I heard this on American Routes today and now I’m obsessed with it. What a great song.
Talk about whatever and throw a button in the plate for the Kenyan usurper if the spirit so moves you.
by DougJ| 197 Comments
This post is in: Open Threads
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The Dangerman
I’ll see your Emmylou and raise you a Bonnie/Norah:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzDUi_L6MzA
MikeJ
I learned about Emmylou through being a Damiel Lanois fanboi. Learned about her circa Wrecking Ball then worked backwards. Lurve her.
hildebrand
I guess I still don’t see why the first debate shifted the tone of the race so significantly. It makes no sense to me. Maybe its the same reason that the inside candidate doesn’t regularly get the job in an academic search – folks are always thinking that the new person is all potential. With Romney, though, why hire a dick?
Just Some Fuckhead
Charles Johnson linked to this awesome song yesterday.
BGinCHI
WVU down a bundle. Cole is, what, + 10?
What’s the over/under?
Just Some Fuckhead
@hildebrand:
People were looking for a reason to vote against Obama, White Daddy Romney gave them one.
raven
The Sweetheart of the Rodeo
Narcissus
not a lot of fatty boom boom fans on bj then I take it
General Stuck
Stevie and Sheryl
BGinCHI
Wow, did I bring WVU luck or what?
hildebrand
@Just Some Fuckhead: I have tried to squelch my cynicism about just that point – but I really can’t think of anything else. What really makes no sense is, well, Romney. Who truly thinks this guy even wants to be President? He wants to be elected, but there is no way that he wants to govern.
freelancer
Listening to the radio wrap-up after the NU/NW game, it sounds like we lost, but NU eeked out a win, just barely. That was one of the ugliest games I’ve ever seen in my life.
BGinCHI
@hildebrand: He doesn’t want to govern.
He wants to sell off pieces of the American dream to the lowest bidder.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
My favorite yarn store in Santa Barbara went out of business. Phooey. At least my second favorite one was still there. And I was able to get some lapsang souchong tea at the British store, along with a dark chocolate Kit Kat. Why do other countries get the cool flavors of mass market candies?
Arm The Homeless
Tori and Maynard
Also, too. GO NOLES!
MikeJ
@raven: The Grievous Angel.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@Just Some Fuckhead:
I’m still not sure if it was voters who switched or conservatives getting off their asses and making themselves likely voters.
Hal
@hildebrand:
I still think a huge factor in the poll reactions was the reaction from the left at Obama. Just amazingly over the top.
I haven’t watched more than 10 minutes of MSNBC since the election night coverage. They just pissed me the fuck off. Yes, I know Obama fucked up and didn’t mention x,y,z and let Romney get away with too much, but my glob. The reaction from that crew, especially Shultz and Matthews was ridiculous. Chris Hayes just looked pissed, but I couldn’t figure out if it was at Obama, or some of his fellow commentators. I still love Maddow, but I think I’m giving MSNBC a break until after the election.
If Obama somehow loses (and I’m still confident he will win) I will probably never watch MSNBC again. It would just be too frustrating. It’s frustrating enough with Obama in office.
Hell, I gave up Kos and various other sites two years ago and only recently waded back in, too much enjoyment, until the debates. Now we are back to fainting couch diaries of folks reacting to every poll that does not show Obama with a +10 lead.
Man I hate the Internet.
raven
“The Sweetheart of the Rodeo” written by Emmylou Harris and Paul Kennerly. Recorded by Emmylou with Waylon Jennings providing electiric guitar and background harmony (It takes a discerning ear to hear this).
BGinCHI
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): There’s a cool yarn store up on Clark St called “Windy Knitty.”
The yarn looks cool although I don’t know how many cats have real money.
raven
As great as Gram and the Burrito’s were, the Return of the Grievous Angel is a very good cover album.
BGinCHI
@MikeJ: Hickory Wind.
Baud
@Hal:
I feel exactly the same way.
The Dangerman
I’ll see your Stevie/Sheryl and toss in a Stevie/Lindsey; seems apropos for the Election and for WVU tonight (“been down one time…”):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zHyQS9blvIc
ETA: Well, crap, I turn off KSU/WVU when it’s a beatdown and turn back to a blowout. Today’s games have sucked (well, Tech and TCU was interesting).
raven
@BGinCHI: There’s a Place
FlipYrWhig
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): @BGinCHI: Did someone say yarn? Check out this Etsy shop: Northcott Wilson Artisans. Tell ’em you saw it here.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@BGinCHI:
I haven’t been to that one — I did take a trip into the city from Oak Park last summer to go to Loopy Yarns on Polk St. I was very mad last summer that my favorite store in Forest Park had shut down, but Yelp tells me there’s a new one that just opened.
Yes, G is resigned to the fact that I plan trips around yarn shop visits. His main complaint is that I still haven’t finished the cardigan I promised him 3 years ago. I have the back and 3/4ths of the fronts done, but it’s still a sadly UFO (unfinished object).
Chris
@hildebrand:
Which makes him just like his predecessor. Reagan and Bush yawned through their eight years, letting their cabinets handle everything while they did the public appearances and enjoyed the perks. It’s just more obvious with Romney.
Batocchio
Hard to go wrong with Emmylou.
FlipYrWhig
@Just Some Fuckhead: I think this is the answer: Romney was strong enough to stop being a punchline, so a number of people–Republican-leaning undecideds–said, “Hey, he’s a lot better than I heard!” Plus Mnemosyne‘s point about giving Republicans a morale boost, showing up as a greater likelihood of voting. I can’t imagine anyone switching their allegiance from Obama to Romney over it, but I can imagine squishy conservatives getting perked up and squishy Democrats getting mopey.
BGinCHI
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): Sounds like he could just man up and wear it like it is. Some people are so picky.
I find yarn shops really interesting, although I have no reason to go into one. It all just looks so cool.
I’m pretty sure a friend of a friend owns a yarn shop in the loop but I can’t remember where. You want me to find out? I’ve met this woman several times at parties and she’s uber crafty.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@FlipYrWhig:
I’ll add them to my Etsy favorites — thanks! Etsy is an awesome and yet dangerous place.
burnspbesq
So far, so good.
Duke 20, North Carolins 6, under 2-1/2 minutes to go in the first half.
Spaghetti Lee
@Mnemosyne (iPhone):
it’s still a sadly UFO (unfinished object).
Ha! I should start using that.
Violet
@BGinCHI:
Knowing Cole has a lady friend visiting makes that sound very dirty. I’m sure Cole is over AND under.
hildebrand
@Hal: I remember thinking after the debate was over that Obama had had better debates, but it didn’t really seem awful. Even my Eisenhower-Republican wife announced that Romney was an ass and could not vote for him.
Then I watched as the MSNBC crew absolutely lost it – Matthews was a parody (I am glad that Obama poked him with a stick at the Smith dinner), and I kept waiting for the others to rein him in. I had written off Ed long ago – when he announced that he wouldn’t vote in 2010 he was off the list, I simply will not watch somebody who advocates such abject idiocy.
It was an unbelievable display. I just can’t imagine that they had that much influence on the polls.
West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.)
@hildebrand: I think a lot of it has to do with ultra low-information voters… the type who are fooled by presidential hair and a 1950-s fatherly demeanor.
There are a bunch of dumb people in the world. I had a student in a junior college class a few years ago who’d never heard of Adolph Hitler. The name didn’t mean a thing to her. I thought that bit on undecided voters on SNL was pretty damn funny and all-too-true!
raven
Dawgs take the lead at the halftime buzzer.
Birthmarker
I have the EmmyLou version, the Rodney Crowell version (who is the songwriter), The Oak Ridge Boys version, and a version by Trisha Yearwood on the Tivo!! Great song, Doug!
BGinCHI
@Violet: Naughty girl.
Image burned into my retinal imagination….
Political Observer
NEW OHIO POLLS:
O 49 R 48 (PPP)
O TIED R TIED (GRAVIS MARKETING)
PPP is a Democrat pollster, btw. Looks like things are tightening up in the Buckeye State, folks.
raven
@Birthmarker: “Grammy Award winner Rodney Crowell and New York Times Best Selling author Mary Karr released KIN, Songs by Mary Karr and Rodney Crowell on Vanguard Records on June 5, 2012. Produced by Joe Henry, KIN marks the first collaboration between the two writers and is Karr’s entry into the world of music.”
Mary is the author of Liar’s Club and Cherry. Great stuff.
hitchhiker
“it ain’t no time for lengthy speeches . . . ”
I LOVE that song so much I want to marry it.
On the subject of the post-debate poll #s, obviously some of Obama’s support was soft and a lot of people were looking for a reason to move on. Mitt gave them one, or seemed to.
I think Ed Schultz should shut the hell up and get off the air. He was on the damn radio during the 2010 midterm runup telling voters not to vote for the Democrats.
“The best way for the 99-ers to get the attention of the congress is to flat out tell the Democrats we’re not voting in the midterms. . . . I’m announcing today that I’m not going to vote in the midterms.”
He damaged the country with that shit, and he damaged the president with his hysteria after the first debate. Enough.
TexasMango
@hildebrand: I not sure that it did. Republicans and Republican types need a Big White Daddy figure and Mitt gave them a little of that during the first debate or at least more then he had been. The polls after that reflected their boost in enthusiasm.
At the same time voting in many places had already begun and if actual voting behavior counts for anything Democrats are pretty damn enthusiastic and have a ground game that Republicans still can’t fuck with. If Republicans were that pumped after the first debate, there is nothing so far in early voting numbers to show it. They didn’t run out to vote for Willard as soon as they got the chance.
The RV pools look like they should, but some of the LV polls are low balling Obama’s support. RV predictions are objective, the questions used to determine LVs are subjective IMHO.
weaselone
duplicate
weaselone
@Political Observer:
And Gravis Marketing leans far more heavily Republican PPP leans Democrate which means Obama is actually kicking Romney tuckus.
PurpleGirl
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): Some of my favorite yarn shops closed like 20 years ago — shops that were down in the Lower East Side, owned by and catering to little old Jewish women. (There were also a bunch of younger shops in the West 30s of Manhattan that I miss. So many of the newer shops are kewl places and uber expensive.)
Etsy had a one-day crafts fair today that I missed going to because I got caught in traffic trying to get into Manhattan and meet some friends. I finally made it to the Whole Bead Show and talked to one of my favorite dichroic glass bead makers.
magurakurin
@Hal:
I only take issue with one thing in your comment. I love the internet.
But everything else, yeah, this.
James E. Powell
@FlipYrWhig:
I think a significant sized chunk of the Republican electorate was cool toward Romney because they doubted whether he had the stuff to stand up to that [insert racist epithet]. In the first debate, he showed that he could and would, so they became more enthusiastic.
Until the first debate, Romney looked like he had no chance. It is now accepted as fact that, had Obama waxed Romney in the first debate as he did in the second, the election would have been effectively over. I doubt that that is true, but I can’t prove it isn’t.
West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.)
NEW NATE SILVER UPDATE:
Mr. Obama’s chances of winning the Electoral College improved to 70.4 percent on Thursday from 65.7 percent on Wednesday, according to the forecast.
Looks like Romney’s sucking hind tit, folks.
gogol's wife
@West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.):
Gee, I like your all-caps messages better than some others I’ve seen.
Just Some Fuckhead
@FlipYrWhig: I think there’s also a little Libya figuring in. The rightwing noise machine is good at creating the illusion of scandal, and they’re milking this one for everything they can.
Spaghetti Lee
My theory about the 1st debate/poll drop thing is that it was mostly people who don’t follow politics mostly tuning in and thinking that Romney looked sharper and Obama looked weaker than they’d been hearing for a while. I really don’t think MSNBC had much to do with it: the percentage of the electorate that watches MSNBC is tiny, and the ones that base their opinions on what the hosts say smaller still.
I think, as some people have said, there’s a lot of people in the middle American electorate who were just disgusted with Romney but didn’t really like Obama either, were looking for any reason to get back to supporting Romney, and found it.
joel hanes
@Narcissus:
fatty boom boom
Visually fucking amazing.
Like much modern media, I like it better without the sound. Damn kids, lawn, onion on belt; born in another world.
Spaghetti Lee
@Just Some Fuckhead:
I don’t think people are buying it, for the most part. I don’t have many conservative acquaintances, so maybe this is a small sample, but then ones I do have were mostly glumly parsing the ‘act of terror/terrorism’ thing after the debate, rather than scolding Obama for doing something horrible. I think O knows what he’s doing there and is gonna put the whole thing to bed in the third debate.
jrg
I’ll never forgive Emmylou Harris for crapping upon the awesomeness that is “The Last Waltz”.
jrg
I’ll never forgive Emmylou Harris for crapping upon the awesomeness that is “The Last Waltz”.
TexasMango
@West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.): According to Charlie Cook who has inside info on the two campaign’s internal polls they both have Obama winning almost all of the 11 swing states. Both camps no Romney is losing and he said outside of some extraordinary event, Romney will lose the election.
Chris
@James E. Powell:
That too. They react to tone rather than substance. Having seen Romney sticking it to the uppity night[clang!] it didn’t even matter that he walked back on half his severely conservative positions.
TexasMango
@West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.): According to Charlie Cook who has inside info on the two campaign’s internal polls they both have Obama winning almost all of the 11 swing states. Both camps no Romney is losing and he said outside of some extraordinary event, Romney will lose the election.
Chris
@James E. Powell:
That too. They react to tone rather than substance. Having seen Romney sticking it to the uppity night[clang!] it didn’t even matter that he walked back on half his severely conservative positions.
TexasMango
@West of the Rockies (formerly Frank W.): According to Charlie Cook who has inside info on the two campaign’s internal polls they both have Obama winning almost all of the 11 swing states. Both camps no Romney is losing and he said outside of some extraordinary event, Romney will lose the election.
cosima
My new favorite song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqJ9M6JenKM
I’d never heard of Sean Hayes until I went to a surprise wedding (thought we were going to our neighbors’ for wine/beer/etc!), this was their first-dance song. They are two amazing kids (of 30) and I have high hopes for a lifetime of happiness for them. Give the song a listen — it’s some lovely bluesy stuff.
I will go back to watching &/or reading MSNBC when they start beating the drum — meaning daily reports, not one-offs — regarding Tommy Franks being one of Mitt’s new advisors/potential cabinet members. And talking about where the eff are the tax returns. And what’s the deal with Bain & Solamere (the lovely Tagg R) owning a disproportionate amount of shares in the voting machines used in many of the swing states. It’s like they’ve forgotten who their primary audience is. Going the way of CNN? Couldn’t be that bad, I guess, because Chris Hayes and Melissa Perry-Harris (or do I have that backward) are awesome.
WereBear
In other news, I hear Nicolas Cage is going to star in a reboot of Left Behind.
My mind, it is boggling.
wrb
I love this song
wrb
@Just Some Fuckhead:
I think the Libya “scandal” has been quite important.
However it just blew up on them. Maybe the fact will penetrate.
It can almost look like another Obama rope-a-dope.
PsiFighter37
Pride and Prejudice is on teevee. My fiancée loves this movie (and the book, an especially Darcy); I disliked the book and think the movie is just as bad. What am I missing?
Litlebritdifrnt
FYWP I cannot post at all right now, I was hoping to post about my new kittens and WP will not allow me to post at all. WTF?
Just One More Canuck
@jrg: wtf?
redshirt
@WereBear: The Christian Death Cult Fantasy story?
PsiFighter37
@WereBear: Left Behind, as in the Christian apocalyptic fantasy book series / wet dream?
Spaghetti Lee
@WereBear:
Reboot? I wasn’t aware that it had ever been booted.
WereBear
@Litlebritdifrnt: New kittens!
Awesome.
PeakVT
@Litlebritdifrnt: If you were posting links there is a limit of three, and FYWP doesn’t like some of the photo sites. Nor does it like some URL shortener sites.
WereBear
@redshirt: @PsiFighter37: @Spaghetti Lee:
The same! They did a version with Kirk Cameron as the crusading reporter.
I’m seeing Cage as the antiChrist… smells like Wicker Man!
The Dangerman
@TexasMango:
I was watching some Romney event yesterday – and I’ll cut him some slack, he has to be tired – but it looked like he knew he was done. His energy level was WAY down. I almost feel for him (note the almost there).
ETA: Speaking of done, looks like the Heisman race has a solid frontrunner tonight.
PurpleGirl
@Spaghetti Lee: Not a major Hollywood production; an indie of sorts with Kirk Cameron as the star. I’ve watched only bits and pieces by way of Fred Clark’s Slacktivist blog and his Left Behind criticism.
Spaghetti Lee
@WereBear:
PEOPLE OF EARTH…I am the ANTICHRIST! I’MTHEANTICHRISTI’MTHEANTICHRISTI’MTHEBWAAAARGHGHGHAAAGH!
(note: I am not entirely familiar with the source material.)
PsiFighter37
@The Dangerman: One gets that way when they’re about to miss hopping on that white horse and fulfilling a ‘prophecy’ they probably believe was meant for them.
Mr Stagger Lee
@efgoldman: I hope that there are no sleeping pills near John’s wine stash. Well at least the Steelers should handle the Bungles tomorrow night.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@BGinCHI:
Sure, if you let me know the name of the shop, I’ll try to check it out next time I’m in town. We probably won’t be back until July or August of 2013, though.
Anya
@Hal: When it comes to MSNBC crew’s disgraceful reaction, I totally agree with you. I am not saying they should emulate Fox News but they really over did it. Even Rachel was disgraceful. In every fucking show after the dabate, she opened with how Obama bombed in the debate. It was weird, it was as though she relished saying it. Ed and Matthews are drama queens so I don’t take them seriously but Rachel really disappointed me.
As for Kos, like you, I stopped going to DKos after the 2010 madness. But I must say, they were not that bad about the debate. I actually don’t read the dairies so I am not sure what the reaction was but the front-pagers were very measured.
redshirt
@WereBear: Has Cage gone bankrupt? Financially or mentally? What’s he thinking starring in a Christian Cult Classic?!
Chris
@Spaghetti Lee:
That’s okay, the authors aren’t too familiar with their own source material (the Bible) either.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@PsiFighter37:
Is it the version with Colin Firth? If so, what you’re missing is any inclination towards being gay. This will probably be a relief to your fiancée.
redshirt
@PsiFighter37: Owe me a coke!
The Dangerman
@efgoldman:
I’m having trouble deciding if KSU is that good or WVU got its heart ripped out. I didn’t see the start of the game and then missed most of the 2nd, too.
Been watching after the half, though, and the KSU QB is really impressive. The TD to go to 52 was a thing of beauty (sorry, BlogBoss).
Anya
@PsiFighter37: I read the book when I was 17 and I really loved it. I never saw the movie so I can’t say, but I really liked the BBC series.
Spaghetti Lee
@PsiFighter37:
Obviously, we’ve been ignoring the real White Horse: Ken Jennings.
James E. Powell
Question for those who like to argue things that cannot be proved one way or the other:
Is this election the one we would have had in 2008 but for Sarah Palin?
Ben Cisco (onboard the Defiant)
Bama absolutely laying the wood to Tennessee. Roll Tide!
Corner Stone
@efgoldman:
C’mon. You fell for that?
Narcissus
I might actually see a Left Behind with Nic Cage in it
being all Nic Cage all over the place
Arundel
I love American Routes on the radio, good show. Unfortunately my local radio station couldn’t afford Prairie Home Companion anymore, so they moved AR to Saturdays. Neither here nor there, I love both shows, miss PHC though. I’m an oldster at 44 indeed. :)
Now playing: “The Swinging Years” , another great radio show. “Pipe Dreams” is lovely to fall asleep to.
Hal
@WereBear:
I just read this on Gawker. Cage must be desperate for money. I wonder if his Hollywood career is drying up after so many flops.
The last Cage movie I watched was The Sorcerer’s Apprentice and man was it horrible. Though I did love Adaptation.
Also, I still cringe 20 years later when I think of Tim Burton’s attempt to direct a Superman remake with Cage as Superman.
The Dangerman
@James E. Powell:
I assume you men how close this election has been…
…and my answer is no; McCain was a terrible candidate. Palin probably helped him with the base, but he was always toast.
Corner Stone
@The Dangerman:
That dude has been dropping dimes all game. Like trying to fit Tunch into a breadbox 30 yards away kinda shit.
WereBear
@Narcissus: This is the attraction for me.
The Left Behind books are such travesties of storytelling, (as The Slacktivist explains so well) that Nic Cage would definitely bring something to the table.
Corner Stone
@Hal: Cage owes the IRS like eleventy billion dollars.
He’s been doing every piece of shit script put in front of him for years so he doesn’t pull a Wesley Snipe.
Corner Stone
Personally, I love Nic Cage. “I want to take his face…off.”
Guy is a genius.
Princess
@BGinCHI: I’m knitting a sweater with yarn bought at Windy Knitty at this very moment. I usually go to Loopy in the, uh, Loop though most of the time.
redshirt
Thankfully, I’ve never been even a bit Christian or religious of any kind, but I actually enjoy reading about religious myth, as I enjoy all myth (Joseph Campbell, represent!). I also enjoy comic books and Lord of the Rings for similar reasons.
So, that said, I’ve never really “got” the stated internal tension of the Christian myth – of Satan trying to conquer the world and Jesus sent to Earth to stop him. I mean, this is like Globetrotters v. Generals, right? God is Jesus; God created Satan, who was just an Angel who got kicked out of Heaven. God has lots of Angels. God created everything, and controls everything, and knows everything, so really what kind of threat does Satan pose to God? None, right? Zero. Zilch. So where’s the excitement in that battle?
Now, Satan as tragic hero is a far more interesting myth. What if Satan really wanted people to be FREE and happy, but God didn’t want it that way, so he kicked him out of the Super Powers Club, and then launched a massive PR campaign to smear his name? Tragic!
Furthermore, God created Satan. So if we’re blaming Satan for this and that Evil, aren’t we really blaming God?
dance around in your bones
@Political Observer: You are a fucking joke.
Corner Stone
@The Dangerman:
Ha! We saw what you did there…
mdblanche
I’m back from Burpleson AFB and Republican enthusiasm is high and confident of Romney’s victory in November after his victory in this week’s debate. However the election turns out, half the country is in for a nasty shock the next morning and there’s no way their (or God forbid, our) reaction can be predicted in advance because neither side will see it coming. We really have become two nations in one country and I really don’t see how we function together until that changes. I have no idea how this occurred but I suspect it has to do with the recent changes in the media landscape, since we no longer have separate opinions about the same body of facts, but separate bodies of facts. Don’t even try to establish a dialogue; just nod politely and wait for General Ripper to kill himself.
Hal
@James E. Powell:
The generic Democrat was beating the generic Republican all along in 2008. Republicans were toast that election, and if anything, Palin probably helped McCain a little more with the base. Quite frankly, a white male Dem with all of Obama’s skill and charisma would have utterly destroyed McCain. His time was 2000, and Bush beat him to the finish line back in 2000.
Still, while I completely do not buy into the myth of John McCain, Republican support of Romney compared to McCain amazes me. Romney is absolutely everything teabaggers supposedly hate, but there they are with bells on.
Corner Stone
@efgoldman: The closet is a destructive force that’s hard for society to really understand.
Anya
@Just Some Fuckhead:
A theme song for that particular segment of the population.
The Dangerman
@Corner Stone:
Breadboxes around the world just collectively shuddered.
WereBear
@redshirt: I believe Satan himself was a late entry to the theology; in response to the rise of the Protestants, if I remember my timing right.
Projection!
Corner Stone
@Corner Stone: Speaking of, I am about to go pickup a huge order of sausage from a local German restaurant. I happen to like sausage.
But, um, I also like football! Yeah! Go team in the tight pants, with all the physical contact! You guys knock the other guys down and then cover on top of them until they stop squirming! Don’t stop til the whistle blows, boys!
Corner Stone
@The Dangerman: It was obviously an allegory.
ppcli
@jrg:
I didn’t mind her in “Evangeline” but she did seem overly nervous. If you like “The Last Waltz” you might forgive her if you listen to the studio version of “Leaving Louisiana…” on the album Quarter Moon In A Ten Cent Town. It has Rick Danko doing signature odd-harmony backing vocals. Also Danko plays the violin on the track.
The Dangerman
@Corner Stone:
Oh, that game as all gory, indeed.
+?
Narcissus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfX7JvU-50c&feature=related
Chris
@redshirt:
God creates humans with their own agency: they can choose to follow him or disobey him. The devil is the guy trying to convince them to do the latter. The threat he poses is never to God, only to us.
At least that’s how I remember it – anyone who paid closer attention in catechism feel free to jump in. (Been a wicked long time since I’ve followed this stuff).
Yutsano
@The Dangerman: I just learned something: do NOT eat stuffed tomatoes with your fingers. Will not end well.
That and I just hit a perfect butter sauce for my veal piccata tonight.
redshirt
@WereBear: No way. Satan was in the Original Trilogy.
The Book of Job – most fucked up OT tale? I mean, really, God? What a dick.
mdblanche
@James E. Powell: Anecdotally I know of several votes Palin cost McCain, but I think this is the election we would have had without the financial crisis and McCain’s erratic reaction to it. This year, in the final stretch of an election that was supposed to be all about the economy, after a month’s worth of economic data coming in above expectations, the economy has suddenly grown more absent from the campaign. This election’s a tribal affair now. I’m beginning to doubt it was ever anything else.
lamh35
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): dont’ even get me started on Colin Firth. I first read about Colin Firth when I read Bridget’s Jones’ Diary for the first time.
If you’ve read the book, then you know what I’m talking about.
It’s that book that lead me to seeing the BBC version of Pride & Prejudice with Colin Firth as Darcey and Jennifer Erhle (sp?).
Bridget Jones started my interest in Colin Firth, but Pride & Prejudice turned my interest into an obsession.
I LOVE LOVE LOVE Colin Firth. He is soo on my British “to do” list…lol. I would gladly give up my love of Idris Elba, momentarily, for Colin Firth.
He’s that awesome…lol
Baud
@mdblanche:
That’s how I feel also. Nothing about this election has been real (as in substantive).
Southern Beale
Emmylou Harris lives up the street from me. I get to wave hello to her in the park every morning where everyone walks their dogs. Jealous, yet?
:-)
redshirt
@Chris: Makes better dramatic sense. Still, these same humans with “agency” are also damned the moment they are conceived, due to one apple some 6000 years ago. Also, a talking snake.
And because of that snake, the entirety of humanity is damned. Why is God ceding the Earth to the Angel he kicked out of Heaven (after a war in Heaven, right? Over humans – Satan and followers didn’t think they were all that; God said, better than you: Kick)?
PsiFighter37
@redshirt: Cage lost quite a bit of money – it was a bit publicized a few years back. That explained why he showed up in shit like Knowing, which was such an awful movie, and an awful ending, and even worse CGI, that I kinda sorta felt bad that he was so stupid to get himself swindled out of his fortune.
@Spaghetti Lee: Not sure you can be the White Horse if you didn’t know H&R Block is the largest tax accounting firm (or something to that effect).
Baud
@redshirt:
I read somewhere that in the Original Trilogy, God shot first.
PurpleGirl
@Yutsano: Ah, veal piccata. I am envious.
Nikolita
If anyone gets the channel CBUT (CBC in HD), there’s a documentary called “Anger in America” on right now. It’s part 1 of 2, and part 1 is called “The Fire Within”.
Summary:
“Examining the Tea Party and Occupy movements, and their impact on the 2012 US presidential election.”
Geoduck
I agree with mdblanche, in that if the financial crisis had been stalled off just a few more months, McCain could still have won, although it would have been a near thing. And yes, choosing another Generic White Guy as VP would have helped him as well, despite the base’s enthusiasm for Palin.
The Dangerman
@Yutsano:
I was in China a decade or two ago and I had the local Hot Pot (cook the raw foods placed in front of you in a community pot of boiling oil)…
…and all was well (excluding their offer of Scorpion, which I passed on) until I tried the tomato; for some reason, it really held the heat and I burned the shit outta my tongue. Tomatoes are dangerous!
Yutsano
@PurpleGirl: It’s such an ugly duckling dish. But the end result in the mouth is fantastic.
I didn’t have capers or parsley, but it still turned out great!
@The Dangerman: The durn thing exploded on me. Bad mater!
The recipe I used called for basil (which again I didn’t have) but I used seasoned breadcrumbs so I didn’t miss it too much. The garlic in this is much more dangerous, I used two cloves. You can tell. :)
jrg
@ppcli: Not bad, but I don’t care for country. Love southern rock, though.
Southern Beale
@Nikolita:
Well, Dana Milbank has a column up outlining how the Democrats can thank the Tea Party for allowing them to keep the Senate.
dance around in your bones
I would agree that MSNBC had a collective freakout after the first debate, which was probably largely due to their high expectations of Obama and low expectations of the Mittster. Even if he DID lie his ass off.
I still enjoy watching Hardball (despite Chris Matthews’ up and down moments) and Rev. Al and Rachel Maddow and occasionally Lawrence O’Donnell. Ed Schultz makes me argy-bargy with his Limbaughisms. Even though he is miles better than the Oxy-Con guy.
Hell, they are all better than the other alternatives on cable. I cannot even watch the Sunday shows anymore.
However, I find that almost everything I see on the MSNBC shows I have already learned about due to my obsessive reading of Balloon Juice.
Thanks, BJ.
ETA: Nick Cage always acts like Nick Cage no matter what the movie, I think.
gbear
@Southern Beale: yes
arguingwithsignposts
@redshirt:
Oh, I don’t know. The w1ncest tales might give it a run for its money.
Arm The Homeless
Both coaches in the Miami-FSU game looked apoplectic with the officiating. I must admit, it’s been pretty ugly, the refs are looking very timid … or lazy.
WereBear
@redshirt: It’s something like yes, he was always there as a Force; something about how he got more personal with the witch prosecutions. To quote Wikipedia:
That’s what I was thinking; the Satan connection and how he has evolved over the centuries. At the time of Job, he was seen only by God, and did not appear to humans.
Chris
@redshirt:
That’s where you’d have to ask these people who paid attention in catechism :D
I don’t know exactly where original sin fits into the whole Salvation/Damnation thing, but I do believe Catholic theology on salvation is less black and white than the fundiegelical kind, and mainline Protestant theology less black and white than both of them. So the answer would probably vary according to belief anyway. (The thing I mentioned about agency and Satan, OTOH, is pretty uncontroversially accepted across the three groups, I believe).
hildebrand
@redshirt: But you will notice, in that particular little story, Satan wasn’t the big bad, just one of the guys hanging with God and talking shit about how Job was a suck up because he always got the best. ‘Dump on him a little, and you will hear a different tune.’ So God decides to see whats what.
The idea of Satan as the big bad is definitely a later addition to the story – and I would guess that most Christians today get their understanding about the devil from Milton, not the New Testament.
arguingwithsignposts
@Southern Beale:
You still live in Tennessee? Nope.
PsiFighter37
@dance around in your bones: Reading on Wikipedia, apparently Ed Schultz used to be a conservative radio talk show host. I was too young, but is this news to anyone else? I was surprised, given his general populist sentiment.
hildebrand
@efgoldman: The best brats in the world are in the train station in Cologne. The very thought of them, with a bit of good mustard, and the hunk of crusty bread (and a Beck’s in a can)…I back to my happy place.
Narcissus
@dance around in your bones: Chris Hayes and Melissa Harris Perry on the weekends are probably the best shows on cable news.
Yutsano
@efgoldman: It’d work perfectly for chicken! Just try to get scallopini cuts at the butcher. If you can’t find them, just pound them thin. Season the breasts with salt, pepper, and whatever you like (I do coriander), then dredge in flour. Fry in olive oil and butter on medium heat until cooked through. Reserve on a plate. In the pan add a chopped shallot and capers and cook about 2 minutes, then add about 1/2 cup white wine. Reduce it for two more minutes, then add the juice of 1 lemon. Turn off the heat and throw in 2 tbsp of very cold butter. Swirl the pan around until the butter disappears. Add some chopped parsley and cover the chicken with the thickened sauce. Serve over rice or pasta or eat as is!
Southern Beale
@arguingwithsignposts:
LOL. Fair enough. If the politics could get out of the crapper this would be an awesome place to live. Nashville has great music, great independent film and theater, great restaurants, and it’s affordable … but definitely too much wingnuttia in the surrounding counties.
My plan is to get more progressive blue staters to move here. My motto: “Infiltrate!”
redshirt
@hildebrand: Great points all.
Yeah, no doubt. Just as Dante’s version of the Hell is the one we carry with us today, as the Bible has little to nothing to say about it, other than generic Underworld themes as expressed in many other religions of the day.
I’m just saying it doesn’t make for a good movie. Get better roles Nic Cage!
Now, the Norse religion – that’s got some drama. I’ve always been intrigued with the idea of Ragnarok, and that in the end all the Gods get smashed to hell by Frost Giants. IE – no matter how might, nature will eventually conquer all. Also, as a personal myth, no matter how glorious a hero you were in the flower of your day, you too, Hero, will age, get sick, and die.
Also too, the real Thor is awesome/terrible. Dumb ass, yet mostly honorable, drunken frat boy.
arguingwithsignposts
@Southern Beale: i have friends who live there, and I’ve visited several times. It is better than most of the rest of the state. That said, Nashville is also Southern Baptist mecca. :)
Yutsano
@Southern Beale: There is an IRS office in Nashville and we’ve poached a few of their people lately. I might have to think about this…
Southern Beale
Oh fer crissakes. They’re remaking that awful Left Behind movie that starred Kirk Cameron and guess who’s in it now: Nicholas Cage.
WereBear
@redshirt: I’m also fond of Norse mythology. While the Vikings did a lot of pillaging, they also had a form of democracy in those Long Houses.
hildebrand
@redshirt: Have you read Neil Gaiman’s ‘American Gods’? Easily the best exploration of the various world religions and their impact on America (including visits by many of the various deities of the pre-Christian world). Great story, brilliantly told.
arguingwithsignposts
@redshirt:
I am reminded of a quote I read from a Christopher Walken interview, where he said he made a decision as a young actor that he would not turn down any role, and that’s why he’s been in a lot of crap. It’s part of his creepy charm. Maybe Cage is taking a similar tack.
Narcissus
@Southern Beale: no way dude
Chris
@hildebrand:
Pet peeve of mine: I finally watched “Percy Jackson And The Olympians” the other day. And dear God in heaven, would it fucking kill Hollywood to write a movie where Hades is NOT a Satan rip off trying to overthrow the ruling God, and instead actually acts like the dude in the myths?
Southern Beale
@Yutsano:
Oh, come and give us a visit! Do!
Yutsano
@WereBear: Oldest democratic body in the world still in existence: the Alþingi. Thank you Island!!
Chris
@redshirt:
Wait, I didn’t think the giants won. I thought they destroyed each other.
redshirt
@hildebrand: Oh yes. It was good, not great, I thought. I had just come of a “Sandman” high, however, and it seemed a pale imitation to me.
“Sandman” is unbelievably good, for those who don’t know. Expensive though!
dance around in your bones
@PsiFighter37: That doesn’t surprise me too much, given his similarity to Mr. Hillbilly Heroin. Thanks to FSM he has switched sides.
@Narcissus:
I definitely agree with this. I DVR them because in my time zone they come on WAAAAAAY too fucking early.
I was talking about the weekday shows on MSNBC.
Southern Beale
@arguingwithsignposts:
We are the Protestant Vatican, that is true. The good news is that fewer people give a shit. We passed a far reaching non discrimination ordinance covering GLBT people and you can buy beer on Sundays now. Woo hoo. Still can’t get wine in the grocery stores but that’s because of the liquor distributors not wanting to share their market.
redshirt
@Chris: You’re thinking of the Jets.
Thanks! I’ll be here all night. Try the Soy-Veal.
Southern Beale
@Chris:
I can’t tell you how many times this comes up in conversation!
Actually, no.
:-)
I thought that was amusing though.
suzanne
Bob Mould.
Vampire Weekend.
New Order.
Yutsano
@Southern Beale:
Something for me, something for Bnut. Seems good so far.
We just went the opposite way up here: liquor now available to sell in grocery stores. And it’s fucking expensive as hell. But hey you idjits wanted privatisation, you’re gonna get it good and hard.
Chris
@redshirt:
Awful.
Fucking awful.
So why did I laugh? I’m losing it, dude.
hildebrand
@Chris: Bingo – I have always felt sorry for Hades in modern cinema and storytelling, because he definitely gets the shaft. The Disney abomination ‘Hercules’ was really the limit. Good god, that was a bad working out of the Greek mythology. Painful.
Southern Beale
You know what annoys me? The Paul Ryan haircut. I’m seeing it on a lot of young actors now. I’m going to call it a haircuLt.
hildebrand
@redshirt: I am working my way through Sandman on my nook. It is a great set of stories. The best news? Gaiman is writing another Dr. Who episode, and is returning to Sandman.
Chris
@hildebrand:
The Kevin Sorbo show treated him pretty well, tho.
Yutsano
@Southern Beale:
Fixteth.
suzanne
Speaking of Emmylou Harris, that album she did with Mark Knopfler, “All The Roadrunning”, is one of my favorite albums of the last ten years. Every song is fabulous.
redshirt
@hildebrand: Where are you in “Sandman”? My experience was it just got better and better (started off a bit shaky, then found its legs and took off).
I should do a re-read shortly. After ASoIaF, again.
Spaghetti Lee
@hildebrand:
I’ve always thought that movie was hilarious, and really underrated, along with the rest of late-90’s Disney.
As far as historical accuracy goes, I tend to side with Ebert: It’s an attribute, not a virtue.
Hal
@Narcissus:
Both great. I love MHP, and Hayes, and I still love Rachel Maddow. She has always been a bit of a concern troll in some of her pieces, but I’ve come to expect that. I think it’s her way of covering all her bases, and there is a reason she is being used as a moderator compared to the others.
redshirt
@Chris: Did you see the remake of “Clash of Titans”? Not a good movie, though I did enjoy it un-ironically, simply because it featured Greek myth.
I thought Hades was somewhat fairly portrayed in it – he’s pissed, and feels cheated out of his birthright. Understandable emotions given his situation.
hildebrand
@redshirt: I have just started ‘Thermidor’ in Volume 6: Fables and Reflections.
James E. Powell
@mdblanche:
This election’s a tribal affair now.
That’s my sense, too. Even when I hear Romney voters talking about particular policies, they are always in the pre-packaged form, talking points from FOX or Rush or wherever. I mean in a word-for-word sense. It’s not “I feel this way on this issue so I will vote for Romney” but rather “I am going to vote for Romney so I know I have to say this about this issue.”
I don’t think I’m being too partisan with this. Some of these are people I know. So I also know that they have never mentioned the particular policy before and cannot now explain how they came to have these feelings.
Kind of strange how all of the sudden I have friends and family who are passionate about whether a health insurance policy provides coverage for birth control.
redshirt
@hildebrand: Awesome. You’re in the sweet spot.
How I miss that voracious thrill of turning the page to a new story.
What’s your favorite story/volume so far?
PurpleGirl
Fred Clark (Slacktivist) has a post up on Nicholas Cage being in a reboot of the Left Behind trilogy. He think Cage would make a good Nicolae (the Antichrist).
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/slacktivist/
hildebrand
On a different topic – I love how every time I wade into one my of brother-in-law’s facebook ‘conversations’ – after I introduce a few ‘facts’ into the discussion, all of a sudden his friends disappear and he is left spluttering about ‘both sides do it’. (He is more than a bit of an odd duck politically – he says he is a libertarian, but he mouths rather a lot of the standard right-wing Republican talking points. Ok, so not really an odd duck.)
hildebrand
@redshirt: Volume 4 – Season of Mists was outstanding, and likely my favorite thus far. All of them have been some of the best stories I have read (though the the first volume, while good, was a bit too superheroic for my tastes).
mdblanche
@James E. Powell: I know just what you mean. I was at a family event earlier today and heard the exact same thing from my Republican relatives. Tribal is the only way I can think to describe it. And I was literally born into the wrong tribe.
Odie Hugh Manatee
@dance around in your bones:
The best part of the joke is that it comes with an expiration date.
November 6th.
@Southern Beale:
Nope, we have Tommy Shaw over here. Well, he lives thirty miles north of town but he frequently shops the local department store here and I see him once in a while.
redshirt
@hildebrand: No doubt. That’s the universal favorite, mine included.
Such a compelling story.
The first volume was rougher, but it makes sense in the light that Gaiman really was picking up an existing DC character, and the first volume most strongly shows that connection. He cut it loose soon enough and made the character his own.
Chris
@redshirt:
That’s one of the movies I was dissing. Understandable or not, still comes back to the whole Heaven vs Hell conflict with Greek mythology stuffed in wherever possible. Eh.
redshirt
@Chris: I see your point, but I thought it was much more familial in the movie, and Hades was motivated on taking Zeus’s place as head of the Gods, not necessarily destroying the world or corrupting its peoples.
And now I can’t believe I’m defending CotT online. Gods, such a nerd!
James E. Powell
@hildebrand:
I’ve done that a number of times. My favorite tactic is to skewer one of their bogus claims (“Obama is responsible for more than half of all federal debt!” or “The US owes the Chinese $11 trillion because of Obama”) by linking to an article on FOX.
Corner Stone
@efgoldman: This place was recently voted best German restaurant in the US. Which you can take or leave as you like.
But I am cramming their meat into my pie hole.
Corner Stone
I’m sorry my affection for meats had me miss the Satan discussion.
But now I’m off to bury myself in some Stabbing Westward while I contemplate the vagaries of the universe.
Maybe later.
patrick II
@PsiFighter37:
Sophistication?
James E. Powell
@Corner Stone:
This place was recently voted best German restaurant in the US
And the name of this place is?
Chris
@redshirt:
Was the sequel any good?
redshirt
@Chris: Didn’t see it, likely never will.
Given the success of Game of Thrones, Spartacus, Rome, and Deadwoood, I hope the cable channels continue the historical dramas. I’d love to see The Odyssey as a TV show.
J R in WVa
We love Emmy Lou Harris, and her work with Linda Ronstadt and Dolly Parton on the Trio albums is nothing short of amazing.
Their voices blend well, and Dolly Parton gives them such a pure high soprano to go with the other women’s lower and huskier vloices. Amazing – give any of them a try.
I can’t believe the country would be willing to elect another empty suit to the job so soon after the last empty suit finished nearly killing off the country. But a friend heard me complaining, quite a while back now, about local elected crooks (now mostly convicted of voter fraud) and told me that in a real democracy people getg the government they deserve. She sure shut me up from that rant!!
Does that mean we’re not living in a REAL democracy? Or do we collectively deserve W Shrub and Romnesia?
Goin’ to the big apple next month for a culture infusion. From Bumfart WV to NYC is quite a shock! Music, food, art, etc, etc. Gonna be swell.
Mnemosyne (iPhone)
@redshirt: @redshirt:
I’ll out-nerd you — I refuse to watch the remake because I still love the campy original with Harry Hamlin. Where, we should note, Hades is NOT a Satan-lite villain.
redshirt
@Mnemosyne (iPhone): The original is awesome. That little metal owl.
BethanyAnne
@Birthmarker: I’ve only heard the Oak Ridge Boys version, and I love it. Here’s a link. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m02V6k9C1MQ&feature=related It appears there’s also a version with them on the Dukes of Hazzard, lol.