Shut Up, Lew Kareem

Blaming the victim is always fashionable:

Basketball legend Kareem Abdul-Jabbar suggested on Monday that Los Angeles Clippers owner Donald Sterling’s racist rant is at least partially his girlfriend’s fault.

“And now the poor guy’s girlfriend (undoubtedly ex-girlfriend now) is on tape cajoling him into revealing his racism,” Abdul-Jabbar wrote in a blog post for Time. “Man, what a winding road she led him down to get all of that out. She was like a sexy nanny playing ‘pin the fried chicken on the Sambo.’ She blindfolded him and spun him around until he was just blathering all sorts of incoherent racist sound bites that had the news media peeing themselves with glee.”

Asshole.

*** Update ***

I stand by the comments regarding his blaming the victim bit- that quote speaks for itself. However, many of you have stated I was being a total asshole using Lew instead of his real name, and after some thought, you are right. Sometimes you try to write a clever title and don’t think things through, and this is one of those cases. You’re right, I am wrong, and I apologize. I’d change the title of the post, but then that would be revisionist, so I’ll keep it the same and hope you read my apology and accept it.

I was just really pissed off (and yes, I read the whole piece he wrote for Time), but I just found that quote to be really offensive, even in the service of a point, and I regrettably responded by being a total asshole. Not surprising, but I am still ashamed.

Again, sorry.






247 replies
  1. 1
    The Dangerman says:

    A victim with a Ferrarri, 2 Bentley’s (one wasn’t enough), a Range Rover, and an LA condo; if that’s victimhood, sign me up.

    Sterlings a shit. This “victim” is probably a shit…

    …and Kareem has done a whole helluva lot of good in this world, especially in the areas of Black History and race relations. Fuck, if that’s assholehood, sign me up, too.

  2. 2
    Punchy says:

    “Pin the fried chicken on the Sambo”? Whiskey Tango Fuckinhell?

    Perhaps that little kid from Airplane was correct after all, and KAJ is lazy and doesnt try the whole time.

  3. 3
    RareSanity says:

    Well, damn…

    Kareem, you could’ve just kept your mouth shut if that’s all you had to add to the conversation.

    FWIW, I really don’t think she had to push very hard to get him to say some pretty foul shit. The challenge was probably getting him to repeat that foul shit while she was recording.

  4. 4
    John Dillinger says:

    Actually, it’s “Lew.”

  5. 5
    ruviana says:

    @John Dillinger: Thanks, because I was going to say this too.

  6. 6
    RareSanity says:

    @The Dangerman:

    …and Kareem has done a whole helluva lot of good in this world, especially in the areas of Black History and race relations. Fuck, if that’s assholehood, sign me up, too.

    All the good he has done (and he has done a lot of it), does not absolve him from completely missing the point, and coming off like a complete asshole…in this particular situation.

    The two are not mutually exclusive.

  7. 7
    The Dangerman says:

    KAJ:

    “Didn’t we just call to task the NSA for intruding into American citizen’s privacy in such an un-American way? Although the impact is similar to Mitt Romney’s comments that were secretly taped, the difference is that Romney was giving a public speech. The making and release of this tape is so sleazy that just listening to it makes me feel like an accomplice to the crime,” he wrote.

    Dead on.

  8. 8
    scav says:

    @RareSanity: Hell, he does similar under oath. poor widdle wich man wid da uppity girlfriend he thought he’d entirely bought and paid for and could order around, along with every other person in his life.

  9. 9
    Bob In Portland says:

    The tape sounds like both the girlfriend and Sterling were reading from a script. It was reported that Mrs. Sterling is going after the girlfriend for the 1.5 million-dollar condo he gave her, and that would be a sufficient motive, so if you don’t want to be blindsided by your rightwing cousin you might want to consider the possibility that the girlfriend encouraged Sterling to expose his true feelings.

    That doesn’t excuse Sterling. He has been a racist and asshole for decades. Tom Tolbert, who played for the Clippers a long time ago and now does sports talk radio in San Francisco has been ripping this guy for years.

  10. 10
    Woodrow/asim Jarvis Hill says:

    Extremely disappointing, on many levels. Kareem has been saying a lot of smart things over the last few years. Having him pull this victim/women blaming bullshit makes me look at him at a pretty ugly light.

  11. 11
    beltane says:

    This must be Old Men Behaving Badly Week. Just like every other week of the year.

  12. 12
    sharl says:

    Hawt!

  13. 13
    Big R says:

    @Woodrow/asim Jarvis Hill:

    Kareem has been saying a lot of smart things over the last few years.

    That. I was just thinking that I had been reading a lot of Kareem’s writing on Esquire which tended to be smart and pretty dedicated to raising up minority viewpoints.

    I guess we can all be thankful that “disgusting racist” is sufficiently minority that Kareem wants to lift it to the limelight….

  14. 14
    r€nato says:

    might I suggest that a former longtime NBA star (or any professional sportsball/puck star) may have a slightly skewed and cynical take on the opposite gender, considering that women throw themselves, sometimes quite literally, at these guys All. The. Time. (I’ve seen it with my own eyes, on many occasions) and that a very high %age of these women are all about the starfucking and then if it ever goes any farther, the dough re mi.

  15. 15
    SatanicPanic says:

    @The Dangerman: Really can’t muster a lot of sympathy for Sterling here. I’m not sure why anyone would want me to

  16. 16
    different-church-lady says:

    In August 2006, the U.S. Department of Justice sued Sterling for housing discrimination in using race as a factor…

    In February 2009, Sterling was sued by former longtime Clippers executive Elgin Baylor for employment discrimination on the basis of age and race.[16] The lawsuit alleges Sterling told Baylor that he wanted to fill his team with “poor black boys from the South and a white head coach”.[14] The suit alleges that during negotiations for Danny Manning, Sterling said “I’m offering a lot of money for a poor black kid.”

    But, ya know, that phonecall was a setup to make him look like he was a racist…

  17. 17
    Joel says:

    @The Dangerman: Kareem comes across as a douche here, which is what’s relevant.

  18. 18
    scav says:

    Funny how the privacy of recorded messages was so less sacred when it dealt with the Clintons — and that went into proceedings, not just the malstrom of public opinion. And the antics of those those trying to stuff the entire weight of accumulated evidence back into the sausage as no biggie because of the most recent tawdry straw are rather amusing.

  19. 19
    different-church-lady says:

    @The Dangerman:

    …the difference is that Romney was giving a public speech.

    Actually, Romney was giving a private speech.

  20. 20
    RareSanity says:

    @scav:

    You know, above all, that’s what pisses him off the most…

    The minority chick that he though he owned full title to, is the one that started the shit storm.

  21. 21
    The Dangerman says:

    Also, for all of you out there (Violet, stand up) taking me to task yesterday for calling out the “victim” yesterday, I hope you taped or watched “The Talk” on CBS today (not a frequent watcher, but I was Adult-Sitting my Mom today). I wasn’t listening that closely (I read while AS) but each of the 5 (I think it was 5; maybe 6) tore this “victim” a new one over her relationship with Sterling as I did yesterday. I guess all of those women are sexist, too.

    ETA: Don’t get me wrong; I’m not defending Sterling. At all. Not even a teeny weeny little bit. Guy should be run from the game. A beautiful game, filled with a lot of good people. Kareem being one of them.

  22. 22
    JPL says:

    The fact of the matter is she doesn’t own an NBA team so her involvement should be secondary. He was proud of the fact that he provides his players with food, and housing and didn’t mention the fact that they provided him with something.

  23. 23
    Joel says:

    @The Dangerman: the difference being that V was a participant in the conversation.

  24. 24
    blueintheface says:

    A Cole thread about Sterling’s racism (or is it Abdul Jabbar’s reverse racism, or sexism). Poor Anne Laurie’s post from 6 min earlier is about to get stomped.

    Having read that article this afternoon, he had some good points (why didn’t anyone care when he was being racist against blacks, Latinos, and other groups that are supposed to be protected by law?) and he had some shitty points (how does the fact that a 20-something year old gold-digger outed his racism make Sterling any less of a racist or make his comments any less outrageous?). But I just can’t get my outrage machine fired up on this.

    In the end, Sterling will finally become the social pariah that he deserves to be, the girlfriend will get some walking away money, the lawyers will get a shit-ton more, Magic will buy the team and will further break my heart as a Laker fan as he takes them to the next level while whoever is running the Lakers continues to run them into the ground. And Abdul-Jabbar’s shitty article will be forgotten.

  25. 25
    Cacti says:

    Cole, disagreeing with KAJ statements is fine.

    But why the need to call him other than his chosen name?

    Coming from a white guy from WV, it kind of comes across a little…I dunno…racist.

  26. 26
    TooManyJens says:

    I really don’t get how “she goaded him into it” is supposed to be a defense anyway. You couldn’t goad some who didn’t believe that shit into saying it.

  27. 27
    Patrick says:

    As bad as Sterling’s comments were; where was the outrage over the racist crap that has been going on since 2008? Among other things, the whole disgusting campaign on Obama’s birth certificate (and his college transcripts), eventually forcing Obama to waste his valuable time to show it a press conference. This whole scenario that our first African-American president is not one of us. And the campaign had the silent blessing of the media, which went along with it. Why was there such limited outrage then? Why did the media go along with it?

  28. 28
    different-church-lady says:

    @scav:

    Funny how the privacy of recorded messages was so less sacred when it dealt with the Clintons

    Yeah, but you know the line with the Clintons — it wasn’t the tawdry sex, it was the lying under oath. We kept hearing the phrase “nation of laws” over and over and over again.

    Funny how “nation of laws” applies to Democratic presidents but not cattle ranchers in Nevada, eh?

  29. 29
    RareSanity says:

    @Bob In Portland:

    I don’t see the angle…

    How does playing out a skit where Sterling is a bigot, keep the estranged wife away from the girlfriend’s apartment?

  30. 30
    The Dangerman says:

    @Joel:

    …the difference being that V was a participant in the conversation.

    Doesn’t matter; recording is illegal in CA (everyone must agree to being recorded). If anything, this makes getting Sterling out of the game MORE difficult (just try to take action based on an illegal recording and watch the lawsuits fly).

  31. 31
    Ash Can says:

    Oh, for fuck’s sake. Forget the TPM link. Here’s the real link. Go read it, and see what KAJ is really saying. (H/t, once again, LGF)

  32. 32
    scav says:

    @different-church-lady: True enough about the legal proceedings I guess. There was certainly a lot less vocal rich male squealing about the slutty spiritness of the woman recording them at the time, or at least I don’t remember it as being used to whitewash the entire situation. This one’s such a toxic brew of racism, mysogyny and rich male entitlement that a lot of the excuses being come up with are pretty revealing.

  33. 33
    Katherine says:

    what’s entertaining about Kareem weighing in on this is he has an article on Esquire about Understanding women / heh

  34. 34
    Joel says:

    @The Dangerman: the legality isn’t really what’s at issue here, is it?

  35. 35
    RareSanity says:

    @The Dangerman:

    Sterling can’t be “forced” to sell the team through legal means anyway. The super secret NBA constitution won’t allow it, at least according to the media reports.

    This will be a matter of how much pain Sterling is willing to endure (lost of value in the franchise, public embarrassment, etc.), as the the other 29 NBA owners, start turning the screws to get him to sell on his own.

  36. 36
    ulee says:

    She did lead him. You would have to be a moron not to hear that. A pox on both their houses.

  37. 37
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Ash Can: Caitlin MacNeil apparently missed the point of Kareem’s piece.

  38. 38
    A Ghost To Most says:

    I believe it was Lew Alcindor.

    But fuck sqeaky shoes, it’s hockey playoff time!

  39. 39
    SatanicPanic says:

    @ulee: Good.

    ETA- I’m still not seeing why I should care about the means she used to get this recording

  40. 40
    The Dangerman says:

    @Joel:

    …the legality isn’t really what’s at issue here, is it?

    Only extremely tangentially (file it under the “two wrongs don’t make a right” heading).

  41. 41
    JPL says:

    @Ash Can: He had me until he said the point that the person making the illegal tape being sent to jail.. I can see some type of retribution but not jail.

  42. 42
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @ulee: Where the fuck is all this “the bitch set me up” bullshit coming from? Jesus. This is what a white racist sounds like. Deal. With. It.

  43. 43
    RareSanity says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    I’m still not seeing why I should care about the means she used to get this recording

    For the same reason you should care that Al Gore is fat.

  44. 44
    Cacti says:

    @The Dangerman:

    Only extremely tangentially (file it under the “two wrongs don’t make a right” heading).

    The problem with Sterling filing a criminal complaint about the surreptitious recording, is that he would be affirming that it’s his voice making the offensive comments.

  45. 45
    ns says:

    John Cole is an ash hole, in this situation for deliberately calling Kareem by his pre-Islamic name as a form of an insult, there is no way to spin that, it’s plain old bigotry right there.

    Did Cole read the entirety of Kareem’s column? KAJ does not blame Sterling’s attitude on the girlfriend, he was pointing out that the attitude was there all along, as it is with plenty of other people who don’t happen to get recorded or otherwise caught red-handed. He’s absolutely right about the finger-wagging. And he’s right in pointing out that the girlfriend was making an effort when the tape was rolling. It is in no way an apologia for Sterling, despite the mischaracterization by TPM.

    Cole, just a little advice — don’t make your speciality attacking dissenting opinions. You are terrible at it, whether in the run up to the Iraq War or the bizarre obsession with Andrew Sullivan, who has contributed more to the public discourse than the equivalent of a dozen Ballon Juices. Maybe stay away from attacking altogether, although it appears that you have little interesting to say other than “look at that idiot over there!” and you don’t do that nearly as well as Jon Stewart. It is especially annoying when the person you are pointing at isn’t an idiot and you made no effort to understand their position.

  46. 46
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Ash Can:

    Wow, that TPM quote is taken way out of context. A sample from the actual article by Jabbar:

    What bothers me about this whole Donald Sterling affair isn’t just his racism. I’m bothered that everyone acts as if it’s a huge surprise. Now there’s all this dramatic and very public rending of clothing about whether they should keep their expensive Clippers season tickets. Really? All this other stuff I listed above has been going on for years and this ridiculous conversation with his girlfriend is what puts you over the edge? That’s the smoking gun?

    He was discriminating against black and Hispanic families for years, preventing them from getting housing. It was public record. We did nothing. Suddenly he says he doesn’t want his girlfriend posing with Magic Johnson on Instagram and we bring out the torches and rope. Shouldn’t we have all called for his resignation back then?

  47. 47
    scav says:

    @RareSanity: read something today that implied that even the corporate backing off isn’t going to hurt as much as one might think — rats. Oh well, at least the banana protests are somewhat encouraging, although starting from a shitty place.

  48. 48
    The Dangerman says:

    @RareSanity:

    Sterling can’t be “forced” to sell the team through legal means anyway. The super secret NBA constitution won’t allow it, at least according to the media reports.

    That seems to be the consensus; I wish Sterling could be made to go away quickly and quietly, but this will be like the McCourts (who didn’t want to sell the Dodgers until they ran completely out of operating revenue). It will be ugly … and it will be sad (for basketball; I could give a shit about Sterling).

  49. 49
    ulee says:

    @The Thin Black Duke: I’m not excusing his talk. But please don’t be so gullible.

  50. 50
    John Cole says:

    @The Dangerman: Your idiocy reminds me of a Craig Ferguson Netflix special in which he talks about Mel Gibson going into rehab after making all his anti-Semitic comments, where Ferguson noted that he had been a blackout drunk for 15 years and never went Nazi on anyone.

    I’ve had a lot of phone conversations with girlfriends that were heated and ugly, lots of fights with black guys in my units, and I regret them, but I never had any kind of inner Klan come out while I embraced my inner Jefferson Davis.

    TL;DR: You’re being a fucking asshole. Like Obama said, keep it up. When someone says something ignorant and stupid, you just let them keep talking.

  51. 51
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ulee: She didn’t lead him anywhere he wasn’t willing to go. My guess is that she’d heard him go there before and knew how to get to head down that path when she had the tape running.

  52. 52
    jenn says:

    Ok, did any of you who are jumping down Kareem’s throat bother to read the full article? Hint: he’s not defending Sterling.

    http://time.com/79590/donald-s.....ar-racism/

  53. 53
    Anne Laurie says:

    @RareSanity:

    How does playing out a skit where Sterling is a bigot, keep the estranged wife away from the girlfriend’s apartment?

    The girlfriend and the wife are fighting over who gets to keep the $1.5million condo.

    Girlfriend hadda know, from experience, that it wouldn’t be hard to wind Sterling up to say more racist shite, when it could be conveniently taped.

    If Sterling’s assets are tied up in litigation — if, for instance, the NBA is trying to get him to give up the Clippers and be an ugly old racist slumlord instead of an ugly old racist slumlord who owns a glamorous major-league sports team — girlfriend’s got the condo keys and wife can sit on it.

    Not saying that’s the girlfriend’s motivation, but it wouldn’t be implausible, either. Girlfriend’s been around the Sterling organization for a while, she’s gotta know people are gonna question why she would date an ugly old racist slumlord if it weren’t for the money (not that there’s anything wrong with that).

    Not sure I can see how/why Sterling himself would be in on this mooted plot, but who knows? Maybe thirty-odd years of using his estranged wife as a shield against aspiring girlfriends hoping to move up to trophy wives has just worn him down, and he was hoping the women would destroy each other and give him a chance to escape?

    But, y’know, asking KAJ to be sympathetic about the girlfriend’s plight is like asking a Native American to be sympathetic about Cliven Bundy’s mistreatment by the lamestream media. Sterling’s been getting a free ride on his ugly racism for decades, and now KAJ has to join the renounce-and-repudiate queue?

  54. 54
    Cacti says:

    @ns:

    John Cole is an ash hole, in this situation for deliberately calling Kareem by his pre-Islamic name as a form of an insult, there is no way to spin that, it’s plain old bigotry right there.

    Yup.

    Talking down to the mooslim by calling him his “proper christian name that his mama gave him”.

    Rather than, you know, addressing him like a grown man more than 20-years John Cole’s senior.

  55. 55
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    By, like, a mile. The tone is more, Well, thanks for finally catching up with what this asshole’s been doing for years than blaming the victim.

  56. 56
    Suffern ACE says:

    Criminies. I know, I know, fight racism wherever it occurs. I’m still not certain how this scandal affects anyone but a mistress and her unfaithful rich husband.

  57. 57
    John Cole says:

    @Ash Can: I read the god damned piece. I agree with much of it, but the bullshit he was writing about the victim was reprehensible.

    Oh, OH, she has a nice car that Sterling bought for her. In that case it’s OK!

  58. 58
    Patrick says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Amen! Way out of context. And I think with his statement, reading between the lines, he among other things is wondering what the hell was the NAACP thinking?

  59. 59
    The Dangerman says:

    @John Cole:

    I’ve had a lot of phone conversations with girlfriends that were heated and ugly, lots of fights with black guys in my units, and I regret them, but I never had any kind of inner Klan come out while I embraced my inner Jefferson Davis.

    Find me a time when I’ve said ONE positive thing about Sterling; happy hunting because you won’t find it (unless my guess that he’s suffering from dementia is a positive, which is one helluva stretch).

    Go pet your animals, you are way the hell off base on this one (me AND Kareem).

  60. 60
    JPL says:

    @ns: Did you read the entire article.. He had me until this

    So, if we’re all going to be outraged, let’s be outraged that we weren’t more outraged when his racism was first evident. Let’s be outraged that private conversations between people in an intimate relationship are recorded and publicly played. Let’s be outraged that whoever did the betraying will probably get a book deal, a sitcom, trade recipes with Hoda and Kathie Lee, and soon appear on Celebrity Apprentice and Dancing with the Star

    really if she hadn’t of taped him, it wouldn’t of been news. what a bitch is what I’m reading

  61. 61
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ns:

    Andrew Sullivan, who has contributed more to the public discourse than the equivalent of a dozen Ballon Juices.

    The phrase “skull fuck a kitten” alone has added more to the public discourse than the sum total of Sullivan’s work.

  62. 62
    JPL says:

    How about this quote…

    I hope whoever made this illegal tape is sent to prison.

  63. 63
    ulee says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Yeah, she got a few hundred thousands out of the idiot, and now she is exacting revenge because…. He’s a racist and she is a jerk. Doesn’t have to be mutually exclusive.

  64. 64
    kc says:

    First of all, she’s not a freakin victim; secondly, he’s right.

    Really? All this other stuff I listed above has been going on for years and this ridiculous conversation with his girlfriend is what puts you over the edge?”

    You should never rely on a TPM headline.

  65. 65
    geg6 says:

    Kareem can kiss my ass, the sexist piece of shit.

    And yes, I read his stupid article. Just love all the men here blaming the victim. Ooooo, she’s a gold digger! Ooooo, she led him on! Oooooo, Kareem has done good things for the African American community! Fuck that bullshit. Who’s the one with power in this situation? I’ll tell you who and it ain’t the mixed race woman who only made public what this asshole has been saying in court proceedings and business meetings the exact same shit. But that nasty whore is at fault, right? Fuck all you fucking sexist shits. With a rusty chainsaw.

  66. 66
    Mnemosyne says:

    @John Cole:

    I’m not sure I would call his mistress a “victim.” It’s not like he’s been accused of beating her or something. She managed to get him on tape saying the kind of racist bullshit I’m sure she’s heard him say a million times.

  67. 67
    ulee says:

    @John Cole: It’s not OK. But private conversations are just that. Don’t be so obtuse.

  68. 68
    JPL says:

    @kc: I didn’t see TPM.. I read the article and the fact that he said this..
    I hope whoever made this illegal tape is sent to prison. bothers me because that is what will bring Sterling down. Sorry, I can’t agree with the fact that he is concerned about illegal tapes. I just can’t.

  69. 69
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @ulee: Gullible? Please. I’m a 60-year-old African-American man living in White America and I can see a mile away when white people uncomfortable with racism try to Change The Subject. And getting back to the subject at hand, what’s happening now is like when Al Capone finally got nailed for cheating on his taxes. Sterling’s bigoted ass should have been booted from the NBA years ago for being a goddamned slumlord. So if a pissed-off ex-girlfriend is able to bring him down because of this, that’s fine with me. Whatever works.

  70. 70
    kc says:

    @John Cole:

    I’m having a hard time seeing her as “the victim.”

  71. 71
    Mnemosyne says:

    @JPL:

    Actually, I think he’s saying that in this specific incident, there’s more than one side to be outraged at if you so choose, so we should be looking at Sterling’s entire history of asshole racism rather than letting him get off by claiming to be a victim of his mistress’s actions.

  72. 72
    Patrick says:

    @geg6:

    How is she a victim? Isn’t Sterling’s wife a bigger victim than the mistress?

  73. 73
    Tractarian says:

    @ns:

    This. I wonder if John Cole will delete this post? I mean, he didn’t have to read the article, he could have just read a couple paragraphs.

  74. 74
    Mnemosyne says:

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Sterling’s bigoted ass should have been booted from the NBA years ago for being a goddamned slumlord. So if a pissed-off ex-girlfriend is able to bring him down because of this, that’s fine with me. Whatever works.

    That seems to be Jabbar’s position, too. A lot of people don’t seem to be getting the hyperbole and sarcasm that the article is dripping with. I’m not sure why.

  75. 75
    kc says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Not just her, but lots of people, for years. This guy’s been crapping on minorities and tenants and employees for years and it was public knowledge, from what I understand.

  76. 76
    scav says:

    @JPL: There’s a bit of how dare she make money off his racism lurking there too, plus the elided how they all went on making money off the situation while going along with it. Like many, he’s got a point, but there are some gaping self-serving inconsistencies and biases peeking through.

  77. 77
    The Dangerman says:

    That seems to be Jabbar’s position, too.

    Just to let you know, using the name without the Abdul is an insult to him. Go with Kareem or go with Abdul Jabbar.

  78. 78
    JPL says:

    @Mnemosyne: It is the illegal tape that might bring him down. I’m not justifying the behavior of anyone but the fact that he is concerned about an illegal tape bothers me. The rest of the article was fine. Of course Sterling should have been called on his behavior before hand but he wasn’t.

  79. 79
    ulee says:

    @The Thin Black Duke: I agree. He’s an asshole and his girlfriend sure did fuck him over. Wonderful people, both.

  80. 80
    Anne Laurie says:

    Also, Cole, I have to agree with the commentors who said that your title is indefensible. Use the man’s proper name, or I’ll think you’re reverting to your wingnut roots. “But that was the name he used in college!” is no more a defense than it is for the idiots who insist on calling President Obama “Barry”.

  81. 81
    RareSanity says:

    @Anne Laurie:

    OK, I can see where that could be a plan…not a particularly efficient one, but a plan nonetheless.

    Seems to me, if he’s already spent several times over the cost of that condo in cars for the girlfriend, she wouldn’t have much trouble convincing him to just get buy her a condo for herself.

    Then again, I understand that this is the story for people that are going to spin Sterling as the victim, so I’m sure it makes perfect sense to them.

  82. 82
    geg6 says:

    @Patrick:

    She’s the victim of all the assholes here (and Abdul Jabbar) getting more outraged by her than by Sterling. Slut shaming, it’s the new thing at BJ, apparently.

  83. 83
    Ash Can says:

    @John Cole: Then read it again. He’s not “blaming the victim.” He’s mocking everyone who thinks that this is a big story, a big revelation, when it’s been playing out over years, with everyone ignoring it until now.

    Out of context, yes, it sounds despicable. Within context, the meaning is completely different. And I for one am not going to get hung up on a couple of trees when there’s a whole forest of significance here.

  84. 84
    kc says:

    @ulee:

    Yeah, I’m sick of both their whiny voices.

  85. 85
    John Cole says:

    @Anne Laurie: I update ten minutes ago. Refresh.

  86. 86
    WaterGirl says:

    @John Cole:
    Cole, since you regret using “Lew” in the title but don’t want to be revisionist… one option might be to change your title to:

    Shut Up, Lew Kareem

    That wouldn’t continue the disrespect but no one could accuse you of trying to be revisionist.

    Edit: Apology accepted. Thank you for that.

  87. 87
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @ulee: I don’t think the girlfriend has fucked up as many people as Sterling has, y’know?

  88. 88
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @geg6: I read it the way Ash Can did.

  89. 89
    YellowJournalism says:

    @Mnemosyne: this woman is no angel, but the tape has the tone I someone who is very controlling and emotionally abusive. Maybe she had enough between his bull shit and his wife’s lawsuit.

  90. 90
    JPL says:

    @scav: It’s ironic, the wife is suing the girlfriend for accepting property from the husband and the girlfriend is releasing tapes in order to protect her appearance on the Today show (just guessing) but it is easy to lose the important point. Sterling should not own the Clippers. The day of the plantation owners is over.

  91. 91
    KG says:

    @Mnemosyne: because it’s so much easier to be outraged about this newest outrageous outrage. No need for nuance or the grand scheme of things

    What The Captain says here isn’t any different than what Bomani Jones said on the radio today (if you can find the clip, I suggest listening to it, because it’s amazing).

  92. 92
    ulee says:

    @geg6: please. You’re not going to score points by being a doormat.

  93. 93
    scav says:

    @The Thin Black Duke: Specially since there’s a shitload of evidence under oath and from trials that he’s a long-standing shit on multiple fronts. The legal status of the last straw can be ignored when building any legal case, should it come to that. And the freaking NBA can play by whatever rules it wants, although I don’t hold out much hope there based on past performance.

  94. 94
    kc says:

    Good on you, Cole, for apologizing about the name thing. Glad I refreshed before I started bitching about that. :)

  95. 95
    ulee says:

    @The Thin Black Duke: I don’t know. I don’t know her.

  96. 96
    beltane says:

    @Mnemosyne: If Sterling has victims, they would be his employees and hapless tenants. Just because a woman chooses to have a douchebag for a lover doesn’t automatically make her a victim of anything.

  97. 97
    John Cole says:

    @WaterGirl: Good solution. Thx for the advice.

  98. 98
    Anne Laurie says:

    @John Cole: Watergirl beat me to it; I say that’s what the strikeout button is for.

  99. 99
    geg6 says:

    @Ash Can:

    Umm, no. I get what he’s saying about Sterling. But the slut shaming is there with big red flashing lights. Fuck him. I don’t give a shit about how you keep trying to excuse it as satire or a small part of the article or whatever you are trying to downplay it as. He’s a pig.

    FTR, no one, and I mean no one, was a bigger fan of his back in his glory days. That’s over now and he’s dead to me. Fuck him and fuck all of you defending him.

  100. 100
    lamh36 says:

    @Anne Laurie:

    …Sterling’s been getting a free ride on his ugly racism for decades, and now KAJ has to join the renounce-and-repudiate queue?

    Not for nothing AL, but ALOT of Black folk have had to ignore or turn their heads to white racism for years (especially in cases where the white person is in positions of authority) and you can bet that alot of Black folk still are.

  101. 101
    MaryE says:

    Please read the article. TPM sensationalizes a lot of stories, probably to get the hits. When I saw the excerpt, I was upset too. I’ve been reading articles by Kareem for awhile and, when I thought more about it, decided to look at the whole story. Love Balloon Juice, but this is below the belt, especially the reference to “Lew.” The knee-jerk response on this site is also exactly what Kareem is writing about. Guess it is easier to get worked up about a phone conversation than it is about how Sterling has been screwing over African-Americans, Latinos and Koreans for years. And then to get just as worked up about a misleading excerpt from TPM.

  102. 102
    scav says:

    @JPL: so few seem to point out the financial motivations of the wife either who stayed put during multiple girlfriends and sued at least one other. This is all a rerun chez Sterling. I’m not seeing a lot of entirely pure motivations in this lot.

  103. 103
    RareSanity says:

    @Patrick:

    Amen! Way out of context. And I think with his statement, reading between the lines, he among other things is wondering what the hell was the NAACP thinking?

    I was listening to one of the shows on ESPN radio this morning (Colin Cowherd maybe?) and he had the president of the California NAACP on, and he asked this very question.

    Her answer was basically that the awards were given (and about to be given) by the local Los Angeles chapter of the NAACP because, surprise, Sterling wrote a lot of checks to that chapter to buy the awards. The state chapter basically let the first award go, because his initial discrimination case had not yet been decided, and local chapter didn’t want to pass judgement until the legal process was completed.

    As far as the second award, once these comments came out, the state and national chapters basically told the LA branch that there would be no award for Sterling.

    So the short answer is that the NAACP is run by donations, like many non-profits…and basically Sterling was writing checks to buy a good reputation. “Look, I won an award from the NAACP. How could I possibly be a racist slumlord?”

  104. 104
    Mack says:

    This is not an actual BJ post until somebody yells “tumbrels!”.

  105. 105
    geg6 says:

    @ulee:

    Go fuck yourself,. I’m no one’s doormat and I’m certainly not yours.

  106. 106
    kc says:

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Sterling’s bigoted ass should have been booted from the NBA years ago for being a goddamned slumlord. So if a pissed-off ex-girlfriend is able to bring him down because of this, that’s fine with me. Whatever works

    That’s one way to look at it. Another is that everyone was willing to look the other way as long as Sterling was treating tenants like dirt, but let him say something about a beloved millionaire sports figure and suddenly he’s a problem.

  107. 107
    Bobby Thomson says:

    Fuck you, John. TPM took one part of a very thoughtful essay out of context as click bait and you predictably took the bait. What part of “Sterling is the real villain here” did you not understand?

  108. 108
    DougJ says:

    I didn’t agree with Kareem completely but I thought it was an interesting, well-written piece.

    I agree that I didn’t quite like the way he went after the girlfriend, though at the same time, with a 50 year age difference, it take two to tango

  109. 109
    MaryE says:

    Posted before I saw the apology. Sorry for that

  110. 110
    Suffern ACE says:

    @beltane: Yep. Mistresses have a higher bar to show victimhood. As do cheating husbands.

  111. 111
    kc says:

    @MaryE:

    I quit reading TPM years ago; the site misled me one too many times.

  112. 112
    beltane says:

    @kc: It’s OK to say whatever you want about poor people. If Sterling had directed his racist comments exclusively towards his tenants, this story would not even be a story.

  113. 113
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Quelle fuckin’ surprise.

  114. 114
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @kc: Welcome to my world. Or as John Scalzi so eloquently put it, “Fair? You’re in the wrong universe for ‘Fair’. “

  115. 115
    efgoldman says:

    @RareSanity:

    This will be a matter of how much pain Sterling is willing to endure

    A whole bunch of companies who were “official” sponsors of the Clippers (and paid for the privilege) bailed today.

  116. 116
    different-church-lady says:

    @Mack:

    This is not an actual BJ post until somebody yells “tumbrels!” Corner Stone posts three disconnected comments in a row.

  117. 117
    Suffern ACE says:

    @beltane: Yep. You can say “It would drive the poor fans away from the Clippers.” But honestly, if Sterling hadn’t given the tickets away, would there be any Clippers fans?

  118. 118
    Marc says:

    @ns:

    don’t make your speciality attacking dissenting opinions. You are terrible at it, whether in the run up to the Iraq War or the bizarre obsession with Andrew Sullivan, who has contributed more to the public discourse than the equivalent of a dozen Ballon Juices.

    And who was great about handling dissenting opinions during the run up to the Iraq war, right?

  119. 119
    lamh36 says:

    I’m inclined to think TPM went for click bait.

    Cause the excerpts Rachel Maddow just quoted were completely on point.

    To use the click-baited link by TPM to completely negate what KAJ wrote is foolish, and nitpicky the article by KAJ that was actually very well written and on point.

    BTW, KAJ will be on Rachel Maddow shortly!

  120. 120
    ulee says:

    @geg6: She is a slut. She’s fucking an 81 year old guy. I suppose she loves him. Or maybe she loves his money and now she has found a way to really fuck him.

  121. 121
    Cassidy says:

    Bitchez be trippin’.

  122. 122
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ulee: Dear lord.

  123. 123
    Ripley says:

    Slut shaming, it’s the new thing at BJ, apparently.

    Pretty certain it’s not all that new here.

  124. 124
    kc says:

    @The Thin Black Duke:

    Yeah, I know. It’s just aggravating.

  125. 125
    Violet says:

    @ulee: How do you define the word “slut”? And what actions of hers make her one?

  126. 126
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @ulee: I guess you know her well enough to call her a slut, huh?

  127. 127
    Bob In Portland says:

    @RareSanity: One could argue (and that’s the kernel from which the right-wing meme is springing) that the ex was releasing the tape as a means to get back at Sterling and his wife for trying to take back the condo. And there’s the whole question about taping a conversation surreptitiously, although in America in 2014 who isn’t taping someone else?

    But, as I said, that doesn’t excuse the racism he’s displayed throughout his adult life. He should have been asked to leave the league when he said he didn’t rent to black people because they smelled and attracted vermin.

    I think Abdul-Jabbar’s piece in TIME should be read in full. Context is important.

  128. 128
    JPL says:

    @ulee: So what.. really that is what happens
    When it comes to billionaires, who is the real slut.

  129. 129
    lamh36 says:

    As for the legality of the recording, I do find it a bit ironic that some of the same people who are aghast at NSA unlawful snooping, are perfectly fine with the girlfriend recording private conversations with Sterling.

    As a legal matter, is it against the law or not to record someone without their knowledge and use it for personal gain or defamation?

  130. 130
    Helen says:

    Kareen Abdul Jabbar on Rachel right now.

  131. 131
    RareSanity says:

    @efgoldman:

    …and there will be more.

    Once the other owners, and the Commissioner, start going through their rolodexes and making calls…it’ll be damn near impossible for Sterling to do business as an NBA franchise.

    I wouldn’t be surprised if something unprecedented..like the Commissioner pulling some previously unknown power out…that would allow him to void the contracts of all the players and coaches, allowing them to become free-agents at the end of the year, if they chose to.

    It all depends on how ugly Sterling is going to let it get. From what I hear in the media reports, he doesn’t have any friends (nobody likes him), so it’s going to get very ugly.

  132. 132
    Violet says:

    The best part of the KAJ article:

    What bothers me about this whole Donald Sterling affair isn’t just his racism. I’m bothered that everyone acts as if it’s a huge surprise. Now there’s all this dramatic and very public rending of clothing about whether they should keep their expensive Clippers season tickets. Really? All this other stuff I listed above has been going on for years and this ridiculous conversation with his girlfriend is what puts you over the edge? That’s the smoking gun?

    Yeah, no kidding. Sterling has a history of racist acts and statements, along with sexual harassment, and this conversation is what gets people’s attention? WTF?

  133. 133
    ulee says:

    I don’t like the word slut. It is very high school. She is not a nice person. And neither is he.

  134. 134
    geg6 says:

    @ulee:

    And you just proved what a dick you truly are. Guess I’m a slut, too, since I live with a guy significantly older than who makes significantly more income than I do.

    Gawd, the sexism here is toxic tonight and I’ve just ODed on it. Good night, toxic asshole.

  135. 135
    Heliopause says:

    Monumentally shitty post, John.

    Did you actually read Kareem’s op-ed? You only linked to the stupid TPM piece. Is it too much to ask that you read the entire original and respond to it?

  136. 136
    lamh36 says:

    @JuddLegum
    Mark Cuban says the NBA shouldn’t force out Sterling for being racist because it’s a “slippery slope”

  137. 137
    JPL says:

    @ulee: so don’t use it..

  138. 138
    lamh36 says:

    “Los Angeles Dodgers outfielder Matt Kemp changed his walk-up music Sunday to Michael Jackson’s “Black or White” in response to Clippers owner Donald Sterling’s alleged racist comments.”
    http://thegrio.com/2014/04/28/.....-sterling/

  139. 139
    Violet says:

    @ulee: How convenient. You call her a slut and then say you don’t like the word. Which is it? Do you apologize for calling her a slut?

  140. 140
    lamh36 says:

    @Violet: this is the part that Rachel Maddow highlighted.

  141. 141
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @lamh36: California is an “all-party consent” for recording conversations. There are, however, a number of exception to the rule and, as I am not licensed in CA, I am not going to hazard a guess as to the legality of this particular taping.

    ETA: It’s not defamation if it’s his voice saying the stuff.

  142. 142
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @Violet: Hey, look at what finally nailed The Jersey Whale. Who said A Tipping Point has to be big?

  143. 143
    DougJ says:

    @lamh36:

    I thought that was a valid point too

  144. 144
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ulee:

    She is not a nice person.

    How do you know? What do any of us know about her other than that she is dating a much older, married man and she recorded him saying abhorrent shit?

  145. 145
    ulee says:

    @geg6: No need to be so angry. I’m just talking.

  146. 146
    efgoldman says:

    @Patrick:

    he among other things is wondering what the hell was the NAACP thinking?

    Sterling has a long history of buying honors with huge contributions – then bragging about it by buying big, amateurish ads in the LA Times.

  147. 147
    JPL says:

    @lamh36: I read an article earlier about the rules and there is no way to force him to sell the team. The NBA can fine him (haha) and ban him from attending games. Advertisers dropping out will cost him more. Cuban came out with pretty strong statements against Sterling so don’t just read tweets.

  148. 148
    raven says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: From a guy I know really well in LA who is a lawyer:

    There are various criminal penalties and civil sanctions for recording a telephone call without permission in California. There also are defenses and legal justifications that may apply. But even if the conversation was recorded illegally, that would not prevent a third party who did not act illegally from using the recording (e.g., the NBA)

  149. 149
    beltane says:

    @JPL: Many people are sluts when it comes to billionaires, especially people who are in the media.

  150. 150
    ulee says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: come on, be real. She has fucked him by releasing these tapes. This is transparent.

  151. 151
    raven says:

    @Helen: Kareem

  152. 152
    geg6 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Obviously, that’s what makes her a slut. Ulee just knows that any younger woman sleeping with an older wealthier man can’t be anything other than a slut.

  153. 153
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @lamh36: Gee, Mark, I guess what you’re saying is that the only difference between Sterling and the other Billionaires who own NBA teams is that he was the only one unlucky enough to have his words caught on tape, huh? Nervous? Good.

  154. 154
    maya says:

    Sigh! Cliven we hardly knew ye.

  155. 155
    JPL says:

    @geg6: The older guys are called perps.. right

  156. 156
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @ulee: Why does that make her a bad person? Shouldn’t racism be exposed to the light of day?

    I have no idea whether she is a good person or not.

  157. 157
    lamh36 says:

    @JPL: So what you’re saying is that context matters, and a small excerpt of a statement may not be a true representation of the nature of a subject?

    ETA: I lived in DFW for 7 years and I never could stand Cuban. So I admit I’m inclined to think the worse of him…i.e. he sound nervous to me ;-)

  158. 158
    Baud says:

    @maya:

    I wonder who’ll be next. These things always come in threes, you know.

  159. 159
    ulee says:

    @geg6: You cannot be this stupid.It’s not possible.

  160. 160
  161. 161
    Cassidy says:

    I’d fuck a billionaire for a couple Rolls, a Lambo, a 1.5 mil home, and some walking around money. Her being 81 wouldn’t bother me one bit.

  162. 162
    geg6 says:

    @ulee:

    So now I’m too stupid to get the nuance of you calling her a slut because she sleeps with older wealthier men?

    You need to get another shovel.

  163. 163
    Steeplejack says:

    Redacted because who knows?

  164. 164
    lamh36 says:

    Matt Kemp responds to Donald Sterling’s alleged racist comments with new walk-up music

    Los Angeles Dodgers outfielder Matt Kemp changed his walk-up music Sunday to Michael Jackson’s “Black or White” in response to Clippers owner Donald Sterling’s alleged racist comments…

    In a transcript of the full 15 minute audio tape…Kemp is mentioned. Both Johnson and Kemp took photos with Stiviano that she later posted on Instagram, and Sterling was not happy about it…

  165. 165
    maya says:

    @Baud: I was thinking the same thing.

  166. 166
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Steeplejack: Wilt.

  167. 167
    The Thin Black Duke says:

    @JPL: I know what you’re trying to say, but, to be honest, I think it’s meaningless words because Sterling’s bigotry was the worse-kept secret in the NBA for years and nobody cared. Mark Cuban knew way back then and he didn’t say shit. And as much as Cuban likes to think of himself as a free-thinking rebel, he’s just another Rich White Guy and Rich White Guys look out for each other.

  168. 168
    Aurona says:

    I saw Lew Alcindor play at UCLA under Coach John Wooden. I saw KAJ play for the Lakers, too, and he’s right; those hussies throw themselves at sports guys. Perhaps he can tell us all about his life and times living in Malibu and let us know if he ever, ever, ever took advantage of that situation himself.
    As I woman who has seen the then and now of sexism and misogyny, Kareem has not grown out of that. Too bad. I’m sticking with Magic on this one; and let’s get back to the fact that Sterling is really a deadbeat rich guy who you would never want to rent an apartment from – ever.

  169. 169
    scav says:

    There’s a large vested interest right now in maintaining the illusion that we’re in a post-racial world, not to mention a post-gender world, added to the forces that want to stifle thought about income disparities. Especially with elections and demographics being what they are. Will be interesting to watch, especially as there are the opposing forces that want this in the news (for the cash) and those that want these issues buried.

  170. 170
    raven says:

    @Aurona: You figure Magic got AIDS from a toilet seat?

  171. 171
    brantl says:

    @ns:

    You are terrible at it, whether in the run up to the Iraq War or the bizarre obsession with Andrew Sullivan, who has contributed more to the public discourse than the equivalent of a dozen Ballon Juices.

    Andrew Sullivan contribute anything other than ennui and bile? Cole’s got more brains in his ass then you have in your head. And you don’t have any, anywhere else.

  172. 172
    beltane says:

    @scav: Speaking of income disparities, the latest conservative response to Thomas Piketty is that income inequality is a necessary precondition to great art http://crookedtimber.org/2014/.....n-the-cia/

  173. 173
    Aurona says:

    @raven: Oh that’s so sad and so irrelevant in this conversation. Magic is invoked in the Instagram photo – if you watched the pre-game basketball games on ABC yesterday, you would have heard Magic discuss this issue.

    Please don’t degrade a guy who really has changed LA (saved the Dodgers for one), so trashing him in this way is … very National Review.

  174. 174
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Aurona:

    Please don’t degrade a guy who really has changed LA (saved the Dodgers for one), so trashing him in this way is … very National Review.

    How was he degrading Magic by referring to the fact that Magic had sex outside the confines of his marriage in response to this:

    I saw KAJ play for the Lakers, too, and he’s right; those hussies throw themselves at sports guys. Perhaps he can tell us all about his life and times living in Malibu and let us know if he ever, ever, ever took advantage of that situation himself.

    from you?

  175. 175
    Anne Laurie says:

    @raven: Back when that news surfaced, did your college town get the tshirts that said “Use a condom, no matter how MAGIC you think your JOHNSON is?”

    (I’m actually a little surprised that the paleofans aren’t already explaining how of course no rich white guy would want his girlfriend ‘associating, if you know what I mean’ with an HIV-positive man. Maybe I just don’t read enough sports pages.)

  176. 176
    Gvg says:

    Kareem May be annoyed at people acting all surprised and talking about selling tickets etc, but his world is the NBA. He knew a long time ago. fine. I never heard of the guy before a few days ago, Sterling, not KAJ. it’s hard to predict what stories will make big news. sure this one has some sensationalist elements, but that doesn’t guarantee it was going to hit this big. Now I know.
    One excuse is there is a large supply of bigots to have heard of. seem to be more of them lately but it’s reached the point I am so overwhelmed by the nasty displays that I have less tolerance than before. I am feeling vengeful.
    as for the girlfriend being a slut, well she is sleeping with a married man and that means he is a cheat. doesn’t have much to do with what he said. if that wasn’t how he was, nothing like it could have been recorded. he has far more power to hurt other people and background info shows he has.
    the Obama years have been a revaluation to this white lady. toxic hate on display. I have to hold on to the awareness O would not have won if we hadn’t made progress but I am counting the days till the bigots die off.

  177. 177
    Aurona says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: How clever! Its not about the sex – its about the guy in the middle of the storm. Please – be real. I don’t care about the sex/not sex of sports stars but I do care about a rich white guy who got tripped up finally for his racism. If you need to talk about sex, which apparently you do, I’m sure there are still some free websites out there that would love to talk to you about it. I am a woman who lovingly and with humor used the term hussies (I did not use any other word). I’m not going to say that V. is anything other than that for the moment. I would certainly not think the worse of anyone I know who has Aids and got it from personal contact or a transfusion. Sharpen your skills sweetheart, I’m out of here.

  178. 178
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Aurona: What the hell are you talking about?

  179. 179
    Cassidy says:

    @Aurona: You brought up the sex.

  180. 180
    Mutaman says:

    Like Sterling. Cole really showed where his head is at here. i always thought the guy’s politics smelled. what a pig.

  181. 181
    Aurona says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: You are not worth my time to respond because you have no thoughtful dialogue to add to the discussion; no responses to you or your dear friend Cassidy in the future.

  182. 182
    Mutaman says:

    @Heliopause:

    Its clear Cole took the quote out of context.

  183. 183
    Aurona says:

    @Cassidy: You are not worth my time to respond because you have no thoughtful dialogue to add to the discussion; no responses to you or your dear friend Omnis Omnibus in the future.

  184. 184
    rammalamadingdong says:

    This is good news for the Warriors

  185. 185
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Aurona: I honestly did not understand what you posted.

  186. 186
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    I’m not going to pretend to judge anyone’s dating choices that don’t include me. I wondered is CA was a one or all party state, but once it’s out there, well, it ain’t going back into the phone line.
    I’m not gonna get real wound up about Kareem making the go to jail statement – he’s allowed an occasional dumb comment and he’s been writing thoughtful well written stuff for a while now.

    I agree with his larger point that the douceschooner has been publicly an obnoxious racist for decades – biggest Fair Housing fine ever – and no one noticed, it would appear. But get an audio on TMZ and it’s a big fucking deal. So this is what gets folks up in arms? Really? KAJ has a great point there, seems to me.

    I know nothing about the woman with the tape recorder, beyond that she appears to use a very short first name (as if I could comment on name/nyms, heh). I suspect that her relationship with the Clipper owning couple will continue to be contentious, and even more litigious.

  187. 187
    Mutaman says:

    Can’t figure out how Cole can think V is a”victim”. By calling her a “victim” he disrespects all those women who truly are. Like I said, Cole’s politics stink.

  188. 188
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: I was beginning to think I was the only one who was missing that. LuckyCLE needing child support enforcement lawyers get to listen to me discuss, substance abuse, professionalism, and legal ethics and the internet tomorrow in Dublin. The midwestern one, sadly.

  189. 189
    Mandalay says:

    @geg6:

    Just love all the men here blaming the victim.

    This. I haven’t seen a word of criticism here for Sterling, married for 50 years, for having a relationship with another woman 42 years younger then himself. IOKIYAM?

  190. 190
    Mutaman says:

    @John Cole: If you read the whole article before publishing it (which I doubt), then you are guilty of intentionally trying to mislead folks by publishing the quote out of context.

  191. 191
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): Near my old stomping grounds. Break a leg.

  192. 192
    Steeplejack says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Thanks. Hadn’t read the thread and thought I might be on thin ice, humor-wise.

  193. 193
    aimai says:

    @geg6: Yes, this. In other words the mixed race mistress who is being sued by her lover and his wife for everything she has is the only one–including KAJ, Michael Jordan, and the god damned NAACP who had the balls to expose this asshole. If KAJ has a problem with the long time media omerta about Sterling he needs to take a hard look at all the big, strong, AA men who worked for this guy and took his shit, and the AA men who were powerful enough in the league to do something about it if they cared to before he starts whining about what an outrage it was that a woman took down a man.

  194. 194
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Ash Can:

    Out of context, yes, it sounds despicable. Within context, the meaning is completely different. And I for one am not going to get hung up on a couple of trees when there’s a whole forest of significance here.

    This. He’s not “slut shaming” her. He’s pointing out the arguments about her that people keep making to avoid talking about the blatant racism of this story.

    Yes, it’s a shame that she’s going to become a minor “Dancing With the Stars” celebrity after this. Now can we talk about racism? Yes, what she did was illegal and she should go to jail. Now can we talk about racism?

  195. 195
    Mnemosyne says:

    @aimai:

    he starts whining about what an outrage it was that a woman took down a man.

    Read the whole article. Cole’s quote is completely out of context. His outrage is that it took this long for Sterling to be taken down when it was an open secret that he’s a racist asshole.

    A representative quote:

    He was discriminating against black and Hispanic families for years, preventing them from getting housing. It was public record. We did nothing. Suddenly he says he doesn’t want his girlfriend posing with Magic Johnson on Instagram and we bring out the torches and rope. Shouldn’t we have all called for his resignation back then?

  196. 196
    John Cole says:

    Look, guys. Sometimes I blow it. There are probably close to 40,000 posts here and multiple millions of comments. And you know what? I probably made 10-15k of those posts, and sometimes I shit the bed. Yes, I did read the full time post at Time, but I hate Time magazine and refuse to send them traffic, much like I do my level best to never link to Politico.

    So I linked TPM, which had the quote which pissed me off. Maybe you thought the whole piece was more nuanced, and I agree with much of it, but that fucking paragraph pissed me off, and I think it should piss off a lot more people.

    Where I blew it was with the flippant title of the post. Again, we talk about white privilege a lot, and sometimes I say things that reflect the fact that I am white and privileged. I try to not do it and try to think about things, but I sometimes shit the bed. I really didn’t think about how offensive it would be to use the name Lew instead of his chosen name. So I apologized.

    That is really all I can do. If you think I am going to delete the post, you are wrong. There are far more embarrassing things circa 2001-2005 that I would delete first were I to follow the LGF route.

    Again, I do not know what you want from me. I try to be a good person, I try to do the right thing, but I am human and I fuck up. In this case, I recognized I had made a mistake, and I apologized, in large part because I actually do pay attention to what you all say and pay attention to the comments.

    I’m a work in progress, I understand, and it bothers me that some of you attribute malice when ignorance and stupidity are actually reigning supreme.

  197. 197
    GOVCHRIS1988 says:

    @Mandalay:

    Ok, can we fucking give up the faux feminism outrage here. For all the so called “feminists” around here who steadfastly tell people about respecting strong, independent women, you sure are expelling a whole lot of fuel taking up for a woman who dated a over seventy plus billionaire who was married for damn near 60 years who only exposed this shit because dude’s wife was threatening to sue her for the million dollar condo, 4 luxury cars and 5 figure a month allowance Sterling was giving her. Not exactly a paradigm of feminism you would like to portray, is it? Granted, Sterling (or his wife for that matter) are just as guilty and deserve every amount of scorn, but if we have learned anything from the conservatives and Clive Bundy, it is to make damn sure you know all about the person before you reflexively cloak the person in whatever ideology you believe, lest you want it to not be taken seriously ever again.

  198. 198
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mandalay: I try not to judge other people’s marriages.

  199. 199
    ruemara says:

    Not to go into details, but when you’re a possession, the relationship is nearly abusive. When you’re a possession and have to pretend to be something socially acceptable (a delicate white girl, a delicate latina), it’s hell on your mind. So if you think the relationship was not abusive, well, you might want to adjust what you consider abuse. You don’t really have to hit anyone to tear them down.

    Also, the amount of slut-shaming from adults on this (My FuckField is barren for what the people of the “The Talk” think) is mind blowing. She’s not doing anything that women before her haven’t. Why am I supposed to condemn her for being a kept woman? And if you think Ms. Sterling is an innocent in this, you need to read up on her as well. She may not be a bigot, but she’s just as nasty and cheap.

  200. 200
    Mandalay says:

    @Ash Can:

    He’s not “blaming the victim.”

    You really don’t think so? This is what he wrote…

    Shouldn’t we be equally angered by the fact that his private, intimate conversation was taped and then leaked to the media?…
    The making and release of this tape is so sleazy that just listening to it makes me feel like an accomplice to the crime….
    I hope whoever made this illegal tape is sent to prison.

  201. 201
    Mnemosyne says:

    @ruemara:

    Here’s the thing, though: I think that what Kareem Abdul Jabbar is criticizing here is the media and celebrity culture, not V. Stiviano. He’s decrying the fact that the media wasn’t interested in the story of Sterling’s racism until they had a hot chick in the picture (literally). He’s sickened by the fact that the media keeps playing the tape over and over again.

    I seriously doubt that she was with Sterling because she really loved him or was attracted to him, but that’s so common as to not really being worth mentioning. Old rich guy has hot young girlfriend — news at 11!

  202. 202
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mnemosyne: V. Stiviano and Magic Johnson.

  203. 203
    Mandalay says:

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    Ok, can we fucking give up the faux feminism outrage here…Not exactly a paradigm of feminism you would like to portray, is it?

    WTF? I didn’t say a word about feminism.

    My point was about all the negative comments here about Stiviano (aka “slut”) simply because of her relationship with Sterling. Your rant just strengthens my argument.

  204. 204
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    Celebrity culture. Note that KAJ is not complaining about her making money from this — he’s complaining that she’s going to become a minor celebrity, because it’s only news if a celebrity is involved. As he said, no one cared about all of the families who were discriminated against by Sterling until you could attach a celebrity like Magic and a hot chick to the story.

  205. 205
    ruemara says:

    @Mnemosyne: I’d like to give him the benefit of the doubt, because I swear I was just about to conniption over this being day 5 of this shit, but the years of this douche being a known bigot get a pass. If you’re a young black man, you get killed for walking, for listening to music, you know, crimes.

  206. 206
    SatanicPanic says:

    @John Cole: It bothers me when people call Bobby Jindal “Piyush” when he calls himself Bobby, but it’s something I could have seen myself doing years ago without thinking of it- Americans are suspicious of people who appear to be hiding their “true” identity (I’m saying appear, not are). It’s an honest mistake.

    ETA- that being said, some people are used to hearing this sort of thing from people who aren’t going to think it through and apologize afterward, so they react accordingly.

  207. 207
    Mutaman says:

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    “the faux feminism outrage ”

    I love it. Kudos! This coming from a websight that during the 2008 primary had more sexist posts than the rest of the internet put together.

  208. 208
    Mnemosyne says:

    @ruemara:

    I can see why people assumed KAJ was going for the slut-shaming, but I think he’s going for something much more specific: famewhore shaming. He’s trying to shame Stiviano for wanting to be the next Kim Kardashian, not for her relationship with Sterling.

  209. 209
    GOVCHRIS1988 says:

    @Mandalay:

    You agreed with geg6’s rant that this young lady is the victim here and she is calling everyone who is saying what she really was in the relationship, an old billionaires sidepiece who exposed someone threatening to take the luxuries away, a sexist slut shamer. I’m just trying to figure out WHY she is a victim? Was Sterling holding her in bondage or something?

  210. 210
    SatanicPanic says:

    Also, I can see calling someone on the receiving end of a racist rant a “victim”.

  211. 211
    Suzanne says:

    @Aurona: That was like English, but different.

  212. 212
    Mutaman says:

    @Aurona:

    “let’s get back to the fact that Sterling is really a deadbeat rich guy who you would never want to rent an apartment from – ever.”

    great, lets find some poor folks to rent from.

  213. 213
    Mandalay says:

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    I’m just trying to figure out WHY she is a victim?

    No you’re not. Not remotely. You’re interested in hurling abuse and picking a fight.

    And if you can’t figure out on your own any way at all in which Stiviano could be a victim, then no amount of posting here by me and others will persuade you.

  214. 214
    Violet says:

    @John Cole: John, you’re a good person. Sometimes good people made mistakes. Character is revealed in how we act when we’re made aware we’re in the wrong. You apologized and it’s evident you understand why you needed to. You’ve got a good heart. Don’t beat yourself up. Not worth it.

  215. 215
    Joel says:

    Sterling’s past misdeeds were well known in certain circles, but there’s definitely something to be said about being caught on the record — recorded surreptitiously or not — that makes your sentiment stand out a lot more than heresy or carefully hidden court procedures. Kareem misses that point in his piece, which makes some compelling arguments despite being published in Time.

    Put another way: as far as public image is concerned, words speak louder than actions.

  216. 216
    Joel says:

    I see the trolls are out. Sockpuppets, too.

  217. 217
    GOVCHRIS1988 says:

    @Mandalay:

    You pretty much just proved to me that you really have no argument or defense here and do what most people do when they have no argument or defense, deflect like crazy. V. Stiviano exposed (At least to a whole lot of white people, many people of color, sans the NAACP knew about Sterling for decades) a racist man who owns a basketball team with a majority of black players to the country. Thats great, but she only exposed him because he or Mrs. Sterling was threatening to take away her livelihood of living large. She was not forced into this. She was not held against her will. She knowingly dated a married man, either knew or found out about his racism and continued dating him. She’s no victim.

  218. 218
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Joel: It’s funny, because we’ve had so few since 2012. Kind of odd to see them here.

  219. 219
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @SatanicPanic: Some topics bring out “interesting” commenters.

  220. 220
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: At least no one has frontpaged a discussion of circumcision (so far). Those used to be truly odd ones over at GOS

  221. 221
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @SatanicPanic: I migrated here from Eschaton not GOS, so I missed that sort of thing.

  222. 222
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Well you didn’t miss anything you should regret missing

  223. 223
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @SatanicPanic: Non, je ne regrette rien.

  224. 224
    Mutaman says:

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    You sir are right on the money.

  225. 225
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mutaman: Why the Cole hate? He has his faults, but he his heart is in the right place and he offers a fucking wide open forum for discussions.

  226. 226
    Mutaman says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    His immediate reaction to expressing misplaced anger at Kareem is to call him “Lew”? He is a very weird dude.

  227. 227
    notorious JRT says:

    @John Cole:
    Hey, John, we are all WIP’s. And this thread exposes much diversity of thought on the post by KAJ.

    After reading much of it, I will say only that I have at no point in this 24-7 discussion viewed V Stiviano as either a victim or a noble exposer of an unrepentant racist, which Sterling appears to be. Sometimes the right thing happens for the wrong reason.

    Finally, I listen to the tape and am struck by how weird and gross it is on so many levels.

  228. 228
    mak says:

    @The Thin Black Duke: The Jersey Whale situation is the perfect analogy. After years of dickishness and arguably illegal thuggery that was what finally harpooned the public imagination? Okay, whatever works.

  229. 229
    Bobby Thomson says:

    @Aurona: Because you’re wrong, got called on it, and can’t admit it. Painfully transparent. No one was talking about anyone’s sex life until you went ad hominem and implied that Kareem had been sleeping around.

  230. 230
    Cassidy says:

    @Aurona: My heart is breaking.

  231. 231
    Paul in KY says:

    @ruemara: No one forced her into that arrangement.

  232. 232
    cleek says:

    wait.

    she’s a victim?

    and Kareem is trying to blame her for her victimization ?

    are we following the same story?

  233. 233
    LAC says:

    Jesus… Shitting the bed is definitely what happened here. Apologies are all well and good, but sometimes a bit more reading and thinking would be appropriate. And, a black man’s name? Don’t fuck with it, Cole. Highly disrespectful.

  234. 234
    a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q) says:

    @LAC: I recognize – and appreciate – our blog host’s sincere apology for the post title, hence my edit below. But I believe this comment deserves some real contemplation – and perhaps its own post:

    And, a black man’s name? Don’t fuck with it. Highly disrespectful.

    Clearly Cole understands and apologized. But it’s a very common assertion of dominance over people of perceived lesser status (by assholes). It’s no accident that it’s disrespectful, and no accident where it’s used. The “Barry” brigade has been in full-throated force since 2008. It’s not only disrespectful, it’s hostile. And we should consider that when people call Jindal and Haley by the ethnic names they no longer prefer as well. Just a thought.

  235. 235
    WaterGirl says:

    @John Cole: Reading this at 10am, so I’m late getting back to the thread, but I’m kinda surprised that only one person acknowledged your (second) apology in this comment.

    I am a work in progress, same as you. We all are. I give you a lot of credit for your heartfelt apology, and I’m sorry that it was mostly ignored. You’re a good man, Cole. Thanks for that.

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q): I completely agree with the idea that it’s terribly disrespectful to fuck with someone’s name, and I hate hate hate it when I see people do that here, even to other commenters.

    I don’t think for a minute, though, that Cole was using it as an assertion of dominance over someone of perceived lesser status – I am pretty sure that Cole knows that KAJ has a lot more status than Cole does, and I do not think for a minute that Cole was racially motivated when he used Lew instead of KAJ. I think he was just pissed.

  236. 236
    Mandalay says:

    @a hip hop artist from Idaho (fka Bella Q):

    And we should consider that when people call Jindal and Haley by the ethnic names they no longer prefer as well.

    And plenty of people with an ax to grind referred to Mitt Romney as Willard.

    The most revealing thing about this thread is that some vindictive sanctimonious assholes don’t want to accept Cole’s apology, and delight in piling on anyway. Small people.

  237. 237
    Jim Treacher says:

    Way to go, racist.

  238. 238
    KXB says:

    @GOVCHRIS1988:

    Seriously, the GF in this case is not some ACLU intern. And while Mark Cuban may be an obnoxious guy with money, think carefully about what he said. Do you really want a system where your private, ugly conversation can be illegally recorded, and have that be the basis to be stripped of your property by a private organization, which had no rules addressing such ugly matters? Guess what, rich guys will still be able to work that system. But, imagine you are in a homeowner association, and you say something that offends either the majority of other members, or just the officers. Do you want to be in that position? Middle class & poor people will get screwed over more frequently. We already were understandably upset when employers were scanning job applicants’ Facebook profiles to determine if they were members of groups the company objected to.

    Let Clipper sponsors pull their support. Let people stop buying tickets & jerseys. Let the “sold its soul for the right price” NAACP take back their awards. But to try and force Sterling to give up the team, without him having violating any specific league rules, might set a precedent for other private organizations to monitor member attitudes and conversations.

  239. 239
    LAC says:

    @Mandalay: and some assholes who think they run the board feel the need to tell folks how to feel and what to think. Small fuckers need to get a life .

  240. 240
    SectarianSofa says:

    WTF, Kareem.

  241. 241
    LAC says:

    @KXB: interestingly, Lester Munson of espn offered a number of legal avenues that the NBA can take against sterling.

  242. 242
    SectarianSofa says:

    FWIW, I wasn’t aware of a racist component to the naming/renaming play. It’s always been a power thing… it’s about dominance and control. Adam named the animals. The cool kids get to rename the losers, and those are the nicknames that stick. Growing up as a loser weirdo nerd in a minority majority school system, I never noticed this was limited by race, only by the desire for power, and as a manifestation of anger and aggression. If you are of the dominant caste (or very super special like God’s boy, Adam, or Steve Jobs), other sentient beings don’t get to talk back. (Just saw the anecdote about Steve Jobs renaming another Steve to ‘Margaret’ yesterday). I don’t think being any particular color and employing a dick move renaming tactic is prima facie racist or racial. There are many contexts and asymmetrical relationships, and race is one and also many of those.

  243. 243
    SectarianSofa says:

    @SatanicPanic:
    Calling Jindal ‘Piyush’ really unsettles me, but I have no problem calling Jeb Bush ‘John Ellis’. Double standard? Or, is it because there is a power differential? Rich white people matter more than immigrants, ‘foreigners’, the 99%, anyone with darker skin. Similarly Christians, Men, Owners, Job Creators, etc. versus the poor, women, the proles, worker bees, atheists, Jews, Muslims, et al.. It does matter more what you say and do when you have more power, at least insofar as this is really representative of your operational prejudices.

  244. 244
    The Other Chuck says:

    @The Dangerman:

    Just to let you know, using the name without the Abdul is an insult to him. Go with Kareem or go with Abdul Jabbar.

    Well it’s basically calling him by one of the 99 Beautiful Names Of God, in this case “The Compeller” or “The Irresistable” … pretty cool name for a sports hero you gotta admit, but it would certainly be an unacceptable level of pretense for one to not prefix the “Abd-al-” (also spelled “Abdul”), which is a prefix meaning “Servant of the”. In this case, Kareem Abdul Jabbar is “Kareem, who serves [Allah] the Compeller”.

    What I don’t get is people whose name is just “Abdul”. Is “Allah” implied, or is that a false cognate?

  245. 245
    SectarianSofa says:

    @The Other Chuck:

    Abdul and the equivalent can also be used in non-Islamic names (e.g., versions referencing a Christian God-view) and potentially/rarely with a reference to a non-theistic subject.

    ‘Abdul’ in the non-Arabic world is still derived (as far as I know) from ‘adb-al’ etc. (depending on the transliteration) but not following the literal meaning so much as it is a cultural echo or homage (probably ‘homage’ here is dissonant, but language is a fun pot to stir).

    That, and language change often involves reduction, shortcuts, and transformation etc.. Or sometimes “odd” (compared to language/locale original) Anglicization (see e.g., current names of former Swedish immigrant families).

  246. 246
    brent says:

    This thread is just about over I guess but I would say I largely agree with Kareem here:

    1. I do think that John takes Kareem out of context here but I also think there is a legitimate difference of opinion on the appropriateness of Stiviano’s behavior. I happen to think its untoward to secretly tape someone else’s conversation with you no matter how despicable they are. I don’t think saying so constitutes a defense of Sterling’s racism or slut shaming or victim blaming. There are certainly contexts where I think the importance of what is being said overrides the basic right to privacy but I don’t believe this case is one of those. I think Kareem is really just making the point that we already knew about Sterling’s racism and general awfulness from his public behavior. It is problematic in a larger social context to rely on his private communications to create the kind of social pressure and ostracism we need to address it.

    2. I am not inclined to morally judge the Stiviano and Sterling relationship, even assuming that it was purely financial but I am also not inclined to view anyone who would be intimately involved with someone as plainly despicable as Sterling as some sort of hero. Her motives don’t much matter to me in the big picture but I also wouldn’t proceed from the assumption that her motives were pure. Again, I don’t think that constitutes slut shaming or victim blaming or really anything of the sort. Just a realization that sometimes people, men as well as women, bring attention to social issues in ways that are more out of self interest than out of any desire to make the world better for other people.

  247. 247
    John S Roszel says:

    @Cacti: A dogone agreed! We are all racists to some degree or another. Those of us who recognize it are in a better position to deal with and try to correct it

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