Patrick Lynch is having a bad week. Here’s a poll:
New York City voters disapprove of police officers turning their backs on the Mayor at police funerals by 69% to 27%. 77% think police union President Pay Lynch’s “blood on his hands” remarks were “too extreme” and no racial or gender subset of the population considers the comments “appropriate.”
That poll also has Lynch at an 18% positive/39% negative approval rating, and New Yorkers think he’s a mostly negative force in the city by 43%-27%. He also had a fight with his rank and file at a meeting last night:
“This is what my members want!” a cop yelled near the end of the raucous meeting. “They want more cars, better vests, more manpower!”
And then the cop — one of about 350 in attendance — took a verbal jab at Lynch, who has called on de Blasio to offer a mea culpa for his continued lack of support for police.
“They don’t want an apology,” he said.
At the peak of the clash, about 100 cops were standing and screaming at Lynch, sources told the Daily News.
I wonder if anything is less likely to happen than “more manpower”. Lynch’s tactics have shown that the city can get along fine without cops passing out tickets for every bullshit infraction. New Yorkers have gotten their peek behind the curtain and they’ve seen the mighty Oz, thanks to Lynch. Why would they support more cops when there’s less work for the police force to do once they stop the broken windows nonsense?
Jack the Second
I would be surprised if any amount of public opinion polling could ever change Lynch’s mind, but hopefully it will help de Blasio.
satby
I have to admit that the “lower crime statistics” thing confuses me, because don’t they base those on documented evidence of crime like tickets and arrests? So if the cops stop ticketing and arresting for minor stuff the crime rates would of course drop, but it doesn’t mean that the activity formerly sanctioned was reduced.
Now whether that was ever worth tickets and arrests is a whole ‘nother debate, and I would vote no.
Motivated Seller
If Lynch wants to be a politician, then he should run for office. New Yorkers want a professional police force, not a bunch of couch fainters.
Buddy H
Some of the officers are apparently lacking basic impulse and aggression control:
Members of the Patrolmen’s Benevolent Association nearly came to blows on Tuesday during a meeting of delegates in Queens. There was pushing, shoving and lots of screaming at Patrick Lynch, president of the 23,000-member union.
The in-house battle erupted over the issue of what patrol officers really need — an apology from Mayor de Blasio or better equipment and more officers to back them up on the streets.
“This is what my members want!” a cop yelled near the end of the raucous meeting. “They want more cars, better vests, more manpower!”
And then the cop — one of about 350 in attendance — took a verbal jab at Lynch, who has called on de Blasio to offer a mea culpa for his continued lack of support for police.
“They don’t want an apology,” he said.
“They asked Lynch directly: ‘What did you ask the mayor for?’ ” the source added. But Lynch provided no answers. The yelling and screaming lasted about 10 minutes before Lynch stormed out.
Amusing comment from Charles Pierce on what happened at the cops’ meeting:
“I’d like to congratulate the NYPD for its restraint. Apparently, nobody at this gathering felt compelled to exercise his or her Second Amendment freedoms in settling the dispute. Things are looking up!”
FlipYrWhig
I’m pleasantly surprised that the cops’ unions’ antics aren’t getting more support.
Patricia Kayden
Good to see that his ugly remarks and conduct have backfired. No one is above criticism — including police officers and soldiers. He could have been more gracious in responding to the protests and critical remarks after Mr. Garner’s death-by-police. I hope he’s ousted.
gratuitous
I confess myself surprised. Usually the follow-on to a stupid statement like Lynch’s is a reasoned and sober discussion as to whether or not Lynch went far enough with his offensive remarks. This one time, it appears that a random reactionary actually overplayed his hand, and the authoritarians are getting some pushback.
I don’t know why that is, but I hope it signals a turning in our national conversation about any number of subjects, including crime, punishment, public safety and national security.
MattF
@FlipYrWhig: @Patricia Kayden: Me too. I thought that Lynch was in tune with the union members, but the morning-after reviews don’t look good.
Mr Stagger Lee
Lynch lets his alligator mouth override his hummingbird ass!
debbie
How long until there’s a non-apology apology?
RSR
bad link to the poll
RSR
can’t find a link to the cross tabs now, but the approve/disapprove numbers are over 50% approve for R’s and about 49% vs 50% disapprove for Staten Island
The Other Bob
There’s that 27% number again.
sam
@satby: it depends, really. I mean, they flood harlem and the outer boroughs with police to ticket every minor, ridiculous “barely-even-criminal” infraction in the name of keeping their quotas up, but god forbid they put some traffic cops in front of my building in midtown where people constantly run the red light (I work at 45th and Park, and because Park doesn’t actually cross there (it’s elevated and goes through the Helmsley building) people seem to simply forget that there’s still a traffic light, despite the fact that pedestrians still need to cross the damn street).
I’ve even called and noted that it would be a revenue generating bonanza if they did so, but no luck. Everyone who works on our block spends each morning playing a modified game of frogger to get to work. I hated Giuliani, but every once in a while, I really freaking miss the “don’t block the box” ticketing blitzes they used to conduct in neighborhoods where white people existed.
boatboy_srq
There are certainly too many cops on the streets, who until recently have been in the perfect position to
shake down the undeservingissue citations to QoL offenders. More? Probably not. Better organized/assigned? Certainly.sharl
First link needs fixing, as RSR at #11 noted – this’ll work.
The slow-down appears to even be real in most of Bedford-Stuyvesant, where much of the over-policing has taken place, according to this report:
But exceptions remain:
So at least in Bed-Stuy, some of the police operations sound somewhat reminiscent of SOP of “law enforcement” in Ferguson MO, based on these observations and analyses from the streets.
Chris
My faith in the American public’s ability to be critical of its uniformed public servants no matter how warranted it may be has been at an all time low for years.
Thanks for restoring it slightly, NYC.
sharl
Ah, first link in OP fixed. Thanks MM!
Elizabelle
Glad to see this. Patrick Lynch is making those police less safe, if he and his ridiculous demands are their public face.
I hope he gets booted from his cushy job. And disgraced on his way out.
It’s doubly sad if people remember him and the police turning their backs first, instead of Officers Liu and Ramos.
the Conster
@sharl:
Great reporting in that article – I love the last paragraph. Not just two Americas, two cities.
Couldn't Stand the Weather
Right wing/authoritarian overreach. It’s what’s for breakfast in the five boroughs.
As for Lynch, I have a feeling his resignation may not be far away. And, yeah… he’ll probably run for office. That winger gravy train is way too much easy money for him to think about passing up.
Snarki, child of Loki
Ooooo! great headlines!
“Lynch mob gets ugly!”
PurpleGirl
I continue to think that Lynch’s actions were aimed as some kind of tactic in the new contract negotiations. As such I don’t think he’s succeeding. His continued holding of office will depend on how good a contract he gets. (Just remember that Bloomberg did everything he could to delay that contact and left it for the new mayor to handle.)
Karen in GA
@PurpleGirl:
Yeah, I wonder if the cops aren’t thinking, “Wait, if he’s so good at beating down the mayor, how come we still don’t have a contract?” All he’s doing is turning the city against his union members. I wondered if they’d ever figure that out — evidently they’re starting to.
David in NY
I thought that actual citizens of NYC were not impressed by the police’s (or rather Lynch’s, and the segment of police that are racists’) hissy fit. Glad to have my intuition confirmed.
What I wonder is if this will affect the press coverage. Even the Times was looking at this as a political problem for DeBlasio, which it turns out to be only marginally, at worst. The Post will never change, of course (will they even report this?), but other outlets may realize that most people don’t necessarily look at this as a negative for DeB.
David in NY
About differential policing in NY. It’s basically policy.
In Manhattan, and in the upper-middle class portion of Brooklyn in which I now live, people are permitted the extra-legal option, during the hour-and-a-half when there is no parking on one side for street cleaning, of double parking on the other side (which remains against the law).
No tickets for that unless, say, you live in Flatbush (90% minority), as I did for 30 years. Double parking not permitted there, ever. And if you ask the police why not, well, it’s against the law, you know.
White privilege, anyone?
Bruuuuce
So much for not supporting the police:
1. Lawmakers in Albany have drafted a bill to retrofit NYC police cars with bulletproof glass and armored doors.
2. NYC City Council is looking to outfit all of its police officers with bulletproof vests.
All indications are that the Mayor supports both initiatives, despite the WATB speaking for the PBA.
ruemara
NYers have minimal tolerance for bullshit. I have no idea why Pat Lynch doesn’t know that. I hope he gets the heave – ho with a vote of no confidence.
rikyrah
Mellody Hobson and friends pay for 10,000 teens to see ‘Selma’
Jan 15, 2015
Mellody Hobson and George Lucas and some of their business friends are paying for 10,000 teens to see “Selma,” the biopic about Martin Luther King Jr. that’s backed by Oprah Winfrey and just secured an Academy Award nomination for best picture.
“What took place 50 years ago in Selma is key to understanding much about the civil rights movement, race, equality and democracy,” Hobson, president of Chicago-based Ariel Investments and chair of After School Matters, said in a statement.
After School Matters is coordinating efforts to get teens in the nonprofit program to see the movie.
I hear she, her film-producer husband and a few others raised $100,000 in 72 hours for the effort.
http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20150115/BLOGS03/150119896/mellody-hobson-and-friends-pay-for-10-000-teens-to-see-selma
sharl
OT, big Navy acquisition scandal that has been slowly simmering for awhile may start to go big, now that Amir’s ne’er-do-well countryman Leonard Francis – known within 7th Fleet circles as “Fat Leonard” – has recently entered a ‘guilty’ plea. Much interest among officers as to who he will name as recipients of his gifts – cash, prostitutes, etc. – in exchange for doing business with his highly overpriced SE Asia ship maintenance service business.
Hard-boiled cynics that many of them are, a number of mid-level officers are wondering if any Flag officers will be implicated, and if so, whether they’ll get off the hook with a wrist-slap and their retirement compensation mostly intact. I’ve already read one observation that a favorite media photo of Francis is one which has been cropped to removed the image of the Admiral (and former CNO) standing next to him.
Lavocat
Patrick Lynch: so much stupidity in such a small man.
If this were Opposite Day, he’d be right @ home.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkkEKqgPhV0
JR in WV
@The Other Bob: I noticed the magival number too, 27% of the NYC populace approve of cops turning their backs on the elected-in-a-landslide mayor.
That landslide part may be what is tripping up the cops’ union leader. Even if the union boss was elected in a landslide of cops, that’s still a subset of 35,000 cops. This is such a tiny bucket of people out of New York City, which is so huge no one can really hold it in their minds.
27% of people approve of a union boss, means the union boss better watch his step, or his union could get in a heap of trouble. Fighting with City Hall has never been easy, and when City Hall’s boss just got elected in a landslide, that makes it even harder to mess with City Hall!
Seanly
@The Other Bob:
Yup.
Gin & Tonic
@JR in WV: that’s still a subset of 35,000 cops. This is such a tiny bucket of people out of New York City
And a majority of those 35,000 aren’t even in the electorate that picked deBlasio, since they don’t live in the city. I wonder to what extent that may have blinded them to his popularity.
shortstop
This pleases me greatly.
Cacti
I called this weeks ago.
What happens if they stop the broken windows gestapo crap and nothing happens to the city?
1. It proves that heavy-handed tactics were wholly unnecessary, 2. It vindicates police critics
BBA
@Gin & Tonic: The most recent demographics I’ve seen are that most NYPD officers live in the 5 boroughs, but most white NYPD officers live outside the 5 boroughs.
Mr. Lynch presides over a union that isn’t majority white anymore and many of his constituents have complained about their fellow officers’ “Archie Bunker mentality”.
Just Some Fuckhead
@Cacti: I agree. But they only need one anecdote of a criminal run amuck to counter that narrative.
Samuel Knight
De Blasio actually has a huge opening now. Sadly similar to the air controller strike for Reagan.
Quite simply – almost no one in NY wants to idiots like Lynch wandering around with guns in their city. And they particularly don’t want to pay to be abused.
De Blasio can now simply say that I don’t want to pay to have abusive police in my city. I’ll negotiate when you give me people to talk to who have a clear interest to serve and protect all the citizens ot NY. Second, if any officer does not want to serve under the elected representatives of the city, nor respect the Constitutional rights of Americans, they can hand in their badge.
And second sad note – De Blasio actually needs to do this, because from most reports, Lynch’s attitude is the attitude of a lot of cops. So he has to break that culture or nothing changes.
slag
@Buddy H:
Thug life.
Chris
@Samuel Knight:
Pretty much.
I hate anything that smells even remotely of union-busting, but I don’t know what the hell else is supposed to happen here, not with the size to which the cops’ entitlement mentality has been allowed to grow. They badly need it hammered into them that they’re not supposed to be above the law.
Amir Khalid
@Cacti:
Then what will the city do with the excess staff in the NYPD? I presume layoffs are not provided for in the collective agreements between the city and, as I recall, five police officers’ unions.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@rikyrah:
I know I’m not the only one who saw the pictures of Lucas and Hobson together and thought, “That guy must have a great personality off camera, because that woman is WAY out of his league.” She’s rich in her own right, she’s intelligent, and she’s gorgeous, so hopefully he understands that he hit the jackpot.
debbie
@Chris:
And that they serve the public.
Elizabelle
@Samuel Knight: I wish DeBlasio would do that.
It would send a huge signal to NYC residents — all of them — and maybe remove some troublemakers too.
shortstop
@Samuel Knight: @Chris:
The problem is that once you break that culture, what do you replace it with? The next generation of cops is going to be just as racist, authoritarian and dismissive of Democratic C-in-C (if you will) legitimacy as this one. I don’t see the majority of people attracted to this profession becoming more liberal, open-minded or given to thoughtful decision-making, particularly in this wildly exaggerated us-vs-them environment/time.
I realize I’m painting with a very broad brush here, but both quantitative and qualitative analysis would seem to bear out my pessimism.
shelley
When they listed the minor offenses that cops weren’t writing tickets for, one was ‘public urination.’ Ugh, is that still a big problem?
drkrick
@shortstop:
I would guess that a lot of people that don’t fit that pattern and self-select out of careers with NYPD (or policing in general) might stop doing so if there was real change in the culture, but it would certainly take some time.
blueskies
@shortstop: A break in the culture would not occur with just the Mayor taking this one-time stand; it would simply be the event that we’d all look back on and say “this is where change started.” There would have to be clear follow-up in terms of stark and immediate changes in officer candidate selection, ab inito and recurrent training, on-the-job mentoring, and performance review. Rewards and punishments would have to be dispensed clearly and cleanly.
Don’t underestimate the power of the boss very publicly cutting nuts and then having a few follow-on examples to make his point. The paycheck is a powerful motivator, in both directions.
drkrick
@satby:
It’s certainly possible to filter out the “quality of life” (i.e., largely bullshit) tickets and arrests from the serious crimes and compare rates for only the latter.
Samuel Knight
Few follow-up toughts for Elizabelle, Shortstop and others.
1) There are people in law enforcement who do want to serve and protect and aren’t racists. Probably more than a few of them being the black cops who when polled reported that they too were racially harrassed by their comrades. Or for example the policeman chased out of the Baltimore police department after reporting police abuse. Law enforcement goes out of control when they let the thugs take over.
2) You start changing the culture by giving the police things like flak jackets, while at the same time cracking down on violations. When you ostracize the bullies you stop letting them dictate the narrative.
3) Unions – well yes, like any institution a union can become a negative force. Just because you think that this union is out of control, doesn’t mean you hate all unions. Unfortunately, a difficult point to make, but one that can be made.
buddy h
With the work slowdown, were they hoping roving gangs of wilding black teenagers would take over, and then the cops could gallop in on white horses screaming “we told you so!!”
Jay C
A few observations from a Manhattanite:
1. @The Other Bob: Yep: just the percentage I would have guessed. The “27% factor” really MUST be some sort of standard in American politics….
2. More manpower? Almost certainly not: as pointed out: @PurpleGirl: the NYPD’s staffing levels are already historically fairly high: and personnel costs (average $125K per officer per year, I think) being such a significant part of the overall Department budget, it is (and probably has been – another gripe for the PBA et.al.) unlikely like that future NYPD budget plans are going to incorporate any large numbers of new hires. More/better equipment? Probably: more bodies in uniform? not so much…
3. Patrick Lynch’s constituents certainly have enough reason to be pissed off at him: by putting himself (or letting himself be put) up front as the Voice Of The Police, his loudmouthed assholery has backfired badly, making the whole Department look bad, and damaging Mayor de Blasio’s popularity/support little, if at all. What goes on behind the Blue Wall usually stays there: but I have a feeling Mr. Lynch may want to spend some time updating his resume….
4. Irony alert: I saw on the local news yesterday that the dwarf legislature that is the NYC CIty Council was considering a bill to criminalize the use of chokeholds in the City (vs. the administrative reg it violates now.). It already has a majority of the Council as co-sponsors: but, if passed, has been threatened with a veto. The irony: the source of the threatened veto, and defender of the police from another level of legal hassles (and potential criminal suits)? None other than Commissar/Mayor Bill (“I hate cops”) Commie de Blasio. Heh.
Patricia Kayden
@buddy h: Yep. Something like that. After all, the blahs just cannot control themselves, doncha know?
Samuel Knight
The other irony of course is that the primary driver of reduced crime is taking lead out of the environment, as shown by Kevin Drum. You don’t poison your kids with leaded gas and paint, so that they can think and control themselves, and you know they actually want to follow the Social Contract. You poison them and they don’t.
The other obvious reason that de Blasion could be aggresive is that the city doesn’t need all these cops. If thousands resign, they will better off.
Rafer Janders
@shortstop:
It’s partly a matter of training. In NYC, the police academy course is 28 weeks on average, or about half a year.
In Germany, by contrast, police candidates train for an average of 2 and a half years.
That amount of training, instruction and education serves to weed out the bullies, testosterone junkies and meatheads and ensures a much more professional police force.
burnspbesq
@satby:
I’m not so sure about that. I remember what midtown was like in the 1970s.
shortstop
@drkrick: @blueskies: @Rafer Janders:
All good points. I wonder, though, if the selection process can be that rigorous — do we really have lots of people lining up to be cops who don’t make the early cuts? If so (and what a thought, seeing the array of what does pass muster), after we weed out the attitudinally challenged in step 1, do we then have enough candidates willing to go through long training periods and constant continued ed? I don’t really have any info on those points.
jl
Seems as though the ‘broken windows’ policy has morphed into a quote of ‘BS citations and arrests to raise revenue from poor people policy’. Should we call NYC Ferguson on the Hudson?The two are different things, so not surprising that reducing the BS has not affected crime rates in the short run. Whether the crime rates stays unaffected over the long run by such a drastic reduction in citations remains to be seen. But probably way to much BS for an effective ‘broken windows’ policy.
NYC could probably permanently reduce the hassling, citations and arrests in high crime neighborhoods by putting the excess cops on a real, genuine and honest community policing beat. SF police certainly have their problems, but I read that one reason for dramatic drop in crime rates in some neighborhoods came out of a spontaneous grass roots effort among a group of cops to offer some people jobs. The pitch was :”Hey, buddy, you’re better than this street corner BS, if you promise not to make me look bad, I can maybe get you a job. How’s that sound?” So, there are things NYC police can do that will be very helpful for crime and keeping the place nice besides hassling people and pumping money out of them.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
As far as “broken windows” goes, I think it’s a great idea for municipal services but a terrible idea for policing. Obvious as it sounds, people aren’t windows. Fixing the visual appeal of the street by removing people from it is a weird way to go about improving it.
noabsolutes
Everyone noticed the Crazification Factor in those polls, right? 27% approve of his actions, 27% say he’s a positive force in the city.
It’s the same people.
Another Holocene Human
@MattF:
I never thought that and the fact that not only was there a near riot and clear factions at his union meeting but that everybody but everybody was ready to blab about it to the press just warms my evil heart. This is the best scandal since ticket-fixing.
I love how they pressed him on what he said to deBlasio, “we don’t need an apology!” Lynch has been on an epic ego trip and their thing is that they think he’s forgotten that he’s supposed to be advancing their interests not getting into ego-measuring contests with pols.
And, yeah, good luck with more manpower after the blue flu. That ain’t fixing to happen.
Maybe they need less cops, and more community liason officers. To, say, manage quality of life at housing projects and stuff like there where you might need cop-lite or at least some sort of City agent but you don’t need cop tires cop guns cop attitudes.
Another Holocene Human
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): It’s a second order thing that happened at the same time as a secular decrease in crime so it gets over-hyped.
Doing stuff like cleaning up the subway was valuable. Or the washer guys. With a city like NYC you need some low level enforcement all the time to keep the stolen goods/fake goods trades in check, the shell games out of sight (no really, they will break out with the three card monte) and other nuisances.
Stop and frisk is complete bullshit. It’s been conflated with broken windows and COMPUSTAT. In fact COMPUSTAT has been used (it’s just a tool, it’s all in how it’s deployed) to compel officers to do more and more S&F. Stop and frisk wastes time and destroys community relations and probably depresses economic activity and leads to more crime.
NYC needs to focus on community policing and to get away from all of these unneeded, illegal stops of young men of color. It’s started to do the second part but needs to do more.
And as for the literal broken window (it’s a metaphor–in NYC it meant going after fare jumpers in the subway, stuff like that), they’ve got a phone line just to report and hopefully repair things of that nature in the city. Environments do make a difference.
Another Holocene Human
@Rafer Janders: In the British system they have less layers of management and you can progress from beat cop up by learning the law. Seriously, they test you on how well you know the law in order to get promoted. Then they pair cops up and do peer training.
Most small cop shops in the US have little management (and also little training and low standards, which can be a problem if they run up against a serious crime). But the big cities, and NYC is the champ of this, have layer after layer of upper management and treat the uniform and detectives like stupid peons. Literally so, as they won’t hire over a certain IQ. Since IQs are rising this is relatively making the cops dumber and dumber. It probably comes of the days when cops were Catholics and TPTB didn’t trust Catholics further than they could throw them so they had layer upon layer of Protestant “professional” management between the Irish whales and City government.