Andrew Sullivan has a very good take-down of Glenn Kessler’s bizarre claim that the Obama is lying by suggesting that Romney may have broken the law with regard to his claim about his time at Bain.
I’d add one thing to it: even if it is true that the SEC is unlikely to bring charges against Romney, that doesn’t mean that Romney didn’t break the law.
4tehlulz
WHY CAN’T I QUIT YOU?
buckethead
Well, now the vacuous John King of CNN has basically said the same thing as Kessler: SEC Filings? What are they good for?
http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/12/politics/john-king-bain/index.html?hpt=hp_c1
It goes off the rails very fast, starting with:
“But first, is there anything other than the SEC filings to suggest a hands-on Romney role at Bain post-February 1999?”
So legal documents stating that he is the CEO and sole shareholder aren’t relevant, we just need to believe what he says.
Blue Neponset
link Saw this on Fark. Here is Romney being quoted as CEO of Bain in July 1999.
Violet
Sullivan is all over this story. Post after post. As I’ve said previously, the media wants ratings. They’re invested in the old horse race narrative because that’s what’s worked before. But this election is boring and ratings aren’t at all like 2008, so a scandal narrative will trump what they’ve got now. Romney committing a felony and the ensuing nomination chaos, with the potential of a floor fight at the convention is ratings gold.
Valdivia
He took Kessler well and good. He is excellent at fisking.
burnspbesq
Andrew has had a good week. I thought his reaction to the Tom Junod article was dead on.
Violet
@buckethead: I would suspect that the media treated Watergate in the same way initially. There was no there there. Until there was. The media is slow. They’ll catch on eventually. A scandal brings high ratings.
MikeJ
Absolutely agree, but it is beyond unlikely that the SEC will file charges. Right now Romney could rape puppies on TV and nothing would happen to him. Any official action taken against him will be sold by the sclm as a panicky Obama using the KGB against his betters.
Violet
“Welcome back…” Now I’ve got that stupid song in my head. Thanks a lot, DougJ.
Jewish Steel
Up Kessler’s nose wid a rubber hose.
trollhattan
It’s settled then: “Rmoney-Issa 2012–One Nation; Two Felons”
redshirt
@Valdivia: What the hell is fisking anyways? It’s dirty, right?
MikeJ
@Jewish Steel: I understand that the name “Kessler” means “the cattle are dying”.
General Stuck
This song goes out to Mitt Romney as creature comfort to all white republicans. Tell It To My Heart. Tell Me I’m the Only One
And best music video ever, imo.
burnspbesq
@MikeJ:
Statute of limitation doesn’t run until sometime in 2014. Plenty of time left after the election. That said, a SEC civil enforcement action is probably more likely than a criminal case. Those have historically ended with a fine and a consent decree in which the defendants agree to never again do the thing they don’t admit ever having done.
Baud
I have to say, there is no better feeling than the moment you understand the meaning behind one of DougJ’s post titles.
Alexandra
@Valdivia:
Must admit I misread that second sentence.
Enhanced Voting Techniques
@Violet: I think have a point. “No drama” Obama is certainly no fun for the press. Mittens is so compulsively secretive he’s a tabloids dream candidate.
TenguPhule
Oh Good, Sully the Slut vs Romney the Slut.
Root for mutal destruction as they turn their big guns on each other.
Jamey
@buckethead: I’d love to extrapolate from King’s line of reasoning the following: Is there anything other than the Second Amendment to the Bill of Rights to suggest that Americans have the right to own guns?
gopher2b
This:
“The Fact Checker, in an earlier life covering Wall Street, spent many hours looking for jewels in SEC filings.”
is the problem with Kessler. You see, if you’ve covered the biz, you know everything in SEC filings is bullshit. Ergo, you cannot lie when everyone knows you are lying. It’s how the game is played, haters.
Violet
@MikeJ: Romney’s on SEC documents saying he was the CEO. There are plenty of records saying he was quite involved during the 1999-2002 timeframe. In his 2011 Personal Financial Disclosure Form that he had to make to run for President he said he wasn’t involved with Bain during that time.
Two official financial forms that are legal documents he signed. Both say something different. If he lied on one or the other, it’s perjury. Which one is right? They can’t both be right?
Jamey
@Violet: Never the crime; always the cover-up.
Rafer Janders
@buckethead:
Why this sudden infatuation with a “hands-on” role? Hands-on, hands-off, in either case the CEO is the CEO and is legally liable and responsible for what his company does. If Bain had engaged in a murder-for-hire business, Romney wouldn’t be able to claim, well, I was hands-off that part of the business.
Plus, is that really going to be his defense? “Yes, I was nominally in charge, but despite having my name on the business, I was kept completely in the dark and had no clue what was happening. Now vote for me for president because I’m a great businessman!”
Steve
@burnspbesq: Seriously? How the heck long is the statute of limitations? We’re talking about filings from 2002 and before, right?
jl
TPM has good coverage this morning of Romney’s long goodbye at Bain.
Testimony of Romney contradicting SEC filings.
Romney attended board meetings, Romney camp won’t deny it, so far
Never any delegation of authority for CEO duties.
Sooooo….. I like it.
Let the hacks spew.
Will be good marketing for the debate title fight.
And this is made for some JoeB wisecracks and Bidengaffes(R)
I’m not complaining.
Fwiffo
Kessler’s amazing ambulatory goalposts are doing their best Usain Bolt impersonation.
“We rate the Obama Campaign’s statement that ‘Mitt Romney worked at Bain after 1999’ as three Pinocchios because the SEC isn’t likely to throw him in jail for it or anything.”
beltane
It’s hard to believe that Romney gets a pass while Martha Stewart had to go to jail. That is not a good thing.
pragmatism
do glenn frey and glenn danzig make up for glenn beck and glenn kessler? or does the extra n in glenn stand for nutburgers for all of them?
Jewish Steel
@MikeJ:
Wow. Your WBK recall is a thing to behold.
@Rafer Janders:
Id take it a step further and ask why profiting from outshoring/offsourcing is less repugnant than directing companies that do so?
Violet
@Jamey: Exactly. Romney is busy trying to cover the most recent revelations while trying not to have to release his tax returns. Meanwhile the Obama campaign will wait a bit and then drip out the next bit of info, which will contradict what Romeny’s been saying to cover up the previous lie.
It’s a big mess for Romeny and it’s only just started. He’s so busy covering up everything he can’t see what’s happening. The cover up will get him.
Trentrunner
Just FYI: MSM (Today Show, Nightly News) so far is covering this as “campaign back-and-forth,” and hasn’t yet given it its status as a story.
Just FYI.
Litlebritdifrnt
@Rafer Janders: From Blue’s link at #3 This is Romney being quoted as CEO of Bain in July 1999
Jamey
Mitt-meme.
barath
@Violet:
I wish I had your confidence. Seems like we’re ripe for some blue dogs and their ilk (Rendell) to make noise about how we need to move on, for the media consensus to form around that, and for everyone to pretend it never happened.
Joey Maloney
@redshirt: “Fisking” means to take apart an argument line-by-line with interstitial rebuttal and commentary.
I knew it was named after journalist Robert Fisk, but I learn just now from Wikipedia that the term was coined in 2001 by Instapundit to describe a response to a Fisk piece by…wait for it…Andrew Sullivan.
Violet
@Trentrunner: MSM is slow. They’re invested in the horse race, hence the “campaign back and forth”. Eventually they’ll catch on.
Valdivia
@redshirt:
In case no one replied yet: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisking
ETA: Joey got there first.
jl
@Fwiffo:
“We rate the Obama Campaign’s statement that ‘Mitt Romney worked at Bain after 1999’ as three Pinocchios because the SEC isn’t likely to throw him in jail for it or anything.”
Technically a felony, but practically, merely a sorry sign that Romney has not outgrown his hippy youth. Giving him more responsibility will help him grow into his elite role.
See, I think better after reading Kessler and Brooks, deferentially, of course, like a good All-Ammercian follower should.
MikeJ
@Violet: I never said he wasn’t guilty. I said there’s nothing that can be done about it until, at the very least, November. I wouldn’t count on anything after that, but again, that doesn’t mean he’s not guilty.
Jamey
@Violet: Wish I could agree, but this time, contra-Watergate, the KapPo seems inclined to cover for the perp.
beltane
@Violet: I think you’re right about the media. For example, the story I am linking to is not snark http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/07/13/1109508/-Bain-Halperin-tightens-the-screws
If Mark Halperin is questioning Romney’s SEC filings it means that the Village has found a shiny object that is not Condi Rice.
KG
@Jamey: this is what amazes me, every kid aged 13 or so knows that what gets you in real trouble isn’t whatever wrong you did, it’s lying about it afterwards
Violet
@barath: I’m sure other scandals had their ups and downs too until eventually the dam broke. Blue Dogs may try to change the subject, but Obama knows it’s working. They won’t stop and eventually the issue will be too big to ignore.
Maybe it’ll all tie in neatly with the Olympics, where the ultra-rich Romneys have their own personal dancing horse competing and which Mitt Romney ran in 2002. Rich, rich, rich, how did he get so rich? What was he doing during those other Olympics? Interesting way to tie it all together.
JGabriel
Kessler via Sully:
Really? Kessler’s defense is that Romney isn’t guilty if he got away with it by beating the statute of limitations?
It’s almost like Kessler took lessons from Karen Handel and the Komen Foundation on how to lose all credibility in ten days or less
.
FlipYrWhig
@Rafer Janders: That’s killing me too, this new threshold for being hands-on or practicing active management. What, I’ll ask again, is the proof that the CEO, president, and sole stockholder of the company ever was active or hands-on _before_ 1999? Does Romney get to claim, simultaneously, that he would make a great president because of his business experience, while systematically fobbing off all unsavory or embarrassing business experiences to someone else? Why does he get credit for anything? Where in the paper trail is that clear?
eldorado
what?
where?
why?
amk
@trollhattan: tweeting that.
eldorado
i’m sooooo confused
Steve in DC
@beltane:
Your comment doesn’t make any sense. Stewart’s activities were known to the public and thus she was taken down. Up till now, nobody has bothered to lock into Romney’s claims and history.
We’ll see just what exactly happened and where they go. The current defense seems to be “well, he was on a leave of absence, so it was on the paper but not really there” which is certainly plausible. People are often semi retained and paid in an official function on leaving a job, provided they aren’t going to work for a competitor, and yet do nothing at all. A non profit I worked for had a senior VP that was “not working” yet paid a fuck ton of money for multiple years and quasi retained to give advice if needed, and to slap on papers when fishing for contracts, even had an office… but didn’t work there. He landed six figures in this fashion for over five years before he was officially “retired”… but his office is still there and he keeps getting paid regardless.
There might be illegal activity with Mitt, and it certainly as hell looks like it… or it might just be one of those cozy positions and situations that are handed out to the big wigs. The name remains in case they are needed, their corner office stays just as they left it, they keep getting paid yet they don’t do anything and aren’t part of the company.
This sort of stuff is rampant in non profits, so I’m not shocked it exists in investment firms as well. Hell paying people just to have their names and their schools listed on pieces of paper even though they don’t do anything is very common in non profit sector bid competitions.
FlipYrWhig
@gopher2b: Almost all the pundit and anchors have been treating the story that way. It’s just the kind of thing filthy rich people do, tsk-tsk you little peon, don’t worry your little head about it.
Nemesis
MSM, especially CNN for whatever reason, has already tried to discredit the Bain stories. Those outlets were punked by the WH. Now those outlets are seeing the Bain Pain as real, but most outlets will indeed be slow on the uptake.
Our ace in the hole is the POTUS and his team can make news so its hard for media to flat out ignore the WH narrative.
The WH will continue to beat mittbot. The Bain Pain will not stop anytime soon. There is much more to the story.
Not only has the WH moved this story well, including a probable leak to David Corn (just my guess), but the WH has also discredited certain media members. Its a twofer.
Violet
@MikeJ: Well, maybe you’re right, but I do think the media is bored out of their minds with this election. There have been polls showing that viewers/voters are bored with it. Nothing like a narrative shift to spice things up. The Republican candidate for President committed a felony? That’s exciting! People will watch that! So, who knows.
@Jamey: The WaPo is not who will break the story this time. They’ve been moribund and useless for a long time. Someone else will and will make a name for themselves.
@beltane: Yep! Shiny new object. And at some point the MSM will race to be “first” to break this story.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
@Trentrunner:
The MSM immune response is attempting to work as usual. I wouldn’t expect anything less at the start of something like this.
The fact that Sullivan (of all people!) is on this gives me a little hope, however. If he keeps pushing this as hard as he pushed against Sarah Palin, the meme may not die.
FlipYrWhig
@Steve in DC: There’s an important difference between being shocked that something happens and being pissed that something happens. I’m sure shit like what Romney was pulling happens all the time among fancy people. It still needs to be exposed, because it’s … rank.
JPL
Gives new meaning to the buck stops here.
jl
@beltane:
If my cynicism about the media is justified, then the hack will not support Romney simply out of general loyalty to corproations and the rich.
Other things being equal, sure, they will.
But the hacks need to keep their audience, they need to keep up their Q-scores or whatever their popularity ratings are called, need good focus group results.
The general environmental incentives of a Romney Amercia will always go the same way. But the individual incentives may go a different way very quickly if Romney is such an ass that defending him harms each hack’s individual business model. Same for corporate news outfits.
How a hack handles a situation like this separates artistes like Halperin, from your utility players like Rendell.
catclub
@Steve: No, it seems to me that the felony is when he filed with FEC in 2011.
I am assuming that his SEC filings 1999-2002 were not lies.
This is not definite.
Joey Maloney
@KG: And the lesson the smart kids take from that is not to lie. For the dimmer kids, the result is a resolution to come up with a better lie next time. But being dim, they can’t quite manage that. If they were smart enough to come up with a good lie they’d be smart enough to know not to.
rikyrah
this was a good column by Sully
scav
Trust the lot that brought us the fiscal controls in Iraq:
Guardian, not much more there yet
Joey Maloney
@Nemesis:
I had the same thought. At the very least, I bet someone pointed him in the right direction.
beltane
@Steve in DC: I understand why Romney is not in jail, but his apologists in the media (David Gergen for example) are coming across as entitled hypocrites by aggressively defending his behavior before all the facts are known.
amk
@trollhattan: linky to the tweet with due credit.
Violet
@Steve in DC: I’m sure that stuff happens all the time too. But in Romney’s case he was the CEO, not some “Senior VP”, one of many, with a cushy job and no responsibilities. In Romney’s case he had specific legal responsibilities as CEO. He can’t say he didn’t if he filed that he was CEO. And later he said under oath as he tried to prove MA residency that he was involved with Bain during those years. So he not only said he was involved legally, he elaborated on that involvement.
It’s not quite the same situation as a VP collecting a salary with no responsibility.
Haydnseek
@buckethead: Shorter “liberal media” response to Bain/Romney story: “Is there anything other than the defendant standing over the victim with a smoking gun that would persuade us that he’s the murderer? Because we aren’t convinced.”
Litlebritdifrnt
@Violet:
From the link above
JPL
According to the Guardian he signed his resignation from BAIN in 2002 and back dated it. How common is this?
Gosh, I know he was running for office and all that but wouldn’t you update other forms?
Turgidson
@Rafer Janders:
It’s the pathetic fig leaf our “fact checking” betters are clinging to to avoid a contrite admission that they either completely fucked this up or are in the tank for Mittens (and are therefore fucking this up on purpose).
They are wrong. Either they know it, or they’re being paid to not know it, or they’re too ignorantly proud to know it. Or in Kessler’s case, he’s too much of an idiot to know it because facts, particularly facts that verify in writing that Mitt is a fucking lying sack of shit, can be partisan.
MikeJ
@Nemesis:
Paul Begala says, “Bain will never go away, never. We may even run ads against Bain after the election.”
Violet
@Litlebritdifrnt: Romney wants it whatever way he wants it when he wants. Until he doesn’t want it that way and then he wants it another way. And he’s always gotten away with it because he’s rich, rich, rich, rich, rich and has toadies and yes-men telling he what he wants to hear.
Chickens are coming home to roost. This story goes to the heart of what he claims are his credentials and worse than that, his character. He’s a liar and a coward. This just piles on to that narrative.
beltane
@jl: This is where Romney’s off-putting personality will come back to haunt him-the Villagers probably don’t like him any more than the other Republican insiders like him. Also, the prospect of drama at the RNC might be too hard to pass up. Have we heard from Newt Gingrich yet?
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
@catclub:
…which would imply that he lied under oath in 2002 when he testified that he had been attending board meetings (to meet the residency requirements to run for MA Governor).
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@FlipYrWhig: I view it like this: There may be nothing technically illegal, but it will be fun watching Mitt explain his “If you want free stuff” quote and getting a 100K salary for doing nothing.
jl
@beltane:
I was a little doubtful about this story at first. But now, Mitt is at board meetings, TPM says no delegation of authority, etc.
At some point Romney will have to address this on camera. That will be interesting.
Better be better than ‘I was going to run for President, for Pete’s sake!”
Wonder what that something better could be.
scav
@Violet: We could make a flip book (Mitt Book? Flip-Flop book?) with all the positions he’s taken.
Steve in DC
@Violet:
A CEO can do the same via a leave of absence, this is common as well. They might be the CEO but they sure as hell aren’t acting as it, it goes to the next guy down.
This entire situation is comedic, and it’s certainly bad for Romney. But we are going to be back in a sort of “well it depends on what the meaning of is is” sort of situation.
I think it coming to light is a net positive, because it certainly brings attention to just how fundamentally different things are at the top of the food chain.
General Stuck
We will be hearing from the horse’s ass
This ought to be interesting.
jl
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
“But, back then I was running for Governor, for Pete’s sake!”
So many sakes for Pete.
Does Pete refer to Saint Peter in that saying? Pete ain’t gonna be happy. Mitt better hope another greeter is on duty when he gets to the bighouse in the sky.
hueyplong
So Romney’s certfied public filings can’t be called lies unless he’s prosecuted, but Obama’s statement that Romney is lying can in fact be called a lie merely because Romney hasn’t been prosecuted?
How much more closely must Kessler’s “reasoning” resemble a pretzel before people conclude that he’s starting with a result and working backward?
Romney has public statements that contradict one another. They can’t both be true outside FoxNewsLand.
There should be no letup on this clown masquerading as a neutral observer/fact checker.
Violet
@Steve in DC:
But as Litlebritdifrnt pointed out, he was only taking a part-time leave of absence. If you’re working part time, you haven’t delegated the responsibility to someone else. Only part of it at most. Which part? How does that work? Who’s responsible?
beltane
Rmoney has agreed to be interviewed by the networks regarding his Bain SEC filings http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2012/07/romney-to-give-network-interviews-today-128875.html
This should be good.
gvg
I am sure Romney changed his story constantly according to his perceived immediate advantage, but we all already knew that. I guess the normal voter might not though.
One problem I have with actually thinking he was still involved is the paltry by his standards $100.000 salary. Based on what I have read on him normal deal profits which are in the millions, leave me feeling that he probably wasn’t that active and it was the eligibility to run for MA government that was the lie. Attending meetings though, makes it possible he was still acting CEO. He said he did, but who takes THAT seriously. I actually need some third party documentation that he did what he said each time.
If I am understanding it right, the scandal is that this company did things which his likely voters won’t approve, like move jobs overseas and dispose of abortion fetuses. there are things BAIN did that both Democratic leaning voters and Republican leans don’t like.
If any government agency goes after him, it will be seen as misusing government powers, even if some other non candidate got found out for the same offense and was routinely charged by the DOJ/SEC, in the context of an election they nay not feel able to act.
Bain is confusing because they apparently spun off multiple companies/departments/funds and named them BAIN this and Bain that plus they bought other companies. I know that Romney was more involved with some of it than other parts but I have already lost track of these companies. /we need a score card with a diagram.
Litlebritdifrnt
@General Stuck:
Will any of the reporters doing the interviews have the balls to call him out on his lies? I doubt it.
Violet
@General Stuck: This should be fun. Romney’s terrible in interviews. All it’s going to do is create more questions. Now the media will have a reason to look into it. “Mitt Romney felt a need to set the record straight because this is becoming a big issue. Why is that?” “Mitt Romney said this to us here at ABC, but he said this to NBC and his FEC filing said another thing. Why?”
Hunter Gathers
Mittens will be on the Big 3 this evening. There is every possibility that he will fuck this up even more than he already has.
trollhattan
@amk:
Aw, thanks! Is it pithy enough for a tshirt?
beltane
@gvg: It is my understanding that he was paid at least $100,000 per year during that time period. Since we can’t see his tax returns we have no way of knowing whether he was paid $100,000 or $1,000,000 or even more.
TaMara (BHF)
@Violet: I loved it when you said it last night and wanted to say, I am really hoping you’re right. This is how it should go in a fair universe.
And when it does go this way, I’ll be the first one to quote you and claim you as the smartest BJ commenter evah.
jl
@Violet: I hope Mitt starts hectoring through the sit downs. I love it when Mitt hectors.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
@General Stuck:
How much you want to bet he pushes the “Obama == liar” angle? On three major networks, no less.
This looks more and more like Obama and Romney trying to push out competing narratives at a frenzied pace, to see which one “sticks”.
The Obama camp’s narrative has the added bonus of being, you know, actually true.
We’re about to spend the next few days seeing if Truth matters, at all.
Turgidson
@General Stuck:
I predict he will lie about his lies. And the interviewer will sagely nod, impressed by Mitt’s courage in addressing this he-said she-said controversy in a forthright manner. And the media will try, again, to drop the subject permanently.
beltane
@Hunter Gathers: Maybe he’ll give a different version of events to all three. That would be in keeping with his character.
General Stuck
@gvg:
He was sole owner of 100 percent of Bain’s stock. Pretty good reason to stay in the loop, as he testified to for attending staff meetings and such. flying back from Salt Lake City. The stench of the lying, that will have a paper trail is what will sink Mitt. And his running around calling everyone liars will only make that demise more profound. He is done for, unless he comes clean now with what he was doing.
dmsilev
@beltane: Huh. Must really be having an effect for Romney to break out of his normal Foxified media orbit and deign to speak to the rest of us.
Violet
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
If the networks start to smell a scandal, Truth won’t matter, ratings will.
scav
There is liquid stuff coming out of the sky. What do I do and should I be worried?
Violet
@dmsilev: Yeah, didn’t he just say something recently about “getting information out in different ways” and how they don’t need the non-Fox media or something? Hmmm…
Turgidson
@gvg:
FWIW – I haven’t seen this corroborated, but Lawrence O’Donnell pointed out on his show last night that the filings showing the $100k salary actually said “at least $100k” and that the real salary he drew can probably only be found…you guessed it…in the tax returns he doesn’t want to show anyone.
edit: Beltane got here first.
General Stuck
@Turgidson:
This is a POTUS campaign for the highest office in the land. The press will not be able to drop it permanently, even if some want to. This isn’t about some ancillary behavior, a one off screwup. It is about the very reason he wants to be president, and that with his business experience, is the person to do it. THIS is his sole claim to experience for voters to judge him on. And the paper trail will be the drip drip of smoking guns. He can’t bullshit his way out of this.
burnspbesq
@Steve:
Oops. My bad. Brain cramp turned 1999 into 2009.
redshirt
@scav: PANIC! I recommend running in circles, screaming.
patroclus
Kessler’s reputation is in the toilet now. He had a day to walk back his earlier “mistakes” but he’s doubling down at a furious pace now. “Boilerplate” is a term used by lawyers to describe common clauses that go in just about every contract (or SEC filing) – the signature line is NEVER “boilerplate.” It is the most important line in a contract (or SEC filing) because it carries prospective legal liability once affixed.
I’ve worked in the “biz” too. Glenn Kessler is lying.
Legalize
I wonder if any of the interviewers will actually confront Willard with facts, you know like his own sworn testimony and writings. I’m betting that they do to an extent; all eyes are on them and they will be massacred if they collectively give puff interviews.
I’m betting that Willard gives inconsistent answers from interview to interview.
And then Team O releases something Monday morning proving that something that Willard said on Friday was a lie.
Willard is only doing this because he absolutely has to. The Rats have apprised themselves of the locations of the lifeboats, and he’s on notice that they aren’t going down with him.
trollhattan
@scav:
Are you in Seattle? If you are not in Seattle…RUN AWAY!
Then run away some more.
MikeJ
@scav:
The liquid is normal. What’s weird is the rumbling sound and stuff that looks like an ACDC logo in the sky. Rain is supposed to fail at a steady rate of .01″ per hour forever, with no other drama involved.
EdTheRed
@Valdivia: He is indeed; he literally invented Fisking.
scav
@redshirt: Got it, will go get some on my chest and have at it.
EconWatcher
This is not a technicality or boilerplate. There’s a very good reason why identification of directors and officers is required in SEC filings: Investors are entitled to know with whom they are doing business. It’s one of the basics of transparency and accountability. A company run by Steve Jobs is not the same investment as the identical company run by “Chainsaw Al” Dunlap.
I think this one is going to pick up steam. This is real.
roc
Why does anyone imagine this is a problem?
The mindset on the right has no trouble with this kind of double-think.
This is a group that can not only insist the Government keep its hands off their Medicare with a straight face, but then goes on to cheer budget plans that propose replacing Medicare with a voucher system. That is, turning a *healthcare* system into a *discount club* from the unassailable logical positions of “it has to be killed so that it doesn’t develop problems” and “the name isn’t changing, so nothing has gone away.” (Funny, no-one saw it that way when Coke changed their formula…)
And the press not only allows that nonsensical multiply-contradictory mess to sail by — with naught but token ‘he-said/she-said’ quotes if anything — but they actually send out their ‘fact checkers’ to proactively excuse it and attack anyone who *does* criticize it.
Why in the world should this turn out any different?
Bobby Thomson
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God: No, you have it backwards. His SEC filings and his MA testimony are completely consistent. It’s his FEC filing that’s contradictory.
SFAW
@Baud:
I gotta say: you’re scaring me.
Turgidson
@General Stuck:
I desperately hope you’re right. But then I remember the 2004 election. The entire Bush reelect campaign was a mountainous pile of rank bullshit and lies and he got away with every single damn one of them.
My hope for why this is different is that Romney has treated the press with total contempt so far. For all Bush’s atrocities, he (e.g. Rove) knew that he needed to keep the press in the tank for him until he got reelected. And the press, being the delicate flowers with sensitive fee fees that they are, might get the daggers out for Mittens just out of personal pique. Problem is, the Obama team and the media have a cool relationship too. So we’ll see.
General Stuck
@Legalize:
There is a treasure trove for Obama to mine, of Romney flip flopping that is unprecedented, and seems quite pathological, I think, in any high office election, especially for president.
Todd
@scav:
Braggart. Everything in my yard is crunchy and yellow/brown, and none of the promised drought relief has arrived yet.
burnspbesq
@scav:
That depends on where you are, what it is, and how much of it is coming out of the sky.
Assuming it’s water, the standard response is to go into your back yard, take off all your clothes, and luxuriate in it.
We had that in SoCal for the last two days. It was glorious.
Linda Featheringill
@beltane:
Newt has an inoffensive article published in the opinion pages of WaPo. Something about the national electric power grid. I think he submitted it as proof of life. He’s still around.
Litlebritdifrnt
@EconWatcher:
Sully is now on his SIXTH Bain post for today.
Prometheus Shrugged
@Steve in DC: Exactly right. Here’s how I would try to illustrate your point from the bottom of the food chain: Imagine if I owned a house and then moved away but retained full ownership. Then that house became a crack den, either because the place was unoccupied or because I rented to the wrong crowd. Would I be forced to accept responsibility for my house becoming a crack den, even though I didn’t directly traffic the goods? Hmmm…I wonder….
On the other hand, I live near one of Mitt’s unoccupied houses. Maybe I could conduct a test of my thought experiment.
Turgidson
@Legalize:
Massacred by who? Rachel Maddow? They’d rather stay in good stead with the clique than give a shit what the riff raff on the fringes of journalism think of them.
Their interviews of Palin were puffier than marshmallows – she just happened to be such an ignorant yutz that even those questions destroyed her. Romney is a pathetic buffoon in many ways, but he’s not quite the certifiable moron that Sarah is. He can survive the softballs I’m expecting.
patroclus
Kessler is utterly pathetic if he thinks that one sworn statement “trumps” another. This is not a game of “bridge.” Either one sworn statement is true or the other is true. And if it’s the SEC filings (most likely)that are true, then Romney has been lying to the electorate. If it’s the FEC documents that are accurate, then Romney has committed a felony. It may be legally moot because of the statute of limitations, but it is not politically moot.
Romney lies, Kessler buys and journalism dies.
dr. bloor
@Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God:
“We’re about to spend the next few days seeing if Truth matters, at all.”
Prepare to be disappointed, O Prophet.
What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us? (formerly MarkJ)
@Steve in DC: I just think the sole owner seals it. I get all the profits but none of the responsibility? That just doesn’t fly.
As for Kessler et al, they have willfully NOT been paying attention if they think Romney’s word is his bond. He’s told so many lies that skepticism of any claims he makes should be the default.
beltane
@Litlebritdifrnt: Oh my, it looks like Bain is filling the void left by Sarah Palin’s uterus. Sully is at his best when his OCD kicks in.
Legalize
@Turgidson:
Yeah, all true. I forget sometimes that no one gives a shit about what Rachel Maddow says.
TaMara (BHF)
This is what happens when you screw up your email.
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
@Violet: I loved it when you said it last night and wanted to say, I am really hoping you’re right. This is how it should go in a fair universe.
And when it does go this way, I’ll be the first one to quote you and claim you as the smartest BJ commenter evah.
JPL
My prediction is Obama is desperate and he is the liar. I did nothing illegal. The fact that the sec and fec forms are different do not matter. He resignation letter is signed 1999. It won’t matter when the actual date he signed it was.
What I hope is the repubs said fix it now or resign.
beltane
Steve Schmidt, who has actually seen Romney’s tax returns, says they’re toxic.
Litlebritdifrnt
@beltane:
Yeah when that British Bulldog gets his teeth into something he is not letting go.
chuck butcher
@gvg:
The $100K is the top catagory, it is in excess of that number by an unspecified amount – that, in fact, would be in tax forms as salary…
Thanks to the way the tax code works, a CEO would take a minimal “salary” and everything else in dividends, etc. Anything you get for “actually working” is taxed a lot harder than – well, you know, money making money.
scav
Still dealing with a rather large leak overhead, neener neener. But, setting aside the entire issue of truth, I think the situation makes him A) look foolish (not a good thing) and B) points out the difference between what small businessmen go through and what large Vultures get to play at. His team has so far swallowed the flippy floppy hood, but a transparent dingbat that gets away with stuff you can’t? That might temper a little enthusiasm in certain traditionally strong quarters.
Turgidson
@Legalize:
I mean, the Obama campaign will do what they can to keep this story running, and since he’s the incumbent and the election is quickly approaching, they can’t simply ignore his spokespeople. But they can continue spinning in circles insisting that this is just the usual he said/she said spat and it will blow over. I mean, shit, just look at John King and Gergen’s heroic performance on this last night. So they might succeed in pooh-poohing this despite Obama’s or the MSNBC anchors’ best efforts.
That all said, this is serious enough shit, with a paper trail that can’t be dismissed out of hand, that they might not succeed in flushing it down the memory hole. And I hope Violet and Stuck are right about what is coming. I really do.
Jeff Fecke
This morning, I drove 98 miles per hour on the way to work. But no cop stopped me, so you’re lying when you said I was speeding.
SFAW
Y’all are basing all your snark, jibes, and other anti-Rmoney remarks on a house of cards (or whatever the right cliche is).
The boys at Powerline have finally turned their massive resource to this issue, and have checked the kerning on the purported SEC filing(s) – upon which Mr. Corn seems to be hanging his hat – and have determined that no such font existed in 1999 and 2002, when soon-to-be-President Romney allegedly submitted them.
So, I think ALL OF YOU owe a major apology to Mr. Glenn Kessler.
Damn liberals, all of youse.
jwb
@JPL: Well, going to all the networks rather than judiciously selecting one where they could better control the message suggests utter desperation.
My money is on Romney fucking up at least one of the interviews and I wouldn’t be surprised if Fox goes for the kill. We already know that Murdoch hates Romney and if Murdoch believes this could bring Romney down before the convention, I think he’ll go for it.
Joey Maloney
@General Stuck:
That’s not just a mixed metaphor, it’s pureed. And you stuck the dismount. Well done.
SFAW
@Jeff Fecke:
But being an honest person, you will doubtless self-
deport-report.SFAW
@jwb:
Yeah, but Rupert hates Obama even more. Who would Rupe get to replace Mitt? Chris Christie? Caribou Barbie? Harold Stassen?
JPL
@jwb: I like your thinking. You might be right because Romney can’t tell the truth. More often than not he lies.
Calouste
@SFAW:
You know what Rupert hates even more than Obama? Backing an obvious loser.
jl
@SFAW:
Murdoch simultaneously takes down Romney for lying, then Obama for being uncivil in smearing Romney for understandable lies that the job creators need to do in order to git ‘er done.
Then, TPaw versus Harold Ford Jr.
WIN!
danimal
I love this scandal, because the folks who should know better have a HUGE blind eye to it. Kessler’s seen semi-phony paperwork from corporate and legal titans for decades; he genuinely doesn’t understand the big deal here. The type of fraud and misrepresentation that Rmoney was conducting are, sadly, typical of our Galtian overlords.
Every day that Mitt spends trying to untangle the mess here is a win. Face it, he got paid $100K a year to attend board meetings, sign papers and oversee the direction of Bain. He profited if Bain profited. He ran the Salt Lake Olympic Committee while he was the head of Bain. He parlayed the Olympic gig into a run for MA governor. Obviously, he was situated so that he could back out of Bain if he won, or retain control of the company if he lost.
At root, this isn’t terribly hard to figure out: Mitt wanted to have his cake and eat it, too.
Edited for clarity.
cmorenc
@Turgidson:
Romney is a very intelligent man, but high intelligence isn’t a phenomena that necessarily extends gifted skills across the board to its owner; for example, people who are very gifted analytically can be very awkward and deficient in social skills and intelligence, and people who have masterfully brilliant social skills and intelligence can be absolutely miserable at anything but very simple quantitative analysis. Plus, intelligence is overlaid on basic personality and character traits that both channel and limit how the person is able to use that intelligence.
In Romney’s case, he’s very skilled inside the networked world of financial business, but has only mediocre skills at communicating with ordinary people day-to-day, and has an almost autistic inability to understand and empathize with folks outside of the elite wealthy and business circles he’s familiar and comfortable with. That’s why he’s so vulnerable to committing spontaneous buffoonish verbal gaffes, and sometimes appearing to walk a fine line between being unaware how ordinary people out of his usual circles live, empathy-challenged, and outright sociopathic.
Hill Dweller
Once again, everything Willard does is reactionary. The Obama campaign is driving the narrative, despite the media desperately trying to change the subject/carry Willard’s water.
Doing interviews with all three networks(should just pick one) on a Friday, which is usually the day reserved for dumping bad political news, is bad strategy borne of panic. No one will see the interviews, but Willard will be on record about his time at Bain, affording the Obama campaign the opportunity to pick apart every one of his answers.
hueyplong
The great thing about Romney bragging about how he doesn’t need the msm is that any time he makes a same day request for interviews with them, he’s putting out a neon SOS.
For what it’s worth, the Harold Stassen thing caused a liquid consumption mishap.
Turgidson
I must say, the last two days have been one of those “Is our Sully learning” stretches. He’s holding firm and calling out Kessler on being a total dipshit despite the risk they could run into each other at a Georgetown soiree.
I’m sure an innumerate tongue-bath of the next Paul Ryan-type fraudulent GOP boy genius is soon to follow, but credit where it’s due on this issue.
jwb
@danimal: Romney: philosophy of the hedge.
WereBear
It seems self-evident; he is a very rich person.
However, just how skilled is he? He’s extraordinarily risk-averse, as he won’t go into anything unless it’s a guaranteed situation. He rigs the games he does play. I don’t see how Bain capital could lose that way; either the company makes money, or they loot it for the assets.
To me, it’s unclear just how much of a genius he is. Give me a few mill; see how I do in a rigged game.
asiangrrlMN
@WereBear: Agreed. Romney doesn’t seem highly intelligent to me, nor particularly skilled. I’m with you. Give me a couple mil, six months to study the game, and let me at it.
SFAW
@hueyplong:
My apologies. The check for a new keyboard is in
your mouththe mail.But frankly, I wonder if having his name on the ballot would be any worse than Mittens being there.
What about you, Huey? As long as we make sure your running mate isn’t Carl Weiss, why not?
jl
@Hill Dweller:
What is the wingnut wurlitzer pumping out. All I see is stuff about burning the US Olympic Uniforms because they look commie, or French, or something.
Are they on vacation? Stumped? Frozen in ‘deer in headlights’ mode? What?
Southern Beale
Rich people sure are different.
Ann Romney’s fucking dressage horse gets a bigger tax credit than a huge chunk of Americans earn every year.
Jesus fucking Christ but I am sick of these people.
scav
@WereBear: Furthermore, he’s in an end of the business where they don’t really manage anything, not even people much. They write zippy sneaky no-risk contracts and raise money (and here’s the sole place for any of his vaunted people skills to be honed). That’s a limited crowd with plenty of fawning people to get you to over-rate your own magnetic charm.
BGinCHI
Given the trouble Obama has had in the summer with Tea Party shit and the media and so on, I was really worried that this year he’d be getting killed in June/July/August.
But that’s not happening.
And the reason is that the WH has gone on the offensive with immigration and other big legislative items as well as an aggressive push against his opponent(s).
I think our Democrats is learning.
jwb
@jl: You forgot the part about the uniforms being made in China.
Calouste
@asiangrrlMN:
Plus all the connections you have because your dad was a governor, presidential candidate, cabinet member and Mormon aristocracy.
Turgidson
@cmorenc:
I don’t disagree. He couldn’t even get through an interview with Brent Baier without getting flustered. So there’s definitely a chance he’ll melt down. I hope so. But if they’re as easy on him as they were on the know-nothing Hockey Mom, he’s capable of slithering out unscathed. And judging from the sad sack performances of most of the media so far on this – unable to simply report documented facts with a paper trail (because if accurately reported they could severely hurt Romney, it seems), I think they’ll give him that opportunity to wriggle free, if only to preserve the horse race.
I’ll note again that I really hope I’m wrong.
beltane
@scav: Romney excels at winning a game that is rigged in his favor. Does this really count as an accomplishment?
SFAW
@jl:
Actually, I think it’s because they were made in China, by French soshulists who wanted the Chinese to provide universal health care for their gay lovers who had their guns taken away.
More or less.
hueyplong
I don’t think Huey Long’s Share Our Wealth would work too well in today’s GOP should Willard suffer a hard drive malfunction, though it’s clear that the current electorate will go for the whole High Popalorum/Low Popahiram-type nonsense.
cckids
It doesn’t matter, in the real world, if he got paid to do nothing for three years. That is just how that world works.
But he signed SEC filings stating that he was the CEO, President, etc, etc. Those have real-world implications, and lying on them is a felony.
At least for those of us who are “little people”.
My spouse has dealings with the SEC as he is an investment advisor. If he lies on a SEC filing, he is liable for a fine up to $250,000. It is a BFD.
Hill Dweller
@jl: Nothing, save a few ‘this doesn’t matter’ pleas. They don’t have a defense because there isn’t a defense.
Willard was legally responsible for every thing that happened between ’99-’02. He can try to spin it, but he was the owner and getting paid during that time.
Moreover, does anyone honestly believe that someone as risk-averse as Willard would stick his neck out without having any control?
Turgidson
@BGinCHI:
A little bit. Obama’s team is remarkably good at this, and they’re dragging the rest of the party kicking and screaming towards successful tactics and strategy. I hope this new, somewhat assertive party politicking operation outlives the Obama campaign and administration.
jl
@SFAW:
thanks. I did not know about the made in China angle.
I will admit that I agree that being made in China should be a problem for Olympic uniforms, mainly because it brings up Bain and that Chinese company they contracted out to for outsourcing and offshoring.
But, seems like the wingnut media is quiet on Mitts’ long good bye.
As long as the pain of Bain stays mainly in the frame, I am pleased.
Edit: I was intrigued this morning by a couple of asides in TPM reporting this morning that no CEO or other duties were ever delegated when Mitt was ‘away’ from Bain. Seems to me that is an important piece of info.
Violet
@TaMara (BHF): Thanks! I hope it goes this way too. I think the upcoming Olympics is going to be a wildcard in how this story goes. The Olympics will dominate ratings and NBC gets a win. Other networks will want to counter. What’s better than digging into Romney’s lies and shady financial dealings? Scandal with the added bonus that Romney has deep ties to the Olympics, so they can use that as a springboard.
@Calouste:
I agree. I think Murdoch will not help Romney out much if he sees scandal brewing. First, he doesn’t like or respect Romney. Second, what better way to add some journalism cred to Fox News than to have Fox destroy the presumptive Republican nominee. No way they can be accused to partisanship if they do that. Win!
scav
@beltane: well, did GW even manage that little? (yes, we’re on the low end of the Kelvin stage of accomplishment.)
Original Lee
@barath: This actually puts the whole budget-cutting exercise for the financial regulatory agencies in a whole different light, doesn’t it? IIRC, the Tea Party started trying to gut the SEC, CFPB, the CFTC, the FDIC, the NCUA, and several others last year, before the Budget Control Act.
Citizen_X
@buckethead:
My, this is a useful meme. Let’s try it:
Is there anything, other than his ability to form complete sentences and to walk upright, to suggest David Gregory is not a shrieking gibbon?
Is there anything, other than the fact that he’s been rotting in the ground, at ambient temperature, for thirty years to suggest that Francisco Franco is actually dead?
SFAW
@jl:
By George, I think you’ve got it!
Catsy
@jl:
Not linking to them, but Erick Ericksdotter over at Redstate is desperately trying to liken the Bain criticisms to Birtherism. The comments are even more vile.
They really are in full-on panic and denial.
Legalize
@cmorenc:
Meh, he’s good at looking like a leader and uttering the corporate gobbledygook he learned in business school – the stuff that makes very serious people nod. I went to school with a million guys like him – they were getting joint MBA / JD degrees; they just read the WSJ editorial page every day and yapped it back in forth to each other, nodding knowingly. That’s Willard.
Alex S.
It’s a thing of beauty.
Judas Escargot, Acerbic Prophet of the Mighty Potato God
@Bobby Thomson:
Yep, you’re right. My Mistake.
(I really shouldn’t let my outrage fuck up my acronym-fu so easily).
Citizen_X
Moderdated! I haz teh hidden drugz!
@buckethead:
My, this is a useful meme. Let’s try it:
Is there anything, other than his ability to form complete sentences and to walk upright, to suggest David Gregory is not a shrieking gibbon?
Is there anything, other than the fact that he’s been rotting in the ground, at a.m.b.i.e.n.t. temperature, for thirty years to suggest that Francisco Franco is actually dead?
scav
@Catsy: Hadn’t thought of that. Is a little sweet to have things blow up in the paperwork.
Blue Neponset
Link Here is more research about Romney’s Shadow Years at Bain. This is the best quote:
Too funny.
JPL
Will his wife be by his side for the interviews? Will their be tears? Did the President intentionally make Romney’s wife sick?
I do think someone told Romney he had better stop the bleeding today or else…
pseudonymous in nc
Little People just don’t understand that Big People can say what they want on SEC filings, FEC filings, and interviews to Glenn Kessler.
cckids
@scav:
Snort. It rained here this morning for the first time since I can’t remember when. Not a lot, mind you, but the sidewalks got wet. One of my cats was lounging on the concrete, enjoying the clouds, when it started. He just sat there in shock, looking at the grass, dumbfounded. I’m sure he thought the sprinklers were on, but his eyes were telling him different. It was funny.
It is only 85 or so!!! Weds night it was still 106 at 11:00 at night.
catclub
@Original Lee: Don’t forget that the FEC is actually completely hamstrung, split 2-2 and the senate (surprise, surprise, surprise) has not voted on an Obama appointee.
I think there was a Bush appointee who was a Republican, but he nominally changed to independent ( maybe Green!) so that
the really stupid rules for political balance between the parties on the FEC board could be met.
jl
No time to find it now, but which commenter said
“GOP lies, media buys and democracy dies”?
That is a keeper. I demand it on rotating head. And I think Cole said the blog needed moar tags?
Litlebritdifrnt
From the twitter machine
He he he, drip, drip, drip.
trollhattan
@SFAW:
Embellished for the sheer panic value.
Calouste
Btw, not smart from Romney to go on 5 networks this afternoon. The only thing that does is draw a lot more attention to something that was still somewhat staying under the surface. One would have been ok, 5 looks like panic.
Alex S.
@JPL:
Maybe he’ll do it like Nixon and mention his dog…or better not.
SFAW
@trollhattan:
Thanks, I was trying to fit in as much wingnutty goodness as I could, but I was clearly not up to the task.
You have the thanks of a grateful nation.
JPL
Supposedly he will be on CNN at four. Will someone please live blog it for those unable to watch?
Villago Delenda Est
From Sullivan:
This is in error.
Kessler has no reputation to defend anymore. He’s a pure hack. He’s sewage.
pseudonymous in nc
@General Stuck:
And if you dig deeper, he was sole stockholder of a Bain company that was sole general partner in Bain companies that were sole general partners in Bain companies that were sole stockholders in other Bain companies.
It’s Bain all the way down.
BGinCHI
@JPL: Wolf’s first question: Mr. Romney, how would you respond to the Obama camp’s lies about your record?
pseudonymous in nc
And doing a network sweep on a Friday afternoon? Perhaps it’s meant to stop it leaking over to the Sunday shows, but everybody knows that Friday p.m. is when you bury the bodies.
Turgidson
@Alex S.:
Please provide an address for delivery of your internets.
jl
@Alex S.: That would bring up the question of the missing cloth coat.
Since a blog prediction pool seems to be developing, I predict attempt to dismiss and go negative on Obama for being uncivil. Perhaps ‘busy important man’ and ‘things take time’ excuse.
If that don’t work, then pissy hectoring.
What are those lights we see down the tunnel? Are they moving? Fast?
Violet
@Calouste: And the networks can smell that panic. They know that he’s going on all the networks so they’ll be working overtime to be THE network that gets the soundbite that gets played everywhere.
It’s just getting started…
MattR
I totally misinterpreted the Three Pinocchios at the end of Kessler’s latest offering. I thought the Washington Post was letting me know that everything I just read was bullshit.
JPL
After Alex’s comment, I had to dry off my computer.
Alex S.
@Turgidson:
Switzerla… no wait, actually, I can’t remember.
scav
And, for all their seeming reluctance to cover a non-story, how many networks made room for him on short notice?
jl
@pseudonymous in nc:
” It’s Bain all the way down.”
Bain bane Bain bane
Bain bane Bain bane
Bain, wonderful bane, wonderful Bain!
Would make a nice song.
Edit: and what the hell Bain is and does is so canned up tight, I think some one needs a video of the song, with cans of Bain.
NancyDarling
@Valdivia: I am not sure on the concept. Is “fisking” considered a complement to Robert Fisk or an insult?
Violet
@scav: They can smell panic in the air. Panic means mistakes. Mistakes means soundbite goodness at least and potential scandal at best. The tide may be beginning to turn…
Valdivia
@NancyDarling:
I never thought about it that way, simply as a rebutting of an argument line by line. And Sully is a master of it. I like him deploying it against the Kessler weak sauce!
Turgidson
@BGinCHI:
This is more or less what I expect to happen in his interview tour. Please let me be wrong.
Poor, poor Mitt. “That one,” and the little people, have no right to question his benevolent, heroic Galtian job-creating activities. How dare they. I never.
Calouste
@Violet:
And the soundbite that is going to be played everywhere is not going to be a prepared statement, because that is going to be in every interview. It’s going to be a gaffe. Unless, contrary to at least six months of evidence, the Romney campaign actually has some skills and they let Romney make one juicy comment only in the last interview. But what juicy comments can you make when you are on the defense?
Original Lee
Do we really want the OJ Simpson of Wall Street to be our President?
That’s the parallel.
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@cckids: Except, for those of us without SEC connections, I think it turns out exactly opposite. I think the “he lied on the form” will be turned into “Clinton lied about his affair.” On the other hand, getting more money for doing nothing than the average American makes in two years will once again hurt him among the undecided.
Valdivia
If you go to Political Wire right now you can see the stories are just coming and coming. Also–see brad DeLong taking Kessler to the woodshed.
trollhattan
@NancyDarling:
Not a compliment. Fisk, what little of him I’ve read, engages in prose of a purplish hue.
The term got coined when warbloggers were feeling their internet oats. IIRC they also had a slogan–“We’ll factcheck your ass”–which today seems the very definition of irony.
Kane
Mitt has finally decided that he will talk to the press.
On Friday the 13th. What could possibly go wrong?
Belafon (formerly anonevent)
@Calouste: I think you’re assuming these will be unscripted.
SFAW
@JPL:
Or, at the very least, have CoT do a live-Bobblespeak-Translation.
Violet
@Calouste: Exactly. The networks know that Romney’s not good in interviews. They can see, just as we can, that he’s said he won’t talk to the MSM and yet all of a sudden he wants to talk to ALL of them. They know that means something’s up. It means panic. And panic means mistakes. Mistakes mean those delicious gaffes. They’ll be looking for one. I don’t know if Romney is talented enough to avoid one. Maybe he’ll get lucky.
Villago Delenda Est
Welcome back, Mittster!
Villago Delenda Est
@Kane:
The fire that is raging on his crusts has hit six alarms.
Time to panic.
SFAW
@Violet:
He saved Teh Olympics, for gosh sakes! Of course he’ll avoid one, he’s running for Preznit!
BGinCHI
@Turgidson: The good news is that even if they softball Mitt might still panic. He isn’t doing these interviews because he wants to. And a guy who is used to being a boss is not used to being polite and canny.
trollhattan
@SFAW: Wish I owned a Roomba so it could translate Willardbot 2.0 for me.
Calouste
@Belafon (formerly anonevent):
Oh, not at all. I’m assuming they will be heavily scripted.
But as Violet points out, there is no gain for the networks if they get exactly the same interview as the other 4. They will try to go somewhat off script to make their’s the interview that gets all the attention. One of the reason why it is stupid from Romney to do 5 interviews, there really isn’t much of an upside to it. Maybe somewhat more exposure, but CNN and Fox were going to run it anyway even if he did it on one of the others.
beltane
@Violet: Even if he doesn’t commit any obvious gaffes his belligerent stiffness in these interviews will be late-night comedy gold.
BGinCHI
Someone should interview McCain today and ask him why he didn’t choose Romney for VP.
Maybe Grandpa Walnuts will accidentally tell the truth.
scav
@Violet: And once on that new level of play, it’s hard to ratchet it down as a nothing burger. His last move seemed to be following the “develop a hard-hitting style” playbook donated by grumpy supporters (the macho outbreak Let Them Eat Freestuff Elsewhere! once once safely in a closed venue). So he’s going with an unfamiliar mode without much practice, a lot of times in quick succession. Yeah, I think the tubes pretty much gone AWOL on this puppy, although it might be toothpaste and it might be anchovy paste and I’m certainly hoping there’s no preparation H on offer.
Violet
@Calouste: @beltane: I don’t know anything about his media team and other advisers. Are they just stupid? There’s zero reason for him to do more than one interview on a network other than Fox. He could have picked one and everyone would have run it. That network would know they had an exclusive (outside of Fox, of course) and they’d have less of an incentive to antagonize him because they’d want the same access again.
Instead he’s done the opposite. Spread out the interviews to everyone, tipped his hand about his panic, and incentivized our competitive news industry to go for the gaffe.
What an idiot.
pragmatism
are there some things that OCEANS OF UNLIMITED SUPERPAC DOLLARS can’t fix?
BGinCHI
Oh my Charlie F Christ, if you can read this and not get angry you are a better human than I am:
http://www.philly.com/philly/columnists/christine_flowers/20120713_A_moment_of_sympathy_for_Joe_Paterno.html
Sympathy for JoePa.
Roy G.
The only way it can get better -I think- is if Rmoney comes out with the ‘Lying for the Lord’ defense, and explains how it’s really ok to lie to non-Mormons.
Martin
Romney’s fucked here.
The media is going to dig up every interview and periodical article from 1999 to 2002 that references Romney as Bain CEO, President, ‘involved’, ‘active’, and so on. Every reference no matter how slight will be damning.
But the goal here isn’t what I think most people believe. The goal here is build up a mountain of circumstantial evidence so large that everyone demands to see Mitt’s returns from that period to determine if he ever drew a salary. If he did, he’s fucked, and the other disclosures of income and deductions on his returns are just dessert on top of the meal.
If Mitt resists releasing his returns from 1999 to today, I don’t think there’s any way he wins this election. It’ll compound like Al Gore’s debate sighs into a character defect so large that he’s seen as too risky to vote for. If Mitt does release his returns, it’s a massive data dump that will probably culminate in the same result, just using different evidence.
I think this is his end here. I don’t see how he gets out of this in one piece.
Villago Delenda Est
@Martin:
I am enjoying ever minute of this, too.
Couldn’t happen to a nicer guy.
With any luck, it will fuck over his spawn as well. Destroy them all.
JGabriel
Excerpt from CNN/Romney Interview Transcript, 7/13/2012:
.
jwb
@Violet: I keep thinking, this is the best team money can buy?
I imagine Rove will be called in soon to take over Romeny’s campaign, which means he won’t be able to spend much time doing mischief with his superpac.
Martin
@BGinCHI:
That’s easy enough. The financial sector implosion hit 11 a month after the convention. McCain knew it was coming. Last thing he needed on the ticket was a banker. Don’t need to look any farther than that – though I’m sure they have a lot more dirt on him than just that.
Spatula
But why does it matter what crimes Mitt or his Wall Street buddies committed, or what they may or may not have lied about?
That’s all in the past.
Best we look forward, not back.
Violet
@BGinCHI: That’s ridiculous. I do get what she’s trying to say in portraying him as a tragic figure. But this
WTF? WTF? WTF? He improved people’s live “by simply existing”? Give me a fucking break.
So no, I’m not a better person and that made me angry.
BGinCHI
@Martin: He gave them 20+ years of tax returns and disclosure, so McCain has to know about buried bodies. He also fucking hates Mitt.
I’d stick a mic in his face and hope for the best.
barath
I’m enjoying this too, but we need to remember that the MSM has an attention span of a fruit fly and will move on from this whenever it reaches its peak. It’s still July, and people don’t start really paying attention until September. While Bain may be an issue in ads run against Romney through the election, the media will have moved on by then.
Add to that a billion or two in Super PAC money, unknown economic / world events, and voter disenfranchisement, and this is very much a close election.
Villago Delenda Est
@Spatula:
Let’s not bicker and argue about who killed who. This is supposed to be a happy occasion!
trollhattan
@JGabriel:
Golf clap. Well played.
Rafer Janders
Is there anything other than my marriage vows to suggest I owe fidelity to my spouse?
Is there anything other than my signed lease agreement to suggest I owe rent to my landlord?
Is there anything other than a restraining order to suggest I need to stay at least 500 feet away from my ex?
Is there anything other than my job title to suggest that I work as a fact checker at the Washington Post?
Patricia Kayden
@Legalize: HA HA HA HA HA. He may puncture those lifeboats. Why should he go down alone? Let them all drown together.
I thought Romney was on vaction this weekend. I guess all this Bain talk has gotten so hot that he’ll have to forgo water skiing behind Ann for a few days.
jl
My evil heart goes pitty pat.
What the world needs now is another fake leave of absence + Am (I built my own coffin) pad!
TPM Editor’s Blog
Ghost of Leaves of Absence Past?
“… according to Marc B. Wolpow, a former Bain Capital executive. Wolpow and another Bain partner sat on Ampad’s board of directors and carried out the brutal downsizing that cost hundreds of workers their full-time jobs and benefits.
“Mitt’s employees executed that transaction. We carried out the business plan. He was CEO of the firm,” says Wolpow, a registered independent voter who now runs a private equity firm, Audax Group.
In 1994, Romney tried to distance himself from the Ampad controversy, since he was on a leave of absence during the initial downsizing. But Wolpow, who came to Bain in 1990 from Drexel Burnham, the infamous junk bond company, says: “I reported directly to Mitt Romney … You can’t be CEO of Bain Capital and say, ‘I really don’t know what my guys were doing.’ ”
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2012/07/ghost_of_leaves_of_absence_past.php
The reason for the fibbing back then was “I’m running for Senator, for Pete’s sake!”
BGinCHI
@Violet: All of the classical references and comparison’s are so fucked up I’m not even going to do a counter-reading.
Suffice to say that Aeneas and the others she mentions are not who she thinks they were. Which goes for that moral midget Paterno as well.
If your hero is a fucking football coach then you need to get a life, because you don’t have one.
Comrade Mary
@barath:
You rang?
And …
The laughter. The laughter. I will die of it.
Villago Delenda Est
@Violet:
The vile bint also makes a comment that others who don’t have a scintilla of the accomplishments of JoPa are, basically, envious.
I do not envy his accomplishment of enabling a sexual predator of children for decades.
redshirt
This has been so much fun these last few days. Thanks all! Let’s hope the good times keep rolling.
Martin
@jwb:
Within the GOP – that would pass muster with the base – and would sign on? Yeah, I think it is.
Any sane political team would be screaming at Mittens to do the opposite of what he does half the time. They don’t need this failure on their resume. Better to work for some Congressional race that stands a chance – or that will at least lose with dignity. And how many respectable advisors on healthcare and the economy are willing to sign on to Mitt’s messaging here? And the base has already drummed out a few members of his team for being too ghey/liberal/etc.
The GOP believes their own propaganda – that workers have no free will. You exclude too many of them, and there won’t be enough willing to work for you.
Violet
@barath: The media smells panic at this point. If they sense that panic is hiding a scandal, they’ll be all over it. Ratings.
Republicans don’t like Romney already. Rupert Murdoch doesn’t like Romney. They don’t want him to be their candidate but they’re stuck with him. If they can see that he’d going to be a drag on their own elections, there will be a move to get rid of him. The media will jump on this and the “Scandal may undo Mitt’s candidacy” story will be off an running. With the convention only weeks away, there is a chance for this scandal/story to be the next big thing. The media will see this shortly, if they haven’t already.
scav
@BGinCHI: Oh yes, the true tragic victim in the whole mess was indeed the moral giant Renassance man of JP. That complete lack of any thought given or compassion for children list just clicked up another enabler. And the tone just reeked hanging out the SUV door and insisting to be directed to the VIP / USP (Uniquely Sensitive Person) parking.
ETA: Although, if she could have thought about it a bit, perhaps the heavy reliance on the whole Greek tragedy aspect of it might not have contributed what she hoped to a apologia for the coverup of of pederasty.
Comrade Mary
@JGabriel:
OMFG! Romney is Hex!
Villago Delenda Est
@JGabriel:
OK, the intertubes need to be delivered to you. FedEx Air or FedEx ground?
pseudonymous in nc
@JGabriel:
So, not live on the cablenewsers? Hmm.
David Koch
I loved Welcome Back Kotter.
Especially cranky old Woodman
barath
@Comrade Mary:
Yeah…Rendell. And I’m sure we’ll get an equivocating statement from Bill Clinton soon enough about how Bain and Romney did good things for the country and how we should give him the benefit of the doubt.
I think these media cycles tend to run on the order of a few weeks to a month, so by mid August let’s see if the media hasn’t turned around and gone after President Obama for something nonsensical and unrelated to Bain.
Tonal Crow
@EconWatcher:
Yes. When a company lists a person as “President and CEO” on SEC filings, an investor may reasonably conclude that that person is personally running the company. If it turns out that that person is only a titular leader, the company has deceived the investor on a material fact. That’s securities fraud, which can constitute both a civil tort and a criminal offense. Further, it’s almost certainly a material misrepresentation for purposes of 18 USC 1001, the general federal false-statements statute.
So Mr. Kessler, are you trying to tell us that Mitt Romney committed securities fraud? And violated 18 USC 1001?
trollhattan
@Martin:
The parallels with Meg Whitman’s campaign keep coming–I’m expecting an “illegal” housekeeper and a corporate shoving incident to emerge any time.
Both had to lurch far right to snag the nom and both had/are having a devil of a time keeping a grip on the inverted etch-a-sketch.
The only major difference I can discern is that Willard’s more of a mooch and is probably not spending a nickle of his own money. He has boys to raise, for Pete sakes.
redshirt
So glad Obama is in charge. These Rendell clowns used to call the shots and look where it got us? Under heel.
Feels good to fight back and be on the offensive.
EconWatcher
The more I think about it, the more I like this little scandal: Romney not only flip flops on political issues, he flip flops on sworn factual statements made under penalty of perjury. Yes, this’ll do just fine.
Redshift
@gvg:
On his (actual) “retirement” from Bain, Romney was given a deal that gives him a share of the profits, continuing to this day. In addition to what others have pointed out about the “$100K or more” category, I very much doubt that salary was his only compensation, though the profits may have been deferred so they didn’t show up in politically inconvenient records at the time.
Violet
@barath: Bill Clinton was on the Today Show this morning and he did no such thing.
barath
@Violet:
I agree with you, but only in the short term. I could see the media setting this up for a make-or-break moment for Romney at the convention, and will frame whatever bland speech he gives as a comeback kid moment, putting the horserace narrative back in play.
BGinCHI
@scav: Exactamundo, as Juan Epstein might say.
Maude
More proof that Romney is stupid.
This isn’t a PR problem he can talk away.
He could be in serious trouble and it’s his bad luck to be running against Obama.
He is making a huge mistake.
Someone in his campaign should take away his shovel. He’s going down a sink hole.
Such fun.
danimal
@barath: Prediction: Early next week, a child will fall in a well, or a beautiful blonde coed will turn up missing, or some other distraction will require 24/7 attention from FoxNews.
It won’t be an accident. If they can’t change minds, they can always change the subject.
barath
@Violet:
I saw the transcript of Clinton today, and he was surprisingly restrained. Let’s see where it goes, though.
Violet
@barath: Could be. I don’t know how it’ll play out. But if Romney’s wounded, other Republicans may want him out of there. A guy who’s facing a felony charge as a presidential candidate. Not such a good idea to have long coattails.
BGinCHI
@danimal: They should just drop the cast of Fox & Friends down a well and then throw a microphone in.
Martin
@Patricia Kayden:
So Countess Ann Romney is also a Class 3 yacht?
I hadn’t considered that Futurama might have been based on actual people.
Tonal Crow
@Prometheus Shrugged:
Look up “forfeiture” and get back to me.
JPL
CNN will air the interview at six. The other networks do not mention it on their internet page.
Villago Delenda Est
@Martin:
The capper will be a meth addled rent boy in a condo someplace in the Caymans.
Violet
@danimal: They can change the subject, but if the other networks are pursuing this story, they’ll look stupid being the only one ignoring it. Just depends how it goes.
danimal
@BGinCHI: Worthwhile even without the microphone.
Villago Delenda Est
@BGinCHI:
“Throw the fools down the well, so my country can be free!”
BGinCHI
@danimal: The poor well though!
trollhattan
@BGinCHI:
Why do you hate groundwater?
BGinCHI
@trollhattan: GMTA.
Redshift
@Martin: There have been reports from inside the campaign that Mittens surrounds himself with yes-men, and will not tolerate anything else. I agree that no sane political team would work under conditions where they’ll be fired if their expertise contradicts what the boss already thinks, but I disagree that it will hurt their reputations much. Remember, Bob Shrum kept getting hired for years, even with the string of losing campaigns he had on his resume, and this is one area where it doesn’t seem to be only Democrats who screw up like that.
And if it really is the candidate who is the problem, then it may be easier (and actually honest) to shake it off. If they want to get hired, they won’t tell tales on the record, but if they have the connections, they can get to the interview state where they can quietly say “here was my plan; he ignored it.”
The Moar You Know
Despite the sputtering of our token Republican (SteveinDC) there are certain legal requirements to holding the position of CEO, and those requirements can’t be shuffled off to someone else on a part-time basis while you take a vacation, or dismissed because you’re “saving the Olympics”.
Those obligations are on you 24/7 until you quit and not one second before. If Romney signed SEC materials in (whatever year) in the capacity as Bain’s CEO, he was Bain’s CEO, period, end of story.
And none of this would matter except he’s decided to lie about it, just like with every other fucking thing that’s ever come out about the guy. Christ, I knew a for real, clinically diagnosed pathological liar in high school, and that guy lied less than Romney does. What a fucking mess the GOP have bought themselves.
Martin
@trollhattan: Yeah, Whitman was just an epic trainwreck of a campaign. I’m glad they’re pushing Biden out there – Jerry was very effective knocking her shit down (and I particularly enjoyed his swearing during the debates) and Biden has the same sort of temperament and charm.
But best of all, Whitmans money eventually worked against her. The ads revealed more about her than they did about Brown. I suspect the same will hold true this cycle with Romney – once the fully weight of them descends on us.
Turgidson
@Violet:
Being the political animal he is, I think Bill Clinton is sensing that the Obama team is readying the roundhouse that is going to knock Romney to the mat, perhaps permanently. So he might know better than to undermine the message now.
I think he realizes his earlier mealy-mouthed “Romney/Bain’s not thaaat bad” comments look silly now that it’s obvious Team Romney has an unbelievably fragile glass jaw on the issue.
Violet
@Turgidson: Clinton essentially said something like “The voters are smart enough to make their own decisions. But they don’t have all the information. Why won’t Romney release his tax returns?” I’m paraphrasing, but that was basically it.
Jebediah
@Violet:
When do we star seeing “Republicans in disarray” over and over?
I am looking forward to the Gooper convention.
Redshift
@Maude:
It’s worse than that. Think back to the primaries, or when he was running in 2008. Romney, in true alpha-CEO fashion, believed that he could just avoid talking about all of this all the way through the election. It’s like his open declaration in an interview that he wouldn’t tell us what he was going to do as president because “you might not vote for me.”
It’s really a corporate mindset — as long as you’re succeeding, no one will really dig into the details, and you can get away with blatant lies, and even contradictory sworn statements. But while you have competitors in the corporate world, they’re other corporations competing against your corporation. It’s not another guy competing against you. There can be opposition research, but it’s about the business, not about you. The times when it’s advantageous for a competing business to dig up and spread damaging information about another CEO are few and far between.
Romney really has tried to run his campaign like a business, and it doesn’t work any more than running government like a business does. I’m honestly not sure he’s able to understand why it fails, when his entire background tells him it should be working.
chuck butcher
Something to remember about FauxNews – their job is much easier from the opposition than it is in the position of support of the government. From a business perspective, who Murdoch wants in charge may be a real question – short of insulting the GOPerloons in coverage.
As for the other networks – one could look at their ownership to think about their ‘loyalties.’
If Mittens were to get pushed I think the chances of a miscue are pretty high – the question is about the pushed part. Media competition may also be rather over-rated.
Spatula
Why doesn’t Mitt just say “let’s look forward, not back?”
How could Obama disagree with THAT?
Redshift
@Violet: Yeah, I think this is building up into a month-long “there’s a lot we don’t know because he hasn’t released his tax returns,” cresting around convention time.
Martin
@Redshift: Yeah, I don’t think losing to an incumbent and still quite popular president is much of a tick on your resume. I suspect more that the staffers look at Mitt and say ‘this is a losing effort’ and instead are working Senate and House races.
Violet
@Jebediah: I think the tide is beginning to turn. The interviews on all the networks today is an indication that the Romney camp is panicking. If he flubs the interviews, or commits a significant gaffe, or outright lies, then we may see other Republicans take a step back. They’re protecting their own backs and won’t have Romney’s if he’s damaged.
rikyrah
@beltane:
CANNOT BE REPEATED ENOUGH.
It was AT LEAST 100K
sacrablue
@cckids: Yes, but is that $250,000 a penalty or a tax?
Rafer Janders
Mitt Romney: Vote for me for president, because the last time I was president of anything, I had absolutely no responsibility.
trollhattan
In the meantime, cue “Magic Bus.”
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entries/romney-bus-circling-but-not-honking-at-obama?ref=fpblg
Sans honking for the moment. He’s just a big ol’ kid, our Willardbot 2.0.
What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us? (formerly MarkJ)
@BGinCHI: Now he’s telling the exact same fib while running for president. He obviously has a learning disability. If it failed the first time why did he think it would work this time around?
catclub
Does anybody think the market is responding to the Romney news?
Tonal Crow
Republicans are now asking themselves whether Romney is a tax or only a penalty.
Tag: Romney lied about Bain.
Violet
@catclub: I wondered what the market might be responding too. The news always seems bad.
catclub
@Redshift: “Yeah, I think this is building up into a month-long “there’s a lot we don’t know because he hasn’t released his tax returns,” cresting around convention time.”
This makes me want to say: _THIS_ is how you vet an opponent’s birth certificate!
Do not gamble for money against B. Obama
JGabriel
__
__
chuck butcher:
Is it, though?
I mean, I don’t remember it looking that difficult for them circa 2000-2006, a period they pretty much split evenly between the two modes of gloating and terror-mongering.
.
trollhattan
@Tonal Crow:
.
Isn’t it spelled “Tagg”?
JGabriel
__
__
300!
No, wait, let’s try that again.
catclub
@Violet: I was kidding of course. The standard is to say it responding to something which happens to be good news for John McCain.
My explanation: after a week of somewhat down, an up day.
remember when Harpo Marx got a telegram? “No message!”
Jewish Steel
@Tonal Crow:
That made me laugh.
Also too: In your face, @JGabriel:
Violet
@catclub: I was kidding too. Sorry if unclear. I did check Google Finance and the market’s up 200 points and the top three headlines are:
JPMorgan traders may have hidden derivatives losses |
Peregrine CEO Arrested
China Slows Despite Aggressive Stimulus
None of that looks like it should send the market up.
JGabriel
__
__
Jewish Steel:
300!
Damn, I missed it again?
Sigh. I never get to defend Sparta.
.
What Have The Romans Ever Done for Us? (formerly MarkJ)
No way Romney doesn’t come away looking testy and evasive int these interviews. He can’t even handle FOX news softballs without coming off that way. Unless the press gives him a full pass, he’ll screw up in at least one of them.
What gets me is everyone is focussed on the CEO and whether he was active in that capacity or not. To me, it comes down to the fact that he was still listed as sole owner. That means he stood to make or lose fortunes based on the company’s decisions, management, and investments. Does anyone really believe Mitt Romney would stand idly by and take no interest with large portions of his own money on the line? I mean, he’s gone to great lengths to avoid paying taxes on that money by putting it in offshore tax havens, but we’re to believe he didn’t care about the decisions that lead to it being made in the first place? I call bullshit.
scav
@Violet: But the thunder was on the left when the eagle sneezed and my chicken guts made the picture of Rubix Cube, so transportation futures should be up.
daverave
More good news for Mr. Get-Off-My-Lawn:
“On Friday, the Romney campaign made some changes. It hired Danny Diaz, a GOP operative who previously worked for John McCain and the Republican National Committee, to handle rapid response with the news media.”
BGinCHI
I predict Romney will admit everything and ask America for a bailout.
ETA: He’s too big to fail.
David Koch
@Violet:
This
General Stuck
Jus more rats on a sinking ship
chuck butcher
@JGabriel:
Don’t forget just how into the BushCo pocket the rest of the media was 00-06 or who the FN’s targets were, especially 06 on.
Fear works petty good on the rubes, gloating not so much. I’d guess that the best business result for FN is a split government so they’ve got angels and devils to play off and the rest of us fucked.
Rafer Janders
@General Stuck:
What? Now he’s in-sourcing? Make up your mind, Mitt!
Tonal Crow
Beware the Bain-time talk, my Mitt:
Those lies can bite;
Those laws can catch!
Beware the interview,
And shun the media question-match!
scav
@Rafer Janders: It’s his post-dated barndoor-closing team.
dmsilev
Via a dkos diary, new ad from Obama. Let’s just say his team isn’t pulling their punches:
Turgidson
@dmsilev:
As I’ve said about 17 times since yesterday, it’s just so awesome to have the pros on our side this time. The O team is on fire lately.
tybee
@JGabriel:
doctor memory? doctor memory, memory, memory…..
cckids
@SFAW:
I keep hearing that he “saved” the Olympics, but I can’t help but believe that he couldn’t have done it in any state but Utah, where he could recruit/strongarm a minor army of Mormon functionaries to do his bidding. Put him in a neutral state & he’d have had a much harder time getting things done.
kerFuFFler
From a thread elsewhere:
“Set aside completely whether Romney was active at Bain. Assume he wasn’t. That’s his claim.
But he’s not listed as a consultant or emeritus at Bain 99-2002. Not even as President. He’s Chairman, CEO and SOLE STOCKHOLDER! He’s everything.
This is his central claim. Run things. Business experience. Been a “real” President in what matters, the private economy, not some silly country.
Yet his best claim at being completely in charge is that he did nothing at all? That he retained all of the authority and bears absolutely none of the responsibility?
This is Romney’s definition of leadership?
Sadly, it is, and it’s easy to accept because it fits his narrative. The very BEST scenario he can spin is that he thinks being in absolute charge means accepting absolutely no responsibility.
We no longer have to guess what kind of Chief Executive he would make.”
SFAW
@cckids:
Don’t forget the infusion of cash from Teh Great Satan, a/k/a US Government.
Go GALT!
SFAW
@tybee:
Clone me?
Tonal Crow
@kerFuFFler: Well said. At best he’d be like a greedy, responsibility-shirking 5-year-old as President. At best.
JPL
@kerFuFFler: According to Josh..Crawford interviewed him and he is owed an apology.
JPL
Romney..no more tax returns..
cckids
@The Moar You Know:
This is especially true if he signed any of them after Sarbanes-Oxley. That added teeth & specified consequences to being a CEO, after the Enron fiasco.
pseudonymous in nc
So, the Rmoney tactic this evening is poutrage?
That’s going to go down like a trailer of shit.
Nick
Um, I’m kind of confused. I haven’t actually thought a whole lot of this stuff. It just didn’t seem to me like it was going to go anywhere politically. We could have a big argument about whether saying that he had left was a lie if he had a some kind of symbolic role and blah blah blah. We can have an argument about how symbolic a CEO role can be while fulfilling the legal SEC definition. It just didn’t seem like a huge winner to me.
But this:
But how is filing an SEC report not “an active role” in a legal sense? I mean…it’s a legal document. How is he not guilty of perjury in that 2011 disclosure? No statute of limitations to worry about there.
Tonal Crow
@pseudonymous in nc:
No problem. We’ll just pull off the highway, hose him down, and get right back on. Oh, wait, that’s only for dogs that Mitt’s strapped to the top of his car.
cckids
@sacrablue: Ha.
It’s a big fu*king fine, one designed to make you think hard & be accurate in your filings. Of course, for Rmoney, it’s no big deal, maybe he can’t buy another horse that year, but no skin off his nose.
Tonal Crow
Romney’s gonna need one hell of a lot of dressage this weekend.
Xenos
If Sully has latched onto this, will it be a Newsweek cover?
There are not a lot of things that force other media sources to at least acknowledge an issue, but a Time or Newsweek cover story can often do it.
burnspbesq
DeLong nails it in one sentence.
Joel
@Prometheus Shrugged: Yes, you would be responsible. Let’s use another example. You lend your car to a friend, who promptly gets in an accident. Guess who is responsible for the liabilities? Go ahead, you can look it up.
Joel
@Prometheus Shrugged: Yes, you would be responsible. Let’s use another example. You lend your car to a friend, who promptly gets in an accident. Guess who is responsible for the liabilities? Go ahead, you can look it up.
SoINeedAName48
Sullivan has not only covered this story in excruciating detail that should be admired by “journalists” out there, but …
He has covered himself in glory by so doing!
El Cid
@burnspbesq: Republicans should not be held to the same standards as liberals, who are still responsible for the crimes of ACORN even when there is no ACORN which exists years after it was dissolved and even though there were no crimes in the 1st place.