Shape of earth, views differ

Fuck the New York Times:

Democrats vividly recall Mr. Trump on the campaign trail vowing to prosecute Mrs. Clinton if he won. “It was alarming enough to chant ‘lock her up’ at a campaign rally,” said Brian Fallon, who was Mrs. Clinton’s campaign spokesman. “It is another thing entirely to try to weaponize the Justice Department in order to actually carry it out.”

But conservatives said Mrs. Clinton should not be immune from scrutiny as a special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III, investigates Russia’s interference in last year’s election and any connections to Mr. Trump’s campaign. They argued, for example, that Mrs. Clinton was the one doing Russia’s bidding in the form of a uranium deal approved when she was secretary of state.

87 replies
  1. 1


    They published an op-ed today about how we need to talk about Bill Clinton’s womanizing (echoing some nice whataboutism by Shaun King I’ve been seeing going around the leftosphere). I read a few of the “NYT Picks” comments, which were all basically about how the entire Clinton family needs to light themselves on fire for the good of the country. Blargh. With friends like these, who needs friends.

  2. 2
    SFAW says:

    I’m just hoping she FINALLY gets locked up for her personal execution (with her bare hands!) of poor Vince Foster.

    I heard she also shot down Amelia Earhart’s plane.

  3. 3
    mai naem mobile says:

    I think Pinch has been compromised by the Russians. The paper hasn’t been doing well financially for a while. I wouldn’t even be surprised if the Russkies have given Pinch a loan. Either that or the irrational hatred of Clinton and Clinton Rules.

  4. 4
    Downpuppy says:

    It’s like nobody at the Times has ever left the bubble. There’s an accurate story in there somewhere, but unless you’re a Times lifer (or better yet, a legacy like Haberman) it would take you 3 hours with a pickaxe to find it.

    What the hell are they thinking?

  5. 5
    different-church-lady says:

    I mean, even FOX NEWS let Shep Smith blow the Uranium bullshit clear out of the water.

  6. 6
    manyakitty says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I think the Atlantic is harping on that, too. Jeebus. The republicans were so unprepared to win they’re still fighting all the battles they had loaded and ready to fire at President HRC.


  7. 7
    TS says:

    Locking up your political opponents is definitely a 3rd world problem. This is where the US has landed under the moron

  8. 8
    Johannes says:

    I think it’s finally time to unsubscribe. As Malcolm Tucker would say, “E-fucking-nough.”

  9. 9
    Salter Wobchak says:

    Every once in awhile you’ll see someone on Twitter commenting on how we all need to support the NYT for their excellent reporting. Fuck them.

  10. 10
    different-church-lady says:

    @Salter Wobchak: Who cares what those Russian bots think?

  11. 11
    SFAW says:

    When I’m anointed God-Emperor of this burg, I will quote Zimmy in My first words to the FTFNYT and RWNJs in general:

    “The next time you see me comin’ you better run.”


  12. 12
    Hunter Gathers says:

    When is the NYT going to figure out that elderly shut-ins who watch Fox News all day aren’t going to pay for a NYT subscription?

  13. 13
    Ruckus says:

    If it doesn’t fit the narrative that some moron completely manufactured out of thin air and bullshit, it must be wrong.

  14. 14
    RepubAnon says:

    It’s Clinton-bashing, so it’s true. I expect Maureen Dowd’s next column is writing itself.

    A foreign company bought a US company… boring. Wait, Hillary was involved??? Page 1 of the NYT.

  15. 15
    Kay says:

    It’s the timing too. The theme is launched on the Right and shortly thereafter the NYTimes launders it slightly and presents it as news.

    There’s a word they use in campaign finance illegality- “conduit”- that’s where one doesn’t want to report where a donation actually came from so it’s passed thru a more legit person- the conduit.

    The theme can’t come directly from Breitbart so it goes thru an intermediary and appears clean when it’s presented to the general public.

  16. 16
    different-church-lady says:


    A foreign company bought a US another foreign company… boring.

  17. 17
    Petorado says:

    It’s looking like Zimbabwe’s military has had enough with Mugabe and is taking over. One despot down, a bunch more to go. Hopefully Zimbabwe doesn’t just replace one aging horrible person with a younger horrible person in a military uniform.

  18. 18


    The republicans were so unprepared to win they’re still fighting all the battles they had loaded and ready to fire at President HRC.

    Here we go. This is really what’s behind a lot of this. I think a lot of Republicans were kind of looking forward to leading four years of hearings into the Clinton administration, and Tяump’s win just caught them flat footed. They never for a minute last year dreamt that they’d need to run shit, and they’ve been flailing around trying to get back on their feet ever since.

    I think they gave it a shot for most of this first year. Like Tяump, they thought, “How tough could this be?” Now they’re learning how fucking hard it is, and they know they aren’t up to it, so they’re falling back on their old trued-and-true, investigating Hillary Clinton.

  19. 19
    Ruckus says:

    I’m confused. I thought that Breitbart got it’s leads from the FTFNYT. It’s the other way around?

  20. 20
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @different-church-lady: Given that the DOJ had both a principal and a deputy at the Council on Foreign Investment in the US (CFIUS) when this was discussed, that the DOJ’s presence was because the DOJ is required to do a full investigation and vetting of every transaction that comes before CFIUS, and no transaction can be approved by CFIUS unless the DOJ blesses off after its investigation of the potential transaction there is nothing here to investigate. There is nothing in the actually happened Uranium One deal that violates US law or was done in an untoward manner. And that’s what is going to be pushed back to the AG from the career prosecutors.

  21. 21
    SFAW says:

    @mai naem mobile:

    I think Pinch has been compromised by the Russians.

    Sadly, No. He’s just an asshole with (as you noted) an irrational hatred of All Things Clinton. He became Publisher in 1992, just in time to get his hate on for Bill & Hill.

  22. 22
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Hunter Gathers: And that those folks can’t read 12 point type anymore.

  23. 23
    Ruckus says:

    @Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
    This is probably part of it. They were totally unprepared to have drumpf as president. Much as we are. The main bit may be though that they are just that fucking dumb. Louie Gofart sure is.

  24. 24
    Kay says:

    Maybe Mueller is actually immune to pressure. It’s possible. I certainly hope so. He’s the only thing standing between us and a complete collapse of institutions. I don’t credit Comey with much but I do credit him with that. He got a real investigation which is no small thing, as it turns out. Imagine how bad it would be with no checks at all.

  25. 25
    Ruckus says:

    @Adam L Silverman:
    I know you said shut ins but they do sell readers at grocery and drug stores.

  26. 26
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    When The Revolution gets here, Pinch Sulzberger definitely gets a tumbrel ride.

  27. 27
    Ruckus says:

    @Hunter Gathers:
    I wonder if some of the problem might be the really, really olds are still watching black and white TV?

  28. 28
    Ruckus says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:
    How are you going to come up with a proper order? Surly there won’t be that many open spots the first go round.

  29. 29
    Eric S. says:

    @Major Major Major Major: I met with two Trump voters at work today. Unofficial meeting. They bring up politics, not me. I mentioned Trump finally made it to Vietnam 70 years late (hat tip Raven). Their response (for the record 2 white women): Clinton didn’t go either because he was too busy r@ping women.

  30. 30
    Amaranthine RBG says:

    The NYT accurately characterize what some conservatives contend and then states the facts that disprove the contention a few paragraphs later:

    Donors related to Uranium One and another company it acquired contributed millions of dollars to the Clinton Foundation, and former President Bill Clinton received $500,000 from a Russian bank for a speech. But there is no evidence that Mrs. Clinton participated in the government approval of the deal, and her aides have noted that other agencies signed off on it. The company’s actual share of American uranium production has been 2 percent; the real benefit for Russia was securing far greater supplies of uranium from Kazakhstan.

  31. 31
    Gin & Tonic says:


    Hopefully Zimbabwe doesn’t just replace one aging horrible person with a younger horrible person in a military uniform.

    But the smart money bets on “of course they will.”

    I recall, ages ago, when Mugabe was jokingly called “Bobodan” – after Slobodan Milosevic. Some joke. Milosevic has been feeding the worms for a decade+, while Mugabe has held on through thick and thin (mostly thin.)

  32. 32
    tobie says:

    I’ve been wondering if it would help matters to have Obama address this, or if this would just send the rabid right wing into an even greater frenzy. I do think Democrats need to have a united message on this that they repeat ad nauseum. This is a bogus story; Clinton played no part in approving the purchase of a uranium mining company; this is only meant to distract us from the Trump’s many Russian ties. Rinse and repeat. Too often the party doesn’t respond until it’s too late. They should take a page out of the Republican playbook. Turn the tables whenever a question about Hillary is asked. Get all self-righteous about how the country has been sold down the river by Trump and the GOP.

  33. 33
    Yarrow says:

    Didn’t Carlos Slim own part of the NYT for awhile?

  34. 34
  35. 35
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Ruckus: Remember the draft lottery? It can be repurposed.

  36. 36
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Yarrow: Still does.

  37. 37
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I still remember my number.

  38. 38
    Wag says:


    Maybe Mueller is actually immune to pressure…He’s the only thing standing between us and a complete collapse of institutions.

    Well, that and the WaPo. Democracy dies in darkness. Best motto for a newspaper. Ever.

  39. 39
    Jeffro says:

    @tobie: Wouldn’t hurt to have Obama, Hillz, or some other prominent Dem in the know give a prime-time news conference about this (hell, about Russia in general). Shake things up. Change the narrative. Break through to folks who might otherwise just be getting their news from Russian trolls on Facebook.

    I mean, go for it: start with pointing out how absurd and unsupported the whole Uranium One story is, talk about who financed “Clinton Cash”, note that absolutely NOTHING Trumpov & Co. have done since the election (or the campaign, really) indicates innocence in the slightest where Russia is concerned, note all the ways that this is right out of the maskirova playbook, and leave it there for for viewers to draw their own conclusions.

  40. 40
  41. 41

    @Major Major Major Major: Thing is, Goldberg’s article (which IIRC is a paraphrasing of a Slate article done she published the election) is, I think, largely right on the merits. But the accusations have been so thoroughly hijacked and piledriven to hell by bad faith that it probably won’t do any good. To say nothing of the piece appearing in an institution which so thoroughly disgraced itself during and since the election cycle.

  42. 42
    Peale says:

    @Ruckus: the issue is really the shortage of tumbrels currently. There aren’t enough wheelwright and cartwrights these days to make an adequate supply. A decent trumbrel can hold eight prisoners standinding, but with some creative packing, I think we could almost double that. Rather than allowing them to stand, we could lay them horizontally and stack them five high per tumbrel. Yes, wed lose the pleasure of being able to view their sorry faces as we plunked them with eggs, but we’d get more of them out of the way before the counter Revolution got started.

  43. 43
    Jeffro says:

    @Jeffro: I should probably add that by ‘prominent Dem in the know’, I mean – talk about a pipe dream – that one of the House or Senate Dems who are on the Intelligence committees will just get fed up and call a presser to lay out everything that has been disclosed in secret, risks/penalites be damned. Sort of the domestic version of what someone (perhaps Adam?) said might happen if Mueller gets fired, that friendly intelligence agencies would leak all of that stuff to the press.

    Storm’s comin’…

  44. 44
    jl says:

    @tobie: Hillary could appear on The View and do a spot on how to beat a man to death with pumpkins stolen out of a reactionary nutcase GOP Congressman’s back yard, for self-defense purposes only, of course. Important to get pumpkins grown by a reactionary nutcase, since they work better.

  45. 45
    Lyrebird says:

    @Petorado: Wow.

    Just looked, Latin Quarter’s “Radio Africa” – where I learned the name Mugabe – was released in 1985. Yikes. Also obligatory.

    Hopefully Zimbabwe doesn’t just replace one aging horrible person with a younger horrible person in a military uniform.

    From your lips to the spaghetti monster’s ears, or something like that…

  46. 46
    tobie says:

    @Jeffro: If Biden so badly wants the Democratic Party’s nomination, maybe he can speak to the matter. I liked the way you turned the tables, making the story about Schweizer and Breitbart and the Russian financed outfits lining up to distract us from the serious matter of Russian meddling in the election.

    ETA: I don’t think Hillary can be the one to address these lies. That would draw attention to her, we want it drawn to the right wing propagandists.

  47. 47
    Lyrebird says:

    @tobie: We just need to play Joy Reid’s show clip where she set that guest straight… OVER and OVER and OVER again!

  48. 48
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Eric S.: Did they know that Trump said his personal Vietnam was avoiding sexually transmitted diseases, because that’s how many random women he was hooking up with?

    (While we’re at it, AFAICT every time he talks about sex he’s lying worse than Andy in 40-Year Old Virgin)

  49. 49
    tobie says:

    @Lyrebird: That was stellar!

  50. 50
    lamh36 says:

    Hey Adam…remember the conversation we had about Roy Moore and his wife and the age difference? Well lookey here… Roy Moore’s wife Kayla was in the SAME class as the latest accuser…Mrs Young!

    More Daniel Dale Retweeted WilliamThornton
    Roy Moore’s wife Kayla was a classmate of accuser Beverly Young Nelson…

    Looks like some smart reporters were looking at the same thing I was…

    Following Following @ddale8
    Moore wrote in his 2009 book that he met wife at a church Christmas party after having spotted her, in some way, “many” years earlier. She told Breitbart this week that they met at Bible study.

    Notice too…Moore and the wife changing the story of how they met…

    Here’s the article: More
    Roy and Kayla Moore have been married 32 years and have four grown children. But how did their relationship begin?

    Oh wait… I had to verify that. He first saw her when she was a teen at a dance recital. He was smitten. Met her again when she was 23, and started off the convo “haven’t I seen you somewhere before?”
    WTH was a grown man doing at a teen’s dance recital?

  51. 51
    Johannes says:

    @Regnad Kcin: OK, don’t rub it in. I’ve got friends who work for that rag, and have been holding on for their sakes.

  52. 52
    Eric S. says:

    @FlipYrWhig: I responded, generically, Trump did the same.

    They responded, there were more less accusers than Bill Clinton had.

    I chuckled and just said look it up. Neither was willing to challenge that.

  53. 53
    Omnes Omnibus says:


    WTH was a grown man doing at a teen’s dance recital?

    I’ve been to things for my niece (there will be a basketball tournament over T-day weekend). OTOH, I wasn’t cruising the things for future dates.

  54. 54
    lamh36 says:

    1h1 hour ago
    Sean Hannity breaking with Roy Moore: “For me, the judge has 24 hours. You must immediately and fully come up with a satisfactory explanation for your inconsistencies… You must remove any doubt. If you can’t do this, then Judge Moore needs to get out of this race.”

    looks to me like KKKLannity got tired of those advertisers jumping ship from his show

  55. 55
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @lamh36: Yep. And compare their sophomore pictures.
    Beverly Young:

    And Kayla Kisor (now Moore):

  56. 56
    frosty says:

    @Gin & Tonic:

    I still remember my number.

    Every guy our age does. 34 for me.

  57. 57
  58. 58
    Petorado says:

    @Gin & Tonic: “Smart” money has nothing to do with it. Corrupt money will do the talking.

    It would be nice, however, if someone more benevolent takes over for a change.

  59. 59
    eemom says:


    I expect Maureen Dowd’s next column is writing itself.

    While she jerks off to her own self-fellating prose, alone in a Colorado hotel room munching a stale brownie.

  60. 60
    danielx says:

    @Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (formerly Mumphrey, et al.):

    Pretty much. I mean, Jason Chaffetz resigned because it was just not going to be any fun not to be able to spend four years investigating HRC, plus the ugly possibility of having to spend a lot of time overlooking Trumpian corruption. Trey Gowdy is trying to carry on, but his heart isn’t in it.

  61. 61
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yep. Most serial sexual offenders have a type.

  62. 62
    Suzanne says:

    @Eric S.:

    They responded, there were more less accusers than Bill Clinton had.

    ……and they all freaked out and said that Bill Clinton’s sexual abuse/harassment/impropriety/adultery made him unfit to have a job in leadership. They may even have been right about that. What they are fucking WRONG WRONG WRONG about is that now they think those things don’t matter because it’s their boy. Once again, they don’t live up to the moral code they have for the rest of us. And for that, they can go fuck themselves.

  63. 63
    Amir Khalid says:

    I wonder why Republicans must keep saying Hillary should not be immune from scrutiny. Over the past quarter-century, they have collectively shown that she is not — by subjecting her to scrutiny again and again and again, without ever finding anything. They are advocating a pointless waste of time and public money to persecute a distinguished public servant solely because she is a Democrat.

    Oops. I seem to have answered my own question.

  64. 64
    noncarborundum says:

    I unsubscribed shortly after they brought Brett Stephens on board. I occasionally wish I still subscribed so I didn’t miss Krugman and the daily crossword, and then they do something like this and I practically sprain my arm patting myself on the back all over again.

  65. 65
    Kay says:

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    The NYT accurately characterize what some conservatives contend and then states the facts that disprove the contention a few paragraphs later:

    There’s nothing new other than Donald Trump and Sessions want to talk about Uranium One right now, for obvious reasons. Sessions had a hearing today on his incessant lying to Congress and Trump’s son was coordinating with Wikileaks.

    They’re recycling their Clinton Cash shit from last year. Best investment ever, huh? They’ve been pulling from that book for 2 years. Who do they “partner” with next cycle? Sean Hannity?

  66. 66
  67. 67
    Kay says:

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    Why now? Why is Uranium One a matter of national importance? This isn’t how the real world works. It isn’t even steven. If Donald Trump gets himself in hot water it isn’t incumbent on them to recycle whatever stale Clinton made-up scandal they have laying around to make him feel better. Because he promised his idiot supporters that he would “lock up” Hillary Clinton doesn’t mean we all have to play along.

  68. 68
    SFAW says:


    the issue is really the shortage of tumbrels currently.

    Funny you should write that …
    I was going to wait until I got enough funding to get the factory built, but I guess I can tell you — as long as you keep it on the QT — that “SFAW’s Tumbrel Works” will be taking orders in the not-too-distant future. I expect to start shipping shortly after Mueller completes his investigation.

    ETA: I forgot to mention: I plant to hire an expert as my Director of Testing: specifically, Villago Delenda Est

  69. 69
    Peale says:

    @Kay: I believe they plan on running against her the same way they ran against Jimmy Carter. The problem is, of course, that she didn’t win so they can only only get so far with that.

  70. 70
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @lamh36: Yep.

  71. 71
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: @lamh36: And here’s an important question: why does a former Army captain who is an ADA suddenly decide he needs to resign his position, move to Texas and then quickly leave Texas for a year on “walkabout” in Australia in his early 30s?

  72. 72
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Because fuck you, that’s why?

    My best guess.

  73. 73
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: That’s a technique.

  74. 74
    Fair Economist says:

    If Uranium One were really a problem, Trump could reverse the American parts of the deal. It’s part of the agreement – revocable for national security issues.

  75. 75
    Marnie says:

    see Woolsey

  76. 76
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Adam L Silverman: But not the preferred method?

  77. 77
    Sandia Blanca says:

    @Adam L Silverman: Would love to hear more about his “lost years,” wouldn’t you?

  78. 78
  79. 79
    Anotherlurker says:

    @Gin & Tonic: 319. I remember that moment of relief……

  80. 80
    Amaranthine RBG says:

    This was discussed during Sessions testimony today.

    It is a news story.

    It’s bullshit but it’s silly to argue taht the NYT should not run stories about it.

  81. 81
    Sandia Blanca says:

    @Major Major Major Major: Might be kind of disgusting.

  82. 82
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Adam L Silverman:

    And here’s an important question: why does a former Army captain who is an ADA suddenly decide he needs to resign his position, move to Texas and then quickly leave Texas for a year on “walkabout” in Australia in his early 30s?

    To escape a shotgun wedding.


  83. 83
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Amaranthine RBG:

    Exactly what is “news” about Uranium One? Be specific. Republicans are bleating about it again isn’t the same thing as it being actual news.

  84. 84
    MisterForkbeard says:

    @Mnemosyne: To be fair, it would be entirely valid for the NYT or other news orgs to run stories about how rather than discuss any of the other myriad problems Sessions has had (including falsehoods, obvious racism, Trump trying to dictate prosecution orders to the DOJ), Republicans wanted to hyperventilate about a repeatedly debunked story… and then note that historically, Republicans do this when they want to distract the country from their own problems.

    But that’s not what we’re seeing.

  85. 85
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: Dude’s a troll. If you want a troll fight, go ahead. Otherwise iggy.

  86. 86
    Mnemosyne says:


    Exactly. There is no “Uranium One” story. The only story is the GOP’s desperation to pretend that there’s some kind of equivalence.

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Thread’s dead anyway. May as well have a fight.

  87. 87
    J R in WV says:


    Still does, a little more now that originally.

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