Trump to “Address a Grieving Nation” at 11 AM ET

According to All-Access Haberman of The Times, there was pressure from advisers for Trump to make a public statement after yesterday’s school shooting in Parkland, FL:

Looks like the advisers prevailed in the interim. Here’s the announcement that the tiny-fingered, Cheeto-faced, ferret-wearing shitgibbon will “address a grieving nation” shortly and has ordered the flags lowered to half-staff until Monday:

None of the lies Trump reads off a teleprompter today will blot out what he said at an NRA conference last April:

President Donald Trump promised guns rights advocates gathered in Atlanta on Friday that he’d come through for them as they did for him during the 2016 campaign.

“The eight-year assault on your Second Amendment freedoms has come to a crashing end,” Trump told the members of the National Rifle Association, assuring them that they now “have a true friend and champion in the White House.”

“I will never, ever infringe on the right of the people to keep and bear arms,” Trump said. “Never ever.”

The blood-gargling sociopaths of the NRA invested more in Trump than they’ve ever invested in any pol in history, and they may have funneled Russian cash to Trump too. As a brand licensing entity for decades, Trump regards the NRA as just another lucrative licensing deal.

Trump will probably read things about mental illness off the teleprompter, even though he rescinded an Obama-era measure that would have added people with mental illness who receive federal benefits to the background check database and is in the process of de-funding healthcare that might address the issue on the margins.

The blather about mental illness will be a distraction, as will the promise by Trump’s minion in Florida, AG Pam Bondi, that the state will pay for the funerals of yesterday’s victims. In the end, the brand licensing deal will hold because it has paid off handsomely for Trump, the Republicans and the NRA.

The only solution is to get rid of all parties to that agreement. Vote out the politicians who take NRA cash, and make affiliation with the NRA as toxic as an association with the Klan or the Nazis. Until that happens, nothing will be done.






151 replies
  1. 1
    lgerard says:

    Perhaps he will have a moment of silence this weekend before teeing off in remembrance of the victims

  2. 2
    GregB says:

    An armed society is a polite society.

    This is the world the rightwing and the gun lobby have created for us all.

    Also perhaps now we can use the Weinstein standard and demand that people who take money from blood gargling sociopaths like Wayne LaPierre return that money.

  3. 3
    Baud says:

    that the state will pay for the funerals of yesterday’s victims

    Socialism in defense of the Second Amendment is ok.

  4. 4
    Arm The Homeless says:

    Did these fucking fascists offer to pay the funeral costs of the Pulse victims? Fuck no, they were icky gays. Let a bunch of suburban white kids get ventilated by a psychopath whose hobby they fall over each other to protect, and the cash spigot is wide open.

    All of these fucking vermin should have everything bad in life befall them and their kin. These assholes should be as afraid to leave their homes as the people who are being terrorized by the GOPs NRA money men.

    NO.FUCKING.QUARTER

  5. 5
    Baud says:

    @Arm The Homeless: Most of the kids I saw on the news were minorities. Not sure what the breakdown is.

  6. 6
    Kay says:

    Why bother giving a speech, though? Nothing Can Be Done. Make that our national motto, because it may as well be.

    The massive Las Vegas slaughter was forgotten in 3 days. Judging by that this will be gone in 3 hours.

  7. 7
    rikyrah says:

    this will not go well.

    it.just.won’t.

  8. 8
    Butch says:

    Watch a pointless Trump “speech” or straighten the sock drawer? It is a dilemma. I must get back to you on this.

  9. 9
    NotMax says:

    Awful, awful, awful, but more than half expecting something that boils down to “More would have died if Hillary won.”

  10. 10
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Baud: The school is in an affluent area.

  11. 11

    He needs to shut his fat face. His presence on the TV is an insult to the grieving.

  12. 12
    Mike in NC says:

    Whatever Trump says will likely be stupid and maybe even offensive. He just needs to STFU. The NRA spent $30M to elect that rotten asshole.

  13. 13
    Betty Cracker says:

    Governor Bat Boy is babbling about guns and mental illness on the TV. This will be the party line. It’s a good dodge because it would be difficult to enact any meaningful legislation to address it, so they’ll act like they’re doing something but once again do nothing.

  14. 14
    Arm The Homeless says:

    @Baud: The demographics are ~85% White for Parkland, much higher than Florida and Broward as a whole

  15. 15
    gene108 says:

    @Kay:

    I’m surprised this even made the national news. We’ve had 18 school shootings in less than 7 full weeks in 2018 and most go unmentioned in the national media. It’s like a car accident. They happen so often and as long as the damage isn’t too bad, it won’t make the news. It’s one of the risks we accept for living in this modern world.

    We’ve reached that point with mass shootings.

  16. 16
    efgoldman says:

    @Kay:

    Why bother giving a speech, though? Nothing Can Be Done.

    If it were up to me, all the gun stores and all the gun shows and all the web sales would ve destroyed tomorrow, After that, the National guard would go door to door and confiscate all but the most basic hunting weapons.

    It’s not up to me.

    I live, sometimes unfortunately, in the real world. As I said i last night’s threads, I have given up. The people that represent me pretty much agree with me, but there are two few of them.

    Maybe by the time my granddaughter is my age this stupid fucking asshole country will come to its senses, but i am not optimistic.

  17. 17
    MomSense says:

    I am feeling so furious. This level of anger is not healthy. Someone yesterday said that the 2nd Amendment has become a suicide pact. Fuck the gun nutz. I just want to repeal it. Enough.

  18. 18
    Kay says:

    @Mike in NC:

    Imagine the frantic work of the low quality team, though. How to make excuses for doing nothing without offending the donors?

    We can all judge how well they pull it off. This is their actual job, not governing but crafting reams of bullshit to drive home the message that Nothing Can Be Done. About anything.

  19. 19
    Baud says:

    @Betty Cracker:
    @Arm The Homeless:

    Thanks. Wonder if the media chose to be selective for some reason. Or I just happened to catch the minorities.

  20. 20
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @Baud: Second-best slavery: if you can’t buy the kids at least you can get the state to buy the corpses.

    Bond probably thinks (assuming she thinks at all) that the funerals are cheaper than the litigation.

  21. 21
    Leto says:

    @Betty Cracker: Laurence O’Donnell mentioned last night that, 2 days ago, their county was named the safest place to live, or something to that affect.

  22. 22
    MomSense says:

    I cannot believe what I am hearing right now.

  23. 23
    Kay says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    If they’re not going to pass anything on mental illness they should shut the fuck up about that too.

    The jig is up. We get it. They intend to do nothing. Stop blowing smoke up our ass.

    The students know they won’t do anything. Those that were interviewed yesterday made that quite clear- they’re not idiots. They know the adults will DO NOTHING. They won’t even try. They won’t try because they are CORRUPT. That’s the word we use for people who refuse to do their jobs because they took stacks of money NOT to do their jobs.

  24. 24
    Betty Cracker says:

    What a terrible fucking speech.

  25. 25

    Haven’t those parents (and surviving kids) already suffered enough without having Trump address them?

  26. 26
    chris says:

    Nothing can be done, eh?

    THEY FUCKING LOCKED UP TIDE PODS BECAUSE 734 people tried to eat them. In like 4 days! You can’t tell me there’s NOTHING that can be done.— 💚CarissaJoy💙 (@carissajanuary) 15 February 2018

  27. 27
    Winston Smith says:

    His speech can’t fill in for the daily 2 minutes of hate? Just asking for Julia…

  28. 28
    Another Scott says:

    Jim Wright at Stonekettle Station – Make the NRA’s rules The Law (from 2015):

    […]

    Banning the future sales of assault weapons, certain types of ammo, and large capacity magazines won’t do a damned thing. That horse is out of the barn.

    So what would?

    Well, we make the NRA’s own rules federal law.

    That’s right.

    [image]

    On my range, on any range, military, law enforcement, or civilian, the first rule of gun safety is this:

    Always assume the gun is loaded, unless you personally have verified that it is unloaded.

    Everything depends from that anchor point.

    Everything.

    You always assume the gun is loaded. Always. Every time. Even if you just watched somebody else unload it. When you pick up a weapon or accept it from somebody else, you assume it is loaded until you, yourself, personally unload it or verify visually and physically that it is unloaded. Period. No exceptions.

    Now, I doubt anybody would want to argue that rule.

    Make it the law.

    Every gun user is personally responsible for knowing the condition of their weapon. No exceptions.

    Every year, hundreds of people are shot with unloaded guns. In the last year I’ve counted dozens of reports of “accidental” discharges, a number at gun shows by so-called experts. For example, last year in Medina, Ohio, a man was wounded at a gun show by a gun dealer, a gun dealer, who was checking out a semi-automatic handgun he had just bought. The dealer took the gun from the seller and accidentally pulled the trigger without clearing the weapon first. The gun’s magazine had been removed from the firearm but one round remained in the chamber. Both the seller and the buyer should have been held criminally liable for failure to properly clear the weapon.

    […]

    It’s a good starting point, and a way to change the conversation so that maybe something gets done before the heat death of the universe…

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  29. 29
    Betty Cracker says:

    Ah, here it is: “We’ll tackle the difficult issue of mental health.”

  30. 30
    gene108 says:

    @MomSense:

    Someone yesterday said that the 2nd Amendment has become a suicide pact. Fuck the gun nutz. I just want to repeal it.

    I have the same sentiment. Repeal it and abolish all gun ownership. I doubt we are alone.

  31. 31
    gene108 says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    Ah, here it is: “We’ll tackle the difficult issue of mental health.”

    And some how expect to do it, without committing any more money or resources to an already underfunded health issue.

  32. 32
    Betty Cracker says:

    Speech over. It was a disgraceful packet of lies mouthed insincerely by an absurd charlatan. To those of you who missed it: you chose wisely.

  33. 33
    MomSense says:

    @gene108:

    How much more proof do we need that the gun community cannot handle the responsibility?

  34. 34
    rikyrah says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    One concrete thing that Dolt45 has done is MAKING GUNS MORE AVAILABLE TO THE MENTALLY ILL

  35. 35
    Kay says:

    Americans have to stop dumping everything on schools. Schools were never intended to provide everything our corrupt, lazy, feckless leaders refuse to provide. They’re not health care facilities and nutrition stations and mental health care clinics and they’re not responsible for creating a facility that is as secure as a maximim security prison WHILE being welcoming places where kids want to spend 6 hours a day. The go-to entity in the US when we’re looking for someone to fix something is “schools”. It’s ridiculous. It is IMPOSSIBLE for ONE public system to carry the entire country.

    Schools have a full plate. Someone else in this country should do some work for the public good.

  36. 36
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @MomSense:

    Sick-making. Utterly anodyne, bland, and so generic it could have been about any kind of large-scale tragedy anywhere.

    One of the great gifts of Obama, both personally and rhetorically, is that he made a point of mentioning personal stories and unique individuals. He cared about the victims and their families, and that always came through.

    With Trump it’s just generalities. He cares nothing about the actual people, and that disinterest comes across.

  37. 37
    aimai says:

    @rikyrah: The even sadder truth is that technically most of these mass shooters–especially the white ones–are not “mentally ill’ unless massive male entitlement and white racism are signs of mental illness.

    We need a change in the law that basically states that the desire to own these guns, or more than one gun, is itself a sign of mental illness. Gun fetishists should be locked up before they can harm other people–let them choose between their freedom and their guns.

  38. 38
    MomSense says:

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    I’m angry that he told kids we will protect them. Bullshit. He won’t do a damned thing.

  39. 39
    Betty Cracker says:

    @MomSense: That made me angry too. He lies to us grownups all of the time. Now he’s specifically lying to our children.

  40. 40
    oatler. says:

    He could set fire to himself like a Buddhist in 1965 Vietnam. I’d be willing to help him extinguish himself, got a full bladder.

  41. 41
    NotMax says:

    “Promises” about mental illness direct from the mentally ill.

  42. 42
    sherparick says:

    I believe we should make clear that we are restrictionists on guns. First, we should only vote for politicians, Federal and State, who will support the following amendment to the Second Amendment.

    “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms when serving in the Militia shall not be infringed.” (From Retired Associate Justice John Paul Stevens).

    And a Federal gun law modeled on Australia’s law (State and local laws can more more restrictionist/prohibitionist on firearms, but this would the Federal minimum). http://time.com/4172274/what-i.....n-control/

    I am tired about sound and fury about background checks or now scapegoating every person who gets mental health care in this country. To build movement, we need to go for the big goals.

  43. 43

    A bit of good news –

  44. 44
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Kay: And what is even more infuriating is that while the Powers That Be angrily demand that public schools be all things to all people, the same PTB undercut school funding by giving away mountains of cash to bogus “charter schools” and then demonize and undercut teachers and teachers’ unions.

    I’m wondering now if the national teachers’ organizations shouldn’t be calling for a general strike, just to protest the very conditions you mention.

  45. 45
    The Moar You Know says:

    Back when I was a child, there was this thing where we made all the 18-year olds sign up for a national lottery and then sent them off somewhere and killed about 10,000 of them every year.

    Maybe we can ditch the guns and go back to that lottery, to satiate the bloodlust of Americans. It would cut firearms deaths by 2/3.

  46. 46

    For those who want to read the decision,

  47. 47
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @MomSense:
    @Betty Cracker:

    Yep.

    Wonder which of his minions wrote it? Not overtly nasty enough for Miller. Hope, probably.

  48. 48
    JPL says:

    @Betty Cracker: I missed it. Did he say if you see something, say something?

  49. 49
    Aleta says:

    Something to bring up

    Tom Scocca‏ 
    @tomscocca

    Don’t bother debating gun-stroking dorks over what is or isn’t an “assault weapon.” Repeal the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act.
    * 

The Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act was written to make it impossible to sue gun makers when people used their products, as designed, to kill people.

    * 

Not only does the law set up almost insurmountable barriers to holding gun makers accountable for their decisions to flood the market with killing power, but if a victim’s family tries challenge the protections and fails, they are forced to pay the gun maker’s legal costs.

    * 

It passed in 2005 with 65 votes in the Senate and 283 votes in the House, and was signed by George W. Bush.



    Roger Wicker (R-Miss.) and Bill Nelson (D-Fla.), who voted to make it impossible for survivors to sue the people who made or sold the guns used to murder their loved ones, are running for reelection to the Senate this year.

    * 
Indeed he did, in the House


 

    @OhWow Hmm
 Bernie Sanders (I-VT) also voted for this

  50. 50
    The Moar You Know says:

    Americans have to stop dumping everything on schools. Schools were never intended to provide everything our corrupt, lazy, feckless leaders refuse to provide. They’re not health care facilities and nutrition stations and mental health care clinics and they’re not responsible for creating a facility that is as secure as a maximim security prison WHILE being welcoming places where kids want to spend 6 hours a day. The go-to entity in the US when we’re looking for someone to fix something is “schools”. It’s ridiculous. It is IMPOSSIBLE for ONE public system to carry the entire country.

    @Kay: Here in San Diego the city is trying to dump the task and expense of support for the entire family of any homeless student on the schools.

    Won’t break their union but may well bankrupt the school system.

  51. 51
    Kay says:

    @Miss Bianca:

    It’s true even on a local level. I’m on a school committee and it doesn’t matter what the problem is- 15 minutes into a discussion about a problem identified by either the city council or local business people they will start shoving it off on schools.

    Then we all adjourn, having accomplished our work for the day, which is dumping something else on the schools.

    I’ve come to believe education people are too nice. They seem to be vulnerable to taking responsibility for everything and anything, and then APOLOGIZING for not fixing it! They need to be meaner. That sector must attract helpful people. It’s something like 80% women- that may be part of it.

    I want them to say “no”. I want them to say someone else will have to fix food insecurity or housing or mental illness or shitty parents. They’re full up with duties.

  52. 52
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @Another Scott:

    Banning the future sales of assault weapons, certain types of ammo, and large capacity magazines won’t do a damned thing. That horse is out of the barn.

    The dealers and collectors have been stockpiling these things for years now speculating there will be a ban.

    So how does “teenager with assault rifle bought for him by his late mother” work in this?

    The thing that surprises me is most of these shootings the victims are REAL Americans, done by people they know are nutters and they still won’t do something about it.

  53. 53

    Did he say there were good people on both sides?

  54. 54
    condorcet runner-up says:

    I don’t know if this is appropriate or not, but even the language “honoring the victims of …” really bothers me. The framing of this implies that these poor kids made some sacrifice for which they should be honored. They did not choose to pay the price of “second amendment freedoms.” They did not choose to be honorable in the moment — someone else with a gun made that decision for them. I am quite sure that they would not seek such an “honor,” and between being “honored,” or being alive I know what their family and friends would prefer. I am not sure that I am articulating my revulsion to the WH’s use of the word “honor” here, but there it is.

  55. 55
    Spinoza Is My Co-Pilot says:

    @efgoldman:

    Maybe by the time my granddaughter is my age this stupid fucking asshole country will come to its senses, but i am not optimistic.

    The liberal/gun control side lost this war a generation ago, and the ammosexual/NRA 2nd amendment fundamentalists have only entrenched that victory more solidly since. There are some important ways in which we are, in fact, a stupid fucking asshole country, and this is one of them.

    I have a young granddaughter who is the light of my life, and I’m sorry to say I’m not very sanguine about the state of my country decades hence when she is my age. Not just on gun control.

  56. 56
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Betty Cracker: Now he’s specifically lying to our children.

    who don’t appear to be having it

    sarah @ chaddiedabaddie
    sarah Retweeted Donald J. Trump
    I don’t want your condolences you fucking price of shit, my friends and teachers were shot. Multiple of my fellow classmates are dead. Do something instead of sending prayers. Prayers won’t fix this. But Gun control will prevent it from happening again.

    I’m a bit leery of kids this age, especially in this situation, becoming the focus of media attention, but some of the tweets I’m seeing trump and his supporters are really admirable

    I’m sure by this evening Hannity will have found a student from the school willing to go on camera wearing a “ProGod, ProGuns, PROTRUMP” tee shirt (as seen at my nephew’s college graduation worn by the mother of one of his friends)

  57. 57
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @Betty Cracker: Interesting that they will blame “mental illness” and then turn around and do fvck-all to treat that malady.

    If somebody suggested that ED or cancer were incurable illnesses and treatment was impractical so why bother, all Greater Wingnutistan would be aflame with outrage. Yet because mental illness is “wrong in the head” it’s just proof that your mother was a sinful wanton woman unSaved by Gun-Toting Capitalist White Jeebus or something, which translates as “svcks to be you.”

  58. 58
    Tokyokie says:

    Every one of these ammosexuals maintains a sick eliminationist fantasy in which he (and it’s almost always a guy) uses his penis substitute(s) to mow down his enemies. They’re perverts. Every. Last. One. Of. Them. And they should be called that at every opportunity. When some GOP flunky goes on teevee, the moderator should call him a pervert and talk about how he’s mainstreaming perversion. When some Federalist Society hack appears, it should be pointed out to him that strict interpretation fetishist Scalia’s majority decision in Heller rests on blithely ignoring the 2nd Amendment’s introductory clause: “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State,” and his deliberate misinterpretation of the Constitution was done to promote perversion, the same perversion that the Federalist Society was founded to advance. And if Wayne La Pierre should have the fortitude to show his swinish countenance, he should be told that he heads a Putin-loving, Russian money-laundering organization that fits the definition of an interstate criminal organization per the RICO statute, and that he’s not merely a traitor, but a pervert traitor. Fuck every one of these assholes. As long as their putrid opinions are treated as having some value, they’re getting the go-ahead to continue the carnage. They’re the scum of the fucking earth and should be treated with the level of dehumanizing scorn they have earned.

  59. 59
    Spinoza Is My Co-Pilot says:

    @condorcet runner-up: With you 100% on this.

  60. 60
    Damned at Random says:

    OK, so it’s time to call your Congress critter. The script is “Senator/Congressman X, you accepted $ X in BLOOD MONEY from the NRA PAC in 2016. In the wake of the 19 school shootings so far this year, will you be returning those contributions?”

    The summary of NRA contributions is here:
    https://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/recips.php?cycle=2016&id=D000000082

  61. 61
    NorthLeft12 says:

    @Baud: I am surprised that this offer to pay for the funerals does not end up pissing off a bunch of RWNJs….”Why should they get free stuff from the state just because they were lucky enough to get slaughtered in a school shooting?!!11!!”

    I really don’t understand the thought process behind this public offer……it just sounds awful and self serving and will no doubt lead to a lineup of people who have lost family members in other gun related violence. Just effing stupid IMO.

  62. 62
    Aleta says:

    Tr seemed lackluster. Poor thing must be petrified, knowing the NRA will be on the line again as soon as he steps away from the podium. “Couldn’t you see they were making me?”

  63. 63
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Damned at Random: my thought was, “Is the good Senator/Critter willing to refuse campaign funds from the NRA and run his/her next campaign on prayers?”

  64. 64
    rikyrah says:

    THREAD:

    If you find yourself bothered by Black people’s happiness at #BlackPanther read this thread 👇🏾 and have a nice day. 🐾 https://t.co/IvAg5KhLJg

    — Dudette (@Dudette9t9) February 15, 2018

    Three years ago I made a video series called Every Single Word where I edited down popular movies to only the words spoken by people of color. In honor of #BlackPanther I’m gonna re-share some of them here.

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    This is the entire Lord of The Rings trilogy. You can watch it in less than a minute. pic.twitter.com/v6UBUlsPo1

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    This is Her, a movie set in a not-too-future Los Angeles. pic.twitter.com/vNm94007Fm

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    This is Maleficent. pic.twitter.com/VPRAn3O6Ze

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    The entire Harry Potter series runs 1,207 minutes. POC speak for 5 minutes and 40 seconds. That’s 0.47% which is represented by 12 characters (and 13 actors), two of whom are CGI. On average, each character speaks for 28.33 seconds. https://t.co/JeBjtU41Bk

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    None of these stories are about race, yet they have cast white people by default. They each deal with fantastical elements yet seem to have found it “unrealistic” to cast POC in anything but the periphery.

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    For too long universally accessible stories have used white avatars to tell them. While there are clearly exceptions, they are just that: exceptions.

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    So if you see people celebrating #BlackPanther and don’t understand why, just remember that cinema has long been telling universally accessible stories that represent everyone with bodies that only represent some.

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

    If you want to know more about why I made this project, here’s a profile by @SorayaMcDonald that sums it up best. https://t.co/Wae9x0bREL

    — Dylan Marron (@dylanmarron) February 14, 2018

  65. 65
    Immanentize says:

    @Another Scott:

    Assume the gun is loaded

    This is just one of the NRA gun safety laws that could be imposed…. Their gun safety instructions, which pre-date their gun lobby capture, are really quite good. What we could actually eliminate is the notion of a gun “accident.” If you follow NRA guidelines, those injuries and deaths are actually negligent or reckless discharge of a firearm. Which should be a crime. With heavy penalties.

    Then we could also force gun owners to buy gun liability insurance (like auto insurance) in case they “accidentally — or purposefully” injure or kill.

  66. 66
    Kay says:

    @The Moar You Know:

    Midwesterners, people close to the Great Lakes, have this joke. “It’s broken, take it to the lake house!” Lake houses are full of broken shit you don’t want in your real, serious house.

    That’s what I think of on the school committee- “it’s broken! Let’s dump it with those nice, earnest school ladies! They’ll at least try to fix it!” The Real Serious People can’t be bothered with these …childrens issues.

    Do schools hold the mental health screenings before or after the lockdown drill and will there be time for math class? There’s only 7 periods. It’ll be hard to jam every societal breakdown issue in, but the ladies will give it their all!

  67. 67
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    sarah Retweeted Donald J. Trump
    I don’t want your condolences you fucking price of shit,

    I like this. When Sandy Hook happened, the anti-gun people, by and large, approached the issue in public discussion civilly, at least in part because the President was civil. Now that that barrier has fallen, people (I think) are freer to express themselves.

  68. 68
    Leto says:

    @sherparick: There are a lot of reasonable/sensible controls listed in that Times article. Unfortunately none of that will matter as the Death Cult will simply say: it’s not in the 2d Amendment! QUIT TRYING TO TAKE MY PENIS EXTENSION GUNZ!!!!

    If you’ve taken money from the Death Cult lobby, you need to be gone. Accepting money from the NRA = automatic political death. Personally I’d seize them all, melt them down, use the metal to fashion a statue to Moloch, and place it out in the fields of Nebraska (centrally located) so that all of the cultists can come worship their god out in the open.

  69. 69
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Kay: I agree with you. Part of the reason I think that it was good I never jumped thru’ all the hoops to be a teacher -tho’ I’ve been a long-term sub – is that I’m an asshole: an antiauthoritarian, loud-mouthed, foul-mouthed asshole. Not “nice” at all. Then I start to think, “no, you *should* have become a teacher BECAUSE you’re an asshole, and right now, the teaching world needs some assholes” – to say exactly what you’re saying, Kay.

    That’s why I’ve started thinking about this “national strike” idea – I don’t know if it would work, because there are too many non-unionized teachers out there – but if the teachers’ unions, other educational organizations, hell, the PTA – just said “Enough” –

    Yeah, a girl can dream.

  70. 70
    Immanentize says:

    @rikyrah: @aimai:
    Oh, this poor fellow is only mentally ill today, to explain his gun shoot ’em up.
    At his death penalty trial, he will be completely competent and really have no history of any serious mental illness.
    Guaranteed.

  71. 71
    GregB says:

    Has this person with a history of violent social media postings been reported to the authorities yet?

    https://www.cnn.com/2016/01/23/politics/donald-trump-shoot-somebody-support/index.html

  72. 72
    Betty Cracker says:

    @JPL: He was haranguing Twitter readers on that point this morning, but I don’t think he mentioned it in the statement. It was such a creepy and repulsive speech. Sounds harmless enough if you read it, but the delivery was so stilted and insincere. They shouldn’t trot him out to do “consoling” and “comforting.” He absolutely cannot pull it off credibly.

  73. 73
    glory b says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: Well, maybe if he had an experienced communications director, it would be better.

  74. 74
    trollhattan says:

    @Betty Cracker:
    I’m guessing FEMA will hand out tents to the homeless.

  75. 75
    GregB says:

    Yes, political money from Harvey Weinstein is far less tainted than political money from Wayne LaPierre.

  76. 76
    Immanentize says:

    @Aleta:

    Not only does the law set up almost insurmountable barriers to holding gun makers accountable for their decisions to flood the market with killing power, but if a victim’s family tries challenge the protections and fails, they are forced to pay the gun maker’s legal costs.


    I have a friend/neighbor in the Mass. AG’s office who works on gun issues. He and I have talked a number of times about how the federal government really shouldn’t be able to carve one industry out of the legal torts system. This seems unconstitutional. And it just might be time that many judges will finally agree.

  77. 77
    Aleta says:

    @NorthLeft12: As long as they don’t get free food it might be OK.

  78. 78
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @condorcet runner-up:

    I think you are spot on. You’ve identified something in the framing that’s always made me uneasy, and I appreciate it.

  79. 79
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Baud:

    Given what’s been reported about the killer, he may have targeted minority students for death.

  80. 80
    GregB says:

    The NRA has been living in the Washington swamp and buying politicians for 40 years.

    This ultra violence is the fruit of their loins.

    Take a bow Wayne.

  81. 81
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @The Moar You Know: We could have ’em fight each other this time, and the last survivor’s home district gets a shipment of food boxes. It’s like Blue Apron.

  82. 82
  83. 83
    Aleta says:

    @Immanentize: Yes. I wish it had been challenged before now, and wonder if the people opposed to that challenge aren’t at least as strong now.

  84. 84
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @chris:

    1) There’s no enumerated Constitutional right to detergents.

    2) They locked up the Tide Pods AT THE EFFING GROCERY. Like the kids are going to pop open the packaging and chow down in the aisle.

  85. 85
    WaterGirl says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: Is the idea to have at least one case reach to the level of each of the U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, in the hopes that if there is perfect agreement between all the courts at that level, it cannot go to the Supreme Court?

  86. 86
    Aleta says:

    @rikyrah: Thank you.

  87. 87
    rikyrah says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    been looking for a list and pictures of the victims. Anyone got a link?

  88. 88
    TenguPhule says:

    @GregB:

    An armed society is a polite society.

    Is a fucking lie.

    An armed society is a “FUCK YOU, I KILL YOU” Society.

    Because its easier to take with force then having to go through the politeness bullshit.

  89. 89
    Mnemosyne says:

    @rikyrah:

    Today at physical therapy, the PT assistant I saw last week excitedly shared with me that he’s seeing “Black Panther” this weekend. He’s either Latino or Filipino.

    I’m seeing it next Wednesday.

    On the radio this morning, the (white) morning show guy asked the (white) film critic if the critic felt pressured to give “Black Panther” a good review because it’s a mostly-Black movie released during Black History Month.

    The critic said something like, Well, sure, you always worry about stuff like that, but that doesn’t apply here, because it really is a great movie. The critic is a huge fan of Ryan Coogler since “Fruitvale Station.”

  90. 90
    efgoldman says:

    @Immanentize:

    And it just might be time that many judges will finally agree.

    “Many” might, but if five RWNJs in the fancy building in DC don’t, then it isn’t worth a fuck.
    I said last nite, Dems have to control all the branches (both houses, WH, SCOTUS) some time in the future for any action on gunz.

  91. 91
    TenguPhule says:

    @Butch:

    Watch a pointless Trump “speech” or straighten the sock drawer? It is a dilemma. I must get back to you on this.

    After you finish dealing with those socks, no doubt.

  92. 92
    gene108 says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    The generation that grew up with lock-down drills at school is hitting college or graduating how. They are becoming adults. I wonder what their take on gun control will be.

    In ten or fifteen years they may not want to put their kids through the same shit they went through and maybe fight for gun control a lot harder than older generations.

  93. 93
    Amaranthine RBG says:

    Meh – another day of virtue signaling.

  94. 94
    TenguPhule says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    Governor Bat Boy is babbling about guns and mental illness on the TV.

    You would think someone, somewhere in political advertising would be capturing all of these mental illness accusations to slam them when the shooter turns out to be non-white and the terrorism/illegal immigrant hysteria starts.

  95. 95
    sherparick1 says:

    @NorthLeft12: Of course, AG Bondi, the NRA’s, Banks, and Trump’s best friend is not saying anything about care for the wounded. I guess they are on their own.

    For what AR-15 5.5 mm bullet does to the human body, the Huffington Post published the public autopsy reports from the Las Vegas shooting. It is not pleasant reading. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/las-vegas-autopsy-documents_us_5a8234efe4b01467fcf08b97

    It should also be noted, in a state and party that loves bashing teachers and public employees who are not cops, the noble and heroic actions of the teachers of this school who put their bodies between the shooter and their students and whose coolness in locking doors and sheltering students in class rooms saved perhaps dozens of lives.

  96. 96
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Not a gun guy, but…

    John Harwood @ JohnJHarwood
    GOP Sen Rounds on why AR-15 assault rifles shouldn’t be “demonized” and regulated any more than other guns that also kill people: “it sounds more terrifying but the result would be the same”

    I don’t think that’s true. I don’t think a hunting rifle, much less a muzzle-loading musket, could do the same damage.

    (Preemptive note to anyone like our persistent troll who want to tell me my terminology is wrong: Don’t give a fuck)

  97. 97
    Another Scott says:

    @rikyrah: Thanks for that. It’s excellent.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  98. 98
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @condorcet runner-up: “Honoring the victims” iS easier and cheaper than explaining to theor grieving next of kin why the shooters’ rights are more important than their loved ones’ continued existence.

  99. 99
    condorcet runner-up says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: I’ve been paying more and more attention to framing over the last few years, because it really does affect (a) how the media reports on issues and (b) whether the democrats tend to be on the defensive (by accepting — or failing to challenge — their opponents’ framing) versus on offense. And both of those things play a crucial role in public thought and general perception of these issues, especially for people less engaged in the day to day of politics than all of us jackals here.

    There is something really insidious about the framing in that WH press release. Not that I am surprised by this WH, but it’s revolting nonetheless.

  100. 100
    Another Scott says:

    @Immanentize: Good point. Thanks.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  101. 101
    Jeffro says:

    @Kay:

    Americans have to stop dumping everything on schools. Schools were never intended to provide everything our corrupt, lazy, feckless leaders refuse to provide. They’re not health care facilities and nutrition stations and mental health care clinics and they’re not responsible for creating a facility that is as secure as a maximim security prison WHILE being welcoming places where kids want to spend 6 hours a day. The go-to entity in the US when we’re looking for someone to fix something is “schools”. It’s ridiculous. It is IMPOSSIBLE for ONE public system to carry the entire country.

    And a 500-point-type AY-FUCKING-MEN to this.

  102. 102
    efgoldman says:

    @gene108:

    In ten or fifteen years they may not want to put their kids through the same shit they went through and maybe fight for gun control a lot harder than older generations.

    We grew to mock “duck and cover.” But that catastrophe never happened. Shootings, OTOH….

  103. 103
    les says:

    @GregB:

    An armed society is a polite society.

    The gun humpers love this line. It’s a throw away line from a mediocre sci fi story–early Heinlein, I think–perfect for the fucked up fiction they run in their heads. Armed society isn’t polite, it’s just scared.

  104. 104
    Mandalay says:

    @condorcet runner-up:

    I don’t know if this is appropriate or not, but even the language “honoring the victims of …” really bothers me.

    Me too. And now the media are calling parents who texted with their kids while the shooting was going on as “heroes”. Injecting this “power-of-the-human-spirit” commentary into the story, instead of reporting what actually happened, serves only as a diversion. It ennobles those who suffered instead of confronting the slaughter.

    And for further sanitizing look no further than the TV networks endlessly replaying the videos taken by the kids. All of the killer’s shots can be clearly heard, but any swearing from the terrified kids is scrupulously bleeped out. This country is nuts.

  105. 105
    Jeffro says:

    @GregB:

    The NRA has been living in the Washington swamp and buying politicians for 40 years.

    This ultra violence is the fruit of their loins.

    Take a bow Wayne.

    I’m going to look into what it takes to publish a full page ad in various papers. Headline: “NRA Members: Wayne LaPierre is nuts and only looking out for the gun industry. You’re not – you’re better than that. Join us in stopping all aspects of gun violence”

  106. 106
    bjacques says:

    To stop a bad person with a bullet you need a good person with a ballot. Don’t stop until Washington and the statehouses look, politically speaking, like the scene of an active school shooting: the carnage of a once seemingly invincible political order; politicians vainly begging for their political lives and lobbyists grieving over lost access; CNN, Morning Joe and Chuck Todd babbling irrelevantly and failing yet again to understand what is happening in from their faces; plumes of smoke from smoke rising from NRA headquarters and their offices (if any) on K Street, from overheated shredders; most of all, a practical demonstration of the limits of “2nd Amendment solutions”: the spectacle of a some angry white dude realizing too late that a stack of guns and only two hands are useless against a SWAT team enforcing the laws passed by a roused polity and no neighbors rising up to save him. My thoughts are of political fallout and my prayers are to Nemesis and the Furies.

  107. 107
    Damned at Random says:

    @TenguPhule: VIa the fricking NRA home page, a flash from the past. Governor Bat Boy has earned his NRA contributions:

    https://www.nraila.org/articles/20140623/alert-governor-rick-scott-makes-history-signing-5-pro-gun-bills

  108. 108
    TenguPhule says:

    @Jeffro:

    You’re not – you’re better than that.

    Sadly, they’re not better. If they’re still a dues paying member, they’re complicit.

  109. 109
    TenguPhule says:

    @bjacques: Sorry, a Constitutional Convention is not happening in any of our lifetimes.

  110. 110
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    Sounds harmless enough if you read it, but the delivery was so stilted and insincere. They shouldn’t trot him out to do “consoling” and “comforting.” He absolutely cannot pull it off credibly.

    As we’ve been noting for two and a half years now, he is only ever animated or sincere-sounding when he’s riffing or going off-script. Put (someone else’s) written words in front of him and he’ll go all low-energy, stilted, failing to emphasize the important words and concepts while giving undue stress to insignificant words, rushing through natural pauses while halting awkwardly during passages that should flow. You could load the TelePrompTer with the Gettysburg Address or the “I Have a Dream” speech or Henry V’s “St Crispin’s Day” exhortation to his troops at Agincourt, and Trump would read it with all the passion he’d bring to a shopping list or a “pick up the dry cleaning” memo.

    Not everyone can be a great orator, but most people whose jobs require them to speak in public can bring at least a modicum of thought and appropriate emotion to the task. Trump is incapable of that.

  111. 111
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    Yeah, who gives a shit about 16 dead kids? It’s literally just another day in America since we have a school shooting every other day now.

  112. 112
    Dmbeaster says:

    When will President Pu$$y Grabber repudiate his hero Alex Jones and his odious hatefullness about Sandy Hook? Or his conspiracy theories about the Vegas shooter? How long until Jones cooks up some conspiracy nonsense about Parkland?

    And why after Vegas are bump stocks still legal (which the NRA fights to keep legal)?

    The orange shitgibbon is already clear about how nothing will be done – just grin and bear it is his message.

  113. 113
    WaterGirl says:

    @Damned at Random: Except there is this in the fine print:

    The organizations themselves did not donate, rather the money came from the organizations’ PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals’ immediate families.

  114. 114
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @condorcet runner-up: “Honoring the victims” is easier and cheaper than explaining to their grieving next of kin why the shooters’ rights are more important than their loved ones’ continued existence.

  115. 115
    Lapassionara says:

    @Betty Cracker: Thank you for watching so I did not have to.

  116. 116
    trnc says:

    @Tokyokie:

    When some Federalist Society hack appears, it should be pointed out to him that strict interpretation fetishist Scalia’s majority decision in Heller rests on blithely ignoring the 2nd Amendment’s introductory clause: “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State,” and his deliberate misinterpretation of the Constitution was done to promote perversion, the same perversion that the Federalist Society was founded to advance.

    True, but even more importantly, they’ve turned 2A into a non-sequitur by completely ignoring the references to militia made in Articles 1-8 and 2-2, which gives the executive and legislative branches direct control over the militia. That’s what ostensibly makes them “well regulated.”

  117. 117
    Just One More Canuck says:

    @Baud: They’ll probably make them pay taxes on it

  118. 118
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @condorcet runner-up:

    It’s important, for the reasons you said. I’ve been paying more attention to framing and rhetoric than I used to, but I know I simply miss a lot of things unless someone brings them to my attention. I hope you’ll continue to point them out when you see them.

  119. 119
    MJS says:

    @Mandalay: I’m hoping some Democrat or Democratic advocacy group can get one of those videos and use it in an ad. Start by having the narrator say, “This is the type of education Republican Congressman X and his friends in the NRA wants for your child” then go to the video of kids huddled under desks as shots killing their classmates ring out from the halls.

  120. 120
    Mandalay says:

    @Damned at Random: Re your interesting link, why on earth would Tammy Duckworth have accepted a $50 donation from the NRA? I can understand (but not condone) accepting $9,999 if you desperately needed the money. And I can understand (and heartily condone) her telling them to shove their money where the moon doesn’t shine.

    But why would you accept a $50 donation?

  121. 121
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: the video of the police clearing a classroom like it was a clandestine ISIS meeting combined with Sweet Paulie Blue-Eyes saying we can’t have a “knee-jerk” reaction to these massacres. Hang that “knee-jerk” on him for the rest of his political life.

  122. 122
    WaterGirl says:

    @Mandalay: The devil is in the details From the fine print at the link: (bolding mine)

    The organizations themselves did not donate, rather the money came from the organizations’ PACs, their individual members or employees or owners, and those individuals’ immediate families.

  123. 123
    Chief Oshkosh says:

    @MomSense:

    How much more proof do we need that the gun community cannot handle the responsibility?

    Perfectly stated. Best point of the whole conversation.

  124. 124
    WaterGirl says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: Two thoughts on your comment. One, I was appalled that those kids were treated like criminals, and I noticed one set of hands in the air that looked like the kid was terrified and waving please don’t shoot me Two, As far as the bug eyed granny starver and knee jerk reactions go: he is a jerk and I would gladly take the opportunity to knee him in the groin. But maybe that’s not what you had in mind with that reference?

  125. 125
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @Mandalay: But why would you accept a $50 donation?

    Yes, I’m sure she personally endorsed that check and kissed it like Max Bialystok when he sold the last 150% of Springtime. Thank god we have you Bernie folk to keep our priorities straight and fighting the real enemy: Democrats!

    Do you find, that when you approach a group of acquaintances or colleagues (I almost said ‘friends’, but that might’ve seemed like taunting), casually chatting and laughing together, that they suddenly lapse into awkward silence and remember they dentist appointments to schedule and TS-R13 reports to file? Do you ever wonder why that is?

  126. 126
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Dmbeaster:

    How long until Jones cooks up some conspiracy nonsense about Parkland?

    I’m surprised he hasn’t yet. It probably just hasn’t made its way into the MSM yet.

  127. 127
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Mandalay:

    Because it’s small enough to fly under the radar so Duckworth doesn’t realize it’s there until someone uses it to smear her.

  128. 128
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    And this wisdom from the Governor of Kentucky:

    Gov. Matt Bevin told talk radio hosts his heart is truly broken for the people of Florida and the community has been shattered in a similar way that Kentucky was in January. He said guns are not the reason for increase in school shootings, but blamed a culture that delegitimizes life through violent video games, TV shows and music lyrics.

  129. 129
    Calouste says:

    @Jeffro: A gun-owning household owns on average 7 (seven) guns. They are also nuts.

  130. 130
    TenguPhule says:

    @SiubhanDuinne:

    He said guns are not the reason for increase in school shootings, but blamed a culture that delegitimizes life through violent video games, TV shows and music lyrics.

    Because those games, tv shows and lyrics fire bullets, AMIRITE?

    /smh

    If Clubbing is good enough for seals, its certainly good enough for these fat fucking republicans.

  131. 131
    d58826 says:

    This is so far off topic but caught my eye and the old saying the more things change the more they remain the same. I was browsing my history book club memebership list and came acrtoss this
    the book Field of blood

    Fought in 1119 between tribal Turkish warriors, Arab foot soldiers, Armenian bowmen, and European knights, the Battle of the Field of Blood would decide the fate of the city of the Aleppo and the eastern Crusader states. Carrying a piece of the true cross before them, the Frankish army advanced, anticipating a victory that would secure their dominance over the entire region—but instead suffered a colossal defeat. With their advance in Northern Syria stalled, the momentum of the crusader conquest began to evaporate, and would never be recovered.

    The middle east has been a mess since Adam and Eve

  132. 132
    Calouste says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: Did the interviewer ask Bevin about the influence of a politician who delegitimizes life by boasting he could should someone in public and his followers would still vote for him?

  133. 133
    Cacti says:

    Looky, looky…

    A white nationalist group in Florida is claiming Nikolas Cruz as a member.

    The leader of a white nationalist militia says Florida school shooting suspect Nikolas Cruz was a member of his group and participated in paramilitary drills in Tallahassee.

    Jordan Jereb told The Associated Press on Thursday that his group wants Florida to become its own white ethno-state. He said his group holds “spontaneous random demonstrations” and tries not to participate in the modern world.

  134. 134
    VeniceRiley says:

    ADL.ORG has the scoop on Cruz being in a white supremacist group

  135. 135
    cain says:

    @Baud:

    @Arm The Homeless: Most of the kids I saw on the news were minorities. Not sure what the breakdown is.

    That would make sense, the guy was a racist.

  136. 136
    John Fremont says:

    @NotMax: While they spent the last year attempting to weaken health insurance policies and mandated essential benefits like prescription drugs and mental health coverage.

  137. 137
    NorthLeft12 says:

    @les:

    An armed society is a polite society.

    This effing quote has always ticked me off. It is first, false, and second, it reeks of intimidation, violence and fear.

    I always felt it carried an implied threat that a person with a weapon commanded respect, and if you choose to not arm yourself, then you were not worthy of respect.

    Last point, although I don’t live in your country, I would consider modern day American society as armed, but I don’t feel the polite part so much.

  138. 138
    TenguPhule says:

    @d58826:

    The middle east has been a mess since Adam and Eve

    No, the Middle East was actually much less of a mess before the fucking Catholic Church authorized the Crusades.

    The Roman Catholic Church is the oldest criminal organization in the world.

  139. 139
    NorthLeft12 says:

    @Cacti:

    A white nationalist group in Florida is claiming Nikolas Cruz as a member.

    I struggle to understand why they might think that the above is anything to brag about. But then again, I really fail to understand anything at all of what these guys say or do.

  140. 140
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Cacti: “tries not to participate in the modern world”…well, except to grab a modern assault rifle and shoot a bunch of modern school children.

  141. 141
    Jeffro says:

    @TenguPhule: Heck, the NRA isn’t even the worst of these groups.

  142. 142
    TenguPhule says:

    @NorthLeft12:

    I struggle to understand why they might think that the above is anything to brag about.

    If he killed non-white students its a way for them to claim street cred with other white power groups without getting their own hands dirty.

  143. 143
    J R in WV says:

    Haven’t read the thread, wanted to comment before it dies out, have to go to the Post Office to do some banking (ha!).

    I will confess that although I am surely saddened by yesterday’s school shooting in FL, I am not grieving for those killed, I didn’t know any of them at all. I certainly hope those wounded recover swiftly and well. But I grieve for my close people (including Boomer, Clyde, Rufus, Roscoe, etc), not strangers a thousand miles away. And of course we know Trump doesn’t grieve for anything or anyone.

    Eventually these shootings will have directly struck enough families that the law will be changed to well regulate (see amendments, 2nd!) those who own guns, and deal in them. Building your own, or modifying one, will be included in manufacturing a terrorist device crimes. The gun humpers always leave out the “well regulated” part of that particular odd sentence. Although I am a gun owner and target shooter, I strongly prefer well regulated gun laws!

    The Russo-Republicans will pay for their crimes, or at least the crimes we can prove in a court of law. The courts will be cleansed of judges without a lick of common sense. Money is not free speech, only a fool or a bought simpleton would say so, much less order that to be the law of the land. We need to fix that, too, by impeaching those without common sense. Or we are surely lost!

    I do have a large dose of sympathy for those who have lost close friends or relatives! The kids whose best friends are dead, how will they decide which funerals to go to? What an agonizing choice. Will FL pay for a funeral chosen by the parents? Or some cheap crap picked out by an assistant to a staff member of the Governor? Hard questions.

  144. 144
    Mnemosyne says:

    @NorthLeft12:

    I struggle to understand why they might think that the above is anything to brag about.

    Because they’re terrorists, and that’s what terrorist groups do when one of their members does a terror attack: they claim responsibility.

    And yet the media and government is going to insist that this totally was not a terrorist attack because it was a white supremacist killing people.

  145. 145
    WaterGirl says:

    @NorthLeft12:

    …but I don’t feel the polite part so much.

    That would be the understatement of the year!

  146. 146
    Aleta says:

    I’ve wondered why an insurance requirement to own guns, as Immanentize mentioned above, can’t be attempted state by state. Wouldn’t this be possible as a start, and faster than first trying to pass laws for responsible use?

    Like driving, insurance cos (rather than legislators and politicians) would be the ones to sort out the tables for risk and cost. So it might end up costing more for 16-26 yos to own a gun, or the highest cost for semi-automatics. As with farm trucks, lower requirements for sole hunting use (non-semi, non-big caliper), and antiques.

    If someone’s kid is harmed by a neighbor’s or shooter’s gun, parents would be able to get some medical support through the gun owner’s policy. Which would transfer the cost of accidents among gun-insurance owners (instead of among ERs and homeowners), and might help pass safety laws.

    eta. not at all perfect, but as a way to move forward with safety and curtail by cost of the ‘hobby’

  147. 147
    WaterGirl says:

    @J R in WV: Thank you.

  148. 148
    d58826 says:

    @Aleta: didn’t the feds pass a law granting the gun makers immunity from legal liability ?

  149. 149
    Ruckus says:

    @Kay:
    Reams of bullshit sounds like a republican bottom 40 pop band.

  150. 150
    Ruckus says:

    @condorcet runner-up:
    Well said.
    It’s the same concept of everyone in the military has honor because they joined. We have a medal for honor, otherwise, we just serve. Kids go to school to learn, not for honor.

  151. 151
    J R in WV says:

    @Ruckus:

    WE do have a medal for Honor, don’t we?!!!

    I occasionally mention that I was once in the Navy around folks who don’t know me, and right off some youngster will say “Thanks for your service!”. I want to tell them I volunteered at the point of a gun being used to round up victims for Tricky Dick Nixon’s treasonous war, but I am aware enough that 90% of people would think I was crazy.

    They didn’t live through that age of treason, and don’t have any idea what a military draft for a phony war is all about – murder on a grand scale.

    So I just say you’re welcome, it was all different then, look it up sometime.

    Regarding the Second Amendment, it doesn’t need to be amended, judges just need to be forced to implement those words in the beginning “well regulated” And congress and state legislatures need to do the regulating. Then it would be OK. Insurance, sure a good idea. A good start as they say.

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