Exclusive: The special counsel has subpoenaed Trump Organization records, some related to Russia, bringing the inquiry closer to the president https://t.co/Gi9JexvR4O
— The New York Times (@nytimes) March 15, 2018
From The New York Times reporting:
WASHINGTON — The special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, has subpoenaed the Trump Organization to turn over documents, including some related to Russia, according to two people briefed on the matter. The order is the first known time that the special counsel demanded documents directly related to President Trump’s businesses, bringing the investigation closer to the president.
The breadth of the subpoena was not clear, nor was it clear why Mr. Mueller issued it instead of simply asking for the documents from the company, an umbrella organization that oversees Mr. Trump’s business ventures. In the subpoena, delivered in recent weeks, Mr. Mueller ordered the Trump Organization to hand over all documents related to Russia and other topics he is investigating, the people said.
The subpoena is the latest indication that the investigation, which Mr. Trump’s lawyers once regularly assured him would be completed by now, will drag on for at least several more months. Word of the subpoena comes as Mr. Mueller appears to be broadening his investigation to examine the role foreign money may have played in funding Mr. Trump’s political activities. In recent weeks, Mr. Mueller’s investigators have questioned witnesses, including an adviser to the United Arab Emirates, about the flow of Emirati money into the United States.
Neither White House officials nor Alan S. Futerfas, a lawyer representing the Trump Organization, immediately responded to requests for comment. The Trump Organization has typically complied with requests from congressional investigators for documents for their own inquiries into Russian election interference, and there was no indication the company planned to fight Mr. Mueller about it.
Much more at the link, but the real outstanding question is why use the subpoena rather than the normal investigator to corporate legal counsel request letter or letters. The reason for the Special Counsel’s decision to go this route is unclear and/or unknown at this time.
Stay frosty!
Open thread!
EBT
Fuck yeah.
Betty Cracker
I could be wrong, but I thought there was reporting recently that Mueller had ASKED the Trump Org for documents. Now they’ve issued a subpoena. Hmmm. I’ll see if I can find that reporting I saw earlier…
Jim, Foolish Literalist
anybody live near the Justice Department HQ? Let us know if you see a Bekins truck backing up to the door
Adam L Silverman
@Betty Cracker: Hey, I finally got that research intern I’ve been asking about!//
Mary G
Mueller is playing hardball to win. This may be why Twitler’s so eager to fire Andy McCabe. Revenge must be taken. Now the gloves will come off and the bareknuckled brawl will commence, because this was the red line the investigation must not cross.
Major Major Major Major
Yay!
Uh, it’s actually quite clear ?
Corner Stone
Rule #1 of BJ jackal commenting must be adhered to! What is the worst possible take we can infer from this news?
But her emails!!!
Umm. Because Panama?
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Adam L Silverman: is this for the Ninja Otter Project that isn’t happening and that you have nothing to do with?
(This Chris Whipple guy never misses a chance to plug his book on WH CoS’s on the TeeVee)
kindness
Don’t you think Mueller went the subpoena route because that makes 1) a better statement of intent and 2) warns the subject everything is on the record because Donnie Two Scoops probably thinks he can shoot someone on 5th Avenue and get away with it.
MP
Well, this sounds like it happened around the same time someone in the know stated that Mueller was not an unguided missile.
SFAW
Yarrow? YARROW!!!!!
Your services are needed on this thread, STAT!
Corner Stone
@Major Major Major Major: IMO, he asked got stonewalled. Mueller then showed enough evidence to a judge so now Trump is fucked.
BGinCHI
I’m guessing they used the subpoena because they don’t trust Trump’s team to respond honestly or thoroughly. Plus this puts it in the public record.
Also, the Trump team is corrupt and dishonest.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
Well, here we go. Strap in.
mai naem mobile
Can i add the obligatory ick tock motherfuckers? I cannot wait for this Orange Monster Asshole to go down in exploding flames.
Baud
Good thing Trump has walled himself off from his organization.
Timurid
TICK. TOCK.
Corner Stone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: You mean his updated paperback version that is out now?
mapaghimagsik
Doesn’t it make is slightly harder for Trump to fire Mueller? It might be legal, but it sure would look worse.
And yes.
Tick.
Motherfucking.
Tock.
Hmm testing.
casino.
viagra
cialis
BWAHAHAHAHA
Major Major Major Major
@Corner Stone: or he wanted to take them by surprise for some reason. But it seems pretty clear to me that he did it because he doesn’t trust them.
Baud
@Major Major Major Major:
So he has at least one working neuron.
Corner Stone
Looks like Adam is needed at his alma mater FIU STAT.
Pedestrian bridge collapse with possibly multiple cars caught underneath. Looks awful.
Manyakitty
@Betty Cracker: That’s what I thought, too. Subpoena issued in response to stonewalling the request.
mapaghimagsik
Okay, last comment got labeled as spam because I tested edits. How eeemtneresting.
Okay. So does the subpoena make firing Mueller just a little harder?
And yes.
Tick.
Motherfucking.
Tock
JGabriel
Countdown to Trump firing Rod Rosenstein and Mueller in 5 … 4 … 3 … 2 …
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Listening to the Slate podcast on Watergate (which I highly recommend) it was the Saturday Night Massacre that finally got people mad about Watergate. I’ll defer to people who remember first hand or who have read more.
I knew a little about WG, but damn I had no idea how much of a story Martha Mitchell was.
schrodingers_cat
OT good news from India.
The ruling BJP lost two Loksabha by-elections (special elections) decisively in Uttar Pradesh, the politically important state in the Hindi heartland.
different-church-lady
I know Meuller’s reputation for being thorough, but it really feels like he’s calculating it so that it stretches and lingers and intensifies ever so sloooooooooooowly… like torturing someone on the rack.
LAO
@BGinCHI: Another reason for using a subpoena relates to the (eventual) admissibility of the records at a trial.
schrodingers_cat
@Corner Stone: Oh noes, did Russkies penetrate Florida too?
LAO
@JGabriel: By the end of business today, I expect.
Major Major Major Major
@Baud:
Well, it’s crucial that you be smarter than the person you’re investigating.
Frankensteinbeck
I think he wants to be ready with marshals to make arrests when they start destroying those documents, which they will do because they’re ignorant dipshits.
HeleninEire
It’s the beginning of the end.
Adam L Silverman
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: It’s Whipple’s raison d’etre!
randy khan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
For those of us who lived through Watergate, Martha Mitchell was utterly fascinating. The general speculation at the time was that she drank too much, but nobody minded.
Frankensteinbeck
@JGabriel:
1.9, 1.8, 1.79, 1.78, 1.77, 1.68, 1.67993…
EBT
Per NBC news a new bridge at FIU has just collapsed with “mass casualties” reported.
https://twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/974349352410996736
piratedan
well this is obviously a last ditch desperate attempt to try and find something, anything with which to smear this administration. After months of exhaustive, irritatingly invasive assaults on our President’s personal affairs, now we have to endure this “fishing expedition” as well. After all, we’ve only had 5 guilty pleas over the last 14 months of people of little or no consequence who only served on the periphery of this administration and while they may be outliers of a sort, they in no way reflect upon the integrity and earnestness of this administration and their desire to serve Vladimir Putin.
randy khan
The reason for the subpoena has to be either message sending or that a nicer request was met with stonewalling. (I don’t think there’s any reason why voluntarily provided records couldn’t be used as evidence so long as you could establish that they were authentic.)
GregB
That pedestrian bridge was reportedly just put in place on Saturday.
Some construction companies and engineers are going to be in some real deep shit.
rumpole
Reason for a subpoena is that failing to produce documents in the absence of privilege (e.g., atty-client) is a crime. The government doesn’t generally do that with people or organizations that it trusts to be straight with them. (Note-subpoena is not the same as a warrant-you don’t need a judge to issue it–only an empaneled grand jury).
Bill Kristol’s been spreading rumors that Beauregard’s about to get fired and Pruitt’s going to take his place. At which point, the wholesale resignations will (or had better) begin. If that’s true, buckle up. Terra incognita.
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: As if that is not going to make T look as guilty as hell. Lamb’s victory shows that many are not buying the T spin.
Adam L Silverman
@Corner Stone: Holy crap! That looks terrible. None of that stuff was there when I was a grad student at FIU. Those are all new dorms and apartments for the students.
Frankensteinbeck
@schrodingers_cat:
Heh. My joke is that this countdown has been going on an awfully long time, and never seems to reach 0.
rk
@Mary G:
Trump cannot fight. He’s an idiot, will send angry tweets, lash out, do something stupid and will be ultimately defeated. He use to be able to intimidate little people with his threats of litigation and he got by with using third rate lawyers. Now he’s dealing with people who are way above the level of his two penny hack lawyers. He has no skill set to handle the situation. Only thing he knows is how to be a loud mouth bum. Funny thing is that he would have totally got away with everything had he even been a little bit smart. Republicans in congress and senate and the media were willing and desperate to cater to him and his moron voters. Every time he showed five minutes of sanity they were ready to call him “presidential” and bow down. All he needed to do was to show a bare minimum of self control. But he’s incapable. Incapable of a single coherent thought, let alone strategy.
randy khan
@EBT:
From what I can tell, the bridge was still under construction, but it also sounds like it landed on top of at least a few cars. So not as bad as it could have been, but still pretty bad.
Anonymous At Work
As my grandmother would say, “Shit just got real, yo”
Adam L Silverman
@schrodingers_cat: This was in South Florida where they still Elmer’s glue roofs on houses despite Hurricane Andrew. Most likely defective building materials and/or construction.
schrodingers_cat
@Frankensteinbeck: I was agreeing with you, with my comment. Firing Comey is what got us Mueller.
JPL
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: That was when the republican party had honorable people. Today’s party would say that it’s not helpful, and Paul Ryan would say the Nunes committee found no collusion.
LAO
@different-church-lady: His reputation is definitely well deserved, but IMO, Mueller is moving a lightspeed.
ETA: at lightspeed.
TenguPhule
I’m going to take a wild guess and say that it looks like Mueller doesn’t expect them to be cooperative with his requests.
Silk hiding steel.
Yarrow
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA! Tick tock, motherfuckers.
SFAW
@Frankensteinbeck:
Some guy named “Zeno of Elea” said he wants to have a chat with you.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@LAO: Warp speed light speed in fact. We probably have a slightly different perspective given our experience of how long these things can take – I think it’s easy for people not to appreciate how quickly this is going.
Yarrow
@schrodingers_cat: I know you’re joking but south Florida is a money-laundering machine for Russians.
TenguPhule
@piratedan: You’ve just distilled the essence of every fucking conservative commentor on every fucking newspaper in the country.
SmokeyB
How likely is it (in your opinion) that Mueller’s report makes it past Rosenstein? (If he hasn’t been replaced as well).
zhena gogolia
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
It’s gonna be a bumpy night!
Bette’s line has been carrying a lot of weight lately . . . .
TenguPhule
@HeleninEire: No, it is the end of the beginning.
SFAW
@JPL:
He’d also say that Devin “Fellow Traveler” Nunes and Lying Littledick “are learning.”
schrodingers_cat
@SFAW: That infinite series does converge, though.
Mandalay
@rumpole:
In the unlikely event that Kristol is actually correct, wouldn’t that be a highly plausible motivation to get the subpoena on the record first? It would seem to make firing Sessions even more difficult for Trump.
No Drought No More
Why the subpoena instead of a pretty please? I assume that people who might otherwise shred documents would think long and hard before defying a subpoena from Mueller Inc.
By the way: is Mueller’s investigation currently on that 60 day clock? I refer to the proposal made by Trump’s attorney’s last week as a being reasonable compromise on the president’s*(*) behalf. Because if it is, Mueller probably made a mistake in agreeing to the deal, and he should think again..
Age does have its rewards. I fondly recollect The Trickster’s plaintive wailing to the peanut gallery for Johnny Law to cease and desist as the noose tightened around his neck, too.
**(“*” TM C.P. esq)
Mary G
@rk: I wasn’t thinking so much of Trump as of the whole Republican establishment. Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, Lindsay Graham seem awfully eager to make the subject of Russia go away. I think it’s because following the money will lead to their door.
TenguPhule
@Corner Stone:
Evidence destruction in progress.
Adam L Silverman
@randy khan: @rumpole:
lamh36
Good Lord…a pedestrian bridge in Miami collapsed and there are people in cars under it!!! Several injuries reported!!
ETA: fatalities not injuries…several fatalities!!
https://twitter.com/cnn/status/974350770995892224?s=21
Frankensteinbeck
@Mary G:
I’ve heard that a million times. As far as Trump’s feelings are concerned, they crossed that line when the investigation started. He’s no more motivated today than he was yesterday to fire Mueller or stop this. Something is stopping him. Until it gets out of the way, no provocation will be enough because Trump is already at 100%. We just don’t know what that thing stopping him is, why it has stayed in place so long, or what would remove it. My guess remains ‘Sessions was the first to sell out to Mueller, and is protecting the investigation to protect himself.’
jonas
No idea if this is relevant, but IIRC, the Russian lawyer and accompanying goons who arranged the Trump Tower meeting with Don Jr. in 2016 were offering information they claimed would show that Hillary Clinton (or the Clinton Foundation or the DNC perhaps) had received illegal/shady money from Russian sources. Don Jr. leaped at the idea, as we know, but evidently — as far as we know — no such information was ever actually produced. I wonder, though, if the reason that Trump people would be especially interested in this kind of info is because it provided an opportunity to defend themselves against the same accusation…should it ever come up. (“If we can show that Hillary is just as compromised by Russia as we are, then it’s off the table as a campaign issue”)
TenguPhule
@No Drought No More:
I see the fatal flaw in this assumption.
Thinking is not these fellows strong suit.
Chyron HR
This is just a big fat perjury trap. Muller’s trying to trick Trump into not releasing documents that someone else already gave him copies of. Trump shouldn’t comply at all.
Source: I went to Upper Middlestate Law College Place.
Major Major Major Major
@Frankensteinbeck: i also thought it might have to do with that.
Washburn
@Corner Stone:
I thought Mueller, like US Attys, had subpoena power???
Does the special counsel have to get subpoenas court approved?
JPL
@LAO: Interesting.
schrodingers_cat
@Yarrow: Not surprising, now that I think of it.
Mandalay
@TenguPhule: You just got whooshed.
Yarrow
@Mary G: You are exactly correct. All of the top GOP leadership are traitors. They knew about the money-laundering and did nothing. There’s a reason Paul Ryan shut down McCarthy and tried to keep the conversation “in the family” and it isn’t because he loves his Republican “family” so much.
TenguPhule
@Frankensteinbeck:
Fairly certain he has never exerted himself beyond 47%. 31% on average.
Low energy. Sad.
TenguPhule
@Mandalay: That was an observation, not a criticism.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Which reminds me, twitter can be good
Yarrow
@schrodingers_cat: There is a Trump building in south Florida that is owned almost exclusively by Russians.
HeleninEire
@Major Major Major Major: Yes. Yes it is.
schrodingers_cat
@TenguPhule: Actually that would statement would apply to Judy Woodruff of the Snooze Hour too. She is always minimizing R culpability on the Snooze fest.
SiubhanDuinne
@Corner Stone:
The pictures are horrifying. Bridge hadn’t even opened to the public yet.
TenguPhule
@Chyron HR:
Can we please stop using the GOP bastardization of the term? Words are supposed to mean something.
jonas
@Frankensteinbeck: Trump hates the Russia/Mueller investigation for two reasons. The first, most obviously, is that he’s scared shitless that evidence of financial crimes, tax evasion, etc. will come to light. But even before Mueller started sniffing around his business dealings, Trump was furious that all this attention to Russian meddling delegitimizes his yoooge election victory.
Also, it was probably not a good idea to say out loud “Mueller had BETTER NOT start snooping around my business affairs!”
TenguPhule
@rk:
But he’s an incapable idiot with far too many buttons available for him to push.
And lots of people close to him who are desperate enough to goad him into pushing them.
Jack the Second
So here I think is the GOP problem.
They (modulo Dana) didn’t know they were being funded by the Russians.
There was something about the NRA being the primary laundering service between illegal Russian money and Trump. But the NRA doesn’t just funnel money to Trump. I’m willing to bet every elected GOP member, at the Federal level and half the state houses, relies on NRA support.
Now they find out a good chunk of that money is Russian.
Do they:
1. Decry it publicly and vow to return the money.
2. Just accept that the NRA’s help will be going away once this is public and they’ll have to get by on their own charisma.
3. Own up to being compromised by a hostile foreign government.
4. Try to shut that whole thing down.
I mean, from the Russian end this is spycraft 101. The best way to turn someone is first to trick them into compromising themselves without knowing it, then using that handhold to pull them in deeper.
Annie
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I was in college during Watergate and remember it pretty well and at the time Martha Mitchell was regarded as rather silly, but not someone who actually knew anything.
IIRC it really began to light up when it was discovered that one of the tapes that Nixon’s secretary had supposedly been transcribing had an 18-minute gap.
Interesting side note: the public library in Jacksonville, Florida, where I lived at the time, placed every single book about the Nixon Administration in the true Crime section. Even those that dealt with topics other than Watergate.
Adam L Silverman
@SmokeyB: I don’t think Rosenstein or Mueller are going anywhere any time soon. The GOP controlled Senate, specifically Senator Grassley, has made it very clear that he will not make committee time to schedule hearings for a replacement for AG Sessions. McGhan has leaked like a sieve to keep the President from firing Sessions. Is it possible that the President will do so in a fit of pique? Sure. Is it probable? Perhaps. I have no way to handicap that probability and neither does anyone else. The DOJ and FBI are already on a knife’s edge in terms of being alienated from the President and the AG. The reported shenanigans regarding Deputy Director McCabe this week only cement that reality. Unless they completely blow up the HR process at DOJ/FBI, which is set by Federal regulations rooted in Federal law, there is no way to fire McCabe before he retires. There is simply not enough time between now and Sunday to do this in a legal way. Firing the AG, which will be perceived as looking to further screw with the DOJ and FBI and their work, will only make things worse. Mueller is beloved in the FBI from his time as director, as well as at DOJ from his time as a prosecutor. All out war with the DOJ and the FBI is not the way to go.
Mandalay
@TenguPhule: You obviously missed the bit at the end: “their desire to serve Vladimir Putin”. That is hardly “the essence of every fucking conservative commentor on every fucking newspaper”.
JPL
They installed the bridge over the weekend.
different-church-lady
@TenguPhule: Now small enough to drown in a bathtub!
lamh36
@lamh36: 5-6 vehicles crushed under bridge
TenguPhule
@Mandalay: No, they’re actually starting to go there. “We can do great things together with Russia!”
HeleninEire
@randy khan: Yeah. The general speculation about me is that I drink too much. But nobody cares. Least of all me.! ;)
TenguPhule
@Adam L Silverman:
So he’s gone by Monday.
Adam L Silverman
@jonas: The Russian lawyer works for the Russian government and is a not for cover Russian intelligence asset. The “translator” they brought (Kavalazde) is a former Russian intelligence officer. The younger Agalarov was there and his dad is Putin’s builder and the President’s Russian business partner. And Goldstone was there. He is the younger Agalarov’s promoter.
SiubhanDuinne
I think we’re going to starting hearing a lot more about Eric Trump.
TenguPhule
@different-church-lady: Well played.
different-church-lady
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
…and Trump resigns before the calendar year is out.
Go ahead, Donnie: tempt history to repeat itself.
Frankensteinbeck
@Adam L Silverman:
Yep. We know he hasn’t in the face of considerable provocation. We can only guess at why, so we can only guess as to whether things will stay this way. Still, whatever it is, I don’t think it will be ‘Now Trump really wants Mueller gone!’
Chyron HR
@TenguPhule:
It’s a big fat perjury a-go-go?
Adam L Silverman
@Washburn: He’s doing everything through one or both of the Federal grand juries he’s working with.
EBT
@GregB:
Trying an experimental new method too.
TenguPhule
@Chyron HR: I suppose I can live with that.
Adam L Silverman
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Except he’s already been contradicted on Shulkin. The Congressional GOP, as well as most of the veteran’s groups have circled the wagons for Shulkin.
https://www.politico.com/story/2018/03/14/trump-administration-dials-back-shulkin-firing-rumors-va-416442?lo=ap_a1
Aleta
Not sure why you say the decision to subpoena this information is unclear or unknown? Mueller seems to consistently follow the (usual) pattern of requesting information first, then delivering a subpoena if they don’t comply, and I believe the request was reported a while ago. The administration lawyers drag out their responses as much as they can. Perhaps stalling is their best or almost only strategy.
I see BC is already checking on this. (Maybe she should receive that intern. : ) )
EBT
@randy khan: Just opened for use on the 10th.
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/first-of-its-kind-pedestrian-bridge-swings-into-place-300611973.html
SmokeyB
@Adam L Silverman: Mahalo Adam
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@SiubhanDuinne: Wait till somebody tells Vanessa she can keep the jewelry and any joint accounts if she cooperates
ETA:@Adam L Silverman: I’m just happy to see somebody mock Bill Kristol, as content as I am to have him as a co-belligerent for the moment
LAO
O/T: If you are in need of a laugh, here is (IMO) the greatest twitter thread ever:
MomSense
I’d love to know what all is included in the definition of documents. There are some servers that might be of interest.
Adam L Silverman
@TenguPhule:
raven
@JPL: I have a good friend who teaches there.
patrick II
If the Trump team does not answer the subpoena promptly, will we see any doors knocked down?
raven
@EBT:
Adam L Silverman
@jonas:
AG Schneiderman has already been prepped on this stuff and is waiting to go if necessary. If necessary means if Mueller is fired or Federal pardons are preemptively issued.
SiubhanDuinne
@Annie:
I love those librarians!
LAO
@MomSense: We should have great faith that Mueller and his team (1) knows what to subpoena and (2) covers all of the bases. In a run of the mill investigation, I shudder when a client receives an federal subpoena.
Baud
@Adam L Silverman: Yep. The whole Trump org will be taken down if Donald steps out of line.
Frankensteinbeck
@MomSense:
It includes a sixty page journal of women’s names, and next to each one Trump wrote ‘I totally did sex with her.’ Amelia Earheart, Annie Oakley, and Cleopatra are listed.
rikyrah
on and poppin!!!
SiubhanDuinne
@raven:
Yeah, back when Florida was still part of our territory, I used to work with some FIU faculty on Canadian Studies.
trollhattan
Florida bridge incident is horrid. How does a design-build go that wrong in 2018? I can’t even.
Those poor people. At least there’s heavy equipment already on site. (Lemons, lemonade, etc.)
clay
@SFAW: Does he have a pair of docks to sell?
TenguPhule
Via Wapo
Can I pass the hat for the world’s smallest violin?
Adam L Silverman
@TenguPhule: His retirement takes effect Sunday AM. So he’s definitely gone by Monday. That said, he should be safe. The legal jeopardy that the AG would accrue in the lawsuit over this from McCabe will be brutal. Specifically, discovery will be brutal. Especially given the President’s tweets about both McCabe and Sessions. And I’m sure FBI Director Wray has made it clear to the AG that if he does this, he might as well never expect anyone in the FBI to do anything for him. Ever.
SiubhanDuinne
@patrick II:
Do Ceiling Cat, the FSM, and Baby Jeebus combined love us that much? Ohplz ohplz ohplz ohplz ohplz….
Baud
@TenguPhule: The foodies are part of the Resistance!
rumpole
@Mandalay: That makes a lot of sense. Given how this investigation has generally worked up from the bottom, there might well be evidence -already- implicating the trump organization. (In other words, the FBI might well already have some of the docs that were sent -to- particular people, and now wants to see what else is in the file cabinets.).
Adam L Silverman
@SmokeyB: You’re welcome.
Mary G
The bridge that collapsed in Florida was the first of its kind. From the university’s press release:
Washburn
@Adam L Silverman:
I know he has used grand jury for these purposes before, but I was just wondering if he had direct subpoena power.
Brachiator
Well, it’s been a wild week. This just adds to the fun.
I got no predictions or speculations. Just sitting back and watching the developments.
Baud
@Mary G: Yikes. We’re getting to Tacoma Narrows territory here.
Feebog
I think Bill Kristol may be right. Trump is certainly seriously contemplating firing Sessions and appointing Pruitt as acting AG. But instead of immediately firing Mueller they may try to constrain the investigation. At this point anything is possible.
Adam L Silverman
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: There was a rumor about two months back that she was worried that Jr had been having an affair. Can’t find the reporting or remember who it was, but it was a story for a day or two.
different-church-lady
@Mary G:
Oops.
JohnO
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:
I’m curious about this because it is my assumption that since the Soviet Union collapsed and Russia more or less turned into an oligarchic free-for-all, which made so much of their money dirty, which The Boy King and Co. has been up to his ears in for…10 years? more?…and all the complexities of all those transactions over all that time make unwinding it all in any “reasonable” (before the midterms?) time frame difficult if not impossible if you’re looking at “beyond a reasonable doubt.”
IANAL, but I have some familiarity with trying to wade through the bureaucratic details of decades (allegedly!) of financial and legal shenanigans. How many people does RM have working for him directly?
I also have the sense now that Mueller is perhaps a little bit more sophisticated from a politics POV than I would’ve guess months ago. I think he’s trying to get around the pardon conundrum.
TenguPhule
Via Wapo.
SMH. That gene pool obviously contaminated.
TenguPhule
@Feebog:
Get ahold of yourself! Are you feeling okay?! Think about what you just said!!
NCSteve
There are just the three possible reasons he would issue a subpoena:
a) He asked for them and they’re stonewalling.
b) He’s afraid they are destroying or will destroy them.
c) He’s asked for them, they’re stonewalling and he’s afraid they are destroying or will destroy them.
I’m gussing a) because if it was b) or c), he wouldn’t be subpoening them, he’d have gotten a search warrant.
JMG
The twitter person NYCSouthpaw, who is an attorney, has posted that use of a subpoena instead of a request is not rare, and it is used to protect those subpoenaed from NDA agreements about transactions, which are not binding in case of subpoena.
different-church-lady
@JohnO: A guy who spent his life investigating people vs. a guy who spent his life sticking his dick in as many porn stars as he could buy. You know who the safe money is on in that one.
Formerly disgruntled in Oregon
@TenguPhule: Okay, smart guy…
Baud
@JMG: Good point.
Uncle Cosmo
? Martin
Interesting. Its a prefab bridge segment that was installed Saturday. Usually, those are quite structurally reliable (looks like a nice design overall). But it looks like it may have slipped off one of the piers based on how one end is still attached to a pier and there is no apparent debris left on the other pier. I wonder if they were still in the process of securing it or something like that.
A lot of structural failures occur at the interface between contractors. This looks like it might fall in that category. I hope that project is much larger than it appears because it shouldn’t take anywhere near a year to get a prefab bridge put up.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@JMG: Don’t know why
Got subpoenas on my mind
Stormy Daniels….
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@LAO: That was awesome sauce. Like Scalzi level surreal. Thanks!
No, I have no assigned matters, nor any pending and I’ve completed CLE for this reporting period, yet I have to be in the office because reasons. Why do you ask?
SiubhanDuinne
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
I’ve been thinking, not without satisfaction, about the kind of stress Don Jr. must be experiencing right now, what with massive legal and marital problems.
But I was actually talking about his brother Eric. We really haven’t heard that much about him, but he is co-director of the Trump Organization (with junior) and he strikes me as someone with a lot of back-alley cunning. And there was all that stuff recently about vast sums of money moving from the Eric Trump Foundation (to help sick children at Saint Jude’s, FFS!) to the Trump Organization. It’ll be very interesting to watch Mueller pick all that apart.
T
T
M
F
Betty Cracker
@Jack the Second: That theory makes a lot of sense. Like you said, the NRA funded lots of Republicans, so most of them are compromised to some degree or another. It would also not surprise me if the Russians used other lobbying organizations / wingnut affinity groups in addition to the NRA as conduits. The Mercers, perhaps, who knowingly bankrolled outreach to Nazis on Breitbart’s behalf, so it’s not like they’d shrink from funneling cash from Russian oligarchs.
Timurid
Ides Mubarak, everyone!
Matt McIrvin
A bunch of Russian pro-Hillary bots uncovered. Seeing Bernie people being very smug and “Hillary is the real puppet” about this.
TenguPhule
@different-church-lady:
Unfortunately none of our money is safe these days.
Fucking Trade Wars.
Mandalay
@NCSteve:
Well I can think of a couple more:
– He already has all the documents he’s asking them to hand over, and wants to see what they actually provide.
– He wants that subpoena on the record ASAP.
Yarrow
@Adam L Silverman: The divorce could be a way of sheltering assets.
? Martin
@JMG:
Right. That’s why the Buzzfeed situation is so interesting. Cohen is suing Buzzfeed for libel against the President due to the publication of the Steele dossier. Cohen also has the NDA against Stormy Daniels. Buzzfeed has now subpoenaed Stormy to preserve any documents related to her affair with Trump presumably to rebut the libel suit. That subpoena gets her out of the NDA, and she can choose to publicly release any subpoenaed information. If it works, it’s quite clever.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Interesting. I’ve agreed with the conventional wisdom that both Large Adult Sons were Fredo. That kind of playing dumb has a movie/TV reference, doesn’t it? I, Claudius? I can think of another example but don’t want to spoil a twenty-plus year old movie
ETA: And I just wanted to get the Fredo/Vanessa news back online out of sheer spite and Schadenfreude. Eric’s wife thinks apparently thinks she can supplant Ivanka. Silly creature.
Yarrow
@Betty Cracker: Evangelical churches and organizations have also been laundering Russian money.
TenguPhule
If it turns out that Trump org has a private email server that they don’t turn over in this subpoena I may hit peak schadenfreude.
Aleta
@JMG: Thanks. And to LAO and the others.
germy
Done and done, libs.
Brad the Impala
@SiubhanDuinne:
This Eric Trump? http://icelandreview.com/news/2016/07/27/icelander-says-donald-trumps-son-trashed-his-apartment
Yarrow
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Lara Trump has her own ties to questionable activities.
schrodingers_cat
@different-church-lady: तुम्हारे मुंहमें घी शक्कर.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@JohnO: Mueller is extremely sophisticated politically and has about half a metric sit -ton of extremely skilled and specialized prosecutors working for him. Specifically, folks who have been prosecutors, which is kind of a niche area in law.(Full disclosure: been there). But your extremely talented M&A killer legal ace would be totally out of her element with these folks.
Plus, Mueller’s more publicized cases include Enron, the Gambino and (I think) Genovese families. So this is a formidable team on this investigation.
EBT
@raven: I see where I got my error from. The segment that fell had just been put in it’s final place, and I took that to mean bridge done.
Betty Cracker
@Yarrow: Can’t say I’m shocked by that. Most of them were crooks all along.
No One of Consequence
@? Martin: By the Holy Marinara Sauce! DiaphukingBOLICAL! OhpleaseOHpleaseOHpleaseOHplease…
By any legal means necessary. I think we can all agree on that. Sooner or later, people will realize the danger we have placed ourselves in, and seek to extricate our collective glutiuses (gluti..II?) ((a bumble of gluti…)) from yon handbasket…
– NOoC
Jay S
@Yarrow:
That would be an interesting way to extract a tithe. Is there a supporting link for that assertion?
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@? Martin: the Buzzfeed Manuveur.
Patricia Kayden
@Baud: Lol!! You mean walled himself in. So sad!!
LAO
@JohnO: @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: Here’s a list of (most of) Mueller’s team from wikipedia. My money is on them:
PS — I’ve personally dealt with 3 members of the team and they are all “grade A assholes” — which in this case, is a positive.
Chip Daniels
This could be some epic brawl, a Constitutional crisis between the Executive and Judicial branches.
Or, following Trump’s Razor, (the stupidist possible explanation), Trump Organization may just send them the electronic files with the names of all the folders marked “DO NOT OPEN THIS FOLDER!!!” and bask in the adulation of the Gateway Pundit commenters for being so clever.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
The latest bestselling thriller from the Estate of Robert Ludlum! On sale wherever fine paperbacks are sold
MoxieM
Wow that photo of Mueller makes him look haggard. Can’t imagine why–something about the actual weight of the world on his shoulders, expectations and so on.
Mandalay
@LAO:
Interesting! Assholes in what respect? Humorless? Hostile? Rude? Condescending? Dismissive?…
JohnO
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho:
Thank you!
For me there’s a critical race on right now between catastrophic Trumpian and Co. stupidity (I put WWIII odds around 25% now and have baked in a Depression to my financial future in my 20-30 remaining years) and Mueller’s progress, sense of urgency, staffing, and the unbelievable amount of corruption and malfeasance I suspect is there for the proving if there is time and resources.
It’s all very unsettling.
Corner Stone
@different-church-lady:
The porn star?
LAO
@Mandalay: Very professional, by-the-book, humorless, uptight and quite certain that they were “on the side of angels.” In other words, exactly what we want in this prosecution team
Gex
@Yarrow: Is that your conclusion or have you read about that somewhere? Brief Google didn’t turn anything up, but I’m very interested in this point.
catclub
@TenguPhule: The Trump org has every expectation of using a private email server, it is a private corporation.
The GWBush admin had public employees emails go through a private server at the RNC – then they ‘lost’ all those emails. Bygones!
When we find out that Trump admin employees (Jared Kushner, DJTrump) used that private server for their official email,
then we will have the repeat, not as farce.
Baud
@LAO: So no Juicers in the bunch. Pity.
randy khan
@EBT:
Actually, not opened. From the same press release:
That press release – with the glowing description of how they used a new construction technique developed at FIU – reads a lot differently now than it did last Saturday.
LAO
@Baud: Are we ever really on “the side of Angels”?
SiubhanDuinne
@Yarrow:
Ooooh, like what f’rinstance? I know her brother was given a job in one of the agencies — something in Energy? — but given the breadth and variety of Trumpian grift, this seems nugatory.
OGLiberal
@Mary G: I went to Hofstra on Long Island and we had the Unispan:
https://static1.squarespace.com/static/59973af5f14aa1ab06cba333/t/5a876dbce4966ba44fa8d2e9/1518824931765/IMG_3417.JPG?format=750w
Built in ’67 so didn’t use this ABC technology. Terrible, horrible news. Best it didn’t happen while operational with kids walking back and forth across it but doesn’t make it any less horrible.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@LAO: IOW, regular AUSAs.? This is exactly the kind of folks we want doing this. This team seems heavy on experience in some, ah, specialized areas that could be important in this specific case.
catclub
@Timurid: For the Ides of March, both cats decided to poop outside the box. Amusing.
Beware the cat poop of the Ides of March!
Baud
@LAO: Only the fallen ones.
lumpkin
@Frankensteinbeck:
Zeno’s countdown to Muellers termination.
catclub
@randy khan:
ouch
Corner Stone
@catclub: They are just trying to get you to expand your ideas about what is possible. Creative little buggers.
randy khan
@? Martin:
I don’t recall the specifics of this NDA (which was an attachment to the lawsuit), but the usual way NDAs I’ve seen work is that a disclosure under compulsion of law does not end your obligation to maintain confidentiality unless the information actually becomes public as a result (e.g., becomes evidence in a trial). Usually the NDA also requires you to take any reasonable action to get the court to protect the information even if you’re required to disclose it.
Just one more canuck
@Baud: humourless and uptight describes some members of our legal community, LAO excepted of course
Ruviana
@SiubhanDuinne: Librarians are awesome!
LAO
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: It’s an impressive team — some of them are even good in the courtroom (although I’d hesitate to say that any of them have actual “jury charm.”)
Gin & Tonic
Prime Minister of Slovakia has resigned in the aftermath of the assassination of an investigative journalist and his girlfriend.
Mnemosyne
@OGLiberal:
That’s the nightmare scenario that I’m sure will be keeping students and parents up for weeks to come.
Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho
@Just one more canuck: Ahem?
trollhattan
@LAO:
“Uptight and out of sight” It’s Team Stevie Wonder!
Corner Stone
Speaking of the horrors of the Ides of March, Google has finally forced its long threatened switch to their new Finance interface. I had been holding on to the older version as long as it was available but it’s now been disabled from what I can tell. I sent them a scorching feedback letter I am sure top executives will take heed shortly.
efgoldman
@Adam L Silverman:
State institution? Low bidder wins
danielx
This may have already been covered, but I would imagine Trump’s lawyers told Mueller where he could stick his polite request. So Mueller said okay, we’ll do this another way.
Steve in the ATL
@Just one more canuck:
At first I was offended, but then I realized you couldn’t be talking about me because I’m “humorless” rather than “humourless”.
Whew—close call!
Uptight? Well, I yam what I yam.
LAO
@Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: I knew you’d catch that.
HeleninEire
@LAO: Have you ever encountered Patrick Fitzgerald professionally? That is exactly how he was described during the Libby trial. In fact one of the defense attorneys said “He needs to get out more.”
lgerard
@randy khan:
The agreement that the victims of trump’s Soho scam signed in order to get their money back had a clause requiring them to refuse to cooperate with any criminal investigation arising from the project.
made me laugh
Steve in the ATL
@randy khan:
And almost immediately, engineering firms cancelled their OCIs at FIU.
Gelfling 545
@TenguPhule:
“Words are supposed to mean something.”
Nowadays that notion seems almost quaint.
Just one more canuck
@Steve in the ATL: @Alternative Fax, a hip hop artist from Idaho: I said “some”, not all
Ruckus
@JPL:
When did the republicans have any honerable members?
The closest I can remember would be Ike and who was his VP? That’s right, Nixon
LAO
@HeleninEire: Not personally. My law partner, before we partnered up, tried a terrorism case against him. My partner, who is fairly humorless, has nothing but praise for Fitzgerald. He really respected Fitzgerald.
LAO
@Just one more canuck: I can’t help but feel that there calling you out, sort of proves your point. ?
Steve in the ATL
@LAO:
Years ago I gamed out what I would do if I personally needed the services of a plaintiff’s side employment lawyer. I originally picked a very reasonable and well respected guy in town. Later I realized my stupidity and replaced him in my Rolodex with the biggest prick in the plaintiff’s bar, the lawyer that every company and defense firm hates dealing with. That’s the way to go!
I hope these prosecutors are as mean as snakes and as thorough as…my wife when cataloging my faults as a husband.
SiubhanDuinne
@Brad the Impala:
Never heard about that! Hilarious!
Steve in the ATL
@Just one more canuck: Omnes, burnsie, and eemom aren’t normally around this early so you’ll need to repost that on an evening thread.
(Confidential to Omnes, burnsie, and eemom: zing!)
Lyrebird
@Steve in the ATL: In case you’re still following along, this uptight non-lawyer-cat is looking at sleeping kittens on Bored Panda to manage the stress. I guess your household is more geared around puppehs than kittehs, but anyhow.
Corner Stone
@Steve in the ATL:
You know what they say about an attorney who represents himself…
Steve in the ATL
@Lyrebird: we swing both ways, but no one ever asks me about the cats! Who are presently sleeping (of course) in my not-yet-unpacked suitcase, trying to foil my plan to dress only in golden retriever-colored clothes, which was intended to end my massive support of the lint roller industry.
Who doesn’t love pics of sleeping cats?
Brachiator
@Gin & Tonic:
Wow. This technically brings down the government. I guess that sometimes protests DO matter:
Just one more canuck
@Steve in the ATL: thanks for the advice counsellor – send me your bill
catclub
@Corner Stone: yesterday afternoon I thought the old version had disappeared – which I also liked.
Nothing worked to get it back.
Now it is back today ( so far).
Lyrebird
@Steve in the ATL: The cats I have known would never stand for leaving my clothes unadorned. So-called grey tiger cats actually can shed the full range of white to grey to black hairs to be sure to be noticed against any color!
grammypat
@efgoldman: *IF* the span was designed with post-tensioned concrete, the failure could have happened during the “pulling of the cables” phase. *Big if, but one pic I’ve seen looks like it may have this detail. Post-tensioning is common in long span concrete.
HeleninEire
WOO HOO. 36 hours till my niece gets here from Boston. Haven’t seen her in 2 years. She’s my favorite (shhhhh). Can’t wait.
efgoldman
@Ruckus:
Before Newtnik took over
JGabriel
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Believe it or not, Martha Mitchell’s involved in the Trumpspriracy too, despite being dead since 1976. Trump gave the guy who beat and kidnapped Mitchell (on her husband’s behalf) to keep her quiet, Steve King, an ambassadorship to the Czech Republic.
prostratedragon
@zhena gogolia: Soon we’ll be getting near where an astonished Eve (Trump) asks Addison (Mueller), “Why did you call me killer?”
ruemara
@GregB: Seriously? Jeez.
schrodingers_cat
@Just one more canuck: Baud too. He is witty.
Aleta
A little good news, in the Austin Statesman today:
I looked two of the three up, and yes they had some history in the community.
(Will post it below.)
kelvin
failing to comply with a subpoena probably has more severe consequences than failing to comply with a polite request. Because Robbie knows they won’t comply…
Aleta
@Aleta:
Some history for Robert Pfaff. (His perjury in the indictment today makes me question the ‘reports’ in 2015 and his ‘witness testimony’ in 2013.) These incidents are unrelated to today.
1. May 2015
2013. If I read it correctly, a court of appeals ruling upheld a conviction of a woman he stopped and arrested on a misdemeanor, sentence was 14 days in jail. Whole document is at the link.
Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism
@grammypat: The engineer for this bridge is Figg, which is well known for their post-tensioned designs. IIRC, they specialized in it in the ’80s.
I assume the new thing in this construction involves the span length.
SiubhanDuinne
@Steve in the ATL:
You might want to borrow my glasses. To me, that reads “humorous and upright.” So much nicer.
celticdragonchick
@Adam L Silverman:
Agree. Senator Grassley was clear that he will NOT make time to confirm a replacement. If Trump want to start ordering interim director’s to fire Rosenstein and Mueller, he will face a line of resignations.
NCSteve
@? Martin: Okay, now there’s a fourth reason. And one that makes much sense.
SiubhanDuinne
@Lyrebird:
I love the one of the big marmalade mother cat curled around her tiny grey kitten. Too sweet!
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Mary G: I think by now “red lines” are meaningless with transactional Donny. Trump will just fire more of his staff until he feels better.
celticdragonchick
@Aleta:
They will be found not guilty. Officer uses of force while on duty are almost never subject to a conviction in a court.
PPCLI
@Yarrow: @SiubhanDuinne: if I am remembering right, in some TV interview she said things that indicated she knew things she shouldn’t know at that point. Knew about some game changer coming a few days before the Podesta emails started appearing on Wikileaks or something like that.
randy khan
@lgerard:
Yeah, good luck enforcing that clause.
SiubhanDuinne
@schrodingers_cat:
Baud is as witty as they come, but I don’t think he’s a lawyer, is he?
lgerard
Off to a quick start!
SiubhanDuinne
@PPCLI:
Wait, now, so you’re telling me Lara Trump is actually Roger Stone? Wow!
Aleta
@Aleta: Some past incidents for Stallings.
The first one was no longer on the news site, so link is to cache. The 2nd link is to a .gov document that doesn’t copy but is revealing. (Why this guy was allowed to continue as a SWAT officer ….) Both of these are unrelated to the charge he was finally indicted for today.
1. Nov 2015 and May 2016
One of the 2014 incidents is described here.That one too is a reckless pursuit based on a suspicion, in which he didn’t even communicate what he was doing, and why, to the APD.
Corner Stone
@lgerard:
“Larry, I spend a lot of time revising my letter of resignation. And then day drinking. That’s pretty much my day.
Just one more canuck
@SiubhanDuinne: @schrodingers_cat: I was wondering about that
SiubhanDuinne
@lgerard:
PJ
@Brachiator: I don’t know if Fico ordered the hit, but he and his cronies are extremely corrupt.
grammypat
@Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: Okay, engineers do tend to stick with “tried-and-true.” So they went with what they knew. but modified or adapted it to accommodate something altogether new for FIU. The length of the span may have been a factor, but I tend to think that the problem was somewhere between design and implementation. As was mentioned earlier, low-bid contracts can always be considered a suspect.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Just one more canuck:
Baud’s motto is “Hang Loose”* and he can be quite amusing.
* It might be “Let it All Hang Out”, not sure. You do know Baud is an attorney?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@piratedan: Here! Here! Valdimer Putin is new being a president in a democracy. We need to give the man a chance to learn the job.
Heidi Mom
@Lyrebird: As someone told me months ago when I noted the various colors of my pets: “One word — TWEED!”
Just one more canuck
@?BillinGlendaleCA: I had no idea, but Baud is whatever he chooses to be
rikyrah
@? Martin:
This sounds like the movie Spotlight. The attorney got the information on the record that the church was stonewalling against through using another discovery motion. I’m not an attorney, but, if anyone’s seen Spotlight, does my reasoning sound in the ballpark?
rikyrah
@Yarrow:
Yep.
TenguPhule
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
Aren’t attorneys required to have standards?
?BillinGlendaleCA
@TenguPhule: Yes, they only pass a bar once.
?BillinGlendaleCA
@Just one more canuck:
Nakid is the answer.
Mnemosyne
@HeleninEire:
I once heard him on “Wait Wait Don’t Tell Me,” so he’s not totally humorless. Outside of court, anyway.
TenguPhule
@?BillinGlendaleCA: Well played.
Mnemosyne
@?BillinGlendaleCA:
I think the preferred spelling around here is “nekkid.”
I’m not really a spelling Nazi, it’s just what I do in my spare time from being a grammar Nazi.
Just one more canuck
@?BillinGlendaleCA: hey! It’s almost dinner time here – don’t need that
burnspbesq
@TenguPhule:
Which now gets you 20 years. Congress’ reaction to Enron and Andersen’s shredding was to make the penalty for shredding equal to the penalty for attempted murder of a witness. It was part of Sarbanes-Oxley.
TenguPhule
@burnspbesq:
You have to remember we’re not dealing with people who believe in long term planning.
Steve in the ATL
@rikyrah:
Ask Baud
Mnemosyne
@Aleta:
Interesting tidbit that came out of the DoJ investigation of Michael Brown’s shooting: the officer called for backup, but decided to get out of his car and confront Brown before they arrived, for reasons he could not adequately explain. He should have been fired just for that, because if he had stayed in his car and waited 3 minutes for the backup to arrive, Brown would still be alive.
Shana
@Anonymous At Work: I would have liked your grandma.
SiubhanDuinne
@Heidi Mom:
Hey! That’s my hair color!
Ruckus
@efgoldman:
Personally I’d say, before that.
MisterForkbeard
@lgerard: This isn’t even a really dumb question, properly asked. Asking your predecessor what their job involved on a day-to-day is a good question. Asking like this (“Hey man! Does this job involve things? I heard it had stuff.”) is remarkably stupid.
Mnemosyne
@SiubhanDuinne:
As someone who spent a lot of her career working as a temp, I always make sure any new people (including temps) know where the bathroom is. Because there’s nothing worse than being the new person wandering around trying to figure that out without having to ask.
lgerard
@MisterForkbeard:
particularly when the job responsibilities may include fast food runs, diet coke retrieval and fly swatting
Shana
@Feebog: At this point he just seems to be rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.
Shana
@Steve in the ATL: I saw a comic years ago who was moaning about there being no navy blue cats.
zhena gogolia
@different-church-lady:
Wait, which is which?