Thursday Evening Open Thread: Texas Wendy

Commentor Brian R. on my thread this morning:

There will be elections [in Texas] in 2014 for both the governor’s seat and Cornyn’s Senate seat.

If the state Democratic Party has any brains, they’ll run Wendy Davis for governor and Julian Castro for Senate. (Davis has already declined interest in the U.S. Senate seat and, while that might change, I think she has her heart set on a statewide office that keeps her in Texas for the time being.)

Both of them would be amazing candidates on their own, but they’d each mobilize a different key constituency (women, Hispanics) and bring out voters from different parts of the state (DFW, San Antonio) for a fucking tidal wave. And the down-ticket impact for state legislature seats would be impressive as well, especially with so many Republicans wearing this abortion vote on their backs.

From my perch in the blue northeast, I don’t know how the Texas Democratic Party could be encouraged to do these things, so here’s your chance to explain it to me.

For more immediate gratification, Wendy Davis has a donate button on her website, and one to sign up as volunteer, if you’re in her neighborhood. (Julian Castro’s asking for donations, too.)

For entertainment purposes, commentor Jibeaux directs us to some Amazon product reviews of the Mizuno Women’s Wave Rider 16 Running Shoe — ‘marathon shoe for marathon filbustering’, ‘fits perfectly up a Republican’s rear end’. And the new one-star reviews are even funnier!

Apart from interfering in another state’s rights, what’s on the agenda for the evening?






284 replies
  1. 1
    Keith says:

    Isn’t the Lt. Governorship up for grabs in 2014 as well? There used to be a time (maybe still is) where that was a more powerful position in Texas that Governor.

  2. 2
    Emma says:

    Open thread, right? Good. Need to rant.

    Why are there so many otherwise bright people who don’t get how the whole government thing works? I was speaking to someone (very liberal) who was grumbling about the fact that the DOMA decision did not establish same-sex marriage as the law of the land. Had to carefully walk her through the case. She was surprised — surprised! — that marriage laws are made at the state level. I pointed out that the decision meant that litigators could use the opinion to challenge the legality of same sex marriage bans in their states, and that in general it was a good thing.

    Her answer: “Why didn’t Obama just pass the law?”

    AAAAARGGHHHH!

  3. 3
    Baud says:

    @Emma:

    Sometimes I’m amazed we win anything with everything we’re up against.

  4. 4
    Mobile Grumpy Code Monkey says:

    Don’t expect any miracles. It’s not like we haven’t Democrats run for state office before. Everything that’s wrong with the DNC is just as true down here.

    Don’t get me wrong, I’d be thrilled if either of them won, but it most likely be in spite of the party’s efforts.

  5. 5
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @Emma:

    “Why didn’t Obama just pass the law?”

    If he would only use the BULLY PULPIT he could pass the law. But he won’t.

    ETA: I put quotes in a blockquote, WTF? Tongue fully implanted in cheek.

  6. 6
    scav says:

    @BillinGlendaleCA: We never did get that font we needed, did we.

  7. 7
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @scav: Wish we did, I didn’t want to sound too trollish.

  8. 8

    If there is a concentration morbidly obese people larger than the one at the Houston airport at any given time, I’d be surprised. So many courtesy carts ferrying them around.

  9. 9
    wasabi gasp says:

    Why didn’t Obama just pass the law?

    Mickey Mouse doesn’t rule the Magic Kingdom.

  10. 10
    Jeremy says:

    @Mobile Grumpy Code Monkey: Well the DNC and the Obama folks are investing in Texas now so things are heading in the right direction

  11. 11
    Jeremy says:

    @Emma: Because a lot of people hold Obama to unreasonable standards and they act like the man is their daddy.

    The main reason is the lack of knowledge when it comes to Civics.

  12. 12
    lamh35 says:

    Lord, so I was sitting at the DMV today and some chick was talking to her friend about work while we were waiting and she said she overheard some white co-workers of hers essentially saying that the Zimmerman trial “their” OJ trial!!!!! I was like WTF!!!! How in holy hell is the Zimmerman trial anything like OJ trial, I was straight bout to go off in the DMV, but thank the Lord my number came up and I held my tongue, but damn if my mind wasn’t just blown apart. White people’s OJ trial…really, really. Seems like it’s all the Zimmerman supporters are about isn’t it.

  13. 13
    Violet says:

    @Keith: Yes the Lt. Gov is also on the ballot in 2014. State Sen Dan Patrick announced he’s running for it today. He’s a GOP creep. I posted his coments on the filibuster in a thread below.

  14. 14
    Anya says:

    From this day forward Wendy Davis and OFA get all of my political donations.

  15. 15
    max says:

    For more immediate gratification, Wendy Davis has a donate button on her website

    Already sent 25$. More later.

    From my perch in the blue northeast, I don’t know how the Texas Democratic Party could be encouraged to do these things

    Uh, have Wendy & Castro declare their candidacies. That should pretty much take care of it, unless I’ve overlooked someone who wants to run. (Seems doubtful given the past decades attempts to drum up candidates.)

    If the state Democratic Party has any brains, they’ll run Wendy Davis for governor and Julian Castro for Senate. (Davis has already declined interest in the U.S. Senate seat and, while that might change, I think she has her heart set on a statewide office that keeps her in Texas for the time being.)

    Well, it doesn’t seem like Wendy is much longer for the state senate on account of redistricting. So moving up is good. That said, if she wants to stay in Texas…lite guv might be better, since she had Dewhurst with a target painted on his ass. Lite guv pays a terrible salary though. I’m not sure I see her winning the gov race, mainly. If it was 2016 and Hillary was on the top of the ticket, oh, yeah, but 2014? {works through the permutations} Yeah, OK, governor works – if she loses she’s still in good shape to run a race for something else in 2016.

    max
    [‘Castro will be a good candidate, but 2014 against Cornyn? 2014 may well be the last throw of the old white dixiecrats, unfortunately.’]

  16. 16
    mdblanche says:

    The Onion gives the Supreme Court too much credit and the Chief Justice will be getting an awkward wedding invitation soon.

  17. 17
    Anya says:

    @Emma: it always amazes me that people who are mad at Obama for not reversing all of B. Clinton’s bad laws are the same folks who worship Bill & Hill.

  18. 18
    Felonius Monk says:

    the Mizuno Women’s Wave Rider 16 Running Shoe — ‘marathon shoe for marathon filbustering’, ‘fits perfectly up a Republican’s rear end’

    I would love to see Wendy Davis use her Mizuno Wave Rider to give Rick Perry an “anal boost” so to speak.

  19. 19
    Anoniminous says:

    @Jeremy:

    Good.

    Texas had a 32.1% turnout in 2010. In 2012 there was a 49.7% voter turnout. The Texas congressional districts are gerrymandered to the max. An outlier voter turnout could flip a goodly number of seats.

  20. 20
    Corner Stone says:

    @lamh35:

    and she said she overheard some white co-workers of hers essentially saying that the Zimmerman trial “their” OJ trial

    As usual, your well sourced reportage is always the highlight of my days.

  21. 21
    MattF says:

    I think that Texas Republicans have been so insulated from no-kidding political opposition that anyone who can get people excited has a real chance. I’m, maybe, concerned that Davis isn’t really ruthless enough, but we shall see.

  22. 22
    elaine benis says:

    Patty Murray (D-WA) parlayed ‘mom in tennis shoes’ into pretty good gig.

  23. 23
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Emma:
    Just take it as another reminder that bright =/= knowledgeable

  24. 24
    PsiFighter37 says:

    Don’t think it’ll happen. Does such a thing as an organized Texas Democratic Party even still exist nowadays?

  25. 25
    different-church-lady says:

    @Emma: My joke for moments like that: “The problem with democracy is that everyone gets to vote.”

  26. 26
  27. 27
    Trollhattan says:

    Since it’s Pound on Perry Day (as should every day be), here’s Pierce on him and his co-conspirators for more better worker deaths in their states.

    This is Rick Perry, Governor Of Texas, including the city of West,on the EPA and environmental regulations:

    “… tell the EPA that we don’t don’t need you monkeyin’ around and fiddlin’ around and gettin’ in our business on every kind of regulation that you can dream up. You’re doin’ nothin’ more than killin’ jobs. It is a cemetery for jobs at the EPA.”

    This is “Bobby” Jindal, governor of Louisiana, including the city of Geismar, on government regulations:

    “We believe in planting the seeds of growth in the fertile soil of your economy, where you live, where you work, invest, and dream, not in the barren concrete of Washington. If it’s worth doing, block grant it to the states.”

    This is Mike Pence, governor of Indiana, including the city of Union Mills, on the same topic:

    “Over several decades the proliferation of administrative rules and regulations at all levels of government has increased the complexity and expense of economic life. Reducing this regulatory burden will promote citizens’ freedom to engage in individual, family and business pursuits.”

    Yeah, that’ll work.

  28. 28
    Corner Stone says:

    From my perch in the blue northeast, I don’t know how the Texas Democratic Party could be encouraged to do these things, so here’s your chance to explain it to me.

    I liken it to the apocryphal saying where (summarized):
    “Sir, the state is burning.”
    “Yes, but at least I’m in charge while it burns.”

  29. 29
    Baud says:

    @Amir Khalid:

    A big problem is that there is so much misinformation out there — some of it deliberate, some of it just ignorance or laziness — that a lot of people who don’t have the time or inclination to look up the facts will just internalize it.

  30. 30
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    This is from one of the One Star reviews of the shoes:

    I call on all patriots to refudiate these shoe makers, whoever they are. All of ’em, any of ’em that have corrupted america’s feet over all these years. Just like when Paul Revere warned the British that there ain’t nobody gonna take our 2nd amendment rights from us, I’m out here sendin’ those warning shots and bells about these pinko shoes!

    The five star reviews are good, but the one star reviews are comedy gold!

  31. 31
  32. 32
    Corner Stone says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    Does such a thing as an organized Texas Democratic Party even still exist nowadays?

    It’s incredibly well organized.

  33. 33
    lamh35 says:

    Ok, saw this on twitter and even though it would be good money for NOLA, my first reaction was what??? Pirates of the Carribean 5??? Now I know Johnny Depp must be flat broke or his trolling his movie fans…right?

    ‘Pirates of the Caribbean 5’ appears headed for a New Orleans shoot, producer confirms

  34. 34
    Corner Stone says:

    IMO, National Treasure with Nic Cage is one of the most re-watchable movies of the last 10 years.

  35. 35
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @mdblanche:

    Oh, I don’t know. This was pretty good…Scalia’s take on the movie of the case:

    “I’m going to be portrayed as a closed-minded Neanderthal and the very symbol of backward thinking. And at the end of the movie, when my character realizes he’s on the wrong side of history, the audience will feel emotionally fulfilled because the hero attorney, probably played by George fucking Clooney, will have won. Great.”

  36. 36
    Keith says:

    @Violet: I do recall a comment from him a couple of days ago where he said something to the effect of “are we gonna worry about following the rules or save lives?” That was why I was so surprised that Dewhurst agreed that the vote came after midnight; I figured if someone in his position was going to overtly say the rules didn’t matter, then that was their position at large. (I suspect when they caucused, enough people convinced them that there wasn’t a need to since they would get a do-over in July)

  37. 37
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Corner Stone: I’m not sure if that’s a joke or not, because any party that has gotten reamed as badly as Texas Dems have in the past 15 years don’t really stand a chance. They haven’t even come close to putting up a fight in a statewide race in a really long time.

  38. 38
    mdblanche says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Oh that’s good, but the real Nino would never be so introspective.

  39. 39
    Corner Stone says:

    @PsiFighter37: It’s not a joke, you’re just ignorant of anything having to do with politics in Texas.
    The Texas Democratic Party has a stranglehold on matriculation for viable candidates in the state.

  40. 40
    MattF says:

    Open thread, so, this:

    http://www.theonion.com/articl...../?ref=auto

    Love the last line.

  41. 41
    handsmile says:

    @Emma:

    Well, even here at this (slightly liberal) website comprised of “otherwise bright people,” I’m often amazed/dismayed at what people do not know (myself very much included).

    Besides, iirc where you work (library), I would imagine that encountering ignorance and/or the pursuit of knowledge would be an everyday hazard and/or pleasure.

    But absolutely props to you for patiently explaining to that person the arcana of US marriage laws and the impact of the Windsor decision upon them. Hope it was appreciated and perhaps someday she can return the favor from one of her areas of interest.

  42. 42
    Chris says:

    @Emma:

    I wasn’t raised in the American school system – is civics a thing?

  43. 43

    @jeffreyw:

    I love Humming Bird Moffs, great job on catching the wings there.

  44. 44
    Corner Stone says:

    @handsmile: This is not a liberal blog.

  45. 45
    Baud says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I agree with your comment above about National Treasure.

    The Texas Democratic Party has a stranglehold on matriculation for viable candidates in the state.

    How? Is it something like the old “boss” system the Dems used to have everywhere? Do they go all in against people who try to put themselves on the ballot without their approval?

    Don’t know anything about Texas, so I’m curious how it all works.

  46. 46
    Trollhattan says:

    @Chris:

    Yes, in high schools that still have auto shop.

  47. 47
  48. 48
    Jeremy says:

    @Violet: @Anya: Obama has undone a lot of the Clinton presidency. Even the conservative daily caller had a list of things Obama has reversed. But the people who wanted those reversals love bill and Hillary. Doesn’t make any sense.

  49. 49
    scav says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt:

    I love Humming Bird Moffs

    And I love the sudden vision of a Grand Moff Tarkin hummingbird flying about Darth. Profound Thanks!

  50. 50

    @Chris: This is a result of not running those Schoolhouse Rock ads anymore.

  51. 51
    Rex Everything says:

    The World’s Most Evil and Lawless Institution is the Executive Branch of the U.S. Government
    from Alternet
    [a sample:]

    U.S. Executive Branch leaders have tried to escape their legal responsibilities in their current war-making by claiming they do not apply to today’s “War on Terror” against “non-state” actors. But this is, of course, as valid as North Korea giving itself the right to attack South Korea. As U.N. Rapporteurs on torture and drone strikes have stated, there is no serious doubt that U.S. leaders have massively violated both the spirit and letter of international law seeking to protect civilians in wartime.

    http://www.alternet.org/invest.....nd-lawless

  52. 52
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Chris:

    Civics USED to be a thing, from what I gather. I remember some basic civics from my elementary school days, but that was back in the 60’s, before the Reagan Revolution did away with teaching the masses how to curb their masters’ whims.

  53. 53
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @Corner Stone: How’s that workin’ out for y’all?

  54. 54

    @Rex Everything: Thanks for reminding me why I don’t read Alternet anymore.

  55. 55
    lamh35 says:

    h/t Pete Souza Reverse angle of the POTUS & FLOTUS in the Door of No Return on Goree Island, Senegal https://twitter.com/petesouza/status/350333621338517504/photo/1

    Said to be the last things African being sold to the Slave Trade saw before boarding the ship for the Middle Passage

    Here’s another: President Obama looks out prison cell window on Goree Island pic.twitter.com/2kJ9C1JLMm

  56. 56
    Rex Everything says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    Thanks for reminding me why I don’t read Alternet anymore.

    Because it’s a bunch of LIBERTARIANS!

    Right?

    Right?

  57. 57
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: As a proud graduate of the CA elementary, secondary and post-secondary education system. Civics survived Reagan here in CA; Prop 13, not so much.

    ETA: I did leave the state for graduate education.

  58. 58
    Corner Stone says:

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Working on it.

  59. 59

    @Rex Everything: I stopped on page three when I saw this:

    “Can Americans Trust the U.S. Executive Branch?

    Columnist George Will recently summarized the fundamental issue underlying not only Edward Snowden’s recent whistleblowing, but all controversies about U.S. Executive Branch behavior: “The problem is we’re using technologies of information-gathering that didn’t exist 20 years ago… and they require reposing extraordinary trust in the Executive Branch of government.”

    Former Bush aide Matthew Dowd chimed in on the same talk show, saying “what they’re saying is trust us, trust us.” Trust is indeed the only basis for supporting a U.S. Executive which hides its activities from its own citizens. ”

    Should we trust the executive branch, let’s ask a former Bush aide!

  60. 60
    2liberal says:

    nba draft tonight. time for the suns to cash in on the new GM guy who supposedly is a whiz kid and a workaholic and one of those moneyball type geniuses, except in basketball. I am hoping for Len or Olapido

  61. 61
    Redshift says:

    @Keith:

    That was why I was so surprised that Dewhurst agreed that the vote came after midnight; I figured if someone in his position was going to overtly say the rules didn’t matter, then that was their position at large.

    According to an account from one of the people who was in the gallery, the real vote time was posted publicly and then changed. People outside sent before-and-after screen captures to the legislators in the closed-door meeting; otherwise they might not have known about it. If that’s true, then apparently Dewhurst decided the “me or your lyin’ eyes” defense wasn’t going to fly.

  62. 62
    eemom says:

    @Corner Stone:

    This is not a liberal blog.

    Nor are you a liberal. Just a garden variety hate-snake who happens to direct its venom in a different direction from most.

  63. 63
    NickT says:

    If the state Democratic Party has any brains, they’ll run Wendy Davis for governor and Julian Castro for Senate.

    If they have any brains, they’ll start by organizing better than they ever have before and fundraise like no tomorrow. Most of the Texas Democratic party’s problems come down to failures in those departments. If they don’t remedy them, they can run God Almighty and Jesus and they’ll still lose to the angry old white crazies.

  64. 64
    Corner Stone says:

    @Baud: Short version is all the real power is held by a bunch of good ole boys who’ve been moving and shaking with their R buddies for the last 50 years.
    The funnel and access to the money spigot goes through a process. And that process is rigidly controlled right down to local party chairpersons.
    Speak out against them in a meeting on Saturday and be ready for a call at 6:00am on Sunday morning with someone yelling at you.
    I personally don’t mind someone yelling at me so it hasn’t deterred me to this point.

  65. 65
    Jeremy says:

    @SatanicPanic: We have Voting rights being attacked, worker rights being attacked in GOP controlled states, as well as Women’s rights but to some Drones and Snowden are the most important issues ever.

  66. 66
    R-Jud says:

    @Chris: We had civics in my PA Catholic school in the mid-80s. I remember the nun who taught it juggling three balls as a metaphor for checks and balances within the three branches of federal government.

    It wasn’t a very good metaphor, but still.

  67. 67
    Mandalay says:

    @Anya:

    it always amazes me that people who are mad at Obama for not reversing all of B. Clinton’s bad laws are the same folks who worship Bill & Hill.

    It always amazes me that people make preposterous assertions without any supporting evidence.

  68. 68
    Violet says:

    @lamh35: That’s got to be full of emotion for Michelle Obama, given her ancestors were slaves.

  69. 69
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Corner Stone: Where I come from (and how I imagine most other blog readers here would take it), a measure of success would be how you’re doing at the electoral game. And you’re doing a mighty fine shitty job; I’d even call Californian Republicans more competent, and that’s saying something.

  70. 70
    Redshift says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    Should we trust the executive branch, let’s ask a former Bush aide!

    To be fair, the Bush Administration didn’t say “trust us,” they said “shut up and go away,” sometimes followed by “before we decide you’re a terrorist sympathizer.” So clearly “trust us” is just terrible by comparison…

  71. 71
    lamh35 says:

    I know some people hear are in love/hate relationships with Sandy Bullock, but I do love her, but I especially love Melissa McCarthey, so who going to see The Heat tomorrow? I sure want to, but I think I may have to wait for my sister Jessica comes down from Texas next week before I see it. She was my movie buddy before she went off to college and I moved to BR

    Check out the NSFW trailer

    http://youtu.be/gbSfd_n_Pog

  72. 72
    Mandalay says:

    @handsmile:

    Well, even here at this (slightly liberal) website…

    You obviously haven’t been following the Snowden threads which are to the right of public sentiment.

  73. 73
    lamh35 says:

    @lamh35: shoot, here’s the link for the last pic

    President Obama looks out prison cell window on Goree Island
    https://twitter.com/petesouza/status/350333847407325184

  74. 74
    Baud says:

    Legal sources tell NBC News that the former second-highest ranking officer in the U.S. military is now the target of a Justice Department investigation into an alleged leak of classified information about a covert U.S. cyber attack on Iran’s nuclear program.

    According to legal sources, Retired Marine Gen. James “Hoss” Cartwright, the former vice chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has been notified that he’s under investigation for allegedly leaking information about a massive attack using a computer virus named Stuxnet on Iran’s nuclear facilities. Gen. Cartwright, 63, becomes the latest alleged leaker targeted by the Obama administration, which has already prosecuted or charged eight individuals under the Espionage Act

  75. 75
    Jeremy says:

    @SatanicPanic: Also the funny thing about this “should we trust the executive branch” is that we trusted the executive branch since the founding of this nation. All of a sudden the 2009 inauguration comes around and that changes.

  76. 76
    Redshift says:

    Oh, and since this is an open thread, an announcement:

    I HAVE A JOB!

    I’m still waiting to get the physical paper in my hands before I mention any details, but WOO-HOO!

  77. 77
    Trollhattan says:

    @2liberal:

    Same for Sac, where we have a new….everything. Last year’s 1st round pick didn’t even last the SEASON, so the bar is set so low it’s brushing the fescue.

  78. 78
    Hal says:

    @Jeremy:

    Obama has undone a lot of the Clinton presidency. Even the conservative daily caller had a list of things Obama has reversed. But the people who wanted those reversals love bill and Hillary. Doesn’t make any sense.

    I like Bill and Hillary and will vote Hillary if she runs, but I have always been amazed at the justifications people use for his support of DOMA. If we can rightly criticize Obama when we think he is wrong, why not apply those standards to Bill Clinton? It doesn’t negate any good he did.

  79. 79
    Trollhattan says:

    @Redshift:

    Right on! Congrats, and enjoy your new Obamaconomy.

  80. 80
    Baud says:

    @Redshift:

    Really awesome. Is it one you wanted for reasons other than wanting a job?

  81. 81
    Rex Everything says:

    @Mandalay:

    You obviously haven’t been following the Snowden threads which are to the right of public sentiment.

    That doesn’t matter. Anyone who disagrees is dubbed a “libertarian” & thus is, by definition, oriented to the right of the Balloon Juice faithful.

    It’s getting to be funny as fuck.

  82. 82
    Corner Stone says:

    @PsiFighter37: You’re confusing the issue. There is absolutely no doubt the Texas Democratic Party is very well organized.

  83. 83
    Rex Everything says:

    @Jeremy:

    Also the funny thing about this “should we trust the executive branch” is that we trusted the executive branch since the founding of this nation. All of a sudden the 2009 inauguration comes around and that changes.

    I KNOW. There were ZERO articles on Alternet questioning the Bush Admin. Eight years of NOTHING. Disgraceful!

  84. 84
    burnspbesq says:

    In case you haven’t seen it, somebody whipped up a “Kill the Bill, vol. 2” poster with Wendy Davis’ head photoshopped in where Uma Thurman’s used to be. Tis awesome. But they forgot the pink running shoes.

  85. 85

    @Jeremy: And they’re willing to go to any source to get quotes bashing Obama. I wonder why.

  86. 86
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @Corner Stone: Well, except for the results part.

  87. 87
    Rex Everything says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    And they’re willing to go to any source to get quotes bashing Obama.

    What “quote[] bashing Obama” are you referring to?

  88. 88
    burnspbesq says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Dear God. That is some industrial-strength stoopid right there.

  89. 89
    Violet says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: Palin Parody. Gotta be. The “refudiate”, “all of ’em, any of ’em” and “pinko shoes” kind of give it away.

  90. 90
    Corner Stone says:

    @BillinGlendaleCA: Sorry. Do you have some special insight into the politics of Texas? Or just have some irrelevant comments from CA that, last time I reviewed had just about as mottled a modern political history as Texas.

  91. 91
    Jeremy says:

    @Mandalay: We have plenty of evidence. The fact that GLAAD gave an award to Clinton when they should have given one to Obama (the most pro gay president in U.S. history) first. Clinton who couldn’t even get a vote on any health care proposal whether it was his managed care employer mandate plan or an individual mandate managed care plan while Obama got a bill (a compromise) passed in 2 years but he got grief for it initially. Obama got Bin Laden while Clinton and Bush failed.

    Clinton get’s a lot of credit for being this great political whiz but the man failed on a lot of fronts.

  92. 92
    cokane says:

    Texas isn’t ready to vote for Democrats statewide in 2014. Sorry.

  93. 93

    @Rex Everything: The ones I posted above.

  94. 94
    eemom says:

    @Mandalay:

    You obviously haven’t been following the Snowden threads which are to the right of public sentiment, the public being people who don’t follow politics and think Snowden’s “revelations” are big news.

    There ya go.

  95. 95
    Rex Everything says:

    @SatanicPanic: I’m sorry, you call THAT Obama-bashing? Good lord.

    The story there is obviously not “we went to some righties just to get a good Obama-bashing quote, because everyone knows there are none to be found on the Left” (!), but “look at even these authoritarian righties expressing discomfort with the powers seized by the Executive Branch.”

    Honestly, you don’t realize that they could have just quoted the ACLU?

  96. 96
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Rex Everything:

    That doesn’t matter. Anyone who disagrees is dubbed a “libertarian” & thus is, by definition, oriented to the right of the Balloon Juice faithful.

    … says the guy who linked to an article that approvingly quotes George Will and Matthew Dowd.

    But you’re not siding with Republicans libertarians at all, no, not you. It’s that all the rest of us have moved to the right of George Will.

  97. 97
    gene108 says:

    @2liberal:

    I am hoping for Len

    Len’s going to be a project. He’s tall, but not very strong and is going to require a lot of work with regards to footwork and positioning for rebounding.

    I’d personally pass on him.

  98. 98
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Jeremy: I had Civics class and I still had a deeply flawed understanding of marriage law. I learned more going through it as a gay person myself, but…

    The only good side was that half of the class was taught by a Black dude who had been through Jim Crow and could put a very personal spin on desegregation. But our teachers weren’t lawyers.

    I was also pretty much taught that I could be a good citizen by learning to read the paper, which I did very diligently–hahahahaha.

  99. 99
    Jeremy says:

    @Hal: I agree. I don’t have positive feelings about the Clinton’s like I had before. Especially after the racism in the 2008 primaries and the constant “inevitability” crap from the Clintonites. But if she is the nominee I will vote for her because I don’t want to see a republican in office after Obama.

    I do give credit for the good things Bill Clinton did but like you I can’t stand the revisionist history when it comes to former presidents.

  100. 100
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @lamh35: OTOH, maybe it means they know he’s guilty as fuck.

  101. 101
    JoyfulA says:

    Re the San Diego trial of a man charged with vandalism for chalking BoA’s sidewalk, a man in Harrisburg was just arrested for chalking a message on Medicaid expansion on the sidewalk in front of the governor’s mansion: http://www.philly.com/philly/b.....rence.html (with pix)

    Lemme go find something to chalk up!

  102. 102
    Redshift says:

    @Baud:

    Really awesome. Is it one you wanted for reasons other than wanting a job?

    Amazingly enough, yes. Since I’ve been out of work for more than six months, I was long past the point of only applying to jobs I really wanted, but this one is really good in lots of ways; really interesting work and in an area that will be really good to get more experience in going forward, good people, a shorter commute, and making about as much as I was before.

  103. 103
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Corner Stone:

    @lamh35:

    and she said she overheard some white co-workers of hers essentially saying that the Zimmerman trial “their” OJ trial

    As usual, your well sourced reportage is always the highlight of my days.

    Don’t you have an MRA meetup that you’re running late to?

  104. 104
    VividBlueDotty says:

    For those of you declaring the Texas Democratic Party ineffective losers, please brush up on your Texas History. Jesus himself might have difficulty getting elected with this mess of a map, a parting gift from career criminal Tom Delay.

    I think organizing (which is indeed done well in many parts of Texas) and strategizing (like running Davis for Gov, Castro for Senate) are our best hope for now.

    FYI for those who click through. I was a part time intern for Martin Frost in 1981 too, while in high school. My hatred for Tom Delay burns with the fire of a thousand suns.

  105. 105
    Mandalay says:

    @Jeremy:

    Clinton get’s a lot of credit for being this great political whiz but the man failed on a lot of fronts.

    I don’t disagree with any of what you posted, but it hardly supports the absurd claim that “people who are mad at Obama for not reversing all of B. Clinton’s bad laws are the same folks who worship Bill & Hill“.

    How the hell does anyone know that? You might anecdotally have a colleague or two who fit that pattern, but that is very different from making the claim that it is always true, and common sense should tell you it is a ridiculous claim to make.

  106. 106
    Jeremy says:

    @Rex Everything</@eemom: I don’t know where this guy has been but the NSA stuff was not revealing. Everyone in the country already knew about it and approval for NSA programs have always run high in polling.

    The issue people had with the Bush team was their lack of warrants and oversight which has been in place for sometime now.

  107. 107
    VividBlueDotty says:

    DYWP!! My linky…

  108. 108
  109. 109
    aliasofwestgate says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: I had civics courses at a freshman in high school and this was like 1991. I have no idea if they’re still in existence anymore after all the extreme cuts they’ve gone to. ‘m pretty sure my choir classes are no more, since when they yell budget, ‘useless’ music (anything that isn’t marching band related) gets the axe first. This was in michigan, btw.

  110. 110

    Also- Alternet commenters are the worst liberal commenters on the internet. Like GOS with a healthy dose of troofer crankiness.

  111. 111
    Suzanne says:

    I am in the dentist’s chair getting numb for a root canal.

    Kitty is severely ill and the vet gave her less than a 50% chance of survival.

  112. 112
    VividBlueDotty says:

    And for those who do not click through, a quote from the article about Delay (emphasis mine)….

    DeLay ultimately went down for his efforts—resigning from Congress in 2006 under indictment for illegally using corporate contributions to fund TRMPAC—but his scheme capped his party’s 40-year ascendancy in Texas, where the GOP has seized every lever of power in a state that was solidly blue for the prior <strong<century.”

  113. 113
    Corner Stone says:

    @Another Halocene Human: No, I actually sold my motorcycle a long time ago.
    I appreciate you thinking of me though. Thanks!

  114. 114
    VividBlueDotty says:

    WP is hurting my feefees so I will hush up for now. I DO think this idea has legs. It honestly might be what would have happened anyway, but to plan it strategically, and maximize the fundraising and GOTV efforts strategically, is probably a very good plan.

  115. 115
    Violet says:

    @Suzanne: Oh, no! I’m so sorry to hear about your kitty. I saw your post last night that kitty wasn’t doing so well. Do you know what’s wrong with her?

    Good luck with the root canal. Hope it’s not too painful.

  116. 116
    Jeremy says:

    Also former NSA director Hayden in the Bush administration admitted that the Obama administration has been way more transparent than the Bush team when it comes to NSA activities. http://www.politico.com/story/.....92686.html

  117. 117
    Mandalay says:

    @eemom:

    the public being people who don’t follow politics and think Snowden’s “revelations” are big news

    BJ posters who assert that Snowden has not revealed anything that we didn’t already know are far more ignorant and deluded/dishonest than the general public.

    Here are some findings of a Time poll on Snowden….

    Fifty-four percent of respondents said the leaker, Edward Snowden, 29, did a “good thing” in releasing information about the government programs, which collect phone, email, and Internet search records in an effort, officials say, to prevent terrorist attacks. Just 30 percent disagreed.

    BJ approval of Snowden’s information release does not come anywhere near 54%.

  118. 118
    Baud says:

    @Mandalay:

    Couldn’t some of those people be right-wingers who only care about embarrassing Obama?

  119. 119
    Mary G says:

    @Redshift: Congratulations! You’ve had a hard slog, must be such a great feeling.

  120. 120
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Redshift: Congrats by the way – great news!

  121. 121
    Baud says:

    @Redshift: Excellent

  122. 122
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @SatanicPanic: Actually, I feel like alternet is much more mainstream than it used to be. It came of like a lefty WND back in the 1990s.

    They carry columns and reporting from a lot of different perspectives. For example, RHRealityCheck columns get crossposted there.

    As for the evils of war, our country is locked in its own karma fighting immoral conflicts around the world and throwing around its power for the enrichment of the few. But I don’t think that one president can change all that. It’s going to take a long damn time and every single one of us Americans bears some responsibility for this situation.

    But, ya know, I have pacifist sympathies. If you look at warfare and conflicts in a historical context there is much to be said for the potential for developing a much more peaceful world. Clearly some people disagree.

  123. 123
    Corner Stone says:

    @Baud:

    Couldn’t some of those people be right-wingers who only care about embarrassing Obama?

    That’s an interesting argument. If you want to know something, do you care the motivations of who is leaking it? What weighs more, the information revealed or the embarrassment to your side?

  124. 124
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @lamh35: thanks for the link, not sure I would have seen that otherwise

  125. 125
    Suzanne says:

    @Violet: My husband has been painting our living room, and kitty drank some of the water he was soaking the roller in. Even though her clean water dish was like 4 feet away.

  126. 126
    Rex Everything says:

    @eemom:

    people who don’t follow politics and think Snowden’s “revelations” are big news.

    You mean like David Carr of the NY Times, who has specialized in reporting on media/government relations for more than 2 decades? John Cassidy of the New Yorker, formerly the Sunday Times’ Washington bureau chief? Marisa Taylor and Jonathan Landay of McClatchy, who have covered foreign affairs, intelligence, and politics for a combined 45-odd years?

    Matt Taibbi, who can be described as many things, but certainly not as a person “who do[es]n’t follow politics”?

    Charles Pierce, who said “No, Mr. Current President, this is not business as usual. This is not even the NSA sifting through e-mails and phone calls. This is giving Big Brother a desk in every federal agency and telling him to go to work.”—is Charles Pierce someone who “do[es]n’t follow politics”?

    I could go on … but, like, who did you have in mind?

  127. 127
    Jeremy says:

    @Another Halocene Human: Actually I took a civics course in high school, but I attended a Magnet school

  128. 128
    Mandalay says:

    @Baud:

    Couldn’t some of those people be right-wingers who only care about embarrassing Obama?

    Sure. We seem to have one or two of them here as well from time to time.

  129. 129
    Rex Everything says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    But you’re not siding with Republicans libertarians at all, no, not you. It’s that all the rest of us have moved to the right of George Will.

    Yes. That’s exactly right.

    You can only tell the truth anymore when you’re trying to be sarcastic.

  130. 130
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @NickT: @Corner Stone:

    And #BGTX is not the Texas Democratic Party. So that gets around the whole issue with the crab bucket.

  131. 131
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Suzanne:
    Very sorry to hear about your kitty. On the root canal, my experience has been that, once you’re good and numb, everything’s cool. Just remember, DO NOT CHEW ON YOUR TONGUE UNTIL YOU GET YOUR FEELING BACK IN YOUR MOUTH.

  132. 132
    Baud says:

    @Corner Stone:

    I was only suggesting that the poll, as worded, might not capture where the country actually is on the issue, separate from the personalities involved.

    In terms of your questions, I guess it depends on the value of the information and the level of embarrassment. Hard to say in the abstract.

  133. 133
    Mark B says:

    @Redshift: As far as I know, Dewhurst has never acknowledged that the vote occurred after midnight, even though video and computer records confirm that it did. It’s unclear whether he called the vote before midnight, but the vote is effective when it closes, not when the voting period begins, and that clearly was after midnight.

    The reason that Dewhurst finally declared the bill invalid was that it is required by the Constitution that the bill be signed in front of the Senate by the presiding officer. There was no opportunity for them to pretend that this happened, so, lacking the required action, the bill was dead.

    As it stands now, the vote on the Texas Legislature’s site still says that the vote took place on June 25. If I were on the floor of the Senate, one of my first actions would be to ask for the official record to be corrected to reflect the actual time that the vote occurred. If you want something to really make you mad, you should read the ass-covering explanation the Legislative Reference Library put on their website explaining why they changed the date on the vote: http://www.lrl.state.tx.us/wha.....LO-actions

  134. 134
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    Do you have some special insight into the politics of Texas?

    Not really.

    Or just have some irrelevant comments from CA that, last time I reviewed had just about as mottled a modern political history as Texas.

    Now, this is quite rich. You claim that the TX Dems are organized, right? I was just pointing out that by measure of effectiveness; ya know, getting folk elected, not so much. When did the last Dem to hold statewide office?

  135. 135
    Corner Stone says:

    @Another Halocene Human: Yeah. Thanks for the insight, hadn’t considered that.
    Thanks!

  136. 136
    ellie says:

    I seem to recall taking American Government in high school. I graduated in 1983. At the time, the class was mandated by the state of Ohio. I am sure this is not the case anymore.

  137. 137
    handsmile says:

    @Mandalay:

    Oh, but I have; I just haven’t commented on any of them. Simply had no interest in participating in the bloodlust and amateur psychologizing that characterized many. I’ve chosen other battles here (my early and ardent support of Occupy Wall Street protests in NYC being one).

    Also, I deliberately (and playfully) chose the adjective “slightly” in my reply to Emma above (#41). “Ideologically conflicted,” “ideologically tribal,” “ideologically diverse” are all ways I could describe this site. I suspect that like most readers/commenters, there are a variety of reasons why I choose to participate here (have been doing so since mid-2010). While on a host of issues this is the most conservative blog I read regularly, the range of topics posted on the front page, the insights and wit of a number of commenters, and of course and emphatically, Kay, sustain my interest and serve to distract me from what I should be doing elsewhere.

  138. 138

    @Another Halocene Human: I don’t disagree this country loves war too much. But it’s kind of silly to blame The Executive Branch like it hasn’t been headed up by a bunch of different people with different policies. I mean, yeah, LBJ, GHWB and GWB killed lots of people. Obama, Reagan, Clinton, not as many. Gerald Ford, what a few dozen? Who knows, maybe the article was nuanced and intelligent once you get past where I stopped.

  139. 139
    ChrisNYC says:

    @Mandalay: Wow, that old poll! That poll came out before the Guardian and GG did their 8 paragraphs down hummina hummina backpedal. And before the whole messy “legitimate targets in the all knowing all seeing mind of one E Snowden” thing came out. (Is he ever gonna give us that list, by the way? We’ll need it if we’re to properly conduct ourselves.) And before our young Ed revealed his dearest hope to globe trot and provide “his” info to each country he stops in.

    There’s a new poll:

    http://news.yahoo.com/support-.....30702.html

    He’s circling the magical 27% on whether he’s a “patriot.”

    Now you can use this as evidence of how unenlightened the populace is.

  140. 140
    JPL says:

    @Suzanne: Sorry about the kitty. I had a root canal and it didn’t hurt but takes forever. Be prepared to be bored. I had ear phones and listened to music.

  141. 141
    MomSense says:

    @Mandalay:

    I made lemon roast chicken with garlic, potatoes and carrots for dinner. Delicious! Here is the recipe.

    I took a small 3.5 lb chicken and rubbed olive oil over it. Then in the roasting pan I placed thick slices of red onion and put the chicken on top. Then I squeezed fresh lemon juice and a little zest on the bird and placed 1/2 a lemon inside the bird. In the pan I put little red, yellow, and purple potatoes and carrots (cut to about 2.5-3 inches long) and whole garlic cloves around the chicken in the pan. On top I squeezed about 2 fresh lemons, added some olive oil, S&P, basil, oregano, and thyme. Roast the chicken 15 minutes per pound +10 minutes at 400 or 375 if convection oven. You will probably have to toss the veggies a few times so they don’t stick. Also, make sure the bottom doesn’t burn. You may need to add a little more lemon and/or water.

    So good! We also had a quick salad of romaine thinly sliced with some fresh dill and a lemon juice and olive oil vinaigrette.

  142. 142
    karen says:

    @Corner Stone:

    This is not a liberal blog.

    It’s not Red State or Breitbart either, but keep on using a litmus test for who is “liberal” and who is a real Democrat ok?

  143. 143
    aimai says:

    @Mandalay: Your entire post is a non sequiteur and just plain silly. Why should BJ commenters, a sub set of a sub set of people interested in politics/pets/john cole track the proportion of people in a generic survey of US citizens? Not all BJ posters are even citizens, for one thing. And a lower proportion of people surveyed probably care about cats and dogs, let alone politics.

  144. 144
    Suzanne says:

    @Redshift: YAAAAAY! That is great. Rock on.

  145. 145

    @Suzanne:

    My dogs have several preferences for water, a) a mop bucket under the gutter by the garage that I use to water my plants when there has been no rain, b) the toilet c) their actual water dish which is constantly filled with fresh clean water from a 5 gallon bottle. I have no words.

  146. 146
    Steeplejack says:

    @burnspbesq:

    As usual, adjust your snark-o-meter.

  147. 147
    Hal says:

    @Mandalay:

    Also:

    But an almost identical number of Americans — 53 percent — still said he should be prosecuted for the leak, compared to 28% who said he should not. Americans aged 18 to 34 break from older generations in showing far more support for Snowden’s actions. Just 41 percent of that cohort say he should face charges, while 43 percent say he should not. Just 19 percent of that age group say the leak was a “bad thing.”

    and:

    Overall, Americans are sharply divided over the government’s use of surveillance programs to prevent terrorist attacks, according to the results of the poll. Forty-eight percent of Americans approve of the surveillance programs, while 44 percent disapprove, a statistical tie given the poll’s four-point margin of error.

    So he did good, but prosecute him, glad he released the info, but maybe sort of I like these programs. Also, I’m willing to bet George Will cares about Obama and the NSA. Another Republican? Probably not at all. But, debate is a good thing.

  148. 148
    Rex Everything says:

    @karen:

    It’s not Red State or Breitbart either, but keep on using a litmus test for who is “liberal” and who is a real Democrat ok?

    OK — and remember, Alternet is Republican now.

  149. 149
    Suzanne says:

    @Litlebritdifrnt: I have no idea why she did this. Poor baby is now on liver medication and a special diet.

  150. 150
    Yatsuno says:

    @MomSense: Fess up: you’re Nigella Lawson aren’t you? :-)

  151. 151
    karen says:

    Don’t you have an MRA meetup that you’re running late to?

    What is that?

  152. 152
    MomSense says:

    @Redshift:

    Yay!!! Congratulations!!

    @Suzanne:

    Sending good thoughts for healing for both you and kitty.

  153. 153
    karen says:

    @Redshift:

    Mazel Tov! I’m over the moon for you!

  154. 154
    Steeplejack says:

    @Violet:

    That and the fact that the poster specifically says: “I’m posting this for an anonomous ‘lady’ who told me to ‘upthingy it on the intertubes or else . . .'”

  155. 155
    Corner Stone says:

    @karen: On it!

  156. 156
    MomSense says:

    @Yatsuno:

    I should be–minus the creepy, chokey husband.

    I just love to cook. My evening routine is to pour a big glass of wine and then start preparing food while the boys come in and out of the kitchen testing everything.

  157. 157
    Violet says:

    @Steeplejack: Heh. I didn’t read the amazon site. Just the quote. Palin parody is so easy to pick out.

  158. 158
    Suzanne says:

    This dental assistant sucks.

  159. 159
    Suzanne says:

    This dental assistant sucks.

  160. 160
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Jeremy: Indeed. I don’t remember the left having such a prolonged meltdown about Clinton’s use of American military power. The lefty papers I was able to get my hands on did not target the president much at all. They were very focused on the American (in)justice system at the time. Oh, and arguing about which doctrinal strain of political thought all right thinking people should adhere to.

    Of course most of this stuff right now is being driven by clever libertarian trolls. Back then the tinhatters were throwing out all kinds of stuff that leftists found repellent. Remember, this was during the same period as Luap Nor’s embrace of Lee Atwater’s paleoconservatism in his newsletters. However now that they’ve bleached out the overt anti-Semitism and adopted a reactionary pose of embracing progress on civil rights all the while holding the deadenders close by quietly endorsing the elimination of the CRA, it seems like the sky is the limit with drawing in discouraged, paranoid lefties. 9/11 tr0000f started the red-black coalition and we’re off to the races.

    Lot of wilfull blindness out there. I’ve lost a friend to 9/11 conspiracy theory. She told me Glenn Greenwald was a lefty and expressed shock that anyone would consider him a libertarian. She was pissed at Obama for not going Hulk Smash on corporations and Citizens United as soon as inaugurated. Hey, I was pissed too but Rome wasn’t burned in a day, jeez. I mean, she totally admitted her Obama backlash was emotional. Lots of really bad things happened in her life (job, financial, children) and so she latched onto a dangerous fantasy.

  161. 161
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Redshift: Mazel tov!

  162. 162
    Botsplainer, fka Todd says:

    @Corner Stone:

    IMO, National Treasure with Nic Cage is one of the most re-watchable movies of the last 10 years.

    For my money, top prize goes to Dodgeball. There’s something about dodge balls to the face that gets me every single time.

  163. 163
    mai naem says:

    I happen to follow several Texas Dem people on my twitter feed. I don’t know a whole lot about Texas Dems. I know about the Delay redistricting map and I know Bill White lost in the last gubernatorial race.But anyhow, from my twitter feed I get the feeling the Dems are alive in Texas. They seem concentrated in the major cities esp. Austin. When OFA asked what they should do next, my response was to organize in Texas. One of my plans, if I get my shit together, is to go down to Texas in 2015/16 to help w/voter registration. If the Dems make Texas even just competitive, its game over for the Repubs.

  164. 164
    WereBear says:

    @Redshift: WOO HOO back at ya!

    I know you’ve had… well… mostly downs. This is an UP!

  165. 165
    MomSense says:

    @mai naem:

    Just making Texas competitive would be huge. Republicans would have to spend money there instead of just raising money.

  166. 166
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Botsplainer, fka Todd: If you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball. Words to live (or die) by.

  167. 167
    Steeplejack says:

    @karen:

    “Men’s rights activists” or some such, I believe.

  168. 168
    Baud says:

    @MomSense:

    Good point.

  169. 169
    Steeplejack says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    “If it’s almost a sport, it’s on the Ocho [mythical ESPN8].”

  170. 170
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Suzanne: :::Suzanne::: (hugs)

  171. 171
    TerryC says:

    When they try this again, in Texas, I wish that the progressives would go all Red, White, and Blue and outdo even the Teabaggers. You know, our country, not yours. Imagine the Republicans trying to oppose people who patriotically out-dress the Teabaggers.

  172. 172
    Violet says:

    @MomSense:

    Just making Texas competitive would be huge. Republicans would have to spend money there instead of just raising money.

    Yep. Every Democrat, left-leaning, liberal, or progressive person in the country should be focusing on Texas. If Texas even becomes a reddish shade of purple, it’ll put the hurt on Republicans like nothing else. They’ll have to spend money there and it’ll wake up the entire country.

  173. 173
    Violet says:

    @Suzanne: I’m so sorry about your kitty. I hope the liver medication works and she recovers.

  174. 174
    Mark B says:

    This article supposedly explains the changing of the date on the vote. However, I disagree with two things in the article. It’s still unclear to me whether the vote started before the clock struck midnight, and also it seems illogical that the effective date of the vote is when the vote is opened, not when it the votes are actually cast.

    This needs to be cleared up. It defies logic, and I think it’s an incorrect reading of the rules. It’s all kind of moot, since the bill could not be signed before the vote ended, and it had to be signed by the presiding officer in order to be official. I sitll think the Senate should spend the first 3 1/2 weeks of the special session debating the complete travesty the Senate made of their own rules on the last day in their zeal to pass an unconstitutional law that benefits noone.

  175. 175
    CaseyL says:

    @Redshift: Fantastic! Hope the job turns out to be even better than you thought it would be!

    ETA: My understanding of the vote on SB5 was that Dewhurst acknowledged it was void in return for the Democrats not pushing for an investigation into why a vote was taken after the midnight deadline, and while a parliamentary matter was still unresolved.

  176. 176
    Yatsuno says:

    @CaseyL: MEET-UP!!! Tentative date July 13 Pike Brewery, time still TBA. Gonna front-page here soon.

  177. 177
    waratah says:

    @Mark B: My understanding is that they could make up the rules but that the midnight finish is in the constitution and they could not change this. I cannot remember where I saw this. They started or resumed trying to vote after midnight from what I could see.

  178. 178
    Suffern ACE is a Basset Hound says:

    @Suzanne: shouldn’t that be “thish dentshal ashisththanth sthuckth?”

    Hang in there

  179. 179
    Lurking Canadian says:

    @Another Halocene Human: Depends what you mean by “the left”. In the late 90s, I was reading Z magazine, Mother Jones, “no difference between Bush and Gore” types, and for damn sure they had no use for Clinton. He and Amy Goodman really got into it one time, when he made the probably unwise decision to be interviewed on her show.

    The strangest thing about the PUMA phenomenon, to me, was that somehow the Clintons became identified with theDemocratic party’s left so Hillary was aupposedly the progressive choice. That is not what the left would have told you in 1999.

  180. 180
    Suzanne says:

    @Suffern ACE is a Basset Hound: She just stabbed me and then lied about it.

  181. 181
    Yatsuno says:

    @Redshift: WOOOOOOT!!!! Give yourself a nice long beer-thirty, you definitely deserve it!

    @Suzanne: :: hug ::

    Kick the dental assistant. See if they squeak.

  182. 182
    JPL says:

    @Suzanne: ugh.. Does the office have a picture of President Reagan?

  183. 183
    BillinGlendaleCA says:

    @Yatsuno:

    Kick the dental assistant. See if they squeak.

    I would advise against that, she obviously has sharp objects.

  184. 184

    @Suzanne:

    My husband has been painting our living room, and kitty drank some of the water he was soaking the roller in.

    I don’t understand why, but cats apparently find random containers of water far more attractive than all the containers you put out there for them deliberately. I don’t know if it’s that they like finding water, or that when they decide they’re thirsty they’ll go for the first container of water they can find, or what, but they will drink from all the wrong places. A friend thinks her cat probably destroyed her kidneys by drinking anti-freeze; the cat wound up needing a kidney transplant.

  185. 185
    Mark B says:

    @waratah: Right, but the questions remaining are: 1. Did voting actually begin before midnight? It seems unlikely, since there was no way the members could have been made aware of that in the pandemonium that erupted. 2. does (1) even matter, since clearly they were actually voting after midnight, and the vote was not completed until about 12:04. It makes zero sense that a vote counts before it is actually cast.

    As I said above, the bill is not considered passed until signed by the presiding officer, and he could not do that until after the vote was finished, so on that procedural matter, it was dead now matter how you resolve the voting issue. But it’s important to me that they get the facts straight and make sure that the record reflect a truthful accounting of what actually happened. So I think an investigation is in order. A lengthy investigation which should take about 30 days to complete.

  186. 186
    Suzanne says:

    @Roger Moore: We’ve had the cat for two and a half years, and this is the first time this has happened. She’s not even the cat that steals food. I wouldn’t have believed if I hadn’t seem her drinking the paint water myself.

  187. 187
    Yatsuno says:

    @Roger Moore:

    A friend thinks her cat probably destroyed her kidneys by drinking anti-freeze

    Kittehs think anti-freeze is like soda. It tastes very sweet to them so they lap it down but it’s very poisonous. Puppehs will do this as well. It’s why you never have it sitting in the open if you have pets or small children.

  188. 188
    Mark B says:

    @Yatsuno: I always use low toxicity antifreeze in my cars. It cost slightly more, but it works just as well as the poisonous stuff. You don’t have to worry about killing pets if you bust a hose or the radiator springs a leak.

  189. 189
    ruemara says:

    @Redshift: YAY! Congratulations!

  190. 190

    @Lurking Canadian:

    The strangest thing about the PUMA phenomenon, to me, was that somehow the Clintons became identified with theDemocratic party’s left so Hillary was aupposedly the progressive choice.

    I volunteered in a local branch of the Clinton campaign in ’96, and I got the impression that Hillary was a lot more popular than Bill among the activists. I suspect that was largely because she was largely a talker rather than a doer, so she was never tarnished by the need to compromise with the Republicans to get stuff done. I think that feeling that she was the real liberal of the couple and Bill was the centrist stayed with people, even though they should have known better by looking at her record in the Senate.

  191. 191
    scav says:

    @Redshift: Huzzah for incoming papers bearing employment!. Tickertape, confetti and streamers!

  192. 192
    srv says:

    @karen: Moped Rider Association.

    Or girl bike gang, at least a few years back when they used to pack ride on scooters.

  193. 193
    eemom says:

    @handsmile:

    ideologically tribal

    Et tu, Brute?

    The ceaseless reiteration of lefty buzzwords du jour “authoritarian” and “tribal” around here in the last few weeks — led by the shining example of that FPer least renowned for original thought — has gotten really, really tedious.

  194. 194
    Anne Laurie says:

    @Redshift: Congratulations!

  195. 195
    Mandalay says:

    @aimai:

    Why should BJ commenters, a sub set of a sub set of people interested in politics/pets/john cole track the proportion of people in a generic survey of US citizens?

    There is no reason at all, and nobody in this thread is arguing that it should AFAIK.

  196. 196
    Corner Stone says:

    @Botsplainer, fka Todd: I like it but it has that bicycle dude in it for a bit part. I prefer my heroes to be flawless.

  197. 197
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Suzanne: Sorry about your cat news! Wishing for the best for you all.

  198. 198
    Corner Stone says:

    Anyone who says the left was ok with Bill Clinton during his presidency, not in hindsight but actually during it, is a fucking fool that should go back to the microfiche and try again.

  199. 199
    ruemara says:

    @karen: Men’s Rights Advocates.

  200. 200
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Redshift:

    Gratz!

  201. 201
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Mandalay: I bet the percentage of people here who think the DOMA decision was good is higher than that of the general public. Pick a different issue, you’ll get a different interplay. Also, are you going by number of comments or commenters?

  202. 202
    Corner Stone says:

    @Steeplejack: Shit, I thought it was Motorcycle Roadracing Association.
    I used to have a GSXR-750 that I sold quite a bit ago. I thought that was the mistaken part.

  203. 203
    PsiFighter37 says:

    Who can come up with the wittiest definition of accurate intercourse?

    And the GOP wonders why no one in my age cohort takes them seriously…

  204. 204
    WereBear says:

    @Suzanne: Cats are often thrown off by smells that signal, in nature: This is safe to drink.

    When, sadly, it is not.

    Good luck to both of you!

  205. 205
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Corner Stone: I had a subscription to the Nation* back then; you are correct.

    I also had a TNR subscription – until Peretz drove me mad.

    @PsiFighter37:

    Who can come up with the wittiest definition of accurate intercourse?

    Hitting the g-spot.

  206. 206
    raven says:

    No NBA draft thread?

  207. 207
    MikeJ says:

    @Suzanne: Is it safe?

    Did someone say meet up? When did this happen?

  208. 208
    Anne Laurie says:

    @handsmile:

    While on a host of issues this is the most conservative blog I read regularly, the range of topics posted on the front page, the insights and wit of a number of commenters, and of course and emphatically, Kay, sustain my interest and serve to distract me from what I should be doing elsewhere.

    Thank you, from someone doing her inadequate best to shift the blog’s Overton window slightly further from ‘authoritarian’.

  209. 209
    Corner Stone says:

    @raven: Do you actually know anything about any of those kids?

  210. 210
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: And if you conceive during said occurrence, you’ve probably hit the jackpot, amirite?

    @MikeJ: When you weren’t on the open thread last night…jerk.

  211. 211
    MikeJ says:

    @Roger Moore:

    so she was never tarnished by the need to compromise with the Republicans to get stuff done.

    Note her stunning success in getting health care reform passed.

  212. 212

    @PsiFighter37:

    Who can come up with the wittiest definition of accurate intercourse?

    Accurate intercourse is when you get the penіs in the right hole, rather than “accidentally” putting it in the ass the way Republican men usually do.

  213. 213
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @PsiFighter37: I think you get a goldfish in a bag.

    ETA: I am not a physician or a biologist.

  214. 214
    raven says:

    @Corner Stone: Sure, KCP is a Dawg! Three B1G players in the first 10 and the big kid from Gonzaga.

  215. 215
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Roger Moore: I thought Republican men preferred dogs, but hey, I can’t project Rick Santorum’s wants on the whole party?…

  216. 216
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Corner Stone: Too true. On the specific matter of military involvement, I remember well long-running internecine left-on-left fights about humanitarian intervention as nothing more than a new phase of Western imperialism. The conflicts in the former Yugoslavia were the flashpoint for that whole debate, which then spilled over into Rwanda and Somalia. The always ornery Alexander Cockburn was all over Clinton’s war crimes, and the pre-neoliberal version of Christopher Hitchens was another thorn in Clinton’s side.

  217. 217
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Violet:

    The title of the review is “I can see these shoes from my house!”

    So, yes!

  218. 218
    amk says:

    @Emma: Being librul doesn’t automatically mean being smart. Left has its own percentage of teabaggers.

  219. 219
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: That’s nowhere near enough to feed a family of three beyond an afternoon snack.

  220. 220
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Rex Everything:

    Yes. That’s exactly right.

    You can only tell the truth anymore when you’re trying to be sarcastic.

    Well, enjoy your new liberal buddies, George Will and Matthew Dowd. I’m sure they’ll continue to agree with you on civil liberties as soon as a Republican president is back in charge, so there’s no way that relationship can ever go wrong.

  221. 221
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Anne Laurie: I don’t see that many “authoritarians.” I see a lot of people eager to call bullshit on self-avowed anti-authoritarians, but that’s not the same thing.

  222. 222
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @PsiFighter37: IIRC goldfish are small carp, so just keep the fucker for a while and it will get huge.

  223. 223
    Corner Stone says:

    @raven: I’ve been flipping back and forth at it. I like the commentary but I just can’t keep track of all these damn freshman coming out every year.

  224. 224
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @FlipYrWhig: I think the preferred term is “statist” anyway.

  225. 225
    Corner Stone says:

    @FlipYrWhig:

    I don’t see that many “authoritarians.”

    Say what now?!

  226. 226
    PsiFighter37 says:

    @Corner Stone: I feel like something should be done to incentivize kids to stay longer in school, but the only foreseeable thing that would induce this is paying college athletes. Overall, I don’t feel like all these 1-and-doners have as good a fundamental game as people who would stick around more.

    Then again, people like Hansborough and Reddick, who stuck it out their full 4 years never really amounted to much in recent times…

  227. 227
    Another Halocene Human says:

    http://littlegreenfootballs.co.....e_Privileg

    Still think Obama is a traitor and a Republican?

    Clinton wouldn’t have done this. He thought the benefits of “engagement” outweighed the risks.

    Whatever. Done with all the fake-progs. No president in MY LIFETIME has taken an action like this. You don’t deserve what you’ve got.

  228. 228
    Yatsuno says:

    @PsiFighter37: Why does everyone pick on Derpy? Although that is one helluva lolwut. It might explain why I have only three brothers, though I thought maybe birth control had something to do with that too.

  229. 229
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Mnemosyne: Heh, Rand Paul claimed his Santorum-redux comments were “sarcastic”.

    I think he is confused. The Wonkette snark in response to his comments–now there’s some sarcasm (not to mention satire and multiple other forms of irony, humor, and outrage).

  230. 230
    Redshirt says:

    @raven:

    No NBA draft thread?

    LOL. Yeah, right.

  231. 231
    Violet says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    Who can come up with the wittiest definition of accurate intercourse?

    Foot and mouth disease?

  232. 232
    Redshirt says:

    @Redshift: Congrats, alter-ego!

  233. 233
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @FlipYrWhig: But you’re talking about people with real newspaper jobs, not Maoist cells handing out mimeographed newsletters in the streets. Okay, maybe Kinko’s had let them upgrade to xeroxed. But still. That’s the left I’m talking about. And they and their intellectual descendents think Obama is the Manchurian Candidate.

    Though it could be that they didn’t focus much on Clinton because they considered the entire US government to be an illegitimate imperialist slave state. So there’s that.

  234. 234
    ChrisNYC says:

    @Anne Laurie: How very authoritarian of you!

  235. 235
    FlipYrWhig says:

    @Corner Stone: I don’t think very many of the regulars, as much as we agree or disagree on various issues and incidents in the news, come down on the side of wanting to follow the orders of a strong daddy-surrogate. I think the most common dynamic is that people rush to declare their anti-authoritarian sentiments, sometimes get challenged on their interpretations, and conclude that the challenge arises from a different view of authority and deference to it, rather than to a disagreement about a smaller matter of interpretation (e.g., is it Obama’s fault, or was another outcome reasonably possible, etc.). IOW, anti-authoritarians get pushback, but the pushers-back are not authoritarians. The narrow exception I see would be on the subject of “keeping us safe,” to wit, “the NSA is just doing what it needs to do to keep us safe.”. But I don’t think most people who say things like that really believe it. They probably mean “even if you don’t like it, it’s legal and authorized, so stop flying off the handle about it.”

  236. 236
    raven says:

    @Redshirt: Thought folks would get a kick out of that! Fuckin commie ass soccer threads all damn day long. I know what time it is!

  237. 237
    Yatsuno says:

    For SoBe and RedKitteh if she emerges: @QUACK!!!

  238. 238
    Corner Stone says:

    @FlipYrWhig: Force involvement was one facet, but the truth which many choose to gloss over is that every domestic policy regarding labor, trade, welfare, etc was roundly panned and inveighed against by people outside of a very special group of delicates.

  239. 239
    Violet says:

    I wandered over to LGF via someone’s link above and saw this:

    S.E. Cupp is going to be a regular panelist on CNN’s revival of Crossfire, and during a segment on Piers Morgan promoting it

    That pretty much sums up the sad gossipy wannabes that call themselves our media.

  240. 240
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Corner Stone: Nice strawman. We were actually discussing the degree of obsession. And there’s no comparison there.

    The frantic attempt to swap Nader and Gore votes and the eleventh hour shows just how deep the revulsion, if any, there was towards Clinton. Which is to say, not very. The weakness was a general meh-itude after eight years of Republican-lite and a completely unfounded faith that a more liberal future was in the offing and it was inevitable.

  241. 241
    Corner Stone says:

    @FlipYrWhig: Unsurprisingly, I roundly and forcefully disagree with your interpretation of the environment here.
    It spreads from issues like nat sec to economic policy to healthcare to voters rights. Have you seen the sheer number of people here licking their chops and praying that every individual who strays from the true and narrow not only pays for it, but pays for it in really troubling ways?
    It’s a sheer sense of delight to punish, and use those as example for the others.
    It’s disgusting.

  242. 242
    ChrisNYC says:

    @FlipYrWhig: See now, I agree, but I would say that the improper opinions, deemed to be anti-authoritarian, are so deemed because they get in the way of some very serious fapping.

  243. 243
    Redshirt says:

    @raven: 65 days till NFL.

  244. 244
    Hal says:

    @Violet:

    Sippy Cup! If ever there was a TV persona with a manufactured personality, it’s Sippy Cup. Are those glasses even real?

  245. 245
    Corner Stone says:

    @Another Halocene Human: How is that a strawman?

  246. 246
    Redshirt says:

    @Corner Stone: That’s a twisted take. Perhaps you should consider the bias in your own judgement. At 241.

  247. 247
    Corner Stone says:

    @Redshirt: Thank the FSM.
    May Her noodly appendages bless and keep you!

  248. 248
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Lurking Canadian: Having no use for is different from obsessive hatred. Mainstream liberals criticized Clinton’s State Dept and FCC policy, for example. I well remember the attitude that Bush and Gore were the same. What I’m talking about is ODS and quite frankly the only people who really hated and feared the fuck out of Clinton were backwoods militia tin-hatters and the dipshits in Congress who had him impeached.

  249. 249
    jeffreyw says:

    @Yatsuno: Kitteh pix, please and thank you.

  250. 250
    MikeJ says:

    @Violet: A revival of Crossfire? Why can’t they just do Wonderful Town? I’ve only ever seen the movie version and would love to catch it on stage.

    I actually went to a taping of the last iteration of Crossfire and got selected to ask a question but they ran out of time. If you go, the key to getting picked is always give them a black and white choice between Democrats and Republicans.

  251. 251
  252. 252
    raven says:

    @Redshirt: 64 till the Dawgs and Clemson!

  253. 253
    Corner Stone says:

    @Redshirt: I’m sorry, what? Are you denying that commenter after commenter here have posted the kinds of harsh outcomes they prefer for certain individuals?

  254. 254
    Redshirt says:

    @Corner Stone: Ramen to you as well, with good red sauce.

  255. 255
    gelfling545 says:

    @Emma: I know Here in NY they teach this at about grade 7 & again at grade 11. Still, people who should know don’t. I can’t tell you how many conversations I have had since 2008 about why the President doesn’t just make Congress do this or that and can’t believe that’s not quite how things work.

  256. 256
    Redshirt says:

    @Corner Stone: Yes. No one here is talking about rounding up the poors or locking up the brownz or incarcerating every pot smoker who’s a darker shade of pale. No one. To dramatize it as you have is not correct.

    And please, sir, consider the opposition, the Wingnuts. We have NAZIism on our doorstep, a militant theocracy waiting to take power, and you’d condemn the folks here as such?

  257. 257

    Since this is an open thread, my take on all the articles I have recently been reading comparing India and China.

  258. 258
    Corner Stone says:

    @Redshirt: Authoritarians don’t have to have a leftvright ideology. I believe you’re confusing the issue.

  259. 259
    Patricia Kayden says:

    @Hal: Agreed. Love both Clinton and Obama. They are both great presidents despite their shortcomings. They’re head and shoulders above the other side. Still shudder at the thought of a VP Palin or a President Romney.

    It would be fabulous if Texas Dems ran Davis as the Governor and Castro for the Senate. Fingers crossed.

  260. 260
    scav says:

    Accurate Intercourse? Tab A in Slut B.

    but that (allowing for traditionalist ® missionary vocabulary) is a truism and may be beyond him. Has he recently been trying to shut down all of Texas’ Brokeback Ride-through Abortion Clinics ‘n’ Bars? Or maybe he recently thought we need to open a few now that we’re all gay marrying but has figured that dead end out and is on a mission of enlightenment?

  261. 261
    gelfling545 says:

    Just a little grand-parental bragging here. My high school freshman granddaughter has become a (paid!) columnist for a small local paper here. She lives (when she is with her dad) in the “hip” area of our city (well, as hip as we get around here, anyway) so she is writing columns about a young person’s perspective of living in an artsy-fartsy & moderately weird environment. Her first column was published today.
    She has ADD & school has been an uphill battle but she is an interesting writer with a rather quirky point of view and I am so proud I’m fit to burst.

  262. 262
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @Emma:

    I had a somewhat similar conversation with a colleague, but the difference is, she’s from Hungary, has lived here only three or so years, and frankly has a better grasp of U.S. politics than most native-born Americans have. And she knows enough not to have asked the stupid “Why didn’t Obama just…?” question. She did find the whole federal-state thing interesting. Perplexing. But interesting.

  263. 263
    SiubhanDuinne says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    Does such a thing as an organized Texas Democratic Party even still exist nowadays?

    Will Rogers, where are you when we need you?

  264. 264
    Josie says:

    @VividBlueDotty: I feel your pain – both with Tom Delay and WP.

  265. 265
    NickT says:

    @Violet:

    If the clue is “accurate intercourse”, the solution must be “Bushmaster”.

  266. 266
    Corner Stone says:

    @Josie: There was nothing more enjoyable for me than working to get Nick Lampson elected to TX-22 after Tom left town.

  267. 267
    Mandalay says:

    @Rex Everything: It might also be worth mentioning that Keith Alexander, Director of the NSA, said

    What Snowden has revealed has caused irreversible and significant damage to our country and to our allies.

    Interesting that he should have made that comment, yet BJ has a gazillion posters insisting that they already knew everything that Snowden revealed, and it is all old news.

    So we have three options:
    – BJ is infested with fucktards who are liars and/or clueless.
    – The Director of the NSA is a liar and/or clueless.
    – Both of the above.

    Think I’ll go for the third option.

  268. 268
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:

    @ranchandsyrup: “So many courtesy carts ferrying them around.”

    Is that what they’re calling forklifts now? ;p

  269. 269
    Mandalay says:

    @Omnes Omnibus:

    I bet the percentage of people here who think the DOMA decision was good is higher than that of the general public. Pick a different issue, you’ll get a different interplay.

    I am sure you are right for most social issues. I am still amazed at the visceral hatred for Snowden here though. Perhaps if he had worked with (say) Amy Goodman or Robert Fisk rather than GG then he might have received a warmer reception.

    Also, are you going by number of comments or commenters?

    I suspect this place has quite a few sockpuppets, which makes the number of actual commenters tricky to determine.

  270. 270
    Josie says:

    @Corner Stone: Good on you for doing that.

  271. 271
    trollhattan says:

    @gelfling545:
    Reviving this dead thread to tell you how much your tale warms my heart. My very best wishes to your granddaughter on her budding career. We need her!

  272. 272
    lojasmo says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    CS is a troll. Don’t take anything it says seriously.

    If you knock off the beer you’ll think more clearly.

  273. 273
    lojasmo says:

    @Corner Stone: and Ted& Helen are the same thing.

  274. 274
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:

    @Mandalay:

    IOW, you constantly amaze yourself.

  275. 275
    karen says:

    @PsiFighter37:

    Accurate intercourse = a guy who knows how to aim.

  276. 276
    karen says:

    @lojasmo:

    Actually not. I like Corner Stone. Ted & Hellen can take a long walk off a shot pier.

  277. 277
    karen says:

    @Mandalay:

    I don’t hate Snowden. I just don’t think he’s the saint you think he is.

  278. 278
    karen says:

    @Corner Stone:

    Let me ask you a question. If someone means harm to you, I mean real harm, salivating at stopping your right to vote or have an abortion or vindictively makes such cuts that you have to choose whether to pay your utilities or starve, wouldn’t you want horrible things to happen to them? Let me tell you, I just got into disabled housing with my Rheumatoid Arthritis. I had to wait on the list for THREE years until I could get in here and it’s subsidized Section 8 housing. If I lived in a red state that had a governor or senator who made it their mission to get my new housing shut down I’d want terrible things for them. I’d want horrible things for their friends and every member of their family. If I was angry enough, I’d even want death for them. I know you despise Obama so you probably wouldn’t understand why I’d want horrible things for his executioner but substitute it for a politician you don’t hate so much. If you don’t understand then you’re a better person than I am CS.

  279. 279
    A Humble Lurker says:

    @Anne Laurie:
    Oh, is that what you think you’re doing?

    @Corner Stone:

    Have you seen the sheer number of people here licking their chops and praying that every individual who strays from the true and narrow not only pays for it, but pays for it in really troubling ways?

    Seemed to me the folks here just refused to immediately worship Snowden, and that turned out to be a valid action to take considering what a screw-up (at the very least) he turned out to be. And if you’re really perturbed about things people have said about Snowden here, need I remind you this is the birth place of ‘skull-fuck a kitten’? That kind of thing seems to be a common occurrence and isn’t a particular of Snowden’s case.

  280. 280
    JR in WV says:

    @Chris:

    Back in the 60s [maybe the 70s too, but I was in High School in the 60s] it was a combination of history of how we got to be a democracy, followed by how democracy works in general. With a little dash of how each state differs a little from the others, like Parishes in LA, unicameral legislatures in wherever. And a bigger dash of how elected pols put aside their personal preferences to work for the greater good of the city/county/state/nation.

    HAHaHaha… now they don’t teach anything about how it works, and wonder why it doesn’t work so well anymore. No user supported pieces inside, do not open device! That’s working so well!

  281. 281
    Anon nyc strand customer (this time) says:

    @Redshift: late to the party, but…
    CONGRATS!

  282. 282
    Tone in DC says:

    @Hal:

    The glasses are real. As for her, not so much.

  283. 283
    rikyrah says:

    shyt,

    this commenter is right. and, so what if neither one actually makes it. I believe the combination, plus what we can do in terms of organizing in 2014, would help pay off dividends in 2016. This would be good experience for both of them.

  284. 284
    Corner Stone says:

    @karen: It’s obvious you misunderstand me.
    I don’t despise nor dislike Obama. He seems like a good family man, and is clearly a world class intellect. However, I do despise several of the people he has chosen to surround himself with during his administrations. And I strongly, vehemently disagree with not only some of his decisions but also the decision making process we are able to discern after the fact, occasionally. That includes matters of economic policy as well as national security issues and others in between.
    The contention I raised is that this site is chock full of authoritarians who worship power, and disregard internal checks on mores and morals when certain circumstances are met, i.e., when it’s “their guy”.
    And those same authoritarians will gleefully delight in the muckracking, name calling, and general indignations that can be heaped upon anyone who disagrees or challenges their guy. They called for death, to be preceded by long and arduous hardship.
    I’m not talking about the reaction on display when a wingnut governor cuts funding just because it amuses him/her, or for specious and cowardly political points. Or just because they are disgustingly stupid human beings, as in the case of Gov Perry.

Comments are closed.