On April 22, people all over the world will March for Science. Will you join us? https://t.co/JtSSEa6ino https://t.co/8t0apuBUKU pic.twitter.com/0jEdSS010U
— March for Science (@ScienceMarchDC) April 6, 2017
Note from commentor Quinerly, whose Travels with Poco enlivened many early-morning threads:
It would be cool if a Front Pager would throw up a dedicated Meet Up thread maybe on a Wednesday before these marches. People could pipe in with their areas, pick places for Juicers to meet, if they wanted to….no pressure, no planning clusterfucks. Just a suggestion.
Look forward to meeting you [St. Louis, Missouri]. I just put up an invite on my Book of Faces page to generate some interest. My neighborhood peeps pretty much hang at Howards on Saturday and Sunday anyway. Soulard is a neighborhood of misfits, hippies, and derelicts….we like our music and cocktails…Ozark will attest to it from his days in the area.
I know various commentors from a number of cities/states have expressed their intentions over the past several weeks. If you’d like to meet up with other Balloon Juicers, or have questions, leave a comment below. (Or you can email me at annelaurie dot verizon dot net, but don’t expect to hear back until late afternoon or early evening.)
Cermet
A photo of the failed shuttle system? Really? That is what should be used to symbolize the Science March? That was NASA at its worse and is a poor representation of applied science. Next, a picture of the ISS?
Central Planning
We can’t do the March for Science in DC or locally due to prior commitments, however we will be going to DC for the March for the Environment. Just a quick down and back since one of our kids has a regatta on Sunday morning :o
geg6
I’m going to the Pittsburgh march if any Juicers are planning on going. It’s getting a lot of press here and it’s expected to be a large march due to all the tech, ed and medical industries around here. I’m going with a couple of friends from high school who I hooked up with on FB after many years of not being in touch. Dolt 45’s election brought us together again. One of the few good things to have come from that.
zhena gogolia
I saw the NYT was concern trolling the hell out of it. “Scientists will lose their objectivity!”
Jeffro
@Cermet: Wait…what’s wrong with the ISS? I love getting the alerts when it’s going to be passing overhead! (Granted, that’s a pretty expensive way for me & the kids to ooh & aah for 4 minutes, but still! =)
Also since this is an OT: stopped at my local Safeway for a few odds and ends and happened to see the latest National Enquirer. Did y’all happen to know that
I only wish I were making that up. Pow! Bang! ErrrrrrrKRAKADOOM!!
frosty
I’m Planning on the DC march this Saturday. Early arrival, but my colleagues will be leaving before 2:00. I’d be interested in meeting up during the day (if it’s even possible).
Jeffro
@zhena gogolia:
I know, right? Funny how that never seems to be a concern for our GOP overlords, yet everyone else must stay “objective” (i.e., silent)
Wyatt Derp
I’m going to the Boston march. Currently just planning on showing up at the Common around 1 pm but if there’s something else planned I’m in.
pamelabrown53
Spouse and I are eagerly anticipating meeting Quinerly and hopefully other Juicers in St. Louis at Howard’s and the March! Must dash to an appointment but will check this thread upon return. Later…
Larryb
Mrs. Larryb has signed us up to go to the march in San Francisco. I’m already dreading the BART ride. The last march had people lined up around the block just to get into the train stations.
lytic
Heading to the march in San Jose. Science!
mousebumples
I’m going to the Madison, Wisconsin march with some friends on Saturday. The weather looks to be clear, so hopefully it’ll be a fun day. :)
raven
We’re going to the beach but I’m just a lowly qualitative researcher and we KNOW that’s not science!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
Wow
may be a notch on Evan Mcmullen’s… where did gunslingers notch their kills?
Corner Stone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Looks like someone’s getting his affairs in order ahead of acquiring some new wrist jewelry.
Mike J
https://www.buzzfeed.com/alexislevinson/utah-congressman-jason-chaffetz-will-not-seek-re-election
Goku
@Cermet: Honestly, they should’ve just used Saturn-Apollo in a picture. Famous, memorable, and symbolizing American science and technology at its grandest.
The Space Shuttle was a huge mistake and the US should have stuck with the Saturn-Apollo architecture. If we had done that and had the political will, we could’ve built on it and gone to Mars by now. Perhaps even multiple permanent space stations? What a shame.
The Moar You Know
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Belt, my friend.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
watching MSNBC, Chaffetz is big news– some junior Broderist is lamenting that politics is getting politicized
ETA: @The Moar You Know: that’s what I thought, but it didn’t sound right
rikyrah
Trump’s inauguration fundraising adds to his disclosure troubles
04/19/17 10:02 AM
By Steve Benen
In late November, Donald Trump’s inaugural committee started selling “exclusive access” to the president-elect and his team “in exchange for donations of $1 million and more.” Apparently, some folks took advantage of the opportunity.
As the New York Times’ report added, Trump’s inaugural committee has not disclosed how the money was spent, how much was unspent, or where those funds may end up. The committee said yesterday it’s “still identifying charities toward which it would direct leftover money.”
The Washington Post’s David Fahrenthold noted that the inaugural committee’s members “said they’d tell us about their donations when they released fundraising numbers. They didn’t.”
When we talk about Team Trump’s transparency troubles, the problem isn’t limited to tax returns and White House visitor logs.
As for the inaugural committee, as we discussed in January, Trump’s allies generally respond to reports like these by arguing that every modern president, from both parties, has raised millions through his inaugural committee. There’s quite a bit of truth to that.
But Trump did run on a platform of ending special-interest influence in Washington – selling access to corporate donors for $1 million a pop is quite a departure from the Republican’s campaign rhetoric – and as the New York Times’ has reported, Trump’s donors were “given greater access and facing fewer limits on donations than those in other recent inaugurations.”
Starfish
@Cermet: This is my problem with the March for Science. People have been catty as hell and killed all the joy. I went to the Tax March last week, but I lost my bus pass there and may skip the Science March because clearly science = assholes judging from the people in the threads related to this particular march on Facebook.
I have heard nice things about the March for Science crew in Boston and may still go to the tiniest hyper local march at a place that might be defunded by all the nonsense against climate, but I am avoiding the bigger march that is local to me.
Kropadope
TenguPhule posted about this earlier, but Donald Chump’s EO on H1-B visas will affect the U.S. dramatically on the science and technology front.
This is purportedly to help people like me, from an established (white) American (white) family that has been here at least two generations and isn’t not white, who are competing for technology-related jobs with foreign born applicants who often get below-market wages and generally aren’t white.
Now, I would love to get out of the retail hell I’ve been in and out of (mostly in) for a decade and a half, but I don’t want that to happen at the expense of other people. Besides which, how do we know this won’t result in the closure of several technology firms; labs; and other scientific enterprises, rather than provide additional opportunities for young people who were born in the U.S. (also men!)?
Michio Kaku called the H1-B program America’s secret weapon. It is a huge part of the reason we’re able to attract talented people from across the world and a huge part of the reason we still have such a vibrant economy. I can’t stand the idea of President Clownshoes fucking with it. For now, I’m only beginning to wrap my head around how a merit based system might work and why it likely won’t.
skyweaver
I don’t post much but I’d be glad to meet up if the schedule allows. I’m in the DC area and my college-aged daughter and I will be down for the march on Saturday. I’ll keep watch here for updates.
Spanky
I’m hoping to make the DC march, but I have to leave early so I can run an astronomy program that evening. Science!
Also too:
Yikes. And no balloons, green or not!
NorthLeft12
@Jeffro: Every time I go to the grocery stores here in Canada I am sickened by the screaming headlines on the Enquirer accusing Hilary Clinton and Barack Obama of crimes against humanity and worse, and their worshipful glorification of Deadbeat Donald.
FYI They have not let up on Hilary since the election. Shameful. Surprised she can’t sue for defamation.
newdealfarmgrrrlll
I hope to go to the St. Paul march.
The Moar You Know
@Cermet: I understand and frankly agree (the Shuttle was a politically-kludged-together deathtrap and pretty much everyone who ever flew in it admits that) but the rocket-based alternative is the Saturn V, a stellar piece of American engineering that last flew before over half the population of this nation was born. Literally ancient history.
You use rockets to advertise this because rockets are visually awesome. You could use a fusor (which nobody would get) or a nuke going off, which might piss off those of a pacifist bent. So we’re stuck with rockets, and if we’re stuck with them you kind of have to go with the shuttle.
rikyrah
@Mike J:
.
tee hee hee
Spanky
@Starfish: Lemme fix this for you:
You’re welcome! No charge!
Summer
I’m going to the Raleigh march. Any NC peeps up for meeting?
Iowa Old Lady
Open thread? My local B&N told me yesterday that they’d ordered my books for the store. I’m with a very small press so this is unusual and a very big deal for me.
schrodingers_cat
@Kropadope: I was called unhinged on this blog more than once by TP because I dared defend people here on an H1-B visa. Yes, it has some problems and some corporate bad actors have exploited its provisions but throwing the baby with the bath water makes little sense.
Anyway according to an immigration lawyer whose Twitter feed I follow, said those EOs on H1-b, amount to a whole lot of nothing.
Mnemosyne
@Starfish:
I know. Until the planning for the march started, I had no idea that people actually hated certain aspects of science (like the shuttle program) so much that they would prefer to stay home and sulk than protest against Trump.
G managed to schedule his trip to Chicago so that I have to pick him up from the airport in the middle of the march. Argh.
NorthLeft12
My daughter is attending the march in London, England. She is expecting it to be a fun time. The English have a good sense of humour about such things, and should not have to worry about counter protestors at all.
Hopefully, the marches in the States will not have to deal with Trumpettes/White Supremacists/Gun Humpers trying to intimidate the marchers.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
sports ball teams at the White House is one of those traditions I’d happily see eliminated, but this pleases me because it’s gonna enrage the Starfucker in Chief
amygdala
Finally finished my brain beanie the other day. I guess I should decide which Bay Area march I’ll attending! Will keep an eye on this space.
The Moar You Know
@NorthLeft12: Every single one since the election. I knew they were all in for Trump but the degree and depth surprises me. It must really be paying off for them.
I dated a girl back in college (early 1990s) whose father was one of their main reporters. I know how they work. He made an ungodly amount of money. The paper makes an ungodly amount of money. A large percentage of that money goes to a damn army of lawyers and retired judges, who go through every single word multiple times. This in the wake of a very large payout to somebody, I forget who, in the 1980s. They decided they’d never get roasted again and they have not. The few who’ve tried have gotten annihilated in court. They play hardball and they know libel law better than anyone else in America.
Humboldtblue
The local march will lead to a science fair!\
Gelfling 545
Going to the Buffalo march which reminds me it’s time to harass my fb friends about attending.
NorthLeft12
@rikyrah:
Funny, I always thought that when politicians accepted money for “access” that it was known as bribery. My, how times have changed.
I wonder how long before someone calls me naïve and brings up all of Hilary Clinton’s “crimes”.
Kay
My 8th grader wants to go to one so I will take him. This is horrible but he’s ALREADY a “both sides” person – I have no idea how I raised this kid and got David Brooks but that’s where we are.
Anyway. He has turned on Republicans over environmentalism which is nice because his father is an environmentalist so I’ll take him to a march. Hopefully the giant puppet people will be there so he can have a proper initiation :)
The 8th grade boy set who come to my house love Bill Nye and Neil deGrasse Tyson. My sense is this a “safe” liberal leaning for them in a very conservative county. They constantly hammer them on STEM at school so it makes sense to me that they feel comfortable aligning with scientists since they are constantly told to BECOME scientists.
jacy
@Iowa Old Lady:
Congrats! This is cool news!
Jim, Foolish Literalist
I was on the road most of yesterday, but clicking around the ‘nets and watching MSNBC I’m kind of surprised that this whole carrier meshegas isn’t a bigger deal. How is this not a huge fucking embarrassment for the whole fucking country?
amk
congenital liar twitler’s latest lie about military matters invites jeers and contempt in Asia.
Goku
@Mnemosyne:
Just so you know, I’m not one of those people. The shuttle program and the wasted potential of Saturn-Apollo is a hobbyhorse of mine. I’d go, but I have classes to attend
Miss Bianca
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: Wow, indeed. But I can’t believe he’d remove himself voluntarily from the govt. teat. So, what’s the little shitchipmunk planning to do with himself, then?
hovercraft
@zhena gogolia:
Objectivity? It’s fucking science, you rely on DATA! The fact that some people then twist that data to fit a preconceived conclusion is a different conversation. As the MIA Baud would say, the NYT is GARBAGE!!!!!!
Scientist spend years training and learning, they must subject all of their work to their peers for review, that is what keeps them objective, kowing that the data must match the conclusion, not whether they spent an afternoon marching to protest an administration that refuses to accept objective data.
These people are going to kill us, their insistence on not just calling the GOP what they are, The Flat Earth Society of the 21st Century.
We have urgent problems that are not only being ignored, they are being exacerbated by the willful denial of science by these people and the fucking NY Times is worried about objectivity. Ugh, I hate these people!!!
El Caganer
Will be going to the march in Sarasota. It will be interesting to see who shows up; it seemed to me that the majority of participants in the tax event were my fellow olds, but there will probably be a lot more college students for this one.
trollhattan
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
We’re already inured to his lying, ignorance and lack of concern for either. What a hundred days!
Kropadope
@Iowa Old Lady:
Congratulations.
@schrodingers_cat:
And the nominees for shock of the century are…
rikyrah
DA PHUQ?!?!?!?
All-Male Panel Fails to End Maryland Law that Forces Women to Share Custody with Their Rapists
Maryland is one of seven states without a law allowing women to terminate parental rights for their rapists, but for some inexplicable reason a panel of only men let the clock run out before doing something about it.
Kelly Weill
KELLY WEILL
04.16.17 4:43 PM ET
Five Maryland legislators could have ended a policy that forces women to share child custody with their rapists. Instead the five legislators, all men, buried the bill.
Maryland is one of seven states without a law allowing women to terminate parental rights for their rapists, if their child was conceived as a result of sexual assault, according to reproductive rights organization NARAL. The state’s current policy forces survivors to negotiate child custody and adoption issues with their attacker. In a bid to update the draconian policy, Maryland Delegate Kathleen Dumais introduced legislation that would allow a woman to cut her rapist’s parental rights.
But while the bill passed both Maryland’s House and Senate, the bill’s text varied between the two legislative bodies. On Monday, the last day of legislative session, a five-person negotiating group was set to decide on the bill’s final text, the Baltimore Sun reported. Instead, the five-man group let the bill fall by the wayside, running out the legislative session’s clock without finalizing the bill’s text.
amk
some breitbart nut got kicked in his nutz.
Mike J
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Giselle going Lysistrata would be a serious personal family matter.
Goku
@hovercraft:
I believe the correct term is datum
/grammar pedant
rikyrah
@Kay:
YEAH!!!
You can get a Pu$$yhat from MomSense.
Another Scott
I’ll be at the DC march, probably collecting with the DC, NoVA, MD IEEE group.
Here’s hoping for a big turnout!
Cheers,
Scott.
(Who will probably be at the Climate March, also too.)
gene108
@Kropadope:
Guy on an H1-b may make 120k per year, in sought after skill. An American maybe able to negotiate for 150k, (Edit) he/she is good at negotiating.
People on H1-b’s are not on starvation wages, and I think the disparity in pay people report maybe less than people think.
The only real way to tell is to go over the W2’s of H1-b holders versus people in similar labor categories, who are U.S. citizens.
I think there’s a lot of opinion on what impact H1-b visa holders have on overall wages, without any hard facts.
Jim, Foolish Literalist
@Miss Bianca: suck on the teat of Koch, or Huntsman Int’, or Marriott, or….
@Mike J: my thought, too. I don’t know how old their kids are but I wonder if there isn’t a twelve or thirteen year old daughter with a pink hat
Central Planning
@Kropadope: The thing I can’t get my mind around with H1-B visas and the claim that there are no qualified people in the US for the jobs is that perhaps they aren’t paying the right amount for those jobs that would attract qualified Americans. With some of the collusion between tech companies on the west coast to keep wages down, H1-B appears to be another way to do that, and that’s the only reason for it.
I do understand the idea of getting the best and brightest to come here (and stay!) and I think that would be a great use of the program. I don’t know (and haven’t looked) at the results of the H1-B program to know if that really works out, or it’s just republicans/white nationalists that scare the shit out of foreigners and they decide to leave.
Seth Owen
I’m planning on going to Boston’s march. It would be nice to pick a rally point on the Common to meet.
Corner Stone
@Jim, Foolish Literalist: It was a miscommunication, that’s all. A simple miscommunication.
hilts
OT
Lowlife scumbag Jason Chaffetz won’t run for reelection in 2018
http://www.politico.com/story/2017/04/chaffetz-wont-run-for-reelection-in-2018-237363
Kay
You can reach middle and upper income parents by telling them conservatives are anti-science. We once won a school board election against a wingnut based solely on worries about math and science focus.
Feel free to use that, should it become necessary. Instead of “anti-science” say “anti- STEM” :)
Marcopolo
Have my lab coat & will be at the St Louis march w/ friends. Hoping the weather winds up being more cooperative than is currently forecast (rain & about 50). 50/50 on whether I wind up down @ Howards afterwards to witness the actual physical existence of fellow BJers.
More importantly will folks post their bestest/favoritest Science March sign ideas? I really haven’t seen all that many good ones.
As for Chaiffetz–now that he doesn’t have to worry about re-election he can take the gloves off and go after all those Trump administration conflicts of interest. And the moon is made of green cheese.
Quinerly
Thanks, Ann Laurie! Not sure how many people I’ve gathered for our St. Louis area march and possible meet up. I’ll be at Howards in my beloved Soulard neighborhood in the City of St. Louis by noon for a 12:15/12:30 launch to Union Station. Howards is at the corner of 13th and Lynch, down by our Anheuser Bush Brewery. Would be cool if any area peeps gather after the march for a meet up, drinks, food. Very good Blues band playing…. If you want, pipe in on this thread. I’ll check it later and get a reservation for a head count. Bartenders know me.?
Kropadope
@Goku:
One point would be a datum. The sum of it is data. Also it’s spelled grammar. Also, that’s not a question of grammar but one of usage.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@The Moar You Know:
Oh come on… everyone knows REAL gunslingers carve a notch in their own leg…
In a slightly more serious vein, does this add any credence to the rumor that the Russians have kompromat on Jason and are using it to blackmail him?
Similarly, is the fact that Louis Marinelli, the man who was heading the Calexit movement, has decided to hightail it back to Russia indicative of something bigger about to break? Was it like, get out of the country now before you get arrested? Did he just choose to toss in the towel or was it on orders from home?
I don’t know and with one following the other so quickly…
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Goku: There’s always a chance you were being sarcastic…
SatanicPanic
I’ll be at the San Diego march!
And the Space Shuttle is a fine representation of science. They have one on display in LA and people love it, because the damned thing A) looks cool B) it took people into space. How many of you have been in space? No one? OK stop overthinking things.
Kay
@rikyrah:
It’s funny how they seem to know that “science” gets adult approval. Bill Nye could be a Communist and adults would still be thrilled that they were “showing an interest” – it’s outside partisan lines.
Louis
Will be marching in Chicago. Who’s with me? YaYaYa Ya Ya. But seriously, any juicers here going?
The Moar You Know
@Kay: Nailed that as usual, Kay. DO NOT say “anti-science”. “Anti-STEM” will have the parents breaking out torches and pitchforks. They understand that “anti-STEM” is “anti my kid having a good job”.
They don’t understand “science” and don’t care.
Goku
@Thru the Looking Glass…: Hint: I was
Kropadope
@Central Planning:
You might also notice a lot of the same people will resist any plan to help Americans obtain better qualifications and credentials.
@gene108:
I’d
killbe extremely enthusiastic for a 120k/year job. But that brings me back to the question of what this merit based system will be. They say they’re going to look at how much money applicants are already making. But if people are already making bucket loads of money, why would they want to emigrate to the U.S.?Yarrow
@Corner Stone: Heh. Rumor is there’s kompromat on Chaffetz.
I wish I could go to the Science March. I can’t due to prior commitments. Disappointed but looking forward to seeing the coverage.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@Kay:
His both siderism may be age and development aspects, Kay. About that age, my daughter suddenly decided I knew nothing about anything. Part of discovering their own identity, personality. She is fifteen and a half now and has decided I’m not so bad after all.
Oh, I still tell only droll dad jokes apparently, and am never, ever under any circumstances allowed to dance or sing if she is in the state, but, hey, it’s progress!
JPL
@hilts: Lowlife, scumbag, O’Reilly is out also.
Corner Stone
@SatanicPanic:
I always loved the Shuttle and never understand why people bag on it. So many innovations came out of that program, and so much knowledge. I get the thought that some people think it stunted investment in other R&D because it hung on too long. But that was more a function of politics, not scientific difficulties.
I remember when they hauled the Shuttle out of NASA Clearlake the streets were lined with people all down the blocked off route to see it off.
West of the Rockies (been a while)
@hovercraft:
Does the NYT ever fret over Lamar Smith’s objectivity?
Nahhhh….
Iowa Old Lady
@hilts: What’s up with Chaffetz? I rejoice that his nasty sneer won’t be on my TV any more, but he strikes me as an ambitious guy and says he won’t run for any office.
themann1086
My mom’s going to the Philly march!
Corner Stone
@Thru the Looking Glass…:
I don’t have any sourcing, but IMO, he is toast.
We’re going to be seeing a lot of people looking for deals where no deals are going to be offered. I think everyone and their brother in the GOP leadership is going to be pointing fingers at each other faster than a Three Stooges skit.
hovercraft
@Jim, Foolish Literalist:
Good riddance.
I think he’s beclowned himself so much that any serious person challenging him would have a good chance of beating him in the primary.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Goku: Ha! I thought so…
i may have just gotten up (West coast) but I am semi-awake… kind of… a little…
Goku
@SatanicPanic: The problem with the Space shuttle is that it never lived up to its main goal of being cheap and reusable. It never was even able to be up and running often enough after each launch. Planners pitched it as being like a delivery truck to space. Finally, the hardware (computer systems) ended up being outdated before entering active service.
Nixon was the one who brought us that white elephant and destroyed any possibility of reaching Mars and long term space colonization anytime soon. Saturn-Apollo hardware could have gotten us there, before the end of the 20th century with some tweaks.
Apollo could’ve been the American Soyuz. An extended Apollo and Skylab program could have given us years of valuable experience about long term space travel
Barbara
@Iowa Old Lady: Just to add further to the speculation, at one point I thought it was pretty well understood that Chaffetz would be running for either governor or Hatch’s Senate seat. Hatch is rather long in the tooth as they say. Has this possibility been ruled out as his reason for not running?
Central Planning
@Kropadope:
Yup. For some reason it’s easier/better (for weird definitions of those terms) to do layoffs and hire new people instead of retraining them. Gotta keep the air filling those golden parachutes I guess.
rikyrah
Their own kids, if given the chance, get out and never come back, and it chafes them.
Forever clinging to the Whiteness…..
I hope the refugees leave and the town dies.
Tired of these people finding excuses for their racism.
Phuck ’em.
……………………………
How a largely white community that was saved from a ‘death spiral’ by refugees came to embrace Trump
THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Wednesday, April 19, 2017, 5:06 AM
LEWISTON, Maine — Richard Rodrigue stood in the back of a banquet hall, watching his blond-haired, blue-eyed daughter mingle among her high school classmates. These teenagers speak dozens of languages, and hail from a dozen African nations.
They fled brutal civil war, famine, oppressive regimes to find themselves here, at a pre-prom fete in this once-dying New England mill town, revived by an influx of some 7,500 immigrants over the last 16 years. Rodrigue smiled and waved at his daughter, proud she is a part of it.
“It will help her in life,” he said. “The world is not all white.”
Rodrigue believes the refugees resuscitated his town — plugging the population drain that had threatened to cripple it, opening shops and restaurants in boarded-up storefronts. But he also agrees with Donald Trump that there should be no more of them, at least not now.
………………….
In early 2001, a few refugee families struggling to afford housing in Portland ventured 30 miles north and found a city in retreat. Empty downtown stores were ringed by sagging apartment buildings.
The refugees saw possibility in Lewiston’s decay. Friends and families followed. The town morphed in a matter of months into a laboratory for what happens when culture suddenly shifts. Maine’s population is 94 percent white, and its citizens were abruptly confronted with hundreds of black Muslims, barely able to speak English.
Ardo Mohamed fled Mogadishu in the 1990s, when militiamen burst into her home and started shooting. She watched her father die, as the rest of the family escaped into the woods. They wound up in refugee camps, separated for years, then finally Atlanta, then Lewiston in 2001.
…………….
When the refugees began arriving, Tabitha Beauchesne was a student at Lewiston High School. Her new classmates were poor, but Beauchesne was poor, too. It felt to her then, and it still feels to her now, that the refugees got more help than her family.
“They just seemed to take over,” she said.
………………………….
Maine’s immigrants from Sub-Saharan Africa made $136.6 million in income in 2014, and paid $40 million in taxes, according to one report from a bipartisan think-tank. But Besteman said they work invisible jobs: they take out trash at hotels, do the laundry at the hospital. People don’t see them working, so it’s easy to assume they are living off handouts.
Republican leaders — from the president to the governor to the local GOP — have seized on the resentment that breeds. The county Republican party routinely rails against what it calls “the refugee racket,” and complains that the school system is forced to accommodate 34 languages.
Lewiston School Superintendent Bill Webster acknowledges that does cost money. But he has a statistic he likes to share with critics.
An average of 78.3 percent of immigrant students graduate from his district within five years, compared to an average of 73.3 percent of native-born students. And now some of those immigrant kids are going off to college to get degrees, as teachers, doctors, engineers. Two years ago, immigrant children led the high school soccer team to win the state championship — a moment heralded as a triumph of cultural cooperation.
“If the immigrant population hadn’t happened,” Webster said, “Lewiston would be a community that was contracting, and potentially in a downward death spiral.”
Yet many on the outskirts of Lewiston have quietly stewed over the change in their county — and Trump’s “America First” message rings especially true with them.
SatanicPanic
@Corner Stone: I’m just making the point that the public thinks it’s cool, why get all hung up on details? This is why the propaganda wing of the revolution can’t be staffed by liberals. Instead of cool images you’d get posters that look like user agreements.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Corner Stone: That’s what I’m wondering too… I sure hope so… it’d be interesting, and very telling, to know if high-level Russians are starting to slip out of the country as unobtrusively as possible…
ruemara
Not me. It’s been troubling, watching the diversity & accessibility arguments in creating the march. Combine that with the “Science Should Be Neutral” argument from (of course) those who are least likely to have a problem under the anti-science regime. Issues of inclusivity have been plaguing this march since the inception and I cannot believe this many people think a march is what will save science while demanding that scientific fact is apolitical so taking a political stance is wrong. I want to support it, but the post-March action, what’s that? Marching won’t save you. It’s like activism in the modern age comes from a cliff notes version of the Civil Rights Era.
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Corner Stone: At least the Three Stooges were funny… and the incompetence was only an act…
rikyrah
Serena is pregnant!!! Congratulations!!!
hovercraft
@NorthLeft12:
If Hillary were to sue, the entire village would accuse her of trying to make a quick buck, they’d say that as a politician she should be able to take whatever’s thrown at her, and ask when is enough enough, how much money do Hill, Bill and Chelsea need? The rending of clothes the fainting couches, it would be epic.
But if the president and his wife sue and for her to get a quick 3 milion, no biggie right?
hovercraft
@rikyrah:
Wow, good for her :- )
Goku
@ruemara: The way I see it, marching is meant to keep people engaged, raise awareness, and stand up to those in power and shoe them that many will not go quietly into that good night
MazeDancer
@Iowa Old Lady:
Congratulations! May seeing your books on the shelf for sale feel just as splendid. And hope you’re all set to autograph a few so they can put those “Signed Copy” and “Local Author” stickers on the front.
SatanicPanic
@Goku: I agree that this is important history and important things to consider when designing whatever we decide to use next. But the point I’m making is that it’s fine for use as a symbol because the people you’re trying to target don’t know any of that stuff and probably don’t care.
Corner Stone
@Thru the Looking Glass…:
Those Russians have all been finding out what it’s like to be an inconvenient mistress for Putin. I’m not sure there is anywhere for them to disappear to.
Paula
Hubby and I are meeting family in Maryland and will be going to the march with them!
Goku
@SatanicPanic: Fair enough
SatanicPanic
@ruemara: Can you elaborate on issues of inclusivity?
Humboldtblue
Maybe the scientists could come up with a data set that convinced elected officials that military families shouldn’t need to rely on handouts from local food banks to eat.
SatanicPanic
@Goku: But that was good to know. I am shamefully ignorant of this stuff.
hovercraft
Florida GOP State Senator Drops N-Word In Front Of Black Colleagues
I am not a crook.
I am not a witch.
I am not a racist.
The first two ended political careers, the question is in today’s republican cesspool, will it cost this asshole his? Notice there’s almost no commentary on his misogyny.
Yarrow
@The Moar You Know: Maybe there should be a “March for STEM.” That might bring out those traditionally conservative upper middle class white folks.
Miss Bianca
@rikyrah: Gotta love white-privilege butthurt. And by “love”, I mean “hate with the heat of a thousand suns.”
Can we be glad that our shitty town was resuscitated by immigrant power? Nah, we gotta seize on resentment over imaginary wrongs.
hovercraft
@Iowa Old Lady:
Congrats, that’s great news.
Seanly
I have a full day Saturday. I am helping with the 2017 Pacific Northwest ASCE Student Conference at the Steel Bridge Competition here in Boise, ID. And I am meeting some friends at the Idaho Capitol Building at 10:30 for the march. Then back to steel bridge. Plus somewhere in there I need to walk the dogs…
HeleninEire
@Iowa Old Lady: YAY, YOU!!!
Yarrow
@Corner Stone:
I agree. Other rumors are that both Giuliani and Flynn have asked for deals but were turned down. Don’t need them.
Eric S.
I cannot because of work but we made up t shirts in support and I can see the Chicago March from the office window.
hovercraft
Ugh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Goodbye, Mar-a-Lago. Hello, Bedminster.
As the Florida resort season closes, residents near Trump’s usual summer getaway at his golf club in New Jersey prepare for more security, and more protests.
By DARREN SAMUELSOHN and KENNETH P. VOGEL 04/19/17 05:13 AM EDT
But once his exclusive seaside retreat at Mar-a-Lago closes for the season, Trump is expected to shift his weekend plans north, to his Trump National Golf Club in Bedminster, New Jersey — and bring with him all the chaos that comes with being a preferred presidential destination.
………………No doubt, Trump’s weekend travel out of Washington remains fertile ground for Democrats, especially given how often he criticized President Barack Obama for playing so much golf during his eight years in office. The Center for American Progress Action Fund has launched a website comparing the $25 million it estimates has been spent to date on Trump’s travels with budget priorities like the National Park Service and Medicaid. Florida Democrats are also collecting emails on a petition seeking reimbursements to the state for Trump’s seven Mar-a-Lago visits during his first 13 weeks as president.
Local Democrats say they’ll greet Trump whenever he comes to New Jersey with protests, even if it may be challenging to accomplish in front of his club due to security restrictions and logistics. The clubhouse and Trump’s villa are set back more than a mile from a high-speed, two-lane county road.
“We’ll do what we need,” said Paula Dolan, chair of the Bedminster Democratic Committee, “to make our opinions known.”
West of the Rockies (been a while)
Congratulations, Iowa Old Lady! That’s exciting news.
Anyone in it near Chico, CA? Our Science March will be smallish but dedicated. Anyone see Martin posting here lately? He’s a local, I believe.
hedgehog the occasional commenter
mr. h will be marching in Denver. I’ll be in Farmington, NM for an SCA event. (A friend of mine and I are joking about adding test tubes to our Viking bling.)
Marcopolo
@ruemara: I am going to this March (and go to marches in general) to have fun, because I get energy from being w/ a large group of folks who share my concerns, to make connections with those folks, to show the world that “real people” do care about these issues and are willing to make their voices heard. Marches have a place & serve a purpose. I’m pretty sure it rises above liking stuff on fb :)
I also call my electeds at least once/week, go to town halls, write postcards, donate to & work on campaigns and vote. But generally those activities aren’t quite so much fun as going out with a good sign and making a statement for a few hours.
Starfish
@Mnemosyne: With space science, there are the manned space flight versus just send robots to space people. But that is not even what I was talking about. I think that particular argument is created to sew discord within NASA and have it eats own. I refuse to participate.
In addition to whatever is going on in the science communities, there are a few people on Twitter talking about how discussions related to diversity and science were totally quashed and some of the women and women and color were shut down or marginalized in the leadership groups because they were making science political.
The fights that I expected to see were the ones around “What is science?” Do science educators count? Do engineers count? What about these sociologists who totally want sociology to be a science? Is this nutritionist trying to concern troll about GMOs or is she accepting that GMOs are the way we make sure that we can feed the whole planet? It was just not clear.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
@Goku:
But WHY?
Moving biological organisms into space is an evolutionary dead end. Gravity wells and short lifespans imprison natural life forms – timespans for travel are long, benefits scant, fuel needs are high AND alien atmospheres, flora and fauna are undoubtedly toxic to a large extent.
Nope, our future interplanetary and interstellar expansion is only successful to the extent AI (or even human memories or thought patterns) are encoded in lattice memory machines.
Call it “homo technologensis”.
Goku
@SatanicPanic: Don’t mention it
Starfish
@Kay: I was a “both sides do it” person at the Gore v Bush election. I would have voted for Nader if I had remembered to open the envelope from the state telling me what I needed to do to properly get an absentee ballot.
I learned my lesson, and I wanted to burn down people my age who were doing the same thing with Trump v Clinton.
Starfish
@Mnemosyne: From what I was reading on Twitter, it seemed like women were being marginalized in the leadership of March for Science. Any discussion of gender or race was “making science too political.”
Miss Bianca
@hedgehog the occasional commenter: Is there a science march in Denver? Tell mr. h hi from me! : )
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Corner Stone: Back to Russia?
Vlad can’t be mad at all of them?
Trumpski’s the weak link in that chain…
I read someplace in the last couple of days that Putin’s getting ready to pull the plug on this little experiment in democracy and move on… THAT should be a fascinating moment, should we actually reach it…
Thru the Looking Glass...
@Yarrow: Please be true… please be true… please be true…
ruemara
@Goku: That’s nice. But it’s like using “The Secret” to stop a bomb.
@SatanicPanic: There was a Twitter thread from the former director of their women’s outreach & diversity on why she left in disgust. I’m at my (scicomm) job, so, it’s not available to me. As I follow the main Science March & RealScientists, BioTweeps and number of female researchers, I can verify some of their initial overtures towards women were tone deaf (bad word choices, asking females what to do about getting women interested in science, etc.) Issues of access and speaking engagement from POC scientists and the disabled. The problem of crafting a protest march then saying it isn’t political when obviously, science is now and always has been political because it is about finding facts. I feel both are talking past each other a bit, but I come down on the side that march organizers weren’t helping themselves much.
It doesn’t mean I don’t support the goals of awareness, but I’ve decided I’d prefer not to donate or join movements that can’t get out of their own way when it comes to diversity. It just doesn’t benefit me anymore to play mule and serve a condescending group versus the domineering group. YMMV and awareness doesn’t translate into action. E.g. “Rally for Sanity”, a large event that did, what, exactly?
@Marcopolo: No offense, but this isn’t specifically about you. I know many people do things. But I have a problem with spectacle that doesn’t have a plan. This isn’t about attendees, this is about organizing to “raise awareness” without a set of practical goals. Review the Women’s March which actually did have goals and tactics for pre & post march and is still working on them.
Another Scott
@schrodingers_cat:
That’s been my impression as well (significant changes will require legislation, and we know that’s not happening any time soon). And it fits with the rest of what Donnie has “done” thus far – lots of bobast, but little actual change in the direction of the federal government (other than letting ICE off the leash – a horrible development) thus far.
Cheers,
Scott.
amygdala
@Starfish: Women, people of color, disabled folks… with the last group, the organizers initially said they wanted to get things going and then would address disability accessibility, seemingly unaware that it needs to be part of the planning.
I’m aware of a high profile neuroscientist whom I always suspected to be a privileged jerk who has outed himself completely as such. Undoubtedly there are others. Science has no shortage of problems in these spheres.
The issues @ruemara brings up are important. I may be naive, but I’m hoping that since I’m in the Bay Area things will be more inclusive for these groups and the LGBTQI science crowd. I spent a bit of time considering the decision to go, much more so than the Women’s March. And while I’m hoping I don’t regret marching Saturday, I know I might.
Kay
@Starfish:
There’s no real upside to being outspokenly liberal in a conservative area. My eldest son did it and his teachers were thrilled to have a dissenter so it was like “you argue THAT and these 27 other students will take the other side!”
The poor thing. He moved to Chicago and the only way he’ll come back is if he’s dropping his dog off for me to watch.
hedgehog the occasional commenter
@Miss Bianca: (waves) will do!
Another Scott
@Goku: Apollo was what you get when money is no object and there is a hard deadline. The average mission cost was $18B (todays $). The Shuttle was a huge bargain by comparison (each mission was about $1B).
Different times, different countries, different budget priorities, etc., etc.
Apollo was doomed by its own success. Once we landed on the Moon, people lost interest and there wasn’t support for a break-neck follow-on that would have kept the money flowing and all the engineers employed. That’s what happens after you win a big “race”.
Cheers,
Scott.
maurinsky
I am volunteering at the Science March in Hartford, CT.
rikyrah
@The Moar You Know:
great piece of advice and will keep it in my back pocket for future use.
SatanicPanic
@ruemara: Thanks! I am not a scientist myself, I’m going mainly as support for some of the scientists in my life, so I honestly haven’t given the planning, post-march plan, etc. much thought. I appreciate your perspective on this.
Starfish
@amygdala: I want to include some links to this. There was some woman related to science policy in the Obama administration who quit being part of the leadership of the Science March. I can’t find links to that. Here is a list of books from a black woman in astrophysics that I like to read about decolonizing science.
chopper
@Goku:
the saturn V was awesome but it wasn’t reusable. cost over a billion dollars per launch in today’s bucks. the shuttle wasn’t nearly as awesome but it allowed us to put a bunch of shit in orbit we couldn’t have otherwise afforded.
Mnemosyne
@Starfish:
Yes, but that’s a genuine issue that needs to be addressed. Ugh, the space shuttle was lame is not.
I’ve mostly been following the Los Angeles March for Science organizers and, fortunately, they’ve been pretty responsive to those concerns so far. We’ll see how it goes, but there have been a lot of scientists who are women (and often women of color) in their PR blitzes.
Starfish
@Kay: When I came back from the Tax March, I spoke to my mom who is liberalish in a conservative area about it. She said that she didn’t really care about the taxes, but this businesses with taking expensive vacations every weekend is starting to look bad. How do people in your conservative area seem to feel about it?
Origuy
I’m going to the one in San Jose. It ends at a park near the convention center, where Silicon Valley Comic Con will be happening. There will be Comic Con activities in the park after the rally, so it should be a lot of fun.
Cermet
@Goku: Funny, I argued this very point with NASA’s Chief scientist at a conference (the shuttle hadn’t been finished yet) and after a terse exchange, they conceded that I was correct and that Saturn launches would be cheaper than the Shuttle even at its best current estimate. As for ISS, how could another think that flying joke isn’t anything but a worse boondoggle then even the shuttle! Well over $100 billions dollars and it does ZERO science.
Cermet
@The Moar You Know: LOL; that is both a great post and I absolutely love the fusor comment – there IS hope for the BJ community! (aside: against Amerikan nukes but do have some love for the Candu reactor.)
Mnemosyne
@Starfish:
Also, FWIW, here’s the Los Angeles March for Science website where they specifically say that inclusion and diversity is important to them and not a sideshow to the March, and their list of scheduled speakers reflects that.
I’m not sure what’s up with the D.C. march since I’ve been following the local one much more closely, but that’s what’s going on locally in LA.
Mnemosyne
@The Moar You Know:
I turn 48 this year. The last Saturn rocket flew when I was 6 years old.
Ancient history, especially for a population that doesn’t know what life was like before there was an Internet.
Uncle Cosmo
@Another Scott: Might just come down from Bawlmer, hon. Might bring along a real scientist (I’m a retired sadistician) who’s visiting from the Czech Republic. (When she asked Could I be arrested? I replied Well, there’s always a chance…). Ask a FPer to dig you up my e-mail address if you want to get in touch.
chopper
@Another Scott:
to me the HST would have been the best image for NASA to use. it’s almost 30 years old but it’s still providing great data and is currently, in my opinion, the best single piece of scientific equipment they’ve ever built and put into operation.
and it would not have been possible had it not been for the shuttle, because it was designed to be serviceable by astronauts which would not have been very feasible without the shuttle program. and it needed that first service to correct problems with the optics, but it’s also been serviced several times since to keep it working and upgraded. so i do have a soft spot for the shuttle program, even though it was a kludge, just because it allowed the HST to happen.
amygdala
@Starfish: Thank you.
evodevo
@The Moar You Know: On the gun handle (a lot of them were cow bone in those days)
Starfish
@Mnemosyne: Thanks. I looked in on the Facebook page for the local event, and it looks like there is less nonsense than there was, and there are a lot of women helping with the organization. It looks very very white, but that reflects the demographics of our area and all the other local marches.
One thing that I have seen with various science communities is that they take a really really expansive view on science, and I get discouraged by some of that sometimes. People start a “What is science?” discussion, and then you find out all your scientists are sociologists. I feel like people grant this importance to science so everyone tries to be a scientist, and I am not quite sure where you draw the line.
The NASA arguments get really weird. Some of it is in-fighting by people who want money for their stuff “manned v unmanned.” Some of it nonsense spouted by people who do not understand how politics works. If you want a project that never dies, you build a little piece of it in different districts all over the country so the local Congress critters will fund it. And some of it is nonsense by people who do not understand all the infrastructure that got built around manned space flight that gets used by everyone else.
Is it better to privatize all of space science? Pretend like we have government funded space science when a whole lot of it is defense contractors working on site at NASA now under very long contracts supporting esoteric systems that most people quit using 20 years ago?
How should any of this work?
Mart
@Quinerly: wife and I thinking of going. Live in west county (with one other liberal family in the hood), so a haul to get downtown.
NorthLeft12
@hovercraft: Yes, I always find it funny how a lot of media types will complain when people collect money from a successful lawsuit and encourage those people to give the money away to prove they did not just sue for the money. Usually those media types have more money than twenty middle class families.
Mitch Albom, noted hack writer, got on his soap box and encouraged the woman who sued the Tampa Bay QB for sexually assaulting/raping her, to give the money away. As if the money would somehow taint her reputation. I went on Mitch’s Facebook page and encouraged him to give away all the money from his next word product to prove to the public that he does not write for money, but for the sheer joy of bringing enlightenment and inspiration to the public. I hate those hypocritical douchebags.
Mnemosyne
@Starfish:
I live and work near JPL, so I think most NASA people here are on the unmanned side simply because that’s what pays the bills and lets them live out here rather than Texas or Florida.
But I also think rocket geeks really underestimate the love people have for the Space Shuttle. When we got ours here, it was a HUGE deal. They did a big fly-over all around the region where crowds of people gathered to see it fly overhead strapped to a jumbo jet, and then even more crowds gathered to watch it inch its way from the airport to the California Science Center, where it’s a very popular exhibit.
Mnemosyne
@Starfish:
Also, too, I know that what happened with the LA March is that it started off very white and male, the organizers got called out, and they said, Oh, shit, you’re totally right! We will re-tool right now and do better. So they did respond to the complaints and tried to improve immediately.
Goku
@Mnemosyne: As admittedly cool as the Space Shuttle could be, it was actually pretty terrible when it came to living up to its expectations. I understand the political will wasn’t there, but the Apollo hardware could have been used for further crewed space exploration (Mars) earlier and I think cheaper. Instead we puttered around in LEO for 30 plus years.
Uncle Cosmo
@Cermet: And maybe if you’d pressed a little harder you would’ve been informed that the only way any sort of manned spaceflight[1] was going to continue was with DoD buyin–& the Department of Death jammed so many requirements into the specs[2] that the resultant piebald hippogriff of a system transmogrified into an albino pachyderm. Unfortunately the Shmatte advocates sold us on the notion that it would make spaceflight “routine”, & it took two vehicles & 14 lives destroyed to demonstrate otherwise.[3]
IMHO they should’ve used a shot of Hubble as an emblem for the march.Then again, the Space Shmatte put up Hubble. And came back to fix what Perkin-Elmer fucked up, so that anyone with eyes was stunned into a (renewed) appreciation of what science can tell us about the universe we live in.
—
[1] Skylab & Apollo-Soyuz used hardware already built & paid for. They weren’t about to fund more throwaways.
[2] E.g., the Shmatte needed a delta wing specifically so that in case of a situation requiring a mission abort, it could be steered away from landing sites where the local political regime was “unfriendly”. DoD insisted on this before they’d use it for classified missions.
[3] You’da thought Apollo 13 would’ve convinced us otherwise. But those guys survived. And very few beyond the space community & its sputniki (fellow travelers) remembers Apollo 1 and Grissom, Chaffee & White, who didn’t...
Mnemosyne
@Goku:
Yes, but you can’t dictate what people love, and we underestimate the love people have for the Space Shuttle at our peril. It may be an ugly baby, but it’s the ugly baby of a LOT of Gen-Xers and Millennials. Saying, Hey, let’s bring back the glory days of sending people into space like we did with the Space Shuttle! is something a lot of people will respond to. We don’t have to replicate the Shuttle, but we can talk about how cool it was to send people into space and how awesome it would be to do that again.
Goku
@Mnemosyne: Didn’t intend to give that impression. Like what you want
FlyingToaster
I’m sending HerrDoktor to the Boston Science Rally (not really a march, just overfilling the Common) while I do WarriorGirl stuff.
If anyone knows of a good calendar of Boston-area #resist events for May, please post! (Or for anywhere else.) We’re trying not to burn out, so we’re each doing one event every other month, to keep the protests going and in Trump’s grill. If everyone does 4 or 6 protests a year, it’ll keep the pressure on — and distract the President* from doing more damage.
Lee
I’ll be going to either the Dallas or Denton march.
If anyone else is in the area let me know.
low-tech cyclist
@Uncle Cosmo:
I remember.
Of course, I also remember things like the Ranger program from the early 1960s.
Kristine
Late to the thread, but I will be at the Chicago March.
ceece
I’m going to the San Jose march, with some students from my school. The lineup of speakers at San Jose is very diverse, with some overlap of people from the Silicon Valley Comic Con. The march ends at Chavez Plaza, where the free public portion of Comic Con is scheduled, and where the Tech museum is having a free kids day. Definitely take the bus or train, as there will be very little parking downtown.
planetjanet
I will be there. Who hashould the green balloons?
Another Scott
@planetjanet: Balloons are verboten at the DC rally. :-(
Cheers,
Scott.
zzyzx
I’m going to the Seattle one.
ruckus
@Goku:
The shuttle computers were able to get updated as needed because of the way those systems were designed. And you say they weren’t cheap? What type of reusable spacecraft would be, given the technology of the day? Pretty decent record, all things considered.
Quinerly
@Mart:
Hope to see you if you make it into the city!
Goku
@ruckus: The point is, the tech wasn’t there yet and NASA let themselves buy into space delivery truck bs when assembly lines and engineers for Saturn-Apollo hardware were still in place. That system could have eventually taken us to Mars a lot sooner instead of screwing around in orbit for 30 years.
I’m not just talking about the Saturn V itself either. There were smaller and cheaper derivatives just for the Apollo CSM into LEO. Perfect crew taxi
sheila in nc
@Summer: I’ve just signed up for the Raleigh march also. Don’t yet know when I will get there. Maybe I’ll try to bring a balloon!
Thrasius
Lurker, but I will be at the Greenville, SC rally Saturday.
Ohio Mom
Planning on the Cincinnati March. I can’t say any of our local marches have been all that inspiring — there aren’t enough of us. Though I think that makes my attendance more important.
Michael Bersin
I plan on covering/attending the march/rally at Washington Square Park in Kansas City. I’ll post photos/story at Show Me Progress. I’ll be the tall guy, glasses, gray hair, holding a camera with a 200 mm lens on a monopod. Say hello.
Citizen Scientist
I’ll be attending the March in DC. Really hope the rain holds off!
Redshift
I’ll be at the DC March! And afterward, there’s an Ask the Astronaut event at the Arlington Planetarium!