Horrowshow (& Hope) Open Thread: The NRA, Proud Death Cult

From the Washington Post:

As a culture warrior that has mastered the art of advancing its interests through brutal rhetoric and intense tribalism, the NRA, like President Trump, has become a master of gaining and maintaining power with the fervent support of an engaged minority…

Former NRA executive vice president Warren Cassidy liked to explain that his organization was different from other interest groups: “You’d get a far better understanding” of the NRA, he once told The Washington Post, “if you just approach us as if [we are] one of the world’s great religions.”

For years, the group posted a slogan at the convention booths where it sold insurance policies: “Share the Belief.”

183 replies
  1. 1
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Dana Loesch is insane. A spittle-flecked rabid fanatic.

  2. 2
    MikeEss says:

    …throwing around words like “assassinate” and implying the end of American civilization, they’re really hoping for some gun nut to do another Dr. Tiller, and blow away some prominent lefty…which they think will advance their cause and stop attempts to regulate firearms…

    It’s not gonna work, but there are going to be deaths before a reasonable interpretation of the Second Amendment (more like what was intended when it was written) is finally restored. Dammit, why does everything have to be so difficult…?

  3. 3

    I just can’t with these people.

    But I did crack the 2/3 mark on the beta version of my novel today!

  4. 4
    Mary G says:

    And when accused of being used by Soros, et. al., the kidz tweeted this:

    Our budget: 0$@NRA how much did y’all spend? @sarahchad_ @Emma4Change @dylbaier @firepfeiffer1 @sofiewhitney @Ryan_Deitsch pic.twitter.com/9YX5WlevGo— Adam Alhanti (@AAlhanti) March 7, 2018

  5. 5
    efgoldman says:

    If there was any doubt that the NRA is a terrorist organization, their spokesman is now openly threatening Americans.

    I’m a first amendment absolutist, even for lying, thieving scuzzballs like Loesch. But sometimes my patience is sorely tested.
    I feel the tide might be turning, ever so slightly. If it does, it is the kids and social media, in which I generally don’t participate, that will do the trick. Go kids!

  6. 6
    Mike in NC says:

    There is only one way that Wayne LaPierre and Dana Loesch should meet their end.

  7. 7
  8. 8
    efgoldman says:

    @Mike in NC:

    There is only one way that Wayne LaPierre and Dana Loesch should meet their end.

    Slowly and painfully, in a cold dank cell.

  9. 9
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    Since it is an Open Thread: I signed up for Netflix last week. I binged both seasons of The Crown. Then I started Peaky Fucking Blinders. I am watching season 2 right now. Damn.

  10. 10
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    Take these muthafukkas (Samuel L. Jackson voice here) down like Osama bin Laden was taken down.

    No quarter for terrorists…foreign or domestic.

  11. 11
    SFAW says:

    NPR’s On Point had a segment today regarding the NRA and the actions taken by (among others) companies suck as Dick’s Sporting Goods and Walmart.

    Apparently one of the NRA-fellating memes out there is that companies and Corporate America should stay out of political discussions. At the same time as I heard that, I could swear that I also heard Irony screaming in its death-throes. I tried to get through to On Point to point out that the NRA is a FUCKING FRONT ORGANIZATION FOR CERTAIN AMERICAN CORPORATIONS THAT LOVE MAKING IT AS EASY AS POSSIBLE FOR ONE PERSON TO KILL AS MANY OTHER PERSONS AS POSSIBLE. Fortunately for the listeners, the lines were jammed, so I couldn’t vent my spleen.

    Fucking terrorists.

  12. 12
    Mary G says:

    Any front pager around who can let my comment out of moderation jail? It’s a tweet by one of the Parkland kids, who are being yet again accused of being pawns for Soros and the ghost of Saul Alinsky in that they didn’t do their video themselves. It shows them doing their video themselves. God, these kids are pwning the right something awful and I am here for it.

    ETA: and while I was pecking that out, someone did, so never mind. In Emily Litella’s voice.

  13. 13
    efgoldman says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    apparently they’re making a second edition of Pathfinder.

    Getting a new SUV?

  14. 14
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Mike in NC:
    Accidentally shooting themselves with their own guns?

  15. 15
    SFAW says:

    @Mike in NC:

    There is only one way that Wayne LaPierre and Dana Loesch should meet their end.

    Unfortunately, that can’t happen at NRA HQ, where guns are forbidden (or so I’m told).

    Who’da thunk the NRA “leadership” would be a bunch of snowflakes/pu$$ies? (That is, other than all rational persons.)

  16. 16
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @efgoldman: She has long term, serious, and unresolved issues. Such that she is absolutely one of the last people that should ever be allowed around firearms.
    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/20/style/dana-loesch-national-rifle-association.html

    For as long as Ms. Loesch can remember, the world has been a scary place. She was born Dana Eaton in 1978 in Hematite, Mo., a small community about 40 miles south of St. Louis. Her parents divorced when she was in kindergarten and she has not spoken to her father in more than a decade. Her mother worked three jobs after they moved to nearby Festus, Mo., bringing home bags of granola bars after her shift at a local granola factory. Ms. Loesch said she spent school-day afternoons at home alone or with an aunt.

    “Now, you could say it was like a meth ’hood,” Ms. Loesch said of her old neighborhood. “People were fighting. It was kind of crazy. It wasn’t the most stable of childhoods.”

    Ms. Loesch mostly found refuge at her grandparents’ home in Annapolis, Mo., a town of about 450 people nestled in the rural Ozarks. Her family voted for Democrats. Her grandfather hunted deer and raccoon. Despite episodes of violence, Ms. Loesch idealized summers in Annapolis in “Flyover Country.” In the book, she recalled her grandfather standing on the porch one night with a shotgun in his hands. Ms. Loesch’s aunt had just arrived; her estranged husband had threatened to kill her.

    “Looking back,” Ms. Loesch said, “I think I always wanted to know that I was safe.”

  17. 17
    Patricia Kayden says:

    Stephen King is exactly right. Anything short of voting out NRA Puppets in November is a waste of time. Republicans aren’t going to change because the NRA dictates their stance on guns. Vote them out.

  18. 18
    mai naem mobile says:

    I really want Dana Loesch,Dolt45,Betsy Devos,Ivanka,Erik Prince and some RWNJ Florida legislators who are for teachers being armed to go through a mock SWAT situation and see what happens. I mean a realistic mock situation with kids in the classroom and local cops and all. I don’t know what kind of bullets or paintball guns or whatever they use in mock situations but I guarantee there will be teachers and kids nock killed.

  19. 19
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    That’s super fucked up. Dana Loesh is saying this shit in the hopes that NRA crazies are going to kill anyone who will dare to oppose them.

  20. 20
    SFAW says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Wow. Her issues have issues, as they say.

  21. 21
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Which is precisely why she shouldn’t be allowed to own a gun. She’s dangerous unless she’s just bluffing and pretending to be off her rocker.

  22. 22
  23. 23
  24. 24
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @mai naem mobile: Erik Prince might do okay given his background. None of the others would.

  25. 25
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Mary G:

  26. 26
    Redshift says:

    @efgoldman:

    I’m a first amendment absolutist, even for lying, thieving scuzzballs like Loesch. But sometimes my patience is sorely tested.

    Yeah, I guess inciting stochastic terrorism isn’t illegal. In any case, the best thing we can do is take away their toys, not their speech.

  27. 27
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @SFAW: It’s sad. In all senses of the word.

  28. 28
    Mike in NC says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Netflix is worse than crack.

  29. 29
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Redshift: I am with efg here. I suspect that we may be a minority on this blog. The 1st has no limiting language. The 2d does.

  30. 30
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    I find out on Saturday if I’m one of the 6 finalists in the writing contest I entered. I basically have no fingernails left.

  31. 31
    Jager says:

    I’m a retired broadcaster…believe me if somebody would have taken Dana aside 20 odd years ago and said, “Dana there’s big bucks in being a lefty talk show host.” she would have done it in a split second. She’d probably have a slot on MSNBC right now. Her ideology is money, period.

  32. 32

    @Mnemosyne: is this the one you entered cuz they score you?

  33. 33
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: And yet we do regulate the 1st much more than the 2nd.

  34. 34
    hellslittlestangel says:

    I don’t think we’ll see change until a right-wing gun nut assassinates a Supreme Court justice. So, yeah, pretty soon.

  35. 35
    Jay says:

    @SFAW:

    Nope. Legal Gun’s are fine at NRA headquarters.

  36. 36
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mike in NC: I never tried crack.

  37. 37
    Redshift says:

    @Adam L Silverman: I wonder how much of that is true. Actually, I suspect it’s mostly true, just hyped for maximum “be scared unless you got guns!”

  38. 38
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    The 1st has no limiting language.

    And yet we have libel and slander laws, plus laws against verbally inciting a riot, so even the 1st Amendment has some limits.

  39. 39
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Adam L Silverman: And that is fucked up.

  40. 40
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Major Major Major Major: No, this is the one where they demand her fingernails.

  41. 41
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: I didn’t say it doesn’t.

  42. 42
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    That’s the one. So even if I lose, I win, because I get comments back.

  43. 43
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    Out of curiosity, what law do you practice?

  44. 44
  45. 45
    SFAW says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    The 2d does.

    What would that be? “Well regulated Militia”? Or “people” instead of “persons”? No, I’m not trying to be a smartass.

  46. 46
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: I have done a variety of things. Right now, I am doing tax law.

  47. 47
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    And now I’m going to drop that argument and zoom off in another direction entirely:

    We basically have to choose between the 1st and 2nd Amendments. We can have unlimited crazy conspiracy speech OR we can have unlimited access to guns, but we can’t have both, because that’s what’s killing people.

    An armed society is one that has no freedom of speech, which is pretty much exactly what that an armed society is a polite society meme means — people will be afraid to speak up if everyone is armed and can kill them for doing so.

  48. 48
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @SFAW: The militia clause.

  49. 49
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @hellslittlestangel: We had one of these guys lay in wait and take out a Federal court judge’s family in Chicago in 2005. This was a year after a white supremacist tried to assassinate her. Didn’t even make a dent.
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/.....story.html

    U.S. District Judge Joan H. Lefkow found her husband and mother shot dead in the basement of her home Monday night, less than a year after white supremacist Matthew Hale was convicted of trying to have her murdered for holding him in contempt of court.

    Michael F. Lefkow, 64, an attorney, and Donna Grace Humphrey, 90, were lying in blood with gunshot wounds to the head when the judge arrived to a darkened house at 6 p.m., a source close to the investigation said.

    Police said they were conducting “death investigations,” and cautioned about drawing any connections to Hale, who is awaiting sentencing for trying to solicit the judge’s murder. Sources said Michael Lefkow and Humphrey were found together, each was shot once in the head. No weapon was recovered, but police found two .22 caliber casings.

    Security at the Lefkow home–including a camera mounted outside the home and guards posted on the block in unmarked cars–had been beefed up after the allegations against Hale emerged in January 2003. But neighbors said the extra measures tailed off about the time Hale was convicted in April 2004.

    Investigators say there was a sign of forced entry, a broken window, at the family’s three-story gray-sided home in the 5200 block of North Lakewood Avenue in the Edgewater neighborhood.

    Neighbors on Monday night said the judge ran into the street screaming after discovering the bodies and was consoled by police officers who put a blanket over her. She was taken to the Belmont Area headquarters while detectives, evidence technicians and federal agents worked the scene in and around the home.

    The perpetrator was someone with business before her court:
    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/07.....amily.html

    Nothing has been normal since that winter afternoon when Judge Lefkow, 61, came home from work to find her husband of 30 years, Michael Lefkow, and her 89-year-old mother, Joan Humphrey, shot dead in the basement. Ten days later, a delusional litigant whose case Judge Lefkow had dismissed admitted to the killings in ranting letters left behind before he committed suicide.

    There have also been several US Attorneys and Associate US Attorneys murdered. Hasn’t made a dent at all.

  50. 50
    Steeplejack says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Be sure to tell raven about Peaky Blinders. He will squee. He has been pushing it for ages.

  51. 51
    Fair Economist says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I have never been able to find the time to play an RPG since college.

  52. 52
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Redshift: Who knows. She obviously believes it enough to tell it to people. All that matters is her subjective belief.

  53. 53
    SFAW says:

    @hellslittlestangel:

    I don’t think we’ll see change until a right-wing gun nut assassinates a Supreme Court justice. So, yeah, pretty soon.

    Only if it’s Alito or Gorsuch. Were it RBG, Kagan, Sotomayor, Breyer, or even Kennedy, it would all be met with (behind closed doors) cheers from the people who already support unfettered access to assault weapons, etc.

  54. 54
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yes it is. As you know well, other than the 2nd, under the reimagining done by the NRA and their fellow travelers, there is not a single one of those amendments, or the enumerated, explicit, and/or implicit rights in them that we don’t regulate somewhat.

  55. 55
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: No fucking shit. I am more or less down with Cole’s gun post after the last shooting. My differences with him would be at the margins. I said that in the thread. Don’t try to start a fight where one does not exist.

  56. 56
    Yutsano says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Right now, I am doing tax law.
    Reply

    Vaya con Dios. Especially if you’re trying to make sense out of the current atrocity that just passed.

  57. 57
  58. 58
    NotMax says:

    Not to derail the conversation, but as it’s an Open Thread –

    Gives a whole new meaning to ‘secret service’ (emphasis added).

    The government’s personnel agency is hiding information about federal employees’ bonuses, overtime and cost of living adjustments. A powerful House committee wants to know why.

    Open the Books, a government watchdog group, has for the past 11 years sought the names, titles, agencies, salaries and bonus information for all federal employees. It has received much of the data it sought and then has posted the information publicly. This year, it was denied salary information on more than 250,000 employees.
    [snip]
    While the government traditionally hides some employee information — about 3,500 positions in the 2016 request — the new redactions represent one out of every eight federal employees.
    [snip]
    The Department of Homeland Security, the Department of Justice and the Department of the Treasury had the most redactions, at about 138,000, 75,000 and 19,000, respectively.

    Other agencies with many missing salaries include the Department of Veterans Affairs, the Department of the Interior and OPM itself.

    Stephen Spaulding, chief of strategy at Common Cause, a nonpartisan organization promoting government accountability, said OPM needs to be more forthcoming about its decision to keep this information secret. He called the jump “jarring.”

    “Why is it now hundreds of thousands more, what’s behind that sudden change?” Spaulding said. “This information isn’t to harass federal employees, this is so taxpayers know how their money is being spent.” Source

  59. 59
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    Can you tell me tricks to avoid paying my taxes?//

  60. 60
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Yutsano: Gah!

  61. 61
    Steeplejack says:

    @jacy:

    Permission denied to see picture.

  62. 62
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Can you pay me cash money?

  63. 63
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @hellslittlestangel:

    I don’t think we’ll see change until a right-wing gun nut assassinates a Supreme Court justice. So, yeah, pretty soon.

    But he’d kill one of the liberals, so it’d prevent the change from ever happening.

  64. 64
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Not fighting, just jumping onto my soapbox. That’s why I said I was dropping my first statement and going a different direction.

  65. 65
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Maybe the next season of Harmonquest will use it. :)

  66. 66
    Steeplejack says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Congratulations!

  67. 67
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    Sure, I can have my man deliver it to you in denominations of 100. Very discrete.

  68. 68
    trollhattan says:

    @efgoldman:
    You could be right, I hope so. It’s not limited to Florida, to be sure. Got this email from the school district today.

    Recently a number of students and families in our community have indicated their desire to participate in a 17-minute walkout on March 14th at 10 a.m. to demand action on gun violence after the tragic event in Parkland, Florida. While this issue weighs heavily on all of our hearts and minds, the district wants to provide some guidance on how our school plans to conduct activities on this day.

    At Sacramento City Unified Schools our top priority is teaching and learning. We respect and support the right of our students to advocate for causes that are important to them and we are actively working with students to plan age-appropriate activities in the spirit of the walk out on March 14th that will occur on school grounds under the safety and supervision of adults. Any students with suggestions, should reach out to their site administrator.

    Note they’re not threatening the kids ala Texas.

  69. 69
    NotMax says:

    @Omnes Omnibus

    Just to let you know, Netflix’ AI gets better over time in offering recommendations based on what you have already chosen to view. Still includes some things which make one go “Huh?” but the more you watch, the less frequent they become.

  70. 70
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: I say that the 1st outweighs the 2d. Say what you want; don’t shoot people who disagree.

  71. 71
    mai naem mobile says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I think Erik Prince would either mock kill an innocent or be mock killed by a cop. His training is not going to have involved shooting while teaching a bunch of noisy adolescents.

  72. 72
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @NotMax: I have seen that already.

  73. 73
    jacy says:

    @Steeplejack:

    Fixed. Stupid toggles.

  74. 74
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Steeplejack:

    If I’m a finalist, I get to pay out of my own pocket to go to the weekend conference in Chicago! 🙄

    (I don’t actually have to go, but as G said, if I’m a finalist, why would I not go? But I won’t know for at least 2 more days. 😢)

  75. 75
    chris says:

    @Mnemosyne: Since we’re dreaming here I don’t see why you can’t have gun laws with teeth and hate speech laws with more teeth. Most civilised countries do.

  76. 76
    trollhattan says:

    @Jager:
    Suspect you’re spot on. Having made her choice she’s now eligible for rot-in-hell status. You can be a wingnut spokesdrome and not threaten people, although the bonuses could be smaller.

  77. 77
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @NotMax:
    You haven’t seen the recommendations that YouTube gives me. It tends to give me weirdly reactionary videos to watch no matter how many times I say I’m not interested.

  78. 78
    trollhattan says:

    @chris:
    Charlottsville march would have been illegal in Germany. They kinda learned after the fact free speech isn’t totally free.

  79. 79
    Mnemosyne says:

    @trollhattan:

    That’s too bad. The school district where our niece attends outside of Chicago allowed the students to go out and protest as long as they were not disruptive or violent. Teachers had to stay in their classrooms, which I was okay with since this is being led by the kids.

    Can you call or email the principal to complain? If enough parents do that, they might back down.

  80. 80
  81. 81
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @chris: I remain convinced that in the US, European-style hate-speech laws would immediately be deployed against liberals for condemning conservatives and racists. I don’t think we can have them here without very bad consequences.

  82. 82
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    NotMax mentioned Netflix’s AI making recommendations. That reminded me of YouTube’s crappy AI.

  83. 83
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Yep, shutting people up can go both ways.

  84. 84
    eclare says:

    @jacy: Cute!

  85. 85
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Matt McIrvin:
    What comes around goes around as they say.

  86. 86
    chris says:

    @trollhattan: We’re not big on Nazis in Canada either. See Ernst Zundel.

  87. 87
    eclare says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Watch the episode of Dirty Money about the maple syrup heist, hysterical. Like The Wire but with maple syrup….one person’s title is Maple Syrup Lawyer.

  88. 88
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Do you want to be jailed for calling someone a Nazi?

  89. 89
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: In Western Europe they seem to do OK with them. But our right has already spent decades developing the idea that they’re the real aggrieved parties and the left is unjustly intolerant of their intolerance. I could see any anti-Nazi-rally law being manipulated to shut down BLM.

  90. 90
    chris says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Heh, it would be a true “both sides” issue. Still better than shooting each other.

    ETA Than, dammit!

  91. 91
    efgoldman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Right now, I am doing tax law.

    Does burnsie know?

  92. 92
    Mike J says:

    @MikeEss:

    …throwing around words like “assassinate” and implying the end of American civilization, they’re really hoping for some gun nut to do another Dr. Tiller, and blow away some prominent lefty…which they think will advance their cause and stop attempts to regulate firearms…

    I have to admit that in my darker moments I wish someone would do something awful to a Republican, but then I realise 1) I’m not a horrible person and B) it would wind up being counter productive.

  93. 93
  94. 94
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @jacy: Bad toggles, bad, bad toggles.

    What?

  95. 95
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Western Europe, even the UK, never had our free speech tradition. How do you impose it from the top down?

  96. 96
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    I have a question. Have plausible is it that an American CEO of a major conglomerate could fund neo-Nazi terror groups circa the early 80s and have ties to high placed white supremacists around the globe under the radar while pretending to be a progressive Elon Musk-type, under the radar? Am I getting into comic book territory?

  97. 97
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @chris: I think I see your problem:

    Most civilised countries do.

  98. 98
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @efgoldman: I do what I do to survive.

  99. 99
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Yutsano: He can’t afford me. No worries.

  100. 100
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Am I getting into comic book territory?

    or Robert Ludlum.

  101. 101
    Mike J says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    In nerdier news, apparently they’re making a second edition of Pathfinder.

    The last time I was in a serious RPG campaign, we pretty much threw away every system and let dice rolls help guide the story we were collectively telling. Of course I was working in a gaming department for the guy who wrote White Plume Mountain, so everyone involved was pretty hardcore. No rules lawyers, no arguing over do I need an 11 or a 12, just play the story and what the GM said is what happened.

  102. 102
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    I demand satisfaction. How dare you insult my wealth. Pistol’s at dawn!

  103. 103
    chris says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Indeed, it was a hint. As a Canadian I’m required to be too polite to say what sometimes needs to be said.

  104. 104
    Jager says:

    @trollhattan: The SOP in conservative talk is you have to take whatever Rush says to the next level, get crazier. At the same time you have to be wilder than your fellow hosts on your local station, the nuttier, the louder the better for your career. When Dana was on the air in St. Louis she started at about a 4 level, moved to 8, got on Bill Maher from time to time, cranked it to 10 and got too crazy for the station, which means they couldn’t sell her. Michael Savage has the same problem, big numbers and the local station can’t give him away. She’s lucky she got the gig with the NRA, wonder what she had to do to get it? I watched the same shit go on with religious broadcasters, the crazier the Revelations bullshit the better they did. I heard a religious talk host do an hour about how to use the fear of demons to discipline your kids while I was driving across the desert one night.

    ,

  105. 105
    B.B.A. says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Isn’t that just Peter Thiel with better PR? (In other words, Elon Musk?)

  106. 106
    efgoldman says:

    @chris:

    Still better then shooting each other.

    Other countries, no matter how democratic, don’t have a bill of rights. “Congress shall make no law….” seems pretty clear to me. As Omnes and Matt have said, no way to shade it just for speech we don’t like.
    Citizens’ United (and its predecessor, Valeo) are abominations and must be overturned someday.

  107. 107

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: well, you’re definitely getting into the territory of the sorta villain I’d come up with, which might be even worse

  108. 108
    NotMax says:

    @Omnes Omnibus

    Two more tidbits about Netflix, the first handy and the second a bit of a bother.

    1) You can change the color, size, font and background of subtitles on the Netflix web site. May take up to 24 hours for the change to lock in.

    2) Should you begin watching something and then decide part way through that you are not interested in watching it after all, the only way to remove it from your watch list is by going to the web site, and it’s a teensy bit tricky to do there.

  109. 109
    Scamp Dog says:

    @SFAW: There’s also the line “She doesn’t just have issues, she’s got a subscription.”

  110. 110

    @Mike J: depends on what sorta game you feel like playing, of course. My most memorable tabletop experience was a game of Paranoia.

  111. 111
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    I do wonder, though, if there could be a way to put more teeth into libel and slander laws by having there be a civil penalty for printing or otherwise promulgating “facts” that are known to be false. For example, make it possible to suppress a book that claims the Holocaust never happened on the grounds that the facts show that the book is false.

  112. 112
    efgoldman says:

    @Mike J:

    in my darker moments I wish someone would do something awful to a Republican

    They did. RWNJ from LA was shot at softball practice.

  113. 113
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷:
    One more thing: the CEO guy has ties to dissatisfied Soviet functionaries as well. Together, they plot to use alien technology to control the minds of everyone else and wipe out all non-European Whites.

    This is mostly background.

  114. 114

    @Mnemosyne:

    “facts” that are known to be false

    Known by, as determined by…?

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: way to bury the lede.

  115. 115
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: I am an officer and gentleman by Act of Congress. Can you offer equal status? If not, we cannot duel. There are rules,

  116. 116
    Mnemosyne says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷:

    I suspected the Stalin thing was a way to fish for book ideas while they were still nebulous.

    Also, that’s kind of the plot of Kingsman.

  117. 117
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Peter Thiel’s about 70% of the way there.

  118. 118
    Jay says:

    @efgoldman:

    We have a Charter.

  119. 119
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @NotMax: Thanks.

  120. 120
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne: Who decides what’s known to be false? About half of the time there’s a faction in control that insists global warming is known to be false.

  121. 121
    Mike J says:

    @Major Major Major Major: The computer is your friend.

  122. 122
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Science and physical evidence. People should not be allowed to publicly claim that Sandy Hook was a hoax when there is actual physical evidence to prove otherwise.

    And someone who manufactures fake evidence gets a double penalty.

  123. 123
    trollhattan says:

    @Mnemosyne:
    Have feelers out and for now telling the kid we will back her with whatever she decides.

  124. 124

    @Mike J: At the very beginning I passed each player a form to fill out. One of the forms was in German, and when the player asked if it was supposed to be in German, I had them executed for questioning the computer, and knowing of German.

  125. 125

    @Mnemosyne:

    Science and physical evidence

    Refereed by…?

    ETA autocorrect

  126. 126
    debbie says:

    Bet Richard Spencer’s one of Dana Loesch’s biggest fanboys.

  127. 127
    Mike J says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I think we should set up a discord.

  128. 128
  129. 129
    B.B.A. says:

    @efgoldman:

    Other countries, no matter how democratic, don’t have a bill of rights.

    Most of them do, actually. France’s is older than ours (though it hasn’t been in force continuously).

    They tend to interpret theirs a lot more narrowly than we interpret ours, such that e.g. a law banning campaign ads on TV isn’t considered an infringement of freedom of speech. But they have them.

  130. 130
    NotMax says:

    @Mike J

    If you haven’t already seen it, a very cute, funny movie about RPG playing is a little crowd-funded gem called The Gamers: Dorkness Rising.

    You will recognize the character types as portrayed to a T from your own gaming group. trailer

    Available on Amazon Prime. Believe also on YouTube.

  131. 131
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Who decides what’s known to be false?

    That’s part of our current problem, isn’t it? There is no standard for proving that a fact is true or false, so gun nuts can claim that no one died at Parkland and all of the kids currently protesting are actors being paid by George Soros, and there is absolutely no way to stop them. The kids are now public figures, so they can’t sue for libel or slander.

    We really need to stop pretending that the claim that no one died at Parkland and it’s all a massive hoax by the government is “free speech.”

  132. 132
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Mnemosyne:
    I never watched the Kingmen.

    The plot doesn’t work out so well when the world blows itself up in late ’83. Although the dude does go on to become the biologically immortal dictator of humanity in a interstellar empire.

    Another idea I had was the Star Wars program nearly comes to fruition under the villain’ s aegis, Hardcastle Industries. Instead of missile defense, it would control the minds of everyone aside from him (he doesn’t like sharing power).

  133. 133

    @Mike J: Be the change.

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Ah, it’s this story.

    @Mnemosyne: But we can keep moon landing conspiracies, right? And chemtrails, pretty please?

  134. 134
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @B.B.A.: Are you here as a commenter or as a troll? You have done both. One wonders, as one does…

  135. 135
    jl says:

    I think a more accurate description is that it is a money and profit cult that is completely indifferent to the associated mayhem, racism, injury and death.

  136. 136
    chris says:

    @efgoldman: We do have a bill of rights which includes freedom of expression. It’s modern, passed in 1982, so it has a “notwithstanding clause” that allows government to fine tune some of those rights. There have been a a couple of high profile cases of Holocaust deniers running smack into that one. Seems to work as advertised.

  137. 137
    Brachiator says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    People should not be allowed to publicly claim that Sandy Hook was a hoax when there is actual physical evidence to prove otherwise.

    Ever since the Kennedy assassination and man landing on the moon, conspiracy nuts have perfected their skills in denial of reality and obfuscation of evidence.

  138. 138
    NotMax says:

    @Major Major Major Major

    A brief, shining moment in Paranoia that is still talked about in our gaming group from time to time was when I managed to give a totally logical within the game yet totally out of left field statement and rendered the computer speechless.

  139. 139
    B.B.A. says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I love you too.

  140. 140
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    That’s what would make it an expansion of existing libel and slander laws. If, say, Mr. Guttenberg above finds out that someone is claiming his murdered daughter never existed or that he’s part of a conspiracy, he should be able to take them to court and get some kind of court order requiring them to STFU because they’re lying.

  141. 141

    @NotMax: Mike J should set up a Discord.

  142. 142
  143. 143
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: How do you want it to work? Please design the program for only truth being reported.

  144. 144
    Yutsano says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    We really need to stop pretending that the claim that no one died at Parkland and it’s all a massive hoax by the government is “free speech.”

    It’s slander. But the kids have to be aggrieved by it. They can’t just go to court because it’s wrong.

  145. 145
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:
    You do realize I was joking.

  146. 146
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @B.B.A.: I asked you a question.

  147. 147
    Mike J says:

    @NotMax: Added to my watchlist.

  148. 148
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Brachiator:

    Ever since the Kennedy assassination and man landing on the moon, conspiracy nuts have perfected their skills in denial of reality and obfuscation of evidence.

    And the fact that our libel laws have such a high bar to meet is part of what fuels those conspiracies. Because Buzz Aldrin is a public figure, he has no recourse when a crazy guy harasses him in public and claims the moon landing never happened. So Aldrin has to ignore the guy (unless he becomes grabby, which is when Aldrin decked him) and let him continue to claim that Aldrin is a liar because our laws don’t allow him to do anything else since the guy has a free speech right to say anything he wants.

  149. 149
    NotMax says:

    @Yutsano

    Yup. Free speech does not mean free from repercussions.

    Except on FOX.

  150. 150
    Jay says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    That’s how we do it up here, STFU, retraction, damages.

    Works well enough, but it worked better when we had HRC’s that took the lead. The Con’s killed those off last time they were in power, tired of getting their asses sued for lying.

    They might be coming back though.

  151. 151
    Mike J says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I will, but not tonight. I decided to have a smoke and watch the dumbest movie on my hard drive and I’m very, very close to giving up on half of that. I think they tried too hard to make it smart when they should have gone for 24 minutes of Dr Shrinker.

  152. 152
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    From my quick glance, the motivations are different. The motivations depend on the person in the org. The American and the South African character are white supremacists through and through. The Soviets not as much. They just dislike current Soviet leadership (Andropov) and crave power (and kinda want to end the Cold War permanently). The other western businessmen involved see dollar signs and also want power.

  153. 153

    @NotMax: hide… behind… the pile… of dead… bards…

    I actually just finished revising a scene in my novel that ends with a bard joke.

  154. 154
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Yutsano:

    The kids are now public figures, so they will have to prove “actual malice.” Even then, the likelihood of them being able to shut down even one conspiracymonger is infinitesimal, because free speech is very broad and you can’t get a judgment against someone just because they lied.

  155. 155
    Calouste says:

    @efgoldman: The US Bill of Rights is just stuff they forgot to put into the constitution at the first go around. The Founding Fathers gave it a fancy name to cover up their failures, and American mythology did the rest.

  156. 156
    trollhattan says:

    John Oliver takes on NRA TV. Must see teevee. Trust me (or I’ll…uh…)

  157. 157

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷: Wait, what? I was just saying that this is about that story I’ve seen you mention from time to time.

  158. 158
    jacy says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Sad thing: my dog knows I’m cheating on him with another dog.

  159. 159
    B.B.A. says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I’ve repeatedly sworn off trolling, but nothing I say will please you, will it?

    Hence my response above.

  160. 160
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Calouste:
    If memory serves the Federalists didn’t believe the Bill of Rights was necessary.

  161. 161
    Jay says:

    @jacy:

    You are not cheating, your dog just wants a threesome.

  162. 162
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Whoops. I thought you said the Kingsmen was basically my story. My bad.

  163. 163
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne: Okay, but… you do realize “reforming” libel laws is a favorite cause of our current President? He is terribly keen on lowering that bar to the ground so he can sue his thousands of critics and abusers into oblivion.

    I just am not convinced that any loosening of speech protections in the First Amendment, in the American political environment we have, wouldn’t be used first and foremost to crush critics of the powerful and enforce lies rather than punishing them. Ken Cuccinelli probably would have gotten Michael Mann thrown in the slammer for promulgating global warming and thereby slandering Exxon.

  164. 164
    Mnemosyne says:

    @NotMax:

    Free speech does not mean free from repercussions.

    Except on FOX.

    The court decison that Fox News is allowed to broadcast stuff that they know to be lies was pretty much the death of the 1st Amendment, because it means that it’s impossible to punish liars.

  165. 165
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Okay, but… you do realize “reforming” libel laws is a favorite cause of our current President? He is terribly keen on lowering that bar to the ground so he can sue his thousands of critics and abusers into oblivion.

    This is the exact same argument the NRA uses: we can’t have even the smallest gun control law because it will force us down a slippery slope where all guns will be taken away.

    You may be fine with people like Dana Loesh whipping her followers into a frenzy by claiming that Parkland is a hoax, but I’m not. If someone ends up dead because of it, the 1st Amendment will be partially to blame.

  166. 166
    chris says:

    @Jay: Supreme shitweasel Ezra Levant of Rebel Media springs immediately to mind. Assholery has legal consequences in Canada.

  167. 167
    Jay says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Works fine in the ROW.

    You do realize that your root argument, “It wouldn’t work here”, is based in the belief that ‘Murkins are beyond redemption?

  168. 168
    Brachiator says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Amerikan Baka) 🗳 🌷:

    If memory serves the Federalists didn’t believe the Bill of Rights was necessary.

    James Madison originally opposed the Bill of Rights. Among the concerns was the fear that if a right was not specifically mentioned, some people might think that those rights did not exist.

  169. 169
    Jay says:

    @chris:

    Yup, Your Ward News, etc.

    But it worked better when Human Rights Councils took the lead, rather than individuals having to front the costs.

  170. 170
    Jay says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    I wish we could uprate comments bigly.

  171. 171
    chris says:

    @Jay: Agreed. Took me a minute to remember what HRCs were on this here Yankee blog.

  172. 172
    Feathers says:

    My fave tweet on Loesch, from fantasy author Cathrynne Valente:

    Dana Loesch looks like if the evil stepmother was just like “You know what, fuck apples,” shot Snow White in front of all the dwarves, cut her face off, stapled it on, and went on into work like nothing happened.

    I’m eagerly awaiting Valente’s new book, Space Opera, a tale of Eurovision in space, determining the fate of Earth.

  173. 173
    Jay says:

    @chris:

    Yup, Warman shut down a shitload of Nazi’s and Asshats,

    But it was “better” when there was an arm of the Governmentnset up to combat lies.

  174. 174

    @Feathers:

    Eurovision in space, determining the fate of Earth.

    Wasn’t that a Rick & Morty episode?

  175. 175
    B.B.A. says:

    @Jay:

    Works fine in the ROW.

    See, I used to think this, but after Germany was roped into prosecuting someone for an obscure offense of “insulting the dignity of a foreign head of state” (it was something like a tweet criticizing Erdogan) I’m not so sure.

  176. 176
    chris says:

    @Jay: We should fix that. I’ve made a note to look into it in the AM.

    It’s very late so I’m for bed. I’ll just leave the kitties here.

  177. 177
    patrick II says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    If you haven’t seen “Wind River” I highly recommend it. It is now on Netflix. Set in Wyoming, it stars Jeremy Renner as a tracker with the Fish and Wildlife service who helps an inexperience FBI agent track down the killer of an Indian girl.
    White men who rape Indian women on reservations cannot be tried in tribal court. The FBI will only get involved if it is murder. The movie is moving, not preachy, and highlights a real problem.

  178. 178
    Jay says:

    @B.B.A.:

    There was an investigation, no grounds were found, nothingburger, Nunenburger.

    When we had Human Rights Councils, anybody, ( almost anybody, some CT Alex Jones fans got banned) could “lay a complaint”,

    The complaint would be investigated. 43% of the time, it went nowhere.

    Despite what “The Rebel” would have you believe, ain’t Big Brother. I got “hauled” into one. They were very accomodating to my schedule. We had tea, coffee, a nice chat, and at the 15 minute mark, a very nice woman popped in with cookies and brownies. There was a “emotional support animal”, available if I needed one.

    ( Yup, went for heavy petting the dog).

    The reality was, only assholes and butfucks needed to “fear” HRC Investigations, like Donnie, and Tangerine Jr.

  179. 179
    Citizen Alan says:

    @Matt McIrvin:

    Every time there’s a shooting, I immediately recall that Merrick Garland would have probably been the 5th vote to reverse Heller. And my hatred for the Bernie swine grows.

  180. 180
    Citizen Alan says:

    @Mike J:

    I really don’t think I would give a shit at this point. I didn’t particularly feel bad when that nutcase in DC opened fire on a bunch of Repukes at a softball game, and I don’t think I’d have felt different if he’d actually taken some of them out.

  181. 181
    Steve in the SFO says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Omnes is the new Burnsie!

  182. 182
    Jay says:

    @Jay:

    BTW, I meant “butfuck’s” not in the concept of gay sex, or pegging, but in the concept of Russian Pee Hookers.

  183. 183
    NobodySpecial says:

    @Mike J: These are the glory days of story based and rules light RPGs. Most of them are indie, though, and most of the mass media is still focused on D&D exclusively. I love 5e, but all the games I want to play and run are indie, like Delta Green (Lovecraftian modern horror), Eclipse Phase (Altered Carbon inspired transhumanism), and Red Markets (Economic horror nerd troped with zombies).

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