I’d Like to See More of This

This is excellent and should be happening a helluva lot more often:

A reverend in Illinois organized a demonstration to hand out condoms outside of a local Hobby Lobby store in order to protest the Supreme Court’s ruling on contraception, the Daily Herald reported.

Rev. Mark Winters of the First Congregational United Church of Christ in Naperville, Ill., said it started out as a joke in a Facebook, but after he got a great response, he decided to organize a protest.

The group of demonstrators stood outside the store to hand out condoms donated by Planned Parenthood.

Winters told the Daily Herald that he wanted the protest to show that not all Christians oppose birth control. He also said he hoped to get people to question whether the Supreme Court’s decision was fair to Hobby Lobby employees’ religious freedom.

“You can make the religious freedom argument, you can make the argument about contraception, but ultimately, for me, this is about power,” he said. “Jesus had a lot of issue with powerful people using power over the powerless.”

As an atheist, I recognize there are some really good people who believe and that religion is not all evil, but damned, why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived? And if you are voting due to your religious beliefs, I just find that really, really weird. And they should have handed out female contraception, as I’ve not heard of any man being denied viagra and condoms are a dime a dozen. Hand out some stuff the women can use, because they are the ones being, well, screwed.

At any rate, it’s nice to see some people out there telling America that not all people of faith are taking their marching orders from the Opus Dei wing of SCOTUS and the Vatican.






68 replies
  1. 1
    NotMax says:

    Hand out some stuff the women can use

    Rather a sticky wicket there, what with prescirptions, medical insertion and all.

  2. 2
    Baud says:

    why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    Yeah, we often talk about the decline of unions but never about the decline of progressive and left-wing populist churches, etc. Between those two groups, that’s a lot of lost organizing capacity.

  3. 3
    gbear says:

    why are they so damned quiet all the time

    The ‘Moral Monday’ folks a couple states south of you have been pretty good at making some noise. I wish that was happening in more states.

  4. 4
    Corner Stone says:

    If some kook started handing out IUDs I’m not sure that would be helpful in any real sense.
    Listen, Cole. I get what you’re clumsily saying. But this isn’t about handing women anything. It’s about recognizing they are equal, with equal rights.
    No package of pez dispenses is going to make that point.

  5. 5
    The Dangerman says:

    …why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived.

    Because people that aren’t the lunatics don’t make the evening news and, unless you listen for them in other places, you probably won’t hear them.

  6. 6
    300baud says:

    Women can’t use condoms?

  7. 7
    PurpleGirl says:

    The liberal and progressive churches do try to promote their beliefs but the not-so liberal media don’t go to them for comments or sound bites because the comments are thought to be too literate, complex and nuanced. And most Americans don’t do nuance.

  8. 8
    beth says:

    I spent a few hours with the pastor of our Methodist church the other day while we waited in a hospital with a member whose wife was having an operation. We spoke about the Hobby Lobby decision and how the right wing Christians are really ruining the reputation of Christianity. I was surprised at how pissed off he was and he said that during the conference meetings he and the other pastors talk about this all the time. He’s preached a few sermons lately about knowing your neighbors on the fringes and showing mercy to all which have rumpled quite a few feathers in the congregation. He predicts there will be a large backlash against the zealots because they are starting to be seen among the clergy as one of the largest causes of declining church membership. It was good to hear this from someone who might actually be in a position to push back and have people listen.

  9. 9
    WereBear says:

    Our current media is in bed with the 1% and their allies, that’s why.

  10. 10
    Matt McIrvin says:

    “You can make the religious freedom argument, you can make the argument about contraception, but ultimately, for me, this is about power,” he said. “Jesus had a lot of issue with powerful people using power over the powerless.”

    What a lot of these cases have in common is the idea that a “freedom” only truly exists if your power in that regard scales directly with money. You don’t have freedom of speech unless you can pump as much money as you want into political campaigns, and make your voice heard over those of poorer people. You don’t have freedom of religion unless having a lot of money means you can impose those beliefs on others.

  11. 11
    bago says:

    I insist that my parents pray for me Jesus style, alone in a closet, and not in public like those hypocrites.

  12. 12
    PurpleGirl says:

    Cole: Ever heard of Riverside Church? Or the Rev. William Sloane Coffin, Jr.? How about The National Council of Churches? And Dr. Tiller was a member of an ELCA congregation (Evangelical Lutheran Church in America).

  13. 13
    Mr Stagger Lee says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Also throw in Amos, a minor prophet in the Old Testament, who lashed out at some 1% ers in the Kingdom of Israel. On the Thom Hartmann show, it looks like that Hobby Lobby seems to have no problem with getting their shit from China a nation that practices forced abortion, I would love to see HL get hosed on that on by the pro-life fanatics.

  14. 14
    Mr Stagger Lee says:

    @Matt McIrvin: Also throw in Amos, a minor prophet in the Old Testament, who lashed out at some 1% ers in the Kingdom of Israel. On the Thom Hartmann show, it looks like that Hobby Lobby seems to have no problem with getting their shit from China a nation that practices forced abortion, I would love to see HL get hosed on that on by the pro-life fanatics.

  15. 15
    Helen says:

    it’s nice to see some people out there telling America that not all people of faith are taking their marching orders from the Opus Dei

    So I have told you all many times here that I am planning to move to Ireland upon retirement. One of the things that has stopped me from doing it now (6 -8 years early) is that it’s a WAY Catholic country (although that is changing rapidly). But here’s what I have been thinking over the past few days. Better to move to a country where the Catholic church runs the country, and everyone knows it, than to live in a country where they pretend that it doesn’t BUT OH YES IT DOES and oh by the way, it’s kinda, (oh well loose that kinda), illegal that it does.

    I’m in the ‘the devil you know’ territory here.

    Love and Kisses,
    Helen, born Catholic and now an FSM adherent

  16. 16
    RSR says:

    pretty sure condoms don’t actually fall under the SCOTUS ruling–or vasectomies. As a friend said in twitter regarding weather those items were in the purview of the ruling: Oh, sorry, no, so far it seems just the kind Vagina-Americans use

  17. 17
    mark says:

    another thing that should be happening a helluva a lot more is what you do here at the top,: mention what is not ever talked about in the establisment media the. “Opus Dei wing of SCOTUS and the Vatican.” Thank you Mr. Cole.

    I will always love Tom Hanks and Ron Howard for doing so in their movie when the Hanks character says “you mean, fascist Opus Dei?”.

    and lets put this in the proper context, this Catholic (and Mormon) stance against birth-control has NOTHING to do with morality. It is all about numbers and power. More Catholics (or Mormons or Evilangelicals or whatever) that are born, the better for them. Doesn’t matter if they’re poor and miserable. They’re dream is for every family to have at least 12 catholic or (insert heretical chtistianity here) kids and for their kids to have 12, etc. These people are out to destroy what little we have left of our democracy and they’re evil as hell.

  18. 18
    WereBear says:

    @beth: He predicts there will be a large backlash against the zealots because they are starting to be seen among the clergy as one of the largest causes of declining church membership.

    That’s encouraging.

  19. 19
    Sir Laffs-a-Lot says:

    JC is NOT an atheist; he revers Flying Spaghetti as much as the next person.

  20. 20
    billB says:

    While I am agnostic, I know a Catholic Father,
    and he has taken up the message of the Pope, and I hear he has given some fire-breathing sermons against the evil of money in our society. His congregation is old and grey, and un-suprisingly, the Bishop flew into town, and retired him.

  21. 21
    Schlemizel says:

    The problem with this as I see it is that a lot of women need birth control pills for reasons other than to prevent pregnancy. Handing out rubbers ties the pill to slutting around instead of hormonal therapy. This actually reinforces the wingnut meme instead of pointing out that Sharia Lobby is actively harming womens health in many ways.

    Its a cute idea but ends up counter productive to winning the morons who are not really paying attention – you know, the ones we need to vote with us so we win elections.

  22. 22

    They aren’t quiet; they just don’t get the press.

    Fox News and televangelist money make it much easier to spread the Word.

  23. 23
    Corner Stone says:

    And Cole. Denigrating K-Lo because she is a virgin does not help advance any point.

  24. 24
    DLew On Roids says:

    The churches that respect the individual aren’t hierarchical, so they don’t have some authority figure who makes headlines. The UCC structure of associations, conferences, and the national office (CLEVELAND, HELLO!), for example, exists primarily as a talking shop and HR assistance for member congregations, which decide on positions for themselves. If you truly believe in the individual, local determination, and contributing on the ground instead of showboating, you aren’t going to get publicity.

  25. 25
    Helen says:

    @Schlemizel:

    The problem with this as I see it is that a lot of women need birth control pills for reasons other than to prevent pregnancy

    Ok that right there is the problem. It does not matter why women need birth control or hormone pills or whatever the hell they are called. We are talking about legal, medically approved prescriptions.

    We need to be on the offensive, not the defensive.

    Abortion is legal in America. The END

  26. 26
    Heliopause says:

    why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    I think mainline protestants do in fact speak their minds frequently, but it’s the crazy fuckers that garner the headlines. What you’re asking for is basically a loud, obnoxious version of hippie Jesus, which is something of a contradiction. It’s kind of like asking Deadheads to out-Nuge Ted Nugent.

    And just by the way, neither version of Jesus is at all in line with the Jesus of the canon, who went out of his way to avoid secular political matters.

  27. 27
    Just Some Fuckhead says:

    As an atheist, I recognize there are some really good people who believe and that religion is not all evil, but damned, why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    Do you not see me beating them up every fucking day?

  28. 28
    bago says:

    Huh. American car companies are starting to get it.
    http://www.cadillac.com/elr-el.....l?seo=ysm_|_Cadillac-Retention-601049_|_1744%7C1753%7CIPUS%7CAU%7CB%7CS%7CBP%7CD%7CE%7CBI%7CRTN%7CELR%7CCPE_|_Cadillac+ELR_|_cadillac%20elr

  29. 29
    scav says:

    @DLew On Roids: That might be a slight over simplification. There are non-hierarchical wackos that just disagee on what they are wacko about and to what extreme and there are hierarchical organizations that are fracturing on similar issues. This Pope, while far from an ideal liberal reformer at least seems to be trying to be a good neighbor (not that his ‘mercan ‘xceptionalist bishops et alia seem to following). Some of the acephelous churches throw up ideologies you wouldn’t want to share a time zone with.

  30. 30
    pseudonymous in nc says:

    why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    They let their actions do the talking in their local communities? They think that religious belief is actually separate from politics and distinguish themselves from the Church Partisan.

    This too easily falls into the “where are the peace-loving Muslims?” trap. (Answer: they’re living their lives, in the hundreds of millions, not blowing shit up.)

    @Helen:

    It does not matter why women need birth control or hormone pills or whatever the hell they are called. We are talking about legal, medically approved prescriptions.

    Yep. And we’re talking about coverage provided by health insurance that is only “paid for by the employer” to the extent that it’s the employer that gets to pocket the tax bennies. Health insurance is no less the employee’s than cold hard cash.

  31. 31
    pseudonymous in nc says:

    @Helen:

    Better to move to a country where the Catholic church runs the country, and everyone knows it

    They got overthrown in the 1990s. Decent run of it, seventy years or so, as far as juntas go.

    Of course, now that Ireland is a net exporter of people once again, that may change (the 1990s was marked by having enough young people sticking around instead of fucking off elsewhere) but I think the spell has been broken for good.

  32. 32
    nellcote says:

    3 Female Justices Dissent In First Post-Hobby Lobby Contraception Case
    ASSOCIATED PRESS – JULY 3, 2014, 5:43 PM EDT

    WASHINGTON (AP) — A divided Supreme Court on Thursday allowed, at least for now, an evangelical college in Illinois that objects to paying for contraceptives in its health plan to avoid filling out a government document that the college says would violate its religious beliefs.

    The justices said that Wheaton College does not have to fill out the contested form while its case is on appeal but can instead write the Department of Health and Human Services declaring that it is a religious nonprofit organization and making its objection to emergency contraception. The college does provide coverage for other birth control.

    Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Elena Kagan and Sonia Sotomayor said they would have denied Wheaton’s request and made the college fill out a form that enables their insurers or third-party administrators to take on the responsibility of paying for the birth control.

  33. 33
    The Dangerman says:

    @Heliopause:

    …to out-Nuge Ted Nugent.

    In other words, Stryper. Doesn’t work.

  34. 34
    bago says:

    Ok, hooray for url encoding and input filters. cadillac.com/elr

    Sweet jesus I was wiring LED circuits 25 years ago and now they’re in American cars.

  35. 35
    FlyingToaster says:

    @Corner Stone:

    And Cole. Denigrating K-Lo because she is a virgin does not help advance any point.

    Mockery IS the point.

    K-Lo deigns to judge everyone by her so-called “morality”, which is neither moral nor by choice. She’s a virgin because no sane human (and few insane ones) would marry the crazy and desperate person she’s become.

    Those of us who share neither her religion, nor her desperation, are sickened by her rationalizations.

  36. 36
    Helen says:

    @pseudonymous in nc: Dunno. It was just last April (2013) that they decided that women dying from childbirth is not really such a good thing.

  37. 37
    hitchhiker says:

    I used to hang out with a bunch of well-off liberal in-name-only “Christians.”

    They don’t speak up politically on purpose, because they don’t want anything messy to happen in their nice, well-endowed, private club of a church.

    They don’t think jeebus died for their sins, and they sure don’t think there’s a personal god watching their every move. They belong to church in exactly the same way they belong to the local yacht club, the local Kiwanis, the local hospital board, and so on.

    Nothing wrong with that, I suppose. But understand that these people are not about sharing power or helping make things right, not even by their own standards. They’re about preserving their own (admittedly sometimes lovely) traditions and ways.

    That’s why they’re never an effective counter voice. They don’t even pretend to inhabit a religious world in the same way that evangelicals do.

  38. 38
    TG Chicago says:

    Cole @ top:

    As an atheist, I recognize there are some really good people who believe and that religion is not all evil, but damned, why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    Hey, dumbass. How am I supposed to NOT get in your shit and NOT tell you what to do and NOT try to force my beliefs on you, but be “loud” about it? Do you want me to come door to door and blather at you about how much I’m not fucking with you? That’s stupid.

    I could just as easily whine about why are so many atheists quiet about the fact that they think it’s okay for other people to believe what they want and not get in their face and tell them they’re stupid. But I don’t, because I realize that would make me a dumbass.

    And if you are voting due to your religious beliefs, I just find that really, really weird

    I vote due to my beliefs. So do you, dumbass. Some of my beliefs are based in religion; some aren’t.

    (just kidding about calling you a dumbass. Hugz!!!)

  39. 39
    angelfoot says:

    @Helen:

    Ok that right there is the problem. It does not matter why women need birth control or hormone pills or whatever the hell they are called. We are talking about legal, medically approved prescriptions.

    Yes, right. The decision elevates the metaphysical concerns of those with the strictly religious belief that life begins at conception above the very real medical concerns of women. I can’t see how this is constitutional. The court should have used this case to strike down the RFRA.

  40. 40
    Morzer says:

    @beth:

    It’s not so long ago that at least some conservative Christians were proposing to rewrite the Bible and strike out the liberal bits. I wouldn’t be remotely surprised to see them carry out that project if the more mainstream denominations finally decide that Jesus might not have been a glibertarian rider upon a pale velociraptor who advocated screwing over the poor, the sick and the suffering.

  41. 41
    Helen says:

    @angelfoot: Bwa ha ha . I think you switched our comments.

    Yup and go see me at 15. I LOVE this blog. But I am bored to death with those who say “Well, just wait till…” Let’s see:
    1. We can jerrymander in 2020 like the repubs did in 2012. Sorry boys and girls I will be 60 in 2012. I an tired of waiting.
    2. Hillary – good enough. I have said it my own self. Hillary is a bazillion times better than any republican. But I have called her a place holder to keep the repubs out until we can elect a real liberal. HA HA I joke. that will not happen on my lifetime. Which is why I am leaving. With all my cool American cash.

  42. 42
    angelfoot says:

    @Helen: Yes, I effed that up, and godspeed!

  43. 43
    Liberty60 says:

    As one of those liberal Christians, I agree with Cole that we ARE too often quiet and passive.
    I don’t like how, often its only the religious right who are bold enough to name names, and call something evil if they think it is.

    I also think thats why conservative churches, of all faiths, sustain more passion than liberal ones- they at least create a believable narrative of the world, instead of mushy “both sides, bipartisanship” bullshit.

    What the contemporary right is doing- on immigration, womens rights, the public sphere- is not in error, it is wicked and evil.

    A reasonable Christian can argue for fiscal restraint- but no one on the right is doing that. A reasonable Christian can argue against unrestrained sexuality- but no one on the right is doing that. A reasonable Christian can argue for a strong national defense- but no one on the right is doing that.

    I have come to realize that Corey Robin is correct, in that all the tropes of the right are only fig leaves for the real agenda, of enforcing the hierarchy of the powerful over the powerless.

  44. 44
    TriassicSands says:

    The obvious thing to hand out would be Plan B (available now OTC) — to the religious zealots that would be like performing abortions in front of the stores.

    Of course, the Holy Five would probably rule against the right of protesters to hand out Plan B, because as we all know, only the truly righteous deserve the protection of the US Constitution of Jesus.

  45. 45
    Helen says:

    @angelfoot: Thanks – and I love the phrase “Godspeed”

  46. 46
    Helen says:

    @TriassicSands: No, No and No. This is not about birth control. It’s about who’s fucking whom? And are they married in the eyes of God? Once again in about 5 minutes on this blog I say BWA HA HA. GOD? Surely you jest. Stop calling me Shirley!

  47. 47
    xenos says:

    @Helen: I live in Luxembourg, a Catholic constitutional monarchy, and the only result of church power is that IVF over the age of 40 requires a special ruling by a ethics panel, and there is a waiting period and required consultations for abortions up to 12 weeks. Second trimester abortions are more difficult to get. A new government not allied with the Christian Democrats will be liberalising this soon because this is widely considered to archaic.

    The Archbishop whines about this occasionally, but everybody seems to ignore him on the subject. He is a nice guy otherwise, I suppose people see him as doing what the job requires, and leave it at that.

    But there are absolutely no restrictions on birth control, which is completely covered by mandatory ACA-style health system that has been in effect for decades (so prices for Dr. visits and prescriptions are quite reasonable before the 80% coverage applies). Sex ed starts in the 5th grade, and is quite complete by the time students are in 7th. There is catechism class in the schools, integrated into the school curriculum, but that is not allowed to get in the way of Health, meaning Sex, Education.

    This place is overwhelmingly Catholic, and largely run in a fashion to accommodate the needs of the 1%ers in the financial world and the EU diplomatic world. But there are real limits to what people will put up with here.

    We have a version of the Teapartisans here, but they make up about 8% of the voting population (roughly 40% of the population can’t vote in national elections, being foreigners), not 27%. They are elderly rural types who want their country back, but tough shit, that country of farms and villages and armies rolling through flattening the place every 40 years or so is long gone.

  48. 48
    angelfoot says:

    @Helen: Maybe they should hand out the diaries of Anais Nin.

  49. 49
    Original Lee says:

    Is this how sensible people felt during the McCarthy era, when it seemed as if the country was running off the cliff over Communism? Because it sucks. I am feeling almost as if I’m stuck in a C.J. Cherryh novel where the protagonists have to deal with the impact of the unhinged on society. Although it would be better if this were one of her novels, because at least we would know the sensible people win.

  50. 50
    Helen says:

    @xenos: Oh my. Thank you for your insights. And way cool to know that in Luxembourg people are reading Balloon Juice.

    Ireland is not a monarchy (um, thanks to civil war?? because oh yes they were). And for some perspective. I am an Ireland citizen because my mother was born in Belfast. So monarchy rings big in my mind.

    The Republic of Ireland is changing and changing fast. Because of the many many horrors that have come to light. The grave of dead babies – born to unwed mothers, the foreign woman who died because a Catholic hospital would not give her an abortion. I hope that Pope Francis will focus on what is important. It seems he might.

    Ireland is moving forward. But here’s why I am going there. I am most comfortable in my skin. It is where I belong.

    Thank you for answering me.

  51. 51
    Helen says:

    @angelfoot: Was she a great writer or what?

  52. 52
    SectionH says:

    BJ’s own Villago basically has it right: left wing (I guess that would actually = Christian, as in following Christ) churches do exist, and do their best against the tide (and get shot up too), but the tiny flutter-over mentions of those sorts of churches in the Corp Media are – oh yeah, nearly non existent.

    @Morzer: I thought they’d already done that. Or maybe I’m just thinking of the [spits] creation museum [spits again] in across-the-river-Ohio. Not official, so far?

  53. 53
    SectionH says:

    @Helen: She was awesome.

  54. 54
    Morzer says:

    http://www.politicalresearch.o.....-violence/

    It could be argued that the so-called culture wars have been long on metaphor and relatively short on violence. That would be fair, even when we consider the violence directed against LGBTQ people and the four decades of arsons, bombings, and assassinations directed at abortion providers since Roe. But the protagonists of the story of the various elements of the Christian Right see themselves as playing a different role than that cast by visionaries of perpetual social progress. There are also clear tensions between those who can live with the social changes taking place in the country, those who can’t, and those who do not see the battle as one of single issues, but one of the survival of Christendom—and whether or not Christians are willing to fight for it.

    Taken singly, the views of any of the Christian Right leaders described here would not necessarily signal a trend. But taken together, the commonalities of their views take the edge off of their many differences and reveal distinct, overlapping factions of a dynamic movement towards the ideas of nullification and secession—and the possibility of violence and revolution.

    One does not have to believe that secession or revolution of any kind would be successful, or that widespread violence is likely anytime soon, to recognize that the political tensions preceding any major matters of nullification, and moves towards secession by any state, would likely beget violence of many kinds. Which is why ignoring Lane, Leithart, McCloskey, Whitney, and their like—or assuming that they are anything less than deadly serious—could be an error of historic significance.

    I’d recommend reading the whole thing if you want some idea of where the right wing extremists aka the GOP are going in religious terms.

  55. 55
    SectionH says:

    @Morzer: yeeeessss. Also too, the technical language ghastliness of it all. Which triggers some shit… or it would if “trigger” wasn’t suddenly a bad thing, because women.

  56. 56
    JW says:

    “As an atheist, I recognize there are some really good people who believe and that religion is not all evil, but damned, why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?”

    John, I’m not a Christian, but I know a few good ones. Christianity as expressed by many folks of that persuasion, aren’t loudmouths and proselytizers; they are quiet folk, quite secure in their belief and more than willing to oversee what they consider their bailiwick. No screeching, doing quiet things that they believe will help folks out. For example the (Priest? Minister? Well, head of) of the local Episcopal church is (ironically) a fisherman by trade, but four years ago fostered a health care clinic for anyone who needed medical attention and years before that opened a still-running soup kitchen, free for anyone and I’ll add a fancy-ass food kitchen. The man draws a ridiculously low salary and gives any cash the church as amassed beyond salaries and physical repair to the structure and gives it to folks in trouble. No strings attached.

    You’d never find Father Burney raising hell anywhere at all. The antics of the fire and brimstone nuts are far beneath his radar.

    Those real Christian folk are quiet ’cause they’re busy. I think, John, it’s up to us crusty angry old farts to do the hell raisin’. I’m more than willing, I’ll bet that you are too.

    John

  57. 57
    McJulie says:

    Liberal Christians are invisible because of the religious right. Organizations like the Moral Majority combined nominal Christianity with nonstop political activism, and part of their activism was to make sure that they claimed the most ground possible.

    For example, if they put out a press release objecting to, say, the movie version of The Last Temptation of Christ, they were always sure to say “Christians are offended” not “Our congregation of extremely conservative evangelicals was offended.”

    It seems ridiculous, but that kind of thing works. Not only the secular press, but actual Christians started to believe that these hate-filled maniacs really did define the religion.

    Unfortunately, it’s hard to imagine a liberal Christian group having the same propaganda effect, because liberals tend to be more interested in actually doing stuff than in cynically manipulating people’s perceptions.

  58. 58
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Morzer: They really should just go cold turkey and get rid of that hippy-dippy Jesus guy and put in Jeebus, Son of Mammon, who they actually worship.

  59. 59
    Ramalama says:

    I’m actually shocked that the minister or priest handing out condoms is from Naperville. Some high school friends of mine who border Opus Dei madness (if they aren’t full on ODers) live in Naperville. it’s a city / town chock full of super rich arse holes. There’s a huge following of Santorum there, for example. And I think there’s even a few Nutjob book publishers there. Unless I’m mistaking that for Hinsdale.

  60. 60
    Ramalama says:

    @Helen: Every country has its issues. And I’m sure you’re right to go to Ireland for retirement. But I wonder what you think about civil war there. I follow a No. Irish crime fiction writer who talks of Ireland getting bloody in the near future. Interesting that there’s SUCH a large output of crime fiction from that tiny country.

    Anyway, check out his latest supposition here: http://adrianmckinty.blogspot......l-war.html

  61. 61
    Chris says:

    As an atheist, I recognize there are some really good people who believe and that religion is not all evil, but damned, why are they so damned quiet all the time and letting these lunatics define how their beliefs are perceived?

    For one thing, as many people have correctly told you, the fact that Christians who aren’t bigoted assholes exist doesn’t mean the MSM will give them equal coverage. It’s the same reason jihadis blowing up Manhattan skyscrapers get more attention than Sufis reading poetry and feeding the poor.

    For another, as in many areas of human activity, being a loud and proud Professional Conservative pays very well: I think we’ve had several posts here about the rise of the religious right in the seventies, in which it was noted that simple money, and how much of it flowed from wealthy right wing donors to televangelists preaching what they wanted, was a not-unimportant factor in spreading the gospel.

    Other reasons, I’m sure, but that’s already two good ones.

  62. 62
    azrev says:

    @Baud: We’re not quiet – the media isn’t interested in us. They have allowed the right wing to become spokespeople for an entire faith. I suspect that many reporters etc. have weak, if any, ties to a faith tradition and so they are more credulous when those puffed up, mainly men, pontificate. And, since, like all false prophets, their values are in line with the predatory dominant culture, little to nothing is done to challenge them.

  63. 63
    Aardvark Cheeselog says:

    @TG Chicago:

    And if you are voting due to your religious beliefs, I just find that really, really weird

    I vote due to my beliefs. So do you, dumbass. Some of my beliefs are based in religion; some aren’t.

    This (except my beliefs are not religious, unless you want to get into an epistemological rabbit hole).

    While discussion here tends to focus on the posers who use religious belief as an instrument to manipulate the unwashed, that manipulation would not work if there weren’t a whole lot of people who are manipulable because they sincerely believe nonsense. Moreover, to these people the nonsense is the most important thing in the universe.

  64. 64
    Aardvark Cheeselog says:

    @Morzer:

    I’d recommend reading the whole thing if you want some idea of where the right wing extremists aka the GOP are going in religious terms.

    The phrase “Christianist Jihadis” needs to be added to the American political lexicon.

  65. 65
    g says:

    And they should have handed out female contraception,

    There isn’t any female contraception available that doesn’t require a doctor’s visit and a prescription.

  66. 66
    g says:

    @nellcote: So now even filling out a piece of paper violates their precious religious rights?

  67. 67
    VillageIdiocy says:

    @Aardvark Cheeselog:

    Talibangelist
    Talibangelism
    Teahadist
    Teahadism

    None specifically Christian, but most folks get the drift.

  68. 68
    Aardvark Cheeselog says:

    @VillageIdiocy:
    Except those are not part of the American political lexicon, as used in mainstream political discussion. And even here in Left Blogistan, they’re generally used to describe people and behaviors which, while obnoxious, do not rise (or sink) to the level of advocating “martyrdom” in service of politics.

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