Open Thread: Derp State

Second time, as farce!…

143 replies
  1. 1
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷 says:

    Based on my emails this morning, the transmission of the anti-Comey line has been extremely successful. Trump pushback working with base.

    His base is shrinking and his electoral margins were small to begin with. His “base is nothing more than a personality cult

  2. 2
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷 says:

    Roger Stone on Trump today: “I see replay of Watergate where Deep State trying to take down President they couldn’t beat at ballot box”

    Who do you think Roger Stone is analogous to in the Nazi Party?

    Me? I don’t really know. I guess he’s Himmerler to Trump’s Hitler

  3. 3
    JPL says:

    Bikers for Trump are in town, in order to support Handel. If they come down my street, I am calling the police.
    Trump’s approval rating in the district is down to 35 percent, so I’m sure that will help.

  4. 4
    Keith P. says:

    That last tweet is real important. In his business career and personal life, Trump has lived by the NDA. If you work with him or see him naked, you have to sign an NDA to not speak about it for the rest of your life. He’s scared people into compliance, but now that he’s POTUS, he can’t do that. So instead, he pitches a fit about classified info leaks. Then, he conflates that with talking about any conversation, trying to back into making any conversation with the president confidential and subject to prosecution if you (and only you) talk about it. For a while, media would just gloss over that part, like it’s just a given that any meeting with the president is classified. It’s not, and I’m glad to finally see some push back on that.

  5. 5
    hellslittlestangel says:

    No puppet no puppet you’re the puppet also worked with his base. Because his base are a bunch of fucking idiots.

  6. 6
    rikyrah says:

    David Frum

    @davidfrum

    Once you realize that “deep state” is code for “the rule of law,” you can translate their jibberish into something more like English https://twitter.com/johnjharwood/status/865540916710264832
    7:21 AM – 19 May 2017

    Frum is so funny to me.

  7. 7
    hitchhiker says:

    The story of collusion with the Kremlin will slowly come into focus no matter what they do, because there’s a whole bureaucracy in place that is both professional and horrified by it.

    That’s the real “deep state” that makes Stone et al so nervous: people who think our elections are our business.

    (Yes, I get the irony that the USA has blatantly interfered in so many other countries’ elections over the last 100 years.)

  8. 8

    The Library of Congress has a very cool online exhibition of dramatic courtroom drawings from landmark cases. Check it out!

  9. 9
    hellslittlestangel says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: Id say Goebbels, but then The Orange Better One’s team is Goebbelses all the way down.

  10. 10

    Re “privileged” information, I thought Trump had the chance to claim executive privilege to stop Comey from testifying and didn’t. What does “privileged” mean? I realize I don’t know.

  11. 11
    rikyrah says:

    Micah Zenko‏ @MicahZenko

    Micah Zenko Retweeted Andrew deGrandpre

    Trump’s first CT strike in Somalia. Now 85 Yemen, 3 Pakistan, 1 Somalia.

    89 strikes in 142 days. 6 times more than Obama’s last 142 days.

  12. 12
    ding7777 says:

    His base = thousands of BOTS; used to whip the wavering into line

  13. 13
    Keith P. says:

    @JPL: Just yell out “ALL YOU PUSSY BIKERS SUCK!*” when they ride by.

    * – stolen from “Tunnelvision”

  14. 14
    Xenos says:

    Turley mentioned Come bring in violation of an NDA in his article, which is a real WTF moment. A really shocking slip on his part, and you have to wonder why he would try to slide such an impossibility into his article.

    Anyway, the coordinated right wing vilification of Comey, and by extension Mueller, seems like a fatal misstep to me. Watching his testimony, it seemed clear that his real audience was the FBI management and rank and file. The FBI has decades of files on Trump, as he has been mixed up with a lot of shady characters. If all the agents who have found dirt on Trump start funelling it to Mueller, or just start leaking it, Trump will have new scandals on a weekly basis to deal with.

  15. 15
    ET says:

    Duh. Of course the line is working with the base. And water is wet. News at 11.

  16. 16
    Splitting Image says:

    @hellslittlestangel:

    Id say Goebbels, bu then The Orange Better One’s team is Goebbelses all the way down.

    I was going to answer that a better comparison to Goebbels is Steve Bannon, then I realized that the second half of your comment is true. They vary in competence, but they’re all Goebbels wannabes.

    Does Frum or Podhoretz make a better Rudolf Hess?

  17. 17

    Yesterday in Kansas City about forty anti-Muslim protestors set up in a fenced off area in Washington Square Park. Almost a hundred counter-protesters showed up, too. In the over two hours we were there the two groups yelled obscenities and hurled insults at each other, separated by a buffer zone and a considerable presence of Kansas City Police officers.

    Anti-Muslim protest and counter-protest, Washington Square Park, Kansas City – June 10, 2017

  18. 18
    Chyron HR says:

    Deep State trying to take down President they couldn’t beat at ballot box

    Pretty sure Trump lost at the “ballot box”, sport.

  19. 19
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: The only thing that matters for the GOP is keeping Congress next November. Keeping their base happy is all they care about. We’ll see if it really has shrunk significantly in November 2018. Or if our side is still replaying the 2016 primaries.

  20. 20
    moops says:

    Deep State must be trending in the RW talking points. I’m seeing the phrase turn up in all sorts of places.

  21. 21
    Xenos says:

    @Iowa Old Lady: executive privilege is a bit like attprney-client privilege (although it is based on practice and political tradition, not the law or professional ethics). The president is like the client- he holds the privilege but is not bound by it. But if a client discloses the privileged communication he waives the privilege.

    Trump wants to tweet and give testimony about his communication with Comey. Thus he can not claim privilege to stop Comey from talking, too.

  22. 22
    Brachiator says:

    @Xenos:

    .Anyway, the coordinated right wing vilification of Comey, and by extension Mueller, seems like a fatal misstep to me.

    Yep. It’s one thing to try to slime Comey. But to take on the entire FBI and the entire intelligence community is madness.

  23. 23
    Tom Levenson says:

    @JPL: They like the Fireworks Suite? Or are they just looking for the Messiah?

  24. 24
    Turgidson says:

    @Xenos:

    I mostly lost track of Turley after Countdown with Olbermann descended into self parody and then was canned. But when he did pop up again, he was usually engaging in spittle-flecked rants about how Obama is the most lawless president EVAR. So he seems to have followed what I call the “Greenwald Trajectory” of following his smug self-righteousness so far off the rails that he’s now all the way on the other end of the spectrum, sympathetic to, or at least not properly horrified by Hair Furor, who really is the walking daily Constitutional crisis he told us Obama was.

  25. 25

    @Brachiator: it’s working adequately so far. At this point I’m convinced they’re just trying to get their trillion+ of structural looting out of the way before they start to go down. They won’t get them all, after all.

  26. 26
    Peale says:

    @Brachiator: except all they have to do is promise the ny field office cell promotions for comeys head and they’ll fall in line

  27. 27
    Teddys Person says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: Not sure. Did Hitler have an evil court jester? Stone’s a very corrupt and dangerous man, but his public persona is just so damn clownish.

  28. 28
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @Brachiator: The Intel community is pretty Reichwing, too. P!ssing them off is going to splinter Conservatistism big time. All those volk who abandoned rational conservatives because they just weren’t conservatist enough may be in for a big surprise.

  29. 29
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @Tom Levenson: Any bets whether if someone mentions that English squish who wrote (gasp) chamber music for King Charles, a lot of Handel’s support will evaporate?

  30. 30
    efgoldman says:

    @Boatboy_srq:

    The Intel community is pretty Reichwing, too.

    There’s a difference between the natural tendency of intel and military to be on the conservative side of economics, law enforcement, or defense, and being unmoored from reality like the foxbots and Citron Shitgibbon’s core supporters are.

  31. 31

    @Xenos: That makes sense. Thank you.

    ETA: If you work in the administration, are all conversations with the President privileged?

  32. 32
    efgoldman says:

    @Boatboy_srq:

    if someone mentions that English squish who wrote (gasp) chamber music for King Charles, a lot of Handel’s support will evaporate?

    He was an import from Germany (like the King) by way of Italy. He didn’t even speak English when he got there.
    But, whatever works to keep that harridan down on the farm.

  33. 33
    hovercraft says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷:
    Shush! Don’t say that out loud or you may force the media to actually go out and talk to people who are not economically distressed white voters who are very satisfied with the Trumpster and believe he’s the most honest ass kicking president we’ve ever had, and that all this noise is just the “deep state” attacking him. The focus on his base and the constant admonitions that the rest of us need to understand their frustrations bullshit needs to stop, they were a minority of voters to begin with and their are getting smaller every day. His core will remain intact, but he will continue to lose people.
    It’s time for a drumbeat of stories telling us that he’s losing support and telling these morons what they are losing from the policies he’s supporting.

  34. 34
    Peale says:

    It is just me or thanks to neoliberalism, hasn’t Most of the deep state now outsourced to “security consultancies” and the board memberships of Koch industries.

  35. 35
    Cheryl Rofer says:

    FYI, Alexei Navalny, an opposition politician in Russia, has called for protests against Putin in downtown Moscow tomorrow. Tomorrow’s daylight is only a few hours away there – it’s approaching 1 am. Moscow officials are putting up sandbag and other traffic barriers.

    It’s not a bed of roses in Russia right now for Vladimir Putin. These protests will probably be put down. But truckers’ protests against a road tax that looks like it will go to the oligarchs instead of badly needed road improvements have continued for a couple of months now. And there are other signs of unrest.

    I keep wanting to write about this, but the Orange Tantrum keeps taking up all the oxygen.

  36. 36
    Just One More Canuck says:

    @hellslittlestangel: Stone isn’t important enough to be a Himmler or a Goebbels. He’d be more like Lord Haw Haw

  37. 37

    @Peale: oh my god, somebody who knows what that word actually means!

    I don’t think that’s too true of the deep state, however, and a lot of it has actually been out of necessity. You’re not going to get enough people to administer for example NSA programs, due to a variety of factors many of them non evil, without outsourcing.

  38. 38
    efgoldman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    But truckers’ protests against a road tax that looks like it will go to the oligarchs instead of badly needed road improvements have continued for a couple of months now.

    So Russia is Texas, but bigger and colder with fewer brown people.

  39. 39
    hitchhiker says:

    @Xenos:

    the coordinated right wing vilification of Comey, and by extension Mueller, seems like a fatal misstep to me. Watching his testimony, it seemed clear that his real audience was the FBI management and rank and file. The FBI has decades of files on Trump, as he has been mixed up with a lot of shady characters. If all the agents who have found dirt on Trump start funelling it to Mueller, or just start leaking it, Trump will have new scandals on a weekly basis to deal with.

    Exactly what I think. All these self-inflicted wounds! All DT had to do was settle down, put somebody to work making an impressive infrastructure package, and press Democrats to support it.

    Instead he decided to take on the courts, the media, the Democrats, and the intelligence community all at the same time. It’s bonkers. The IC is going to roast his balls over an open fire.

  40. 40
    efgoldman says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    You’re not going to get enough people to administer for example NSA programs, due to a variety of factors many of them non evil

    I dunno’ Hiring freezes and shrinking departments by attrition without back filling, as well as appointing political hacks to head agencies, looks pretty evil to me, in context.

  41. 41
    JPL says:

    @Tom Levenson: Getting out the vote for the rabid Trump lovers. All thirty-five percent of them. This last week she has pledged herself to god and Trump, so things are getting desperate for her.
    In a low turnout runoff that 35 percent can help and makes smart political sense. Since Ossoff is trying to appeal to moderate republicans, he has yet to air an anti-trump ad. He might reconsider because he has to get out his base too.
    This is cute.. https://twitter.com/emokidsloveme/status/873761178031448064 not

  42. 42
  43. 43
    Kay says:

    I can’t imagine saying “the people who email me constitute an entire political base” and meaning it. Wow. He must get a lot of emails!

    Most people temper that with “obviously I don’t speak for 25 million people”- no such humility there! Not only does he speak for them, they emailed him!

  44. 44

    @efgoldman: I was thinking specifically of the distinct needs of the NSA in some areas of their work. But you’re right, there are also bad/greedy/neoliberal/evil elements at play too. Just saying that it’s not the full story.

  45. 45
    Brachiator says:

    @Boatboy_srq:

    .The Intel community is pretty Reichwing, too.

    As others have noted, it is one thing to say that they are conservative. It’s another to say that they are all fools who will swear personal loyalty to Trump and eagerly do his bidding.

    Trump is playing an interesting game. The Republican leadership is working hard to protect him because they desperately want to kill Obamacare and get their tax cuts. But the strain of supporting Trump is starting to show.

  46. 46
    Woodrowfan says:

    @Boatboy_srq: it’s a lot more diverse than the law enforcement community, esp in terms of politics. Lots of people with advanced degrees in the humanities working as analysts…

  47. 47
    Cheryl Rofer says:

    @efgoldman: Oh, they have brown people they worry about, from Central Asia. And the roads are much worse than Texas’s.

  48. 48
    Kay says:

    I’m gonna ask around the Trump cultists I know and see if any of them emailed John Podhoretz. I’ll let you know. If I get 5 responses I’m make a national pronouncement. “No. The Trump Base say they don’t know who the hell he is”

    DIS-proved! :)

  49. 49
    efgoldman says:

    @hitchhiker:

    Instead he decided to take on the courts, the media, the Democrats, and the intelligence community all at the same time. It’s bonkers.

    He can only fight with the weapons he knows, which are obstruction, obfuscation, throwing tantrums, and burying weaker (usually, poorer) opponents in motions and paperwork.
    To the extent he “thinks” or “plans”, he’s still treating Mueller’s investigation as another civil matter that he can buy his way out of.
    SURPRISE!

  50. 50
    hellslittlestangel says:

    @Just One More Canuck: Good point. Stone is probably disappointed that the name Lord Haw Haw is already taken.

  51. 51
    Corner Stone says:

    @Peale:

    thanks to neoliberalism, hasn’t Most of the deep state now outsourced to “security consultancies”

    Why would a soft spreadable cheese have anything to do with the deep state?

  52. 52
    Hal says:

    @rikyrah: I’m personally irritated by how much I have found myself agreeing with Frum over the past multiple months. Makes me feel dirty.

  53. 53
    efgoldman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer:

    And the roads are much worse than Texas’s.

    Didn’t Texas decide a couple of years ago that they couldn’t afford paving, and left some roads as gravel?
    Why, yes. yes they did!

  54. 54
    Oatler. says:

    @Major Major Major Major: That’s been my theory, a Trumpslosion for the big diversion while the heist proceeds (“The Russian Job”). You’re only supposed to blow the bloody doors off!

  55. 55
    Kay says:

    They’re rolling Ivanka out again next week. She plans to speak on her vast experience with “workplace training” for the lower classes. Skilled trades. They’ll gussy it up with bullshit language but it’s all skilled trades- technical ed for the non-college track. There’s nothing wrong with it- I did it- but they don’t actually respect that work so they always have to fluff it up by making it more wonderful and exciting than it is.

    I thought it was vaguely insulting when they rolled her out as a kind of consolation prize for “women” when her horrible ancient, lecherous sexist father took the throne there, but this may actually be worse. They couldn’t find a more credible spokesperson for skilled trades training than this nepotism hire who has never trained for anything?

  56. 56
    efgoldman says:

    @Kay:

    I can’t imagine saying “the people who email me constitute an entire political base” and meaning it. Wow. He must get a lot of emails!

    Think about when your son was four or five years old. It will make a lot more sense to you.

  57. 57

    @Cheryl Rofer: Central Asian people can be fairly light skinned, many even have green or blue eyes. So white really is a stand in for Christian and European, amirite?

  58. 58
    Kay says:

    I was naive enough to think Ivanka might lay low now that her husband is embroiled in the corruption mess, but that was foolish. They’re going to insist this person has something of value to offer over and over until he leaves office, because she can’t be fired and like her father, she believes she is wildly popular.

  59. 59
    efgoldman says:

    @Major Major Major Major:

    there are also bad/greedy/neoliberal/evil elements at play too.

    “Neoliberal”? Really, Gracie?

  60. 60
    JPL says:

    @efgoldman: If charges are brought, they won’t be prosecuted until he’s out of office. There is nothing he can do that is impeachable according to the republicans.

  61. 61
    Corner Stone says:

    @Kay: I really hope this whole family is kicked in their backside, and forced to roll down a muddy hill like the English Nobility who killed Braveheart’s wife. Then tied to a post and bled out.

  62. 62
    Hal says:

    @Kay: Do the skilled trades include forcing people who work for you to buy your kids crap?

    When Ivanka was a kid, she got frustrated because she couldn’t set up a lemonade stand in Trump Tower. “We had no such advantages,” she writes, meaning, in this case, an ordinary home on an ordinary street. She and her brothers finally tried to sell lemonade at their summer place in Connecticut, but their neighborhood was so ritzy that there was no foot traffic. “As good fortune would have it, we had a bodyguard that summer,” she writes. They persuaded their bodyguard to buy lemonade, and then their driver, and then the maids, who “dug deep for their spare change.” The lesson, she says, is that the kids “made the best of a bad situation.”

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....0e7cda76f3

  63. 63
    Kay says:

    @efgoldman:

    I thought it was a joke when I read it. Because it is. A joke.

  64. 64

    @Kay: Yesterday when I was grocery shopping I saw some BS cover about T daughter, on some low rent version of People of how she struggles between her beliefs and supporting her father.

  65. 65
    bystander says:

    @Michael Bersin: Having spent 28 years in KC, I have to say I had never heard of Washington Square Park.

    I remember back in the 70s a gay pride march where most of the men wore paper bags on their heads. It could not have been more KC if they’d carried platters of barbecued ribs.

  66. 66
    Teddys Person says:

    @Kay: Trotting Ivanka out to clean up after Dolt45 and salvage the Trump brand seems to the their go to move.

  67. 67
    Another Scott says:

    In other news, chicken counting, etc., etc., but still – BlueVirginia:

    New Poll Has Tom Perriello Up 54%-46%; Corey Stewart (!) Up 42%-41%

    By lowkell – June 11, 2017

    First, I’m going to summarize some key findings from this new poll, then I’m going to lay out a few reasons why you might – or might not – believe it.

    “On the Democratic side, Tom Perriello has a clear, 8-point lead, 54–46, over Ralph Northam. Former congressman Perriello does well among a wide array of Democrats: young voters, former Bernie Sanders supporters, black voters, and voters unenthusiastic about the economy.”

    “Tom Perriello’s lead among young voters is huge: he leads by nearly 30 points among voters under 45. Voters under 45 made up 44% of the Virginia electorate last November, and our models predict that they will make up 39% of the electorate on Tuesday.”

    “Northam’s margin among the oldest voters — those 65 and up — is indeed above 20 points. But Northam’s lead is far smaller among those between 55 and 64, and voters between 45 and 54 are evenly split between the two Democratic candidates.”

    “Perriello also fares quite well among minority voters, leading by 20% or more among blacks, Hispanics, and Asian Americans. Collectively, these three groups make up nearly half of the Democratic electorate in Virginia. Whites planning to vote in the Democratic primary are evenly split between Perriello and Northam.”

    “On the Republican side, we see a very tight race (in contrast to other polls suggesting Ed Gillespie will rout his opponents), and we give a very slight edge to Corey Stewart. Stewart’s advantage comes from his enthusiastic base: his supporters are both more likely to vote and less likely to change their minds. We project Stewart ahead of former RNC Chair Ed Gillespie, 42–41, with Frank Wagner in third place at 16%.”

    […]

    Stewart is basically a Confederate.

    Perriello winning big would be a huge wake-up call to the Virginia Democratic Party, I think. Just about everyone in elected office endorsed Northam in December when nobody else (IIRC) had a announced they were running against him. I hope this gets these officials to think long and hard about endorsements before the campaign even begins. Early endorsements are a disservice to voters, and invite candidates to sit back and take it easy rather than fighting for every vote.

    We’ll see what happens Tuesday, but we must win in November.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  68. 68
    Cheryl Rofer says:

    @schrodingers_cat: Basically, yes. Central Asians come to Russia, particularly the cities as guest workers, much as Central Americans come to the US. Many are Muslim, which concerns many Russians.

  69. 69
    efgoldman says:

    @Kay:

    I thought it was a joke when I read it. Because it is. A joke.

    To rational adults, sure. Remember who we’re talking about here.

  70. 70
  71. 71
    Kay says:

    @Hal:

    That’s why people hate nepotism hires in the real world. Have you ever been in that situation? It’s an imposition. It forces this uncomfortable situation you just don’t want to be in. It’s actually uncomfortable on both sides. I always resented it because I have my own horrible family dynamics! How did I get hijacked into yours? Let me OUT. All this subtext and history and falseness and everyone trying too hard. Ugh. Disaster.

    To me it shows such poor judgment, even insisting on taking the job. Now we’re all thrust into their horrible dinner table conversation or whatever, where she has to say “I disagree with my father” and he has to promote her constantly. OMG, who cares? Just take that home and keep it there. Stop imposing on us.

  72. 72
    Another Scott says:

    @schrodingers_cat: I saw it today, also too. Us Weekly.

    (groucho-roll-eyes.gif)

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  73. 73
    sm*t cl*de says:

    @Teddys Person:

    Did Hitler have an evil court jester?

    Streicher? Ribbentrop?

  74. 74
    Corner Stone says:

    @Vhh: And a little bit slutty?

  75. 75
    JPL says:

    @Another Scott: I have no idea what policy issues, they differ on. I do know that when Northam called Trump a “narcissistic maniac”, I agreed.

  76. 76
    Kay says:

    @Hal:

    Since the Trumps saw fit to bring me into their horrible dysfunctional family, I can say this too- if I were their mother I would be offended that she’s never mentioned. Apparently Donald Trump fathered children who miraculously appeared without benefit of someone else.

  77. 77
    efgoldman says:

    @Kay:

    it shows such poor judgment, even insisting on taking the job.

    Or go out and find a real job.
    Hahahahahahahahahaha
    I slay me.

  78. 78
    sm*t cl*de says:

    “I see replay of Watergate where Deep State trying to take down President they couldn’t beat at ballot box”

    I realise that rehabilitating / vindicating Nixon is high on Stone’s agenda, but I still don’t see how the comparison of Trump’s entanglements to “replay of Watergate” is supposed to help Trump.

  79. 79
    RobNYNY says:

    @efgoldman: But wasn’t either Charles. Handel was still gestating when the most recent Carolus Rex, Charles 2, died. His British royal patrons were Anne the Only, George 1, and George 2. And the Water Music and the Music for the Royal Fireworks are kinda sorta the opposite of chamber music, since they were written to be performed outdoors to entertain a crowd, even though they are performed by chamber orchestras today.

  80. 80
    Chyron HR says:

    @Another Scott:

    We’ll see what happens Tuesday, but we must win in November.

    Unspoken corollary: “And Northam can’t win in November because we’ll stay home on election day to spite the Democratic party if we don’t win on Tuesday.”

  81. 81
    efgoldman says:

    @sm*t cl*de:

    I realise that rehabilitating / vindicating Nixon is high on Stone’s agenda

    And Tricksie took 49 states in a HUGE landslide (18 million votes and 520 EVs). None of this “losing the popular vote by three million and winning because of quirks in the EC” crap.

  82. 82
    Redshift says:

    If Stone wants to equate Trump with Nixon, who am I to argue?

  83. 83
    rikyrah says:

    @Hal:

    @rikyrah: I’m personally irritated by how much I have found myself agreeing with Frum over the past multiple months. Makes me feel dirty.

    Him and Jennifer Rubin. don’t understand what the world is coming to…LOL

  84. 84
    efgoldman says:

    @RobNYNY:

    Water Music and the Music for the Royal Fireworks are kinda sorta the opposite of chamber music, since they were written to be performed outdoors to entertain a crowd

    Yeah, I don’t have it handy, but someone found the payroll record for “Fireworks”, and the band was ridiculous. Must have been most of the musicians in London. But you’re right, it was George and Caroline, for whom he wrote the Coronation Anthems. I knew that, but my brain is all crowded with the seven hours of notes i announced at yesterday’s band festival in Boston. Nobody played Handel.

  85. 85
    the Conster, la Citoyenne says:

    @rikyrah:

    Bill Kristol too. It’s got me questioning everything.

  86. 86
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @efgoldman: Come back down to The District and look around. There’s a lot of wingnutsery in the locsl intel circles to be found, and the split between tRumpet and Paulbot is about even. Eight years of BHO drove both sides b@gf@ck.

    It’s far worse, mind you, out in Defense/Intel Contractorland: the Blackwater/Custer-Battles side is off the chain.

  87. 87
    Kmeyerthelurket says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: i think he’s more of a Journack, though he probably considers himself a Skorzeny. He’s way too far down the pecking order to be considered a Himmler.

  88. 88
    Another Scott says:

    @JPL: Neither is perfect. Northam voted for W twice and has taken big contributions from Dominion (the big power company in the state that wants to build two new gas pipelines across the state). Perriello voted for the Stupak amendment to the PPACA when he was in Congress (a vote he says he was forced to take to keep a promise). Obama campaigned for him for re-election.
    Perriello has much more progressive policy positions; Northam says he’s progressive but says too many things won’t get through the state legislature so it’s pointless to fight for them.

    I would normally think that Northam would be a safer choice, especially with (essentially) the whole state party behind him, but he seems very cautious very much like Mark Warner and Warner barely won re-election in 2014. He doesn’t seem willing to fight to make good things happen, but is willing to fight to keep them from getting worse. There are lots and lots of angry Democrats in the state who don’t want to be told that good policy positions are too hard and that we have to let the big power company do what it wants and we can’t raise taxes on the wealthy to pay for tuition-free community college (but instead must make graduates donate their time in some sort of community service).

    We’ll see which side dominates there.

    The Lt. Governor’s race for the Democrats is a 3 way race among people who have not held elective office. The party favorite – Justin Fairfax – is a young African American prosecutor/lawyer and has lots of endorsements and lots of money, but hasn’t seemed to say much and (perhaps rightfully so) is cautious (his web page is pretty sparse). Gene Rossi is a retired prosecutor. Susan Platt has laid out detailed policy positions, has come out unequivocally for taking down Confederate monuments, and was a chief of staff for Biden. The LTG position is basically toothless, but I think she would do a good job there. We need more powerful women in Virginia politics, also too, and she has my vote.

    We’ll see what happens.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  89. 89
    Turgidson says:

    @Kay:

    The FTFNYTimes seems to share that belief, along with a fair number of other MSM outlets/pundits.

    For some of them, I think Ivanka is their last holdout hope that there is something, anything redeemable about the monumental catastrophe they participated in creating. She’s on the younger side, grew up in NYC, says non-horrifying things about women’s rights. She justhas to be a good person worth rooting for. If it turns out she’s a soulless grifter like the rest of Hair Furor’s offspring – only with better manners – what Hair Furor-related subject is left for them to write banal fluff pieces about?

  90. 90
    JPL says:

    @RobNYNY: Wow, So much to think about now. If the bikers for Trump campaign in my neighborhood for Handel, I’ll ask them what they think.

  91. 91
    hitchhiker says:

    @Kay:

    My nepotism experience was when I was waiting table during college. Family had started a restaurant — mom was a dragon, and she insisted that her 3 young adult kids work the floor. They were all on speed most of the time, which works for a while when you’re reasonably healthy and trying to manage a major lunch rush.

    One day I came in and all 3 of ’em blew off their shift. It was just me and her, running flat out for two straight hours. At the end she apologized, but nobody got fired.

  92. 92
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @Peale: Most likely. And just think that the tRumpery are too b@gf@ck for the likes of Blackwater, Custer Battles and Mitre, when they’re the most obvious constituency. That says a good deal.

  93. 93
    sm*t cl*de says:

    It would be nice to hear more from Stone about how the Deep State took down Nixon. Did they record his conversations?

  94. 94
    Boatboy_srq says:

    @RobNYNY: True, but if we say King George, the Reichwing will immediately think we mean Shrub, and the Anglophile Brexiteers all know who married Camilla.

  95. 95
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: Russia, as you know, has a lot of brown people that came there during the Soviet Union.

  96. 96
    JPL says:

    @Another Scott: Thanks. Here it really is an uphill battle to get out the vote. I mentioned before that if DeKalb had turned out for Ossoff, like they did for Clinton, he would have been over fifty percent. Lewis is putting in overtime, working for him, and hopefully, that will change the result. I can’t remember who, but someone mentioned that they heard that Ossoff wasn’t courting the black vote, which is a lie. Unfortunately, here because of the McKinney, especially Cynthia, a rift was created between blacks and jewish people. Billy her dad made some unfortunate statements after she lost. Even though that was awhile ago, some people have long memories, and maybe they are spreading the rumors. That’s just my opinion though.
    It might have been ruemara.

  97. 97
    efgoldman says:

    @Another Scott:

    The LTG position is basically toothless, but I think she would do a good job there.

    That’s true in most states, but I’d think because the governor is single-term limited (yes?) LTG can grow in political power over the governor’s term.

  98. 98
    hueyplong says:

    Stone is a guy who thinks that just being a dick constitutes an act in the service of Cleek’s Law. He could be right about that.

  99. 99
    Teddys Person says:

    @sm*t cl*de: After some quick Wikipedia research, I’m gonna go with Ribbentrop.

    One German diplomat later recalled that “Ribbentrop didn’t understand anything about foreign policy. His sole wish was to please Hitler”. In particular, Ribbentrop acquired the habit of listening carefully to what Hitler was saying, memorizing his pet ideas, and then later presenting Hitler’s ideas as his own – a practice that much impressed Hitler as proving Ribbentrop was an ideal National Socialist diplomat.

  100. 100
    Amaranthine RBG says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷:

    Yes, this is why Clinton crushed him in the election.

  101. 101
    Baud says:

    @Another Scott:

    we must win in November.

    QFT.

  102. 102
    Another Scott says:

    @efgoldman: Indeed.

    Virginia politics is all about musical chairs: Start off at AG or LTG, move up when term-limited GOV leaves. GOV often tries to move up to US Senate (but sitting Sen. Kaine lost with HRC).

    Platt talks a good game, and has worked in the trenches in lots of campaigns and in staff positions in government. She should know how to do this stuff right. :-)

    We’ll see.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  103. 103
    Cheryl Rofer says:

    @Adam L Silverman: If you and I are thinking about the same people, those are not the ones facing the most discrimination there now.

  104. 104
    BBA says:

    In Puerto Rico, statehood gets 97% of the vote. That’s getting into Middle Eastern dictatorship “shall we reelect the glorious President-for-Life?” numbers.

    The anti-statehood parties boycotted the vote, and there’s literally no chance that Congress will act on this result.

  105. 105
    Adam L Silverman says:

    @Cheryl Rofer: This is true.

  106. 106
    debbie says:

    @the Conster, la Citoyenne:

    Have you seen the parody accounts on Twitter? Bill Kristol on History is especially funny.

  107. 107
    Baud says:

    Via Reddit, this makes me want to drink.

    https://i.imgur.com/6PyQyEm.jpg

  108. 108
    the Conster, la Citoyenne says:

    @debbie:

    No. Can’t imagine finding him parody-worthy these days, considering the rich veins to mine currently out there.

  109. 109
    divF says:

    @JPL:

    If the bikers for Trump campaign in my neighborhood for Handel,

    We keep switching Handels in this thread – my first image is a bunch of bikers singing the Messiah.

  110. 110
    Barbara says:

    @Another Scott: Re: Northam v. Perriello. I think Northam is progressive on the big things. I think he is more passionate — at least when I have seen them at events with Perriello. It feels like Perriello is going to spend a lot of time banging his head against the wall. McAuliffe was disdained by many but I am grateful he was able to do as much as he has. My goal for Virginia is to expand voting access and reverse blatant gerrymandering. I think a lot more will be possible when those goals are met. And regarding Stupak — color me unimpressed. I am tired of purity for me and not for there. Perriello is okay but he has negatives too.

  111. 111
    sdhays says:

    @BBA: A Democratic Congress could, though. As I recall, it’s a simple majority for allowing a territory to become a state. DC is, unfortunately, more complicated because it’s carved out in the Constitution. If a Democratic House voted to allow Puerto Rico’s statehood and dared the (hopefully razor-thin) Republican Senate not to, that could be very interesting.

  112. 112
    Achrachno says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: “Who do you think Roger Stone is analogous to in the Nazi Party?”

    All of ‘um, Katie.

  113. 113
    Librarian says:

    @sm*t cl*de: Actually, I believe it was Robert Ley.

  114. 114
    Redshift says:

    @Another Scott: See, this is what bugs me about Periello – he’s running as the pure progressive, but says that he’s sorry for his past positions, so they shouldn’t count. I’d be much less bothered by his vote for the Stupak amendment if he didn’t claim to have been “pro-choice all my life.” Catholic Democrats like Tim Kaine get grief for saying they’re personally against abortion, but won’t support government restrictions, but Periello can be “pro-choice all my life” except for the one time it counted and we’re supposed to accept that.

    That said, I’ll be out knocking does whoever wins. I just have to express my frustration.

  115. 115
    🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷 says:

    @Amaranthine RBG: If we lived in a real democracy where majority actually ruled she actually did crush him by 3 million votes. The GOP won partly by suppressing millions of voters with ID laws in several party-controlled states and purging voter rolls, with an assist by the Russians. They also interfered in House races as well with their active measures campaign. Not just Trump, but the GOP benefited too.

  116. 116
    Shalimar says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: Roger Stone would be this guy in the Hitler analogy.

  117. 117
    Baud says:

    @Another Scott:

    Northam voted for W twice

    I didn’t know that. That’s the worst thing I’ve heard about him.

    That said, you seem to have two good candidates. Hope everything works out in the end.

  118. 118
    JPL says:

    @divF: Their engines would drown it out though.

  119. 119
    D58826 says:

    @hitchhiker:

    Yes, I get the irony that the USA has blatantly interfered in so many other countries’ elections over the last 100 years.)

    Hypocrisy rule 101 – big powers do it to others, they don’t have it done to themselves.

  120. 120
    zhena gogolia says:

    @Baud:

    That’s cute! Smirnoff is actually an inexpensive and drinkable vodka, especially the 100-proof.

  121. 121
    RobNYNY says:

    @efgoldman: When I was in college, we performed the original instrumentation of the Water Music. No strings (like casual sex), lots of oboes and bassoons, brass and percussion. We hired every double reed player in the state. Oboes are more piercing that loud, but they make themselves heard.

  122. 122
    RobNYNY says:

    @efgoldman:

    It’s odd to think of Handel as a band composer, but he was. I hope Vaughn Williams, Grainger, and Holst were on the program. Best band composers I have ever heard. Euphonium heaven.

  123. 123
    Another Scott says:

    @Redshift: Both of them are running in the primary as the “true progressive”. On Stupak, he was boxed in by a promise he made (from 2010):

    Washington, DC -Rep. Tom Perriello released the following statement today:

    “Since the beginning of the debate on health care reform, I have maintained a pledge that I would not support any health care reform bill that includes federal funding for abortion, and I stand by that pledge today. The original House bill language (Capps Amendment) did not meet this standard, and so I opposed that language. I voted for the Stupak Amendment–the only alternative offered at the time–because it ensured no federal funding of abortions, even though it also went beyond the current federal standard (Hyde Amendment) to prevent Americans from purchasing private insurance with their own dollars.

    “As health care experts and pro-life leaders agree, the abortion language in the Senate bill upholds the Hyde Amendment standard. The Senate health care bill prevents federal taxpayer dollars from funding abortions, as the Catholic Hospital Association and legal experts have recently stated and as my own research has confirmed.

    “Furthermore, several key yet unadvertised provisions of the bill are likely to reduce the number of abortions in this country in ways that move beyond politics toward a real impact on the culture of life in our country, such as those that provide $250 million for programs to support vulnerable pregnant women and increase the adoption tax credit, also making it refundable, so that lower income families can access it fully.

    “I have tended to avoid the labels pro-life and pro-choice–often drawing ire from both sides of this debate–because I believe those labels serve to end debate rather than start us on a path towards solutions. I understand why many pro-choice groups consider the Senate language a major setback, but I made this pledge to the people I represent. Mired as we are in the issue of taxpayer dollars in this debate, we have not been discussing how this bill can reduce abortions. My hope is that, after this debate in the health care bill, lawmakers will come together to support a culture of life in their policy-making, including improving pre- and post-natal care.

    “I have plenty of serious problems with the Senate bill and, until I see the final language, I cannot take a position on final passage. But the existing language on abortion in the current Senate bill meets the pledge I made to ensure no federal funding for abortion in this health care bill.”

    He represented a fairly conservative district (and only served one term). He voted for the PPACA on final passage, the Stupak amendment wasn’t included, and he has said he regretted his vote (and it’s clear that he didn’t like being in the position he was in).

    Both he and Northam have “purity” issues. Tom has clearly and forcefully talked about his Stupak vote. But Tom didn’t vote for W twice (and Northam refused to say at a recent debate those votes were a mistake). ;-)

    There are risks with both of them. But, I’ll be voting and donating to whomever wins on Tuesday. It’ll be interesting to see how things turn out Tuesday, but we must win in November.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  124. 124
    sm*t cl*de says:

    @Shalimar:

    Roger Stone would be this guy in the Hitler analogy.

    Hanussen employed a strongman called Breitbart for a while, as part of his cabaret freakshow.

  125. 125
    geg6 says:

    @schrodingers_cat:

    I just read about that. I think it’s US Magazine and the Shitgibbon’s buddy who owns the National Enquirer bought it. They plan to focus on Lolita in a big way they said because she’s so awesome and everybody wants to be like her!

  126. 126
    RobNYNY says:

    @RobNYNY: I should not omit King and Sousa. Both also euphonium heaven.

  127. 127
    PIGL says:

    @Xenos: i don’t buy this. What about that “rogue” detachment in New York?

    There may exist principaled, loyal not authoritarian elements within US law-enforcement but I see no reason to suppose any such exist within the FBI.

  128. 128
    Barbara says:

    @Another Scott: He got booted next cycle anyway and never stood behind the ACA or Obama. Blaming it on his district is kind of ridiculous when no one seems to accept that kind of reasoning for anyone else. That is my point. Not that Perriello is bad but that he is also an opportunist like most other pols. Not some stellar example of untarnished principle.

  129. 129
    efgoldman says:

    @RobNYNY:

    I hope Vaughn Williams, Grainger, and Holst were on the program.

    Not a one (which is very unusual for seven bands in seven hours.) Almost no Sousa, only one John Williams (also very unusual, in Boston).
    Lots of newish music.

  130. 130
    Another Scott says:

    @Barbara: We remember things differently. NPR (from 2010):

    […]

    That’s why people are scratching their heads about the first stop on the president’s last itinerary on behalf of his congressional majorities. The 5th District of Virginia, home of freshman Democrat Tom Perriello, has been on every list of the endangered, usually near the top, since the campaign began.

    So why does the president want to head into the final weekend smiling and waving by the side of a guy most people expect will lose? Is he sending some kind of a signal?

    Well, yes, a rather mixed signal. And like a lot of the messages that come from this president, it may be lost on many. But let’s try to unbraid it for a moment and see what we’ve got.

    Perriello is probably a goner for one simple reason: Of all the push-the-limits districts Democrats annexed two years ago, his was the farthest frontier. It took six weeks and a recount for Perriello to be declared the winner over 12-year incumbent Virgil Goode by a mere 727 votes (the narrowest margin by percentage in any district nationwide).

    ( From NPR’s Election Scorecard, where Political Editor Ken Rudin says the race “leans Republican”: “Perriello knew he was targeted for defeat from Day One, but he nonetheless voted for the health care bill. Robert Hurt, a state senator, has his own problems; he voted for a tax increase in 2004 in the state Legislature. One thing that has the potential of hurting Hurt’s chances is the presence on the ballot of Jeff Clark, a conservative independent.” )

    While electing Perriello, the district also preferred Republican presidential nominee John McCain over Democrat Barack Obama by three percentage points. The only surprising thing there is that McCain did not win by more. Four years earlier, President George W. Bush carried the district by 13 percentage points.

    […]

    Perriello has worked hard to win over his largely rural, deeply traditional constituents. The native son of the district with two degrees from Yale who founded two faith-based non-profit groups has been a model congressman. He has the endorsement of the National Rifle Association and can say he reached out to Tea Party activists during the campaign. He voted against the first Obama budget in 2009, as well as for a delay in the payment of funds in the bank bailout.

    But when the big ones went down — the stimulus, health care, the energy bill known as “cap and trade” — Perriello was there for his party and his president. And with those votes he may have stamped himself more as Obama’s man than as a Blue Dog. Seven Republicans lined up in the primary for a chance to oppose Perriello in the fall. The one who survived to challenge Perriello next Tuesday was state Sen. Robert Hurt.

    When you look over the rest of the president’s final swing, it all makes political sense. The main focus is on the key states of the Great Lakes region where the Democrats are hurting badly — Pennsylvania, Ohio and Illinois. The Democrats could lose three races for governor and three more for the Senate in these states, along with as many as 10 House seats. But most of those contests are still close, and the president hopes to make a difference.

    […]

    Defeating Goode was a great thing. Perriello tried to finesse his way to re-election in a conservative but the wave was simply too big. Knowing that, he still voted with the President on all the big bills. That takes courage and shows that he’s more than a typical poll – even if he’s not as pure as many (including his ad team) would like.

    FWIW.

    Cheers,
    Scott.

  131. 131
    Apocalipstick says:

    @Teddys Person: Uh, can you say Goerring?

  132. 132
    Uncle Cosmo says:

    @🌎 🇺🇸 Goku (aka Junior G-Man) 🗳 🌷: Hess. The one obvious imbecile in the upper levels of the dritten Reich.

  133. 133
    dogwood says:

    @Barbara:
    Other than assholes like Joe Walsh, I don’t know of any one-term congressman who is afforded a platform to support a president. So I don’t know where you get the idea that he got kicked out and then didn’t support the ACA or the President. What was he supposed to do? What I do know is that Obama spoke publicly about Perriello’s loss in ’10 being one of the hardest for him to take. He really admires the guy.

  134. 134
    Barbara says:

    @dogwood: I like Perriello but he could not vote my way on the issue I care about the most and I hold it against him. I will campaign for him if he wins the primary.

  135. 135
    Pinksnapdragon says:

    @Barbara: I share your view of Perriello. I cannot forgive him for that Stupak amendment vote and neither can any of the democratic women I know. We don’t like his support for the NRA either. And he is a Bernie supporter. Northam has been in the trenches fighting in Virginia for years. Perriello has not been involved in Virginia politics since he lost his reelection bid. How I see it is that when he found himself out of a job in January when he had expected to have a big position in the Clinton administration, he looked around and decided that he didn’t have any better opportunities, so he’d give being governor a run. The only way he’ll get my vote for anything is if he wins on Tuesday.

  136. 136
    TenguPhule says:

    I can honestly say that being +2 really helps today.

  137. 137
    The Lodger says:

    @divF: Ask the bikers if they all like sheep.

  138. 138
    Jacel says:

    @Hal: Frum has been refreshingly all-in as far as speaking as true as he knows about the current situation. MSNBC is getting honest value by giving him air time recently.

  139. 139
    Jacel says:

    @RobNYNY: Two local bands I conduct had a euphonium player who was still playing with these groups in his 90s. He had once been in a college group conducted by Sousa, and had played for Karl King numerous times with circus bands.

  140. 140
    RobNYNY says:

    @Jacel:

    In the 1970’s I was music librarian for a city band in a small town in Wisconsin. The music library was astonishing. Rossini, Verdi, Dvorak, arranged for band, and obviously played because the parts were marked in pencil with dynamics, fingerings (apparently there was a cellist who played euphonium parts), other musical cues.

  141. 141
    westyny says:

    @hellslittlestangel: What is Goebbelses, Precious? Is it tasty?

  142. 142
  143. 143
    westyny says:

    @Boatboy_srq: Handel was German, I believe, but he wrote music for the English court. He became a naturalized Brit squish in 1727.

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