It’s Like They Want a Riot

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Good grief. It’s almost as if they want this whole to town to blow up:

In another day of demonstrations, protesters chanting “Don’t shoot!” marched in front of the St. Louis County prosecutor’s office on Tuesday, demanding the arrest of a police officer who shot and killed an unarmed black teenager.

The Ferguson Police Department, which had previously said it would release the name of the officer, said Tuesday that it had decided against doing so out of concern for the safety of the officer, who was put on administrative leave. The department said threats had been made against the city’s police on social media.

“The value of releasing the name is far outweighed by the risk of harm to the officer and his family,” the Ferguson police chief, Thomas Jackson, said.

Look, if someone does hurt the cop, at least we can be assured the local police will do a thorough investigation and not leave his body to roast on the pavement for four hours in the afternoon sun like they did for Michael Brown. Besides, shouldn’t you have something to fear when you shoot an unarmed teen eight times, most in the back as he fled unarmed? I have no sympathy for this man whatsoever. Release his damned name. Now.

Despite the bullshit claims (on the few occasions the national media actually covered the story), most of the protests in Ferguson have been peaceful. Lemme rephrase that. Most of the protesters have been peaceful. The police have been up to their usual bullshit, cordoning off the protesters so it was basically shooting fish in a barrel and firing tear gas, rubber bullets and these at protestors:

Not sure about you all, but I think while gagging on tear gas, being shot in the head with a large hunk of wood might be more than “less than lethal.” Oh, bonus fact- the cops corralled everyone protesting, and then while shooting at them, screamed at them to disperse and go home. Which, of course, they couldn’t do, because they were corralled by the cops and not allowed to break police lines to leave. Speaking of tear gas, here are Ferguson’s finest shooting teargas into a guy’s lawn because he would not disperse… from his own yard:

NWA had it right. I guess when these neanderthals get their toys, they want to use them, and use them they did. Can the feds just take over the entire Ferguson police department?

Another good question- does this look like a smart composition for the government and police force:

Ferguson’s police chief and mayor are white. Of the six City Council members, one is black. The local school board has six white members and one Latino. Of the 53 commissioned officers on the police force, three are black, said Ferguson Police Chief Thomas Jackson.

Blacks in Ferguson are twice as likely to be stopped by police as whites, according to an annual report on racial profiling by the Missouri attorney general. Last year, 93% of arrests following car stops in Ferguson were of blacks. Ninety-two percent of searches and 80% of car stops involved blacks, the report said.

Lots more here at Vox.

219 replies
  1. 1
    C.V. Danes says:

    I’ve said this before, but the rich and the poor have no disillusionment as to who the police “serve and protect.” When you grow up poor, and especially poor and black, this is something you learn at a very young age. When the shit goes down, you run away from the police for protection, not towards them.

  2. 2
    Botsplainer says:

    For shits and giggles, I did locate the home addresses of the Ferguson chief and the St. Louis County chief, the guys running this shitshow of stonewalling, obfuscation, helmeted riot cops and dogs.

    Those homes are probably in nice neighborhoods, and neither are located in Ferguson. – the protests among happy nice time white people could be fun.

    Absurdly easy tracing if you know what to look for (a hint – pretty much every municipality of size in the country has a readily accessible and name searchable tax roll database for the listing of property taxes, mainly to facilitate real estate transactions on the cheap. No hacking required).

  3. 3
    Alison says:

    No doubt in my mind they wanted this. They do this shit because they know it’ll get a (totally fucking justified) reaction from the crowds, and then they can say SEE LOOK HOW THEY’RE ACTING and get even more fucking violent. They show up expecting war and if it isn’t there, they start it, then claim they’re on defense.

    Fucking assholes.

  4. 4
    BGinCHI says:

    The beatings and shootings and poor schools and incarceration and food deserts and humiliation and intimidation and murder and discrimination and corruption and harassment and profiling and general fucking-with will continue until morale improves.

  5. 5
    Botsplainer says:

    I like this one best, I think.

    Pork belly, caught on film inciting concfict by calling out citizens to “bring it” while calling them “fucking animals”.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/.....mg00000067

    I’m guessing we won’t hear from Greenwald on this.

  6. 6
    shortstop says:

    Want a riot? Well, maybe not actively want. However, if you provoke the daylights out of protesters to pump whole blood into the “Look at these animals!” narrative that’s flourishing in certain very white venues, it comes to the same thing, doesn’t it? Just ask that hard-working cop who fears for his life in the face of these terrible savages.

    A couple of threads down, there was a long argument about whether the militarization of today’s police forces a) exists and b) makes this stuff worse. It might be more to the point to finger the extreme racism that’s exploded over the last few years. All these white grievances about “reverse racism” and “white people are the truly oppressed nowadays” can take hold just as firmly in redneck police departments as they do in other low-information pockets. There is serious white resentment going on in a hell of a lot of American PDs.

  7. 7
    bluehill says:

    I think I saw this comparison in DKos about the different ways police handled the situations of the 18 year old white guy walking around Denver, near Columbine High School of all places, exercising his 2nd amendment rights by carrying a shotgun and a black guy in a Wal-Mart carrying a toy rifle. One guy refuses to put down the gun he is carrying and still walks away without as much as a citation and the other guy says don’t shoot me and is dead. You can figure out which one died.

    I read some of the comments in the local newspaper about the killing and they basically said he deserved it for not cooperating with the police. I wondered if those commenters would have said that the white guy deserved to be shot as well.

    Now we have this situation where black people are protesting the treatment of someone in their community, and I can only imagine what some commentors believe the police should do in addition to what they have done because some of those protestors were breaking the law and threatening police officers. Of course, it was different when Clive Bundy and his paper soldiers were breaking the law and pointing weapons at police officers and federal officers. That was about the constitution and government overreach.

    Ugh, the hypocrisy shouldn’t be surprising, but I wish someone in the media would just call it for what it is.

  8. 8
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Botsplainer:

    I’m guessing we won’t hear from Greenwald on this.

    Dudebros not involved in this one. Now, if the Ferguson police were hunting down IP addresses of porn downloaders, well, time to get busy!

  9. 9
    rikyrah says:

    Blacks in Ferguson are twice as likely to be stopped by police as whites, according to an annual report on racial profiling by the Missouri attorney general. Last year, 93% of arrests following car stops in Ferguson were of blacks. Ninety-two percent of searches and 80% of car stops involved blacks, the report said.

    But bringing up such statistics is soooo racist, Cole.

    And, of course, should have no bearing on how the Black community in Ferguson views the PO-Lice.

    Uh huh

    Uh huh

  10. 10
    rikyrah says:

    Eli Rosenberg @EliKMBC

    Just Announced: @TheRevAl will pay for #MichaelBrown’s funeral. Crowd assembled at news conference applauded. #Ferguson

  11. 11
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @bluehill: I am, once again, reminded that the response to Black Panthers legally open carrying long arms in Sacramento was a gun control law signed by Ronald Reagan.

  12. 12
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @shortstop: Clearly, this Brown kid was just a footsoldier in the Democrats’ war on white people.

    /Mo Brooks

  13. 13
    TooManyJens says:

    If you start from the assumption that the shooting must have been justified because a cop did it, then it follows that Brown was extremely dangerous. Therefore everyone who’s protesting his death is wanting to defend this dangerous kid and subvert justice, so they’re dangerous too. And if showing up to a peaceful protest (which it was at first) with guns and dogs tips some people over the edge with anger and fear and they burn a convenience store down, well then, you were right about how dangerous “those people” are. Which just goes to show that the initial shooting must have been justified. It’s all self-reinforcing.

  14. 14
    Hunter Gathers says:

    Who knows if he actually said this, but I’ll quote Thaddeus Stevens from Lincoln:

    You claim you trust them –
    but you know what the people are.
    You know that the inner compass
    that should direct the soul toward
    justice has ossified in white men
    and women, north and south, unto
    utter uselessness through
    tolerating the evil of slavery.
    White people cannot bear the
    thought of sharing this country’s
    infinite abundance with Negroes.

    The majority of White people fear/hate Black people. That’s why this country doesn’t give a shit when unarmed Black teenagers get gunned down by the cops or wannabe cops. We have been thoroughly convinced through the media, our elders, and popular culture that all Black people are lying, murderous thieves. That Black people are mentally deficient, genetically lazy and morally depraved. That if we don’t keep them in check, they’re going to knock up our precious little snowflake Aryan daughters with their unclean sperm producing racially mixed ‘mutts’. That any Black person who ever accomplished anything was the result of Affirmative Action, a policy that is racist against White people. That all they do is fuck, smoke crack and steal. That the only thing that they’re good for is playing football or basketball. How ‘The Blacks’ have ruined the NFL and the NBA. That every black woman with children is a whoreish welfare queen. And how they need to shut the fuck up, we gave them the vote, how ungrateful can these animals be?

    I’ve heard this shit my entire life. I’m not surprised when some dipshit, willfully ignorant fuckstick of a Cracker spews some racist shit. What surprises me is the fact that it’s considered rude to call them out on their bullshit. Which makes me a ‘nigger lover’. Which suits me just fine. The White race is diseased, and will always remain so.

  15. 15
    skerry says:

    FAA has restricted airspace over Ferguson “TO PROVIDE A SAFE ENVIRONMENT FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ACTIVITIES”.

    ETA:Anonymous has reportedly told the Ferguson police chief to release the shooting officer’s name or they will “release information about his (chief’s) daughter”.

  16. 16
    The Dude says:

    Well, when you mostly hire white suburban kids who were raised by white flight families to police the very places those families ran away from, what other result would should be expected?

  17. 17
    C.V. Danes says:

    @shortstop:

    A couple of threads down, there was a long argument about whether the militarization of today’s police forces a) exists and b) makes this stuff worse

    I believe the answers to your questions are a) yes and b) yes.

    The police serve to protect the rentier class and enforce their edicts. Since the middle-class buffer is going away, they need to step up the hardware. There’s a thin line between keeping the peace and enforcing oppression, and the you can expect to see that line crossed more and more often as the rich keep distancing themselves from the rest of us.

  18. 18
    bluehill says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: I just recently learned that and that the NRA is using some of the same arguments that Black Panthers used. It’s a crazy old world.

    I wonder how people in Texas would feel about open carry if groups of minorities started walking carrying AR-15s. Might just change their view about the constitution and all that.

  19. 19
    Temporarily Max McGee (soon enough to be Andy K again) says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    I checked in the wee small hours of this morning. Nothin’. Zero. Zilch. Zip.

  20. 20
    Ben Cisco says:

    @John Cole +0:

    It’s Like They Want a Riot

    Self-fulfilling prophecy.

    That’s why they “ran” the press off.
    That’s why what you HAVE heard about this mess was all about the “riots” and not about Michael Brown (at least, until such time as they can Mau-Mau him).
    That’s why the unnamed cop has been turned into a “victim” so that he could go unnamed.
    That’s why, if this does manage to get worse (?), the Village will use it to whitesplain the tactics that got Michael Brown killed in the first place.
    And that’s why, if they and their like-minded brethren get the war they seem to be itching so badly for, it won’t have anywhere NEAR the happy ending they think it will.

  21. 21
    Bill Arnold says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    …gun control law signed by Ronald Reagan.

    One wonders whether that would be a possible outcome now (assuming an animate Ronald Reagan).

  22. 22
    different-church-lady says:

    @bluehill:

    I read some of the comments in the local newspaper about the killing and they basically said he deserved it for not cooperating with the police. I wondered if those commenters would have said that the white guy deserved to be shot as well.

    Well, the difference is that in the first case the black guy didn’t cooperate with police, but in the second case the police cooperated with the white guy.

  23. 23
    different-church-lady says:

    @Bill Arnold:

    One wonders whether that would be a possible outcome now (assuming an animate Ronald Regan).

    If it weren’t for the 22nd amendment Regan’s rotting corpse would still be president today.

  24. 24
    C.V. Danes says:

    @bluehill:

    I wonder how people in Texas would feel about open carry if groups of minorities started walking carrying AR-15s. Might just change their view about the constitution and all that.

    No, but there would be blood, for sure.

  25. 25
    Schlemizel says:

    I will disagree about one thing, releasing the cops name. At this point there is no benefit & a huge risk of vigilante justice. Does not matter to me if he has it coming or not its just not part of a society I want to live in. Just like that kid did not deserve street justice neither does this cop. I don’t want to live in a world where cops shoot unarmed kids either but it seems that if the cop or his family is harmed by a mob or a murderer the response will be more young dead minority kids not fewer.

    We do need a full and fair investigation and it seems pretty obvious that the locals cannot deliver that – at least not without the appearance of it being tainted. Lets bring in the State and the FBI and do this right. It will serve justice better and if it turns out it was as ugly as it seems. Getting the truth out without violence might have a greater impact on those who like to pretend that cops do not mistreat minorities.

  26. 26
  27. 27
    Trentrunner says:

    Sidenote: Ezra Klein is onto something with Vox.

    Bullet-pointing contextualized facts? Yes, please!

  28. 28
    Ben Cisco says:

    @bluehill:

    I wonder how people in Texas would feel about open carry if groups of minorities started walking carrying AR-15s. Might just change their view about the constitution and all that.

    I’ll say this just once.

    All that would result in is dead groups of minorities. FULL STOP.

  29. 29
    Patrick says:

    @Schlemizel:

    I will disagree about one thing, releasing the cops name. At this point there is no benefit & a huge risk of vigilante justice.

    If it had been a civilian, wouldn’t the person’s identity would have been release already? Why is there no concern for vigilante justice then?

  30. 30
    C.V. Danes says:

    @Ben Cisco: Exactly. Who do you think the whites are arming themselves against?

  31. 31
    TooManyJens says:

    @Trentrunner: Vox’s Ferguson explainer is great. I wish they’d focus more on that kind of work and cut out the shallow clickbaity crap, but I guess they need that stuff for their revenues.

  32. 32
    bluehill says:

    @Ben Cisco: Unfortunately, you guys are right.

  33. 33
    flukebucket says:

    @Ben Cisco:

    All that would result in is dead groups of minorities. FULL STOP.

    Amen brother. White guys can carry honest to God fully loaded weapons around town. Picking up a plastic gun at Walmart will get you killed if you are a black guy.

  34. 34
    boatboy_srq says:

    @C.V. Danes: this is why we have Tentherism. All those amendments from the 11th onward don’t mean s#!t to them. And yes, that includes one whole vote per black person, and a whole vote for each woman of voting age. They really do want to scrap all those higher amendments – including the ones they may actually like – just to get those amendments revoked. (There was a time when I thought that the wanted to keep the 22nd amendment, but then I saw how they revere Saint Ronnie and Shrub His Prophet and realized the only President they wanted to limit would be a Democrat.)

  35. 35
    geg6 says:

    @Patrick:

    Yup. That mother fucker is being paid for by tax dollars. Tax dollars that Michael Brown, his parents and all his protesting neighbors pay. Seems to me that the least they should get for their tax dollars is the name of the guy who is, by all semi-believable accounts, out there gunning people down for walking in the middle of the street.

  36. 36
    nellcote says:

    racial profiling 2013 stats from MO state AG:

    https://twitter.com/Ljay90/status/498785784766693376/photo/1

  37. 37
    Citizen_X says:

    Meanwhile, another heavily-armed white asshole makes a half-assed attempt at starting a revolution, this time by shooting at firefighters and cops, and gets…arrested.

    Helluva double standard we got in this country, eh?

  38. 38
    Arclite says:

    That’s some fucked up shit right there.

  39. 39
    drkrick says:

    @different-church-lady:

    f it weren’t for the 22nd amendment Regan’s rotting corpse would still be president today.

    Close. It would probably be Eisenhower. Kind of bit the GOP’s ass that the first President covered by the 22nd was Ike.

  40. 40
    Mandalay says:

    @Schlemizel:

    I will disagree about one thing, releasing the cops name. At this point there is no benefit & a huge risk of vigilante justice.

    I see your point, but disagree for several reasons:
    – I think the name is probably going to come out anyway. There must be dozens, if not hundreds, of cops in MO who already know who it is. Someone will blab.
    – The risk of vigilante justice is not relevant. If there is really such a risk then he can be allowed to go into hiding (or jail!) for protection, but his name should still be published.
    – Go to the website of any local newspaper. They probably have dozens of mugshots of people who have been arrested by the police, but not convicted. By definition, every one of them is innocent at the time the mugshot was taken, yet they are plastered all over the web. Some have been arrested for alleged offenses against children, and will subsequently be found innocent, yet the damage has already been done. There’s a real risk of vigilante justice there as well. If we are doing that to potentially innocent citizens we can surely also do it to potentially innocent cops, who are much better able to protect themselves.
    – Most importantly, there is a growing perception that cops are above the law, and operate under a different set of rules compared to the general public. Events in Ferguson have already made things worse, and suppressing the cop’s name just reinforces that perception. If you want people to lose confidence in the police, suppressing the name is a great way to do it.

    ETA: Post #29 makes a similar argument much more succinctly.

  41. 41
    bluehill says:

    @Citizen_X: From the wonkette comments – “what does a white guy have to do to get shoot around here?”

  42. 42
    Belafon says:

    In that block you copied, you should include the fact that the town’s population is 2/3 black.

  43. 43
    gian says:

    @Patrick:
    Good chance a civilian would be in jail and safe from most vigilante types. If it was LA County jail that would not mean safe from the deputies though

  44. 44
    Patrick says:

    @Mandalay:

    – Go to the website of any local newspaper. They probably have dozens of mugshots of people who have been arrested by the police, but not convicted. By definition, every one of them is innocent at the time the mugshot was taken, yet they are plastered all over the web. Some have been arrested for alleged offenses against children, and will subsequently be found innocent, yet the damage has already been done. There’s a real risk of vigilante justice there as well. If we are doing that to potentially innocent citizens we can surely also do it to potentially innocent cops, who are much better able to protect themselves.

    Amen. It seems rather hypocritical that we are making an exception to one group over the other irregardless who that group is. Personally, I don’t anybody should be named until they are convicted. By naming a person, the person’s life has already been ruined irregardless of a trial’s outcome.

    But be that as it may; since we already as practice are naming people, then this cop should not be allowed to be exempt.

  45. 45
    Berial says:

    From my twitter feed:

    Christopher Hayes @chrislhayes

    I interviewed the key witness to the Michael Brown shooting last night.

    The police haven’t.

    Think about that.

    2:25pm · 12 Aug 2014 · Twitter Web Client

  46. 46
    catclub says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Yeah, but do YOU want to be the balck guy carrying a long gun? I would fear for my life.

    Who will bell the cat?

  47. 47
    Mike in NC says:

    Have Sean Hannity and George Zimmerman been spotted in Ferguson yet?

  48. 48
    MattR says:

    In fortunate/unfortunate timing, the Daily Show repeated an episode from July 28th last night that includes this bit with Larry Wilmore.

  49. 49
    gian says:

    @catclub:
    Imagine the friendly fire risk for under cover black officers

  50. 50
    Citizen_X says:

    @Berial: Holy crap!

  51. 51
    BGinCHI says:

    Check this out. Here are some shopping tips for the cops who want to shoot people without consequences (to themselves).

    http://www.defense-technology......mpact.aspx

  52. 52
    skerry says:

    Statement by the President on the Passing of Michael Brown

    The death of Michael Brown is heartbreaking, and Michelle and I send our deepest condolences to his family and his community at this very difficult time. As Attorney General Holder has indicated, the Department of Justice is investigating the situation along with local officials, and they will continue to direct resources to the case as needed. I know the events of the past few days have prompted strong passions, but as details unfold, I urge everyone in Ferguson, Missouri, and across the country, to remember this young man through reflection and understanding. We should comfort each other and talk with one another in a way that heals, not in a way that wounds. Along with our prayers, that’s what Michael and his family, and our broader American community, deserve.

  53. 53
    Mike J says:

    @Belafon:

    In that block you copied, you should include the fact that the town’s population is 2/3 black.

    Somebody needs to do some GOTV.

  54. 54

    […] More. This too. And John Cole. […]

  55. 55
    kc says:

    @Berial:

    Someone needs to tell Chris that the Ferguson PD is no longer handling the investigation.

    County PD is now saying they’ve tried to contact Johnson, but haven’t gotten a return phone call. FWIW.

  56. 56
    BGinCHI says:

    Seeing all the pics from the newsfeeds, how in the fuckity fuck can the Ferguson PoPo afford all the equipment??

    Are their schools that well-equipped?

    I bet….not.

  57. 57
    Warren Terra says:

    Blacks in Ferguson are twice as likely to be stopped by police as whites … 80% of car stops involved blacks, the report said.

    If we took these numbers straight, and assumed the 80% figure for traffic stops was similar to the total proportion of stops, and assumed the people being stopped were local residents, w could only get these numbers if Blacks were a strong majority of the local community (twice as many Blacks as Whites, and that’s assuming no other ethnic groups ever get stopped; more than twice as many Blacks as Whites if you assume there’s some proportion of Latinos who do get stopped occasionally.

    So, this leads us with two options:
    1) Blacks are at least 2/3 of the town, but have 5% of the cops, 1/6 city councillors, and no other positions of authority.
    2) Blacks are a small minority of the town, and the local cops stop a LOT of black drivers who don’t live there but are trying to pass through (and don’t stop a lot of non-Black drivers).

    I suspect it’s the second, but either option is disgusting.

    ETA in comments above, someone claims it is in fact (1), the town is 2/3 Black but they have no political power.

  58. 58
    Belafon says:

    In regards to the picture at the top: Of course the guy on the left is more dangers: He’s the Predator. Just look at those dreadlocks.

    // sarcasm

  59. 59
    BGinCHI says:

    @Warren Terra: Population of Ferguson is 67% black, 2010 census.

  60. 60
    Craigo says:

    The FAA has now shut down the Ferguson airspace to any vehicle not operating at the behest of the St. Louis County PD.

    No cameras in this room, huh? Don’t want anybody seeing what goes on in here.

  61. 61
    TooManyJens says:

    @Mike in NC:

    Have Sean Hannity and George Zimmerman been spotted in Ferguson yet?

    No, but CNN had Zimmerman’s attorney, Mark O’Mara, on to discuss the case.

    Sometimes it feels like it’s impossible to be cynical enough.

    @Mike J:

    Somebody needs to do some GOTV.

    I wonder what the Voter ID situation is like in Missouri.

  62. 62
    Mike J says:

    @TooManyJens:

    I wonder what the Voter ID situation is like in Missouri.

    I don’t know about the id laws, but when I lived there they had a habit of having a hundred voting machines per block in white neighbourhoods and one per hundred thousand people in black neighbourhoods. Predictably, Republicans would complain when polling places in St. Louis stayed open until 1am.

    This comment was created in a facility where hyperbole is used. Some cross contamination may occur.

  63. 63
    bluefoot says:

    @flukebucket:

    Amen brother. White guys can carry honest to God fully loaded weapons around town. Picking up a plastic gun at Walmart will get you killed if you are a black guy.

    Hell, picking up a pack of Skittles will get you killed if you’re a black guy.

  64. 64
  65. 65
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Josh Barro @ jbarro · 49m
    Is there any purpose for police to wear camo other than to look like soldiers? Not a lot of dense vegetation in Ferguson.

  66. 66
    kc says:

    @TooManyJens:

    No, but CNN had Zimmerman’s attorney, Mark O’Mara, on to discuss the case.

    Are you kidding me? Good God, CNN is awful.

  67. 67
    Cacti says:

    I’ve taken to calling Ferguson the Johannesburg of middle America.

    In a town where 2 of every 3 residents are black, there is no reason short of institutional racism that the local police force is 94% white.

  68. 68
    Betty Cracker says:

    @skerry: The voice of reason as usual.

  69. 69
    BGinCHI says:

    Anyone here from St. Lou? Would love to hear about that part of the city and a bit more context on this from a native.

  70. 70
    some guy says:

    Michael Brown is gunned down, his body lays in the street for 4 hours, and Chris Hayes has interviewed the primary witness 2 days later. the cops haven’t.

    Can the US Dept of Justice forward a murder indictment, or does the local DA have to do that?

  71. 71
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Hunter Gathers:

    The majority of White people fear/hate Black people.

    I really don’t think that’s true. A significant and deplorable percentage, yes. The majority, no. I’d put it at around 27% if I had to guess.

  72. 72
    Woodrowfan says:

    @kc: why? It seems to me he is an expert of how to kill a young black man and get off scot-free. (yes, that was bitter sarcasm).

  73. 73
    Cacti says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    I really don’t think that’s true. A significant and deplorable percentage, yes. The majority, no. I’d put it at around 27% if I had to guess.

    I think that’s an overly generous assessment.

    I’d say about 27% are overtly racist, and another 25-30% are quietly racist.

  74. 74
    shortstop says:

    @Betty Cracker: Oh, yeah? Well, why doesn’t he ever make public statements about unarmed young white men gunned down by cops for walking in the street?

  75. 75
    different-church-lady says:

    @Betty Cracker: Yeah, but I’d love to hear what his anger translator has to say on this one.

  76. 76
    Hunter Gathers says:

    @Betty Cracker: Romney got 60% of the White vote. And a lot of White bigots don’t vote. Unless you’re a Bible thumper, in on the grift,or have developed a serious case of Teh Stupid, you vote Republican because you hate/fear Black people. There’s no other reason to do so.

  77. 77
    Hunter Gathers says:

    @Cacti:

    I’d say about 27% are overtly racist, and another 25-30% are quietly racist.

    The quiet ones practice ‘elegant’ racism.

  78. 78
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @shortstop: He probably would.

  79. 79
    PopeRatzo says:

    Remember, all that paramilitary hardware metropolitan police departments have been showing off, where they dress up and gear up like a character out of Counter-Strike:Global Offensive, is a gift from your friendly neighborhood Obama Administration. Here in Chicago, I live a few blocks away from the Academy and walk my dog past there a few times a day, and I’ve watched the big flat-bed trucks pulling up and unloading all that surplus stuff from Iraq and Afghanistan, and most of it has come in the past six years.

    The Feds are driving this militarization of local police departments.

    Never too much money for Big Defense, Big Intelligence and keeping minorities in the US version of Gaza.

  80. 80
    Cacti says:

    @Hunter Gathers:

    In the former confederate states, I’d say the number is more in the 60-70% range.

  81. 81
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @BGinCHI:

    I haven’t seen Tommy the last few days. I know he lives in Illinois, across the river, but he’s mentioned St. Louis on a number of occasions and I have a sense he is pretty familiar with the area. Tommy, if you’re out there, I for one would be very interested in your thoughts.

  82. 82
    shortstop says:

    @Cacti: I’d say:

    –27% are overt
    –25-30% are “quiet” or “elegant”
    –Another 25-30% aren’t particularly racist but don’t give the problem of racism much thought, either
    –The rest are aware how bad the problem still is, are trying significantly hard, but even then can sometimes be prey to cultural/environmental modes of stereotyping or dismissal

  83. 83
    drkrick says:

    @Betty Cracker:

    @Hunter Gathers:

    The majority of White people fear/hate Black people.

    @ Betty Cracker:

    I really don’t think that’s true. A significant and deplorable percentage, yes. The majority, no. I’d put it at around 27% if I had to guess.

    27% of the general population. Closer to 35% of the white portion, I would imagine.

  84. 84
    shortstop says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Of course he would — if unarmed young white men were getting gunned down by cops for walking on the street.

  85. 85
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Hunter Gathers:

    Unless you’re a Bible thumper, in on the grift,or have developed a serious case of Teh Stupid, you vote Republican because you hate/fear Black people.

    Yeah, but the bible thumpers, grifters and stupids comprise tens of millions of people. And of course, some categories overlap. I’m a white person who grew up among working class people in the rural South. I am not disputing that there are millions of racists or that racism is a huge and horrible problem. I just don’t think it’s accurate to say the majority of white people hate and fear black people. There’s no way to know it for a certainty, but my sense — and my hope — is it’s less pervasive than that.

  86. 86
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @drkrick: Probably not. The John Birch Society (Glenn Beck’s ideological parents) thought Eisenhower was a Communist.

  87. 87
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @shortstop: Exactly.

    @PopeRatzo: Congratulations on finding a way to blame this on your bête noire.

  88. 88
    kc says:

    @skerry:

    People already picking it apart, from the right and the left.

  89. 89
    shortstop says:

    @Betty Cracker: It’s hard to disentangle the threads of the toxic tribalism that’s on the right now. Republicanism in 2014 is a noxious brew of Christian fundamentalism, racism, sexism, nativism, homophobia, poor-bashing, worship of aristocracy, bellicosity on the international stage, etc., etc. Not every Republican embraces every one of those things, and Republicans embrace different ones to different degrees, but they’re all critical parts of the character of The Tribe.

  90. 90
    Baud says:

    @some guy:

    Can the US Dept of Justice forward a murder indictment, or does the local DA have to do that?

    There’s no general federal murder statute. The feds would be pursuing a civil rights violation.

  91. 91
    kc says:

    @shortstop:

    Yeah, and what about the beer that got looted? THINK OF THE BEER.

  92. 92
    skerry says:

    @kc: He’s damned if you do and damned if you don’t. I think releasing a written statement was smart given the reaction to his verbal comments on Trayvon Martin’s shooting.

  93. 93
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: Someone dropped into the earlier thread, nym Missouri Buckeye, who said this was about six miles from his home.

    I don’t think I’ve seen Tommy since some people started making fun of his writing.

  94. 94
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @BGinCHI: I live in St. Louis County, a few miles from Ferguson.

    While Ferguson is an older suburb and majority black, I didn’t consider it dangerous. I did some canvassing for Claire McCaskill and Obama in areas fairly close to where the shooting happened.

    From what I’ve heard the local residents are outraged and humiliated by the looting. They say that the looters are outsider criminals who came in because they saw an opportunity. They have asked for no more protests at the site of the shooting.

    KSDK broke into its programming last night with live coverage of the police throwing tear gas at people who were there, and had told people to “return to their homes”, even though since this was a residential area, some of the people actually were at their homes.

    The news media were also told to leave by police because they were “endangering lives.” The KSDK reporter on the scene was visibly scared and was being affected by the tear gas (she tweeted about it later).

    It seems that right now there is just an uneasy silence. No one wants to talk about it. But we are all horrified that this is how we get on the national and international news.

  95. 95
    Hunter Gathers says:

    @Betty Cracker: I switch back and forth between majority/minority of Whites hates/fears Black people. The annual Summer War On Black People usually puts me in the ‘majority’ camp until October.

  96. 96
    PopeRatzo says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):

    Congratulations on finding a way to blame this on your bête noire.

    Well, Ol’ Bête Noire-in-Chief and Co have sure made it a lot easier for police departments, national and local,, to treat citizens like the enemy.

    When you assume that everyone is a suspect, it’s a short hop to “everyone is a criminal”. Then, the inner city becomes instant Gaza.

  97. 97
    trizzlor says:

    Besides, shouldn’t you have something to fear when you shoot an unarmed teen eight times, most in the back as he fled unarmed?

    The idea that vigilante justice (or fear of it) would be a positive outcome is easily the dumbest commentary I’ve read to date on this mess. Should the PD also release the addresses of family members (not like they’re hard to find), to really get the point across?

  98. 98
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @kc: After all this time, Johnson now says he will only talk with the FBI.

    Can you blame him?

  99. 99
    TooManyJens says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: People did what to Tommy? God damn it.

  100. 100
    carlweese says:

    @Alison: Exactly as has just happened with Israel in Gaza.

  101. 101
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism:

    That’s a shame. Those comments made me very uncomfortable, and I’m ashamed I didn’t say something at the time. I hope Tommy comes back.

  102. 102
    raven says:

    @BGinCHI: Ozark Hillbilly knows what’s what.

  103. 103
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @TooManyJens:

    Yep.

  104. 104
    PurpleGirl says:

    @PopeRatzo: The militarization began years ago with the War Against (Some) Drug Users/Drugs. It has been funded by the Feds and by localities being able to seize property and money from people (not just drug sellers).

  105. 105
    Betty Cracker says:

    @Hunter Gathers: Understandable. I’m often in despair about the human race altogether.

  106. 106
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @PopeRatzo: , is a gift from your friendly neighborhood Obama Administration.

    Soon as I saw your nym, I knew you’d get there, Puddin.

  107. 107
    Luna Sea says:

    I grew up in Ferguson, up to the 5th grade back in the late 60s. It’s a part of the north side of St. Louis County, very near the city. My father moved us across the river in the early part of the “white flight” thing back then. I was just a kid, but even then I thought that whole idea was incredibly stupid. I now live in another part of the county (after spending a couple decades in Chicago, by the way), but one sister lives in a town right next to Ferguson. I would say a lot of the older, long-time white residents have thought of the growing population of black residents as a sort of migration from the city of St. Louis (if not invasion). Since I moved back to St. Louis, I’ve been amazed at how much more diverse the suburbs are, which I love — when I was a kid, it was mostly white, mostly German immigrants. Now there are all sorts of different populations, Asian, Bosnian, Latino. It’s a much more interesting place than when I grew up here. So maybe there’s hope yet.

    I have to mention the local NBC affiliate here is doing a pretty good job at coverage. They just did a story about the racial make-up of the Ferguson P.D. According to the department, they’re having trouble getting young African American men to join the force, but they would love to be more diverse. (I’m paraphrasing, but that’s the gist.) Anyway, they’ve been doing a pretty good job avoiding the Fox-like coverage of the other stations.

    Regarding where a small town gets the kind of force shown on the news, frequently when there is a big incident like a shooting or fire, etc., in any of the smaller cities in STL county, all neighboring cities get involved, as well as county police, state troupers, etc. So when you see lots of cops in the images, it’s not always just the one town, in this case Ferguson. It’s not like they have an army, just kind of looks that way.

    I will also say that one of the infuriating things about the show of force last night was the cops kept yelling at the residents to go home. The residents yelled back that they WERE home. I think I would have been out there screaming at the cops, too.

    Anyway, that’s my little take on things from someone who lives nearby… Not sure it helped any.

  108. 108
    skerry says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: Johnson’s on MSNBC with Al Sharpton right now.

  109. 109
    raven says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: I looked back, that shit was uncalled for. I think people here need to shun Corner Stone, seriously do not engage him. As for Omnes, I’m really surprised.

  110. 110
    JPL says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: Well if Tommy is reading this, just ignore the jerks.

    @Missouri Buckeye: Thank you for the update. In the past, were there concerns about the police?

  111. 111
    Luna Sea says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: Hi, Neighbor! ;-)

  112. 112
    raven says:

    ruemara says:
    block August 7, 2014 at 1:35 am
    Is there a reason why people are mocking Tommy? I mean, it’s one thing to mock people who are jerks, but a someone who seems to be a decent sort, who isn’t out there picking fights for no reason, you’re mocking him? A little surprised at this level of mean girls-itis.

  113. 113
    different-church-lady says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: It’s only a matter of time before someone ties the NSA into this.

    I’ll be like a unified field theory made out of derpbro.

  114. 114
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @skerry: I should have said that the only *law enforcement* he’ll talk to now it the FBI.

    But it’s simply been investigatorial malpractice that he hasn’t been interviewed yet, and after all these interviews he simply will not be believed by anyone who currently believes the cop was in the right.

  115. 115
    raven says:

    And my pal Steeplejack who has just fucking skewered me for what he found to be inappropriate.

  116. 116
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @raven: I don’t want to further derail this thread with discussions of Tommy, but I would be happy to address my part such as it is in an open thread.

  117. 117
    John Cole +0 says:

    @trizzlor:

    The idea that vigilante justice (or fear of it) would be a positive outcome is easily the dumbest commentary I’ve read to date on this mess.

    WTF? I’m not calling for vigilante justice. I’m saying that if I were a cop, I’d be afraid of the community response if I shot an unarmed kid eight times for no reason. Wouldn’t you? Letting him hide by anonymity shows other officers that they can do what they want and get away with it.

    It would be nice if he also feared going to jail, but it looks like the Ferguson PD isn’t going to even bother with a serious investigation, since they haven’t even interviewed the eyewitness yet. At this point, the Justice Department should just take over every investigation of police shootings nationwide. We simply can not trust local police to do the right thing.

  118. 118
  119. 119
    beth says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: I was just watching his interview and thinking the same thing. The account of the incident he gave tonight is twice as long as it was last night. His lawyer isn’t doing him any favors by having him appear on tv giving interviews. It’s going to come back and bite the case right on the ass.

  120. 120
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @JPL: I had not heard this about the police problem before. That’s why this whole thing has been so shocking. It’s apparent I’ve been pretty ignorant.

    My only interaction with local cops have been falling prey to speed traps in Berkeley (MO) and Bel Ridge.

    But that’s the advantage to being a white guy :-)

    What I have known about is extreme racist attitudes in areas that are fairly close, like South City and St. Charles. One reason why I don’t live there.

  121. 121
    raven says:

    @beth: Yep, save that stuff for court.

  122. 122
    Patternmaker says:

    My work sometimes takes me into police procurement. A riot is EXACTLY what they want, and what they get off on training and buying equipment for.

  123. 123
    BGinCHI says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: Thanks for that. I hope we get to hear more from locals.

  124. 124
    mclaren says:

    Of course the police want a riot. Then they can justify acquiring all that military weaponry and all those SWAT tanks and MRAP vehicles.

  125. 125
    BGinCHI says:

    @PopeRatzo: Thanks for nailing Obama’s Prime Directive.

    Dumbass.

  126. 126
    PurpleGirl says:

    Forfeiture laws exist at all levels of government. That lady who was found having $41,000 on her person before boarding a plane — got caught in the snare and was being stupid to begin with. Yes,she could lose it all. That’s how much of military gear is bought, or they get it from the Feds (either excess equipment or money to buy it).

    Tommy (if you are reading this): Come back. I miss you. (Lots of other people do too.)

  127. 127
    BGinCHI says:

    @TooManyJens: When did that happen?? Goddamn it.

  128. 128
    Patrick says:

    @trizzlor:

    The idea that vigilante justice (or fear of it) would be a positive outcome is easily the dumbest commentary I’ve read to date on this mess. Should the PD also release the addresses of family members (not like they’re hard to find), to really get the point across?

    Fine. But then don’t release the names of non-police people who have been arrested but not convicted. Why should cops that behave badly get a free pass? Such hypocrisy…

  129. 129
    chelsea530 says:

    @Berial: Well, he’s been taped now. People were worried about him changing his story.

    He needed to get his account down. He’s as shocked as anyone would be if present. He saw his friend who was walking with him get shot and killed for no reason.

    For no reason. Think about that.

    That poor kid.

  130. 130
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @Luna Sea: Hi :-)

    Just for completeness, I am a transplant (hence my InternetName), but I’ve lived in North County for 25 years.

    Yes, STL County has become more diverse, but there are still pockets of extreme racists in the County. However, most of the racists moved to St. Charles.

  131. 131
    BGinCHI says:

    @Luna Sea: Thanks for this.

  132. 132
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @raven: I missed that (Steeplejack). I was surprised at Omnes the other day too.

  133. 133
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: You know, I have become so inured to police wearing camo that I didn’t even consider this.

    It seems that the police want to play soldier without all the danger of actually becoming one.

  134. 134
    patroclus says:

    @PopeRatzo: I thought Congress did the appropriations. Do you mean that the Obama administration is now circumventing the Constitution and allocating money to local police forces all by itself?? Please explain…

  135. 135
    Missouri Buckeye says:

    @Cacti: Just for clarification, Missouri is not a former Confederate state.

  136. 136
    kc says:

    !! I love Tommy. He’s the nicest person here.

    If he doesn’t come back, I’m kicking Corner Stone’s ass.

  137. 137
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @SiubhanDuinne: It was long since over by the time I saw it, so I wrestled my Inner Moderator down. If I’m not mistaken, that’s two people Corner Stone has run off in the last week or so.

  138. 138
    Luna Sea says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: Agreed. My teen years were in St. Charles, back when it was mostly rural. I was shocked (well, maybe disappointed, not shocked) when I moved back here to find it’s so chock full of totally right-wing batshit crazies. I mean, it was a challenge back in the 70s, but I don’t even like driving out there now. I’m in Creve Coeur, which is an appropriately named place for my state of mind these days….

  139. 139
    kc says:

    @Missouri Buckeye:

    @kc: After all this time, Johnson now says he will only talk with the FBI.

    Can you blame him?

    Noo, but . . the FBI isn’t the entity doing the investigation of the shooting.

    I don’t think it helps the investigation for his lawyer to say, “Gee, we can’t get the PD to listen to us” and then when the PD follows up, turn around say “Nope, we’re not talking to you.”

    Johnson’s gotta do what’s right for him, though.

  140. 140
    BGinCHI says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: The loss of Corner Stone would be an addition by subtraction.

    I like to mix it up with him/her on occasion, but not everyone’s cup of tea.

  141. 141
  142. 142
    Cacti says:

    @Missouri Buckeye:

    Just for clarification, Missouri is not a former Confederate state.

    Well, yes and no. Secession was never adopted by Missouri, but confederate partisans did send representatives to the confederate legislature, and Missouri was one of the stars on the confederate flag. Non-uniformed confederate thugs like Quantrill, Bloody Bill Anderson, and the James brothers also operated out of Missouri. And of course, there was the border war and bleeding Kansas prior to the Civil War.

    5th generation Missourian here. I know the place pretty well.

  143. 143
    raven says:

    @BGinCHI: This was not the first time he attacked Tommy. citation on request

  144. 144
    raven says:

    @Cacti: Ride With the Devil by Ang Lee is a wonderful movie about that.

  145. 145
    BGinCHI says:

    @raven: There is also a really great novel about Jesse James and the James Gang that is criminally underrated.

    Called The Chivalry of Crime, by Desmond Barry.

    Check it out.

    ETA: It’s got great stuff on the whole context from which JJ emerged and into which he did all of the things he (and they) did. Especially the role of newspapers.

  146. 146
    Chyron HR says:

    @PopeRatzo:

    Bête Noire

    Hate to break it to you, sport, but that’s not actually a fancy way of saying “nigger”.

  147. 147
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @Chyron HR: To be fair, I used it first.

  148. 148
    patroclus says:

    @raven: Them Yankees, what with their public schools teaching them how to think exactly the same way and all, have no sense of propriety or station. They’re always throwing mumbletypegs at squirrels and whatnot.

  149. 149
    raven says:

    @BGinCHI: Interesting that he’s a ferriner too!

  150. 150
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @BGinCHI: CS reminds me a lot of a troll I knew years ago who made a hobby of blowing up gaming fora.

  151. 151
    Morbo says:

    @Missouri Buckeye: Perhaps someone should let the St. Louis County chief of police know that.

  152. 152
    raven says:

    @patroclus: Yea, Ang Lee is an Illini!

  153. 153
    BGinCHI says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: Now there is a sentence you don’t read every day.

  154. 154
    Mike in NC says:

    @mclaren:

    Then they can justify acquiring all that military weaponry and all those SWAT tanks and MRAP vehicles.

    Unfortunately, local politicians view this as a win-win scenario where their police departments (town/county/state) get free stuff that the feds no longer have a need for. Who, they say, could possibly be against that?

    As for the feds, they like the publicity it gets in the local papers. More importantly, it would cost more to scrap the MRAPs and other surplus hardware than it would be to simply donate it to law enforcement agencies. They’ve done the same thing in Iraq and Afghanistan in setting up local “anti-terrorist” groups (though they might well be used to keep the Sunnis or Shiites in line, depending on the situation) because they don’t want the expense to ship all that stuff stateside.

  155. 155
    shortstop says:

    I have just summoned a friend of mine who had the exceptional misfortune to live in St. Charles, Missouri for three years — recently. I figured he’d want to get a few punches of his own in before this thread dies.

  156. 156
    ed says:

    Fresh from Reddit/Imgur, Chapelle the prophet

  157. 157
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @BGinCHI: Around the turn of the century, the RPG community (and I use that term loosely) was a lot like the Baptists. They would fracture at the drop of a hat, half the group running off to start their own forum over some difference that made no sense to outsiders. This guy enjoyed finding those minor cracks and driving wedges into them.

    He tried that on us, figuring that the weak moderation there would give him free reign, and I ran him off instead. Chased him off with a virtual frying pan, actually. It had a lot to do with how I ended up taking over the moderator’s hat there.

  158. 158
    raven says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism: I sent him a flickr email.

  159. 159
    shortstop says:

    @BGinCHI: That sounds like something I need to read.

  160. 160
    shortstop says:

    @kc: Save a good punt for Steeplejack. His rationalizing in that thread is almost worse than CS’s original offense.

  161. 161
    trizzlor says:

    @John Cole +0

    Ferguson PD: We’re not releasing the name for fear of harm to officer and family
    JC: “shouldn’t you have something to fear when you shoot an unarmed teen eight times”

    How is that supposed to be interpreted if not support for fear of vigilante justice? When the perpetrator’s name gets out, do you think he’s going be fearing a sternly worded letter from the community … or fearing for his life? And yes, “hiding in anonymity” should be granted to any suspect when there is clear risk of violent retribution, public shaming can wait for a trial.

  162. 162
    kc says:

    @shortstop:

    I don’t even wanna read it; it’s going to piss me off.

  163. 163
    raven says:

    @kc: Now I hit his twitter, work and facebook.

  164. 164
    kc says:

    @raven:

    Tell him to get his ass back over here.

  165. 165
    different-church-lady says:

    @Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism:

    Chased him off with a virtual frying pan, actually. It had a lot to do with how I ended up taking over the moderator’s hat there.

    And you haven’t repeated that action in the current circumstances why?

  166. 166
    TooManyJens says:

    They’ve released the preliminary autopsy results.

    ST. LOUIS COUNTY – St. Louis County Police have released preliminary results of an autopsy done on the body of 18-year-old Michael Brown.

    It shows he died as the result of gunshot wounds. Police won’t specify how many times the teen was shot.

    Sure, sounds legit.

  167. 167
    raven says:

    @kc: I was a tad more gentle than that but that was the gist. That is why I urged a total shunning. People here won’t do it but, hey, I tried.

  168. 168
    raven says:

    @different-church-lady: Because the asshole in question relishes the attention. That is why I urged a total shunning. People here won’t do it but, hey, I tried.

  169. 169
    Another Holocene Human (now with new computer) says:

    @trizzlor: Well, shame can kill, but seriously, where are these supposed vigilantes? G-Zim’s still breathing, after all. Like others have said upthread, all of this “unrest” is a pre-determined conclusion by police.

    I sit here and read about Russian expansionism and the news from Ukraine, all the provocations, the “good guys with guns” the extra-judicial killings, the firing on protesters, then I read about Ferguson PD and I can’t fucking tell the difference. Same old shit, just a different language.

  170. 170
    kc says:

    @TooManyJens:

    Police won’t specify how many times the teen was shot.

    What the hell! There is NO justification for that!

  171. 171
    Sister Rail Gun of Warm Humanitarianism says:

    @different-church-lady: Well, I had a lot more energy back then….

    I was also a major contributor to the site. Not so much here.

  172. 172
    Another Holocene Human (now with new computer) says:

    @raven: Thanks for going to the effort.

    CS should have been banned or put in the box for at least a week when he ran off that first commenter last week. His behavior in that thread was atrocious. Just pointless abuse of a newbie, no excuse for it.

  173. 173
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @kc: It will be in the autopsy report. It will be used by the prosecution.

  174. 174
    raven says:

    @Another Holocene Human (now with new computer): If I don’t get any action in a reasonable amount of time I’ll distribute his contact info.

  175. 175
    raven says:

    Lauren Bacall just died.

  176. 176
    tybee says:

    @raven:

    give him a few days.

  177. 177
    kc says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):

    Don’t understand why the PD won’t release it now . . . it won’t take the ME four weeks to count the bullet entry wounds.

  178. 178
    raven says:

    @tybee: roger

    how’d you do with the net?

  179. 179
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    @raven: Now that was a helluva life. That’s gonna be a marathon to watch for. especially The Big Sleep.

  180. 180
    raven says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist: To Have and Have Not is killer. We just watched it.

  181. 181
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @kc: My understanding is that the PD is more or less out of the investigation now.

  182. 182
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @raven: “Was you ever bit by a dead bee?”

    Unrelated: I may be going out on a salmon fishing charter on Lake Michigan later this month.

  183. 183
    kc says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name):

    City’s out. This is the County PD, which I thought took over the investigation.

    Things could have changed, though.

  184. 184
    raven says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): Downriggers? I used to fish for them in Muskegon around Labor Day.

    Here’s one we got on a “Loco” spoon.

  185. 185
    raven says:

    Of course To Have and Have Not is a fishin movie!

  186. 186
    Lolly says:

    @Berial: That’s because they aren’t trying to find out what happened. Heck, they probably already know.

    They are trying to get their story down.

  187. 187
  188. 188
    tybee says:

    @raven:

    nada. nothing big enough to keep.

    excellent exercise but no dinner.

  189. 189
    raven says:

    @tybee: Fuck it, you can’r win if you don’t play! The garden club party is this weekend and Cobia tacos it will be.

  190. 190
    Citizen_X says:

    @TooManyJens:

    It shows he died as the result of gunshot wounds.

    Now there’s a fucking news flash. Good job, FuPD!

  191. 191
    kc says:

    @Jim, Foolish Literalist:

    I can watch The Big Sleep repeatedly . . . without ever understanding the plot. Doesn’t matter, though.

  192. 192
    raven says:

    @kc: Well, Key Largo is insanely good too!

  193. 193
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @raven: Dunno. My dad is arranging the thing for a bunch of us. I let you know details when I have them.

  194. 194
  195. 195
    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @raven: BTW, I addressed the Tommy situation in next thread up if you are interested.

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  197. 197
    rikyrah says:

    @raven:
    HOLD UP!
    Who was mocking Tommy?

  198. 198
    raven says:

    @Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name): I read it. I really have trouble disagreeing with you except that I think the dude has a good heart.

  199. 199
    raven says:

    @rikyrah: Well, it’s complicated.

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    Omnes Omnibus (the first of his name) says:

    @raven:

    I think the dude has a good heart.

    So do I.

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  202. 202
    Larv says:

    @Another Holocene Human (now with new computer):

    CS should have been banned or put in the box for at least a week when he ran off that first commenter last week. His behavior in that thread was atrocious. Just pointless abuse of a newbie, no excuse for it.

    I missed that. Can anyone give me a link to the thread?

  203. 203
    metricpenny says:

    They won’t release how many bullet wounds because they realized too late that the “detain, arrest, and, if necessary, kill, every black male you can” law enforcement policy kind of got put on hold with the NYPD’s choking to death a man for allegedly selling untaxed SINGLE cigarettes.

    That Ferguson police THUG thought he was okay to shoot a black man D.E.D. for refusing to walk on the sidewalk and not the street because this nation has conditioned its citizens to devalue black life.

    Now, with black folks having the ability to PROVE (video) the allegations we have been making for decades about police BRUTALITY, maybe we can use it as the stepping off point for addressing the problem we have with racism in this country.

    White supremacy is at the root of all of this.

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    raven says:

    @Larv: That’s a tough one. It was easy enough to track down the Tommy threads but I don’t recall her name or the thread.

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    hoodie says:

    I lived in StL as a kid, and still have family around there. StL has always had bad race relations, traditionally very segregated. North StL suburbs like Jennings and Ferguson were the first stop for the white flight from N. StL areas (e.g., N. Grand area), then they moved out to Florissant and Hazelwood, then even further out to St. Charles and St. Peters. This white flight left a lot of suburbanites in StL with a kind of apocalyptic view of the city, particularly those that came from this northern/northwestern migration, so the attitudes of the cops is not that surprising. A lot of the guys from that background have really racist attitudes (my sister married one).

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    raven says:

    @hoodie: And then there is East St Louis.

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    Anne Laurie says:

    @Botsplainer:

    I’m guessing we won’t hear from Greenwald on this.

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Dudebros not involved in this one.

    You would be wrong.

    @Schlemizel:

    I don’t want to live in a world where cops shoot unarmed kids either but it seems that if the cop or his family is harmed by a mob or a murderer the response will be more young dead minority kids not fewer.

    You, on the other hand, would be correct!

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    Snarki, child of Loki says:

    The overwhelming majority of domestic dogs are wonderful; when called upon to protect, they will often show more courage and loyalty than many humans.

    But a rabid dog is very dangerous, and should be treated with extreme caution.

    Ditto the cops.

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    cmm says:

    I’m on vacation and mostly staying offline, so I hadn’t heard much about this. But John’s post with the eyewitness report and the “riot” stuff makes this cop sick to her stomach. I hope there is some measure of justice for Mr. Brown. I’m ashamed that I share a profession with these people.

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    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @raven: Me too.

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    KS in MA says:

    @Citizen_X: “This seems to be the work of thieves.” (Police constable, in a really old Peter Cook/Dudley Moore routine)

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    Steve J. says:

    Speaking of tear gas, here are Ferguson’s finest shooting teargas into a guy’s lawn because he would not disperse… from his own yard:
    A few years ago, I think a woman was arrested in her own yard for taking pictures of an arrest.

  213. 213
    Dog On Porch says:

    It’s hard to believe. I mean, that a state upright enough to have honored Rush Limbaugh by enshrinement into its Pantheon of Great Missourians is plagued by this type of trouble. Go figure.

  214. 214
    gian says:

    @gian: @gian:

    it looks like my cut and paste attempt a long while back on my phone failed.

    it was supposed to be a link to the story on the settlement of the shooting death of Douglas Zerby by the long beach police department. Mr Zerby was drunk, stoned, and sitting outside a dwelling playing with a garden hose when he was shot and killed by cops who did it “from cover” and never announced their presence.
    The late Mr. Zerby, like, the late Mr Thomas (of fullerton) were not “people of color”
    these are just two fairly local cases that I recall. Mr. Zerby’s death supposedly has resulted in a change in reporting the names of shooters…

    http://homicide.latimes.com/post/douglas-zerby/

    the “Belmont shore” area of long beach is a rather high-rent zip code.

    a local small paper on the fullerton case. don’t look if you don’t want to see a guy who had enough of his face broken to choke and die on his own blood:
    http://www.fullertonsfuture.or.....s-beating/

  215. 215
    BruinKid says:

    This is really starting to feel like St. Louis’s version of the L.A. Riots of 1992. We had the same racial disparity problem in the LAPD back then. Things have gotten a lot better since then. (And no, that doesn’t mean things are hunky dory in Los Angeles now.)

  216. 216
    Larry says:

    Greenwald’s reporting ‘beat’ for years before Snowden was and is still the constitutional violation of privacy exercised in the service of a presumed but out-of-control national security. This has been his whole focus. Why you even mention Greenwald as you do, stupidly and negatively, is just pointless baiting. You know less than nothing if you think Greenwald has to chime in on every subject under the sun. This subject is a serious one, and not just locally of course. But your comment about “dudebros” etc just entirely misses any point worth making. Get over your stupid biases.

  217. 217
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Anne Laurie:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Dudebros not involved in this one.

    You would be wrong.

    Why does a mere retweet count?

  218. 218

    @BGinCHI:

    Seeing all the pics from the newsfeeds, how in the fuckity fuck can the Ferguson PoPo afford all the equipment??

    Post 9/11 Homeland Security threw bazillions of dollars at states and local PDs. ‘Cause, you know, the terrorists were coming to the Heartland. Little did we know that the terrorists would be wearing badges.

  219. 219
    Dr. Squid says:

    @PurpleGirl: Silly person. History began on January 20, 2009. Nothing that happened in the Before Time counts. Such is the Way Of The Emo.

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