issues.
This town hall was designed for residents to feel safe discussing sensitive issues in a threatening political time.
We indicated previously that it would be closed to press.
— Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (@Ocasio2018) August 17, 2018
They are attacking her because she is a woman, because she is young, because she is of the left, and they want to bitch slap her and let her know who is boss. Actually covering her positions on issues is much harder than the easy script- “She’s inexperienced, making rookie mistakes, and she’s not ready for prime time.”
There is a reason she might want to meet with these people without the media there:
Not to mention ICE is now carjacking people as they drive their pregnant wives to the fucking hospital to give birth:
That was on Wednesday. I’m surprised these idiots in the media are not asking her about Hillary’s emails. I fucking hate these people.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
I can’t believe these people get paid for this shit.
Most of the time I feel hopeful that we’ll make it through this shit show. But when the press pulls this kind of thing, I despair again.
Amir Khalid
You are talking about media people who would have had no problem covering that event and then trashing Ocasio-Cortez for pandering to special-interest groups and/or airing people’s sensitive personal stories.
Emma
To misquote one of our more famous commenters: Villago (with some exceptions) delenda est.
Platonailedit
And they
wonderwhine why both sides want them dead.Odie Hugh Manatee
Instead of being at the meeting and writing their interpretation of what she says, maybe the assholes could interview the people exiting the town hall and ask their opinion of the event? You know, do some interviewing and reporting on that?
Too much work, I guess.
schrodingers_cat
She should ignore them.
dmsilev
These are, of course, the same people who assured us that Donald Trump would grow into his job and we just needed to give him some time to do so.
Starfish
I don’t know if you read Sydette on Twitter, but she went after the media folk this morning, and it was beautiful.
Platonailedit
@dmsilev:
They did/do that because they are the corrupt minions who put the totus in that job.
Chyron HR
Gee, it turns out the media doesn’t actually support democratic socialism and medicare-for-all, they just like people who are willing to go on CNN and stab Democrats in the back 7 days a week (twice on Sunday). Who could have predicted this shocking twist?
Brachiator
The press are jackals, or at least they are supposed to be. Trump has most of them thoroughly whipped.
AOC is both low hanging fruit and the flavor of the month. Having missed the rise of her campaign, they are eager to document it if she crashes and burns.
NotMax
There’s the rub which engendered the butthurt. Had the word public not been adjectivally invoked…
Brachiator
@Chyron HR:
Why should they? The media ain’t your moral conscience or cheer squad.
schrodingers_cat
@Chyron HR: They will cheer her on as long as she lashes elected Ds on TV.
TaMara (HFG)
Every fucking time. And whenever I hear them whining about how the tangerine hairball or Huckysand treats them, all I can think is, “you helped create this monster you sleazy, ‘where’s my bbq and tree swing’ fucksters.
Baud
As if this this unqiue to AOC. The time to get mad was when they did it to Hillary. Now they know they can act like this with impunity.
tobie
@Brachiator:
I respectfully disagree. We are jackals. We’re what the press should be.
On a more serious note: I can’t begin to fathom how just heartless you have to be arrest someone as he’s bringing his pregnant wife to the hospital to deliver.
NotMax
@NotMax
Following up, the better way was to welcome the press, with the stipulation that what transpired was off the record unless specifically stated otherwise.
raven
@Odie Hugh Manatee: What’s up man? Good to see ya!
Major Major Major Major
@schrodingers_cat: āShe should ignore them.ā
Agreed
Gvg
Eh, we need to not act provoked the way the whiners want. I think Coles response of two stories demonstrating why media needed to be excluded was exactly the most effective response, but not calling them names, even though they deserve it. I hope Ocasio-Cortez responds something like that. It would make a point to voters like me and wise up some of the media.
It’s possible the media is feeling under attack and paranoid right now. They haven’t been wise for awhile IMO but hysterical people don’t react intelligently and maybe reporters are feeling the heat.
On the other hand, they collectively have been acting stupid going on 20 years at least.
Mnemosyne
@Chyron HR:
Pretty much this. AOC will only be a media star for as long as she attacks Democrats. If she actually tries to move forward on Democratic priorities, sheās going to be attacked.
Chetan Murthy
I remember when Hillary’s meetings with voters that excluded the press were treated this way, too.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)Ā ??
So the story recommendation thread is dead so I’ll post mine here.
I highly recommend Veritas by ShayneT
Based on the TV showLois and Clark, it shows very effectively the effects 9/11 had had on the US and the rest of the world in 2008, describing “our” world as a dystopia (not really ours since the Lois and Clark tv show apparently never existed but Superman as a franchise did). I also enjoy stories that pay attention to details. For example, in one part of the story, because Clark was time displaced from his world’s 1993, he grew up in the 80s and mentioned he liked Journey, not liking what was on the radio. Overall, I highly recommend this to anyone that likes fish out of water type stories. One criticism I do have is that author gives the impression that 9/11 mainly caused the US to become what it was in 2008 when in reality a lot of our problems can be traced back to Nixon and Reagan. Just a small issue.
Major Major Major Major
@Chetan Murthy: it makes you wonder if the two women donāt have something in common.
maya
I must have missed the US press’ live coverage of the tRump + Sergai + Sergay + Russian press meeting in the Oval Oriface where Classified Info was discussed.
Brachiator
@Baud:
We don’t have a time machine. We can’t change the past, but we can fight for a better future.
Baud
@Brachiator:
I am doubtful lessons have been learned.
Chetan Murthy
@Major Major Major Major: You mean, besides caring about their most vulnerable constituents? No, I can’t think of anything else. Nope, nothing comes to mind.
NotMax
@Brachiator
Having one isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. In optimal conditions one gets barely three years per gallon.
:)
But Her Emails!!!
I sort of get the issue the media has here, but that they don’t seem to grasp the concept that that media exposure could be dangerous to the people at these meetings is different than Trump’s “media is the enemy of the people shtick is maddening. AOC should have just had a “private” event where the guest list consisted of her constituents then the press wouldn’t have had as much to whine about.
Platonailedit
@Odie Hugh Manatee:
Who has got time for that when you have to scour for trumpturds to get their ‘views on why they still support him’?
rikyrah
This story, Cole.???
Platonailedit
Fcuk the blog remembertron.
Amir Khalid
@NotMax:
Only works if you can trust the media people to respect “off the record”. Not everyone does.
Villago Delenda Est
My nym. Over and over again.
Wipe them out. All of them.
Platonailedit
@Villago Delenda Est:
At least your wishes are coming true here.
NotMax
@Amir Khalid
In which case the miscreants’ campaign credentials are circular-filed. Or could have the press pool select one representative to attend and serve as a conduit to the gang after the fact.
Call me naive, but building a campaign on a foundation of trust beats any alternative. Said with the experience of running for office (although on a smaller scale and *cough cough* years ago) as well as having labored in Journalismstan for a while.
lamh36
Interesting interview with John Dean on the McGann news today.
Gozer
This makes me angry beyond belief. Once again these brain-dead pieces of fuckshit are all over AOC because she has the audacity to be young, female, liberal, and brown. I’ve had white people (incl. unfortunately a certain type of white liberal “lookin’ at you NPR assholes”) “well, actually” me and my wife in the same obtuse fucking way.
It. Is. MADDENING! It make us want to throw things, break shit, and tear motherfuckers’ throats out. I’m *this* close to throwin’ hands these days.
Gozer +4
Jeffro
I know there’s going to be serious-ass competition for the 2020 nom, but one would think (in hindsight) that the Dems would have united on Jan 21, 2017 and agreed that every time Twitler’s administration did something un-American, they’d all stop, show up on the Capitol steps, and have a very brief press conference.
Very brief as in this: “GOP Congress, where are your principles? Is this ok?”
And then disperse to talk to every media outlet within reach about how not even 1% of this shit would be okay if it were a Democrat doing it.
Fucking wear them down. It worked against poor Carter and the Iran hostages, didn’t it? Make the GOP Congress/cowards own it. every. day.
I know we are heading for a “blue wave”. I know there has already been a historic # of GOP incumbents resigning. I want to absolutely crush these assholes and make the dead-enders own it, forever and ever.
Mike J
Matthew Yglesias pointed out that the media would have thought nothing of being excluded had AOC charged $2000 to get in.
Brachiator
@NotMax: AOC might have tried for off the record, etc, but fuck it. Some, not all, of the press are the enemy of the people. Well heeled politicians have private events all the time. Worse, sellout reporters protect vile secrets in exchange for access.
Some of the press are not used to the little guy and woman getting respect. And when you have ICE hunting immigrants like prey, caution over courtesy to the press is understandable.
Chetan Murthy
@Jeffro:
Uh, Nancy (and to a lesser extent, Chuck) have held their caucuses together pretty well. Isn’t that more-or-less what you’re asking for?
James E Powell
Me too, John Cole, me and several million people too. What we don’t have is any alternative source for information about the various governments. We don’t have any way to influence these assholes, their bosses, or their owners.
Matt
Re: the ICE thing – IMO “abolish ICE” is the squishy centrist position; “jail ICE until we can determine a reliable fascist-or-not test and/or hell freezes over” should be what we’re aiming for.
Upside – it’d solve the “we promised these private prison operators we’d fill X beds” problem too.
strategery
No sale.
The campaign is offering the illusion of privacy at an event open to the public where there is no legal expectation of privacy. It isn’t a safe space, and they shouldn’t try to advertise it as such. If you are running for public office, then run in public. It doesn’t matter that she’s a lefty Latina, it matters that she wanted to limit negative press coverage* and thought she had found a politically bulletproof way to market doing do.
*seriously, don’t be naive. Shaping coverage with limited access is a propaganda move, not a public servant move.
Emma
@James E Powell: sure we do. I read the foreign press either in the original or the English translation every day. There is information on the web published by NGOs that follow the news in their areas of interest. It does take some time to investigate these and find out their “trustability factor” but in the words of all friends, the truth is out there.
tobie
@lamh36: I’m not sure what to make of this but Marcy Wheeler / emptywheel is convinced that the Haberman story is basically McGahn’s attempt to make himself look good and exonerate himself. Normally I would be cautious about a conspiracy theory like this but Haberman has shown herself to be such a reliable stenographer for the Trump regime that I view whatever ‘scoop’ she has with some suspicion. From emptywheel:
Patricia Kayden
@Odie Hugh Manatee: You mean like they do with Trump supporters all the dang time?
Brickley Paiste
I am not surprised to see the media turn on that lady latina.
Her honesty frightens them. They much prefer someone like Hillary Clinton whose positions move with the political winds so the reporter need not worry about interpreting her positions because they are reducible to polling data.
Brickley Paiste
@Brachiator:
They do, indeed, kind of have a point.
satby
Can someone clean up the vomit in aisle 50?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brickley Paiste:
Were you asleep during 2015 and 2016 or passed out drunk?
Brickley Paiste
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
That latina lady qot zero coverage.
That’s how they treat real threats to the neoliberal order.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brickley Paiste:
Really, I’m on the other side of the country and I heard about her.
OK, I’ll go with passed out drunk.
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)Ā ??
@Brickley Paiste:
Don’t forget the chem trails!
Brickley Paiste
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
You heard about her in 2014?
Whereabouts?
I can understand why you are assuming that other people you encounter on the internet are idiots who can’t handle their liquor.
Gretchen
@tobie: Right? They left the pregnant woman alone in the car to fend for herself. Ugh
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brickley Paiste: You’re drunk, go home.
Amir Khalid
@NotMax:
By the time somebody’s credentials get revoked, the damage is already done. Picking a pool reporter won’t help if the reporter who gets picked does the wrong thing. I don’t like excluding the media from certain events either, but it seems the least-bad solution.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
There has always been a double standard in the Village:
Standard #1) vicious when covering Dems
Standard #2) IOKIYAR
??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)Ā ??
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
They’re not drunk they’re just stupid
Brickley Paiste
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Well, Bill, you’re the one telling me about all the coverage that latin lady got back in 2014.
So you do please continue talking about other people being drunk.
David ??Merry Christmas?? Koch
Luckily AOC wasn’t wearing a tan suit.
That would have ended her career.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brickley Paiste: I never said anything about AOC being covered in 2014, there did seem to be another female politician from New York that was coverd quite a bit in 2015 and 2016 and was pointing out that you seemed to have missed that. BTW, I don’t drink.
NotMax
@Amir Khalid
If one doesn’t roll the dice, one doesn’t advance around the game board.
Gretchen
There are 29 congressional districts in NY State, and each of the candidates will hold dozens of events before Election Day. The other 28 would be thrilled to get a reporter at a few of their events, never mind every single one. Do they get one? No, they all have to be at every single one of AOCās events in hopes of catching her in a gaffe. Their fervor for transparency and the publicās right to know withers when it comes to covering boring events in Scarsdale and Harlem.
jl
@Gretchen: IIRC, Ocasio-Cortez has a hard time getting coverage before she won. I don’t think she could get any coverage at all until Crowley started messing up his campaign. I think she got a little coverage when he sent a surrogate for their second debate. If Ocasio-Cortez had beaten a more obscure Congress member, she would still have a hard time getting coverage.
I remember reading a piece by a reporter who had worked for various organizations, Fox, CNN, one of the networks. He said political coverage has to be cheap, it has to easy, it has to be quick, it has to be ‘safe’ (not ruffle too many advertiser’s feathers or corporate brass) . Nothing else really matters.
Mnemosyne
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
He’s mocking you because you’re in recovery. It’s what he loves to do.
Brickley Paiste
@Mnemosyne:
God, you are just consistently wrong. Again and again.
Bill started alleging I was drunk despite the fact that he was arguing that OAC got media coverage in 2014. He couldn’t even read what I wrote and was responding to somebody else.
So then he starts spouting off about me being drunk. I call him on it and here you show up on your little white pony, just so anxious for a pat on the head.
Brickley Paiste
@jl:
Exactly right.
opiejeanne
@Brickley PaisteYou really are an ass and Iād rather read about pie. Mmm ? :
Odie Hugh Manatee
@raven:
I’m sorry I’m so late in responding… company is over and I’m working at the same time = busy!
Maintaining altitude at this end (so far!). I hope you are doing well too. :)
Odie Hugh Manatee
@Patricia Kayden:
Yeah that, exactly. Anyone can see that the only time someone interviews someone on the left it’s only to make the Democrats look bad. It seems that the only public opinions they ‘value’ are those on the right.
Ruckus
@opiejeanne:
I figured someone might inform dingleberry that he lives in the pie shop. I wonder how soon he’d stop showing up if no one answered his dumb ass?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Brickley Paiste:
I said no such thing, do you need glasses?
Adam L Silverman
Perhaps a reporter would like to ask her to explain how she’s tied to, including paying money to, a pair of SuperPACs run by Cenk Uygur and several former high level Sanders’ campaign officials. SuperPACs that appear to do nothing but pay the campaigning/campaign services companies tied to these former Sanders’ campaign officials with the money they collect from candidates, rather than actually fund the progressive candidates they claim they want to see take over the Democratic Party. And how these companies don’t appear to actually be doing anything for these progressive candidates they claim they want to see take over the Democratic Party, rather they are paying salary and overhead and that’s about it. It would also be nice if they asked her why most of the professional section of her resume that isn’t about food service and being an intern for Senator Kennedy for a few months can’t be verified, why the most important socially progressive part of that resume – working at some sort of educational/tech incubator that appears to be a front and doesn’t actually doing anything, why her LinkedIn account was scrubbed, and why her original twitter account was first sanitized and then deleted.
Those would be appropriate questions to ask. Because it took me less than ten minutes of poking around using keyword searches in Google to come up with them based on both what I did find and what I didn’t find. Something smells very, very badly in
Brooklynin the Bronx and it isn’t just the hipsters.??? Goku (aka Amerikan Baka)Ā ??
@Brickley Paiste:
Bill never claimed AOC got coverage in 2014, you ass.
opiejeanne
@Ruckus: I usually have him pied but I was on my phone on the freeway when I posted that, and I have to add him to the pie filter there.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
Wouldn’t that be like actual journalism?
From what I understand and have observed that’s not really the job they have. The closest I’ve come up to the job they get paid for is fluffers, and that involves porn stars.
Mnemosyne
@Brickley Paiste:
Er, no. He was mocking your assertion that the media loved Hillary and brought up two specific years, neither of which were 2014. You misread both the year AND the name of the person he was referring to, and then you got pissy.
Put down the bong and get some sleep. You’re incoherent. You can’t even see that my pony is a pegasus.
Adam L Silverman
@opiejeanne: You can set the pie filter so that people can’t use the freeway anymore?
Sure, we can’t get the comments to work right, but we can ban people from using the interstate.//
Ruckus
@opiejeanne:
When on my phone I’ve been using firefox with BJ mobile site in a privacy tab, which stops all ads and I just skim by. But I only use the phone at work on break so I seldom see dingleberry.
Adam L Silverman
@Ruckus: It would be actual journalism. And they would be questions I’d like to see answered. Her connection to Uygur and his involvement is not a positive indicator.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
I’m agreeing here.
So the actual chance of anything positive happening is approaching zero.
I wonder how long a little sleuthing on the old net might find something interesting. Of course the problem is now it’s her or the republican, correct?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Adam L Silverman:
Nope.
opiejeanne
@?BillinGlendaleCA: He didn’t read your comment for content, just skimmed it or he wouldn’t have confused what you said about HRC with AOC and I no longer care to read anything he writes. He’s a jerk and pie is greater than commentary by jerks.
For my niece’s birthday party I made lemon meringue cupcakes. It was an experiment that turned out to be a success. White cake batter with a dollop of lemon curd on top, bake as usual, top with meringue. I bought a little kitchen blowtorch to toast the meringue and managed to not burn myself, so the whole enterprise was a success.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
I’d really like that pie filter/freeway thing here in the land of the all night traffic jam. And I rarely drive at night any more.
NotMax
@Adam L. Silverman
In Brooklyn, that’s the Gowanus Canal which smells bad.
:)
The district Ocasio-Cortez is running in covers northwestern Queens and a southern part of the Bronx.
opiejeanne
@Adam L Silverman: I wish I could do that. Sorry about the phrasing that left it wide open for a comment like this.
I need to set the pie filter on my iPhone to pie for certain people.
opiejeanne
@Ruckus: We need it on the 405 (yes, I’m from SoCal) in Bellevue. That stretch is almost always insane, and not for lack of lanes. Lots of lanes but there’s always a jam, both directions and sometimes still jammed late at night.
Saw a terrible accident just south of there tonight, I think 5 cars plus a semi, the cars all mangled, and 4 people standing in the lane. Took 4 lanes down to 1 and no cops were on site yet. Couldn’t tell how many cars for sure because the semi blocked my view. Thought he might not be part of the accident, just shielding them, until I saw the front of the cab. It must have just happened when we got there.
Ruckus
@opiejeanne:
So really it’s not the freeway itself it’s the name that’s a problem. Because the 405 in socal is a disaster as well.
Ruckus
@Adam L Silverman:
I just spent ten minutes looking and found basically the only negative thing was repubs or a reader of the LA Times that they posted. He has the same sort of concerns that you do.
It’s like she’s a vanity candidate, a younger version of BS.
opiejeanne
@Ruckus: I think all the 405s have an issue. There’s one at Portland, and it’s a disaster a lot of the time, as well as the 205 that makes the big loop around to the east. I’d rather drive on the I-5 most of the time.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Ruckus: Driving back from Amboy last Monday morning, we ran into traffic at 5-5:30am.
magurakurin
@Adam L Silverman:
this. AOC is a snake. I get a very bad vibe from her. People need to look more deeply and see that her real motivations are not to advance the Democratic party. She’s bad news and the sooner everyone stops swooning over her the better. If we need to find a new face for the party, I nominate Sharice Davids. Compare the eyes of the two. In AOC eyes I see no serenity or calm…only a chaotic mix of angst and rage. double plus ungood, I reckon.
Adam L Silverman
@Ruckus: I’m aware. No arguments here.
opiejeanne
@Ruckus: That’s my perception of her, and I have to ask how could the incumbent have been so stupid and negligent to neglect his campaign the way he did?
Then she took off with Wilmer to bash the NA woman candidate in Kansas. Talk about needing to stay in your own lane.
I almost think she could lose this election.
Groucho48
She espouses good positions. She is articulate and passionate. I don’t know the details of her political background, but, accepting help from folks who despise anyone to the right of them (virtually everyone) isn’t necessarily a bad thing if you follow through on what you campaigned on.
Yesterday, my google news homepage had a section about her banning the press from one town hall which was focused on immigrants, handicapped, drug dependent and other “outcast” types. When I expanded the section to full coverage it ran to over three pages, a record as far as I can recall. All of them, right wing and MSM, were very negative. Very few of them mentioned it was just for the one town hall. Most of them considered it he worst attack on the media ever.
Okay, maybe she is over-reaching by campaigning in distant districts, for other progressive candidates and, maybe, she is too beholden to Sanders, though, I don’t see a lot of evidence for that.
But, really, are her positions good positions? I say yes. Is she better than the complacent middle of the road guy she beat? Early to say, but, she is talking the talk. Whether she can walk the walk remains to be seen.
Will she be a dependable vote for progressive issues? Odds are she will be. I’m fine with that.
Adam L Silverman
@NotMax: I’ll fix it.
Adam L Silverman
@opiejeanne: I understood the original comment, I just decided I’d play it for a quick attempt at getting a laugh.
magurakurin
@Groucho48:
only when reading a prepared statement. She woefully unprepared to answer question off the cuff. Her best play right now would be to hunker down in her district and spend every free moment reading as many policy papers as she can find. But she won’t.
She is DSA. An actual socialist who wants to end capitalism. Read their charter information. We can argue about whether or not ending capitalism is a good thing or not. It may well be. But there is really little evidence to support that embracing “workers control the means of production” socialism is the sure fire ticket to electoral success in America at this moment in history. She’s not an ally of the Democratic party. She’s using the party to further her own goals. It’s right there on their website listed as one of their strategies.
Adam L Silverman
@magurakurin: I’m a big fan of Davids. And I still think, all things being equal, that we need to supporting, promoting, and voting for/electing qualified women and, especially women of color. And that doesn’t exclude young women and women of color who will grow into their responsibilities. The qualified here means they’re actually legit and on the up and up. Ocasio-Cortez may be just that, and she certainly seems to have the hustle, but we, and the voters in her district, really don’t know a lot about her. And that’s the difference between electing a Sharice Davids or a Amy McGrath or Stacy Abrams, to name just a few, versus the seemingly leftist versions of Palin, O’Donnell, Katrina Pierson (now working for the President’s reelection campaign), etc.
opiejeanne
@Adam L Silverman: Yeah, I know.
I’m writing a book and I’m finding that sometimes I need to spell things out very carefully because something I thought was obvious was not, that my character’s first wife had died and he’d married his dead wife’s recently widowed sister. A cousin read the paragraph that outlined the complicated family structure and thought I was saying he was a polygamist. I read it again, it was clear that he was not in fact a polygamist, but I rearranged the words slightly, added two words, and there’s no way anyone could think he was a polygamist. She just wasn’t paying attention and that was bad because it was part of the first chapter. Oh dear. Anyway, I’ve been tightening up the writing, deleting extra words that made sentences clunky, making sure I got the important words in, and it’s much better than what I started with.
But yeah, I’d like that pie filter to keep people off of the 405 when I’m driving through Bellevue. And Levi is not a polygamist.
magurakurin
@Adam L Silverman:
agree completely.
I’d be overjoyed to be wrong about AOC…hell, I hope I am…but I don’t think I am.
Adam L Silverman
@opiejeanne: So just your garden variety Levirite marriage then.
jl
@Adam L Silverman: I’m not into trying to judge neophyte politicians on their first campaign, whether Ocasio-Cortez or Davids. I’m also not into prolonging the HRC/BS feud by trying to sniff out everyone’s bloodlines and issuing personal bills of attainder. Ocasio-Cortez says Uygur and the Justice Democrat bunch spend a lot of time persuading her to run, so I am not surprised there is a strong connection, and hope there is no funny money involved.
When I’ve seen Davids in interviews, she is inspiring and foreceful, she makes her story and her goals for working people sound compelling. But on her website I found her position statements very thin and vague. She won the primary with it, and we’ll see whether she sharpens the choice between her and Yoder in the general, or uses the same strategy, and then we can all argue about whatever she did worked of didn’t afterwards.
I think economic issues,will be the most important issue in the next few election, other than having an incompetent crook as president. The current recovery, like the last one, is extremely weak by post WWII standards, and things still suck for most of the population. The standard for a ‘strong’ economy seems to be you have a decent chance to at least have a job, and you are not living like a cave person eating prehistoric roadkill, roots and berries. Ocasio-Cortez seems to have as much knowledge of economics as any other Democratic politician. She certainly less incompetent at economics than the media people interviewing her, and that is good enough for me.
Pulling rank as an economist, nearly all discussion of economics in media and in interviews is innumerate bullshit and horseshit. It is just that some bullshit and horseshit things to say are considered more acceptable than others, and that criterion determines whether someone’s statements get any scrutiny at all. So, on economics, I so far haven’t seen any basis for damning her knowledge of economics, since it has consisted of reporters, or news media divas who I know are full of bullshit deciding on bogus conventional wisdom grounds to criticize someone who may or may not be full of bullshit for not saying bogus bullshit that is officially accepted bullshit.
I want a variety of people to win, with a variety of viewpoints, and we’ll see who has the political chops to make good policy proposals and persuasive arguments for them to the public as time goes by. I think that is the only method that works reliably.
And given the crisis in our federal government, taking at least the House is all that matters right now. I don’t care much who they are, as long as they can avoid getting indicted and are Democrats. Get them all elected, and we will see who is good enough to hang around for more than 2 years.
Adam L Silverman
@magurakurin: I don’t know enough to say anything other than I have questions and/or concerns. I’m not eligible to vote in that district as I don’t live there, so at the end of the day it isn’t my immediate problem. And if she is elected she’s going to be one of 435 members of the House and as a member of the incoming group of freshman representatives, she’s going to have very, very little institutional power.
I’ve been considering doing a post on the Pelosi brouhaha and just haven’t gotten around to deciding if I will. What I will state here is that Pelosi and her leadership team, win or lose, need to each pick a number of mentees out of the younger members of their caucus. I like Pelosi a lot and she is unfairly maligned because she makes a nice conservative and/or GOP target: she’s a woman, she’s in a leadership position, and she’s effective at her job. And I like Clymer a lot too. Hoyer is Hoyer. But all of them are old. And the party is itself undergoing a generational shift among the electorate and the candidates. They each need to pick some of them and very publicly indicate they’re grooming them and that while you don’t get rid of your experienced, effective leaders in a crisis, you do begin preparing not just the next generation of House Democratic caucus leaders – many of whom are already clearly emerging as ranking members and senior members of their committees (and these folks need to be doing the same thing) – but the generation that will replace them as they move up the leadership ranks. And do it very, very publicly. Make it empowering. Communicate that you see and recognize the generational and demographic changes and you’re embracing it.
opiejeanne
@Adam L Silverman: Stahp! I’ve got enough Mormons in the fambly but not that side, they wuz Free Will Bapdists. Thank goodness they wasn’t Footwashin’ Bapdists. Those people are so rigid!
Adam L Silverman
@jl: I have few quibbles with this. And it’s late, or early depending on your point of view, where I am. And I wholeheartedly agree on the economics thing as one who had several courses in grad school and then had to go back and do a self directed refresher on macro and development economics for my work for the military before I deployed to Iraq.
So with that, I bid you and everyone else a good night or a good morning.
Groucho48
@magurakurin:
I don’t totally disagree with that, but, as she has a spotlight on her, campaigning for other folks of a similar persuasion could be helpful. Despite the horror the MSM has for an articulate, ethnic woman actively promoting others of a similar viewpoint.
I also agree that some of the earlier hype, portraying her as the savior of the Dem Party and a sign of the inevitable wave to come, were way over the top, but, that wasn’t coming from her.
Really, the bottom line will be if she votes consistently progressive. A quick google shows Crowley as the 87th most progressive Representative. and in the 41st percentile for NYS Representatives. Decent but not great. I think she will be a giant step up from that. Which is the important thing.
Procopius
@Brachiator: Jackals are not noted for bravery. In fact I believe they are an archetype of cowardice. They are scavengers, after all.
jl
@Groucho48: What concerns me is that the acceptable public discourse on economics has moved so far to the right, and so far in favor of whatever BS PR giant corporations and Wall Street pump out, that it makes Truman look like Trotsky, and Eisenhower look like the leader of the Socialist International.
And if you depart from that script, media frauds who seem to be aware of no history, no economics, no civics, no nothing immediately start mouthing bogus CW condemnations.
I do have concerns that Ocasio-Cortez is taking on too much wandering around the country for other campaigns. From what I’ve read, a big reason for her win was the Crowley was caught be surprise and phoned in a dismal campaign effort. She is the Dem candidate now, whether anyone likes it or not, and I hope she knows what she is doing. It is true that positions that would be considered sensible center-left decades ago are considered wild commie talk today, and it is very difficult to get media coverage even for that. So, I can see why Ocasio-Cortez is tempted to take the opportunities to get her ideas out.
I’m going to try to give money to them all. I’d like more attention to some very good candidates in California, like Josh Harder, Jessica Morse, Andrew Janz, Katie Hill, Henry Rouda, Ammar Campa-Najjar, Some of those are long-shots, particularly Campa-Najjar against the miserable Duncan Hunter, but they are all very impressive candidates.
Gretchen
@Adam L Silverman: Iām glad to hear youāre a big fan of Davids. I live in the district and I am too. A friend tonight was despairing that we can win this one. I said I see a lot of energy from her supporters. He sadly said he hoped so, but he didnāt believe it. We had a Democrat representative here for 10 years until he had to retire for health reasons. The current rep, Kevin Yoder, started as a moderate and has gone full wall/tax cut/Trump and refuses to hold town halls or meet non-donors. I think we have a chance.
Ruckus
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
The only reason one might think this is abnormal is that they don’t normally have their eyes open at that time.
I once left the VA ER room, at Wilshire and the 405 at 5:30-6:00am on a Saturday, and hit traffic, up the 405, and east on the 101/134. Nothing about LA traffic surprises me anymore. I’ve been driving here before the 405 was finished and I drove into the downtown LA area for 22 yrs. I’d already been commuting with my dad for 6 yrs before that. I once spent 4 hrs driving 33 miles and would have turned around and driven home rather than bother going to work, except that the freeways in all directions were stopped up. Would have taken me just as long to get back home. Every major interchange between all the freeways had a major multi lane accident. No one got anywhere that day.
Gretchen
@jl: Yes, I was very annoyed that AOC and Bernie came to my district and campaigned for the Bernie-bro, who was the weakest candidate and had policy views that didnāt extend beyond slogans. Iām all-in for Sharice Davids. Jl finds her policy positions weak and vague. Compared to the other candidates, I thought they are nuanced. Compared to the AOC candidate whose position was Medicare for All, sheās, that may be a reach, letās try steps towards that. Her opponent Yoder is lying about her, saying she wants to outlaw private insurance and throw millions off of that in her devotion to government control of insurance. Oh, and she wants to abolish ICE and have open borders and immigrants flooding in. Heās so scared of her he has to lie about everything she says
Groucho48
@jl:
She is in a D+29 district. If we can’t elect very liberal folks there, we might as well give up. I only know what I’ve seen in the media and from browsing the web. The MSM is almost completely against her. Reading her Wiki article, I don’t see much to disagree with. That she is a Bernie follower is a bit troubling, but, she does have liberal positions on a lot of the issues Bernie ignores.
And, most importantly, Joe Lieberman is against her. Clinches the deal for me.
Citizen Alan
@Brickley Paiste:
Kill yourself. Just slit your damned wrists and be done with it. It’s the only positive contribution you could make to this country.
Jay
Brickley Paste is a Russian Nazi,
The tell is in the nym
satby
@Jay: oh, explain please! I thought he was a troll too, but would like your elucidation of your conclusion.
Apocalipstick
@magurakurin: Are you a dentist?
cleosmom
@dmsilev: These are, of course, the same people who assured us that Donald Trump would grow into his job and we just needed to give him some time to do so.
As I recall, they quietly gave up on identifying the “moment when he became President” sometime before Ash Wednesday, 2017.
Apocalipstick
@opiejeanne: Free Will Baptists are foot washing Baptists.
cleosmom
@Brickley Paiste: They much prefer someone like Hillary Clinton whose positions move with the political winds so the reporter need not worry about interpreting her positions because they are reducible to polling data.
And not a single bird landed on her podium during a speech. BENGOLDMANBILLEMAILSSACHSMONICANOPENISGHAZI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
low-tech cyclist
@Apocalipstick:
True story, from maybe 30-35 years ago: I’m riding the bus or Metro in northern Virginia, and the two guys behind me, who don’t know each other, discover they’re both Christians. “What church do you go to?” asks one. “I’m a free-will Baptist,” the other one replies. “What’s a free-will Baptist?” asks the first. I turn around, reply, “it’s the opposite of a predestination Baptist,” and face forward again.
tobie
@jl: This thread is probably long since dead but I’ll take the risk and chime in on one point. There’s a misapprehension that Trump’s voters were/are union types–line workers in factories that used to be unionized and are no longer and who feel they’ve been left behind by the Democratic party because of its adherence to identity politics, high tech, finance, etc. No doubt Trump got some support from that group but that group is so small it could fit on a pinhead.
I live in a ruby red county and my impression is that Trump supporters are largely small business owners or mid-level administrative staff in larger companies, often in HR divisions, never in any technical/R&D wing. Their education varies from high school diploma to a BA, with a few having done online MBAs. Their small businesses are largely in the housing trade (plumbers, electricians, contractors, moving companies, trucking companies, etc.). They feel like the economy’s booming, the tax bill helps them as sole proprietors, and that it’s an enormous relief not to have to deal with pesky regulations. They’re convinced they never received a handout in their lives. No political platform that promotes universal responsibilities or universal protections will appeal to them in any way, shape, or form. They live in a 20th century bubble and at some point will be automated out of existence. Until then their well being is tied to the health of the economy. It crashes and they crash with it since they are not–in spite of their mythology about themselves–innovators, “job creators,” and “engines of the economy” but low-skilled service providers whose fortunes depend on the amount of disposable income Americans have in their pockets.
BellyCat
@strategery: Agreed. Excluding the press (no matter how dysfunctional and unfair it currently is) at a public event is not good when the right does it. Why is it good when the left does it?
Answer: Itās not!
Worse, it further decays trust in the press (on the left), which is EXACTLY what Drumpf seeks.
ICE is the concern? Focus on (fixing) that instead or hold a private meeting.
Kathleen
@Adam L Silverman: Thank you. I’ve read some of the same stories.
J R in WV
@NotMax:
The Press is astounded and hurt that someone would NOT think THEY, the PRESS are the public’s only authorized representatives. How could this be, they think? It cannot be!!!
Groucho48
How would you go about having a private town hall when you want to have a conversation with the whole community? If you invite specific people you are excluding other folks and other voices. Voices you might not be aware of.
If she excludes the media from all, or even a significant percentage of, her public appearances, then, yes, criticize that.