Thursday Morning Open Thread: Thoughts & Prayers?


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The news stays this bad, people are gonna revive the old superstition about the health of a nation depending on the health of its king. Given the season, Trump’s handlers should probably be suspicious of any invitations for him to visit an oak grove, Bohemian or not…


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Apart from doing what we can to help those most in need, what’s on the agenda for the day?
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136 replies
  1. 1
    Divf says:

    Good morning all. I’m awake in the middle of the night due to smoke from the fires.

    ReplyReply
  2. 2
    eclare says:

    @Divf: Are you in any danger?

    ReplyReply
  3. 3
    Amir Khalid says:

    Even Obama would have found so many natural disasters in quick succession a great challenge to his administration’s resources and management ability, but he would have handled it as well as anyone could. Trump is just oblivious.

    ReplyReply
  4. 4
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    Hillary got 7,362,490 votes to trump’s 3,916,209 in California. Still think these fires are due to global warming enhanced freak weather?

    ReplyReply
  5. 5
    rikyrah says:

    Good Morning, Everyone 😐😐😐

    ReplyReply
  6. 6
    rikyrah says:

    I believe that the response to Puerto Rico is deliberate.

    They are trying to kill these American citizens.😠😠

    ReplyReply
  7. 7
    rikyrah says:

    @Divf:
    Stay safe.

    ReplyReply
  8. 8

    @rikyrah: Here’s Olbermann’s take on that; yes, he’s trying to kill the Puerto Ricans because he hates them.

    ReplyReply
  9. 9
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @🐾BillinGlendaleCA: He hates everybody. Except Ivanka. He’s got a thing for her.

    ReplyReply
  10. 10
    NotMax says:

    This is the dawning of the Age of Precarious…

    (Or Nefarious – take yer pick.)

    ReplyReply
  11. 11
    Cermet says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: INteresting that the Northern regions of California were the fires are worse tend to vote republican.
    Regardless, all those there be safe and leave well before the fires get to your location since they are really fast thanks to the winds.If there is any chance for the fire to reach you, be ready, have all critical items (meds, pets, water, food, essential documents, extra money) and leave asap when danger approaches.

    ReplyReply
  12. 12
    raven says:

    @Cermet: Yea, that’s real fucking “interesting”.

    ReplyReply
  13. 13
    rikyrah says:

    Maddow reporting on Puerto Rico.
    That mega ship- the USS Comfort…

    Is treating only 7 patients.

    SEVEN!!!!

    They are trying to kill these American citizens.

    ReplyReply
  14. 14
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Cermet: SEE! It’s them ebil lieberals comin’ to get the good, upstanding by their own bootstraps Patriots ™ !!!

    ReplyReply
  15. 15
    NotMax says:

    @OzarkHillbilly

    Boots and straps made in China.

    @raven

    Thank you.

    ReplyReply
  16. 16
    satby says:

    @rikyrah: Good morning ☕.

    I’ve been donating to different charities for Puerto Rico since Maria because, like Haiti, NGOs will haved to do what the government is not getting done. Not enough, but it’s something.

    ReplyReply
  17. 17
    Gvg says:

    In order for Congress to “do something” about Trump or anything, they have to act collectively. These fools are almost as bad as Trump at acting. But anyway they have to build a consensus and it takes time to gather momentum for something like impeachment. They are supposed to represent all of us which means they are never going to act quickly on something hard. They define a committee. What they say to themselves is more significant than to the press. Leading successfully there is hard. Also Ryan and McConnel are not good leaders especially for the Trump problem. It’s also a problem for democracy that it was obvious the day he was elected that he was unfit which means lots of voters are unfit.

    ReplyReply
  18. 18
    satby says:

    @rikyrah: what was the explanation given for such low usage? Because that’s bizarre, only 7 patients.

    ReplyReply
  19. 19
    Baud says:

    @rikyrah: Good morning.

    ReplyReply
  20. 20
    rikyrah says:

    This is the second week of October. Where is the aid package for Puerto Rico?

    ReplyReply
  21. 21
    Elizabelle says:

    I don’t see people allowing a tax cuts package. I hope the issue is DOA.

    All these natural disasters all over the place? Got to be paid for.

    I think talking about the “tax reform” legislation just gives the complicit MSM a chance to act like we’ve got a normal governing body and president in charge. We don’t. Foreign capitals and press talk about this more seriously.

    ReplyReply
  22. 22
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @rikyrah: It’s on my front porch. UPS delivered it here by accident. I opened it thinking it was a present for my birthday. It contained 1 16 oz bottle of water (refilled), 1/2 roll of toilet paper, a squeezed out tube of toothpaste but no toothbrush, 1 MRE from the first Iraq war with the pudding taken out, a half empty bottle of sun screen SPF3, a few bandaids, and a MAGA hat.

    I stuffed it all back in the box and called UPS. It should make it to PR in about 3 months or so.

    ReplyReply
  23. 23
    Baud says:

    @satby: What charities do you recommend?

    ReplyReply
  24. 24
    Elizabelle says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: LOL. Well done.

    ReplyReply
  25. 25
    Elizabelle says:

    So quiet on the blog this morning. I feel like everybody else is at a breakfast I was not invited to …

    ReplyReply
  26. 26
    debbie says:

    Did that guy who posted over the weekend who was 400 yards from the evacuation area but was sticking around to hose down his house — has he posted back since? I wish I could remember his name.

    ReplyReply
  27. 27
    debbie says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I just spent my entire shower imaginary-yelling at my Trump-supporting family members and then I come here and see that ridiculous post. I don’t know, maybe the whole country should just disappear.

    ReplyReply
  28. 28
    evodevo says:

    thanks for the CA fire link … my son’s family had to evacuate due to the Lobo fire near Lake Wildwood (eastern CA near Nevada border) … he’s deployed at present and my daughter-in-law and three grandkids are staying at a friend’s … so far house is OK, but no electricity. Luckily the winds there are nothing like they are on the coast. They were all commenting on how the drought had ended when they visited in July, but I guess it’s back to CA normal now … THANKS global warming!

    ReplyReply
  29. 29
    Kay says:

    Trump is actually bashing Puerto Rico right now:

    Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump 2m2 minutes ago
    More
    …We cannot keep FEMA, the Military & the First Responders, who have been amazing (under the most difficult circumstances) in P.R. forever!
    632 replies 352 retweets 1,431 likes

    The giant baby is whining again, instead of working.

    ReplyReply
  30. 30
    satby says:

    @Baud: funny you should ask! We did a whole thread about it on 9/25 I was just rereading. Personally, I donated to Oxfam, Drs. Without Borders, and kicked in to Chef Andre’s World Central Kitchen, because they’re doing meals in Puerto Rico right now.

    ReplyReply
  31. 31
    eclare says:

    @Kay: What a vile, disgusting POS.

    ReplyReply
  32. 32
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    Over half of all police killings in 2015 were wrongly classified as not having been the result of interactions with officers, a new Harvard study based on Guardian data has found. The finding is just the latest to show government databases seriously undercounting the number of people killed by police.

    “Right now the data quality is bad and unacceptable,” said lead researcher Justin Feldman. “To effectively address the problem of law enforcement-related deaths, the public needs better data about who is being killed, where, and under what circumstances.”

    Feldman used data from the Guardian’s 2015 investigation into police killings, The Counted, and compared it with data from the National Vital Statistics System (NVSS). That dataset, which is kept by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), was found to have misclassified 55.2% of all police killings, with the errors occurring disproportionately in low-income jurisdictions.

    “As with any public health outcome or exposure, the only way to understand the magnitude of the problem, and whether it is getting better or worse, requires that data be uniformly, validly, and reliably obtained throughout the US,” said Nancy Krieger, professor of social epidemiology at Harvard’s Chan School of Public Health and senior author of the study. “Our results show our country is falling short of accurately monitoring deaths due to law enforcement and work is needed to remedy this problem.”
    ……………….
    To assess how accurately that classification was being used, the team took the 1,146 police-related deaths recorded by The Counted in 2015, removed 60 cases that did not fit the criteria of the CDC’s “legal intervention” category and requested death certificate data for the remaining 1,086 individuals. They found that a majority, 599 deaths, were classified as resulting from something other than legal intervention – principally “assault”.

    Researchers found the accuracy varied wildly by state, with just 17.6% misclassification in Washington, but a startling 100% in Oklahoma. “[Oklahoma] had more than 30 people were killed by police there in 2015 and none of them were counted on death certificates,” Feldman said.

    According to the report, there were 36 cases of “legal intervention” captured in the NVSS which were not included in The Counted.

    I am shocked, shocked I tell you.

    ReplyReply
  33. 33
    Baud says:

    @Kay: Today show is covering PR at least, although they are blaming FEMA and not Trump.

    ReplyReply
  34. 34
    Baud says:

    @satby: Thanks.

    ReplyReply
  35. 35
    rikyrah says:

    @Kay:
    The Ever loving PHUCK 😠😠😠

    ReplyReply
  36. 36
    SFAW says:

    Over at TPM, Josh transcribed Lying Littledick’s latest “thoughts” on the state of the economy, which he expressed on the show of the Stupidest Man on Television (Hannity):

    “The country, we took it over, the last eight years they borrowed more than it did in the whole history of our country. So they borrowed More than $10 trillion. Right? We picked up $5.2 trillion just in the stock market. Possibly picked up the whole thing in terms of the first nine months. In terms of value. You can say in one sense, we are really increasing values and may be in the sense, we are reducing debt. We are very honored by it and very, very happy by what’s happening in Wall Street.”

    Good Christ, what a fucking moron. Even Grunthos the Flatulent’s small intestine had a higher IQ than the Dumbfuck in Chief. He seems to forget that the Dow performance, at this point in Obama’s first term, was 50 percent better than during Shitgibbon’s — and that includes a “scary black man” drop of 12 percent the first month or so after Obama’s inauguration. And fuck you, Mnuchin, just for good measure.

    ReplyReply
  37. 37
    Repatriated says:

    @Kay: “If tha FEMA Puerto Rico deal doesn’t start getting better ratings, we’ll cancel it.”

    ReplyReply
  38. 38
    Baud says:

    @Kay: I remember when Obama was attacked for not fixing BP’s underground well in 24 hours.

    ReplyReply
  39. 39
    debbie says:

    @Kay:

    How stupid is he? Every time he says this stupid stuff about PR, he loses more and more of the Hispanic vote. Didn’t Bannon or Miller ever point to him that “they” live in states he needs, like Texas and Florida?

    ReplyReply
  40. 40

    @evodevo:

    They were all commenting on how the drought had ended when they visited in July, but I guess it’s back to CA normal now

    At least in Southern CA, we usually get Santa Anas in early October. The additional rain last winter means there’s more dry fuel to burn. So it did end the drought, but it made for a more challenging fire season.

    ReplyReply
  41. 41
    Kay says:

    @eclare:

    Hey, when he’s attacked he “counterpunches”- if “punching” = sitting on his ass Tweeting.

    I don’t know why people worry about Trump attacking another country. He’s a loud, blowhard coward. His threats mean as much as his promises- nothing. He may SUE another country or say really mean things about another country but launch some real attack with actual weapons and people? Fat chance.

    If you can’t believe a word he says- and you can’t- then you can’t believe any of what he says. He’s not honest exclusively on starting a war. He may incite an attack by someone else or blunder into a situation he can’t weasel out of but start one? No.

    ReplyReply
  42. 42
    debbie says:

    @Kay:

    I just noticed he replied to himself with the exact same Tweet. He must be more unhinged than usual.

    ReplyReply
  43. 43
    rikyrah says:

    @Baud:
    I bought Lin-Manuel Miranda’s song. And, he has a group that he works with. I have been following the Puerto Rican celebrities, and the groups they suggest. Staying away from the Red Cross, of course. The celebrities know the local groups.

    ReplyReply
  44. 44
    Baud says:

    @debbie: I hope so. Latino turnout was disappointing in 2016.

    ReplyReply
  45. 45
    Baud says:

    @Kay: I agree.

    ReplyReply
  46. 46
    rikyrah says:

    @satby:
    Chef Andre and his crew are reaching these rural towns that FEMA can’t seem to get to.😠

    ReplyReply
  47. 47
    SFAW says:

    @Kay:

    Example number 3,271,859 of proof that there is no such thing as a Just God.

    Fucking asshole. It might be a step in the right direction if Dumbfuck in Chief were to get on primetime TV and announce: “Yeah, I fucking hate PRs/Ricans (reflecting NY slang from his younger days). I COULD say it’s because a gang of them stole my lunch money when I was a kid, but … NO, I just fucking hate them, because they’re not REAL ‘Muricans, and because my Dad told me about them.” He’d be saying what rational people already believe about him, and it might wake up some of those who think he just “tells it like it is.”

    Aahhh, who am I kidding?

    ETA: Upon reflection: as I have said more than a couple of times, Lying Littledick has not intentionally told the truth since his campaign started, so the idea of him actually expressing his hatred of non-whites (which he considers Puerto Ricans to be) would never happen.

    My bad.

    ReplyReply
  48. 48
    Baud says:

    There’s no reason to treat Trump better than Weinstein.

    ReplyReply
  49. 49
    Kay says:

    @Baud:

    I remember when Obama was attacked for not fixing BP’s underground well in 24 hours.

    The standards are lower now. We’re “protecting institutions” by lowering standards that apply to those institutions.

    Because “institutions” apparently exist independently of what they do or the people who comprise them- they’re a theory. VERY strong, theoretically. Clap louder, Baud. That’ll work.

    ReplyReply
  50. 50
    bemused says:

    @Kay:

    Oh god, he never ceases to horrify.

    I think we will have trump ptsd for the rest of our lives even if we and the country survive him, his rotten crew and gop.

    ReplyReply
  51. 51
    satby says:

    @rikyrah: yes they are, and since they’re waiting for FEMA to recontract with them, they’re doing it with their own donated funds. And serving real food, not MREs. So that’s why I just sent them a bit more!

    ReplyReply
  52. 52
    Baud says:

    @Kay: The institution of white people is the only one that matters, Kay.

    ReplyReply
  53. 53
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    Some good news for women in Misery:

    COLUMBIA, Mo. • The Planned Parenthood clinic in Columbia has received a license to begin offering abortions.

    Planned Parenthood Great Plains announced Tuesday the clinic received its license and its first counseling appointments will be scheduled for Monday. The Columbia Daily Tribune reports the first abortions will be provided Oct. 23.

    The new license comes after Planned Parenthood won a court ruling in April that some new state requirements for abortion clinics violated infringed on women’s abortion rights. The Department of Health and Senior Services was ordered to process abortion license applications for clinics in Kansas City, Columbia, Springfield and Joplin. At the time, a St. Louis facility was the only place in Missouri offering abortions.

    Kansas City received its license in August. The licenses for Springfield and Joplin are still being processed.

    ReplyReply
  54. 54
    MomSense says:

    I’m facing my Senators and Rep and telling them that we will hold them responsible for failing to provide oversight to this administration and for failing to pass a relief package.

    I honestly believe trump wants people on PR to die.

    ReplyReply
  55. 55
    David 🍁Canadian Anchor Baby🍁 Koch says:

    @Kay: Pivot

    ReplyReply
  56. 56
    Elizabelle says:

    @Kay: What institutions have not failed us?

    For me, it’s the Democratic party. They stand strong and united against Trump. While MSM tells us how clueless and leaderless and in disarray they are.

    It would seem the Coast Guard is still doing a good job.

    Who else has not failed?

    ReplyReply
  57. 57
    eclare says:

    @Elizabelle: The military pushed back on the transgender ban.

    ReplyReply
  58. 58
    Eric S. says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: The Chicago Porsche Club, including myself, are arriving in your area (?) tomorrow evening. We are staying at Tan Tar A in Osage Beach. Tomorrow night there are no organized plans. Any suggestions for a nice diner and matbe a nightcap?

    ReplyReply
  59. 59
    Baud says:

    @Elizabelle: The institution of Balloon Juice stands strong!

    Speaking of Democrats, it seems the current meme de semana is to talk about how old our leaders are. Interesting, since we now have a number of fresh faces in Congress.

    ReplyReply
  60. 60
    eclare says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: A bright spot, indeed!

    ReplyReply
  61. 61
    rikyrah says:

    @satby:
    Nobody has reported it , but I truly believe that the government’s initial refusal to allow SNAP funds to be used for hot meals had something to do with Chef Andre and him cancelling the business deal he had with Dolt45.
    Yes, I think that he’s that petty.

    ReplyReply
  62. 62
    bemused says:

    Our one-eyed dog has adapted well to sight in just one eye since other affected eye was removed about 2 months ago. However, she has a sore leg this morning from not seeing, tripping over something in the dark outside while running after our other dog. So we’ve learned that the dark is more difficult for her to judge what is in front of her on her blind side.

    I woke up this morning remembering a disturbing dream that a thread here had over 900 comments last night. Dreams are weird.

    ReplyReply
  63. 63
    Elizabelle says:

    WRT institutions: it’s almost like Trump and all the hollowing out the GOP and the oligarchs and their buds the Russians have done:

    It’s like a Biblical flood has taken place. Swept out, destroyed. The good with the bad.

    And corporate-owned media can’t accurately report, because they answer to their owners, when it comes down to it. They’re risk averse. (The Weinstein stories that the FTF NYTimes and NBC passed on — they’re timid. They don’t want to rock the boat unless a Clinton is on board.)

    The conservatives on the Supreme Court stink to high heaven. Like dead Scalia. They’re ruining this country too.

    How safe and happy are YOU going to feel at your next outdoor concert? Why not a shopping mall? USSC don’t care about non-ammosexuals.

    Now we find that the toll of police shootings is vastly underreported. Why is that?

    ReplyReply
  64. 64
    Kay says:

    @Baud:

    If they can’t pass the huge tax cuts Trump’s backers were promised you’ll see an exodus. They don’t give a shit about health care- that’s for the voting base. They backed him for deregulation and tax cuts. I don’t think he can deliver because he’s bad at his job a fact they overlooked. Imagine trading everything you supposedly believe for a promised windfall and then not getting it. That’s when the elite outrage will start.

    ReplyReply
  65. 65
    eclare says:

    @rikyrah: I still wonder if part of the non-response is because POS’s golf resort in PR went bankrupt.

    ETA> And I agree with you about the vendetta against the chef.

    ReplyReply
  66. 66
    Elizabelle says:

    @Baud: Very interesting. The Dems are olds.

    Especially since 50s and whipsmart PBO replaced by 70s and doddering Trump, who was not up to the job in his prime. Does not have the character for the job.

    And since the youths are not flocking to the GOP. Unless they are culturally white. They have any independent thought processes at all — they are not in the GOP.

    ReplyReply
  67. 67
    Baud says:

    @Kay: Added incentive to oppose them.

    ReplyReply
  68. 68
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    @Eric S.: Sorry, I can’t help you there. I stay as far away from Lake of the Ozarks as I possibly can. Once, by mistake I drove thru Osage Beach. It was a mistake. This being October it might be better for you. It being a Friday night it could be much worse.

    ReplyReply
  69. 69
    Elizabelle says:

    @Kay: I want those tax cuts to go down in flames more deadly than those lapping wine country California right now.

    And to burn those who pushed and pushed for them. You cannot loot the Treasury like they intend when there is so much unmet need among Americans, and natural disasters pummelling us.

    ReplyReply
  70. 70
    Betty Cracker says:

    I’m glad the shitgibbon is back to bashing Puerto Rico on Twitter. His administration’s colossal mismanagement of the crisis there hasn’t received the attention it deserves.

    ReplyReply
  71. 71
    Baud says:

    @Elizabelle: I hope our side starts to realize that when you teach Dems a lesson, that lesson is learned on the backs of our up-and-coming leaders. You can’t then whine about the absence of new, younger faces.

    ReplyReply
  72. 72
    Baud says:

    @Betty Cracker: That is a silver lining. I agree.

    ReplyReply
  73. 73

    @bemused: Do you know Henry Taylor’s poem, “Riding a One-Eyed Horse”?

    Riding A One-Eyed Horse
    by Henry Taylor
    One side of his world is always missing.
    You may give it a casual wave of the hand
    or rub it with your shoulder as you pass,
    but nothing on his blind side ever happens.

    Hundreds of trees slip past him into darkness,
    drifting into a hollow hemisphere
    whose sounds you will have to try to explain.
    Your legs will tell him not to be afraid

    if you learn never to lie. Do not forget
    to turn his head and let what comes come seen:
    he will jump the fences he has to if you swing
    toward them from the side that he can see

    and hold his good eye straight. The heavy dark
    will stay beside you always; let him learn
    to lean against it. It will steady him
    and see you safely through diminished fields.

    ReplyReply
  74. 74
    Elizabelle says:

    Thinking about Tom Petty a lot these days. I think we should have a weekly Tom Petty thread to share good stuff about him.

    Thinking on one of his songs:

    All the vampires
    walking through our Congress
    spoiling healthcare
    and the environment too

    There’s a big dick
    in the Oval Office
    loves Twitter, and his golf games too …

    Tom Petty wrote on much better topics.

    ReplyReply
  75. 75
    rikyrah says:

    @Elizabelle:
    I know that Dolt45 and his sycophants are clueless as to how much the Congress is actually covering for him.

    ReplyReply
  76. 76
    Elizabelle says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady): That’s a wonderful poem. Thank you.

    ReplyReply
  77. 77
    Kay says:

    I’m sort of a traditionalist but I’ve made peace with the collapse of institutions. They were weak anyway if a reality tv star took them down. We didn’t know but they were rotten and hollowed out. It’s like finding out your foundation has shifted when you went to paint a wall or the roof has to be replaced rather than reshingled. Upsetting at first but true so you just have to deal with it.

    It’s funny because all those people on the far Left and (now) the far Right who said “tear it down!” like that was some kind of action- something one had to DO- and as it turns out it can just fall down. Quietly collapse, despite best efforts to pretend it isn’t happening. Doesn’t really require any effort at all.

    ReplyReply
  78. 78
    Baud says:

    House Speaker Paul D. Ryan backed away Wednesday from legislative action to ban “bump stocks,” the device a mass shooter used in Las Vegas earlier this month to create machine-gun-like rapid fire from his legal semiautomatic rifle, killing 58.

    
Instead, Ryan and many of his fellow House Republicans hope the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) will act administratively to outlaw the devices, which the agency ruled legal in 2010.

    WaPo

    ReplyReply
  79. 79
    Lapassionara says:

    I heard that the Jones Act waiver expired on Monday and that people in remote villages are on the verge of starvation. FEMA says it is not supposed to be delivering supplies, but if not FEMA, who? Meanwhile the press has moved on to the Weinstein story. This is an epic catastrophe, as is California, and the press should focus energies on getting the truth to people. I am heart sick. Our nation is being run by malevolent lunatics.

    ReplyReply
  80. 80
    bemused says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady):

    Not until now, thank you.

    ReplyReply
  81. 81
    Baud says:

    @Kay:

    I disagree. It took a lot of effort by a lot of bad people, foreign and domestic, to get Trump elected. It was not easy.

    ReplyReply
  82. 82
    Baud says:

    @Lapassionara: Today show covered PR this morning, and it’s on the front page of WaPo. Trump’s tweet will also help refocus attention.

    ReplyReply
  83. 83
    TS says:

    @Baud: trump is held to a much lower standard than Weinstein – or anyone else.

    ReplyReply
  84. 84
    Elizabelle says:

    How much is our military involved in PR relief? If not, why not?

    What national guard units are assisting? Not that much going on in many states, don’t other states’ units often assist? I can see lots of deployment to fight the wildfires, but we have a lot of capacity that it seems is not being used.

    Why is that?

    ReplyReply
  85. 85
    Patricia Kayden says:

    One tiny spot of good news. Trump’s hotels are losing business among professional sports players. And I assume that his racist anti-NFL player attacks aren’t going to help his bottom line.

    ReplyReply
  86. 86
    Elizabelle says:

    @Baud: Agreed.

    And stealing the Supreme Court seat did not happen on Trump’s watch.

    What is happening now is a murder unacknowledged, and carried out by Republican radicals, with confederates here and abroad.

    ReplyReply
  87. 87
    SFAW says:

    @Baud:

    ZEGS has all the backbone of a bed of kelp.

    ReplyReply
  88. 88
    Kay says:

    @Baud:

    But the defenses. Trump isn’t “the institutions”. They were weak so allowed a Trump to occur. I’m completely willing to blame voters but they entered this at the end, after every other check had failed. This is an “elite” failure as much as it’s a dumb-ass Ohio- Michigan- Wisconsin voter failure. He never should have gotten that far. That’s why I don’t buy that it’s a lack of “education”. Rex Tillerson seems to be very well educated. It’s not “education”. It’s character. They lack character. It’s worse than education because education can be remedied. They admire bad people. That can’t be fixed.

    ReplyReply
  89. 89
    SFAW says:

    @Elizabelle:

    What is happening now is a murder unacknowledged, and carried out by Republican radicals, with confederates here and abroad.

    Exactly

    ReplyReply
  90. 90
    Lapassionara says:

    @Baud: Thank you for watching so I don’t have to. Seriously, I am glad to hear someone is paying attention to the suffering there.

    ReplyReply
  91. 91
  92. 92
    O. Felix Culpa says:

    @bemused: Ok, so you’re spending waaaaay too much time on BJ if it’s invading your dreams (says the person who’s been awol for several days. Because needed a break. From everything.)

    ReplyReply
  93. 93
    bemused says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I just skimmed Fortune piece, Trump Scotland golf courses $200M money pit.

    ReplyReply
  94. 94
    Kay says:

    @Baud:

    I had a Republican here tell me it’s a lack of “civics” education. He’s on the state central committee. He’s the institution that failed. Why is he blaming “civics” education? He knows plenty of civics. They could have knocked Trump out earlier had they put ambition and greed and self-interest aside and presented some kind of united front- he’s a corrupt disaster of a human being. They failed. It was like dominoes. The last check was voters.

    ReplyReply
  95. 95
    O. Felix Culpa says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady): Beautiful. Thank you.

    ReplyReply
  96. 96
    bemused says:

    @O. Felix Culpa:

    Ha, ha, you could be on to something but in my dream I sensibly refused to read that thread. Baby steps.

    ReplyReply
  97. 97
    Baud says:

    @Kay:

    The media and the GOP are corrupted institutions, no doubt. My only point is that there has been a lot of work involved by our enemies to get us to this point. It’s not as if we were defeatable due to some other factor that allowed them to take advantage of us. This is the result of their own efforts.

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  98. 98
    Baud says:

    @Kay: The lack of civics education didn’t create fake stories about Hillary.

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  99. 99
    OzarkHillbilly says:

    I find it amusing that trump has to cannibalize his own administration for a Homeland Security Secretary. And a woman too. I can’t help thinking he searched high and low for a more manly person to fill that role.

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  100. 100
    Kay says:

    Well ladies and germs, we need Richard Cordray to jump into the Ohio gov race or say hello to Jon Husted!

    This is what I mean. People decide to do or not do things. It’s not a mystery.

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  101. 101
    SFAW says:

    @Kay:

    Kay –
    The unrelenting attacks on democratic institutions have been going on for a long time. Rethugs have been trying to destroy a functional public education system since at least 1980. Voting rights have been under (obvious) attack since at least 2000. McConnell has perverted his office as a means to maintain Rethug rule as long as possible, and to destroy the effective functioning of government. And the list goes on …

    In some ways, I’m a little amazed that the country has been able to resist the efforts of Rethugs and “outside operators” to destroy the so-called “American ideal” for as long as it has.

    ETA: Which is not to say that I don’t consider Rethugs to be traitorous motherfuckers, just that they’re “inside the house!!!!!”

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  102. 102
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @bemused: Good. I hope he leaves the White House poorer than he went in (and hopefully in cuffs).

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  103. 103
    Elizabelle says:

    It’s the result of Fox News Channel and Rush and all the other rightwing Republican blowhards. They built this horrible, horrible Republican base. They empowered them.

    And it’s money that built and sustained the rightwing outrage machine. And took over the Republican party, even more than historically. Pull our country apart. To make and keep more money.

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  104. 104
    Kay says:

    @Baud:

    It’s not as if we were defeatable due to some other factor that allowed them to take advantage of us.

    Okay then we really do disagree because that’s exactly what I believe. We were defeatable. “Institutions” doesn’t retain credibility by magic, unearned, forever, based on reputation that was earned by prior members of those institutions. They ARE the people who make them up. If those people are low quality or coasting or corrupt then the institution is no longer strong and the weakness will eventually become clear.

    “FEMA” isn’t anything except a string of letters. If they let Puerto Rico collapse then they no longer retain their good reputation and that is directly attributable to them. The Supreme Court isn’t credible because it’s the Supreme Court. It COMES from something. It’s earned.

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  105. 105
    Weaselone says:

    @Kay:
    Interestingly enough, the voters actually managed to spit out the correct answer. The problem is that an institution set up by our founders in part to protect slavery failed to do the job it was ostensibly set up to do – prevent an unqualified demagogue hacked up by the electorate from taking office.

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  106. 106
    NotMax says:

    @Kay

    While feel for Ohio, better for the country (IMHO) that he stay on at the CFPB and deny Dolt 45 a chance to choose someone for that position. Cannot conceive that Cordray is the sole good person available in an entire state.

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  107. 107
    bemused says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Much, much poorer, the whole damn family and Trump brand in the toilet.

    ReplyReply
  108. 108
    NotMax says:

    @NotMax

    Also, pushback against Rs is still on an upswing. By late spring or next summer we could be seeing flashing neon signs pointing to a wave election year, which would favor someone with a D after his/her name other than Cordray.

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  109. 109
    Ivan Ivanovich Renko says:

    White people.

    I know, most of you guys are white and so it becomes terribly uncomfortable to face, but the vast majority of American white men voted for Trump (IMHO, of course) BECAUSE he ran on obvious racism and misogyny. BECAUSE he was the Birther-in-Chief.

    How do we wean American white people from their addiction to white supremacy?

    “Trump’s dominance among whites across class lines is of a piece with his larger dominance across nearly every white demographic. Trump won white women (+9) and white men (+31). He won white people with college degrees (+3) and white people without them (+37). He won whites ages 18–29 (+4), 30–44 (+17), 45–64 (+28), and 65 and older (+19). Trump won whites in midwestern Illinois (+11), whites in mid-Atlantic New Jersey (+12), and whites in the Sun Belt’s New Mexico (+5). In no state that Edison polled did Trump’s white support dip below 40 percent. Hillary Clinton’s did, in states as disparate as Florida, Utah, Indiana, and Kentucky. From the beer track to the wine track, from soccer moms to nascar dads, Trump’s performance among whites was dominant…By his sixth month in office, embroiled in scandal after scandal, a Pew Research Center poll found Trump’s approval rating underwater with every single demographic group. Every demographic group, that is, except one: people who identified as white.

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  110. 110
    But her emails!!! says:

    @Kay:

    “FEMA” isn’t anything except a string of letters. If they let Puerto Rico collapse then they no longer retain their good reputation and that is directly attributable to them.

    I’m not certain whether FEMA has the capabilities to prevent PR from collapsing without a significant dedication of other government resources to it to do the job. It can still be full of competent people who are good at their job, but simply be overwhelmed by the task at hand.

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  111. 111
    Elizabelle says:

    @NotMax: I agree.

    Keep Cordray at CFPB. It’s an incredibly important agency; no doubt next up in the Trump hairs.

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  112. 112
    Elizabelle says:

    My thoughts and prayers are with all of us.

    We do not live in the same country we did in October 2016.

    We were among those who fought hard to be better, and to do better. We were robbed, and insane stuff is being done in our names.

    It can happen here. It just did.

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  113. 113
    Humboldtblue says:

    The wildfires are not directly linked to climate change, this is normal fire behavior it just happened in areas that were heavily built-up. There are several factors at play here including drought impacts to that region (conversely, we had normal or slightly above normal rainfall all four years of drought declaration) and the heavy rains from last winter. They watered some parched landscapes and that meant an explosion of grasses and chaparral and there is nothing more that fire likes than dry grass and chaparral.

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  114. 114
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Ivan Ivanovich Renko: By 2050 Whites will be a minority in the U.S. I guess that knowledge frightens enough of them to cling to their White supremacy fantasies and explains their love for Trump who has not done one thing since his election to help any of them — especially the precious White working class.

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  115. 115
    rikyrah says:

    @Ivan Ivanovich Renko:

    UH HUH

    UH HUH

    How indeed.

    ReplyReply
  116. 116
    rikyrah says:

    @NotMax:

    While feel for Ohio, better for the country (IMHO) that he stay on at the CFPB and deny Dolt 45 a chance to choose someone for that position. Cannot conceive that Cordray is the sole good person available in an entire state.

    Cordray’s term is up soon. If he were going to be there until 2020, I’d be with you, but his term is up soon. He would be better as the Governor of Ohio.

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  117. 117
    Eric S. says:

    @OzarkHillbilly: Fair enough. Maybe some of the other club members will have plans I can attach myself to.

    ReplyReply
  118. 118
    Laura says:

    @Cermet: Pull your head out of your ass, your not getting enough oxygen and your spouting stupid shit. And your wrong, and fuck off while your at it why dontcha.

    ReplyReply
  119. 119
    Ajabu says:

    @Ivan Ivanovich Renko:
    You can’t get them to give up white supremacy. It’s the root cause of every evil this country has
    committed. From the original sin, to ethnic genocide of the native populations, through Jim Crow and on to the Shitgibbon. Even “reasonable” white folks cling to their unearned white privilege. They don’t even notice it because it’s always been there. A fish doesn’t notice he’s in the water. I don’t have any answer for them. All I can do is keep on and try to protect my own child and grandchildren from them. I’m tired…

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  120. 120
    Tenar Arha says:

    My plan for the day is to get blue streaks, try to stay off Twitter before I try to drag a Bourdain or any other clueless man who keeps on trying to displace widespread rape culture everywhere into a failure by Hilary Clinton, & bag up some more clothing at my father’s house.

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  121. 121
    seaboogie says:

    I am going to take a nap in my car for an hour or two after pulling a 10 hour shift at Sonoma Valley High School as an evacuee/volunteer. I am so punchy on NO SLEEP in the past 27 hours, and averaging about 4 per night in the previous 3 days. Wonderful stories that I don’t have the juice to tell right now.

    Everything still up in the air – no idea when I will be able to return home, or if I still have one to return to.

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  122. 122
    Laura says:

    @seaboogie: Get a good, long, well deserved respite seaboogie. Service to your community in spite of the known and unknown . . .your my hero.

    ReplyReply
  123. 123
    Humboldtblue says:

    @seaboogie:

    You and thousands of others deserve mountains of praise. Here’s hoping home is still there.

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  124. 124
    Interstadial says:

    @evodevo: The drought is over in most of the state including where the bulk of the fires are. However, California has dry summers and this past one was the hottest ever recorded. Vegetation is dried out more than usual for this time of the year. Most of the state would normally start getting cool weather and rain next month.

    @eclare: Smoke is widespread 60 miles or more from the fires. Millions of people who are not in physical danger from the current fires are getting enough smoke for it to be a health hazard.

    @Cermet: The fires span a broad area ranging from liberal to conservative. The reality is a lot more granular than you are stating.

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  125. 125
  126. 126
    Humboldtblue says:

    Here’s a fire map for Sonoma and Napa

    (may take a minute to load)

    ReplyReply
  127. 127
    MomSense says:

    @seaboogie:

    Thank you so much for helping others. I am sending my best to you and hope your place is ok. Please try and get some rest.

    ReplyReply
  128. 128
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Dorothy A. Winsor (formerly Iowa Old Lady): I love this. I’m sharing it.

    ReplyReply
  129. 129
    Mart says:

    @Eric S.: Lake of the Ozarks is over-loaded with upper middle class and rich obnoxious republican white folks riding around in very large boats in the summer. Wake is so bad in the narrow channels that I blew my knee out on a jet ski. Tons of complete crap bar food, most shut down now as out of season. I can tolerate the place this time of year, but never go in the summer.

    Alley Cats, 1255 Bagnell Dam Blvd, is about 20 minutes from Tan Tar A. Friendly bar with pizza that is better than average. Could also try the State Park – Ha Ha Tonka. Has some great views.

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  130. 130
    catclub says:

    @Lapassionara:

    FEMA says it is not supposed to be delivering supplies, but if not FEMA, who?

    I think FEMA was designed to coordinate groups who are actually able to put people on those jobs – state agencies? Military? whoever.
    The staff and budget of FEMA do not correspond to an organization that does those things.

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  131. 131
    catclub says:

    @OzarkHillbilly:

    I can’t help thinking he searched high and low for a more manly person to fill that role.

    I don’t think he did. He is just lazy and did not bother to actually perform any search – just fill in with the deputy chief. Also, the fact that he would have many interactions with the woman he appointed would bias him in her favor. He goes with whatever he thinks he knows.

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  132. 132
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Kay: I have taken to repeating this assertion of yours, Kay, about character. About bad character, and about people being bad judges of character. The looks of shock and dismay, and the bluster, are priceless. About the only satisfaction I get from dealing with crappy, selfish people making crappy, selfish political choices.

    ReplyReply
  133. 133
    Duane says:

    The biggest disaster in this country is Trump being President. Makes everything else worse.

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  134. 134
    No Drought No More says:

    Anyone inclined to despair about a shared sense of community in 2017- more to the point, of a typical American community- need look no farther today than San Francisco’s north bay to renew their faith in their fellow Americans. It’s the second time I’ve witnessed The Spirit arise among people during a crisis, the first being during the aftermath of the ’89 Loma Prieta earthquake. That Donald Trump is making noise about further harming Puerto Ricans is reason enough for any decent American to turn on the swine and dryve him from power.

    And yeah, I’m looking at you when I say that, Barack Obama.

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  135. 135
    J R in WV says:

    @Elizabelle:

    Now we find that the toll of police shootings is vastly underreported. Why is that?

    And it’s a nation-wide “error”… or in real world terms, a nation-wide conspiracy to fabricate information about a nation-wide conspiracy to kill people without repercussions.

    Isn’t it a felony to provide false information to the federal government? To create a false death certificate? Why would one create a false death certificate? Insurance fraud is the MOST benign reason I can think of, and that’s a felony.

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  136. 136
    gaderson says:

    @Interstadial:
    @eclare: Smoke is widespread 60 miles or more from the fires. Millions of people who are not in physical danger from the current fires are getting enough smoke for it to be a health hazard.

    I’m anther 40 miles south of SF, and yesterday the sun was orange the whole day (even 2 pm in the afternoon), and still smelling smoke today, not as bad but still a haze here. Just incredible the force of the fire the after pictures show stone walls crumbling (like the Oakland Hills fire). Most schools have been trying to keep the kids inside this week, as the particle count is high (the various weather apps are actually showing “Smoke” as their forecast). And relatives have a place in Sonoma (they live in SF and feel greatly for their neighbors who don’t have anywhere to go) — neighbors said was evacuated last night — so hope they all are safe.

    ReplyReply

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