Hoo boy, Betsy DeVos is a real winner. If you are a c-list blogger with a potty mouth or a writer for a comedian/comedy show, her hearing yesterday was fucking amazing. If you care about education policy or have children, well, you know, sorry about that.
There were so much fail it’s hard to just limit it to one blog post, but here goes. First, she has no idea the difference between proficiency and growth or the existence of the debate, which is to education what evolution/creationism is to hard sciences:
I’m pretty sure any undergraduate at ANY college in America with at least ONE education course could answer that better.
Next up, she seems completely unaware that IDEA exists:
Again, she is so ignorant of everything around here, I sort of hoped that Franken and Hassan would start making up federal laws that don’t exist and asking her position on them, just to see what she would say.
And then finally, there was this:
Just so we are clear, there is no no grizzly infestation menacing Wyoming public schools:
Audra Morrow, a teacher at Wyoming’s Valley Elementary School in Cody from 2004 to 2006, explained to Mic that no guns were necessary to ward off ursids, and that the fence and bear spray were “absolutely” sufficient measures on their own.
“No firearms in our schools!” Morrow wrote. “We do have bear spray but have never had a problem that would require using it.”
And I’m not joking that I am just scratching the surface here- she also stated she did not support standards for every school that receives federal money and on and on and on.
Welcome to the United States of Dumbfuckistan.
oldster
I gotta say, though, I was pleasantly surprised–very surprised, and very pleasantly–by how aggressive and effective our Democratic Senators were.
Of course they cannot stop the stampede to confirmation. But they made her look as bad, shallow, and dysfunctional as she is. Every time that they show the country what morons Trump has selected, they work to protect us from the worst that he might do.
aangus
My goodness. Didn’t he work her over good.
Sometimes I wonder if being a comedy writer should be a prerequisite to being a Senator.
Watched this live and the good Senator sure knows how to play the Mark. IYNWIM
chopper
yeah, having kids in public school, i watched the hearing and immediately felt like running into traffic. we are all so deeply fucked.
BGinCHI
I liked the moment when she waved the receipt around and said: “But I paid for this office!”
trollhattan
Yup, if you want the epitome of Trump’s desire to simply break government, you can’t top Betsy. It’s like bringing a kitchen appliance to fly an airplane As the kid of school teachers this must be extra sweet. Charlie Pierce brought the wood to the proceedings, also, too.
bbleh
Hey look, she’s a girl, education is girl stuff, so waddaya waddaya? Besides, her family is STINKING rich, and the Bible-bangers LOVE her, so she checks THREE boxes! She’s gonna be great, terrific, and our kids are gonna have the best schools in the WORLD, unlike the TOTAL disaster we’ve got now, just terrible, just awful. Really, those schools where those people’s kids go are gonna be just great.
/s
? Martin
See that she’s got the same knack for excellence that her brother has.
Wag
@aangus:
He was a credit to his Party
He put her through some changes, Lord
Sorta like a Waring ????
zhena gogolia
Proud of my Senator Murphy.
rikyrah
The worst part was her phucking smirk with Murphy.
Yarrow
They don’t care if she knows anything about Education, nor if any of the other appointees know anything about their departments and future jobs. The goal is to loot the Treasury, enrich themselves, family and friends, and push their reactionary version of Christianity on everyone. Oh, and punish sluts.
When those are your goals, who cares about things like “proficiency and growth”? Those things are not relevant. It doesn’t matter if kids are proficient in anything or improve year to year if they kneel down and worship Jesus. Critical thinking is dangerous anyway, remember?
zhena gogolia
@rikyrah:
Her heart bleeds! Like a room full of six-year-olds.
Yoda Dog Democrat
Great post. One of my biggest personal fears in all of this is the fate of public education. Will my kids even get to go to school like we did or are they just going to hand me a fucking coupon and tell me “good luck”? I fear the latter.
Oatler.
“Ketchup is a vegetable”.
Elizabelle
I foresee people in grizzly costumes trailing that woman around.
Cacti
Was reading yesterday that since “education reformer” Devos started buying elections in Michigan, statewide reading scores and graduation rates have both declined.
O. Felix Culpa
Grizzly bears. Seriously. No words.
Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.)
What a fucking shitshow. This incoming administration can’t end soon enough for me.
rikyrah
Will her thieving ass be required to pay the FINE in Ohio that she owes?
laura
I’d walk on broken glass to the polls to cast a presidental vote for Senator AL Franken.
Without public schools, we can kiss goodbye any pretence of having a shared American experience and civic commonality. But that’s the point, isn’t it. Many truths, and one fool to rule them all.
Brachiator
In the second video, the look on the face of the woman sitting behind Devos is amazing.
The tv coverage of Trump nominees should have a little graphic that notes their net worth and how much they contributed to Trump’s campaign.
ETA: DeVos family net worth, $5.1 billion
JPL
@Oatler.: Time to make ketchup great again.
aangus
@Wag:
*grins bigly*
This.
Anne Laurie
Mr. Charles P. Pierce, nut graf:
Corner Stone
“Bears. Now you’re putting the whole station in jeopardy.”
? Martin
@Cacti: Yeah, but on the upside she didn’t kill people like her brother. It’s interesting that in all of this Erik Prince’s name hasn’t come up at all from what I’ve seen.
Aleta
When there’s a proposal for a very big project that would change a big piece of ecosystem, some developers open with a plan that has some outrageous pieces. Then they drop those and claim they are compromising, giving up part of what they want. Negotiating!
Tr’s candidates are like that to me. Some are perhaps put up there but expected to fail, so they can say it’s all balanced. The D side won some, and meanwhile they get Tillerman, Sessions etc through.
Mike in NC
We have no children or grandchildren, and feel sorry for anybody who wants theirs to have any shot at a decent future in a country presided over by this lunatic and his minions.
laura
@? Martin: that you know of.
aangus
@Anne Laurie:
Link doesn’t work. :(
eta At least not here in Canuckistan.
Hey, I can make corrections again!
? Martin
Bit of a followup on the payday loan dustup that happened during the election.
The problem with the payday loan debate was that it distracted from the much broader problem of how to provide cost-effective banking options for either low-income workers or workers without steady pay. Like most people I get free banking because my pay is steady enough to rely on direct deposit. A whole host of benefits flow from that. I never pay credit card fees or banking fees or ATM fees. Those things are available to me because I have enough money for banks to chase after me, but for so many other people they have nothing but bad options to choose between. As she sums up:
James Powell
@oldster:
I wish this were true. I don’t think it is. I see no evidence that being stupid, evil, or just wrong about everything is any barrier to taking complete control of the government and doing stupid, evil, and wrong things.
Aleta
@Yoda Dog Democrat: In honesty, I believe that plans have been in the works for years to take taxpayer money out of public schools and give it to private companies. They’ve worked toward this and their moment is here. They’ve also been collecting data to manipulate to defund state universities.
randy khan
So this is one more time we need to put pressure on the Senate. She’s obviously entirely unqualified for the job, so remind them of that. It might not work, but it can’t hurt.
Lizzy L
A friend told me today that the hearing for Andrew Puzder (SecLabor nominee) has been postponed, and that his nomination may be withdrawn.
Chris
A debate that was completely settled a century ago, in which one side argues for the more or less incontrovertible truth and the other is arguing for fairy tales and pixie dust, which isn’t in fact a “debate” at all within the relevant field but rather a debate in the political arena between those who think they’re entitled to their own facts and those who don’t?
(I actually know as little about the debates in education – wasn’t even raised in American schools – which is why unlike this nincompoop I’m not trying out for Secretary of Education, but I couldn’t let that one pass without comment).
Yoda Dog Democrat
@Aleta: I know. I completely agree. And I hate them. Im not going to be shy about it anymore.
West of the Cascades
@laura:
This. 1000 times this. I would knock on doors in deepest red Pennsylvania or Wisconsin to ask people to vote for Senator Franken as President.
cmorenc
In the bottom-most photo in Jon’s post, captioned: “Guns in school protect against grizzly bears” – Devos’ face and hand posture makes it appear she’s trying to blow soap bubbles at her inquisitors. And figuratively, that IS exactly what she’s trying to do. This is like a SNL sketch come to real life.
SRW1
@Anne Laurie:
Madame DeVos bought that job fair and square.
schrodingers_cat
@? Martin:Post offices doubling as banks would be an easy answer to this problem.
Chris
@Smedley Darlington Prunebanks (Formerly Mumphrey, et al.):
The best case scenario is that this administration ends up being such a complete and utter shit show that it collapses in disgrace and leaves its party and its side of the aisle with the kind of stink that Hoover did for Republicans circa 1930 and Carter for Democrats circa 1980, and that whoever shows up in 2020 or 2024 is able to exploit that as completely as Roosevelt and Reagan did.
Not holding my breath, especially since in any sane world, the draft-dodging war criminal Obama replaced should’ve had all that effect and then some. But one can hope.
gene108
@laura:
95% or so of Americans attended public schools. People may have had varying levels of fun there, but we all went to one.
People put a lot of value in public schools. They buy houses based on the schools in the neighborhood.
I do not get, why there is not more pushback on people like Betsy. So many of us are products of public schools.
? Martin
@schrodingers_cat: Agreed. There are a number of fairly straightforward things that can be done, yet fail to be done.
schrodingers_cat
That’s bullshit, evolution/creationism debate is not a scientific debate at all but a political one. The science on that issue is settled. I know you used to be RWNJ, but still.
randy khan
@Lizzy L:
Fingers crossed. Puzder is a bad man.
(By the way, I get that the next choice probably won’t be much better, or even could be worse. But one element of the going-forward strategy has to be to make the Trump Administration and the Republicans look incompetent. Knocking down awful nominees who can’t bother to prepare or who don’t know anything in the first place whenever possible is part of that. Also, it keeps the career people in charge for as long as possible, which might limit the damage. And it’s fun.)
dedc79
Scanned the comments and can’t believe nobody’s made a Bear Patrol/Anti-Tiger Rock reference yet.
FlyingToaster
I think the Commonwealth of Massachusetts is going to spend the next four years suing the U.S. Department of Education.
Aleta
@schrodingers_cat: I regret so much that the Ds in Congress did not fight harder to protect the USPS the last 15 years.
schrodingers_cat
@? Martin: So many problems in this country are manufactured and are unsolvable because of the lack of political will. Like idiot descendants of once powerful and successful families, a significant minority continues to fritter away the advantages that earlier generations worked so hard to build.
raven
So meet a bear and take him out to lunch with you
And even though your friends may stop and stare
Just remember that’s a bear there in the bunch with you
And they just don’t come no better than a bear
cmorenc
@oldster:
Unfortunately, it’s not going to be until the softer Trump voters – e.g. the ones who voted for the candidate they disliked the least, rather than being on-board as a roaring true believer – start feeling personally distressed and alienated from the actions of Trump, his cabinet, and the GOP congress that the realization will truly sink in of what knaves and morons Trump has inflicted on the country, including himself. Given his falling approval numbers since immediately post-election – this buyer’s remorse may already beginning to set in, but it won’t get sufficient traction until enough people feel real pain from these assholes.
aangus
@cmorenc:
” makes it appear she’s trying to blow soap bubbles at her inquisitors.”
Well, it appears like she was trying to blow something, soap bubbles wasn’t at the top of my list, but, I guess that it will have to do.
*evil grin*
Calouste
@randy khan: Specially if the nominees withdraw rather than are rejected. It would be nice if articles are appearing stating that more nominees have withdrawn than under any president in history.
Mart
@Yoda Dog Democrat: One of my biggest personal fears in all of this is the fate of public education. Will my kids even get to go to school like we did or are they just going to hand me a fucking coupon and tell me “good luck”? I fear the latter.
I fear for my wife and daughter who are teachers. As the Betsy’s of the world know; you can easily maximize your profit margin off the public’s money by mostly replacing my wife and daughter with aides with two weeks training making minimum wage and no benefits. Screw those democrat teachers and their evil unions, they are taking all our profits.
Chris
@schrodingers_cat:
So much this.
America is a family dying of eminently treatable diseases and controlled by Christian Scientists who keep the doctors and the ambulances away at gunpoint because Medicine Is Satan.
(Or Anti-Vaxxers, whatever your preferred analogy. If there’s one thing the world isn’t short on, it’s morons).
ThresherK
Never been near a university,
Never took a paper or a learned degree,
And some of your friends think that’s stupid of me,
But it’s nothing that I care about.
Yarrow
@raven: I love that song!
Anne Laurie
@aangus: Fixed, thanks. (FYWP)
? Martin
@gene108: NYTimes has a piece today on universities that provide upward mobility.
8 of the 10 are publics, and 5 of the 10 are California publics. The two privates have a combined enrollment of 15,000 students, while the publics each run 30K plus except for one. I went to a private university and it was the right choice for me, but private universities are wholly inadequate to the scale of the educational challenge, nor do they want to be. The largest private in the US is BYU at 30K and it goes down quickly from there. 30K is a smallish public. SUNY has 400K students. UC + CSU has 750K. California community college system has 2.4 million.
Patricia Kayden
@Yoda Dog Democrat: I do feel very sorry for parents/guardians with school-aged children. Funny how these forced birthers could care less about the quality of children’s education unless their parents/guardians can afford private schools. I thought they loved children.
randy khan
@cmorenc:
If we can believe the polls about Trump’s approval ratings, it would appear that, in fact, some of the soft Trump voters already are figuring this out. It’s really stunning that his ratings have been dropping since the election, particularly given how low they were in the first place.
aangus
Oh, my.
Facts would appear to have a liberal bias.
Who could have forseen this?
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Chris:
It took California two useless GOP governors to get over Republicans, so just got to wait it out.
O. Felix Culpa
Speaking of education, I’m off to teach my first class of the semester at the local community college. Wish me – and my students – luck!
Anne Laurie
Ancillary grievance:
“Rich lady wants her bought-and-paid-for position, so she can gut public education and turn the profits over to her cronies. Whew! Business as usual, thank Repub Jeebus!’
Yarrow
Ha. Check out these two photos side by side. Sure Trump was “working on his speech.” Uh huh.
? Martin
@schrodingers_cat: Right, which is why creative destruction is effective. California rejected single payer because the political will evaporated once ACA came along. Take ACA away, and that will may return.
Many, many political problems require circumstances to get much worse before the will arrives to make them better. That’s cold comfort to everyone who suffers while things get worse, but that’s a possible upside to a president Trump. Public polling support nationally for single payer is very likely to grow now that ACA is under threat. We may see that in other areas as well.
Pogonip
Cole, when you move, don’t let the cat out for a couple of days or he’ll probably head back to the old place and meow indignantly for food all night.
Our neighbors forgot to feed their cat the other day and he let the whole street know. He is much louder than yours. It was trash day so we had no scraps for him. I was just considering whether to fry him an egg when they came home and fed him and blissful silence descended.
The Moar You Know
@gene108: Remember that Pink Floyd song “Another Brick in the Wall”? Even those hippies bought into the notion that “schools are mind control and teachers are there to ruin your lives for fun”. Something which the overwhelming majority of people believe. People hate schools and teachers.
Talking out my ass? Nope. My wife is a teacher and I’d say the number of students who appreciate what she does runs around 5%. The number of parents who appreciate their kid’s teachers is far, far less. Not even 1%. It would be to her benefit, financially, to stay in until age 62 but she will retire the first day that the CA teacher’s pension system lets her, seven years sooner. If we could afford it I’d say “fuck the pension, just get out today”…but teachers do not get Social Security, so we can’t afford that option at all.
It’s an awful job and people like DeVos have made it that way. And they’ve ruined the profession; I don’t know a single teacher who would recommend it as a career, and that is going to be a real problem in about five years. Nobody wants to do it at any price, and the price that’s being offered is insulting. You can literally make more managing a McDonalds. In some states (GA springs to mind) you can make more just working the counter at a McDonalds.
sigaba
@Anne Laurie: “Never talk about right and wrong, just talk about how liberals are mad, therefore everything’s business as usual and going to be okay.”
Yoda Dog Democrat
@Mart: Teachers: who knowingly sign up for minimal compensation in order to have the oppurtunity to help better the lives of other people’s children. They are some of the most beautiful, caring and selfless people, by and large, I’ve ever been around. I’m scared for them too and I will not stand for this travesty without a fight.
Pogonip
@Mike in NC: Calm down, he’ll be impeached in 6 months. The Village doesn’t like him any more than you do.
Pogonip
@Elizabelle: Ha! I’d like to see that!
I went through 12 years of schooling and never saw a bear once. On the other hand, if she gets her way, every school in the U.S. could change its school song to “The Homecoming Queen’s Got A Gun.”
Major Major Major Major
@Anne Laurie: it is reminiscent of the good old days of Harriet Miers.
@Pogonip: I’ll take that bet. I accept Venmo and Bitcoin.
ThresherK
@The Moar You Know: And your wife gets to hear people squawk out their cloacas about how she “only works 180 days a year”.
Seriously, if teaching is so easy and financially rewarding, and right-wingers so superior, why haven’t they just en masse infiltrated, dominated the profession in the 40+ years they’ve been bitching about “reforming” public education, and taken it all over?
Yarrow
@The Moar You Know: Yep. People who teach often warn younger people not to go into teaching. And those who do it for a few years see what the deal is and leave. The attrition rate is high. There are selfless teachers and those who love it but you do need to be able to support yourself and maybe your family. It shouldn’t be something that only someone with a rich spouse can do.
From a September, 2016 article:
Yoda Dog Democrat
@Patricia Kayden: My kids are 20 and 2 months old and the incoming administration is presenting a clear and present danger to their futures. This drives my rage. I can’t just watch this happen. I’m just thankful they’re so young so A) I don’t have to explain what just fucking happened and B) We have some time to fix this mess, FSM willing..
Timurid
@Pogonip:
The Villagers (and their elite patrons) do not like Trump, but they need him… because he is the only national politician with the balls to be King. He won’t be very good at it, but they think he can flattered and manipulated. If all else fails, he’ll last long enough to break down institutions and norms sufficiently to pave the way for a more able successor.
The Village and the elites believe that the end of the white majority, growing inequality and automation/surplus labor will make democracy unsustainable (for them at least). Thus there needs to be a shift to a more authoritarian mode of government, the sooner the better. As flawed as Trump is, he is the one guy who has stood up and volunteered for the job.
Pogonip
@Major Major Major Major: Got no Bitcoins and don’t even know what Venmo is, but if he’s still there in 6 months + 1 day, you get bragging rights.
I have not seen any Bitcoin news in quite a while. Maybe it was a fad that’s now ending.
Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes
Anybody ever get a backstory in the founding of the Co-Dominium or its collapse in “The Mote in Gods Eye”? We may need to know this…
raven
@Yarrow: Not my favorite on the album but it’s good.
“Memphis Midnight/Memphis Morning”
“West Texas Highway”
“Rollin’ By”
are my favs.
J R in WV
@schrodingers_cat:
You are missing John’s point completely. He knows that there is no debate between Evolution and creation, and is using that fact to make the point that there is no debate between proficiency and growth – which Ms DeVos is ignorant of.
Major Major Major Major
@Pogonip: nope, Bitcoin is still going strong, it’s just lost its novelty so nobody’s writing about it.
Venmo is just a cash transfer app you link to your debit card.
But I also accept bragging rights ?
EBT
@? Martin: I went to a public university of 7,000 and it felt super easy to get lost in the crowd.
schrodingers_cat
@J R in WV: Okay then, I stand corrected. I haven’t clicked on the DeVil woman’s video.
Peale
@Anne Laurie: I bet she on video peeing somewhere, too. You know her soldier of great fortune brother would have security cameras installed every six inches in the compound. Time for a hack to see what turns up.
Chris
@ThresherK:
This has been my question to these people since basically forever, though with a slightly broadened emphasis.
If CEOs and wealthy heirs and “the rich” in this country really do have it so horrifically bad with being taxed and regulated out of business and in fear for their life because of the mobs of union thugs, and people on welfare really do have it so easy because everything’s provided for them and it’s the cushiest thing ever, why have you never heard of even one of these people selling everything and going on welfare?
I mean, it can’t be their rigorous ethic of hard work and self-sufficiency. After all, some rich people are liberals. George Soros. Warren Buffet. All of Hollywood and all of the media, according to what Fox News tells me. All lazy good for nothing liberals with no work ethic, but with huge and taxable fortunes. Why hasn’t Meryl Streep ever given away the hardship of 1%er-hood for a lucrative career as a food stamp recipient?
Anyone? Bueller?
Brachiator
@Pogonip:
i will take some of this bet.
I do not understand why anyone would say with such certainty that Trump will be impeached. It wasn’t that long ago that people were insisting that he was not seriously running for office. Then, he would never win the GOP primaries. Then, he would drop out before the general election because he wanted to start his own Fox News channel.
So, now the Congressional Republicans are bending over backwards to accommodate Trump, even turning their eyes away from clear conflicts of interest. The Village may not like Trump, but they believe that he will be tremendously useful.
Yarrow
@raven: I like the title song.
Chris
@Timurid:
I don’t think they’ve thought it through nearly to that extent. I think their religious creed of “both sides do it, but liberals are worse” is all it takes.
I do believe that’ll be the practical result, though. And that they’ll entirely swallow every antidemocratic reform with the drumbeat of “we’re a REPUBLIC not a DEMOCRACY” and “the founding fathers gave us the electoral college for a reason!”
schrodingers_cat
@Brachiator: I agree, he is not going to be impeached, the GOP congress critters are afraid of him and his supporters.
debbie
Trump tweeted a photo of himself working on his inauguration speech. He’s holding a pen above a pad of paper and looking off thoughtfully into mid-space. Five bucks says the pad is blank.
Major Major Major Major
@Chris: everybody knows that they weight food stamps and welfare in favor of the blahs; for white people it’s not nearly generous enough. Keep your government hands off my SSDI!
Chris
@Brachiator:
So will I.
Trump controls the votes. Impeaching Trump is a “fuck you” to the diehard racist core of the GOP voter base which all of these politicians desperately need to get reelected, and Trump would absolutely react by tweeting up a storm about the need to primary those bad liberal RINO traitors before they stop him from making America great again.
And nothing Trump is likely to do is worth them impeaching him. If he turned out to be some sort of W. J. Bryan or Teddy Roosevelt esque figure who actually is economically populist despite his reactionary views elsewhere? Then, yes. It would be on. But everything we’ve seen so far seems to indicate that Trump is simply going to do a steroids-enhanced version of the standard “loot the Treasury and put the hurting on every liberal constituency.” Sure, he’s an unstable lunatic, but they don’t give a shit.
Yarrow
@schrodingers_cat: What will lead to him being impeached is if the pressure on members of Congress is so great they have to choose. And by “pressure” I mean proof from the IC that shows that they and possibly their family members and associates have committed crimes. At some point they may have to choose between their own crimes being made public and taking out Trump. If that happens, my money is on them taking out Trump.
Chris
@Major Major Major Major:
So? There’s black people among the rich and famous too. Surely one of them would’ve gone back to the Affirmative Action Welfare sinecure, if it existed.
trollhattan
If you go down to your school today
You’re sure of a big surprise.
If you go down to your school today
You’d better go weaponized!
For every griz that ever there was
Will gather there for certain,
Because today’s the day the
Grizzly bears eat the students.
NotMax
Edumacatin ‘ is hard.
Yarrow
@debbie: I linked it above at #67. Go have a look at the side by side photos. It’s totally staged and he likely kicked some poor receptionist off her desk for the photo.
Aleta
@Yarrow:
“My fellow people who voted for me,
No one could have predicted that Donald Trump, I, the winner, was determined to attack America. And I won. Are we having a good time? Does anyone want a hat? The world will long remember what I say here, and it will never forget what I’m going to do, which is win some more. It is for us to do what I want. So help me God because I’m being very nice to you.”
Major Major Major Major
@Chris: everybody knows they use targeting (via IRS records and gun registries) to make sure conservatives get crappy benefits.
Yoda Dog Democrat
@Brachiator: I agree, he’s got their balls in a vice, I don’t get all this talk of impeachment. Unless we get hard evidence of criminal activity. Then we might have something. Make it happen IC.
p.a.
OT good news- not important really but we need all we can get: Curt Schilling’s HOF vote goes down from last year; probably the kiss of death for his bid. He can blame the historically ultraliberal BBWAA ? I guess.
fyi: Bagwell, Raines, Rodriguez in.
debbie
@Yarrow:
I love this response tweet. They’re talking about his holding a Sharpie with the cap still on, then this:
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@Aleta:
That may be true for a lot of them but for the DeVoses in particular, I don’t believe that’s so. It’s a bit harder to understand this if you’re outside of West Michigan, but the vast majority of Dutch Calvinists here have always believed that they have a right to tax dollars in order to give their kids a religious education. This was barely an issue with the Catholics around here until Reagan and white flight from the core cities’ public school systems, but it’s always been an issue with the likes of the Princes, and Betsy’s mom is a notably zealous Dutch Calvinist.
debbie
@zhena gogolia:
Just watched Murphy’s exchange with De Vos. What her heart really bleeds is potential grizzlies.
NotMax
“Ms DeVos, what are known as the ‘Three Rs?'”
“Republicans, religion, and ‘rite-offs.”
Miss Bianca
@trollhattan: heh heh
? Martin
California Strikes a Bold Pose as Vanguard of the Resistance
trollhattan
@Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!):
Have recently read DeVos reveres Milton Friedman who specifically supported publicly funded education run by the private sector, so I suspect she’s quite on board with the concept.
Yoda Dog Democrat
@p.a.: Nice. It will be fun to watch Warren use him for a pinata as well.
ETA: She cracked me up when some reporter told her Schilling was thinking of running against her. She just shrugged and went “Who?”… It was pretty funny.
Aleta
People who hate government voted for Trump. So now those ones are ready to hate him. I’m hoping they stay encouraged. It might torture the allegiance of a small piece of Congress.
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@trollhattan:
As a stepping stone, yes. But the DeVoses and Van Andels aren’t stupid with their money, and they see the bubble in the charter schools and they won’t be investing in it heavily.
Major Major Major Major
@Aleta: Don’t be silly, they only hate it when it’s not their government.
@? Martin: We would hate it so hard if a state tried to do that to Obama…
debbie
@Yoda Dog Democrat:
Speaking of Elizabeth Warren, Putin recently confused her with Betsy De Vos. I can’t find a link for the quote, but I came across this recent Putin gem. Colbert mentioned it, but I was sure he was joking. Wrong:
It’s like listening to Trump, but in Russian.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/putin-defends-trump_us_587e1d6ee4b03549ebc067d4
EBT
@Major Major Major Major: But the right has been doing that for decades. Look at the constant law suits over equal protection and voter access. They get money and are told to redo a district then steal the money and do nothing. Fuck them, we need to take their tricks, do them better and screw them over back.
Aleta
@Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!): Good point. I’ve been assuming that the families that run Protestant Christian charter schools around here (which are drawing the former homeschool types) have formed small companies in order to apply for charter school funds, but I don’t know that for sure.
Major Major Major Major
@EBT: I tend to agree but I’m not sure it’s right.
NotMax
@Martin
Zelda Gilroy rocks!
Aleta
@Major Major Major Major: He’s already betrayed some of them in their minds.
Origuy
@Le Comte de Monte Cristo, fka Edmund Dantes: Wikipedia has an article about the CoDominium. Some of Pournelle’s other books tie into it, in particular the War World series. (Which I haven’t read.) King David’s Spaceship and the Falkenberg series were pretty good, though.
EBT
@Major Major Major Major: Making so they can’t rob us for their god, or beat us for being queer is absolutely right even if we have to disenfranchise the sort of folk who have been trying to disenfranchise people.
NotMax
@trollhattan
“Charter schools for us, charter prisons for them.”
Sab
@gene108: Michigan is weird. When I lived there in the 1980s (western Michigan) they didn’t even provide books in the public schools. The kids families had to buy them. I grew up in the Jim Crow south and even the black kids got free (but old)books. But not in Grand Rapids.
Major Major Major Major
@EBT: Even if we’re literally actually the ones doing the robbing? This wouldn’t have been OK under Bush. I’m not arguing with you per se, just interrogating the idea.
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@Sab:
Where in the hell did you go to school? I’ve lived in West Michigan for my entire life, almost entirely in Grand Rapids, and I’ve never heard of a public school system that was set up that way.
Sab
@Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!): I didn’t go to school in Michigan but I did live there from 1980- 1984 and they did not provide books in the schools and my boyfriend who had lived his whole life in Grand Rapids thought it was very weird that schools did provide books.
gene108
@Anne Laurie:
But according to Trump supporters, since all these Cabinet picks are billionaires, they are above the petty corruption that would tempt the likes of us and are doing this public service out of the goodness of their hearts.
When I moved to NJ from NC after college, I got suckered into an Amway meeting. The guy, who suckered me started of by asking me, if I was someone else that he mistook me for. Then we had some small talk. He told me a bit about himself. I told him I just moved here after college in NC. He said he had friends having a get together or something like that and they were from the same place I was from in NC and I was free to drop by.
I went expecting a friendly get together, but it was an Amway indoctrination meeting.
They came off like a cult. They had rules on your appearance – such as no facial hair for men – and a dress code and other stuff.
It was creepy.
? Martin
@Major Major Major Major: Yeah, I’m not crazy about that attitude, TBH. But, we’ll see where things go.
There’s talk that California may sign onto the Paris Agreement if Trump pulls the US out of it. We’re not legally allowed to do that, but we might do it anyway just for the Supreme Court exposure and to demonstrate to the nation that CA will exceed the accords goals even without losing economic power. There’s a decent shot that California’s economy will pass the UK given Brexit, putting us 5th behind Germany. We’re also the 5th largest food producer on earth. To say that these environmental goals will hurt the economy is utter fucking bullshit. The Paris agreement says the US will reduce emissions 28% below 2005 levels by 2025. CA has already met the states 20% below 2009 goal by 2020 and has set a new goal of 40% below 2009 levels by 2030. We should have no problem meeting 28% of 2005 levels by 2025.
What’s more, we’ve attracted ⅔ of the nation’s venture capital going into clean energy and we are considering banning the sale of internal combustion engine vehicles by 2030. That means that there’s not only a huge market for EVs in California, but a lot of jobs going into EV development and related technologies and services. This can be a jobs positive transition if states fully buy into it. We’re planning on proving that.
Yoda Dog Democrat
@debbie: Yea, I saw that here on BJ I believe, that is too funny. I can’t even be mad at Putin, it’s like being mad at a scorpion or a great white shark…
waysel
@trollhattan: Thanks for the laugh. I needed it. “Because today’s the day the
Grizzly bears eat the students.”
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@Sab:
Which school systems did you and the boyfriend attend? I find it hard to believe that, in the ’80s, there was a public school system around here with- maybe, but probably not- a couple of exceptions.
Sab
How old (or young) are you? -Your comment suggests that you do not believe me or that you think I am lying. I am not lying. I cannot believe that you have lived in Grand Rapids and do not know this. Either you are very young and things have changed substantially, or you are a liar.
gene108
@Chris:
As long as most white people have serious “economic anxiety” issues caused by Latino and Asian immigration and Black Lives Matter, there is not a point in holding your breath.
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@Sab:
51. Graduated from Grand Rapids Ottawa Hills in 1983. My sister is three years younger. I’ve got friends and family from all over West Michigan. I’ve devoured news since I was in elementary school.
I’m thinking that you’re mistaken, and that you were in a private school whether you knew it or not. Or you were in Muskegon Heights or Benton Harbor- but their systems didn’t start crashing and burning until later in the ’90s.
Chris
@gene108:
Yeah, unfortunately, that’s basically my guess as well.
TriassicSands
Donald J. Trump nominate an unqualified person to fill a cabinet position?
Unpossible [sic].
DeVos is exactly what I’d expect from someone who knows nothing about education, nothing about government, and nothing about the government’s role in education.
Sab
@Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!): @Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!): Interesting.I am not lying and I guess you are not lying so we disagree about the GR schoolboard position in the 80s. Apparentlyvthings changed so much that you think I am nuts, which is a good thing.
EBT
@Major Major Major Major: If using tax payer money to continue to enforce equal protection and keeping disabled students in meaningful education is robbing then goddamn right sign me up.
Temporarily Max McGee (Until Death!)
@Sab:
So you went to a GRPS school? If so, which school(s)?
SgrAstar
@? Martin: Go Bears!
hellslittlestangel
Say what you want about DeVos, but some of her early stuff, like “Mongoloid” and “Jocko Homo,” was brilliant.
EBT
@hellslittlestangel: Beautiful World sure fits right now.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56u6g0POvo0
Freedom of Choice probably applies well to america now too though.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVGINIsLnqU
gene108
@Yarrow:
The financial upside to teaching, if there is one, was job security and a pension. The Great Recession killed job security for teachers. And many of the people, who lost their jobs were younger teachers, and the kids leaving high schools 5-6 years ago saw their older brothers or sisters getting canned.
Whatever incentive there was too teaching basically evaporated for a generation.
glory b
Late to this, but I’ll also note that teaching (and government employment in general) has had a huuuuge role in lifting African Americans into the middle class.
So, I guess it’s a two-fer for them.
laura
@Aleta: well when my Senator Diane Feinsteins husband was on both sides of the fire sales to essentially give away post offices all over America -including the Washington one that’s now Trump’s newest hotel, it makes sense from a business perspective. But for us who paid for them and consider them part of our commons, well, we don’t count.
PIGL
@gene108: The GOP/Red State/WWC problem with public schools? Black kids go to them. Look no further.
Well, some hate women and unions too.