All of your family had to kill to survive

Jeb!’s pathetic attempt to defend W against Trump is a good example of why the Bushes don’t get tough with anyone, their campaign operatives do. Sure, all presidential campaign managers are probably sleazeballs, but Rove and Atwater have to be the nastiest in recent memory. I had always figured that push came to shove with Trump et al., Jeb! would have some hard pipe-hitting wingers go to work on the homes with a pair of pliers and a blow-torch. But it looks like the real assholes are working for Rubio:

“South Carolina is known for its viper-pit political culture, dirty tricks, and all that stuff,” said journalist Corey Hutchins, who covered the state for many years. But, he said, the strategists now working for Rubio always seemed especially mesmerized by the local mythology around mudslinging and mischief-making. “Terry Sullivan and Wesley Donehue worked together at one point in a consulting firm in downtown Columbia, and I’m pretty sure I remember a Lee Atwater poster on the wall in Wesley’s office.

I like this picture. It looks a little like they photoshopped two iPhones into a promo photo for Nashville Skyline.

longform-8318-1445616855-13






123 replies
  1. 1
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    that fashion photo of Wesley Donahue!

    What is it with right-wing operatives and the whole retro look?

  2. 2
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: I think he should have gone with a lighter-colored pocket square. I’d have picked something in the yellow-orange spectrum, myself. Navy just seems like a faux-pas.

  3. 3
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Gin & Tonic: That’s just the thing: They go for the retro thing, but they never quite do it right… end up looking like they’re in a high school play set in the 1940s… Maybe “Our Town”

  4. 4
    gogol's wife says:

    He looks just like the actor playing the sexually predatory Wing Commander on Home Fires. But I’m sure he doesn’t speak like him.

  5. 5

    @Germy Shoemangler: Unfortunately, they can’t pull it off, they are no Jon Hamm.

  6. 6
    MomSense says:

    @Germy Shoemangler:

    Is this an actual person who dresses like this in real life? It’s not an extra from a Masterpiece series?

  7. 7

    @gogol’s wife: Are you still watching Indian Summers or have you given up on it?

  8. 8
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @MomSense: They want to look the part for this new gilded age.

  9. 9
    NotMax says:

    The “Gene Kelly in Inherit the Windlook is not working.

  10. 10
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    And I thought Tucker Carlson ruined the bowtie for all of those guys. Thought they’d be ashamed to wear one.

  11. 11
    gogol's wife says:

    @gogol’s wife:

    I guess people here would know him as Anguy on Game of Thrones.

  12. 12
    gogol's wife says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    I gave up on it 15 minutes into the first episode. I really haven’t looked back. I like Home Fires, and that’s about enough for me on Sunday nights. Are you watching IS?

  13. 13
    rikyrah says:

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    10. 1994 Crime Bill was like Willie Horton, Sister Souljah, Welfare Reform – Clintons distancing themselves from black people.

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    11. And worse still, @HillaryClinton is lying when she suggests the 1994 Crime Bill was a serious policy initiative that went too far.
    8:29 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    12. The 1994 Crime Bill was passed in a wave of hysteria that the Clintons themselves helped to stoke and cynically capitalize on.
    8:30 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    23. When seen in the civil rights tradition of Scottsboro Boys, AEDPA is a dramatic, historic abandonment of black people.

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    24. And its not just AEDPA. With the PLRA, Clinton all-but withdraws federal protection of incarcerated people.
    9:00 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    25. Want to know why prison and jail conditions are so atrocious in the U.S.? Bill Clinton’s PLRA makes it insanely difficult to sue and win
    9:01 PM – 25 Oct 2015

  14. 14

    @Gin & Tonic:

    I think he should have gone with a lighter-colored pocket square.

    Isn’t the pocket square supposed to complement the tie? You definitely shouldn’t go with a plain tie and a polka-dot pocket square.

  15. 15
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: They like the days before VRA and CRA and labor always to bring them back.

  16. 16

    I clicked on the article and read far enough to see that “squeaky-clean” Rubio has hired the author of “John McCain’s illegitimate (well, adopted) black (well, Indian) child”.
    Maybe it’s because I’m a transracial adoptive parent myself, or maybe it’s because it sickens me that McCain remained a member of the party that did that to him, but the operative who did that is a special monster in my political mythology.

  17. 17
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @rikyrah: That all may be true, but I lived through the 1990s too and the only group on the left I recall saying anything at all about conditions for prisoners were the Maoists. (Also, the Boston Globe did an expose at the end of the 1990s.) Polls of African Americans around 1990 only showed slightly less support for tough on crime measures than whites. These attitudes only changed gradually over time. (White attitudes didn’t alter, making for some stark contracts today.) This is revisionism. You can’t make a political consensus with today’s electorate yesterday.

  18. 18
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @John M. Burt: have to upgrade Rubio’s chances slightly, except that I don’t think the SC good ole boys will be that excited about a Cuban closet Mormon and papist. Quite the glass house.

  19. 19
    trollhattan says:

    @John M. Burt:
    Completely agree. And I know not a single Republican who acknowledges that that occurred. It simply did. Not. Happen. The discussion of “was it wrong?” in theory is also interesting, given that the desired outcome did occur so would it have been such a bad thing? Also, too, vans driving through the ghetto picking up fake voters to do voter fraud so…both sides!

  20. 20
    Just Some Fuckhead says:

    Who chooses to look like Peewee Herman?

  21. 21
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Bobby Thomson: closet Mormon?

  22. 22
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Just Some Fuckhead: tailoring is wrong

  23. 23
    trollhattan says:

    @Bobby Thomson:
    Rubio vs. Carson vote in the new Confederacy. Discuss.

  24. 24
    Jeffro says:

    @trollhattan: Rubio vs Cruz in SC should be even more interesting

  25. 25
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Another Holocene Human:
    If I recall correctly, the Rubios are Catholic but briefly converted to Mormonism when Marco was in his early teens.

  26. 26
  27. 27
    JPL says:

    @Amir Khalid: I found this online at the NYDailynews…
    Now he attends both Christ Fellowship and a Catholic church, he says.
    It does appear that his faith has a lot to do with politics.

  28. 28
  29. 29
    trollhattan says:

    @Amir Khalid:
    They must be a strong-necked clan because that switch would give most folks whiplash.

  30. 30
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Roger Moore: It should complement it, but not be the same. That’s the worst faux-pas, having a necktie and pocket square of the same fabric. But I think of the overall look, too, and something there (presumably it is summer, ergo the linen jacket and the boater) cries out for a touch of brightness. At least to me.

  31. 31

    @gogol’s wife: I am watching it. It is pretty uneven, plot driven rather than character driven. Characters seem like stock characters rather than real people.

  32. 32
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Gin & Tonic: I imagine him affecting a walking stick as well, and then accidentally putting the hat on the stick (like W.C. Fields) necessitating a brief nervous search for it.

  33. 33
  34. 34
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Gin & Tonic:

    But I think of the overall look, too, and something there (presumably it is summer, ergo the linen jacket and the boater) cries out for a touch of brightness. At least to me.

    I think the eyes cry out for a touch of brightness.

  35. 35
    gvg says:

    @Another Holocene Human: Is my info out of date? Last I heard, African American’s were actually more tough on crime than white Americans. They were also more anti-drug use, supposedly because it impacted them more. Now it seems obvious that those views were not in their self-interest but I hadn’t seen any statistics that showed they had realized it. I would like to know any evidence because I think their views and votes will be nessesary to reverse our mistakes.

    I agree that at the time, it was impossible to resist that tide. Tough on crime sold well. So did cut spending due to the peace dividend after the Berlin Wall came down. Those 2 things gave the more extreme Republicans a big advantage in local elections and the Democrats were not all trying that hard to resist. the ones that did, lost elections and disappeared. Clinton gave way on a lot of fronts I felt but couldn’t prove were a bad idea and at the same time I thought he was more sucessful than most at not getting completely run over. the times were different than now and completely stopping the fools was impossible. Welfare reform and repealing Glass Steagal were 2 other areas, not enough votes were there to resist because most people wanted them. If Clinton had had a stronger supportive Congress, I don’t think he would have done these Bills. If someone else less tricky and pragmatic had been President, I think it would have been even worse. Doesn’t mean it wasn’t bed though but don’t overlook that a lot of time bad laws come from er less than intelligent voters collectively.

  36. 36

    @gogol’s wife: continued from comment 31 since WP won’t allow me to edit.
    I am watching it, in a train wreck kind of a way. Historical details are right in broad brush strokes but the show trips up on the details.

    The actor who plays Ralph Whelan is excellent as are Roshan Seth and Julie Walters.

  37. 37
    S-Curve says:

    “Don’t miss Edward Norton in the smash hit Douchebag Derby!”

  38. 38
    Dave L says:

    “South Carolina is known for its viper-pit political culture…”

    – What is a viper-pit? A hole filled with pit-vipers??

    They speak a different language down there in the Palmetto State.

  39. 39
    Gin & Tonic says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: That’s what gin is for.

  40. 40
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    The visible differences between Penang and the real India must be jarring for you.

  41. 41
    SFAW says:

    @trollhattan:

    They must be a strong-necked clan because that switch would give most folks whiplash.

    Either strong-necked or spineless.

  42. 42
  43. 43
    rikyrah says:

    @John M. Burt:

    Maybe it’s because I’m a transracial adoptive parent myself, or maybe it’s because it sickens me that McCain remained a member of the party that did that to him, but the operative who did that is a special monster in my political mythology.

    Just a Black woman in America, but it disgusts me to no end.

    AS IF having a Black child – IS WRONG.

  44. 44
    jacel says:

    I also recall that the 1990s crime bills were pushed for by Clinton alongside measure to improve crime and poverty impacted communities. The latter got funding reduced over time and many discontinued under Bush and a fully-Republican congress. I remember during the first few months of Bush’s presidency he would do a photo op at a facility doing positive work. A few weeks or months later, that facility would be quietly shut down. But the prisons kept getting more money through those years.

  45. 45
    Paul in KY says:

    @Just Some Fuckhead: Peewee Herman impersonator in Vegas?

  46. 46
    gogol's wife says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    That was what struck me from the first 15 minutes. They really need to get you involved in at least one of the characters, or the story-telling, right off the bat. It seemed as if they were relying on “atmosphere” and music to carry the whole thing.

    I was hooked on Home Fires immediately when the farmer woman looked insolently at the military guys as she slowly walked her herd of cows across the road. That’s all it takes — a moment of sharp character portraiture.

  47. 47
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @Steeplejack: thanks.

    I took out the extra http but maybe removed too much.

  48. 48
    Cacti says:

    The Bushes practically invented modern gutter politics.

    It’s poetic justice of the highest order to see Jeb get hit with cheap shot after cheap shot by Trump.

  49. 49

    @Amir Khalid: Yes. Shimla looks nothing like the tropical rainforest of Indian Summers. One of my friends’ father was in charge of the IAAS (Indian Audits and Accounts Services) academy in Shimla. IAAS is a part of the administrative service (IAS now or ICS in the Raj era) that provides bureaucrats who run India.

  50. 50
    lefthanded compliment says:

    If that’s Donehue’s idea of a fashion statement, perhaps he should consider taking a vow of silence.

  51. 51

    @lefthanded compliment: He should start a style blog and leave politics alone.

  52. 52
    Cacti says:

    @rikyrah:

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    10. 1994 Crime Bill was like Willie Horton, Sister Souljah, Welfare Reform – Clintons distancing themselves from black people.

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    11. And worse still, @HillaryClinton is lying when she suggests the 1994 Crime Bill was a serious policy initiative that went too far.
    8:29 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    12. The 1994 Crime Bill was passed in a wave of hysteria that the Clintons themselves helped to stoke and cynically capitalize on.
    8:30 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    23. When seen in the civil rights tradition of Scottsboro Boys, AEDPA is a dramatic, historic abandonment of black people.

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    24. And its not just AEDPA. With the PLRA, Clinton all-but withdraws federal protection of incarcerated people.
    9:00 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    David Menschel @davidminpdx
    25. Want to know why prison and jail conditions are so atrocious in the U.S.? Bill Clinton’s PLRA makes it insanely difficult to sue and win
    9:01 PM – 25 Oct 2015

    IMO, the most unforgiveable thing candidate Bill Clinton ever did was taking time off the trail in ’92 and going back to Arkansas to execute the mentally incompetent Ricky Ray Rector, to show his “tough on crime” bona fides.

  53. 53
    EthylEster says:

    Nashville Skyline album or Nashville movie?
    not getting the connection to Bobby D…..

  54. 54

    @Cacti: Bill Clinton and his stupid centrist initiatives. If Hillary gets elected, she should keep him far away from the west wing.

  55. 55
    Geeno says:

    @Dave L: I’ve heard “snake pit”, but not specifically “viper pit”.
    Yes, it really was a hole full of (venomous) snakes they’d toss people into as a punishment.

  56. 56
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @John M. Burt: If I recall correctly, what made this so ugly was the implication that McCain had had an affair with a Black woman which explained the Black (actually Bangladeshi) child.

    http://rumorswiki.org/index.ph.....mate_Child

    Because having an illegitimate Black child would have been the horror of horrors for Repub voters, I guess. Wonder how they feel now that McCain’s son has married a Black woman.

  57. 57
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    As I understand, Bill has moved to the left along with Hillary, at least lately.

  58. 58
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Jeffro: I read that as ESPN Sports Center

    nanunaaa nanunaaaa!

  59. 59
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Amir Khalid: That’s sort of easy to do without meaning to, it’s sort of like buying magazines you don’t want or extra life insurance

    darn door to door salesmen

  60. 60

    @Amir Khalid: Penang looks very pretty, though. I would love to visit someday. Also AFAIK, Shimla has no tea plantations, that’s Darjeeling.

  61. 61
    Anoniminous says:

    @Roger Moore:

    By the standards of The Look the tie, pocket square, and socks should all match.

  62. 62
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    @Anoniminous:

    By the standards of The Look the tie, pocket square, and socks should all match.

    He didn’t know that because when he chose his style all he had to go by was black and white photographs.

  63. 63
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @JPL: WTF?!?

    Did something change, did Popetine issue a bull stating RC pols can now participate in religious ceremonies not in communion with the RCC (in this case, Protestant as fuck) for the good of the Dominion?

  64. 64
    rikyrah says:

    Steve Marmel ‏@Marmel 20h

    Walker signs law allowing 2016 election to be rigged w/out repercussion.
    Wisconsin is lost.
    http://nyti.ms/1S1CsVi

  65. 65
    TG Chicago says:

    QOTD from Ben Carson’s spokesman:

    “We spent 54 cents on the dollar to raise money this quarter,” he said. “Last quarter we spent 64 cents on the dollar. That is an 11 cent reduction.”

  66. 66
    JPL says:

    B.J. the site to go to for fashion advice. The new What Not to Wear.

  67. 67
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    Be warned, though: Penang (the island part of the state, and the birthplace of all Dell laptops) is heavily urbanised and has traffic jams out the wazoo.

  68. 68

    @TG Chicago: What does this mean? They spent 54 cents to raise one dollar? Or spent 1$ and raised 54 cents? I ar confused.

  69. 69
    rikyrah says:

    and yet, nothing from the 2 piece and biscuit clergy who pimped this lowlife mofo for Governor.

    ……………………….

    One State’s Struggle to Make Ends Meet: Why Illinois Is Without a Budget
    By JULIE BOSMANOCT. 26, 2015

    CHICAGO — Illinois, notorious for its debt and dysfunction, is poised to begin its fifth month without a state budget, the consequence of a long-simmering ideological and political dispute between Gov. Bruce Rauner, the Republican who took office in January, and the Democrats who hold a supermajority in both chambers of the state legislature.

    As the conflict threatens to drag into 2016, even those in power are issuing dire warnings about the consequences. Illinois is spending more money than it is taking in, said Leslie Munger, the state comptroller, who cautioned that the state would have about $8.5 billion in unpaid bills by the end of the year, partly because of the expiration of a temporary increase in income tax.

    Gov. Bruce Rauner of Illinois last year. Mr. Rauner filed a brief at the Supreme Court, though he had not meant to speak for the state, the governor’s general counsel said.

    Mr. Rauner has tied passage of the budget to changes in workers’ compensation and collective bargaining rights for unionized public employees, measures that he says will help revive the Illinois economy and bring in much-needed revenue. Democratic Party leaders in the state reject those suggestions, saying that the governor is making demands that are unrelated to the budget.

    Some residents are losing patience, directing their anger at lawmakers and calling on state leaders to end the stalemate. Even members of Mr. Rauner’s own party are questioning his handling of the situation.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10.....pe=article

  70. 70
    catclub says:

    @Dave L: yes. usual term is ‘nest of vipers’

  71. 71

    @Amir Khalid: So not a tropical paradise, anymore?

  72. 72
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    Not so much nowadays, alas, although some parts are still very nice, like the hill resort.

  73. 73
    TG Chicago says:

    @schrodinger’s cat: They spent 54 cents to raise a dollar. That’s not a very good rate. (The article contrasts this with Bernie Sanders’ ActBlue donations, which cost just 4 cents per dollar)

    But the quote is mostly notable for the spokesman’s amusing attempt at math.

  74. 74
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Amir Khalid: Bill has talked explicitly about bills he regrets signing. But also defends while doing so the circumstances and compromises he got out of the GOP because they could have been worse. And he’s not lying.

  75. 75
    Anoniminous says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    It means they spent 54 cents for every dollar raised netting 46 cents.

  76. 76

    @Amir Khalid: The hills are probably not as tall the foothills of the Himalayas, right? That would explain the different vegetation.

  77. 77
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @rikyrah: Damn. Not even trying to hide the rot.

  78. 78
    Paul in KY says:

    @Another Holocene Human: He’s trying to convert the heathen Baptists back to the true faith.

  79. 79
    Amir Khalid says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:
    No they aren’t. Nowhere near. It’s all tropical in Penang.

  80. 80
    Seanly says:

    @Gin & Tonic:

    His pocket square doesn’t match his bowtie. Do you even need a pocket square while wearing a bowtie?

  81. 81

    @Amir Khalid: Shimla is among the few places in India to actually get some snow in winter.

  82. 82
    Another Holocene Human says:

    No fucking way. This is a parody account, right?

    https://twitter.com/JebBush/status/658631911166771200?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

    When I was Governor, a clock sat on my desk counting down the minutes I had left to serve the people of Florida.

    Sean McCabe quipped: @JebBush 5:00pm just couldn’t come fast enough. Especially on Wednesdays as Judge Judy was on at 5:30

  83. 83
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Seanly: What Would Tom Wolfe Wear?

  84. 84
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Paul in KY: Must be rough these days, since the Cards elected a Communist dictator.

  85. 85
    Germy Shoemangler says:

    meanwhile…

    CHUCK TODD: There’s been some talk that you and the rest of the Democrats might resign from the committee and not see this through. Where are you on that this morning?

    ELIJAH CUMMINGS: We have decided to stay on the committee because somebody has to be in the room to defend the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. And if you think about it, if you listen to the questions that were being asked by Republicans and the way they tried to attack her, you really did need to have Democrats in the room to give the other side of the story.

  86. 86

    @TG Chicago:
    Shorter Sponge Ben Crazypants:

    Now with 11% less grift!

  87. 87
    Rafer Janders says:

    @Seanly:

    His pocket square doesn’t match his bowtie. Do you even need a pocket square while wearing a bowtie?

    The pocket square shouldn’t match the bowtie, it should rather complement and/or offset it.

    And you don’t “need” a pocket square, but if you’re wearing a jacket with a breast pocket it provides another dash of color for the outfit and can offset/complement whatever tie and shirt combo you have.

  88. 88
    dedc79 says:

    It looks a little like they photoshopped two iPhones into a promo photo for Nashville Skyline.

    Fun game — if each candidate was a song off of Nashville Skyline, which song would they be:

    Fiorina – Tell Me That Isn’t True
    Huckabee – Country Pie
    Jeb! – I Threw it All Away

    Ok, having trouble with the rest of them.

  89. 89
    Paul in KY says:

    @Another Holocene Human: It was actual work screwing over the blahs & poor in Florida. I wasn’t used to that & was sure happy when I could go back to the normal ‘executive’ jobs I excelled in (fixed for accuracy).

  90. 90
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Rafer Janders: No wonder Americans have ditched such attire for mix and match shirts and pants (even dungarees, the shame) in public. Yeesh.

  91. 91
    Paul in KY says:

    @Another Holocene Human: Yup, he might be entertaining offers from the circuit bishop.

  92. 92
    Elie says:

    @rikyrah:

    I haven’t kept up with this iin detail but didn’t Quinn run an incredibly horrible campaign — running away from Obama and throwing in his lot with the likes of Chris Christie on the Ebola quarantine shit. Isn’t he to blame to some degree for this asshole being elected?

  93. 93
    Elie says:

    @Germy Shoemangler:

    Totally true. Never leave these assholes with anything valuable… including our country!

  94. 94
    trollhattan says:

    @TG Chicago:
    Arithmetic: totally like slavery.

  95. 95
    Peale says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: yes, Chuck. The Democrats would be feckless not to “see this through” to the end.

  96. 96
    Gene108 says:

    @jacel:

    IIRC, by 1993 crime rates had been going up for three decades with no end in sight and what are now vibrant hipster communities, like Brooklyn, were hollowed out husks well past their “glory days” of the 1950’s, with little hope of turning around.

    I think the attitudes and attempts to reduce the crime rates, in the 1990’s, needs to be looked at through the situation that was there then in not knowing if crime rates would ever come down, because they had not for 30 years.

    Now that crime rates have dropped, some urban areas have bounced back, etc a different set of challenges needs to be addresses.

  97. 97
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Germy Shoemangler: Good strategy. Dems have to resign themselves to the fact that for a long time to come, they have to deal with a lot of tomfoolery. Oh well.

  98. 98
    PurpleGirl says:

    @Another Holocene Human: Well, from these pictures it seems that Wolfe prefers regular ties. Only a few pictures with a bow tie and from pictures at Zimbio.com that occasion was a library benefit.

    https://www.google.com/search?q=tom+wolfe+pictures&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0CDoQ7AlqFQoTCNrggfjc4MgCFYWUHgod2OMOqQ&biw=1237&bih=644

    ETA: That style of dressing it much more Southern — an affectation of plantation ownership, not needing to work, warm weather, etc. In northern areas it isn’t as needed to offset to be cool.

  99. 99
    japa21 says:

    @rikyrah: Rauner now only has 38% approval in the state. Moving rapidly toward the magical 27%.

    Of course the legislature and the Dem leaders have even lower approval ratings and a lot of both sides to blame rhetoric. The Dems did pass a budget that Rauner vetoed. Even with a supermajority, the Dems missed by one vote overriding the veto.

    Believe it or not, the thing that may ultimately cause Rauner to back down on this is that the state lottery is refusing to pay any winnings over $600 until a budget is passed.

    And yes, it is all because the Dems in the legislature won’t hamstring the public unions. At least we weren’t so stupid as to give Rauner a GOP legislature, unlike the folks in WI.

  100. 100
    Mike in NC says:

    Rubio is a lightweight schemer. I could see Cruz or even Hucksterbee blowing him away in SC.

  101. 101
    japa21 says:

    @Elie: Only partially. Quinn never was a good politician but he still made it close. Rauner was the perfect GOP candidate. Smooth talker, man of the people type. He made a lot of voters want to have a beer with him. He didn’t come across as a wingnut. In fact, he beat out the wingnuts in the GOP primary.

    Probably the biggest thing in his platform was term limits, because that is one of those things that sounds nice in theory but would be horrible in practice. He never talked about trying to gut the unions. When asked about it he didn’t lie, just wouldn’t answer.

  102. 102

    @Gene108:

    In case anyone missed it, Ta-Nehisi Coates had a recent article about incarceration:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/mag.....on/403246/

    As with so many of these policies that go spectacularly wrong, well-meaning people blinded by their assumptions made common cause with people who didn’t mean as well and it turned into a disaster. Moynihan’s report on the black family gets detailed coverage.

  103. 103
    Elie says:

    @japa21:

    OK — thanks for that. Still, I just HATED what Quinn did during the campaign with Ebola and avoiding anything Obama. I donot think that helped him.

  104. 104
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Second the recommendation; that article was fascinating reading even for a Coates article. He was discussing it with Trevor Noah on The Daily Show recently.

    There’s a nuanced treatment of Moynihan as an almost tragic figure, who had a whole raft of mostly progressive proposals that weren’t included in his report, but who just doubled down after his thesis got pushback as racist.

  105. 105
    rikyrah says:

    @Elie:

    I haven’t kept up with this iin detail but didn’t Quinn run an incredibly horrible campaign

    Yep.

  106. 106

    @Matt McIrvin:

    In one way, Moynihan was right — unemployment and underemployment in the black community was and continues to be the elephant in the room that no one wants to seriously address, because it would require taking action other than blaming the unemployed. But mass incarceration was not the way to solve the problem, to say the least.

  107. 107
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): And Moynihan’s report was still being quoted approvingly by Very Serious People in the 80s and 90s despite being a lying crock of shit.

  108. 108
    glory b says:

    Pennsylvanian Juicers! PLEASE make sure you tell everyone you know (well, not the right wing crazies) to voter this November 3! Important Supreme Court elections! If we get a majority of Dems on the court, we stand a decent chance at re-gerrymandering (as I like to call it) time!

    PA is one of the most lopsided states in the country, with a clear dem majority of vioters and a veto proof repub majority in our legislature.

    I don’t know about the rest of the state, but in western PA there hasn’t been very much said about this aspect of the race. Remember, the Supreme Court was the only way we got rid of that horrible voter ID law. We need a great turnout!

  109. 109
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Fuck that guy. NPR had some asshole woman on there weeping about Moynihan and his haters last month but it’s all complete shit. Culture does not cause poverty, poverty and insecurity cause a break down in families, standard of living, and, second order, a change in culture.

    How can it not? You’re being chased by the police, chased by rival gangs, shut out of legitimate employment, of course that affects the creative sort’s outlook on life.

  110. 110
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): No worries, the Moynihan Report has been cited repeatedly over the years to blame the unemployed.

  111. 111
    Another Holocene Human says:

    @glory b: Please email the front pagers and ask them to put it in a FP post.

  112. 112

    @Another Holocene Human:

    You should read the Coates article, if you haven’t already. He has a pretty persuasive argument that Moynihan’s initial intention with the report was well-meaning, but he went down the rabbit hole when he got pushback.

    Biggest blind spot in the initial report — Moynihan couldn’t picture a way to fight poverty without male supremacy. Black men had to control their women, possibly with government help, and all problems would be solved. This was 2 years *after* “The Feminine Mystique” was published, so you can’t even say it was the times.

  113. 113
    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Yeah, the whole bit about it being a crisis of manhood was really sexist, and I think that was hugely influential. You see people like David Frum and Charles Murray decades later arguing that if a man’s children aren’t in danger of starving to death, his identity as a breadwinner has no meaning, and the devil’s work for idle hands follows in short order. And this is somehow only true for men, not for women.

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    Matt McIrvin says:

    @Mnemosyne (iPhone): Also, though his initial intention might have been well-meaning, that got pretty much buried in the published version, and the applications of it were mostly up to no good.

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    jl says:

    The post title is a very offensive micro-aggression against poor widdle me.
    I am half Swiss and half Irish.

    As everyone knows, the Swiss have always been a totally peaceful people, who have been sitting in their cute tidy little mountain chalets since time immemorial making chocolate and cuckoo clocks. And blowing alpenhorns And cheese, don’t forget the cheese. Almost as peaceful as the Irish.

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    Amir Khalid says:

    @jl:
    The Swiss have been making chocolates since time immemorial? As in, from locally grown cocoa beans? I did not know that.

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    Joe Shabadoo says:

    I just see people trying to hype Rubio up as the new big guy now that Jeb has the stink of a loser all over him.

    Rubio is now essentially the defacto establishment candidate so they need to make it seem like he really has some secret trick that somehow no one has seen yet instead of the current opinion where I picture the donors saying this “Bush is done? Who’s left? Rubio? Thirsty guy? Really? Who else? Oh god no, lets back Rubio.”

  118. 118
    Svensker says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    The Swiss have been making chocolates since time immemorial? As in, from locally grown cocoa beans? I did not know that.

    Yup. Truth. You know that whole Swiss Family Robinson thing? Totally pre-Columbus.

  119. 119
    catclub says:

    @Svensker:

    You know that whole Swiss Family Robinson thing? Totally pre-Columbus.

    Ever since I read Guns Germs and Steel, which is really about islands versus continents, I see things differently.
    Did the SFR have animal power? How big was their island? Hunter gather or starting agriculture?

    Also, how was chocolate domesticated? When and where? I guess switzerland.

  120. 120
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @Another Holocene Human:

    Culture does not cause poverty, poverty and insecurity cause a break down in families, standard of living, and, second order, a change in culture.

    More basic than that – the War on Drugs turned poor black neighborhods into the Wild West.

  121. 121
    Hob says:

    @Gene108:

    IIRC, by 1993 crime rates had been going up for three decades with no end in sight and what are now vibrant hipster communities, like Brooklyn, were hollowed out husks well past their “glory days” of the 1950’s, with little hope of turning around.

    If you’re talking about New York, no, you don’t really remember correctly. In 1993 the crime
    rate (both violent and property crimes) had been dropping significantly for three years after peaking in 1990. But you’re not the only one who was confused in that regard; Giuliani managed to convince everyone that the decrease only cane after he took office. Hell, there are lots of people now who still think the crime rate is soaring.

    Also: Brooklyn is a big place. Various neighborhoods within that big place have had their ups and downs. It doesn’t make any more sense to say that Brooklyn in general was a “hollowed-out husk” in 1993 than to say that Brooklyn in general is a vibrant hipster neighborhood today.

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    Tokyokie says:

    Am I the only chatter to spot Doug’s offhanded reference to the vastly underappreciated Don Siegel film Charley Varrick?

  123. 123
    Paul in KY says:

    @catclub: Think Gilligan’s Island on steroids. Lots of enthusiastic, Swiss kids to make stuff.

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