Monday Evening Open Thread: Where Are Your Records, Donald?


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Apart from all the random noise, what’s on the agenda for the evening?

96 replies
  1. 1
    Yutsano says:

    He won’t release them. No point in badgering him about it now. That horse has sailed.

    No apologies for the mixed metaphor either.

  2. 2
    Cain says:

    On the other hand, @Yutsano, reporters will continue to do false equivalence. Maybe what they should do is focus on their own false equivalence as news and start badgering each other creating a different kind of horse race that ends in manure.

  3. 3
    some guy says:

    does Trump’s 7 figure donation to NAMBLA, or his overwhelming financial dependence on Russian oligarchs, or his illegal use of his trump Foundation as a slush fund disqualify him for the Presidency? The media’s failure to get answrs raises troubling questions.

  4. 4
    JDM says:

    With Trump’s doctor (and his constant lies), can anyone believe you’d get full and accurate medical info?

  5. 5
    Cain says:

    @efgoldman:

    Disagree here with our friend from the wrong coast. The Village may let him off the hook, but the campaign should hammer the living shit out of it – HRC in speeches, surrogates, commercials, debate, all of it. Pull a Harry Reid on the sumbitch. Don’t ask what he’s hiding, say affirmatively that he is hiding something, maybe the seven-figure contribution from the Trump Foundation to NAMBLA.

    Just tell them that there is a “whitey” tape where the whole thing is exposed and they are saving it for October. In fact, do it such that nobody is covering Trump but covering Hillary constantly “when did she know, and how did she know?” Just keep feeding it.. once Trump is off the front, it will drive him fucking crazy.

    One way to punish the guy is simply not give him the attention he craves until he gives up the doctors report… not that, that is going to happen.

  6. 6
    JPL says:

    @Yutsano: Rumor has it, that he is giving them to Dr. Oz. If that happens, the doctors name will be blacked out.

  7. 7
    Cain says:

    @some guy:

    One thing I want to know is if Democrats stage a complete media walkout and not listen to any of their crap, how much reliance do 24 hour news have on the aging conservative tv watching market that they can keep going? I mean it might be interesting to call for a complete media blackout for one week and see where it goes. It will frighten the shit out of them and set a precedent. Even better, the right will likely follow and do the same thing and instead go to their right wing news areas instead of MSM.

  8. 8
    Cain says:

    @JPL:

    Dr. Oz’s name should be blacked out too..

  9. 9
    James E Powell says:

    @efgoldman:

    The Village may let him off the hook, but the campaign should hammer the living shit out of it – HRC in speeches, surrogates, commercials, debate, all of it.

    With you all the way. The fact that Trump is hiding something or some things has to be common knowledge by the end of the month.

    I think the Harry Reid type line would be “Trump is scared we are going to find out he is not nearly as rich as he says he is.”

  10. 10
    raven says:

    “That horse has sailed”. I likey!

  11. 11
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Yutsano: Fucking Bronies.

  12. 12
    catclub says:

    @raven: That trojan horse has sailed over the wine-dark sea as rosy fingered dawn rises in the east.

  13. 13
    raven says:

    @efgoldman: Half way. I was able to do my normal swim today so that is good. No lifting for 3 more weeks so flying to Chicago this weekend should be fun. Fortunately Southwest has free bag check so I can wheel the suitcase and have them take it.

  14. 14

    @efgoldman: Not unless we get a fuck LBJ comment.

  15. 15
  16. 16
  17. 17
    hovercraft says:

    @some guy:
    And his position as the founding member of the Miniscule P e n ! s Guild.

  18. 18
    raven says:

    @efgoldman: Yea, I’m really ok. We’ve been doing the 2 mile walk at dawn and then my noon swim of bike at the Y. I’m just not supposed to lift much.

  19. 19
    Loneoak says:

    TNC’s latest is a must read.

    It’s all good, but holy mother of noodles I almost punched my computer when I read this part:

    The media’s criticism of Clinton’s claim has been matched in vehemence only by their allergy to exploring it. “Candidates should not be sociologists,” glibly asserted David Brooks on Meet The Press.

    DAVID BROOKS THINKS WE SHOULD CEASE IT WITH THE WEAK SOCIOLOGY ALREADY. THE UNIVERSE IS COLLAPSING ON ITSELF RIGHT EFFING NOW.

  20. 20
    Mike in NC says:

    He will never release his tax records and the media will never press him to do so.

  21. 21
    hovercraft says:

    @efgoldman:
    10 % of the contribution, so $2,500. His entire premise is that he’s a billionaire, so he scared that he will be revealed as the fraud he is. He is nowhere close to as rich as he says he is. They should ask him if since he says he’s audited every year, and there fore he can’t release his tax returns,does that mean as president he will not release his tax returns?

  22. 22
    Citizen_X says:

    @Cain:

    Dr. Oz’s name should be blacked out too.

    No, just the “Dr.” part.

  23. 23
    lollipopguild says:

    @catclub: After a Dark and Stormy night. It was the Best of Times it was the Worst of Times.

  24. 24
    SFAW says:

    @catclub:

    That trojan horse has sailed over the wine-dark sea as rosy fingered dawn rises in the east.

    “Sing, Muse, of the anger of the orange, ferret-headed shitgibbon, and his supporters”

    ETA: Or, for the pedants:
    μῆνιν ἄειδε θεὰ Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλῆος
    οὐλομένην, ἣ μυρί᾽ Ἀχαιοῖς ἄλγε᾽ ἔθηκε,

  25. 25
    D58826 says:

    Two generations of young journalists have waited and hoped for the opportunity to break a story like Watergate, esp if it involves the Clintons. Well according to Twitter today some lucky journalist has achieved the high honor of uncovering the latest ‘gate’ scandal . No not that Watergate but the fact that Hillary doesn’t like to drink water. (sigh)

    I agree that the campaign should have held a press conference about Hillary’s health on Friday night, just in time for the evening news. They should have announced that she has been diagnosed with the most contagious form of bubonic plague. And while all her staffers have been vaccinated against the disease, all of the reporters who finally got to meet her on the plane are going to die in the next 96 hours. Have a good weekend ladies and gentlemen of the press.

  26. 26
    dr. luba says:

    Stephen King ‏@StephenKing

    Breaking News: Reliable sources reveal that Donald Trump is actually Cthulu. The absurd hairdo isn’t absurd at all. It hides the tentacles.

  27. 27
    lollipopguild says:

    @D58826: Yes, really, yes.

  28. 28
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @catclub:

    That trojan horse has sailed over the wine-dark sea as rosy fingered dawn rises in the east comes up like thunder outer China ‘crost the Bay.

    (“Do you like Kipling?” “I don’t know, I’ve never kippled.”)

  29. 29
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @D58826:

    the fact that Hillary doesn’t like to drink water.

    Dehydrationgate.

  30. 30
    SFAW says:

    @hovercraft:

    He is nowhere close to as rich as he says he is.

    Liar! He’s at least a thousandaire, which is only 6 or so orders of magnitude away from being a billionaire.

  31. 31

    @dr. luba:

    It hides the tentacles

    A short-tentacled vulgarian?

  32. 32
    JPL says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: Josh Barro actually mentioned that Rubio drinks to much water and Hillary not enough. That means we need a third party.

  33. 33
    jl says:

    People think these tweeter jokes about HRC in iron lung or is brain in a vat are funny. They are not funny. NYT and AP will run headlines setting up new narrative arc for next couple of weeks: Clouds over HRC health status: is she really in an iron lung or a brain in a vat, press access issues raise questions!

    BTW, I heard media nitwits approvingly noting Trump’s graciousness (will it give him a BOOST, this graciousness!?) and his promise to release more health info, contrasting it with trust problems for HRC, with a damn soundbite of Trump saying he is obvs only willing to talk about releasing more health info because he knows it will be good.

    In trivial news that is not worth bothering about, I guess: Trump saying he doesn’t want moderators for the debates, and he names another conspiracy loon as one of his national security advisers.

    Jeebus!

  34. 34
    scav says:

    @Yutsano: What have you got against throwing dead horses anvils? Especially if the horse refuses to drink water without Kool-Aid.

  35. 35
    Cacti says:

    Nate Silver has gone to the dark side.

    Gives 2-day, paid, closed door presentation on battle ground states to a gathering of 3-dozen top Republican donors.

  36. 36
    PPCLI says:

    @JPL: Dr Oz? Wait for the headlines: “Trump Does Moslem Outreach! The Pivot Is On!”

  37. 37
    Chip Daniels says:

    @Yutsano:

    No point in badgering him about it now. That horse has sailed.

    No, no, no.
    Politely, but NO.

    If we have learned anything from the right, it is that persistent badgering and hectoring and working the refs DOES pay off.

    Argle bargle Whitewater, gibber squee Benghazi…
    Tireless hammering away at dead horses DOES make a change in the public perception of a thing.

  38. 38
    Miss Bianca says:

    @Yutsano: Good Heavens! That sounds like a positive “Aubreyism!” ; ) Well done, you – I am *so* stealing that line!

  39. 39
    CONGRATULATIONS! says:

    Nate Silver has gone to the dark side.
    Gives 2-day, paid, closed door presentation on battle ground states to a gathering of 3-dozen top Republican donors.

    @Cacti: Don’t quibble with the sentiment, just the proposed time frame. Back in 2012 when he decided to be a pundit, that’s when he went over. Who he’s working for is less relevant than what he’s doing.

  40. 40
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @efgoldman: I may have missed your update elsewhere, but how is your wife doing? And you’re right that the media and Democrats should badger the hell out of Trump for his refusal to be transparent and release his tax returns like other Presidential candidates. Secretary Clinton should have several ads about that issue alone. What is he hiding?

  41. 41
    hovercraft says:

    @SFAW:
    Okay I’ll concede your point, he’s at least a thousandaire, and maybe even a millionaire but no way a billionaire.

  42. 42
    cokane says:

    @Cacti: that’s … troubling. I’d even say so if it was a meeting of Democrats. Seems like a violation of journalistic ethics honestly

  43. 43
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Cacti: From the link:

    Attendees noted to The Hill that Silver gave them no advice on strategy.

    I could believe that although it makes you wonder why they’d pay him.

  44. 44
    SFAW says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Democrats should badger the hell out of Trump for his refusal to be transparent and release his tax returns like other Presidential candidates.

    Not to worry, Julian Assmange’ and his merry band of ex-KGBers WikiLeakers will get right on it.

  45. 45
    PPCLI says:

    Maybe we should just start lining up candidates to ask the Trump people about. Here’s one:

    ht*t*p:/*/*www.rawstory.com/2016/09/got-your-attention-didnt-it-oregon-trump-voter-brags-about-hanging-clinton-in-effigy/

    (Omit * for link)

    A guy who is displaying an effigy of Hillary, hanging from a crane, and refusing to take it down. So, Trump people, are we really not supposed to say this is deplorable?

    [Rhetorical advice — I would keep hammering on deplorable actions and deplorable statements, rather than arguing that *people* are deplorable. Just say that deplorable people are the ones that habitually and proudly act and talk in deplorable ways. And then shift the emphasis to the actions. Ask: Are we not allowed to deplore these actions, and call them what they are? Just keep reporting outrages and ask: can’t we even say that this is a deplorable thing to do/say?]

  46. 46
    Archon says:

    @Cacti:

    It was clear after Nate Silver’s his deplorable performance in the Republican primary (for the same meta-analysis issues he used to criticize others for, no less) that it was about the clicks and the dollars for him now, not about being an detached interpreter of polls anymore.

  47. 47
    Feebog says:

    So, like everything else, Trump is going to try to make a spectacle of releasing new health information. I assume the letter will come from the same quack who wrote the first letter. There will be little or no new information released, just a barrage of medical word salad and false assurances. Not. Holding. My. Breath.

  48. 48
    Cacti says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    I could believe that although it makes you wonder why they’d pay him.

    I could believe it if it was coming from the mouth of someone other than top Republican donors.

  49. 49
    lamh36 says:

    @JPL: which is actually pretty smart of the campaign if they do. Cause I’d bet ya that Dr Oz viewer demographic is almost the same numbers as Trump’s supporter numbers…

  50. 50
    JMG says:

    @Patricia Kayden: These groups just want to feel they’re getting the inside skinny, After 2012, they don’t trust their own data analysts and who can blame ’em.

  51. 51
    Immanentize says:

    @raven: I will see your Sailin’ Sir and raise you one Smooth. Smooth Sailin’!

  52. 52
    Anoniminous says:

    When, O Donald, do you mean to cease abusing our patience? How long is that madness of yours still to mock us? When is there to be an end of that unbridled audacity of yours, swaggering about as it does now?

  53. 53
    Cacti says:

    Mike Pence proves Clinton right.

    Declines to call David Duke deplorable during Wolf Blitzer interview.

  54. 54

    @Cacti:
    I get suspicious about anything involving Republican strategists, but I certainly would not blame him if they wanted to pay him large sums of money to tell them, in person, what they could get off his blog for free. It’s a very plausible scenario. There is nothing asshole rich people like more than sitting in a room with their buddies feeling like geniuses because someone who is famous for being A Smart Guy is giving them a private presentation.

  55. 55
    JPL says:

    Pence was on CNN a few minutes ago
    Wolf Blitzer: Would you call David Duke “deplorable”?
    Pence: “I’m not in the name calling business…”

  56. 56
    Mike J says:

    @Yutsano:

    That horse has sailed.

    Lyle

  57. 57
    JPL says:

    @Cacti: I’m always late to post.. Good job.

    Trump’s folks are trying not to use that word. Hopefully, the media doesn’t play along.

  58. 58
    Trentrunner says:

    The problem this cycle is not that Trump is undercovered (though he is).

    The problem is the fake narratives (dishonest, secretive, cold, et al.) about Hillary that have set in stone.

    As ably documented elsewhere, these propagated in the VRWC fever swamps, were pukefunneled into the mainstream, and now they form an institutionalized frame that the MSM uses unreflectively.

    I don’t think the country doesn’t know who Trump is. The problem–and the reason Hillary isn’t ahead by 15+ points–is that Hillary has been successfully slandered.

    Now we’re adding “sickly and frail” to the list. Just watch.

    I really don’t know what can be done about this.

  59. 59
    Mike J says:

    @Cacti:

    Fred Clark ‏@SlacktivistFred 15 minutes ago
    Priest at baptism: Do you renounce Satan and all his works?

    Mike Pence: I’m not into name-calling. …

  60. 60
    debbie says:

    @JPL:

    I Googled because I didn’t know what you were talking about. He’s releasing them on The Dr. Oz Show. How absurd, yet how typical.

    Googling further, I find that Dr. Oz identifies as a Republican who supports Democratic health policies.

  61. 61
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @PPCLI: There were quite a few nutters hanging President Obama in effigy in the last two elections so this isn’t even shocking anymore. Sadly true.

    @JPL: I wish you were joking.

  62. 62
    Origuy says:

    @JPL:

    Pence: “I’m not in the name calling business…”

    No, he just does it as a hobby.

  63. 63
    Anoniminous says:

    Hidden amidst all the SheDevilHasPlagueDeath! bullshit, AP has Clinton taking 273 Electoral Votes not including Iowa, Ohio, North Carolina, Florida, and Nevada totaling 74 EVS. I expect her to scoop Iowa, Ohio, Florida, and Nevada and have a good shot at NC . She is within the MOE in Georgia and Arizona (27 EVs) which I do not expect her to win.

    If she does win Georgia then Texas and Missouri (48 EVs) will be in play as this election has moved from bizarro-land to Looney-Tunes.

  64. 64
    Redshift says:

    @hovercraft:

    He is nowhere close to as rich as he says he is.

    Absolutely. The agreement from his roast was posted a while back, and one of the few things they were forbidden to joke about was that he wasn’t as rich as he claims. (For comparison, jokes about his creepy attraction to his daughter were okay.)

  65. 65
    PPCLI says:

    @debbie: Since Dr. Oz was raised a Moslem and retains a Turkish citizenship, perhaps he’ll take the occasion to ask some critical questions about that whole “Deport the Moslems” thing…
    Naw, of course not.

  66. 66
    JPL says:

    @Origuy: He can’t use the word deplorable because of the new Trump ads, but by not calling Duke deplorable, it looks worse. hmmm

  67. 67
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Trentrunner: It should be easy to show that Secretary Clinton is not sickly and frail. She just needs to be seen vigorously campaigning for the next two months which is something within her control once she gets over her bout of pneumonia.

    As to her trustworthiness, her supporters need to hit back against the song that the media and Republicans are singing. She’s trustworthier than her Orange Opponent. Everytime someone comes at you with “I just don’t trust her”, hit them with all of Trump’s scandals, including the ones which the media refuses to investigate. There is no way that Secretary Clinton is found wanting when it comes to truthfulness vis-a-vis Trump. We’ve seen him like with our own eyes.

  68. 68
    Steeplejack (tablet) says:

    Sopan Deb: “Something that I bet becomes a thing—last week, Trump told ABC that he would release his medical records first.”

    “Becomes a thing”? WTF does that even mean in this context? That this will become a “talking point,” or something that the press continues to bring up when talking to/about Trump? Good luck with that. Nothing else has become a thing except “Trump being Trump.” And that has had no apparent consequences in the media at all.

  69. 69
    hovercraft says:

    @efgoldman:
    Exactly, this is what Mark Cuban said a couple of months ago when he began his trashing of Trump. Real billionaires do not devise all sorts of petty ante schemes for nickels and dimes. If he’s the real estate big wig he says he is, he wouldn’t be doing stupid failing stuff like the steaks and water and all the seminars and the University scam. And today in the WaPost, there is a story about the Trump foundation paying for things for Trump himself, like a portrait of Trump himself to the tune of $22,000. This is not the behavior of a billionaire.

  70. 70
    Redshift says:

    @debbie: He’s releasing “the results of his physical,” not his medical records. I predict the “results” will include as much detail as the report from his personal physician.

  71. 71
    geg6 says:

    @Cacti:

    Amazing. Even the stupidest man on TV (well, Don Lemon hasn’t been on as long as Wolfie) can back these idiots into a corner.

  72. 72
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Mike J: He’s not into name calling but his running mate sure the hell is. “Crooked Hillary”, “Lying Ted”, “Little Marco Rubio”. I could go on and on. The man does nothing but lie and insult people. Pence should own that and stop acting as if he is so holy.

  73. 73
    dogwood says:

    @Frankensteinbeck:
    If republicans read the autopsy that the RNC produced after 2012, they would have a roadmap for general strategies. Paying Silver or anyone else for info that is free all over the web is a waste of money I can condone.

  74. 74
    hovercraft says:

    @Feebog:
    Can you picture it, two quacks and Trump first discussing the great health of the glorious leader, and the the three of them trashing Hillary. Good times.

  75. 75
    Mandalay says:

    Exiled Villager David Shuster is continues to make stuff up about Clinton:

    DNC delegate: If @HillaryClinton withdraws, every indication now committee will vote to replace with Biden.

    AFAIK the washed up loser Shuster is the only person in the country making this claim. We are expected to believe that in the entire media he alone gets this scoop? He’s not on the record discussing this, or writing any article. He’s just twittering his fabricated stories down the intertubes while safely pretending that he has an inside source who he must protect.

    Shuster isn’t mistaken – he’s lying.

  76. 76
    debbie says:

    @Redshift:

    It will be interesting to see if Oz asks for more details. Checking the local schedule, Trump will be on on Thursday for the full hour.

  77. 77
    debbie says:

    @efgoldman:

    Great news!

  78. 78
    Kay says:

    In other news, the Governor of Indiana is now afraid to denounce the KKK. This bar is dropping fast, I must say.

    Pence is on the fence on the KKK issue. Could go either way.

  79. 79
    Immanentize says:

    @Patricia Kayden: Pocahantes?

  80. 80
    Kay says:

    @Mandalay:

    How weird is it that all of media are pursuing these weird personal grudges against the Clintons.

    I’m bored with their personal/career problems.

  81. 81
    SFAW says:

    @hovercraft:

    but no way a billionaire

    No argument there.

    Unless billions in debt makes him a billionaire — then you and I might have to re-think.

    “Mr. Trump: Is it true that you call yourself a billionaire because you welshed on the billions you’ve owed people, and so therefore you have billions more than you would otherwise, were you an honest businessman?”

    Hilarity would ensue

  82. 82
    Trentrunner says:

    @Patricia Kayden: Helpful. Thanks. :)

  83. 83
    SFAW says:

    @efgoldman:

    Fine, thanks. Apparent false alarm,.

    Good. Glad to hear it.

  84. 84
    hovercraft says:

    @JPL:
    So David Duke is not worthy of the “name” deplorable, but it’s okay for him to call Hillary dishonest, accuse her of leaving the people in Benghazi to die. But he doesn’t believe in name calling unless it’s democrats.

  85. 85
    hovercraft says:

    @debbie:
    He’s a Hillary health truther.

  86. 86
    Mandalay says:

    @Kay:

    How weird is it that all of media are pursuing these weird personal grudges against the Clintons.

    Not really that weird in Shuster’s case: Hillary Clinton really went after him, and tried to get him fired, after he talked about “pimping out” Chelsea Clinton.

    Well good for her, and fuck Shuster forever for saying that.

  87. 87
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @debbie:
    @Redshift:

    Trump predicted his physical would show “large numbers”

    Weight? BP? LDL?

    and “hopefully very good statistics.”

    If precedent is anything to go by, they will all be extremely positive.

  88. 88
    JaneE says:

    @SFAW: And sent many glorious Republican souls straight to hell.

  89. 89
    Aleta says:

    @Cacti:

    (Nate Silver) Gives 2-day, paid, closed door presentation on battle ground states to a gathering of 3-dozen top Republican donors.

    Investment advice and racing tips. Politics is the new “sport of kings” throughout our land. But times are tougher now for the super wealthy: when they’re buying in-state manure, it better deliver a nice return crop.
    (Disappointed in Silver though.)

  90. 90
    Aleta says:

    @Kay: I’m having a hard time understanding them. Journalism school has become more like business school? The heros in their field now are the ones with big book contracts and speaker gigs?

  91. 91
    Aleta says:

    @Trentrunner: I sort of think it’s also about the entertainment value of rejection these days. And an audience with too much practice following signals in the script and voting someone off?

  92. 92
    The Very Reverend Crimson Fire of Compassion says:

    @dr. luba: the inauguration ceremony the acceptance speech.You’re welcome.

  93. 93
    Shana says:

    @efgoldman: Well, that’s a relief. Glad to hear it and hope you’re both back to normal.

  94. 94
    Original Lee says:

    @Patricia Kayden: They’re already claiming Clinton uses a body double (including on Sunday).

  95. 95
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Cacti: Interesting. I recall that he used to make a big deal about how he didn’t vote, and he didn’t think people in his line of business should, to maintain neutrality.

  96. 96
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @jl:

    People think these tweeter jokes about HRC in iron lung or is brain in a vat are funny. They are not funny. NYT and AP will run headlines setting up new narrative arc for next couple of weeks: Clouds over HRC health status: is she really in an iron lung or a brain in a vat, press access issues raise questions!

    I’ve slowly come to the realization that a lot of Bernie fans really truly hope that the Democratic Party will now replace her with Bernie Sanders. It’s Superdelegates II, the sequel, and it’s why some lefties are pushing the death’s-door angle really hard.

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