Florida Woman vs. Florida Man

In case you missed it, here’s a speech by a young woman, Emma Gonzalez, who survived the Douglas High School massacre. She calls out Trump, the NRA, Senator Grassley and the other cowardly shits who have done nothing while people, including school children, are slaughtered by maniacs with easy access to weapons of war:

I’m so damn proud of these kids. Some highlights for the video-phobes:

If the President wants to come up to me and tell me to my face that it was a terrible tragedy and how it should never have happened and maintain telling us how nothing is going to be done about it, I’m going to happily ask him how much money he received from the National Rifle Association.

You want to know something? It doesn’t matter, because I already know. Thirty million dollars. And divided by the number of gunshot victims in the United States in the one and one-half months in 2018 alone, that comes out to being $5,800. Is that how much these people are worth to you, Trump? If you don’t do anything to prevent this from continuing to occur, that number of gunshot victims will go up and the number that they are worth will go down. And we will be worthless to you.

To every politician who is taking donations from the NRA, shame on you.

[Crowd chants: “Shame on you!”]

If your money was as threatened as us, would your first thought be, how is this going to reflect on my campaign? Which should I choose? Or would you choose us, and if you answered us, will you act like it for once? You know what would be a good way to act like it? I have an example of how to not act like it. In February of 2017, one year ago, President Trump repealed an Obama-era regulation that would have made it easier to block the sale of firearms to people with certain mental illnesses.

From the interactions that I had with the shooter before the shooting and from the information that I currently know about him, I don’t really know if he was mentally ill. I wrote this before I heard what Delaney said. Delaney said he was diagnosed. I don’t need a psychologist and I don’t need to be a psychologist to know that repealing that regulation was a really dumb idea.

Republican Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa was the sole sponsor on this bill that stops the FBI from performing background checks on people adjudicated to be mentally ill and now he’s stating for the record, ‘Well, it’s a shame the FBI isn’t doing background checks on these mentally ill people.’ Well, duh. You took that opportunity away last year.

The people in the government who were voted into power are lying to us. And us kids seem to be the only ones who notice and our parents to call BS.Companies trying to make caricatures of the teenagers these days, saying that all we are self-involved and trend-obsessed and they hush us into submission when our message doesn’t reach the ears of the nation, we are prepared to call BS. Politicians who sit in their gilded House and Senate seats funded by the NRA telling us nothing could have been done to prevent this, we call BS. They say tougher guns laws do not decrease gun violence. We call BS. They say a good guy with a gun stops a bad guy with a gun. We call BS. They say guns are just tools like knives and are as dangerous as cars. We call BS. They say no laws could have prevented the hundreds of senseless tragedies that have occurred. We call BS. That us kids don’t know what we’re talking about, that we’re too young to understand how the government works. We call BS.

If you agree, register to vote. Contact your local congresspeople. Give them a piece of your mind.

[Crowd chants: “Throw them out!]

Several hundred folks in my part of Florida — hundreds of miles from the Douglas High massacre — had a rally against gun violence yesterday. Wouldn’t it be ironic as shit if FLORIDA, of all fucking places, ends up being the birthplace of gun sanity?

Meanwhile, from his Disgraceland estate in Florida, Trump uses dead kids and teachers as human shields:

That deranged globule of rancid marmalade is on a Twitter tear this morning. I’m not going to subject you to further rantings from that quarter in this post, but it confirms what we already knew: Now that Trump can no longer deny Russia’s cyber attack on U.S. democracy, he’s casting himself as its chief victim, and he’ll do absolutely nothing to stop further attacks.

Like the high school kids in Florida, we must find the courage to put an end to this bullshit ourselves. Our government, as presently constituted, isn’t going to help us. We have to change it.

116 replies
  1. 1
  2. 2
    mawado says:

    Maybe it’s just the coffee kicking in, but it dawns on me, Fred Trump was a war profiteer, klansman, and civil rights opponent.

    Yet, somehow, his son managed to become an embarrassment to him.

  3. 3
    tobie says:

    Loved the call-out to register to vote after that impassioned speech. Go, Emma. Go, youth. Demographics are on our side.

  4. 4
    donnah says:

    I’m seeing a lot of more positive thinking about our strength as a country against guns. While school shootings like Columbine and Sandy Hook ripped our hearts to pieces and left us dazed and helpless, the survivors and parents from Florida are on message, they’re communicating anger and resolve effectively, and they’re inspiring grassroots groups to gel.

    MADD did it, and I know there are already groups formed to make a stand against gun violence, so we need to focus on what angles will work in mass media and how to make our state and national representatives understand that we are not going to lie down on this.

  5. 5
    Magda in Black says:

    Goddess bless these young people who haven’t learned submission and state quite clearly that the emperor has no clothes. Hi, major media, I’m looking at you…..

  6. 6
    Jeffro says:

    “Deranged globule of rancid marmalade” – excuse me, 911? I’d like to report a murder…

    And the answer to your question is yes. If Florida somehow became the center of American anti-gun efforts that would indeed be peak irony

  7. 7
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    That deranged globule of rancid marmalade

    You don’t even take time off on the weekend, do you?

  8. 8
    Adam L Silverman says:

  9. 9

    @mawado:

    Yet, somehow, his son managed to become an embarrassment to him.

    I was about to say “say what you will about Donald, at least his son isn’t Donald trump” but then I remembered who his sons are.

  10. 10
    JPL says:

    @mawado: If I was drinking coffee while reading that, I would have spit it all over my keyboard. You are right!

  11. 11
    glory b says:

    Not an open thread, but Jill Stein is spinning her a** off on msnbc right now. She’s talking about the DNC rigging the election for Clinton in response to her being mentioned in the indictment.

    Her voice sounds kind of high pitched and nervous. Claiming studies (which she doesn’t name) saying 60% of her voters wouldn’t have voted if she wasn’t on the ballot and it’s the arrogance of the Dems. Neoliberal Obama admin, smear campaign about her, Dems denigrating the resistance, same as saying Black Lives Matter was Russian, silencing progressive voices, etc.

    Nothing about Repubs. Hmmm.

  12. 12

    @glory b: has anybody asked her about her fete with Putin and Flynn?

  13. 13
    foucault swing voter mistermix says:

    I posted a link to the March 24 march in my last post. Cameron Kasky, a high school junior from Douglas, is a great spokesman for the cause. His interview with CNN is linked there.

  14. 14
    Amaranthine RBG says:

    @glory b:

    Another white woman ruining America.

  15. 15

    Hey look, a gun-humping troll talking about pie.

  16. 16
    FlyingToaster (Tablet) says:

    I know that Massachusetts gets vilified for our gun laws, which involve membership in a shooting range or hunting group, and convincing your municipal PD that you’re not a fucking hazard to your neighbors. Plus they inspect your storage and transport (reinforced gun locker or closet). If I’d learn to shoot, we could get a permit, but with only one adult capable and a kid, our PD would be reluctant to let us keep a weapon at home. 10k pop/sqmi gives us some focus.

  17. 17
    zhena gogolia says:

    She is magnificent. Wish she were president.

  18. 18
    No Drought No More says:

    I submit it’s changing before our eyes. Take, for example, Jill Stein’s performance this very moment on MSNBC. Stein is clearly terrified, perhaps of Mueller, but as likely, of her place in American history. I take heart in the obvious, you might say; in knowing that Trump’s treason is- inescapably- a watershed moment in the history of the United States, and that Americans such as that very young lady can muster, from their spirit in the moment, words such as she spoke at that service.

  19. 19
    Radiumgirl says:

    Propaganda can be very effective until it slams into direct, personal experience. Once you realize that the official story is a lie–because your lived experience is exactly the opposite–that’s when the spell is broken.

    I don’t know what critical mass is when it comes to turning the tide on mass shootings in America, but I agree that it is coming, and it will come from the next generation rising up and taking their place in civil society.

    The analogies to smoking are entirely apt. Big Tobacco had a stranglehold on Congress until it didn’t — and the same thing is going to happen to the gun lobby.

  20. 20
    Luthe says:

    I think Florida will be the megaphone for gun safety. Places like Connecticut, New York, and Massachusetts already beat them to the “birthplace” part.

    Of course, any and all new regulation will be for naught if Justice Gorsuch et al. get a challenge to the new laws placed before them.

  21. 21
    Adria McDowell says:

    Gonzalez, huh? Don’t worry, I’m sure ICE is investigating her and her family’s “immigration status,” even if her ancestor was Ponce de Leon himself.

    Get him, Emma, get him!

  22. 22
    scav says:

    Suddenly there’re going to be cries of “Ignore the Children!” heard from the usual suspects.

  23. 23
    Mr Stagger Lee says:

    The kids are definetly alright I like the quip of one them who asked why are politicians freaked about “Rainbow Colored wedding cakes, but not dead kids” another one asked about why the protecting kids from the bathroom but not AR-15’s? Sadly though in my old stomping grounds in Ohio, it is like Hitler in the bunkers, the bitter enders, no sign of compromise, no clue.

  24. 24
    Zach says:

    Emma 2022! (sadly, need to be 21 for Florida state legislature).

    This is what gun control advocates need to do. Emotional appeals from victims with the goal of allowing communities to be gun free if they want to be. Move the goal posts. Do we need another assault weapons ban? Yes. But you need a more inspiring goal than that: something that would actually stop school massacres if enacted. That means making it possible for communities to ban guns and funding gun buybacks. Accepting anything less than that as a goal for your movement dooms you to defeatism in the face of continued massacres that the changes you’re advocating for likely wouldn’t have prevented, anyway.

    Obviously this runs afoul of the current interpretation of the 2nd amendment, but the Supreme Court didn’t consider taking up gay marriage until there was a popular movement in favor of it with near majority support. Force the Court to overturn local gun bans and buybacks over and over again until people start demanding a right to life/liberty/happiness be prioritized over a right to infinite guns.

  25. 25
    KD says:

    The vague language about ‘common-sense’ gun laws from current lobbying groups and gun control advocates is really unhelpful x and not effective as a rallying cry – nobody really knows what this means. A much simpler, straightforward, and rhetorically familiar rallying cry ought to be – LICENSE, INSURANCE, REGISTRATION. How many times have we heard that phrase, and how easy it is to repeat in a chant. And it should be the simple answer everyone gives to every single adult – Republican or Democrat – waffling about ‘what can we do’.

  26. 26
    satby says:

    There’s a gun control rally in downtown Chicago today. I only know because a formerly not very political friend posted on FB she was in her way to it. People are riled up, here’s hoping that anger lasts until November.

  27. 27
    cain says:

    @Radiumgirl:

    The analogies to smoking are entirely apt. Big Tobacco had a stranglehold on Congress until it didn’t — and the same thing is going to happen to the gun lobby.

    They are a dead man walking. The forthcoming generation who are the victims of these shootings are going to kick their ass. The GOP time is over. The final gasp is coming and we can finally wave goodbye to all the Nixonian assholes that have been in ratfucking this country for past 50 years. Can’t wait for age to wipe these assholes out.

  28. 28
    LevelB says:

    Words fail me. Thank God for that young woman.

  29. 29
    cain says:

    @Adria McDowell:

    Gonzalez, huh? Don’t worry, I’m sure ICE is investigating her and her family’s “immigration status,” even if her ancestor was Ponce de Leon himself.

    Let them try. That will only piss off the teens even further because it is such an obvious tactic. Deport the parents and pile tragedy on top of someone who was brave enough to speak for a generation. Yeah, try it assholes.

  30. 30
    oatler. says:

    @cain: “Can’t wait for age to wipe these assholes out.”
    That’s what I thought…fifty years ago. O what a piece of work is man.

  31. 31
    zhena gogolia says:

    @KD:

    It also saves you from the trap of, “Oh, you can’t tell the difference between a semi-automatic and an automatic? Then how can you be saying anything about this issue? You don’t know the difference between a cartridge and a clip!” Damn right, I don’t, because I’m not a gun-humper.

  32. 32
    scott (the other one) says:

    I am seriously sorry she’s not yet old enough to run for Congress. She is awesome.

  33. 33
    Zach says:

    @Radiumgirl:

    The analogies to smoking are entirely apt. Big Tobacco had a stranglehold on Congress until it didn’t — and the same thing is going to happen to the gun lobby.

    Yup. And the NRA is really overstepping right now with the fascist ad campaigns in ways that’ll alienate their non-deplorable supporters (e.g. ~20% of the 50% of people who are pro-gun because it’s prerequisite for Republican tribalism, but don’t really care that much). We also haven’t gotten the full story yet about corruption within the NRA related to Russian influence and money laundering. Any organization that wins that much political influence will inevitably fail because of internal corruption, and the NRA seems to be at that point.

  34. 34
    zhena gogolia says:

    I do wish, after years of contributing to Brady Campaign and Giffords’s organization and Josh Horwitz’s organization and our Connecticut organization, that there were one big obvious anti-gun lobbyist, analogous to NRA, that we could all contribute to instead of fragmenting our efforts.

  35. 35

    @KD: That’s a good point. I’m borrowing it to tweet.

  36. 36
    Waldo says:

    How hard would it be for Trumpov to get in front of this by setting up a do-nothing commission to fake an investigation of Russian (or more generically, foreign) election hacking?

    Someone needs to tell him there’s more to traitoring than angry twittering.

  37. 37
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @oatler.:

    The war will be over by Christmas.

    Originally stated by someone every year during the Hundred Years War. Now stated by someone every year in Afghanistan. Eventually someone will be right.

  38. 38
    gene108 says:

    @satby:

    People are riled up, here’s hoping that anger lasts until November.

    My mom retired recently. She moved from NC to NJ to be closer to her kids.

    She is new to the area. She voted regularly but was not active politically.

    She is volunteering for the Dem challenger to oust the Republican incumbent in our district.

    There is something changing.

  39. 39
    Baud says:

    @Adria McDowell:

    I’m sure ICE is investigating her and her family’s “immigration status,” even if her ancestor was Ponce de Leon himself.

    I hope Emma doesn’t have a private email server.

  40. 40
    Aimai says:

    @KD: you do realize that “common sense gun laws” was chosen WITH A LOT OF THOUGHT prdcisely because it polled well? I want a toral ban myself but Christ I’m sick of commenters running in with their amateur hour analysis. Your slogan was rejected because it created enormous backlash not because people were too mealeymouthed.

  41. 41
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @zhena gogolia:

    You don’t know the difference between a cartridge magazine and a clip!”

    Now you’re all set!//

  42. 42
    Zach says:

    @cain:

    They are a dead man walking. The forthcoming generation who are the victims of these shootings are going to kick their ass. The GOP time is over.

    Democrats sat back and were complacent about their inevitable victories thanks to changing American demographics. Meanwhile, the GOP won all the state legislatures, gerrymandered their way into at least a generation of disproportionate representation, likely stole a Presidency, and definitely stole a Supreme court seat.

    Voters have very short memories in American politics. The country has moved ~20 points on gay rights/marriage. How many consequences did the GOP face for vile anti-gay rhetoric that peaked around 2004? What consequence has the GOP faced for racist campaigns? How much did the GOP really suffer for Nixon’s corruption? Realignments happen all the time — the 2016 election saw a minor realignment that was enough to give Trump the presidency. America might very well reverse the trend towards reduced gun control (and it’s still trending that way), but, if it does, the GOP will shift right along with it and still get ~50% of the vote.

  43. 43
    Adria McDowell says:

    @Baud: But then she’ll have Glenn Greenwald lecturing her about how corrupt she is and shit. No one should be subjected to that! Lol.

  44. 44
    Baud says:

    @Adria McDowell:

    I accidentally said “does” instead of “doesn’t” (fixed now), but your point stands.

  45. 45
    debbie says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Just saw Trump’s tweet calling out McMaster. How much longer do you think he will last?

  46. 46
    Suzanne says:

    @zhena gogolia: On the topic of ammosexuals insisting on “correct” terminology……this is another tactic we need to employ.

    They blarblarblar all day about how the problem is “mental illness” and not access to firearms, but they don’t know shit about mental health. They don’t know what the DSM-V is, or that most murderers and mass murderers are NOT mentally ill (because being a fucked-up asshole is not the same as being mentally ill). And therefore their opinions don’t matter.

    25% of American adults have a mental health problem every year. Are they planning on infringing on (what they believe is) a Constitutional right of 1/4 of the population every year? Everyone who’s ever taken Prozac? Every veteran with PTSD?

    When they say “mentally ill”, what they really mean is “creepy weirdo”, but that is not a discrete category.

  47. 47

    The Republican Party is not going to turn away from its ‘guns guns guns!’ position, because they are too polarized and the issue is tied to race. Forget the NRA. Their voters, the same ones who tell you in a survey they support sensible gun laws, will never let them.

    What can happen is that a new generation of voters overwhelmingly joins the Democratic Party, disengaged voters become voting liberals, liberals become driven to vote, and the party organizes to help them all do it. That looks like it’s happening, all because Republicans have taken their moment on top to shit all over the rest of America, and people are angry. Please, let this truly be so.

  48. 48
    debbie says:

    @scott (the other one):

    I’d like to see Emma share a stage with Malala.

  49. 49
    Jager says:

    A couple of quick anecdotes…

    In the 80’s I took my family heirloom antique Springfield 45.70 to a gun shop for an evaluation for my home owner’s insurance. I hadn’t been in a gun store for years. The place looked like a Special Forces Armory and that was more than 30 years ago.

    A pal of mine, a Vietnam War Army Infantry vet, was backpacking with his son, they walked through the camp of a bunch camo clad assholes who were armed to the teeth with assault rifles. One of the shit heads yelled at them, my friend stopped and told the guy, “You fucks need to tighten up your perimeter security, my kid and I could have taken all of you out before you’d even know it was happening.” He and his kid laughed and walked away.

    I agree this episode feels different.

  50. 50

    @Suzanne:

    When they say “mentally ill”, what they really mean is “creepy weirdo”

    I think you are giving them too much credit. What they really mean is “Nuh-uh!”

  51. 51
    debbie says:

    NPR’s interview this morning with three high school shooting survivors is well worth the listen.

  52. 52
    WaterGirl says:

    @foucault swing voter mistermix: I just looked in the previous thread and I don’t see a link. Can you post it again?

  53. 53
    Ksmiami says:

    @Luthe: the only place gorsuch belongs is behind bars. Fuck that guy we can reclaim his stolen seat

  54. 54
    trollhattan says:

    Not only does she have amazing poise in that setting, she managed to drag EVERY Republican-NRA talking point into the daylight and allow them to collapse under their own faux weight. Wow.

    Those without a teenage girl at home may not be aware of their capacity for cutting scorn. Nice to see it being used for good!

  55. 55
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Magda in Black: The vermin of the Village are utterly worthless to anyone but the 1%.

    Hence my nym.

  56. 56
    trollhattan says:

    @Major Major Major Major:
    Pie for breakfast? Why the hell not?

  57. 57
    WaterGirl says:

    @debbie: What did he say about McMaster? I can’t bear to have to see his ugly face if I google Trump’s twitter to see that tweet.

  58. 58
    Zach says:

    @Frankensteinbeck:

    What can happen is that a new generation of voters overwhelmingly joins the Democratic Party, disengaged voters become voting liberals, liberals become driven to vote, and the party organizes to help them all do it.

    This happened, and the last generation of reliable Democrats became Republicans. ~6% of voters are 18-22. ~60% of them will vote for a Democrat and 40% will vote for a Republican. That’s, at best, a 1% swing in the popular vote every four years, ignoring that people become Republicans as they get older.

    You need to win, now, and if you wanna do it within the current rules of the game the best thing to do is to convince rich people to give you a lot of money to spend on increasing voter turn out (especially in non-Presidential elections), to spend on lawyers to sue to overturn gerrymandered districts, and to rewrite the laws in Democrat-held states to favor Democrats in the future.

    Also, either crush 3rd parties or ally with them so that votes are never split by encouraging 3rd party and independent candidates to enter Democratic primaries a la Sanders in exchange for not running in the general election.

  59. 59
    germy says:

    @Radiumgirl:

    The analogies to smoking are entirely apt.

    And it wasn’t all that long ago that Pence was writing editorials about cigarettes not being harmful; not causing cancer. And Boehner handing out checks from the tobacco lobby.

  60. 60
    cain says:

    @oatler.:

    That’s what I thought…fifty years ago. O what a piece of work is man.

    Yeah, but those assholes from 50 years ago are still here. More than that, they’ve gotten other old folks (eg tea party) from that same generation who continue to run for office.

  61. 61
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @debbie: The President or McMaster?

  62. 62

    @WaterGirl:

    General McMaster forgot to say that the results of the 2016 election were not impacted or changed by the Russians and that the only Collusion was between Russia and Crooked H, the DNC and the Dems. Remember the Dirty Dossier, Uranium, Speeches, Emails and the Podesta Company!— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 18, 2018

  63. 63
    kattails says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: I was just going to say I want to keep a list of Betty’s Trump epithets, and here you pretty much beat me to it.

  64. 64
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Suzanne: They have that covered. They consistently argue that people with run of the mill mental health issues, such as depression, should not have their natural, civil, and constitutional right to keep and bear arms infringed. It is why they oppose California’s law that allows for weapons confiscations after a complaint regarding someone being a threat to themselves and/or others.

  65. 65
    AkaDad says:

    @trollhattan:

    One day my teenage daughter and I were talking and I said, “You know what’s stupid?” and without hesitation and with a smirk she says, “The advice you constantly try to give me?”

    God, I love her.

  66. 66
    Betty Cracker says:

    @trollhattan:

    Those without a teenage girl at home may not be aware of their capacity for cutting scorn. Nice to see it being used for good

    QFT! It’s a weapon as fearsome in its own way as a Titan missile!

  67. 67
    debbie says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Damn pronouns. I’m wondering how long it will take Trump to dump McMaster.

  68. 68
    debbie says:

    @WaterGirl:

    Here’s a bit of background. I’d bet the word “incontrovertible” drove Trump over the edge at least for a few minutes.

  69. 69
    JPL says:

    On the Alex Witt show Emma was asked about how to deal with Trump and is tweets. Without flinching she said ignore him.

    @AkaDad: teeheehee

  70. 70
    NotMax says:

    @oatler.

    This.

    The supply of asses is neverending. Better to strive to reduce the demand for them.

  71. 71
    cain says:

    @Zach:

    Democrats sat back and were complacent about their inevitable victories thanks to changing American demographics. Meanwhile, the GOP won all the state legislatures, gerrymandered their way into at least a generation of disproportionate representation, likely stole a Presidency, and definitely stole a Supreme court seat.

    Democrats should always be paranoid about liberal voters and keep them engaged. I think that lesson was learned quite forcefully in 2016. The democratic party needs a flag bearer that should be younger and can relate to the younger generation.

    Voters have very short memories in American politics. The country has moved ~20 points on gay rights/marriage. How many consequences did the GOP face for vile anti-gay rhetoric that peaked around 2004? What consequence has the GOP faced for racist campaigns? How much did the GOP really suffer for Nixon’s corruption? Realignments happen all the time — the 2016 election saw a minor realignment that was enough to give Trump the presidency. America might very well reverse the trend towards reduced gun control (and it’s still trending that way), but, if it does, the GOP will shift right along with it and still get ~50% of the vote.

    The american voting electorate is always reluctant to make big changes. Thats just how the political process works. But we’ve really moved a lot of liberal things despite the GOP. We have to live with incrementalism. Maybe we take two steps forward and one step back. I still firmly believe at some point GOP is going to have to pivot. The more incidents like this happen, the worse it gets for them.

    But it is not assured that Democrats are the alternative, being anti-GOP doesn’t mean pro-Democratic. They might simply not vote at all. So the Democratic party has to really bring in new voices and not people from the Clintonian era. Only a full throated liberal policies and being able to defend them. Finally, we need to have our younger generation start not only going after local state houses, but also the media. Not as liberal syncophants, but as actual fair voices not yellow journalism.

  72. 72
  73. 73
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @debbie: I really don’t know how to speculate. My understanding is that LTG McMaster, like Secretary Mattis, is doing this because he sees it as a way to protect the country. The question on that side is how high LTG McMaster’s level of tolerance is to continue to do so. As for the President, I have no idea. Recognize that at this point it would almost be impossible to replace LTG McMaster with anyone of quality. With the exception of the small hand full of retired general officers/flag officers that either support the President and/or already work for him (for instance, LTG ret Kellogg, who is on the National Security Staff), I’m not sure he gets someone of quality to replace LTG McMaster. He could try to tap another currently serving general officer/flag officer, but he’s just as likely to have that person retire on him. As for pulling in an experienced, acceptable replacement from the civilian side, he doesn’t have a very deep bench at all. Almost everyone that one would expect to be interested in a GOP administration either wouldn’t take the job or has disqualified themselves by being Never Trumpers.

  74. 74
    B.B.A. says:

    @Adam L Silverman: You could make the same argument about convicted felons – that once they’ve paid their debt to society, they should have all of their constitutional rights restored. Yet somehow nobody ever does. Hmmmmm, I wonder why…

    (I actually believe the above. Or rather, I believe that all people should have access to the same weapons legally, through the same process. Including the police – a badge shouldn’t come with the right to carry a gun. But for the usual reasons, this is unlikely to get anywhere.)

  75. 75
    WaterGirl says:

    @debbie: Thank you. That was very helpful, context makes all the difference.

  76. 76
    debbie says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    Thanks. To be honest, I’m not sure Trump cares about “quality” at this point. Trump only wants people who will defend him 1,000%, even to their own detriment.

  77. 77
    B.B.A. says:

    @debbie: I’ll take the opposite side of the bet, because I don’t think he knows what the word means.

  78. 78
    patroclus says:

    My favorite angry Florida survivor is David Hogg.

  79. 79
    Immanentize says:

    @Aimai: @KD:
    I completely agree with Aimie. But I also agree with KD. The “common sense gun laws” polled well and is still working well. But a “Register, Insure, License” campaign (I will call it RIL) also will resonate with people who do not want to ban guns, but want “common sense regulations.”. I for one think RIL is common sense and so do many (maybe not a majority, who knows).

    So I say, Get RIL about gun safety.*

    *of course “gun safety” polls way better than “gun control.”

  80. 80
    Immanentize says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    a magazine and a clip

    A magazine is something like Forbes used for spanking; and a clip is what the Russians have of Trump and fallen women,
    Amirite?

  81. 81
    debbie says:

    @B.B.A.:

    That’s never stopped him before!

  82. 82
    Jeffro says:

    @debbie: that actually IS his definition of quality

  83. 83
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Immanentize: Close enough.

  84. 84
    Immanentize says:

    @debbie: I think we are at a point where no one. Has to leave unless they are involved in a serious scandal (Porter) or they simply want to for their own sake (Brand at DOJ)

  85. 85
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    A magazine is what you buy at a newsstand to read. A cartridge is what contains the ink for your printer. A clip is for tidying up long hair.

    Do I pass the gun-knowledge test?
    ETA: Dang you, Immanentize!

  86. 86
    Aimai says:

    @Immanentize: excellent! Get RIL about guns is great!

  87. 87
    WaterGirl says:

    @Immanentize: Nicely played.

  88. 88
    WaterGirl says:

    @Aimai: @Immanentize: Agree!

    Get RIL about guns – Register, Insure, License

    And it fits on a bumper sticker! Where can I buy one? (Although I prefer car magnets so I can move them around.)

  89. 89
    NotMax says:

    @Amir Khalid

    Newsstand? Read?

    Never realized you were a time traveler.

    :)

  90. 90
    trollhattan says:

    @debbie:
    Incontrovertible has to exceed Trump’s syllable cap by two, at a minimum.

    At prep school McMaster would have received Trump wedgies like the other eggheads.

  91. 91
    glory b says:

    @Major Major Major Major: She’s referred to her “European trip,” and won’t answer, did an impressive Gish Gallop to a critique of the Dems, her stance on peace being the reason the neolibs are targeting her…

  92. 92
    Vhh says:

    @glory b: Dr Jill is nervous about her smiling face in that photo of her dining with her BFF Vlad in Moscow…..

  93. 93
    Immanentize says:

    @Suzanne:
    This reminds me of a conversation my dear friend (a lawyer) had with her husband (an adolescent brain psychologist researcher). My friend was worried about her teenage son, he was acting out, not interested in school, maybe smoking a bitter too much weed… She was all like, he must be ADD, we should have him tested, meds! Etc! And her husband said, “His diagnosis is B.O.Y.”

    It’s like that with so many of these gun men — their diagnosis is (_*_) hole. But that is hard to say, because they might kill you and your family.

  94. 94
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Major Major Major Major: @glory b: @Vhh: Bob Mueller has access to all the intelligence. He and his team know everything possible about what connections may exist between Russia and Jill Stein. She should be very, very nervous. The Special Counsel’s office will have gone through every bit of Stein’s life, finances, and campaigns by now. Even if she was just running an elaborate grift, he’ll know.

  95. 95
    Wapiti says:

    @Zach:

    We also haven’t gotten the full story yet about corruption within the NRA related to Russian influence and money laundering. Any organization that wins that much political influence will inevitably fail because of internal corruption, and the NRA seems to be at that point.

    A question and a follow-up that I’d like asked: “How much money has the NRA received from the Russian government and its agents in each of the last 4 years?” and “Has the NRA registered as a foreign agent?”

  96. 96
    bystander says:

    @glory b: Stein was in a lather and spinning wildly. I forget the mod’s name but she had already worn herself out over twitler’s use of the word “a$$”.

    I was trying to find another instance in which twitler spelled “little” as “liddle” as he did today with reference to Adam Schiff, the Congressman, not the L&O DA. I cannot shake from my mind that he’s making some “Yiddle” dogwhistle. All I have found is an oral reference to “little Marco Rubio”.

    I’m never going to complete my dissertation at this rate.

  97. 97
    KithKanan says:

    @bystander: I knew I remembered ‘liddle’ from something else! It was Republican Sen. Bob Corker back in October after Corker’s NYT interview where he said Trump was setting us “on the path to World War III”

  98. 98
    bluefish says:

    @trollhattan: That’s right! What you just said. And what Emma just said yesterday — These kids are giving me life — She’s awesome.

  99. 99
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Immanentize: Yeah, I think I’m with you on this one. I like “Get RIL” – it’s short, it’s punchy, it’s easy to remember, and it will become increasingly hard to argue against it as a “common sense” approach, because societal fury is going to start prompting people to suggest, increasingly seriously, the things that the ammosexuals fear most: repealing the 2nd Amendment, and outright banning and buybacks of certain types of guns (ie, “gun-grabbing!”).

  100. 100
    Msb says:

    God bless that girl. I feel a bit like that scene in Iron-Jawed Angels when Alice Paul (Hillary Swank) is depressed about the death of a friend in a suffrage campaign, and angrily and sadly reflects that all these bright women shouldn’t have to fight for rights they should already have. Gonzalez is obviously a bright girl whom we’re lucky to have. (And thank God she survived.) But it’s sad that she s going to fight a battle that should never be held.

  101. 101
    Kathleen says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Proud to say at least half of the people in my pie filter have appeared today.

  102. 102
    Brachiator says:

    @glory b:

    Her voice sounds kind of high pitched and nervous. Claiming studies (which she doesn’t name) saying 60% of her voters wouldn’t have voted if she wasn’t on the ballot…

    She did a lot better than she performed in 2012.

    But she performed notably better than she did during her first presidential run with the Green Party in 2012. During that election, she garnered a mere 0.4 percent of the popular vote from a total of 469,501 voters.

    Stein got a million votes in 2016. But that was only 1 percent. Not even enough to qualify for partial funds for 2020.

    And in 2000, Nader got 2.7% of the vote.

    Stein is fake news.

    https://www.bustle.com/articles/192987-how-many-people-voted-for-jill-stein-in-the-2016-election-more-than-you-might-have

  103. 103
    Chet Murthy says:

    Two things I wanted to say: (1) I’m really, really, really angry. I thought I’d reached “11” on the anger scale, and then Wednesday happened. It seems there’s another scale above the original one. I appreciate seeing your anger, b/c it helps me feel not-alone. Maybe b/c we don’t (and shouldn’t) feel OK with expressing this level of rage in public. Whatever, I’m glad you’re here — all of you.

    (2) I especially appreciate the FPers (and commenters) who are posting transcripts of the speeches and remarks of these young patriotic Americans. I tried watching Ms. Gonzalez’ speech, and had to stop pretty quickly, it was making me so angry, so so so angry. I can read her words, and control my reactions by stopping to do something else for a while. But watching, it’s difficult.

    I find that the @ObamaPlusKids feed is really helpful these days. Also, your puppy (and kitty) pics & vids. But especially that feed.

  104. 104
    Niles says:

    Any POTUS who fails to stop Russian interference in our elections is an incompetent boob who should have been impeached.

  105. 105
    Bill Arnold says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady):

    General McMaster forgot to say that the results of the 2016 election were not impacted or changed by the Russians…

    (Quoting a TrumpTweet if it’s not clear)
    FWIW, if any agencies in US have expertise in precisely quantifying the effects of attempts to influence elections, they will probably be reluctant to admit it in public. (The justice department probably does not formally have this expertise.) Some civilian statisticians/political scientists have started to pick up the slack.

  106. 106
    gVOR08 says:

    Re donations from the NRA. It’s hard to see the real picture. I looked on Open Secrets and was surprised my Senator, Rob Portman got only about 9K. The Cincinnati Enquirer reported today the NRA spent a quarter million on independent support for Spineless Rob and 1.5 mil on ads against his Dem opponent.

  107. 107
    J R in WV says:

    @Immanentize:

    That dear friend’s husband has an amazing amount of common sense for a professional psychologist, actually. “Diagnosis is B.O.Y.” so good, so professional.

  108. 108
    J R in WV says:

    @gVOR08:

    Re donations from the NRA. It’s hard to see the real picture. I looked on Open Secrets and was surprised my Senator, Rob Portman got only about 9K. The Cincinnati Enquirer reported today the NRA spent a quarter million on independent support for Spineless Rob and 1.5 mil on ads against his Dem opponent.

    Lessee, in my book, that should be booked like this:
    $ 9,000 +
    250,000 +
    1,500,000 =
    1,759,000 — total

    That $9,000 is peanuts, obviously every cent spent to support a candidate OR to tear down their opponent needs to be totaled up on a regular basis.

    They think this shifty reporting will allow Portman to claim he only got a trivial donation from the NRA, when he really got very nearly $$$ TWO MILLION BUCKS!@!!! That’s a boat load of money, even in Ohio!

  109. 109
    Arclite says:

    My 10 year old son just now after reading DJT’s tweet: “He’s using the school shooting to distract from the Russia investigation!”

    Even a ten year old gets it.

  110. 110
    SFAW says:

    I’m wondering if rebranding (by sane people) of the NRA as the “National Association of Mass Murder Machine Makers” a/k/a NAMMMM or NAM4 (with humble apologies to our own M^4, of course), or some similarly honest description, might help.

    If more people started associating the NRA with the manufacturers — since it’s a trade group — than with the Second Amendment, those murderous bastards might start feeling an iota of shame.

    And I might fart rainbows.

  111. 111
    SFAW says:

    @Wapiti:

    A question and a follow-up that I’d like asked: “How much money has the NRA received from the Russian government and its agents in each of the last 4 years?” and “Has the NRA registered as a foreign agent?”

    And the response would likely be “Look! Over there! Hillary’s e-mails!!!!!”

  112. 112
    Tom says:

    @trollhattan: McMaster was the Army captain commanding Eagle Troop in the Battle of 73 Easting in the first Gulf War. The first time Trump tried to give him a wedgy would have been the last time Trump had use of his fingers and arms for several months.

  113. 113
    Mike G says:

    “Disgraceland”, that’s too good not to steal.

    We’re going to Disgraceland, Disgraceland
    Palm Beach, Florida
    We’re going to Disgraceland
    Traitors and grifters and cronies
    And we’re all going to Disgraceland

  114. 114
    Daddio7 says:

    @J R in WV: “maniacs with easy access to weapons of war”, said maniacs being BOYs. How many school shooters have not been young men? Keep guns out of their hands and other kids would be safe at school. You really want to save lives? Go into the inner cities and vacuum all the hand guns up. Disarming tens of millions of middle aged men will only save a life or two.

  115. 115
    tybee says:

    That deranged globule of rancid marmalade

    mmmm. marmalade. Betty, you’re the best.

  116. 116
    SFAW says:

    @Daddio7:

    Excellent point!!!!!1!!2!!

    Because Black Panthers, etc. Or just blacks in general.

    Can’t tell if you’re trying to be a parody troll (in which case, not bad), or being serious (in which case, FOAD).

Comments are closed.