Your Exquisitely Calibrated Misogyny Detector

I missed the foofarah this weekend occasioned by Anne Laurie’s post on whether or not it was sexist or just routine competitor slagging for Bernie Sanders’ campaign manager to offer to interview Hillary Clinton to serve as VP. For the record, my initial take is no, it’s not sexist.

However, I thought several folks in that long thread, most notably Suzanne, made some great points about why reasonable people could interpret it that way. I’m still not convinced there was any sexist intent behind the remarks, but I do think angry dismissal of the question is counterproductive (and in many instances in that thread, downright dickish!).

Anyhoo, here’s a new public utterance upon which to test your exquisitely calibrated misogyny detector — remarks made by Donald Trump about blog-favorite Debbie Wasserman Schultz:

Trump on Monday knocked the chairwoman of the Democratic National Committee as a “highly neurotic woman.”

Trump criticized the debate process of his own party speaking with Breitbart News on Siriux XM radio, before he leveled personal barbs at the leader of the opposing party, DNC Chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz.

“This is a woman that is a terrible person,” Trump said of Wasserman Schultz after calling her “crazy” and a “highly neurotic woman.”

Yeah, that shit is sexist, IMO. While it’s true that men, or Woody Allen, anyway, are often described as “neurotic,” the term has a long and ugly history of successfully being used to portray women as emotionally unstable and therefore not credible and unfit to lead or make their own decisions.

Trump is an asshole, so of course he went there, and DWS fired back, calling him out for misogyny, which will surely boost esteem for Trump among the “PC has gone too far!” crowd. I’m certain he chose those words for maximum effect, showman that he is.

Discuss! Or talk about something else; open thread!

PS:  Please be patient with me while I figure out the new back-end formatting, particularly around images.






100 replies
  1. 1
    Keith G says:

    Please Donald, Do Not Make DWS A Rallying Point!!!

    I think the DNC would be better if she took a hike, but I bet we are saddled with her for one more year….Oh god!!!

  2. 2
    Ruckus says:

    tRump is running under the republican banner and has a long history of being a douchebag so to expecting him to say anything positive is the surprise to me. Not that he’s said much positive at all, just saying……

  3. 3
    NonyNony says:

    Wait – why is Trump attacking Wasserman Shultz at all?

  4. 4
    bemused says:

    @NonyNony:

    It’s instinctive with old, white, misogynist, loud mouth, know-it-all jackasses?

  5. 5
    Ruckus says:

    @Keith G:
    What’s that old saw about changing in mid stream?
    I’d also like to know exactly what the head of the DNC is supposed to do so that I could actually know if she’s doing a bad job or just not meeting my expectations.

  6. 6
    beltane says:

    Trump must be hanging out at DKos these days.

  7. 7
    Keith G says:

    @NonyNony: It may by 11th dimensional chess. By attacking her, he solidifies her flagging support and we are stuck with a substandard chairbeing for even longer.

  8. 8
    NonyNony says:

    @Ruckus: Fundraising mostly. Some media appearances. Figuring out how to distribute funds raised by the DNC to races across the country. And keeping a lot of Democratic politicians happy simultaneously. Also being the designated scape goat for the Democratic base to chew on when the party doesn’t do well in elections.

    It’s a shit job as far as I can tell. Much like the RNC chair, except that the DNC has more pull with Democratic pols because there aren’t as many billionaires lining up with Brinks Trucks to fund Democratic SuperPACs.

  9. 9
    Keith G says:

    @NonyNony: @Ruckus:
    Yes fund raising, but it is so much more than that. The national Democratic Party seems adrift and is actually losing ground to conservative forces in some key areas. I would like some indication that the DNC realizes this and has begun to put together some ideas of what to do about it. This seems well beyond DWS’s interests/capabilities – unless I am missing something.

  10. 10
    trollhattan says:

    @NonyNony:
    Probably because he awoke to find that yet another day, water remains wet.
    And 99% of Trump supporters responded, “Who?!?”

  11. 11
    WereBear says:

    The way to test is to do this:

    “This is a man that is a terrible person,” Trump said of Wasserman Schultz after calling him “crazy” and a “highly neurotic man.”

    And if it sounds weird… then yes. He’s sexist.

  12. 12
    MattF says:

    Well, I was happily not giving a shit about Debbie Wasserman Schultz, and now Trump goes and attacks her. Tsk.

  13. 13
    Peale says:

    The “crazy” part is probably sexist. The “neurotic” part is anti-Semitic.

  14. 14
    Punchy says:

    which will surely boost esteem for Trump among the “PC has gone too far!” crowd

    This is genius, really. Anything to boost Trump’s numbers. More Trump means more heartburn for the filthy rich, some which may keel over with myocardial infarctions. More headaches for Rinsed Prius. More clowncar behavior in plain view of the small percetage of actually undecided voters.

    Just keep poking that faux dragon.

  15. 15

    I thought ruemara had a good point in the post above that — because the comment took the same form as most sexist comments (i.e. it was condescending and a couple of other things), it pinged people’s radar to check it for sexist content as well. I don’t think it was sexist, but I understand why it was borderline for some women.

    (Though the woman quoted in the actual story was way over the top, IMO. The comment was a little hinky, not obviously misogynist.)

  16. 16
    Calouste says:

    If Trump had a greater vocabulary, he could have eliminated all doubt and called DWS “hysterical”.

  17. 17
    NonyNony says:

    @Keith G:

    The national Democratic Party seems adrift and is actually losing ground to conservative forces in some key areas.

    The problem is the state-level parties. The national party is not a powerful organization – it’s a fundraising operation and it tries to funnel money to races but that’s about all it does. The state-level parties are where attention is sorely needed. If we had better state-level parties, the national party would be better also.

    I don’t think that the DNC has much in the way of power and influence. What they’ve got is the ability to raise and spend money on behalf of campaigns in a way that individual campaigns cannot due to campaign finance restrictions. That’s the extent of the power and influence of the national party. If a candidate or a state party wants to let them spend the money and then tell the national party to go pound sand, sand gets pounded.

  18. 18
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/why-hillary-clinton-is-pushing-to-reignite-democrats-in-arkansas/2015/07/18/07a7b9ea-2cbc-11e5-a250-42bd812efc09_story.html

    Clinton aides say they are trying to build a broad national coalition that extends well beyond the states that vote early in the primary. Last month, the campaign said it had dispatched 51 organizers to build volunteer networks in the 46 non-early states and had held or scheduled 320 organizing meetings there.

    Arkansas Democratic Party chairman Vincent Insalaco said the prospect of Clinton being at the top of the ticket in 2016 has made it easier to recruit Democrats to run for state and local offices.

    “It’s not going to happen overnight, but we need to start recruiting good Democratic candidates and then running them at every level,” Clinton said.

  19. 19
    benw says:

    @Calouste: Too bad he didn’t remember to compare her to his crazy wife that he keeps locked in the attic of the manor house of his hereditary English estate.

    But seriously, one nice thing about Trump is that we all know by now that he will never, ever apologize. So everyone can skip doing the whole faux outrage, claim to be misquoted, demand for apology, issuing of insincere apology, attack the media dance. Having said that though, Trump is a major league asshole.

  20. 20

    95% of Americans might know HRC and 80 % might know Trump but DWS? 20% maybe? I’m thinking 20 % in her district. Trump is smart PR wise but not sure what this is about. BTW, Trump has been around some crazy women given all these comments from him. Probably crazy due to him.

  21. 21
    Brachiator says:

    Yep, Trump lashing out at Wasserman Schultz as “crazy” and “highly neurotic” is sexist, and also has a tinge of anti-semitism.

    A CNN story also noted that “Trump again on Monday slammed CNBC moderator John Harwood as a “sleaze” for his questions.”

    Trump’s method is always to go for the personal and nasty, and then to only slightly back away if called out on it. And I think that to some degree, this crudeness is natural to Trump, because he is a thin-skinned counter-puncher. To this extent, he is as much, or more, a cheap shot artist as he is a sexist.

  22. 22
    Jamey says:

    Cornyn a Klanner? Can anybody confirm or deny this report (not the findings, but whether the report is legit).

  23. 23
  24. 24
    dedc79 says:

    If this follows the pattern by which the media deals with racist statements by politicians, I expect we’ll soon be told that calling someone a misogynist is way worse than any “perceived” misogyny in Trump’s statement.

  25. 25
    lol says:

    @NonyNony:

    THIS THIS THIS

    State parties are all kinds of fucked up but you’ll never see any of the progressives complaining here actually get involved in them. They’re just going to bitch and moan that DNC Jesus hasn’t swooped in and solved all their problems.

  26. 26
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Brachiator:

    Trump’s method is always to go for the personal and nasty

    I believe everything Trump does is to settle some personal score. Someone here said that Trump is determined to derail the Jeb! campaign because a few years ago Jeb interfered in some business deal of his in Florida. He doesn’t debate based on political differences, he debates over personal grudges.
    He’s like Santa Nixon. He has a list of everyone who’s been naughty and nice.

  27. 27
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @WereBear: I’m surprised he didn’t call her “hysterical”

  28. 28
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Jamey: Anonymous is a dicey source, so it could go either way. Personally, I suspect this revelation is bullshit, not because the politicians in question aren’t scum-buckets — they are — but because it doesn’t make any sense for someone with actual power and influence to join the KKK these days. It used to be a pretty powerful regional force, but it’s all downscale losers these days.

    ETA: They were always racist losers, of course, but pillars of the community used to be in their ranks back in the day. Now, not so much.

  29. 29
    max says:

    (Do italics work?)
    Yeah, that shit is sexist, IMO. While it’s true that men, or Woody Allen, anyway, are often described as “neurotic,”

    I’m pretty sure that’s first and foremost an anti-semitic dog whistle because Trump has been staying away from the anti-female thing, but of course, it’s likely BOTH!

    However, I thought several folks in that long thread, most notably Suzanne, made some great points about why reasonable people could interpret it that way. I’m still not convinced there was any sexist intent behind the remarks,

    I’m sure it was intended to be assholish – whether that was misogynistic assholery I cannot say. I AM sure that anything that could be possibly be interpreted as misogynistic (and a few things that cannot even get that far) will be. It’s a political campaign and Hillary is trying to pick up as many women as possible so that’s going to be their go-to attack, which no doubt some (only a few unless things get very intense) male Democrats and every Republican will more than match.

    That’s the way of it.

    max
    [‘As for DWS, the less said the better.’]

  30. 30
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @lol: don’t you think this is a step in the right direction?

    Last month, the campaign said it had dispatched 51 organizers to build volunteer networks in the 46 non-early states and had held or scheduled 320 organizing meetings there.

  31. 31
    Keith G says:

    @NonyNony:

    If we had better state-level parties, the national party would be better also.

    Well, then I guess that we are fucked.

    The national GOP was active in states throughout the 80s and 90s, doing things both large and small to nurture a better political environment. That is one reason why over 70% of state legislatures are run by the GOP. If the Democrats’ only choice is to wait until a couple of dozen state parties (on their own) get their shit together, then I am afraid that there is no good end to this story.

    We are not in good shape. Whatever we are doing needs to be changed, unless one likes this status quo.
    Edit
    @lol: Some of us do spend time working state and local political matters – both campaigning and planning.

    But again…assuming that the status guo is not good, outline a possible fix.

  32. 32
    Yatsuno says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: I’d like to think he’s smarter than that. Although something tells me words to that effect were on his brain.

  33. 33

    @mai naem mobile:

    Believe it or not, DWS is a huge target for Rush and Fox News. They spend a lot of time fulminating about her, so much so that I’d bet that more registered Republicans know who she is than registered Democrats.

    So this Trump comment is more red meat for the Republican talk radio base.

  34. 34
    RaflW says:

    This one is tough. Well, the sexism isn’t tough to detect, I mean Donald is a jerk and a bore and clearly belittling DWS.

    But the tough part is, many of us kinda agree with the underlying issue. Still, saying “This is a woman that is a terrible person,” is beyond the pale. She is fairly terrible at her job. That does not make her personhood “terrible.” Sheesh.

  35. 35
    NotMax says:

    Barkers gonna bark.

  36. 36
    Geeno says:

    I always wondered why the 50 state strategy was blown off when it was.

  37. 37
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Geeno:

    The Democratic National Committee on Saturday released the interim findings of a review intended to examine problems in the midterm election. The report said Democrats lack a “cohesive narrative” and recommended that the party find ways to help it explain bedrock values such as fairness, equality and opportunity.
    […]

    The report recommends a multiyear effort to prepare for the next round of congressional redistricting after the 2020 elections, wary of Republican clout in statehouses that will determine the new boundaries for members of Congress following the next census.

    It calls for more financial support and training for state parties in a return to the principles behind the “50-state strategy” promoted by former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean, who led the DNC from 2005 to 2009. That approach aimed to compete in state and local elections throughout the country, even in states dominated by Republicans.

    http://www.dailykos.com/story/.....-Strategy#

  38. 38
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @bemused: Pretty much my take on it. The Donald cannot help himself, and besides, the scum that constitutes the GOP base laps that shit up like it was pudding.

  39. 39
    planetjanet says:

    @Mike J: Wow. What a great tool. Thanks for providing that.

  40. 40
    Patricia Kayden says:

    Trump saying crazy things is not news anymore. It would be more shocking if he said something that made sense.

    DWS hasn’t really been an effective DNC chairperson so hopefully she steps down after next November (if not sooner). Dr. Howard Dean was brilliant with his 50-state plan. Would love to see him reclaim the chairmanship and plan an effective get-out-the vote strategy for the 2018 mid-term elections.

  41. 41
    NotMax says:

    Please be patient with me

    You new here?

    ;·)

  42. 42
    Turgidson says:

    @benw:

    Since he said it himself, and not in a Tweet, he’ll stand behind it 100% and probably rise in the GOP primary polls for it. I’m still a little disappointed in Trump for saying the Tweet accusing Iowa voters of having brain damage was sent by an intern without his approval. What a loser!

  43. 43
    J.D. Rhoades says:

    @benw:

    Agreed on all points. Never demand apologies you know you aren’t going to get. It makes you look weak and ineffective.

  44. 44
    sharl says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    Anonymous is a dicey source, so it could go either way. Personally, I suspect this revelation is bullshit, not because the politicians in question aren’t scum-buckets — they are — but because it doesn’t make any sense for someone with actual power and influence join the KKK these days.

    Journalist Adrian Chen had lots of encounters with the U.S. contingent of Anonymous back when he worked for Gawker, and he is inclined to agree.

    Adrian Chen @AdrianChen

    i’ve obtained information proving every member of anonymous is in the kkk. [pastebin that says: “all of anonymous is kkk”] #opkkk

    Adrian Chen @AdrianChen

    Reminder: Anonymous is bad and dumb {link to Nov.2014 article in the Nation by Chen} #OpKKK

    Note that Chen has tangled in the past with academic researcher Gabriella Coleman, who is more sympathetic to Anonymous. FWIW, I respect them both, and since Coleman writes a lot more about Anonymous in other nations, I’m not sure they disagree as much as it appears, since Chen sticks to the U.S. domestic version of Anonymous, which has really screwed the pooch on several occasions.

  45. 45
    Mike J says:

    @planetjanet: It’s a great way to see if an insult is gendered, even if that wasn’t the inspiration for the tool. One sign of a great general purpose tool is when people come up with new uses for it.

  46. 46
    J.D. Rhoades says:

    @Patricia Kayden:

    Dr. Howard Dean was brilliant with his 50-state plan. Would love to see him reclaim the chairmanship and plan an effective get-out-the vote strategy for the 2018 mid-term elections.

    Probably not going to happen. The Clintonistas apparently hate Dr. Dean.

  47. 47
    geg6 says:

    @lol:

    Speak for yourself. I’m involved at every level, municipal, county, state and federal. I work my ass off for the party and have for over 30 years.

  48. 48
    cmorenc says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    whether or not it was sexist or just routine competitor slagging for Bernie Sanders’ campaign manager to offer to interview Hillary Clinton to serve as VP. For the record, my initial take is no, it’s not sexist.

    I agree that it’s not sexist as applied to HRC, but it is rather dick-swaggeringly arrogant of the Sanders campaign to be attempting such presumptuous trash-talk at the current state of the race from their position. This is the kind of move Chris Christie or Ted Cruz might make over on the GOP side with nothing but chutzpah to back it up, but for Bernie’s campaign to do so, they’re stepping on one of the key character traits that has made him appealing beyond just hard-core progressive ideologues – projecting strength and resolve without succumbing to the pitfall of personal arrogance.

  49. 49
    geg6 says:

    @cmorenc:

    Too many bro types involved in that campaign. I could have easily been swayed to feeling the Bern. But the bully/bro contingent of his supporters make me ill. He needs to get rid of the ones that are actually working for his campaign and tell the ones who aren’t to shut the hell up, assholes.

  50. 50
    Keith G says:

    @Mike J: I guess he might have done better calling her crazy, since the graphs flip.

  51. 51
    Gimlet says:

    http://prospect.org/article/sh.....an-society

    In a reversal of earlier trends, death rates among white non-Hispanic Americans in midlife increased sharply between 1999 and 2013, according to a new study by economists Anne Case and Angus Deaton, winner last month of the Nobel Prize for economics.

    The increased deaths were concentrated among those with the least education and resulted largely from drug and alcohol “poisonings,” suicide, and chronic liver diseases and cirrhosis. This midlife mortality reversal had no parallel in any other industrialized society or in other demographic groups in the United States.

  52. 52

    @J.D. Rhoades:

    It doesn’t have to be Dean himself running it again, but the Clintonistas don’t have the power they did in 2008 anyway. If we’re going with the data-driven Obamanauts, I think they’ll probably want a 50-state strategy or something like it.

  53. 53
    Ksmiami says:

    @Jamey: it would be irresponsible not to speculate…

  54. 54
    Betty Cracker says:

    @J.D. Rhoades: I thought it was the Obama people who disliked Dean? Maybe he doesn’t get along with anyone, but he was still right about the 50 state strategy, IMO.

  55. 55
    Yatsuno says:

    @geg6:

    I could have easily been swayed to feeling the Bern.

    Oddly enough I never was. Besides the fact that he’s not a Democrat and is campaiging to become the leader of a party he has open contempt for, I always thought he was more effective as a Senator. Now I can see he’s tilting at windmills. What scares me more is that once he’s out there will be no push from him to have his supporters go to the winning side. And he might be forgetting that should be win he needs our votes. I’m not forgetting we will need all of his or else the Supreme Court is literally going to be the death of this country.

  56. 56
    Gimlet says:

    @Gimlet:

    Would have figured lung cancer and cigarette-related respiratory failure in there too.

  57. 57
    Mike J says:

    @geg6:

    He needs to get rid of the ones that are actually working for his campaign and tell the ones who aren’t to shut the hell up, assholes.

    Check them out on Reddit. The berners are a real he-man woman haters club.

  58. 58
    NotMax says:

    @Gimlet

    Would certainly classify Russia as an industrialized society, and its population has been decreasing way, way beyond numbers leaving due to emigration. Lowering of life expectancy there has been documented multiple times during the years cited.

  59. 59
    Brachiator says:

    Semi O/T Just ran across this. A little counter to sexism

    Watch The Inspiring Movie ‘CODEGIRL’ For Free On YouTube Until November 5th

    As an extension of Google’s “Made With Code” project, the new documentary is being shared, free of charge, on YouTube until November 5th. The film will be in theaters in the next few weeks.

    http://techcrunch.com/2015/11/.....w8iu5:kRgW

  60. 60
    Keith G says:

    @Yatsuno:

    What scares me more is that once he’s out there will be no push from him to have his supporters go to the winning side.

    My goodness, he actually has said something this awful?

  61. 61
    CONGRATULATIONS! says:

    Sanders: borderline

    Trump: blew through the border like it wasn’t even there.

    Clinton’s campaign has been very, very nice to Sanders. He might want to think about returning the favor. Slagging her only benefits Republicans.

    What scares me more is that once he’s out there will be no push from him to have his supporters go to the winning side.

    @Yatsuno: Precisely. He – and more precisely, his supporters – need to get on board. This is not the “elect Bernie or nobody” election, it’s the “get any fucking Democrat you can in the White House because the alternative is so horrendous I don’t even want to think about it” election.

    If Sanders is the nominee, I vote for him happily. Same for Clinton.

  62. 62
    NotMax says:

    @Yatsuno

    Do believe that Sanders is astute enough to recognize modern Republicans for what they are (not what they profess to be) and will aggressively push his supporters in the correct direction when/if that crossroads is reached.

  63. 63
    Betty Cracker says:

    @NotMax: I agree. He implied as much when the topic of an independent bid came up — he said he’d never play spoiler because that would help some right wing Republican take the White House and damage the country. My sense is that Sanders knows exactly what’s at stake and will do his part to avoid the catastrophe of a Republican win.

  64. 64

    @Gimlet:

    I remember hearing in the wake of the 2008 crash that a lot of people in their 50s were trying to get on SSI because they were experiencing a lot of age discrimination and couldn’t find new jobs even when the recovery started. So unfortunately I’m not surprised to see that study at all.

  65. 65
    Ella in New Mexico says:

    “This is a woman that is a terrible person,” Trump said of Wasserman Schultz after calling her “crazy” and a “highly neurotic woman.”

    Ok, now THERE’s your dog whistle. This is on par with “Obama loves fried chicken and watermelon”.

    Not the Bernie Sanders thing, however. That was equal opportunity politics.

  66. 66
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @Betty Cracker: Anonymous disavowed the pastebin post.

  67. 67
    dogwood says:

    @Yatsuno:
    If Bernie becomes president he won’t be the leader of the party. It’s one of the reasons I don’t support him. Barack Obama will have to do all the party shit.

  68. 68
    Gimlet says:

    Republican presidential candidate and former Florida Gov. Jeb Bush wants everyone to know he is one tough cookie. He told Bloomberg News on Saturday that he eats nails when he wakes up — and then has breakfast.

  69. 69
    Another Holocene Human says:

    Anti Semitic. Trump knows what he’s doing.

  70. 70
    CONGRATULATIONS! says:

    The increased deaths were concentrated among those with the least education and resulted largely from drug and alcohol “poisonings,” suicide, and chronic liver diseases and cirrhosis. This midlife mortality reversal had no parallel in any other industrialized society or in other demographic groups in the United States.

    @Gimlet: Oh yes there is, and I can’t believe the study’s researchers ignored it. Russia, after the collapse of the Soviet Union. Exact same deal.

  71. 71
    dogwood says:

    @max:
    “Trump has been staying away from the anti-female thing”
    Do you mean since Megyn Kelly or did you miss that misogynist spectacle?

  72. 72
    Gimlet says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone):

    in the wake of the 2008 crash that a lot of people in their 50s were trying to get on SSI

    The phenomenon goes back to 1999 according to the article.

  73. 73
    goblue72 says:

    @NotMax: He’s more than astute enough. He is no Ralph Nader. Nader cared only about his own ego and not for any of the “regular people” on whose behalf he ostensibly claimed he was running.

    Sanders has a long history of caring about the economic circumstances of working stiffs and the poor. He’s been quite clear that he is not going to play a spoiler. He’s running to win and if he loses, he will most surely support whomever is the Democratic nominee. He has long been a fairly consistently loyal associate of the Democratic caucus, from the Progressive wing (which Progressive caucus is now the larger caucus within the Democratic caucus)

    The pissing and moaning that “he’s not a member of the Democratic Party” is just that – pissing and moaning. He’s an accepted member of the caucus – and he certainly was more than welcomed as party of the membership count in terms of control of the Senate. If for some insane reasons he decides to go rogue – then sure, he should be kicked to the curb. But not until then.

  74. 74
    A guy says:

    Thing about most chicks with an agenda is that no matter what a guy says the will find some way to call it a sexist comment. Best thing to so is ignore them. Drives them bat shit crazy. Which they are. Which is sexist I guess

  75. 75
    Betty Cracker says:

    @dogwood: Trump’s comments about Fiorina were sexist as hell too. He’s a sexist knob through and through — he can’t even offer a sincere compliment to a woman without objectifying her, not even his own daughter.

  76. 76
    goblue72 says:

    @Mike J: Seriously – you are referring to a sub-group on Reddit as evidence of a misogynistic skew to a candidate’s supporters. Reddit as a whole is a petri dish of misogyny. There’s probably a Gloria Steinem fan group on Reddit that is composed mostly of misogynists.

    Jesus, people. Get a grip.

  77. 77
    Gimlet says:

    @Gimlet:

    Wonder if the changes to the social safety net in the Reagan – Clinton years are the background to this?

  78. 78
    Keith G says:

    @goblue72:

    Jesus, people. Get a grip.

    But..but..but somebody with a “Feel the Burn” button said something mean about Hillary. So many micro aggressions, so little time.

  79. 79
    Keith G says:

    @Gimlet:

    Wonder if the changes to the social safety net in the Reagan – Clinton years are the background to this?

    Also too:
    1) The AIDS epidemic – trust me on this
    2) Lawyers and the spread of storefront SSI advocates

  80. 80
    goblue72 says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: Sadly, that report came out in February 2015. And so far, I haven’t seen anything coming out from the DNC that they are taking any of the recommendations in that report to heart. DWS is still head of the DNC and still doing an awful job at it. The DNC is flailing about trying to robocall and email spam Democratic supporters on a daily basis with ridiculous over the top “the world is on fire” statements as reasons why everyone should just give them money. There’s no sense of overall plan or strategy, or a consistent thematic message. Its a hot mess.

    The task force for the report include Gov Steve Beshear – a Democrat who knows how to win in a Republican state, and Eric Schmidt, former long-time CEO of Google, a long-time advisor to this guy called Barack Obama. But I fully expect the Tringulation-R-Us folks in the party (Rahm, DWS, and other long-time Clintonistas) to ignore and continue to pursue a Republican-lite / swing-voter strategy that only sorta-kinda works once every years and then only for the Presidential election, but doesn’t really work for Senate or House races (let alone, state leg races)

  81. 81
    Brachiator says:

    I missed the foofarah this weekend occasioned by Anne Laurie’s post on whether or not it was sexist or just routine competitor slagging for Bernie Sanders’ campaign manager to offer to interview Hillary Clinton to serve as VP.

    BTW, I don’t think these comments were sexist, nor the comments about “shouting” about gun control. And cynical me thinks that Team Clinton deliberately made the charge in order to peel away some of Bernie’s heroic shine.

    Because the Clintons know how to fight dirty, just as much as Trump does. And I say this as someone who currently supports Clinton.

    BTW, back in June 2008, Team Clinton floated this:

    Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton has told supporters that she would agree to be Senator Barack Obama’s running mate if he offered her the vice presidential spot.

    Of course, nobody was asking and this was seen as an attempt to pressure Obama into considering Clinton for the ticket. Happily, he did not bite. And later, Clinton supporter Debbie Wasserman Schultz (remember her?) announced that a letter suggesting such had been withdrawn.

    “According to Florida Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, the supporters felt the letter would be misunderstood as them demanding the Illinois senator choose Clinton. ‘We’ve decided to communicate our views informally,’ Schultz said Thursday.”

    Pushy? Imperious? Privileged? Racist?

    Politics is nasty business when played by friend or foe.

    But even though, I do not think that Sander’s remarks were sexist, I can understand that some might take it that way. That is the sad thing about the issue. Even some remarks that might be neutral when said about a male can be sexist when directed at a woman, because the context is different.

  82. 82
    goblue72 says:

    @CONGRATULATIONS!: Who are these people saying that? Random anonymous posters on Reddit? A handful of cranks on DKOS (the same type of cranks who 8 years ago called themselves PUMAs and refused to vote for Obama if Clinton didn’t get the nom?)

    Again: Clue, go find one.

  83. 83
    Mike in NC says:

    JEB! has slipped to 5th place in Florida, behind Cruz now. Should be a fun week!

  84. 84
    Brachiator says:

    @Mike in NC: Wow! Now its Rubio to Rise. Ha ha ha.

  85. 85
    Goblue72 says:

    @Mike in NC: And his new campaign slogan is trending on Twitter in a classic Jeb backfire fashion –

    http://www.wired.com/2015/11/b.....-big-time/

  86. 86
    sparrow says:

    @Brachiator: Anti-semitic? Really?

    I honestly don’t honestly think, as a woman, that we want to lay exclusive claim to ‘neurotic’ by saying it’s a sexist slur. I get the history, I do, but there are legitimately neurotic people! Americans in general are particularly neurotic, it’s like our national disease. (see: every recent play about modern life in American suburbs).

  87. 87
    Anoniminous says:

    @Mike in NC:

    JEB! is …

    Iowa: 5th
    NH: 5th
    Ohio: 7th (!)
    Ca: 5th
    Pa: 5th
    SC: 6th
    NJ: 5th
    NV: 5th

    and 4th in National polling with 7.5% support.

  88. 88
    Elie says:

    Trump WANTS to be called sexist. Maybe he needs to be laughed at and told he aint all that — that he is in no place to tell anyone else what to do with that dead possum on his head — oh by the way, did he know you had a dead possum on his head? Why did his wife let him go out the house with that thing on his head?…

    All this conversation about what an ignorant pig face thinks..

    As for DWS, she passed her sell by date a while ago. The 2014 midterms just did me in with her where Democrats were encouraged to run away from winning policies. We need someone else, but as has been said, we are stuck with her through the next election.

  89. 89

    Oh hee. I see the Democrats are negotiating taking the spot with Telemundo that the Republicans flounced away from. It’s for a forum, not debate.

  90. 90
    Brachiator says:

    @sparrow:

    Anti-semitic? Really?

    Yeah. It’s a New York thing.

  91. 91
    A guy says:

    Trump is not a sexist. The women are weak

  92. 92
    Kay says:

    Every national Democrat should be out making fun of the GOP for focusing on their campaigns and the stupid debates. No one outside of political junkies and the GOP base gives a shit about debate rules.

    Don’t respond to Donald Trump. Instead, take the giant opening Republicans (including Donald Trump) just handed you and beat them over the head with it. Why are they talking about their stupid campaigns and who gets what amount of time and how everyone has to have an open and closing statement? Who cares about that outside of them and political media? No one.

  93. 93
    Kay says:

    I mean, God almighty, this stuff is just great for Democrats:

    Team Carly not signing: “We do not care whether it’s 67 degrees or our green room isn’t as plush as another candidate.”

    How long are the GOP candidates planning on talking about themselves? Really? They’re planning on spending a week on debate negotiations? That’s bad! That’s a bad thing for candidates to do, because it isn’t about voters!

  94. 94
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Kay: That’s longer than any of them have spent on policy development. Because IGMFU says most of it, and the rest is stomp those lazy poors and people of color.

  95. 95
    max says:

    @dogwood: Do you mean since Megyn Kelly or did you miss that misogynist spectacle?

    Not as all – post-insulting Kelly he dialed down and then laid off the hyper-explicit sexism – i.e. he didn’t think that particular backlash was worth it. (He’s also dropped the extreme harshness of his anti-Hispanic remarks. That is, no replay of the ‘Mexicans and rapists and thugs’ line.)

    He moved on to insulting other people, in other ways.

    max
    [‘Ergo, the anti-DWS remark wasn’t intended as that particular kind of attack. It was an intended as another harsh dog whistle.’]

  96. 96
    Kay says:

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):

    This new format is wild. Does your screen go black when you post? I don’t mind it, but it’s a little jarring. I thought “OMFG, I broke it and it’s brand new”. I was ready to run away.

  97. 97
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Kay: It goes black (deep gray, to be pedantic) when you post and also when you refresh. Disconcerting, still. And I’m gonna have real trouble learning to live with the quick swoop up to a linked post. But you missed the real hot mess of last night – it’s 50 shades better than then. With some issues remaining. But clearly lots of hard work went into it.

  98. 98
    Cervantes says:

    @Keith G:

    Surely that’s just two-dimensional chess, three-dimensional at best.

  99. 99
    Keith G says:

    @Cervantes: The Donald would never limit himself to just two or three dimensions.

  100. 100
    Chris T. says:

    Shouldn’t your second element be “Cr” (Chromium), as in B. Cr. ? For that matter, your first maybe should be Beryllium (“Be”)…

    (I suppose Erbium is rarer though, perhaps that’s more compelling :-) )

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