So you walked back in through a bolted door and did it all again

Count me out of all the “oh noes, we shouldn’t have tried to recall Scott Walker” bullshit. Every time Republicans try some crazy shit — shutting down the government, impeaching Clinton, etc. — we hear about how they learned their lesson and they’ll never try it again. Then, of course, as soon as they get their chance, they try again. Sure, they didn’t shut down the government this time, but they came awfully close. There were few if any repercussions for impeachment and the government shut downs (they held on to Congress through it all) and there were none for the recent near shutdown.

They say to be a great shooter in basketball, you have to have no conscience. You missed your last ten shots, who cares, you take another, because you know you’re a good shooter. Likewise, an effective political movement should have no conscience. The last crazy shit you tried didn’t work, just start planning the next caper.

Wisconsin Democrats took a pretty good run at Walker. They came up short, but that’s the way it goes sometimes. Maybe recall elections are a trickier vehicle than we thought.

Doesn’t mean it’s time to retreat back into Vichy mode.






181 replies
  1. 1
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    Sure, but next time don’t run the guy who just lost to the incumbent out of party fee fees.

  2. 2
    Valdivia says:

    I saw someone saying yesterday it was a waste of democratic resources. I actually think it wasn’t. The other side had to spend 10 times as much as we did just to get the same result as last time. Maybe I am crazy but I think it’s amazing that it took all of that money to keep their guy afloat.

  3. 3
    Dave says:

    Exit polling showed about 60% of voters felt the recall should only be used for official misconduct. I have to say, I don’t exactly disagree with that. Walker is a dickbag of the first degree, but recalling him because of policy…why fucking have elections then?

    It’s a shame the John Doe investigation didn’t start six months earlier. Then I think you’d have seen Walker slammed last night for that very reason – misconduct.

  4. 4
    Forum Transmitted Disease says:

    Still don’t get the breastbeating. We got the WI Senate back, ergo we won.

  5. 5
    Mike Goetz says:

    Dems don’t need to be Vichy, but they need to be smart. This recall thing was a dumb idea and bungled every which way.

  6. 6
    Poopyman says:

    Wisconsin Democrats took a pretty good run at Walker. They came up short, but that’s the way it goes sometimes.

    Not so fast. In my email this morning:

    Last night was a tough night for us in Wisconsin. After being outspent 8 to 1 by Scott Walker and the billionaire Koch brothers, we lost the gubernatorial recall.
    __
    But what the national media is not telling you is: I am the new Democratic Senate Majority Leader after winning an important Senate recall election by just hundreds of votes.
    __
    Starting today, Senate Democrats will be a strong check on Scott Walker’s power. If Walker tries to pass extreme policies that bust unions, hurt women, or attack middle-class families, we will have one word for him: No. We will demand laws that benefit the middle class and start repairing our state.
    __
    PCCC members have stood with us in Wisconsin every step of the way.
    __
    The donations you made to the Wisconsin Democratic Party and Wisconsin Senate Democrats directly helped get out the vote that fueled last night’s Senate win.
    __
    From the bottom of my heart, I want to say thank you. Despite the disappointment in the governor’s race, your efforts helped us achieve victory and restore balance in our state.
    __
    I look forward to working as partners with bold progressive activists in the days, months, and years ahead.
    __
    Solidarity,
    __
    Mark Miller, incoming Wisconsin Senate Majority Leader

    I think that’s as important as removing Walker.

  7. 7
    Lev says:

    I agree completely. The point I made on my blog is that labor did make the mistake of doing this without having a candidate ready to go, so Barrett–who is no labor friend–effectively hijacked the election and made it about him vs. Walker rather than Walker vs. individual rights. You can say that it was a blow to labor, but that presupposes that that issue was what was being debated in the recall election (as opposed to the recall drive). So far as I could tell, Barrett was practically dismissive of the whole thing. “Civil war” my ass.

  8. 8
    redshirt says:

    I’m seeing LOTS of references to the Kochs in a variety of mediums this morning, and it heartens me. We need to expose these rartfucks to the light so folks MIGHT get a clue what’s really going on.

  9. 9
    beltane says:

    Flipping the state senate may not be as glamorous or cathartic but it will surely have major implications at the policy level.

  10. 10
    rikyrah says:

    I agree with you. Why you gotta roll over. No, you take the fight to them, which is what they did.

  11. 11
    Dave says:

    No conscience?? Gasp! Moore Award!

  12. 12
    Mino says:

    Ezra and others are starting to promote the idea that Republicans are too dangerous to be in the minority. That they will crash the car to keep the wheel. They’re gonna crash that car anyway, folks. Shock doctorin ahead IS the plan.

  13. 13
  14. 14
    Martin says:

    Recalls are hard. They’re supposed to be hard. But if the petitions are there – if enough voters feel that the election was a mistake, you do it.

  15. 15
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    So how does it go in the next two years?

    Once the passion wears down in three to six months it’s back to “Governor Walker; idiot” He was in the dumps poll wise before the various recalls. By then he will be a “that idiot, who sucks so much he was recalled” I sense lame duck with no second term. Even if things go well for Wisconsin I see no long term wub for Walker.

    If the John Doe has teeth then the Left gets to tell everyone “told you so” and the potential for tearing down the Wisconsin GOP is there.

    Also, how much more vile could Walker behave without being so blatant it lands him in court?

    Personal wet dream; Romney taps Walker for VP.

  16. 16
    Keith says:

    Amen.

  17. 17
    The Snarxist Formerly Known As Kryptik says:

    I don’t think the recall shouldn’t have been done. It should’ve by all rights because Walker is a toxic little fucking nugget.

    I just find myself despondent over the fact that it seemed like a failed venture from the start and that it’s gonna end up leading to stupid fucking momentum both electorally for the GOP and for people to cheer on the absolute annihilation of Unions elsewhere.

    US Politics punishes good things, and now the people seem to loathe Unions and Liberals even more, because failure breeds contempt.

  18. 18
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    The GOP is the white man’s party, in a white majority country. So they are basically the default leaders, until they over reach so far that it even makes Aunt Millie Whitehead of the Kansas Church of the Pentecost, wince, and throw up the bloody towel to ratchet down the cretinous wingnuttery.

    The good news is the color of America is changing toward the darker hued, and more women are putting the goopers in their rear view mirrors, especially if they are single. You can already see it in some of the SW, and also too, in other regions of the country.

    The majority favored white party has two choices, either moderate their hateful policies of power and control, or forsake democracy all together. The jury is out on that turn.

  19. 19
    Riilism says:

    Que sera. Would have been nice to get rid of Walker, but thems the breaks (hopefully an indictment of Walker will be breaking soon). But, the Dems got the WI Senate, which is very cool and makes up significantly for losing Walker’s recall. Plus, got the Repubs to spend 30 mil defending the turd…

  20. 20
    Mino says:

    @Joey Maloney: Sad to hear that. A cultural treasure, he was. He put poetry into SciFi.

  21. 21
    The Bearded Blogger says:

    Oh, it was a victory; new people got engaged, Walker sweated, a state senate seat was one and Koch had to spend an unplanned for buttload of money.

    Fight all the time, don’t give an inch

  22. 22
    Martin says:

    @Mino:

    Ezra and others are starting to promote the idea that Republicans are too dangerous to be in the minority.

    They aren’t promoting the idea. They’re warning us that the GOP is basically running on an extortion platform: “We’re going to burn this house down unless you give us what we want, and then we’ll consider not burning the house down.” And reminding use that extortion is somewhat effective, so don’t underestimate it.

  23. 23
    Redshift says:

    I’m not much for celebrating moral victories (and we did have an actual victory), but one thing to keep in mind is that beating incumbents is always hard. Running against an incumbent shouldn’t be measured as just an even-up two man contest. The fact that they spent at least 6-7 times as much as we did, and had the advantage of incumbency and anti-recall sentiment, and still only got about the same result as they did in the previous open race, that’s actually a pretty good sign.

  24. 24
    taylormattd says:

    What a ridiculous post.

    all the “oh noes, we shouldn’t have tried to recall Scott Walker” bullshit

    Doesn’t mean it’s time to retreat back into Vichy mode.

    How goes the glorious battle against straw?

  25. 25
    Rhoda says:

    @Mino: When did he become so God damn simple?

  26. 26
    Jim, Foolish Literalist says:

    Maybe recall elections are a trickier vehicle than we thought.

    Certainly trickier than I thought. One more reminder that we– issue-driven progressives who are willing to see Republicans for what they are and fight them on their own terms–are a small minority of the electorate. I tend to think we are 10% of the electorate, are opposite numbers on the right are the 27% who never gave up on Bush and the IRaq War. Again and again I keep coming back to the parallels between CT in ’06 and WI in ’12: People who are broadly inclined to be on ‘our side’ seem to be looking for an excuse to vote for the status quo, to be polite and high-minded. What Josh Marshall once said about self-styled liberal Beltway pundits, that they are vaguely embarrassed that there are people who actually care about issues, has broader application than I’ve been inclined to think.

  27. 27
    Jewish Steel says:

    The only way we are going to heal the rifts that are tearing this country apart is we put aside partisan rancor and come together to…HAHAHA! Fuck that!

    Come at me, bro.

  28. 28
    Metrosexual Black AbeJ says:

    @taylormattd:

    I didn’t say “there are those who say we should go back into Vichy mode”, did I? I think it’s in the air, though, in establishment media, that this shows that the hippies need to cut their hair and start going to church. That’s what I’m responding to.

  29. 29
    MikeJake says:

    I bet if the only choice Ohio had was to recall Kasich, instead of putting his shitty legislation up for a vote, it likely wouldn’t have turned out well either.

  30. 30
    dp says:

    Best post of the aftermath.

  31. 31
    beltane says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse: We are witnessing the slow but inexorable transition of the white Republican base as they move from hateful majority to hated minority. It is quite easily to imagine some demagogue fifty years from now making political hay by scapegoating those people who now consider themselves “real Americans”.

  32. 32
    Redshift says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Some idjit Republican “strategist” on NPR yesterday was talking about how if Walker won, he’d be a star at the GOP convention, and if Romney loses, the top contender for 2016.

    I’m experiencing extreme cognitive dissonance over that.

  33. 33
    Steve in DC says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse:

    That doesn’t mean SHIT unless we get rid of the “socially liberal fiscally conservative” mother fuckers running the party. Who is the top 2016 guy, Cuomo! AKA hates unions, fucks workers, fucks the poor, and then panders to rich white liberals by legalizing gay marriage.

    Um…. yeah! Social liberalism for all, poverty for all! Go Democrats go neo liberalism!

    Sorry but count me the fuck out. Maybe if we make rich white liberals gay sons and pregnant daughters the victims of the church they will give a crap about the rest of us. Short of us making them cry and burn, I don’t see a chance.

    So sure, we will have the majority, socially liberal policies will pass, social security will go away, medicare will go away, centrism for all…. go go Democrats.

    Again, count me out. Let’s watch the bodies pile and then come back and negotiate with our leaders. 200 bucks says the first Wall Street asshole who’s daughter gets raped by a poor man and dies later in a back alley abortion rethinks his tax situations, till then he won’t.

    BLOOD! That’s what we need, and that’s the only thing they will understand. Lords of the houses, heads on pikes, daughters of the houses, raped. Dogs of the houses eaten. Sons of the houses, flayed and beheaded. Short of that, we are done.

  34. 34
    AliceBlue says:

    I hope people who voted for Walker get everything they voted for. That goes double for people who didn’t like Walker but voted for him anyway because their panties were in a wad over the recall.

    I didn’t know the Dems had taken the senate; woo hoo!

  35. 35
    Brachiator says:

    Wisconsin Democrats took a pretty good run at Walker. They came up short, but that’s the way it goes sometimes. Maybe recall elections are a trickier vehicle than we thought.
    __
    Doesn’t mean it’s time to retreat back into Vichy mode.

    Absolutely agree. I simply do not understand this bullshit about recall elections being fair and proper.

    I remember back during the California recall election, when all the Very serious LA Times political columnists were patiently explaining to the ignorant masses that they were dopes for wanting to recall Governor Davis, and that they had an obligation to let him serve out his term, because earier voters had already spoken.

    But not matter what anyone thought about Davis or the Guvernator who displaced him, the plain historical fact was that an earlier generation of California voters specifically built the recall mechanism into state government, because they were reacting to a recalcitrant state government that refused to do its fucking duty to the voters and were all in with special interests.

    But aside from history, there are examples of propositions passing (or failing), or laws passed regarding such issues as gay marriage, etc., and the voters immediately turning around and trying to repeal the measure. There is little consensus here that an earlier vote is the final answer.

    So what’s the freaking difference with a recall, especially when an elected governor uses his office to try to dismantle settled law without the consent of the voters?

    The notion that voters somehow belong to elected officials, and must passively endure them until the next election cycle is nonsense, unless the people of Wisconsin wish to dismantle the recall mechanism.

  36. 36
    Martin says:

    @Riilism:

    Plus, got the Repubs to spend 30 mil defending the turd…

    That’s a few days profits out of the Koch Bros. – money they got from you and me.

    Bleeding the opposition dry was a viable strategy pre-Citizens. But now it only works against Dems.

  37. 37
    Forum Transmitted Disease says:

    @Poopyman:
    @Riilism:

    You guys nailed it. Seriously, what is wrong with people? WE GOT THE WI SENATE BACK. Walker is DONE. He can keep the governor’s seat warm for the next year and a half, but that’s all he can do.

  38. 38
    Mino says:

    @Martin: @Rhoda: Oh, no? When he says Romney is our best bet for government stimulus, that Romney is probably the only one who can move the House? I read that fucking essay of his.

  39. 39
    Spectre says:

    @Poopyman:

    The Senate won’t even be in session until November, at which time the Republicans will regain control due to freshly gerrymandered districts.

  40. 40
    Forum Transmitted Disease says:

    Again, count me out.

    @Steve in DC: From what? You’re a Republican. You’ve admitted as much many times on this blog.

  41. 41
    Sanjuro says:

    Making the Repubs and their enablers burn 30 million that most likely would have gone to ads against Obama has still got to put a dent in their war chest.

  42. 42
    Patricia Kayden says:

    I have to disagree with AbeJ. Why waste the energy, resources, time and $$$ in trying to recall a governor who was elected less than 2 years ago? Now Walker and Repubs across the country feel empowered to go harder with their extremism. I don’t read Rightwing blogs or watch Faux News, but I can just imagine how much they are crowing about this.

    Did Dems at least win one of the Senate seats?

  43. 43
    Steve in DC says:

    @Martin:

    You mean pre Clinton, let’s not forget his hand in building the profits of the 1%.

    The Republicans are worse, but that means crap until the traitors among us are dead and buried.

  44. 44
    PGFan says:

    After the first round of recalls there was a lot of doubt about pursuing this one. At that time I remember feeling that it didn’t matter whether we won or lost this round, what mattered was that the entire process would mean that Walker would be diverted, with his energies focused on surviving the recall rather than imposing the Koch agenda. Ditto the reps that would be recalled – they would have to spend time raising money and campaigning rather than “legislating”.

    The repubs relentlessly harass. They are terminators. They regroup and continue on. This is when we are all weakest — exhaustion and disappointment are demoralizing. But we have to find ways to learn any lessons that can be extracted, regroup, and carry on.

    The key is not to give them a break. Not to let them regroup. Start with the DOJ investigation. Blanket Wisconsin with info about Walker’s likely criminal conduct. Investigate the Fitzgeralds. Counter Walker lies with facts, and with stories about real people. Attack this horrifying politics of envy that has taken hold — people wanting to make others worse rather than people wanting to make things better for everyone. That is what the repubs have successfully sowed (sown?). Insidious ugliness and selfishness that needs to be shown for what it is. Go to work on whatever right wing hate jockeys fill the airwaves with all this venom. Find out what churches are preaching hate and let everyone know about them.

    Lose the battle but win the war.

  45. 45
    SatanicPanic says:

    Do even CRAZIER stuff next time. If they have a money advantage, then we need to make them spend it on stupid stuff like this.

  46. 46
    Jebediah says:

    @Mino:

    Ezra and others are starting to promote the idea that Republicans are too dangerous to be in the minority.

    For fuck sake – if they are “too dangerous to be in the minority” then they are too dangerous to be in government AT ALL.

  47. 47
    Egypt Steve says:

    The recall could have been handled better, sure. But it made Walker suffer, and it also made his puppet-masters piss away a few mill that they won’t be able to spend on Romney. If we can’t out-raise ’em, we might as well come up with lots and lots of ways to make them spend it on shit that they would have had anyway.

  48. 48
    Steve in DC says:

    @Forum Transmitted Disease:

    No, I’m not really, more of an old school style liberal and conservative in some ways.

    I’m an economic populist first, everything else second. And those who don’t place that first I don’t like. Social Wall Street liberals, fuck em.

    But that doesn’t make me a Republican.

    I view social liberals as republicans since they kept trading the New Deal away for social issues, and I’d like their heads just as much as the Bush’s!

  49. 49
    Spectre says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    Reminds me of the boxers that claimed to block punches with their face.

  50. 50
    stuckinred says:

    Fuck it and drive on.

  51. 51
  52. 52
    EGrise says:

    This, AbeJ, a thousand times this.

  53. 53
    Mino says:

    @Jebediah: You’ll get no argument from me on that.

  54. 54
    mds says:

    @Martin:

    Recalls are hard. They’re supposed to be hard. But if the petitions are there – if enough voters feel that the election was a mistake, you do it.

    Yeah, I’m not getting all the “That’s what elections are for” talk. This recall mechanism is in the Wisconsin state constitution, which didn’t simply appear by magic one day. The petition hurdle is a pretty substantial one, one which is a very directly democratic process. And if all that polling about reasons for the failure of this recall is actually true, there’s also a steep psychological hurdle that caused people to oppose this particular recall even while participating in the recall process. I don’t see how allowing the electorate to change their minds in between regular elections under special circumstances is somehow automatically an affront to representative democracy. (California’s system might be a bit too easy, but then again, how many times have they used it?)

    In closing, something something consent of the governed.

  55. 55
    Mike E says:

    Yeah, fuck this pseudo-war bullshit. Lets instead go all meta and explore our fee fees. Fight “smarter”! That’s the ticket.

  56. 56
    taylormattd says:

    @Metrosexual Black AbeJ: Oh. Ok. I guess maybe this right here: “Count me out” sounds like you are referring to a chorus of people on the left who are pushing this theme. Not really sure why any of us, let alone you, would ever heartily agree with a stupid meme pushed by a bunch of David Broder centrist type beltway douchebags.

  57. 57
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Steve in DC:

    BLOOD! That’s what we need, and that’s the only thing they will understand. Lords of the houses, heads on pikes, daughters of the houses, raped. Dogs of the houses eaten. Sons of the houses, flayed and beheaded. Short of that, we are done.

    Woot! Gitsum, gunny…

  58. 58
    Valdivia says:

    Got@Metrosexual Black AbeJ:

    That sounds like the lyrics of a song from Argentina about what it was like for young people when the Milicos (the military) started El Proceso (their Process of Clean Up, ie the dictatorhsip). The cutting of the hair thing was a big big deal with these types.

  59. 59
    Waldo says:

    @Jewish Steel:

    The only way we are going to heal the rifts that are tearing this country apart is we put aside partisan rancor and come together to…HAHAHA! Fuck that!

    Agreed. We fight them till they start talking happy bipartisan talk. And then we keep fighting them until we’re sure they mean it.

  60. 60
    satby says:

    OT, but maybe not when you remember Farenheit 451:

    Edit: And Joey Maloney got it first. What happened to my link?!? I did the linky thing…

  61. 61
    Steve in DC says:

    @Ben Franklin:

    I was in the military. In a way, I look back to so many of us coming back to no jobs.

    Labor rights used to be defined by violence, that’s how we won. Till it’s all labor, all the time, nothing else, and no holds bared, we will lose.

  62. 62
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Spectre: Where did we lose? We’re better off today than we were yesterday. I had this same stupid conversation with a Republican last year on Wisconsin. This idiot was trying to tell me we lost because we didn’t win as much as we hoped. Apparently expectations have some real world value that stuff like control of the state senate doesn’t. Morans.

  63. 63
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    I am all for election recalls, if all the hoops are jumped through to get them for a particular state. What I am not for, are sour grapes from those on the left, when they lose such an election.

    Elections, where by their nature, mandates that someone is going lose, and it could be their side that loses. And then pointing their bloody fingers at this or that reason for casting blame, beyond the real reason that voters in WI have the right to make up their own minds. And they did. They split the baby, leaving Walker as the previously duly elected governor, but sent him a message by handing the senate back to the dems.

    As an outsider, my disappointment that Walker remains remains, but is greatly tempered by the fact, that I am an outsider, for a state election for state office in a state that I don’t live in.

  64. 64
    Amanda in the South Bay says:

    I don’t get all the left wing angst over this. I always thought (especially during the Bush years) that having a system of government based on more progressive parliamentary systems (where you have votes of no confidence and so forth, and hence allow for more fluid governments) was a good thing. Quite frankly, I think our political system is sclerotic under the best of circumstances, and I’m all for adding more democracy to it.

  65. 65
    Randy P says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse:

    The GOP is the white man’s party, in a white majority country.

    They have a majority of the white males, I’ll grant you that. That’s the only possible explanation for Romney’s slight polling advantage among males.

    But they don’t have a very LARGE majority, and I believe it tends like Limbaugh’s demographics to be strongest among those 65+. So please don’t paint all white males with this brush.

    The kids are all right, including the white kids. Every year that brings a new crop of 18-year-olds into the voter ranks, also shows a significant shift toward the progressive position on any number of issues.

  66. 66
    Steve in DC says:

    And I’m being half a smart ass for those who can’t tell, but if someone wants to get the torches and pitchforks, sign me the fuck up!

  67. 67
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Steve in DC:

    Rhetorical, metaphorical violence will do until………..

  68. 68
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Brachiator: Totally agree. We don’t elect dictators on 4 year terms (though some people think we should). I imagine part of this is people see recalls as similar to impeachment, which is a different thing entirely.

  69. 69
    Steve in DC says:

    @Randy P:

    GOP has a majority among rich people and baby boomers with cash, aka white people.

    The DNC is another rich “white peoples party” but the sort of white people that get off on keeping their cash and donating it non whites and feeling like they are doing good.

  70. 70
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Steve in DC:

    btw; Heard from Zack the Marine?

  71. 71
    Steve in DC says:

    @Ben Franklin:

    Violence is not always the best solution but at times it is the only one.

    Till the Democrats throw everything but economic issues away, sign me up for the “don’t vote for them, and hope for the blood path” group.

  72. 72
    Steve in DC says:

    @Ben Franklin:

    Violence is not always the best solution but at times it is the only one.

    Till the Democrats throw everything but economic issues away, sign me up for the “don’t vote for them, and hope for the blood path” group.

  73. 73

    @Poopyman:
    I read only 800 votes?

    Any chance of the GOP stealing it in a recount?

    Isn’t WI the state with that one shadowy election official who always manages to find a few thousand GOP votes on her laptop, just when they are needed. (Or maybe that was OH).

    I’d be surprised if they didn’t at least try.

  74. 74
    LanceThruster says:

    I like how 51-49% is somehow a complete vindication of Walker, for which he conceitedly gave his thanks to Gawd for the victory.

  75. 75
    Jebediah says:

    @Mino:

    Yeah – and just to make totally clear, the “fuck sake” was not directed at you but at Ezra.

  76. 76
    Brachiator says:

    @Judas Escargot, Your Postmodern Neighbor:

    Isn’t WI the state with that one shadowy election official who always manages to find a few thousand GOP votes on her laptop, just when they are needed. (Or maybe that was OH).

    The margin is too wide and too much distributed across a wide range of voting areas for anything shady to be even a suggestion.

  77. 77
    beltane says:

    I did not click on the following link, and I don’t expect anyone else to, but just reading it made me laugh: http://www.nakedcapitalism.com.....ckage.html

    “Thanks to Obama American Left Lies in Smoldering Wreckage” by Matt Stoller. If Matt Stoller is the American Left we have far bigger problems than Obamasellingusout.

  78. 78
    SteveM says:

    Don’t let the fuckers and their useful idiots in the press frame the question as “Ooooh, is this even a legitimate tool of governance?” Fuck that — it’s a lawful process, you’ve cleared the hurdles the law set up for you, therefore it’s legit. You got a problem with that, take it up with the guys in handlebar mustaches who wrote the recall provisions into the law.

    That should have been the Democrats’ message anytime anyone questioned whether it was de trop to recall Scott Walker: You’re spitting on the graves of the great Wisconsinites who wrote this damn law!

  79. 79
    SatanicPanic says:

    @beltane: Matt Stoller-It’s hard to overstate how bad this is … it may be hard, but when Matt Stoller puts his mind to something, anything is possible

  80. 80
    Randy P says:

    @Steve in DC: I’m a baby boomer, I have cash. I’m not a Republican. Very few of my friends are Republican. I hang out a lot with Quakers, Unitarians and Episcopalians, who are overwhelmingly white and overwhelmingly not Republican (at least the ones I know). “White majority” does not equal “all white people”. That’s all I’m trying to say. So I find myself bristling at the concept of a “white people’s party”.

    On the other hand, maybe I should recuse myself as a data point because in most discussions I consider myself as “it’s complicated” rather than “white” (perhaps “non-black” would be a more accurate description). But I’ll throw in my wife and kids and as I said, practically everyone I know as white people who really, REALLY are not Republicans.

  81. 81
    Valdivia says:

    @beltane:

    ah! Stoller. I remember him blogging during the 2008 election. always a big fan of Obama. I see he hasn’t changed a bit.

  82. 82
    Spectre says:

    @SatanicPanic:

    You lost several high profile recall elections. You then gained 1 senate seat, which will be negated by Walker’s gerrymandered districts in November. In the meantime, the senate won’t be in session.

    Reactionary forces are now emboldened, workers demoralized, and now any direct action will be viewed as sour grapes.

    This was a terrible defeat of working people, in part due to placing their trust in a bunch of sellouts.

  83. 83
    Todd says:

    Everyone seeking a meta on this is screwing up.

    The real meta is this – the conservatives/glibertarians won last night, and they won big. Don’t expect self-reflection or restraint on their part.

    Pay close attention to this, because I’m going to state it in capital letters – THEY DON’T CARE ABOUT SUCCESS IN GOVERNING, POSITIVE OUTCOMES TO THEIR METHODS, OR MAKING PEOPLE’S LIVES BETTER, THEY JUST WANT TO HAVE THEIR WAY. If you have spent the last 10 years in a closed system, talking only to people who agree with you, then success is in getting that reinforced system set into place, regardless of the product of that system. This is why causing widespread pain never bothered them, why they were able to pivot effortlessly from actively thwarting civil rights to claiming that the effort to quash systemic racial oppression stymied their freedom to be assholes.

    As a straight guy with some white trash chops, I guess I’ll do OK in the era of Romney, so long as I can do proper mea culpas on my unfortunate drift into liberalism. I’ll need it, since I’m unfortunately just under 55. I will predict a retreat on gay issues, much to the consternation of Sullivan and Greenwald, and will probably get to see my next liberal administration sometime in my 80s, when I’ll be living in the midwest, next to the rising and dying sea. Betcha that even then, the glibertarian hue and cry will drive liberalism to do nice things for gay folks first.

  84. 84
    Raven says:

    Fuck it and drive on.

  85. 85
    Jebediah says:

    @Steve in DC:

    GOP has a majority among rich people and baby boomers with cash, aka white people.

    Their policy of making sure there are fewer and fewer people with more and more money might then backfire on them.

  86. 86
    Yutsano says:

    @Valdivia: The rending of garments continues apace I see.

  87. 87
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    @Randy P:

    They have a majority of the white males, I’ll grant you that. That’s the only possible explanation for Romney’s slight polling advantage among males.

    But they don’t have a very LARGE majority, and I believe it tends like Limbaugh’s demographics to be strongest among those 65+. So please don’t paint all white males with this brush.

    I’m a lily white male myself, so am not painting all with any brush. We are talking about elections in a democracy, and every point should be taken as to do with majorities needed to win those elections.

    It is hard to tell what with all the variables of the coming election, like say a first black president up for a second term, but the worm of demographics and death of the silent generation, seems to be turning fairly fast. As well, as my other comments today on other threads, that while polling nationally has Romney doing well against Obama, But at the swing state level, that parity for now looks to be rocking to the D side of the ledger.

    There are likely several reasons for this, not the least of which are better econ conditions in those swing states, but whatever the reason, national numbers don’t tell the story for how we elect presidents via the Electoral College. Romney and the wingnuts, at least at present, are pretty royally fucked on that front.

    In to the future, and some now, the GOP is going to have to contain the racism and xenophobia, and war on women, fairly soon, or get run over by a tidal wave of democrats.

  88. 88
    Jennifer says:

    I’m gonna repost something I put up at the end of that very dead “fuck it” post by Cole downpage, but first, this:

    We can talk all we like about how voters actually were voting against the recall rather than for Walker, and maybe that’s true, but that’s not how it’s going to be portrayed by the media, Scott Walker, or Republicans. For the media we already know it’s going to be good news for John McCain. For Scott Walker, it’s gonna be “I got a MANDATE to do every public-interest-raping thing my corporate johns want.” And for Republicans it’s gonna be continuing full-scale attack on unions and us little people everywhere, because there’s no consequence for it. People get a little upset – just spread enough money around to divert their attention to some other outrage and this can be made to go away.

    That’s what the results of the recall election will be, so we should stop right now with the “well, it turns out that people REALLY voted against recalls.” That and $5.00 will get you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

    Now, to repost from the dead “fuck it” thread:

    Sometimes I wonder if maybe the best course of action, after this type of thing, might be for the state Democrats to simply announce that since the people of Wisconsin have spoken and made it clear they have no problems with the policies of Scott Walker, that the Dems are going to give him everything he wants. If it comes to the lege, they’re going to pass it.

    Of course, this type of speech might have helped before the election more, but I wondered the same thing in 2004: what if the Democrats had just said, “you know what, America? If 4 years of dysfunctional misrule hasn’t convinced you, and you think you want more, here’s the deal: we’re not going to stand in the way of you getting what you want. So go ahead and vote for Bush; just don’t expect us to save your Social Security or Medicare for you, because when he tries to gut them – and he will – we’re going to let him give you what you voted for. Got that? You want to play footsie with people who appeal to your worst instincts, then you get to find out what the consequences are. Think long and hard before casting that ballot – what do you really want? Someone who tells you that it’s good to be greedy and bloodthirsty and racist, or someone who’s going to help keep you from sleeping under a bridge in retirement? Those are your choices; choose wisely, because whichever way you choose, we’re going to help you get what you voted for.”

    I know, I know, fantasy. But at some point you’ve got to wonder what the fuck it’s going to take, and sometimes I think a statement of complete capitulation might be the only thing that would wake up the mushy middle who go out and vote GOP with the idea that “well, yeah, he SAYS he’s going to execute illegal immigrants, but I know the Democrats will stop him from doing that, so it’s still ok for me to vote for this douchebag.” If some of those folks were told upfront – “hey, listen up – the crazy shit this guy’s spouting? We’re tired of dealing with this, and it appears that a lot of people like you don’t take it seriously and won’t take it seriously until they get a taste of it, so think carefully about who you vote for. Because this time, we’re not going to save you from your own worst instincts.”

  89. 89
    Culture of Truth says:

    I agree with this. Lessons learned, and all that, but it was a good fight and I’m not convinced that Walker is stronger now, as I keep reading. No Democrats were recalled last night, so whoo-dee-freaking-do, for you, GOP.

  90. 90
    Valdivia says:

    @Yutsano:

    of course! Don’t you see we have to sit collective shiva.

  91. 91
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques: Barrett won a primary election. He was not forced on anyone. His main opponent in the primary would have been easily tarred as an effete Madison liberal. She would not have been a shoo-in either.

  92. 92
    flukebucket says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse:

    Aunt Millie Whitehead of the Kansas Church of the Pentecost

    LOL! God, I have wondered about Aunt Mille Whitehead for a long time.

  93. 93
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Valdivia:

    I saw someone saying yesterday it was a waste of democratic resources. I actually think it wasn’t. The other side had to spend 10 times as much as we did just to get the same result as last time. Maybe I am crazy but I think it’s amazing that it took all of that money to keep their guy afloat.

    If the Dems actually won that senate recall race then Walker’s agenda is done, anyway. Way to go WI dems and AFL-CIO!

  94. 94
    Jebediah says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse:

    In to the future, and some now, the GOP is going to have to contain the racism and xenophobia, and war on women, fairly soon, or get run over by a tidal wave of democrats.

    I don’t think the current crop is capable of doing that. And at the risk of being uncivil, good! I hope they choke on their own bile.

  95. 95
    SatanicPanic says:

    @Spectre: We have more power today than we did yesterday. That is a net gain. We might lose in November? Well then why win anything? Someday in the future we might lose. Are you serious?

    Since everything that has happened under Walker has been negative, the fact that the senate won’t be in session until November is a gain. Not getting worse is better than getting worse.

    Reactionary forces are now emboldened, workers demoralized

    This has been the case since 1980, welcome to today.

  96. 96
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: Barrett pissed off the grassroots who started this whole thing in motion which–and I don’t live anywhere near Wisconsin, so take this with a grain of salt–might speak to why he lost the race the previous time.

  97. 97
    Belafon (formerly anonevent) says:

    @Randy P: I believe you would be falling into “the plural of anecdote is not data” trap.

    Though I disagree with Steve in DC’s analysis of the Democratic party in this respect: With the majority of the country being white, of course both parties are going to be majority white. This difference is that as the country is changing demographics, only one party is willing to make that change as well.

  98. 98
  99. 99
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    @Jennifer:

    The media is going to promulgate all sorts of bullshit, for all sorts of reasons. I come to blogs, a few of them, to try and find some solace in as much truth as can be delivered. It may be painful truth, or depressing truth, or even marginal truth, but I don’t want to go through any day bullshitting myself on stuff that matters. If I can help it. There are a few people on this blog that help me with that.

  100. 100
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    @flukebucket:

    LOL, seemed a good time for an update.

  101. 101
    gaz says:

    I agree with this FP post. I’d add that the sort of message that DougJ observes (and laments) in the “WI dems shouldn’t have tried a recall” is precisely what I feared in the event of a successful defense by Walker – which is one of the main reasons (outside of WI) that I thought the special election was so important.

  102. 102

    @Brachiator:

    The margin is too wide and too much distributed across a wide range of voting areas for anything shady to be even a suggestion.

    Excellent.

  103. 103
    Culture of Truth says:

    For Scott Walker, it’s gonna be “I got a MANDATE to do every public-interest-raping thing my corporate johns want.” And for Republicans it’s gonna be continuing full-scale attack on unions and us little people everywhere,

    I’ve heard this, but were they models of restraint before?

    because there’s no consequence for it.

    I hear you, but there was a consequence – the third recall effort in the history of the country. A normal human would be chastened, so the extent that Scott Walker will not be, it’s at least partly a losing battle to eschew fights because he might be even more emboldended in his bad actions. Yes the media takeaway may be open season on unions, but likewise it’s problematic to shy away from fights worrying “what will David Gregory think?!?”

    You make some good points, about “That’s what the results of the recall election will be” but the results can be what we want them to be, and to the extent we can’t control the results, i.e., Walker’s and the media’s reaction, I wonder if the failed recall is to blame, or if those were preexisting conditions.

  104. 104
    Bill Murray says:

    Since this is about Wisconsin, I wish to repeat the words of Robert LaFollette

    “Men must be aggressive for what is right if government is to be saved from men who are aggressive for what is wrong.”

  105. 105
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Enhanced Voting Techniques:

    Personal wet dream; Romney taps Walker for VP.

    I don’t think they’re this stupid, but who knows? Enough beat-down liberals are buying into the right-wing gloating so who knows? They just might be stupid enough to believe their own press.

  106. 106
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse:

    The majority favored white party has two choices, either moderate their hateful policies of power and control, or forsake democracy all together. The jury is out on that turn.

    You missed the third, and currently favored option: propagandize out the wazoo, and cheat.

  107. 107
    LanceThruster says:

    @Jennifer: Thanks for reposting that because I think it’s a brilliant insight.

    I do not recall any of the details but I remember reading about an evangelical pastor post-Clinton who was up in arms over his moral failings. When he saw how the economic downturn of the GHW Bush years was so intensely hurting his parishoners, he regretted making the “moral” issue his single cause. He came to realize that the financial health of the people plays a large part in their ability to do good themselves when not mired in a struggle merely to survive.

    Rmoney would basically signal the death knell of the Republic as far as I’m concerned. It’s bad enough that Bush the lesser got to stack the court with regressives. Rmoney will make Shrubya look astute and principled by comparison.

  108. 108
    piratedan says:

    http://memebase.com/2012/06/06.....o-just-no/

    kinda exemplifies what we’re up against

  109. 109
    kideni says:

    Last night was difficult, so I appreciate reading this. John Nicholls and a Madison radio guy were talking yesterday about how the one thing the Democrats and progressive groups might have done better would have been to push some sort of educational campaign about why the recall is part of the state constitution (it came as a direct response to 19th-century politicians campaigning on one platform and then pushing the interests of big-money backers once elected — it was meant to allow the people to hold politicians accountable for lying their way into office before they’d done too much damage), why a recall is different from impeachment, etc., because there was already a lot of talk about how recalls should just be for malfeasance. Of course, much of this talk was coming from the editorial boards of the major newspapers, talk radio, and television news stations, so it would have been difficult to get the message out. But that meant that a lot of people who didn’t otherwise like what Walker was doing were still susceptible to the message that recalls are antidemocratic (when, in fact, one can argue that they’re a vital part of holding elected officials accountable in a democracy).

    We do have the state senate now, and yes, it’s possible we’ll lose it in November. That gives us 6 months, though, when Walker can’t call special sessions, and the senate Dems can call hearings and that sort of thing. It’s not a lot, but it’s better than nothing when we’re looking at Gov. Rebecca Kleefisch after Walker gets indicted.

  110. 110
    rea says:

    @beltane:

    “Thanks to Obama American Left Lies in Smoldering Wreckage” by Matt Stoller

    Commentors over there explaining how it is crucial to defeat Obama next fall . . .

  111. 111
    Jennifer says:

    @Stuck in the Funhouse: I’m not knocking anyone for making a careful analysis here – that’s why I come here myself.

    I’m just sayin’ – the message most people will take away from this will be that “this is a center-right country,” voters even in liberal Wisconsin agree with the extreme policies of Walker, and for the real wingers, it will be intensified with “voters in Wisconsin saw through those crybaby liberal union thugs who tried to reverse the results of the election.” Because these are the only messages most people will hear. And we shouldn’t delude ourselves into thinking that most people will understand that voters in Wisconsin were voting against the recall process instead of for Scott Walker. This will be reinforced when the Republicans, who may have the same info showing a vote against recall rather than for Walker, turn Walker into their next not-ready-for-primetime Great White Hope, because the why of the vote doesn’t matter. These ARE Republicans we’re talking about, and their narrative will be that Walker triumphed over evil liberals and greedy union thugs, blah blah blah.

    That’s the reality.

  112. 112
    LanceThruster says:

    @Bill Murray: Thx for that. Wonderful, wonderful quote (I’ll look up Mr. LaFollette to see the WI connection).

  113. 113
    Yutsano says:

    @Another Halocene Human: I doubt it, if for no other reason than the John Doe investigation continues apace.

  114. 114
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Redshift:

    Some idjit Republican “strategist” on NPR yesterday was talking about how if Walker won, he’d be a star at the GOP convention, and if Romney loses, the top contender for 2016.

    Sister Sarah II: Koch Bros. Boogaloo

  115. 115
    Culture of Truth says:

    Smoldering Wreckage

    [ eyeroll ]

  116. 116
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Brachiator:

    But aside from history, there are examples of propositions passing (or failing), or laws passed regarding such issues as gay marriage, etc., and the voters immediately turning around and trying to repeal the measure. There is little consensus here that an earlier vote is the final answer.

    So what’s the freaking difference with a recall, especially when an elected governor uses his office to try to dismantle settled law without the consent of the voters?

    Because Villagers are all about fellating those in power. Recall the prohibition/taboo against trying heads of state for war crimes.

  117. 117
    Culture of Truth says:

    I guess Stoller wasn’t around when I busted my ass for Mondale only to watch him lose 49 states. Drama queen.

  118. 118
    gardenia breath says:

    @Jennifer: i completely agree! but it’s so shrill, right?

    comment on Krugman’s latest piece: “It’s been downhill ever since the Democratic establishment turned on Howard Dean.”

    that pretty much sums it up, for me.

  119. 119
    LanceThruster says:

    @Culture of Truth: Thank you for your service. Seriously.

    I only truly learned what a marvelous individual Fritz Mondale was after his defeat.

  120. 120
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Forum Transmitted Disease: Lol, Steve is a special snowflake. You can tell by his snow-white skin and special status which flows from this.

    Don’t box Steve in, bro.

  121. 121
    Brachiator says:

    @kideni:

    because there was already a lot of talk about how recalls should just be for malfeasance. Of course, much of this talk was coming from the editorial boards of the major newspapers, talk radio, and television news stations, so it would have been difficult to get the message out.

    Maybe people in Wisconsin are just nicer and better behaved. Back when California had their recall election, the media tried to educate the people about how recalls were a bad idea. The people said “Screw you! We’re gonna have a recall.”

  122. 122
    schrodinger's cat says:

    BTW according to Sully, Walker = Obama, Wisconsin Dems = Congressional Republicans. He says at the beginning of the post that he did not pay much attention to this recall, since partisan politics is icky and not high minded Burkean but he analyzes the election any way. Oh to be a Punditubbie, and give expert opinions on stuff you know nothing about.

  123. 123
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @Randy P:

    The kids are all right, including the white kids. Every year that brings a new crop of 18-year-olds into the voter ranks, also shows a significant shift toward the progressive position on any number of issues.

    There’s been progress, but real change awaits the dismantling of institutional racism.

    Something Dems are for and the GOP… is not. Let’s not be pollyannas. Our “colorblind” society was not brought “on step closer” because Bush II brought on some PoC friends of his into his admin while in Real America African-American households steadily lost ground economically and a generation of young Black men were hustled off to rot in prison.

  124. 124
    trollhattan says:

    @LanceThruster:

    I’ve not paid close attention to his victory preening–has he thanked St. Ronny’s corpse yet? After yesterday’s “Gipper” twitter-twat he cerainly should.

  125. 125
    Stuck in the Funhouse says:

    @Jennifer:

    That’s the reality

    It is the reality that a lot of right wingers and their stenographers in the msm, will make the case you state. I just don’t think it will matter much either inside or outside WI, for the coming POTUS election. Remember, WI is polling in double digits average for Obama. So the margin for Walker was about 7 percent, which gives a clear indication that WI were separating the issue of recalls from their prevailing voting intentions for dems.

    And you can also see this in Ohio, a much heavier union state, trending to dems and Obama, with Kasich approvals in the shitter, and he did about the same thing Walker did with public unions. And PA has turned into a solid blue state via current polling, also with a big union population. I don’t think they are going to swing back to a swing state, because some other state’s local election, out of some sense (false sense) of validation of Walker’s anti union policies. They will likely just sigh and shake their heads at WI, and not suddenly embrace the implied consent to anti unionism.

    And the rest of the much less union states of the country, I don’t think will much care what WI does. But we will see if it matters soon enough. And pretty soon, like in about a couple weeks, we are going to get a SCOTUS decision on the ACA, and WI will seem like a distant dream.

  126. 126
    Brachiator says:

    @schrodinger’s cat:

    Oh to be a Punditubbie, and give expert opinions on stuff you know nothing about.

    I think this is an essential requirement of contemporary punditocracy.

  127. 127
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @LanceThruster: Completely agree. It’s that hierarchy of needs again.

    MHP said it best this weekend–how can we lift children out of poverty without uplifting families?

  128. 128
    kideni says:

    @Brachiator: That’s basically what we did — the state Dems were nervous about the recall, but various grassroots groups said, basically, we’re going ahead with it, and if you want to help, great. It was only in October that the Dems came on board for starting up the petition drive in November. Then we got almost twice as many signatures as was necessary (we had half the time California had, and we had to get a much higher percentage, so it was a fuck-ton of work). The fact that the people spoke made no difference to the media, and they did their damndest to undermine the recall and downplay the significance of the effort at every step of the way.

  129. 129

    @rea:

    Commentors over there [nakedcapitalism] explaining how it is crucial to defeat Obama next fall

    They need Romney to win so they can make a killing shorting stocks.

  130. 130
    Davis X. Machina says:

    @Brachiator & @ kideni:

    how recalls should just be for malfeasance.

    Something of an own-goal for some Democrats, since an analogous argument was used to defend Clinton during his impeachment — Yeah, it’s disgraceful, but it’s not high-crimes-and-misdemeanors. We shouldn’t resort to this drastic a remedy, etc, etc…

    John Nicholls and a Madison radio guy were talking yesterday about how the one thing the Democrats and progressive groups might have done better would have been to push some sort of educational campaign about why the recall is part of the state constitution…

    Made more necessary by three decades of Republican bleating about ‘criminalizing policy differences’. Add an electorate that’s unlikely to draw fine distinctions between recall and impeachment — they both have the effect of removing an official from office, and recalling anybody’s an uphill lie.

    There’s the Gray Davis counter-example, of course.

  131. 131
    Another Halocene Human says:

    @kideni: Dem leadership is very nervous about its grassroots coming back to life.

    This is a very good sign, but will be completely missed by soi-disant left-wing purity trolls, concern trolls, and Obama-haters.

  132. 132
    KS in MA says:

    @Poopyman: I totally agree that retaking the WI Senate was critical. And the takeaway for those of us who don’t live in WI should be: Retake Congress!

  133. 133
    MCA1 says:

    Agree with the consensus and Doug here. The defeat at the gov. level stings a bit and will be used by Romney’s people to suggest something deeper, but no one’s listening or gives two shits amongst 98% of the electorate, anyway.

    – Democrats took the State Senate
    – Republicans and backers spent upwards of $30M on saving this guy’s bacon; money that could otherwise have been spent elsewhere. That’s the kind of waste of time and resources Dems need to force more of. Including in the Presidential race – put them on the defensive in Missouri, Montana, and other places.
    – Message was sent that if you try to blatantly fuck the unions this way, they’re not just going to lay down anymore
    – The points being mentioned here and in other threads: Walker won because polite Wisconsinites felt bad about recalling someone not under indictment, and probably still felt nervous about the State’s Democratic legislators fleeing across the border last year. Not because they like him.

    New Pew poll has the Pres up 7, he’s up 12 in PA and GOP’s throwing in the towel there before the race even starts, and he’s got a 4 pt. lead in FL right now.

  134. 134
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Another Halocene Human:

    but will be completely missed by soi-disant left-wing purity trolls, concern trolls

    They should be concerned, but it would’ve helped if that concern were displayed before they needed us,

  135. 135
    LanceThruster says:

    @LanceThruster: Oops, that should have been Shrubya, not GHW Bush.

  136. 136
    PG says:

    Never, never, never let the “oh noes” be the cry of the day. As a staunch liberal, the one thing that drives me CRAZY about some of my brethern is the tendancy to have a big mope when things don’t go our way (that, along with the hyperbole of The End Of The World As We Know It with each brain-dead turn of American politics).

    We can’t erase the satisfaction the other side has from winning. We can deny them getting off on our misery, simply by refusing to be miserable.

    Also, keep in mind that the New Deal came to pass only after the Great Depression. In other words, a really large part of the country has to be hurting A LOT before we get the average American to “share the wealth” with their lessers (even if they’re the lesser).

  137. 137
    Brachiator says:

    @Davis X. Machina:

    Something of an own-goal for some Democrats, since an analogous argument was used to defend Clinton during his impeachment—Yeah, it’s disgraceful, but it’s not high-crimes-and-misdemeanors. We shouldn’t resort to this drastic a remedy, etc, etc…

    Not too sure about this. Even over here in California, I got the idea that people wanted to recall Walker because of his actions as governor. With Clinton, it was always more (from the GOP goons) that Clinton was a bad person and whatever could be used to bring him down was acceptable.

    But in any event, one thing I find interesting is that I am only learning about this “ooh, we’re scared to use a recall” sentiment from the exit polls. Was any of this noted before the election? I find this a more important issue than the media opposition to the recall, which I more or less expected.

  138. 138
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Spectre:

    The Senate won’t even be in session until November, at which time the Republicans will regain control due to freshly gerrymandered districts.

    If the Senate is in session in November, but the Republicans from those freshly gerrymandered districts aren’t sworn in until January, how are you picturing Republicans running the senate between November and January?

  139. 139
    Jebediah says:

    @Mnemosyne:
    Magic Replubimojo.

  140. 140
    brantl says:

    @Dave: If it isn’t legally official misconduct to say you’re going to do one thing and then go right out and do another, it goddamn well out to be. With Walker’s full cooperation, the Wisonson legislature met in secret, to pass the things he couldn’t have gotten passed in the light of day. That’s bullshite, and it ought to get him chucked out of office.

  141. 141
    Commenting at Balloon Juice since 1937 says:

    @Forum Transmitted Disease: I agree completely. I was scanning the news sources to find out the Senate election result to no avail. I had to wait until I got spam from Democracy for America to learn that they took the Senate. That’s huge and effectively stops Walker’s agenda.

  142. 142
    Riilism says:

    Dear me, some of the angst expressed here today has put me in mind of this melancholic dirge….

  143. 143
    brantl says:

    @taylormattd: Have you been tested for reading comprehension? Do the scores go low enough for you?

  144. 144
    KS in MA says:

    @Bill Murray: Yes– and we must be willing to be aggressive for as long as it takes. And if it takes longer than any of our lifetimes, then so be it.

  145. 145
    kideni says:

    @Brachiator: There was some undercurrent of people being uncomfortable with recalls — Walker even ran an ad with people saying recalls suck. Barrett and other Dems did their best to remind people that Repubs never had problems with recalls in the past — Repubs actually started the senate recall process last year, they tried to get Jim Doyle recalled twice, Walker came into the Milwaukee County Exec office on the heels of a recall (that was never actually completed, in that they got the signatures but the county exec was forced out by other means so an election never happened), and Walker was prominent enough in a failed recall of Sens. Feingold and Kohl in 90s to have been given some of the leftover funds by the organizers (Walker claims he doesn’t remember if he signed those recall petitions; Barrett hammered him on this in a debate, and even the moderator didn’t quite believe that he wouldn’t remember something like that; because the recall failed, the signatures were never submitted, so there’s no public record to check for his name). Add to that the fact that this spring they tried to get a Dem senator recalled for not rolling over for a mining corporation that wrote legislation, and their miserable failure in trying to get enough signatures goes to show that recalls are fucking not easy and require a real groundswell of unhappiness with an elected official.

  146. 146
    Nemesis says:

    What we learned last night wil reverberate for decades.

    We learned that voter turnout means jackshit in a Citizens United world.

    Remember this day. Looking back on this date from the year 2014, we will be baffled as to how we lost so much so quickly. Frankly, I dont see how me and you and you over there can make much of a difference now. Just being realistic.

  147. 147
    Mnemosyne says:

    Also, too, to continue the basketball metaphor, if a team loses game one of a seven-game series, do they generally forfeit the rest of the series because, hey, they lost the first game, so there’s no possible way to win any of the rest?

    It’s fucking June, people. Five months until November. This is the first game in the series, not the last. Nut. Up.

  148. 148
    Brachiator says:

    @kideni:

    There was some undercurrent of people being uncomfortable with recalls—Walker even ran an ad with people saying recalls suck. Barrett and other Dems did their best to remind people that Repubs never had problems with recalls in the past

    Thanks very much for this. A very helpful background.

    @Nemesis:

    What we learned last night wil reverberate for decades. We learned that voter turnout means jackshit in a Citizens United world.

    I don’t know. Seems to me the problem is that not enough people voted to recall Walker.

  149. 149
    danielx says:

    I don’t think the recall shouldn’t have been done. It should’ve by all rights because Walker is a toxic little fucking nugget.

    Correction.

    …Walker is a toxic little fucking buttnugget.

    I read somewhere today that Walker is going to be a star in 2016 because he has – I’m not making this up – more charisma and appeal than Mitt Romney.

    Ummm…right. That’s not exactly setting a high bar, since on the charisma/appeal scale Mittens makes Newt Gingrich look like Kanye Fucking West. Romney could definitely use a little Elvis, but that’s kind of antithetical to the whole Mormon ethos.

    Then again, that’s using the assumption that Walker has charisma and appeal. What Walker has is a shit ton of money from the Kochs, which is why he won – that and a lot of resentment on the part of voters who resent anybody who has better benefits than they do. Somehow they skip right by the issue of why their benefits don’t match those of public employees. Fanning resentment is something the Republicans know how to do, and they execute it well.

    From what I’ve seen of him and heard of his pronouncements, Walker has all the charisma and appeal of your average IRS agent. He comes across as a mean little shit who wants to make people suffer. But then that characteristic isn’t exactly uncommon among Republicans, is it now?

    Thanks, Supreme Court justices! We really appreciate your your tender concern for the right of corporations and billionaires to buy elections.

  150. 150
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Valdivia:

    The other side had to spend 10 times as much as we did just to get the same result as last time. Maybe I am crazy but I think it’s amazing that it took all of that money to keep their guy afloat.

    People keep disregarding this, but I think it’s actually a big deal. Republicans spent literally 10 times as much to get the same result as last time.

  151. 151
    var says:

    I say fuck em. That’s another $30 million drained from the Kochs. Bleed them dry.

  152. 152
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    Also, too, to continue the basketball metaphor

    And one more. Phil Jackson didn’t believe in Offensive rebounds. He didn’t need to because he coached teams who paid beaucoup bucks for exceeding the salary cap.

    A Basketball version of Citizens United,

  153. 153
    Just Some Fuckhead says:

    @Steve in DC:

    Who is the top 2016 guy

    Warner, same answers.

  154. 154
    danielx says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    It is, and it isn’t. Yeah, they spent ten times as much to do it, but they had the resources to do it, and they have the resources and the legal freedom to do it again…and again…and again. If you regard politics as war, which movement conservatives do, how much it costs to achieve a goal is irrelevant as long as the goal is reached.

    As a practical matter, $30 million is a rounding error to people like the Kochs or Sheldon Adelson or Foster Friess. If buying elections gives them what they want – freedom from regulation and freedom to fuck consumers and their employees in various creative ways – $30 million is an excellent investment. If a group of these assholes thought putting up a billion dollars would guarantee Republican governors in all fifty states, they’d come up with the money tomorrow.

  155. 155
    Liberty60 says:

    I wonder what the spin would be if Walker were a Dem who barely survived a recall a year after being in office.

    I think we would be treated to the Wurlitzer screaming about how he lost his mandate, and this cripples his agenda, and he should take it as a wake up call for his overeach, etc.

    I think last night vidicates us incrementalist libs; we didn’t get the hail mary pass, but we moved the ball.

    Now we regroup, huddle, and come out again.

    And again.

  156. 156
    clone12 says:

    Doesn’t mean it’s time to retreat back into Vichy mode.

    OK, someone is just trolling for the Moore Award at this point :-)

  157. 157
    Mnemosyne says:

    @danielx:

    I guess that’s my question, though. Since it cost Republicans $40 million to maintain Walker’s incumbent advantage, how much more would need to be spent to overcome that incumbent’s advantage? We don’t actually know the answer to that question.

    Of the four state senate races, three of them were a Republican incumbent vs. a Democratic challenger (in the fourth race, the recalled senator decided to resign for “family reasons”). In two of those races, the incumbent won. So, again, we really don’t have a good sense of how good massive amounts of money are at getting rid of incumbents.

    ETA: Also, too, in the successful recall last night, I would like to say Yay Racine! I only lived there briefly, but I am proud of you.

  158. 158
    danielx says:

    You heard it here first: cue the following.

    David Brooks – Scott Walker is the new face of the Republican Party; it’s so unfortunate that leftist extremists have once again led the Democratic Party down the path of destruction. Also, too: it’s certainly a good thing that freedom of dollars has enhanced the electoral process.

    George Will – the voice of the dollars has triumphed over the voice of the great unwashed in Wisconsin, and that’s a good thing.

    This stuff practically writes itself.

  159. 159
    Culture of Truth says:

    Republicans spent literally 10 times as much to get the same result as last time.

    Yes, I noticed that. Dems kept all their Governors too without spending a dime. Woot.

  160. 160

    @var:

    I say fuck em. That’s another $30 million drained from the Kochs. Bleed them dry.

    The two of them have a combined net worth of about $50 Billion, so at this rate they’ll be broke after 1666.67 more elections.

    (Also, to put this into perspective, Romney is worth “only” $250 million, so one Koch brother equals 100 Romneys).

  161. 161
    LanceThruster says:

    @trollhattan: Yeah, I’m sure the gods of the GOP be luvs him some bunches. Expect much more genuflecting at the feets of St. Raygun.

  162. 162
    dianne says:

    California had a recall that did succeed after Arnold, Issa and Cheney had their little confab before Bush was even sworn in. I don’t remember the media and talking heads crying over their beer back then. And we got six years of failed Republican governance (is there any other kind?)
    with yet another Democrat coming in to try to put the pieces back together. I’m so sick of this. If it weren’t for the fact that we would all suffer so much, I would almost throw up my hands and say have at it, tea baggers.

  163. 163
    LanceThruster says:

    @Judas Escargot, Your Postmodern Neighbor: One down, 1666.67 to go (boy, that “666” jumps right out atcha, doesn’t it?).

  164. 164
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Judas Escargot, Your Postmodern Neighbor:

    If they put that amount into all 50 states, I think it’ll run out a wee bit faster.

  165. 165
    Heliopause says:

    I’m a million miles from being a pollyanna but I see some good coming out of this. The more time that doltish functionaries like Scott Walker spend fighting for their lives the less time they have to perform their real function, which is destroying civil society. His overlords had to waste tens of millions of dollars to save him. A senate seat got flipped. It’s a long game.

  166. 166
    Ben Franklin says:

    lifted this comment from a winger blog.

    Does anyone know anything abut this?

    Don’t get me wrong, I dropped a grand toward Walker’s campaign.

    It’s just, well, if you must know, and I’m probably going to get in trouble for saying this, but the Koch Brothers “reimburse” folks for “contributing” to causes they champion.

    Kinda like Big Insurance did against ObamaCare in 2009 (before they went into the tank for it later on). You wanna see the giant check they cut me?

  167. 167
    Barry says:

    @Liberty60: (RE: What if Walker were a Dem):

    “I think we would be treated to the Wurlitzer screaming about how he lost his mandate, and this cripples his agenda, and he should take it as a wake up call for his overeach, etc.”

    He wouldn’t have survived, since the same presstitutes who were howling about the evils of recalls would have been saying that any (Dem!) politician faced with a recall election should resign immediately.

  168. 168

    @Mnemosyne:

    If they put that amount into all 50 states, I think it’ll run out a wee bit faster.

    True. That makes it a little over 33 election cycles.

    They’ll probably die of old age first, but there must be heirs.

  169. 169
    Liberty60 says:

    @Ben Franklin:
    I wouldn’t put it past them, except it doesn’t seem to make much sense given Citizens United.

    If they can directly give as much as they want, why bother with the shenanigans of money laundering?

  170. 170
    David Koch says:

    We would have won if only DWS had used the bully pulpit!

  171. 171
    Jebediah says:

    @Liberty60:
    I thought unlimited money could only go to PACs. This sounds like money directly to the campaign.

  172. 172
    Enhanced Voting Techniques says:

    @Another Halocene Human:

    I don’t think they’re this stupid, but who knows? Enough beat-down liberals are buying into the right-wing gloating so who knows? They just might be stupid enough to believe their own press.

    Mitt Romney is their nominee, they are that stupid. Seriously, the GOP couldn’t find a candidate who says “we want to redo the Banking Collapse of 2007” if they deliberately set out to do that.

    Mitt has problems getting his base up because is his a robot. His choices for base stimulation are few. Walker’s got Douch appeal now.

  173. 173
    The Snarxist Formerly Known as Kryptik says:

    @Barry:

    And if it did end up going to an actual vote, you wouldn’t have had nearly 1/5, 1/6 of GOP voters voting ‘against the recall’ on principle.

  174. 174
    burnspbesq says:

    @Steve in DC:

    Dude, have you been drinking anti-freeze all day?

  175. 175
    rikyrah says:

    Ezra and others are starting to promote the idea that Republicans are too dangerous to be in the minority.

    no, they’re far too dangerous to become the majority.

    fuck Ezra and all the rest of them

  176. 176
    taylormattd says:

    @brantl: Read this: you are dumber than a sack of hammers. Fuck off and die in a fire.

  177. 177
    David Koch says:

    Can we launch a recall of the next Adam Sandler movie?

    Sandler is clearly a greater threat to the US than an member of al-Qaeda. Maybe the President could authorize a commando raid to neutralize this clear and present danger to our country.

  178. 178
    OmerosPeanut says:

    Just because the Dem’s candidate was terrible and lacked any concept of political tactics doesn’t mean the recall was a bad idea.

  179. 179
    Mike D. says:

    Yes, this.

  180. 180
    tam1MI says:

    The Senate won’t even be in session until November, at which time the Republicans will regain control due to freshly gerrymandered districts.

    Correction: the Senate will not be in session again until January, when the newly elected Senators will be sworn in.

    Source here.

  181. 181
    kideni says:

    @tam1MI: The governor can always call for a special session, and he has to get the legislature to go along with it. Last year, the rubber stamp Republicans agreed to be in special session (sometimes “extraordinary session”) for pretty much the entire year — the first half of the year it was on the budget, and the second half was on jobs. And they passed a lot of horrific and stupid legislation in that “jobs” session, including bills that allowed concealed carry and created Wisconsin’s Castle Doctrine, defined a bicycle, allowed wolf hunting, eliminated the requirement that schools teach comprehensive sex ed, eliminated the ability of local governments to set their own landlord-tenant ordinances, and oh, so much more. I believe redistricting came up then as well.

    With control of the senate, the Democrats can hold hearings and investigate stuff. The Republicans can no longer shut down hearings after an arbitrary amount of time just because they’re tired of hearing from people. As a specific example of how it helps to have one house even when there is no legislative session, at the end of the month the “Deer Czar” will be making his recommendations, and since in Texas he’s been a proponent of eliminating hunting on public land, promoted game farms, and other such things, it’s widely expected that he’ll make similar recommendations. The Democrats are now in a position to fight anything along those lines, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the Republicans back off from even making such a proposal.

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