Next Steps on DACA

Alice Ollstein at TPM has a summary on the status of the DACA program. The opening grafs:

When the final gavel came down Thursday afternoon, marking the Senate’s failure to pass any one of four immigration bills up for debate, Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR) left the chamber with a spring in his step.

Asked by reporters what Congress will do now for nearly 700,000 young immigrants at risk of losing their work permits and legal protections after March 5, the anti-immigration hardliner grinned and replied: “We move on to confirming judges and banking reform.”

The bobble-throated slapdick from Arkansas (thanks, Charlie Pierce) is content to maintain the status quo on immigration so he and his colleagues can get back to stuffing the federal courts with unqualified, donor-adjacent, legal practice wash-outs and religious fanatics and setting the United States up for “Financial Meltdown II: The Hobo Adventure Retirement Plan.”

So, with heartless dicks like Cotton running the shit-show, will DACA go unaddressed, and will DREAMers start getting deported to what, for them, are foreign countries? Maybe.

As Ollstein notes, there are still “bipartisan” bills in the works in both chambers. But Trump seems convinced that taking a hard line on immigration makes him look like a Putinesque strong-man, so no legislator can discount the possibility that Trump will charge in on a metaphorical horse (shirtlessness also mercifully metaphorical) with a veto threat and series of belittling tweets, no matter how pliant and conciliatory he seemed in earlier pronouncements on the program.

Another wild card: Ollstein also notes that the Supreme Court is expected to signal today whether it will weigh in on two lower court rulings that blocked Trump’s termination of the DACA program and forced the feds to keep accepting and processing DACA renewal applications. So, the uncertainty continues, and lives are on hold for the duration.

108 replies
  1. 1
    burnspbesq says:

    Cotton is extremely dangerous.

  2. 2
    p.a. says:

    Ugh. USSC? Those dreamers are effed.

  3. 3

    Can somebody summarize how the courts can/have block(ed) ending DACA? (IANAL obviously.)

  4. 4
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @burnspbesq: All Republicans are dangerous. It wasn’t just Cotton who voted against the DACA bill. If Democrats don’t take control of Congress in November, DACA beneficiaries are screwed. To be honest, I wouldn’t be surprised if Trump doesn’t start deporting them in March.

  5. 5
    Ridnik Chrome says:

    (Banging head to video) “Da da nana NANA, da da nana NANA, aieeeeaaaaahhhhh-HAH! Aieeeeaaaahhhh-HAH!”

    (Wait, what was the post about again? Immigrants? Oh, yeah.)

  6. 6
    cmorenc says:

    Would Cotton and the GOP be so hard-line anti-DACA if 80% of them were of German, Scottish, or Scandinavian origin? The extreme hostility of many Republicans like Cotton to DACA is rooted in the fact that a strong majority of DACA folks are of darker-hued ethnicities born in countries predominately comprised of darker-hued ethnicities. Well, maybe they would get a bit squinty-eyed at even blond, pale Scandinavian kids because they might import their parents’ socialist-leaning moral and political sensibilities.

    Shorter version: it’s all about keeping the US a clear majority WASP nation, instead of one with a looming nonwhite voting majority. Even shorter version: Cotton is a vile racist. Even if he claims to have a black friend here or there somewhere.

  7. 7
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @cmorenc: I don’t recall any Republicans denouncing Trump for his sh*thole comments except perhaps Lindsay Graham who witnessed them and backed up Senator Durbin’s account of the exchange where Trump made those comments. Otherwise, Trump’s racist comments are met with crickets by the majority of Republicans. It’s clear that they are now the party of White Supremacists and proudly so.

  8. 8
    rikyrah says:

    Racist muthaphucka.

    I will NEVER forget how he treated Cassandra Butts.

    NEVER.

  9. 9
    Mike in DC says:

    The only possible upside is the bastard is never getting his wall.

  10. 10
    Amir Khalid says:

    The irony of that song choice is that Trump recently stated a preference for immigrants from the land of ice and snow. I suggest a more inclusive choice.

  11. 11
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    that Trump will charge in on a metaphorical horse (shirtlessness also mercifully metaphorical)

    The horse, too. You know trump is afraid of horses.

  12. 12
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    Cotton is unspeakable racist scum. I’d love to see what his “supports EO” block looks like on his OERs.

  13. 13
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @cmorenc:

    Would Cotton and the GOP be so hard-line anti-DACA if 80% of them were of German, Scottish, or Scandinavian origin?

    An examination of American history says the answer to your question is yes. It’s not just the skin color (though it makes the hate and fear easier), it’s immigrants aren’t exactly like them.

  14. 14

    @Amir Khalid: I don’t know whether you saw my comment on yesterday’s thread, you were right about AG in A Passage to India as my brief research showed me.

  15. 15

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: I mean the Brexiteers were mad at all those damn Pollacks taking their jobs (among other things).

  16. 16
    opiejeanne says:

    @Ridnik Chrome: apropos of only the music: Viking Kittens

  17. 17
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodingers_cat:
    Yes, I did see your response.

  18. 18
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Yet in the past the failure to be “white” at the time was more than enough for immigrants to be despised. The Irish, the Italian, were just not good enough for some. Admittedly, much of that has to do with Catholicism, but in the case of the Italians it’s all that swarthyness.

  19. 19
    laura says:

    @burnspbesq: The banality of evil. The vaneer of respectability. The inside voice of racist institutional power. The face of Gomer Pyle.
    Don’t turn your back for one moment on this delusional, power hungry, evil, racist shite bag.

  20. 20
    bemused says:

    All of GOP is vile in levels from very high to extremely high. Cotton is one of the worst people on earth.

    It’s my own fault that I clicked on nyt link in Judd Legum’s tweet that Brooks argued after 17 gunned down in high school, the most important thing is to be polite and deferential. The title “Respect First, Then Gun Control” should have made me stop right there. I need to atone for my stupidity somehow.

  21. 21
    Thoughtful David says:

    Ruh-roh. WaPo: Manafort/Gates colleague Alex Van der Zwaan set to plead guilty to lying to the FBI later today. Another felony racked up by Mueller.
    Tick-tock, motherfuckers.

  22. 22
    opiejeanne says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: And anyone of Greek origin. 30 years ago my friend overheard her future husband’s family say to him, “I thought you were marrying a white girl!”. She was Greek.

  23. 23
    condorcet runner-up says:

    Sen. Tom Cotton (R-AR) left the chamber with a spring in his step

    These people are ghouls.

  24. 24

    I doubt Trump will veto a DACA bill. He’s probably too chickenshit.

    The moment it’s legally clear to do so, I expect Dreamers to start being deported regularly. It is horrifying and disgusting, but elections have consequences and Trump was elected specifically on a white supremacy platform. I hope like Hell we can stop this in time, but…

    Most Republicans, elected and voting, want this and want it a whole Hell of a lot. There’s a big chunk who would rather not say it. That’s a steep mountain to climb to save these poor people.

    This was always the most grim and sad result of the election, the thing Trump is probably not stupid enough to fail at.

    We need to vote. We need to get control of Congress and bully Trump into signing fixes. It doesn’t take a lot of Republican senatorial defectors on the most obvious stuff.

  25. 25
    guachi says:

    I think Gates flipped on van der Zwaan.

  26. 26

    @Frankensteinbeck: I also expect the deportations to start as soon as he can, but I’m hoping he applies his trademark incompetence.

  27. 27
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @guachi: and VDZ had pleaded (not pled, huh? I think pled sounds better) guilty. A high powered lawyer pleading guilty… doesn’t that suggest another flip?

  28. 28

    @Frankensteinbeck: People with no criminal records are being regularly deported or being detained already. Check out the case of the chemistry prof. Syed who lost status between losing a job and going back to school. His deportation has a stay order but he is being incarcerated.

    The current path to citizenship is narrow and difficult, what the Rs want to do is make it narrower still in the guise of “helping” DACA recipients.

  29. 29
    kindness says:

    Cotton…..I wish karma was more instant than it is. Of course if that had been the case some good GI would have fragged the bastard (with votes?) in Iraq.

  30. 30
    gvg says:

    If there were a large enough contingent of British immigrants coming here, the fearful party would become anglophobes. the traits that make them anti immigrant, make them afraid of large groups of different. Migrations change the power. 1 or 2 individuals don’t.

  31. 31

    @Amir Khalid: How is your pinkie finger, no more problems I hope.

  32. 32
    Jeffro says:

    Interrupting this thread briefly to mention that David Brooks can absolutely, positively, go fuck himself.

    Now back to the thread…I think Guachi and Jim, Foolish Literalist are both right: Gates flipped on his own lawyer, and now the lawyer is taking a deal and flipping his own self. Flip Flip Flippity Flip. Or as so many here would put it, tick tock, motherfuckers.

  33. 33

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:
    I disagree. An examination of history shows that standards keep moving as new alliances are required to maintain white power. Catholics and evangelicals joining forces in America because the secular threat has become overwhelming is a fine example. They would welcome white immigrants who would help reduce America’s brownness. Note that sufficiently white-skinned Hispanics have already joined the racist cause. Meanwhile, in a much less brown country like England, the racists still have room to say Poles and Slavs aren’t white enough.

  34. 34

    @Jeffro: Wait whut? This sounds confusing. What does flipping on your lawyer mean? IANAL, obviously. This is too meta and complicated.

  35. 35
    Steeplejack says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Maybe a frail hope, because ICE has been the model of steely efficiency lately.

  36. 36

    @Jeffro: i read the first few paragraphs of that Brooks article to confirm that it was terrible and it exceeded my expectations.

  37. 37
    StringOnAStick says:

    If commenter Peale is around, I’d like to let he/she know that their additional wisdom teeth, while quite rare, is not unheard of. While two on the side seems odd, the way teeth form is a single tooth “seed” splits and each migrates to the proper spot to grow into the final tooth (in the vast majority of cases). It looks like you had a residual “seed”, it split as usual but they didn’t migrate much.

    My boss DDS tells patients that there is a sweet spot for getting wisdom teeth removed. The crowns of teeth form first, then the root forms as it pushes into position. If wisdom teeth are extracted before enough root has formed then there is a small risk that some root cells will be left behind and then keep making root for the already extracted crown, which likely means going in after that at some point. Wait too long to extract wisdom teeth and they have fully formed roots so a bit harder to get out. On the lower jaw this can be critical because the root can wrap around the main nerve channel and extraction can lead to nerve damage that leaves those teeth and half the tongue permanently numb (this is why you want an oral surgeon, not a general DDS doing these extractions).

    The reason why Peale’s DDS wants an additional scan is this is an exotic case a d no one wants any further surprises. I’m sure they want a 3D scan, a really good idea in such a situation. That answers a lot of questions about exactly where these teeth are in relationship to other things like sinuses, roots of other teeth, etc.

  38. 38
    condorcet runner-up says:

    @opiejeanne: You would be amazed at how often I end up arguing with certain fellow Greek-Americans, because they have this mistaken belief that they wouldn’t be swept up in anti immigrant hysteria. These are people who still speak English with a heavy Greek accent, and yet they remain staunch GOP supporters.

  39. 39
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodingers_cat:
    It is still attached to me, and has turned out not to be any problem at all for guitar playing.

  40. 40
    oatler. says:

    @opiejeanne: Jon Lovitz’s Dukakis: “My parents were little people..little swarthy people…”
    Speaking as a half Greek.

  41. 41
    rikyrah says:

    @Thoughtful David:

    Tick-tock, motherfuckers.

    Where is Yarrow?

  42. 42
    opiejeanne says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: I know a couple of people who seem young to me but are probably too old to have enrolled in DACA; mid-30s. College was not their goal but staying in this country is. They have jobs, pay taxes, have children, and are now figuring out how to buy houses. It can change your attitude about the undocumented when they’re someone you know and like and you find it out long after you get to know them.

  43. 43
    rikyrah says:

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    The moment it’s legally clear to do so, I expect Dreamers to start being deported regularly. It is horrifying and disgusting, but elections have consequences and Trump was elected specifically on a white supremacy platform. I hope like Hell we can stop this in time, but…

    Most Republicans, elected and voting, want this and want it a whole Hell of a lot. There’s a big chunk who would rather not say it. That’s a steep mountain to climb to save these poor people.

    MAKE.THEM.OWN.IT.

  44. 44

    @opiejeanne:

    It can change your attitude about the undocumented when they’re someone you know and like and you find it out long after you get to know them.

    Remember that trump voter profile where the small town of trump voters was aghast that their kindly shop owner, who they knew was undocumented, got rounded up? I seem to recall that EVEN HIS WIFE was a trump voter, because they all knew he was one of the good ones and would be safe.

  45. 45

    @Steeplejack: President Kelly transformed it into a lean mean deporting machine when he headed the DHS. Credit where credit is due. Unlike the rest of the gang that can’t shoot straight, the Marine general is efficient.

  46. 46
    opiejeanne says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I stumbled onto that Brooks piece, probably the same link on Twitter, and couldn’t back out fast enough. I ws pissed off at the first sentence.

  47. 47
    rikyrah says:

    @Jeffro:
    WAIT….

    Gates FLIPPED ON HIS OWN LAWYER?

    DA PHUQ?

  48. 48
    bystander says:

    @Patricia Kayden: The racist “sh*thole” remark was the truthtelling part. Acting as if they want to do anything other than deport the Dreamers is the lie part. The repubs will never propose any solution other than the default one: deportation.

  49. 49
    Davis X. Machina says:

    Cotton’s getting ready for 2020. He’s seen the LDL/HDL ratio, and the calendar, and the special prosecutor.

    He knows the best hater gets the GOP nomination should there be no incumbent.

  50. 50
    StringOnAStick says:

    @laura: Hey, I wanted to say thanks for your kind comments regarding my husband. Some lifestyle changes have his WBC count down to only one half point above normal.

    How is your father doing?

  51. 51
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @rikyrah: Who pays your lawyers’ bills can be very important. Cf. Watergate….

  52. 52

    @condorcet runner-up: There are some high skilled Indian immigrants stuck in decades long GC queues who think sucking up to the Rs is what will come to their rescue.

  53. 53
  54. 54
    opiejeanne says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Ok, maybe it doesn’t change minds enough to understand the consequences of a vote.

    I didn’t hear that particular horror story but plenty of others. I saw the man who was weeping when he was reunited with his mother, weeping because he’d been deported to the “Old Country”, Poland maybe.

  55. 55
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Not sure who flipped on whom, but I hope the Trump cartel’s lawyers see this charge by Mueller as a high-and-tight fastball. Will they be willing to go down for their scumbag clients?

  56. 56

    @Major Major Major Major: His wife probably wanted to get rid of him, anyway. No cost divorce. I judge people by their actions for talk is cheap.

  57. 57
    Immanentize says:

    @rikyrah:
    It is basically a mob movie all up and down the chain.

    I wanna know why Trump’s personal lawyer, Cohen, is still a member of any bar. I want to see him type: IANAL.

  58. 58
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    You know trump is afraid of horses.

    Also sharks.
    Also stairs.
    Also germs.

    Apart from everything else, the man appears to be a seething stew of phobias.

  59. 59
  60. 60
    The Moar You Know says:

    I’m trying to look at this from the GOPs point of view, a mental exercise very akin to swimming in a hot tub full of septic tank contents, but I cannot see any downside for them to torpedo the whole DACA thing and start deporting ASAP. They personally don’t care, their voters are all for it, and their donors, even the nation Chamber of Commerce, will go along. I thought the Chamber’s addiction to low-cost labor and financial clout would win the day but instead they have caved, like every other institution.

  61. 61

    @opiejeanne: Desperate people do stupid and immoral and ultimately self-destructive things.

  62. 62
    rikyrah says:

    @Immanentize:

    I wanna know why Trump’s personal lawyer, Cohen, is still a member of any bar. I want to see him type: IANAL.

    I think it was LarryO last night who had on a former IRS person, trying to explain the problems of Cohen from the IRS POV. LarryO had to cut him off – time issue, but I want that guy back on, because he was explaining how Cohen pretty much phucked himself, talking about he paid the porn star out of own money. I wouldn’t be shocked to hear one of these days that Cohen spent some time with Bobby Three Sticks.

  63. 63
    Jumbo76 says:

    I got into a discussion with Patroclus and Major Major Major Major the other day regarding the “Common Sense” compromise. I would like to ask a follow up, if either of you would like to answer:

    Why was that compromise acceptable but the Grassley bill wasn’t?

  64. 64
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @rikyrah:

    Where is Yarrow?

    I’ve wondered the same thing for a couple of weeks now, and I think one of the threads yesterday also had several people concerned. Certainly hope he’s okay — vacationing, or just taking a sanity break — and not in any difficulties.

  65. 65
    msb says:

    We have much to remember when voting this year – I plan to add to my list the R’s casual cruelty in keeping millions of people in anxiety and uncertainty.

  66. 66
    Steeplejack says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    Yup. The Leopards Deporting My Neighbor Party.

  67. 67
    LAO says:

    @Immanentize: Good morning! Cohen isn’t a lawyer in a traditional sense. He’s a fixer — I doubt’s he’s stepped foot in a courtroom or drafted any meaningful legal documents.

  68. 68

    @The Moar You Know:

    I thought the Chamber’s addiction to low-cost labor and financial clout would win the day but instead they have caved

    The key is realizing rich people are even more racist than poor people.

  69. 69
    mai naem mobile says:

    @rikyrah: I was watching that. I hope ODonnell took it off live teevee and continued it off screen and taped the rest of it for today. Either that or have him back on.

  70. 70
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Jumbo76: I’m not either of those commenters, but I believe the Grassley bill curtailed legal immigration across the board, whereas the “Common Sense” bill placed legal immigration restrictions only on the parents of people in DACA status. Both provisions are cruel, but Grassley’s is substantially more so.

  71. 71

    @Betty Cracker: the Grassley bill was just the administration’s wish list. Like, literally.

  72. 72
    mai naem mobile says:

    I know this is not exactly for everybody but,honestly, if I was a DACA.person after Dolt45 came in and I was single I would find a ‘mutually beneficial arrangement’ and get my GC. I know a couple of Filipinas who married good for nothing wife beater losers who got their GCSs that way. It’s a means to an end. I also don’t understand why some of them don’t have citizenship when they’ve married what appear to be US citizens.

  73. 73
    Betty Cracker says:

    @mai naem mobile: Marrying a US citizen can usually prevent deportation but does NOT automatically confer citizenship. Getting citizenship is a long, arduous and expensive process.

  74. 74
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Yep. It was the exact same terms Trump outlined. IIRC, Trump threatened to veto the “Common Sense” bill, which was identical except it applied legal immigration restrictions only to DACA recipients’ parents. So, if he remains consistent (which isn’t a safe bet), that means Trump will accept nothing less than the terms he originally outlined (“negotiation”), and DACA folks are screwed unless the courts intervene to help them, which doesn’t seem likely.

  75. 75

    @Betty Cracker: Not just that it put all other undocumented immigrants on a fast track to deportation with ICE acting as both the judge and the jury. The path to citizenship for dreamers was more like a tightrope walk over a fiery pit, where a job loss could land you in deportation proceedings.

  76. 76
    Brachiator says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I don’t know whether you saw my comment on yesterday’s thread, you were right about AG in A Passage to India as my brief research showed me.

    Great novel, one of the most exquisite works in the English language. So so film.

    @The Moar You Know:

    I’m trying to look at this from the GOPs point of view, a mental exercise very akin to swimming in a hot tub full of septic tank contents, but I cannot see any downside for them to torpedo the whole DACA thing and start deporting ASAP. They personally don’t care, their voters are all for it, and their donors, even the nation Chamber of Commerce, will go along.

    Dreamers are not cheap immigrant labor, so the money interests don’t care one way or another what happens to them. Any immigration bill that emerges would still have provisions allowing for businesses to get workers and screw citizens and residents.

    Some military people have voiced strong support from Dreamers in various service branches, but the angry mob cannot be appeased by any appeal to patriotism.

  77. 77
    Jumbo76 says:

    I have read all the comments above relating to my question. Here’s my problem. I was criticized for saying the common sense bill still sucked because it included funding for a border wall. That was more than I was willing to give up. And it seemed to me that the response was essentially, shouldn’t we give that up to help 1.8 million people. Yes, maybe we should. But why shouldn’t we give up more? Why shouldn’t we go all the way to Grassley? If the real problem is helping these people, well, everyone else has a line they won’t cross either. Why is my line worse than your line?

    Anyway, I know you all will call me a troll and a purity pony and whatever. But I’m actually serious about this. The dreamers are going to get kicked out of the country, because Dems won’t go the full Stephen Miller. The suffering we wanted to avoid will come about. Why is that acceptable with respect to the Grassley bill but not the common sense bill?

  78. 78

    The problem with the current immigration system that the number of permanent resident slots per year are too few and the paths to reach them are narrow. Our system is rigid and unfair to immigrants, from doctors to farm laborers and everyone in between.
    The economy is dependent on the fruits of immigrant labor but is unwilling to treat them in a humane and a fair fashion. This is before we even get to the anti-immigrant hysteria whipped up by the current occupant of the WH. The Grassley-Cotton bill was intended to make the system even more unfair and inhumane to potential and current immigrants. And by that I mean not the people who are overseas but many who are currently living and working here on various work visas, the undocumented and the TPS holders whose status is being terminated in months.

  79. 79

    @Betty Cracker: It depends on whether you have ever been out of status. A non-citizen has to be in a lawful status, always. If you let your status lapse (while changing jobs or going back to school and leaving your job) you are in deep trouble.
    If you have always been in status then GC application usually involves an interview with both partners to determine that the marriage is not just for the purpose of getting a GC. Then when your initial application gets approved you undergo a medical checkup and a background check. If everything is OK. You get a GC. You can apply for citizenship three years after you actually physically get your green card.

  80. 80
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Jumbo76: Since we’re arguing about acceptable levels of harm, there really are no good answers. If it were up to me, I’d definitely waste money on a stupid, racist wall that can be torn down to save the DREAMers — people over symbolism and financial prudence. I’d be willing to accept some awful terms to save the DREAMers, but elected Democrats aren’t willing to go there, and I completely understand why. Maybe they’re right; I know I’m not objective since it affects family.

  81. 81
    Uncle Ebeneezer says:

    @Frankensteinbeck: Nah, it’s the realization that White Supremacy>>>Economic Concerns. Hypothetical: If you could somehow cut taxes to 0% across the board, in a way that would help make life better for those people, I’m pretty sure Republicans (rich and poor) would reject it.

  82. 82
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Betty Cracker: It turns out to be moot, anyway, since “The Wall in exchange for DACA” was never actually a feasible deal. As such, it becomes something kind of like Obama’s rejected budget deals–a thing you can use rhetorically to illustrate how unreasonable the other side is. (Not that that matters much either.)

  83. 83
    mai naem mobile says:

    @Betty Cracker: I am an immigrant so trust me I know. My dad came on a business visa and it cost $50K in legal fees alone in the 80s. It took about about 10 years. Had to travel back to home country for documentation etc.

  84. 84
    Brachiator says:

    @Jumbo76:

    And it seemed to me that the response was essentially, shouldn’t we give that up to help 1.8 million people.

    There is more to the immigration issue than just helping the Dreamers.

    @schrodingers_cat:

    It depends on whether you have ever been out of status. A non-citizen has to be in a lawful status, always. If you let your status lapse (while changing jobs or going back to school and leaving your job) you are in deep trouble.

    Yep. This almost happened with a co-worker.

  85. 85
    Barry says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: “Cotton is unspeakable racist scum. I’d love to see what his “supports EO” block looks like on his OERs.”

    Probably like John Kelly’s. We need a purge of the military.

  86. 86
    Betty Cracker says:

    @mai naem mobile: I misunderstood your last sentence at #72, then. Sounded like you were saying you didn’t understand why they weren’t citizens if they’d married US citizens.

  87. 87

    The express goal of immigration restrictionists is to go back to the system we had in place in the 1920s, the Reed-Johnson act, Grassley-Cotton bill would have been a big step in that direction. So I am glad that the Ds held strong.

  88. 88
    mai naem mobile says:

    @Betty Cracker: I should have said GC but I don’t understand that either. I wouldn’t have thought a GC would be an issue.

  89. 89
    Jumbo76 says:

    @Brachiator:

    Yes, that is actually my point. My problem is that I was called a troll and a purity pony because I said I was against funding a border wall. I softened on that in the course of the discussion, but anyway. The thing is that everyone else has something that goes too far for them—something that they won’t compromise on even if it helps dreamers. The Grassley bill goes too far for everyone, it seems. You can’t really attack people for drawing the line in a different place if the end result is the same, ie, no help for dreamers.

  90. 90
    mai naem mobile says:

    @schrodingers_cat: they don’t always have an interview. I think the interview thing has been exaggerated by the Green Card romcom movies.I know a couple of people who never had an interview.

  91. 91
    Betty Cracker says:

    @mai naem mobile: From my second-hand knowledge of the process, it takes years and thousands of dollars for a resident alien who is married to a U.S. citizen to get a GC too.

  92. 92
    Jumbo76 says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    Yes, and let me be clear that elected Republicans are also unwilling to do enough to reduce this suffering. It’s not just (or at all) the Democrats’s fault.

  93. 93

    @mai naem mobile: A few of my friends have had to go through the interview.

  94. 94
  95. 95

    @Betty Cracker: No, getting the green card is harder than getting citizenship. OK that’s probably what you are saying as well.

    ETA: By resident alien do you mean someone on a temporary visa.

  96. 96
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Jumbo76: I blame every bit of this on the Republicans, starting with Trump, who triggered the DACA crisis by arbitrarily ending the DACA program.

  97. 97
    Betty Cracker says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Not in this particular case. It’s a long story.

  98. 98

    @Betty Cracker: I am sorry I was rude to you in last week’s DACA thread. I could have made my point in a better fashion. BTW how is your doggie, does she miss her sister.

  99. 99
    Brachiator says:

    @Jumbo76:

    Yes, that is actually my point. My problem is that I was called a troll and a purity pony because I said I was against funding a border wall. I softened on that in the course of the discussion, but anyway. The thing is that everyone else has something that goes too far for them—something that they won’t compromise on even if it helps dreamers. The Grassley bill goes too far for everyone, it seems. You can’t really attack people for drawing the line in a different place if the end result is the same, ie, no help for dreamers.

    My priorities would be
    1. Immigration law
    2. Dreamers
    100. The wall

  100. 100
    JR says:

    @cmorenc: Actually, on some level they would be. After all, there is a common anti-immigrant thread in our nation’s history. Evil people will take any expedient.

  101. 101
    Betty Cracker says:

    @schrodingers_cat: No worries. It’s an emotional subject — it’s about families. Daisy Mayhem is okay. She’s an old lady now, so she frequently flops down in a sunny spot and takes a nap.

  102. 102
    BellyCat says:

    Interesting NPR story (I know… captive in the car) a few days ago suggesting strong support for Dreamers (as well as immigration) from the Bible Thumpers since immigrants are saving something like 1/4 to 1/3 of failing churches by taking them over, with new, very active congregations. Story was focused on Texas, but the phenomenon applies (in lower percentages) anywhere there are high immigration numbers of similar ethnicities.

    Democrats and Evangelicals. Strange bedfellows….

  103. 103
    mai naem mobile says:

    @Betty Cracker: it is completely the Republicans’ fault. I don’t remember the time line but I fervently wish the Dems had not gotten played by the GOP and wasted so much time trying to get a compromise on O-Care. Immigration could have been taken care of then. I remember the Hispanic groups complaining in 2010 and they were right.

  104. 104
    Cckids says:

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    Most Republicans, elected and voting, want this and want it a whole Hell of a lot. There’s a big chunk who would rather not say it. That’s a steep mountain to climb to save these poor people.

    Yes. I think most of us remember Kimmel’s horrifying sit-down with the Dreamer, her child & boyfriend vs the Trump voters, and how hateful they were willing to be. Kimmel has said that the active footage was MUCH worse, they edited it down to avoid claims that they were favoring the “liberal” side.
    Trumpers hate, hate, HATE. It’s who they are, at base. They can put a face over it, and be decent at times, but it is only a faćade.

  105. 105
    SgrAstar says:

    @mai naem mobile: it’s not that easy to get a GC, even if you have married a US citizen. My hubby is a Brit and we had to jump through all kinds of hoops. The process in no way feels like a slam dunk…it was actually pretty intimidating, and it happened years ago. I’m sure that today it’s much worse.

  106. 106
    mai naem mobile says:

    @SgrAstar: it isn’t easy but it’s the easiest fastest way of all the options. I know a few people who got their GC pretty quickly. Granted, almost all have used immigration lawyers. My sister is involved a lot at our temple and the priests and assistants at the temple come here from India or Nepal on some kind of special visa. Almost all of them stick around for 5 years for their GC and then go off and find regular work or start their businesses or whatever. Sometimes I think the US should just have regular work visas like they have in the ME countries and not grant citizenship but that would completely change this country within a few generations.

  107. 107

    @SgrAstar: GC by marriage to a US citizen is one of the easiest paths available. It is telling that even the easy path is quite difficult. The truth about immigration is unlike the stories T company feed the media, that immigration is a walk in the park and immigrants are moochers or worse.

  108. 108
    Betty Cracker says:

    @schrodingers_cat: I really wish the Beltway media would push back harder on the lies about how easy it is to immigrate. I mean, it’s public information — they could talk to immigration lawyers, interview actual immigrants and study government statistics to get the truth. It’s not like we have to take the liar president’s word for it! I had no clue what immigration entailed until it affected my family, and I assume most other people who aren’t directly affected don’t know either. Great opportunity for the media to do their goddamned job and educate the public!

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