I Blame Beauchamp

Alright, wingnuts, closer your eyes, plug your ears, and yell LALALALALA:

The paratroopers had their assignment: Check out reports that Afghan police had recovered the mangled remains of an insurgent suicide bomber. Try to get iris scans and fingerprints for identification.

The 82nd Airborne Division soldiers arrived at the police station in Afghanistan’s Zabol province in February 2010. They inspected the body parts. Then the mission turned macabre: The paratroopers posed for photos next to Afghan police, grinning while some held — and others squatted beside — the corpse’s severed legs.

A few months later, the same platoon was dispatched to investigate the remains of three insurgents who Afghan police said had accidentally blown themselves up. After obtaining a few fingerprints, they posed next to the remains, again grinning and mugging for photographs.

But no one would ever make a joke about a burn victim or play with a piece of skull, right wingnuts?

BTW- if this kind of thing upsets you, there is only one way to stop it. Stop sending human beings into dehumanizing war zones. That’s the only solution to ending this.






92 replies
  1. 1

    We need to hurry on up and get on out of that place

  2. 2
    bjacques says:

    I know I’m going to liberal hell for this (“West Heck”) but I thought this was pretty damn funny. Shockingly bad form, and the soldiers shouldn’t be doing it. But “Zombie Hunter?” I’m still giggling. I’ve got no sympathy for suicide bombers and they deserve every indignity visited upon them in death.

    But, yeah, “f–ked up” doesn’t begin to describe it.

  3. 3
    eemom says:

    We can haz open thread soon plz? I need to bitch about Jim Webb and what a snake in the grass asshole he is. kthxbai.

  4. 4
    BGinCHI says:

    Wingnuts blame the LA Times in 3, 2, 1…..

  5. 5
    greenergood says:

    ‘Stop sending human beings into dehumanizing war zones. That’s the only solution to ending this.’

    Thank you John. Your comment was measured and dignified – seriously – sometimes I just get sick of snark.

  6. 6
    Yevgraf says:

    Is it too much to ask for some professionalism from our currently overpaid, coddled and overworshipped troops? Or are they genuinely angling to be spit on when they return?

  7. 7
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    What is distressing is that it’s painfully obvious that the chain of command is at best indifferent to this sort of thing.

    It’s a demonstration of a lack of discipline. Our Army is going to hell in a handbasket, and the leadership, what is left of it, is doing little about it.

  8. 8
    efgoldman says:

    VERY, very OT, but Dick Clark has died.
    http://www.latimes.com/news/ob.....0009.story

  9. 9
    Brachiator says:

    BTW- if this kind of thing upsets you, there is only one way to stop it. Stop sending human beings into dehumanizing war zones. That’s the only solution to ending this.

    Unfortunately, human beings have not shown that they are willing to give up their love of war.

  10. 10
    beltane says:

    It’s a demonstration of a lack of discipline. Our Army is going to hell in a handbasket, and the leadership, what is left of it, is doing little about it.

    Doesn’t this closely parallel the experience of the Soviets in Afghanistan?

  11. 11
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Brachiator:

    Unfortunately, human beings have not shown that they are willing to give up their love of war.

    Most human beings who have experienced it up close and personal, as they say, don’t seem to love it very much. There are of course exceptions, like George Patton.

    Nowadays those who seem the most keen about it are also those who “do their part” in fighting the war by sitting at a keyboard thousands of miles and at least one ocean away from where it’s actually happening. When asked to join in the fun, they always find a reason not to…college deferments, I’m a dad now, no, I’m in the Texas Air National Guard, I’m busy doing missionary work for my cult, etc.

  12. 12
    Punchy says:

    My sandbox reenactment shows that these “crimes” were actually unpossible and a figment of the lamestream media’s obsession with body parts.

  13. 13
    the Conster (f/k/a Cat Lady) says:

    @eemom:

    Every single Senator looks in the mirror and sees a president. Barack jumped the line, then showed them all how inadequate they are, and uppity. Also too.

  14. 14
    Mickey says:

    Commander Cole sitting on his ass in front of his computer in buttfuck Virginia or wherever the fuck he is, trying to tell us that war is bad because here is more ugly stuff that happens in war because war is ugly…duh. So therefore, using childishly simplistic Cole logic, We must end all wars now. No consideration to what would happen if we just cut bait and left. How that would undo everything with no hope for some sort of a soft landing.

    Like he can relate to what is happening over there in a war zone were there is no sense of reality anymore just like any other warzone. At least that is what the experts say when they describe why these things happen.

    Why won’t you tell us what you did when you were in the military Cole? I’m guessing you peeled potatoes because you sure as shit don’t seem to have a clue. Then again that is nothing new.

    Stick to talking about shit you know about. Your cat puking on your bed and what your favorite TV shows are.

  15. 15
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Mickey:

    He’s a combat vet (first Gulf War), dumbass.

    Now go play with your toy soldiers in the sandbox. That’s a good little chickenhawk.

  16. 16
    Quaker in a Basement says:

    @Mickey:

    in a war zone were there is no sense of reality anymore just like any other warzone. At least that is what the experts say when they describe why these things happen.

    And that’s different from what our host wrote how again?

  17. 17

    @Mickey:

    Yet you’re still here. Why? You hate this place and the feeling is mutual.

  18. 18
    Ben Franklin says:

    Villago Delenda Est Says:

    What is distressing is that it’s painfully obvious that the chain of command is at best indifferent to this sort of thing.

    My Lai was symptomatic of the breakdown of command. It becomes
    SOP for field operations to push the envelope when the top defers to the judgement of the haggard troops.

  19. 19
    Mickey says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: I call bullshit. Yea I heard he was in Iraq but what did he do exactly?

    A real combat vet wouldn’t talk about war in such childishly simplistic terms unless they are too fucked up in the head from PTSD or just flat out stupid….or both.

  20. 20
    magurakurin says:

    @Yevgraf: they definitely aren’t overpaid, and doing 3,4,5 and even more combat tours hardly qualifies as coddled. As to overworshipped, I’d say only the idea of “the troops” is worship. The actual men and women who have gone might as well be spit upon when they come back since many face long terms of unemployment, bankruptcy and bouts of PTSD without any real and meaningful forms of treatment.

    I’ll go with what John said. Send human beings into dehumanizing conditions, guess what, they become dehumanized.

  21. 21
    jl says:

    ” BTW if this kind of thing upsets you, there is only one way to stop it. Stop sending human beings into dehumanizing war zones. That’s the only solution to ending this ”

    Yes.

    OK, fine, there will always be wars so it is hopelessly visionary to think we can end them, and maybe Cole spent most his time in the army peeling potatoes. Whatever.

    But that BTW of Cole’s is a point the US has forgotten, and it is ruining us, in many ways.

    ” A universal and perpetual peace, it is to be feared, is in the catalogue of events, which will never exist but in the imaginations of visionary philosophers, or in the breasts of benevolent enthusiasts. It is still however true, that war contains so much folly, as well as wickedness, that much is to be hoped from the progress of reason; and if any thing is to be hoped, every thing ought to be tried. ”

    James Madison, Universal Peace, National Gazette, February 2, 1792

    Seems to me a long time since we have tried the ‘if any thing is to be hoped, every thing ought to be tried’ approach.

  22. 22
    Mickey says:

    @The Other Chuck: Soooo you hate this place too and yet you are still here? Alrightey then.

  23. 23
    eemom says:

    Is this “Mickey” the latest Fred/Derf, et al, thing?

    A clever one he is.

  24. 24
    jl says:

    @Mickey:

    ” Like he can relate to what is happening over there in a war zone were there is no sense of reality anymore just like any other warzone. At least that is what the experts say when they describe why these things happen. ”

    You have a link or a reference or personal history to relate that might explain what you are talking about?

  25. 25
    trollhattan says:

    @Mickey:

    i.e., how many kills and where are the ears, maaaaaan?

    You want a toe? I can get you a toe, believe me.

  26. 26
    Villago Delenda Est says:

    @Mickey:

    Well, he’s written of his time in the 11th ACR. Which means he was an armor trooper. I don’t know if he was on the “keep the treds rolling” side, or the “oh boy, I’ve got a big gun to play with” side, but I think it was the latter.

    At any rate, if he served in a combat arms battalion or smaller unit, despite his MOS, he saw war up close and personal.

  27. 27
    jl says:

    I love the smell of commenter mouth froth in the afternoon.

  28. 28
    Optimism! says:

    When I read that article, I wasn’t surprised that it was the 82nd that did this; from my experiences and those of my friends, those guys are trained to believe they can do no wrong, and as a result, the civilians in Iraq and Afghanistan hated them, because of stuff like this.

    Also, let’s be honest; this is not getting attention because it happened, it’s getting attention because there are photos. Many units have a “no pictures” policy when on a mission, because of stuff like this.

  29. 29
    MikeJ says:

    @efgoldman: And he’s been dead on every goddamned thread all day.

  30. 30
    Origuy says:

    Chris Rodda of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation reports that the new commander of Marine Fighter Attack Squadron 122, which changed its nickname to “Werewolves” (its original name) in 2008, has ordered the name changed back to “Crusaders”. They are also changing their insignia to have a red Crusaders’ cross. This isn’t the case of some clueless grunt doing something insensitive out of ignorance.

  31. 31
    David Koch says:

    reportedly they sung David Lee Roth’s “I ain’t got no body”

  32. 32
    Tickraw says:

    Has Dana Loesch announced yet that she would totally pose for pictures next to severed remains? What? She’s too busy interviewing Nugent? Oh well.

  33. 33
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Mickey: I was an infantryman in both Iraq and Afghanistan in the recent conflicts, and not that I need to prove it to some sorry chickenhawk Bushcocksucker like yourself, but I can very readily do so. Cole is spot on with his point, and you don’t need to be a vet to know that, but as a vet I can tell you that yes, it really is that simple you sorry grabastic bucket of the afterbirth of a mongolian goatfuck.
    Since you’re the one who initiated the concept in this thread that one has to be a vet to talk about such things, let us see a scan of your DD214.
    Otherwise, shut your warblogger-cumhole or get off that line and find one that better suits you, with monosyllable words in short sentences about the great taste of paste glue.

  34. 34
    David Koch says:

    @efgoldman: maybe they can pose with Dick Clark’s corpse.

  35. 35
    Cromagnon says:

    @Yevgraf:

    Well go spit on some then there tough guy. Just go to your local Airport. There will be plenty of them there. Lets us know how it goes

  36. 36
    some guy says:

    @Mickey:

    At least that is what the experts say when they describe why these things happen.

    Chickenhawk says what?

  37. 37
    Cromagnon says:

    @Soonergrunt:

    I’m a former 11B myself, and I generally agree this incident isn’t helpful to our cause. At the same time, there are plenty of commenters here who just revel in these sort of incidents just so they can spew their venom at our troops, like that idiot moron Yevgraf… I’m just curious if you, as a fellow vet and someone who knows what our combat troops go through, are going to equally condemn his hateful ignorant bile?

  38. 38
    Amir Khalid says:

    @Soonergrunt:
    Well said.

  39. 39
    Citizen_X says:

    @Soonergrunt:

    you sorry grabastic bucket of the afterbirth of a mongolian goatfuck

    Oh, well done, sir, well done! The judges are giving you 9.9s and 10s across the board for that one.

  40. 40
    Ben Franklin says:

    @Yevgraf:

    I hope that was ironic snark.

  41. 41
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Cromagnon: I could, but to what point?
    If he has any self-awareness at all, then anything I could say to him would only be piling on.
    If he has none such, then it would be utterly pointless anyway, and would only lower me.

  42. 42
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Soonergrunt: Sometimes it takes an NCO to really explain things to someone. There is no way I could ever have done that.

  43. 43
    hilzoy says:

    @Villago Delenda Est: “it’s painfully obvious that the chain of command is at best indifferent to this sort of thing.
    It’s a demonstration of a lack of discipline. Our Army is going to hell in a handbasket, and the leadership, what is left of it, is doing little about it.”

    Yes. Every time I read about something like this, one of my thoughts (note: not my only thought! Not even my first one! Before anyone tells me I should be having other thoughts: I do!) is: where the hell was their chain of command? The people I know who have commanded troops in combat have been incredibly concerned to prevent things like this from happening, for the sake of the victims, for the sake of the effects on other troops, but also for the sake of the effects on the people who might do this stuff or not, depending on a whole lot of things, one of which is: the quality of their commanding officers.

    But then I remember the stats on how many people were being promoted to captain and major because so many of their peers were getting killed or injured, and I think: the existence of idiots with command authority is also completely predictable, and never more so than now.

  44. 44
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Amir Khalid: @Citizen_X: @Omnes Omnibus: I learned all of that from one of my Platoon Sergeants. Like the narrator in A Christmas Story said of his father, one could say of SFC Madigan:

    He worked in profanity the way other artists might work in oils or clay. It was his true medium; a master.

    I was a bit of a fuck-up in those days, so I got quite a lot of it directed my way, usually accompanied by something like “did your parents have any children who lived? What the fuck is wrong with you, son?” It stayed with me.

  45. 45
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @hilzoy: It is my understanding from people I served with that promotions to LTC and COL were virtually a sure thing among the commissioning classes of 87-90 for anyone who had not been convicted by a court martial.

  46. 46
    magurakurin says:

    @Ben Franklin:

    “Yevgraf? No! Yevgraf’s a Bolshevik!”

  47. 47
    celticdragonchick says:

    @Yevgraf:

    Is it too much to ask for some professionalism from our currently overpaid, coddled and overworshipped troops? Or are they genuinely angling to be spit on when they return?

    Unsentimental (and frankly brutal) treatment of enemy remains has been going on as long as humans have been fighting. I have two ancestors who fought at King’s Mountain in the Revolutionary War where the British commander was killed and his corpse was imaginatively desecrated in retaliation for some unfortunate statements he made on what he would do to Americans.

    This kind of gallows humor in the photos is a sort of psychological defense mechanism against the mass horror you are dealing with as a soldier. Saying they are coddled (while fighting a particularly vicious counter insurgency against people with medieval religious beliefs about infidels and martyrdom)is almost alughable…except that nothing is really funny at all.

  48. 48
    Omnes Omnibus says:

    @Soonergrunt: I have heard enough of it in my life time, but I just can’t do it. I think it is taught at PLDC.

  49. 49
    Mouse Tolliver says:

    @Tickraw:

    She’s too busy interviewing Nugent? Oh well.

    Crooks and Liars has a VH1 doc where Nugent talks about banging underage girls as a thirtysomething hasbeen rocker. He’d go to the parents and get their permission first, but that makes it seem so much creepier IMO. Honestly can’t wait to see how the GOPers justify this one, because he’s been out front as a spokesperson for the right for so damn long. Is the Republican Party now in favor of statutory rape?

  50. 50
    efgoldman says:

    @Yevgraf:

    Is it too much to ask for some professionalism from our currently overpaid, coddled and overworshipped troops?

    Whatever you’re trying to do here, it isn’t working. I’m tying to figure out where the snarkasm lies. “Overpaid”? Then why are so many military families on food stamps. “Coddled”? In Afghanistan? You ever been there or even read a good boo about the place? I don’t know about “overworshipped”. I don’t see that in my world. And I’m no fan of the military.
    What we need is a 2012 equivalent of Michael Herr.

  51. 51
    celticdragonchick says:

    @Soonergrunt:

    Thank you thank you thank you.

    Oh…and Mickey? You can stop jerking off at Ace of Spades or Jawa Report or whatever mastubatory wingnut site is your favorite and go see your recruiter.

  52. 52
    Narcissus says:

    @Mouse Tolliver:

    Is the Republican Party now in favor of statutory rape?

    Uh, yes? Is this a trick question?

  53. 53
    Mnemosyne says:

    @Villago Delenda Est:

    Most human beings who have experienced it up close and personal, as they say, don’t seem to love it very much. There are of course exceptions, like George Patton.

    I think Patton’s reputation as a lover of war is a bit overblown. Curtis Le May, now …

    I had never seen this particular Patton quote before (when he addressed an all-black tank unit) but I do love it:

    Men, you’re the first Negro tankers to ever fight in the American Army. I would never have asked for you if you weren’t good. I have nothing but the best in my Army. I don’t care what color you are as long as you go up there and kill those Kraut sons of bitches. Everyone has their eyes on you and is expecting great things from you. Most of all your race is looking forward to you. Don’t let them down and damn you, don’t let me down!

    ETA: And he apparently didn’t hate the Nazis just because they were the enemy of the day. He illegally smuggled a copy of the Nuremberg Laws out of Germany and secretly donated them to the Huntington Library in California. The National Archive now has ownership of them (all according to Wikipedia).

  54. 54
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Omnes Omnibus: BNCOC, actually. Four hours of instruction with practical exercise.

  55. 55
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Mnemosyne: Being a bomber guy, LeMay didn’t exactly see it up close.
    Patton, whatever his thoughts about combat itself, honestly believed that the quickest way to end the war with the fewest casualties to all sides was to win it decisively, and to do so by always being on the offensive. He loved winning.

  56. 56
    celticdragonchick says:

    @Mnemosyne:

    I understand he became physically ill when he first saw a concentration camp. He took his antagonism with Nazis very personally.

  57. 57

    I was drafted into the Army in 1972, and to put in way too mildly, the Army, at least was parked in hell with its hand basket. I heard one of the Teevee Generals talk about this era and how totally broken our military was at that time, to where as a company commander in the states, he wore his side arm when any where around the barracks.

    We used to half joke, that if the Russians invaded we were fucked as a country, and you might as well put up the Cub Scouts against them. It was a fucking mess, and after the peace agreement in 1973, the small base I was on brought back a battalion of clerks from Vietnam, and at least half of them were hard core heroin junkies. We were getting three or 4 robbery murders every single payday, after that. And I never walked around that fort after dark.

    I hope our mil isn’t that fucked up after Iraq and Afghanistan. I don’t see how it could be, really.

  58. 58
    efgoldman says:

    @celticdragonchick:

    I understand he [Patton] became physically ill when he first saw a concentration camp.

    In this he was certainly not alone.

  59. 59
    Kathy says:

    @Soonergrunt: I was going to tell Mickey to shut the fuck up. I am so glad I read the whole thread and saw your response before I hit the reply button. A tip of the hat to you and your SFC.

  60. 60
    Raven says:

    @Yevgraf: As an anti-war Vietnam Vet I urge you to give it a whirl. It’s not that hard to eat through a straw for a couple of months.

  61. 61
    PIGL says:

    @Mickey: why don’t you take this acetylene torch and stick it up your ass where it will start a nice hot fire that you would then be most welcome to die in.

    The behaviour Cole describes, and which you apparently admire, is not that of disciplined, professional soldiers. It’s the behaviour of an undisciplined barbarian horde out for rapine and pillage. Authors from Sun Tzu to Shakespeare have taught us that no good can come of that.

  62. 62
    efgoldman says:

    @General Stuck:

    I hope our mil isn’t that fucked up after Iraq and Afghanistan. I don’t see how it could be, really.

    And unlike the last ten years, neither LBJ nor Nixon was going to activate any Guard or Reserve unit, when you were drafted. Good thing, they would have been (and were) hideously unprepared. For lots of units (at least in the Army), summer duty was a two-week drunk, and weekend drills were not much better. Yes, I speak from experience.

  63. 63
    Raven says:

    @efgoldman: I spent the last 6 months of my tour in Vietnam in a National Guard unit from Providence, RI. Try again.

  64. 64
    efgoldman says:

    @Raven:

    I spent the last 6 months of my tour in Vietnam in a National Guard unit from Providence, RI.

    It happened, but it was very rare. Not at all like Iraq2 or Afghanistan.

  65. 65
    PIGL says:

    “We will have all such offenders so cut off.”

    Henry V.

  66. 66
    efgoldman says:

    New thread, pleeze, so it won’t be unseemly to rag on both the Pens and Flyers excuses for goaltenders and defense?
    Seven goals in the first period. Cripes.

  67. 67
    Raven says:

    @efgoldman: Eight units called up after the King assassination were sent to Vietnam. When you say “any Guard or Reserve unit” I’ll be here to correct you.

  68. 68
    efgoldman says:

    @Raven:

    When you say “any Guard or Reserve unit” I’ll be here to correct you.

    Fair. In fact I think we may have had this same discussion a long time ago, but it slipped my aging mind.

  69. 69
    Raven says:

    @efgoldman: Besides that you are totally correct, it’s a backdoor draft.

  70. 70
  71. 71
    Odie Hugh Manatee says:

    @Soonergrunt:

    “… it really is that simple you sorry grabastic bucket of the afterbirth of a mongolian goatfuck.”

    That line… ’tis a thing of beauty. It brought tears to my eyes.

    Tears of mirth.

  72. 72
    Roger Moore says:

    @Mouse Tolliver:

    Is the Republican Party now in favor of statutory rape?

    Of course not. The existence of statutory rape is a terrible blow against the freedom of men* to have sex with any “woman” whose father will give them permission.

    *Offer only applies to white Christians.

  73. 73
    kindness says:

    At least they didn’t piss on the body parts.

    Not excusing their behavior, I mean after all the incident with the army/marines who did defile dead Taliban had already happened by 2010. They knew they were supposed to be ‘nice’. Still, when I was in my early 20’s I was much more impulsive than I am now. I’d chew these guys out but not kick ’em out.

  74. 74
    Ruckus says:

    @Mouse Tolliver:
    Is the Republican Party now in favor of statutory rape?

    You know it sure seems like they aren’t actually against it as long as it’s one of their own, and they don’t see it on faux news.

  75. 75
    Jess says:

    Is this really such a big deal? Dark, twisted humor is how we cope with the horror of dealing with shit like that, especially when there’s a good chance of ending up like yourself. It’s just body parts, not a living being. I’d give these guys a pass for finding a way to deal with the insanity without hurting innocent people.

  76. 76
    Amir Khalid says:

    @kindness:

    I’d chew these guys out but not kick ‘em out.

    Imagine if a group of rookie cops in some American city, at the morgue on police business, were to pull out a few dead bodies and pose for pictures with them, just for shits and giggles. Do you think that they would deserve no more than a chewing out from their station commander?

    What these soldiers did, in the pictures that they themselves took, made their mission in Afghanistan more difficult. Others before them have done such things. This additional incident has put them and their fellow soldiers in danger of more retaliation from Afghans. If kicking them out of the army is the only way to teach their colleagues not to do these things, then that’s what must be done.

  77. 77
    Jess says:

    @Jess: Should read “ending up like THAT yourself.” Grading midterms has rotted my brain…

  78. 78
    Heliopause says:

    BTW- if this kind of thing upsets you,

    Me personally, I get a little more upset by the actual process of killing human beings for no good reason rather than by what happens to their remains, but to each his own.

  79. 79
    Baron Jrod of Keeblershire says:

    @Jess: Desecrating dead bodies is a bigger deal in Afghanistan than it is here.

    And it’s not exactly smiled on here in the states either.

    Sure, it’s not as bad as exploding another wedding, but these soldiers were disregarding orders to do something that would rile up the locals. And they took pictures, just to make sure that as many Afghans as possible could be enraged.

    So yeah, it’s kinda a big deal. I’m with you on not being terribly angry about it personally but it’s a serious problem for the military.

  80. 80
    Corner Stone says:

    @Yevgraf:

    Is it too much to ask for some professionalism from our currently overpaid, coddled and overworshipped troops? Or are they genuinely angling to be spit on when they return?

    You never fail us. I’m going with a five star rating on this one.

  81. 81
    lacp says:

    @Ruckus: Statutory rape? I thought the Republican deal was super-closeted ghey sex, or that whole Diver Dan shit what with multiple wetsuits ‘n dildoes ‘n shit.

  82. 82
    Ruckus says:

    @lacp:
    It really seems like they don’t like all the things they do, but that doesn’t seem to slow an awful lot of them down much. Statutory rape, gay sex, weird wetsuit stuff, divorce from sick wives, total religious hypocrites, staying as far away from military service(battlefields especially) as possible while yelling that someone(else) needs to die, do I need to go on?

  83. 83
    Richard says:

    Stop sending human beings into dehumanizing war zones.

    Hey man, the GOPers have a great way of implementing that. Replace the troops with “private contractors” from the company formerly known as Blackwater. Those gun happy murderers are pretty much sub-human, and the added expense of using mercenaries will further the GOP goal of keeping the military budget more bloated than Vegas era Elvis.

  84. 84
    AA+ Bonds says:

    Well I think John has a point which is how do you expect these kids to carve people in half with 50 cal tour after tour without thinking that this business is funny

  85. 85
    AA+ Bonds says:

    This war was always going to end like this and I told everyone that from the beginning so you may understand why I am sometimes a little frustrated with liberals

  86. 86
    Jess says:

    @Baron Jrod of Keeblershire: Okay, point taken. I guess I’d be more surprised if such things DIDN’T happen. I know how cops and firemen can slip into sick humor to deal with stress, so I would assume it’s way off the charts in a war zone. I guess the lack of discipline is in taking pictures and making it public. Hypocrisy is the foundation of civilization…

  87. 87
    Soonergrunt says:

    @Heliopause: The dead guy in this case killed himself. Was suicide bomber.
    The Afghan National Army, who are frequently the targets of these yahoos, have no respect for the dignity of their remains, and tend to treat them rather harshly. Occasionally the Americans who also get attacked by these “people” can do the same.
    Yes, you can judge them. You can find their behavior to be abhorrent and morally wrong. They are not doing what they were sent there to do, and they should be punished.
    Where you need to stop and apply some level of restraint, is in how they get punished, should they be found guilty of a crime.
    I’m not even sure what crime would be charged, except possibly Art. 90, UCMJ (Disobeying an Officer) if they were ever told not to do something like this or Article 92, UCMJ (Failure to Obey an Order or Regulation) if they were ever made aware of a standing order or reg about this (and there are orders and regulations about this kind of stuff). Definitely Article 134, UCMJ Conduct predjudicial good order and discipline in the armed forces, or conduct of a nature to bring discredit upon the armed forces.

    If the only misconduct is that which is depicted in the pictures, I’d go for confinement for 90 days with full forfeiture of pay and allowances while confined (which would extend their enlistments by 90 days), bust two pay grades, suspended Bad Conduct Discharge, and place a Bar to Reenlist/NFPA in their records. If other misconduct is uncovered (not unreasonable to assume, given the lack of discipline and professionalism shown here) then of course, harsher actions should be contemplated.

  88. 88
    Montarvillois says:

    When BushBoy gave the green light to torture fellow humans, soldiers posing with body parts became kid stuff.

  89. 89
    sherparick says:

    Long wars, especially guerrillia wars, produces hard men. From the soldiers point of view these guys, who were building IEDs that would blow them apart (http://www.statesman.com/news/.....ticle=ywho), ironically suffered the same fate from their own devices. The irony naturally brings a smile. Again, good discipline and leadership would reminded the soldiers that the consequences of these photographs and poses was not worth indulging in the feeling. But who in those soldiers shoes would not have such feeling. As John says, if we don’t want to see the horrors of war, we probably should not start or continue wars that have no particular purpose. (That happened in the “Good War,” WWII, read “With the Old Breed” by E.B. Sledge; or look at Union soldiers posing with the corpse of “Bloody” Bill Anderson after he was killed in an ambush in Missouri in 1864. But at least one could argue the victory was worth the horror. What victory will we ever have in Afghanistan?”)

  90. 90
    rea says:

    “C’est pire qu’un crime, c’est une faute”

  91. 91
    Jon H says:

    Well, at least *we* didn’t kill them, they killed themselves, while trying to kill innocent people.

    That’s a kind of progress, right?

    I’m not even sure if they pictures should count as trophies of war, since they didn’t die in combat. It’s almost more akin to taking pictures for FAILBlog.

    All that said, poor judgment, given the status of relations with the Afghan people.

  92. 92
    Jon H says:

    @magurakurin: “Send human beings into dehumanizing conditions, guess what, they become dehumanized.”

    Sadly, there’s nothing in the history of our species that suggests this kind of behavior isn’t entirely human.

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